Saturday, March 19, 2016

Joe My God news articles and comments

 

 
   






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BudClark  • 4 minutes ago 




What's the heterosexual divorce rate in Australia? The percentage of illegitimate children? The percentage of ABANDONED children.
A gay couple NEVER has an unwanted child. Nor do we kick them out of the house for being heterosexual.
Gay couples get married because they love each other and WANT to get married.
 
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Stogiebear  • 10 hours ago 




We don't have to assume you're bigots. You prove it daily with your every word and deed.
Also, FUCK YOU!
 
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WebSlinger > Stogiebear  • 9 hours ago 





  
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JT > Stogiebear  • 8 hours ago 




He's probably had numerous non-marital fucks.
 
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Eric in Oakland > Stogiebear  • 7 hours ago 




It's nicely ironic that he immediately followed that statement with several bigoted assertions. That takes a special kind of stupid.
 
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Schlukitz > Stogiebear  • 7 hours ago 




Hear. Hear.
And I toss my FUCK YOU into the ring along with yours. ;-)
 
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Sam_Handwich  • 10 hours ago 





  
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Robincho > Sam_Handwich  • 10 hours ago 




You'll roo the day you get kicked by one of them damn thangs... they do NOT fuck around. (cf., cassowary)...
 
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tcinsf > Robincho  • 10 hours ago 




Oh, yah, I will always remember the ranger who led a tour of the Queensland rainforest ... "If you see a cassowary, just run. Maybe you'll make it."
 
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Ninja0980 > tcinsf  • 9 hours ago 




One of the only birds that can actually kill people.
 
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Octavio > Ninja0980  • 8 hours ago 




See a cassowary. Run awary.
 
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BlueberriesForMe > tcinsf  • 8 hours ago 




Per this wikipedia article, there's been only one reported human death - back in 1926.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
However, they can certainly inflict injury.
 
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Mark > tcinsf  • 2 hours ago 




This is why too - -
 
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Cattleya1 > tcinsf  • 2 hours ago 




Had breakfast at a friend's house in the QLD rainforest. I was about to put a banana in my mouth when a cassowary walked out of the woods with his chick(males do the rearing) and walked up where I had nowhere to run. I offered him my banana. He took it. and walked quietly away and watched us for a few minutes and then lead his chick away. Met a lady on the same trip who rescued orphaned Kangaroos. The wildlife there is really up close and wonderful.
 
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Dreaming Vertebrate > Robincho  • 10 hours ago 




Roo, rue? I see what you did there!
(Homonyms are fun!)
 
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Robincho > Dreaming Vertebrate  • 9 hours ago 




It's always fun, keeping the "homo" in "homonymy"!...
 
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Gene > Robincho  • 9 hours ago 




yes...(bad memory coming back of seeing one in a baddd mood)..one kick..and..well. buh bye
on the other hand, they ARE very tasty (surprisingly so)
 
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Acronym Jim > Gene  • 8 hours ago 




So they taste like bacon-chicken?
 
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Mark > Robincho  • 2 hours ago 




We had a dom buck roo that came around ever few weeks - we named him Bluto - - that mother was huge!!!! I do miss them though - the does 'n joeys came through often and would let me get within about a meter before they even noticed. That was as close as I'd get though.
 
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Dreaming Vertebrate > Sam_Handwich  • 10 hours ago 




To be fair, kangaroos also have a tender side. Just don't piss them off.
Momma with young joey.

 
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2guysnamedjoe > Dreaming Vertebrate  • 9 hours ago 




Would make a great Mothers' Day card/greeting.
 
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Falconlights > 2guysnamedjoe  • 3 hours ago 




It sure would.
 
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GayOldLady > Dreaming Vertebrate  • 9 hours ago 




That's beautiful.
 
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tcinsf > Sam_Handwich  • 10 hours ago 




I love kangaroos. They have serious attitude.
 
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Bad Tom > Sam_Handwich  • 9 hours ago 




Up close.
 
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JT > Bad Tom  • 8 hours ago 




Those arms look amazingly like muscular human arms. He could use some pec, deltoid and traps work though.
 
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David L. Caster > Bad Tom  • 3 hours ago 




Yeah, that's Roger, a big rescue male, that although brought up in a rescue context, is still very territorial even with human beings.
 
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tcinsf > Sam_Handwich  • 10 hours ago 





  


 
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Acronym Jim > tcinsf  • 7 hours ago 




I'm pretty sure Roger was just messing with him or playing. Kangaroos can go much faster than that.

  


 
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Ninja0980 > Sam_Handwich  • 9 hours ago 




They can kick hard too.
 
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Stogiebear > Sam_Handwich  • 2 hours ago 




Sen. Bob Day has probably dropped mistresses less artfully.
 
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Tor  • 10 hours ago 




And hets are so great at that monogamy thing.
 
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David Walker > Tor  • 9 hours ago 




They are the measure by which we must be compared? No no no. Australia is as infected with xnty as we are. "...gay men are typically ‘unfaithful’ and that having one partner to be ‘unrealistic and unnatural,’" not unlike Breeders We Have Known. Anyway, this will come as news to my partner of 37 years.
 
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TexasBoy  • 10 hours ago 




Hey, Senator, what's the divorce rate on heterosexual marriages?
 
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TerryInIowa > TexasBoy  • 9 hours ago 




Actually, what's the break-up rate among non-married heterosexuals, because, like their unmarried homosexual counterparts, they don't have the bond of marriage to keep them together.
 
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David Walker > TerryInIowa  • 9 hours ago 




In at least half of the cases here in the states, it could also be pointed out that "the bond of marriage" doesn't keep them together, either.
 
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Lane  • 10 hours ago 




"Well, farmers are notorious for hiring farmhands or ranchhands who are usually young, single men, who bunk together, shower together, wear tight jeans and sexy boots, help each other over the fence or over a hay bale... I really can't stop picturing the lurid things these menfolk are doing. God! So, so sexy. So hot...
I'm sorry, what was the question again?
"What is your stance on farm subsidies?"
 
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Treant > Lane  • 10 hours ago 




"Oh, that. Most of the farmhands I've seen don't need subsidizing, if you get what I'm saying here."
 
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Dreaming Vertebrate  • 10 hours ago 




>>> Some people are too unfaithful to deserve marriage.
Tell that to Kim Davis. Is she on her fifth husband yet?
 
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Joseph Miceli > Dreaming Vertebrate  • 10 hours ago 




LOL, unfaithful bad. Serial marriage after the Lord has washed away your sins: O.K.
Honestly, we fags need our own religion. What a scam!
 
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nocadrummer > Joseph Miceli  • 9 hours ago 




Okay... then what about Newt Gingrich? He who started dating the woman who'd become his second wife while still married to the first wife. He who started dating his current wife while still married to his second wife. And served that poor woman divorce papers when she was in the hospital with cancer.
Tell us again about Conservatives' adherence to "family values" and "sanctity of marriage"? Oh, yeah... the first two didn't count because they weren't Catholic weddings.
 
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Joseph Miceli > nocadrummer  • 9 hours ago 




Newt is my "go to" when I want to piss of straight people extolling the "sanctity" of marriage. Newt Gingrich is the exemplar of EVERYTHING wrong with conservatism, the Republican party and the "faith community." The only thing Newt missed out on was raping an alter boy and there's still time for that.
But... according to conservatives... Newt is just fine. His wives were sequential, he converted to the Catholic faith and he's remained faithful/hasn't been caught cheating on Calista (yet!)
See, WE live by a higher moral standard than they do. I find Gingrich absolutely fucking APPALLING!
 
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David Walker > Joseph Miceli  • 9 hours ago 




And don't forget that the first two marriages were annulled. While that would seem to mean that his kids are illegitimate, I'm sure there are catholitic loopholes that kick in depending on the amount paid for the annulments.
 
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Joseph Miceli > David Walker  • 9 hours ago 




No, actually. I think that ...according to Catholic doctrine... his kids from those marriages are literally bastards, not just figuratively like Daddy.
 
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David Walker > Joseph Miceli  • 8 hours ago 




Words ARE important. Words DO have meaning. Thanks!
 
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GayOldLady > Joseph Miceli  • 9 hours ago 




"Honestly, we fags need our own religion."
If you'll admit lesbians I'll join.
 
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GayOldLady > GayOldLady  • 9 hours ago 




Never mind, I've seen your commandments.
 
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David Walker > GayOldLady  • 9 hours ago 




Now wait a moment, GayOldLady. One of the precepts of religion is providing wiggle room. What we're forced to believe is one god (or the Ballentine Beer or oil concept of 3-in-1) for everyone. Multiple gods make every bit as much sense, as do different commandments for the Ls, Gs, Bs, Ts, and Qs among us. You and I have been outsiders long enough to know that any religion we might come up with would be different, creative, inclusive, and fabulous. Come back, please, GayOldLady. Sainthood awaits.
 
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GayOldLady > David Walker  • 8 hours ago 




Sainthood sounds good! :-)
 
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Joseph Miceli > GayOldLady  • 7 hours ago 




Hey, I'll vote to canonize! Saint GayOldLady of Perpetual Patience!
 
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GayOldLady > Joseph Miceli  • 6 hours ago 




:-)
 
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Dreaming Vertebrate > Joseph Miceli  • 10 hours ago 




First step in religio-genesis is to craft a list of sincerely held beliefs, preferably rendered in stone. Then you can (like all true believers) throw them in the face of the "unbelievers".
 
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Joseph Miceli > Dreaming Vertebrate  • 9 hours ago 




1. Thou shalt venerate the lost art of "Disco," and venerate the prophets Gloria Gaynor, Donna Summer and Patti LaBelle.
2. Just because they make it in thy size doesn't mean thou shouldst wear it.
3. Always use a condom
4. Don't say thou art a "top" when thou art just a bossy "bottom."
5. Thou shalt not exaggerate the size of your penis on Grinder beyond one inch in length OR thickness, not both.
6. Thou shalt not wear "color block."
 
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GayOldLady > Joseph Miceli  • 9 hours ago 




Some of those commandments I cannot keep, I cannot even think about. :-)
 
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stuckinthewoods > GayOldLady  • 9 hours ago 




I know. I didn't understand "color block" but I think it means you wouldn't be able to wear your rubies and emeralds together.
 
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Joseph Miceli > stuckinthewoods  • 8 hours ago 




See what I mean?
 
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Joseph Miceli > stuckinthewoods  • 8 hours ago 





  
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Joseph Miceli > GayOldLady  • 9 hours ago 




Well, I don't think YOU will be worshiping at the "Church of Priapus." :)
 
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OrliJoe in Fla > Joseph Miceli  • 9 hours ago 




7. Thou shalt venerate the Penis, thy Lord and Master, at least once a day. Twice on the 13th day.
 
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Joseph Miceli > OrliJoe in Fla  • 9 hours ago 




I'm more of an ass man....
 
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Steve McCaig > Joseph Miceli  • 9 hours ago 




I'm a hole-y man myself.
 
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OrliJoe in Fla > Joseph Miceli  • 8 hours ago 




That's the Beauty of Priapus. He accepts veneration in many different forms.
 
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OrliJoe in Fla > Joseph Miceli  • 10 hours ago 




The Temple of Priapus. Seriously, why not? It's definitely something I get on my knees for.
 
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Joseph Miceli > OrliJoe in Fla  • 9 hours ago 




Where do I sign up?
 
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OrliJoe in Fla > Joseph Miceli  • 9 hours ago 




I hereby anoint thee Master of The List !! And thou shalt list them by cut and uncut, girth and length.
 
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Reality.Bites > Dreaming Vertebrate  • 8 hours ago 




Depends if you count reruns or not.
 
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Michael Abbett  • 10 hours ago 




I refuse to be lectured to by straight people on the subject of fidelity.
 
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OSG > Michael Abbett  • 10 hours ago 




Or gender or sexuality for that matter.
 
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Octavio > OSG  • 10 hours ago 




Or lectured by clergy. The absolute worst!
 
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OSG > Octavio  • 8 hours ago 




Worse than perpetual humanities students?
 
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GayOldLady  • 10 hours ago 




"Bob Day on Friday hit out at same-sex marriage, saying that most gay men in relationships are unfaithful to their partners."
If I had a dollar for every married straight man that hit on me when I was 17-35 years old, I could have retired a lot earlier.
 
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OrliJoe in Fla > GayOldLady  • 10 hours ago 




Oh honey, the number of married 'straight' men I've gotten to know biblically is, well, more than I can count on my fingers and toes. Let's leave it at that.
 
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Reality.Bites > OrliJoe in Fla  • 8 hours ago 




Thanks for ruining Australia's chance for marriage equality! /s
 
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GayOldLady > OrliJoe in Fla  • 9 hours ago 




You bad boy! :-)
 
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OrliJoe in Fla > GayOldLady  • 9 hours ago 




I know!
 
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Joseph Miceli > GayOldLady  • 10 hours ago 




I'm going to have to start aggravating you like I do Octavio to write your memoirs!
 
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GayOldLady > Joseph Miceli  • 10 hours ago 




:-)
 
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nocadrummer > GayOldLady  • 9 hours ago 




I just wish I had a dollar for every time I heard, "I'm straight and married, but I love getting f-ked in the @ss."
 
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Cuberly > nocadrummer  • 8 hours ago 




I've met my share of married men looking for cock. And I've walked away from every one of them.
 
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Hue-Man > GayOldLady  • 10 hours ago 




Me too! Well, maybe not enough for retirement security...
 
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Cackalaquiano > GayOldLady  • 10 hours ago 




Oh surely not - straight men never, ever cheat, right? At least not in Bob Day's world.
 
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David Walker > Cackalaquiano  • 9 hours ago 




Probably excluding himself.
 
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John30013  • 10 hours ago 




This Aus-hole quotes Dan Savage's neologism "monogamish" to discredit relationships between (presumably) gay men, but Savage never restricted the term to gays (or men). Indeed, Savage most often discusses "monogamishness" in the context of hetero relationships.
And, as usual, the bigot completely ignores lesbians in his irrational screed.
 
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zhera > John30013  • 10 hours ago 




A relationship without at least one penis is irrelevant to these morons. Only the PENIS counts during sex! Won't somebody think of the PENIS!
 
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Stev84 > zhera  • 7 hours ago 




Oh, he probably thinks about penises a lot
 
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nocadrummer > John30013  • 10 hours ago 




That's because "woman-on-woman sex" is "hot". He's got the video collection to prove it!
 
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Joseph Miceli > John30013  • 10 hours ago 




Of course he ignores Lesbians. According to the criteria he uses, Lesbians make better marriages than straight people. It makes the fuses in his lil' bigot brain fry. :)
 
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Gene > John30013  • 9 hours ago 




he's just a bigot fighting a (largely) losing batter in an other wise nice country (empty deserts, and worlds second ugliest parliament building...American architect...NOT a point of pride that, aside) that will, in time, get marriage equality.
Australian fundys are numerous..and FAR more determined than American ones I have noticed. (remember, its an Australian who is making that ridiculous "ark" in N Ky just south of cincy...those folks are hard core)
 
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olandp > Gene  • 6 hours ago 




I googled it and thought it was an under construction shot. If that is the second ugliest, what is the first?
 
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Bluto  • 10 hours ago 




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Octavio  • 10 hours ago 




I submit Bob Day lacks the genetic components for sympathy/empathy, therefore his is not fit to contribute his chromosomes to the human gene pool. Next.
 
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Cackalaquiano > Octavio  • 10 hours ago 




I submit that if he were about 65 years younger and had the slightest familiarity with technology, he'd have one of the most active Grindr accounts in South Australia.
 
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Octavio > Cackalaquiano  • 10 hours ago 




He'd also have to be marginally attractive. Although some people will fuck anything. :-)
 
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stuckinthewoods > Cackalaquiano  • 9 hours ago 




Actually Mr. Day was born in 1952, so 65 years younger......
 
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Cackalaquiano > stuckinthewoods  • 8 hours ago 




I'm a product of public school in the deep South - you can't possibly expect me to math.
 
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Octavio > stuckinthewoods  • 8 hours ago 




65 years younger and he'd be a spec in his mommy's whatever.
 
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Reality.Bites > stuckinthewoods  • 8 hours ago 




OMG, I'm gonna look like that in six years!!?!?
No wonder my boyfriend isn't monogamous!
 
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stuckinthewoods > Reality.Bites  • 8 hours ago 




..right, when I saw I'm two years older than Mr. Day I immediately went to moisturize.
 
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bkmn  • 10 hours ago 




Not sure why I get the feeling this guy has a piece on the side.
 
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Joseph Miceli > bkmn  • 10 hours ago 




It isn't cheating! He and his wife "have an arrangement" which is NOTHING like those dirty queers because vagina.
 
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bkmn > Joseph Miceli  • 8 hours ago 




Right wingers never say vagina, vajayjay or v*g*n* if you were Monica Cole.
 
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Joseph Miceli > bkmn  • 7 hours ago 




I stand corrected. Mrs. Betty Bowers prefers "Vajheen," because it sounds friendlier.
 
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David Walker > Joseph Miceli  • 9 hours ago 




The arrangement being he can fuck around all he wants while she stays, barefoot and pregnant, in the kitchen. Should she complain about that or rebel, she's history.
 
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Cackalaquiano > bkmn  • 10 hours ago 




Right. A politician KNOWING they're a secret hypocrite has never stopped them from making sanctimonious proclamations. Until they're found out.
 
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abel > bkmn  • 10 hours ago 




Oh, he's a politician, so you KNOW HE HAS. Probably many times!
 
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Bill Harnsberger  • 10 hours ago 




23 faithful years with my partner. But that's gay years so I'm sure it doesn't count.
 
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PeterC > Bill Harnsberger  • 9 hours ago 




Good for you. Kent and I have been together for 28 years. And now legally for one (Kansas is slow too.)
 
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David Walker > PeterC  • 9 hours ago 




37 years, but we've decided against marrying because his SSI would be reduced (because my SS income is SO high we'd never notice the difference). Funny how our Truly Religious congress lets the grannies (straight and gay) live in sin. Lets? Practically demands. Still, there's something to be said for shacking up.
 
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Reality.Bites > David Walker  • 9 hours ago 




LOL, most countries handle that by treating couples exactly the same for taxes and benefits whether they're married or shacked up
 
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Octavio > PeterC  • 8 hours ago 




Please accept my sympathies that you must suffer living in Kansas.
 
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edrex  • 10 hours ago 




someone need to respond with an a full page ad listing every adulterous member of his party and family. including second marriages that began before the first was over.
 
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jomicur  • 9 hours ago 




So he both criticizes gay men for not forming monogamous unions AND says we shouldn't be allowed to form them in the first place. So what the hell does he want? Christians have been talking out of both sides of their mouths for 2,000 years, and I for one am sick to goddamn death of it.
 
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Ninja0980 > jomicur  • 9 hours ago 




Indeed, if you don't want to be monogamous, then why would you want to get married?
 
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Reality.Bites > Ninja0980  • 9 hours ago 




Umm... Because you want to form a family with someone, but that doesn't necessarily include monogamy?
As long as neither party is deceiving the other it's up to them how they live their lives.
 
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Steven Leahy > Reality.Bites  • 9 hours ago 




Totally agree. I used to be a big promoter of the "monogamy" thing, but my hangups that people should all be monogamous have changed as I've gotten older. I realize in the end it's about love and emotional commitment, and that sexuality isn't the primary determiner of that. I think the bigger issue, for me, are the ones who pretend and lie about being true and monogamous, and then slip around on the sly. I don't see an issue if both parties are in agreement and the arrangement works for them.
 
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McSwagg > Steven Leahy  • 5 hours ago 




I agree as long as you include the "trick on the side" having the right to be informed as well. Just because the married couple has an agreement, doesn't mean that the feelings and aspirations of the "third party" are irrelevant. He (or she) may be looking for a relationship of their own, not just to be used in a fling.
 
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Ninja0980 > Reality.Bites  • 8 hours ago 




I get that, I guess my point was if you aren't going to stay faithful to your spouse (cheating) no point in getting married.
 
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Friday > Ninja0980  • 7 hours ago 




People often equate non-monogamy with *cheating,* or breaking marriage oaths, ...but they simply aren't necessarily the same. Christianists simply don't approve of anyone agreeing to such a thing, cause then they can't make people beg 'forgiveness' for 'sinning' or something. In a sense they want to force any non-monogamy to be deceitful or oathbreaking, regardless of what the people involved think.
Legally, of course, it's irrelevant and disingenuous. Civil marriage being set up for two people doesn't change if two gay people get married.
 
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Reality.Bites > Ninja0980  • 5 hours ago 




But not cheating doesn't always mean monogamy.
 
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jomicur > Ninja0980  • 9 hours ago 




You'd have to ask a straight man about that. ;-)
 
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Ninja0980  • 10 hours ago 




I've been with my husband for almost 14 years and have stayed faithful to him and vice versa.
 Fuck off you bigoted asshole.
 
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Ernest Endevor > Ninja0980  • 10 hours ago 




46 years here. Not that anyone's counting.
 
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Cackalaquiano > Ernest Endevor  • 10 hours ago 




46 years! I want to upvote you twice!
 
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Ernest Endevor > Cackalaquiano  • 8 hours ago 




The importance of equality for us is SSI and end-of-life issues. For example, I've delayed taking my SSI to claim spousal benefits under what's-is-name's. This is a real windfall and will mean tens of thousands of dollars over the years. He's older than I am so we're both bracing for what's ahead. But having a legal structure is a great help. We live in rural NY and have met with nothing but respect regarding our status.
 
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CCleverly > Ernest Endevor  • 9 hours ago 




^^^^^^^^^ a gazillion upvotes & congrats to you Sirs.
 
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David Walker > Ernest Endevor  • 9 hours ago 




At 37 years, you make me feel like a newlywed. Thank you.
 
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Ernest Endevor > David Walker  • 8 hours ago 




You'll find it starts to get easier after 40.
 
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jmax > Ninja0980  • 10 hours ago 




Congrats.13 years for me and my man.
Oh, and I second your "Fuck off".
 
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CCleverly > jmax  • 10 hours ago 




Congrats to all of you. Me & mine are 9 years DPd and 8 years married. And I would third your "Fuck off" but I won't waste the energy.
 
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CCleverly > CCleverly  • 10 hours ago 




Couldn't help myself... Fuck off you bigoted Aussie asshole.
 
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nocadrummer > Ninja0980  • 9 hours ago 




Over 13 years with my husband. And ONLY my husband.
All in favor of "Fuck off"?
I guess it's unanimous.
 
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ECarpenter > Ninja0980  • 8 hours ago 




Whether your are in a monogamous couple or not is irrelevant to the discussion of who should be allowed to exercise their right to marry - the private arrangements of married couples are not the business of the state.
Equal marriage is equal marriage.
 
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D. J. > ECarpenter  • 4 hours ago 




Unless you are a law maker, preacher injecting yourself into politics or in other ways publicly interfering with marriage equality.
Then one's private life becomes the business of the public, including the state.
 
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Wynter Marie Starr  • 10 hours ago 




I'll agree with him the very moment he proves that being unfaithful doesn't happen in straight couples.
 
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David Walker > Wynter Marie Starr  • 9 hours ago 




Why, Wynter Marie, I'm shocked...surprised!...that you should doubt his facts. Straight couples believe in Jeebus and would never do anything that would make the baby Jeebus cry. At least in Australia (apparently), that's a given...and we fags (obviously) don't know squat about Jeebus or the love he advocated. It's a beautiful day. I think I need to get away for a while.
 
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Wynter Marie Starr > David Walker  • 8 hours ago 




LOL, David you are great! Monogamy really isn't encoded into our genes, it's a social construct. Doesn't mean we can't be faithful. Being unfaithful is a human thing, not a gay or straight thing. To anyone that thinks otherwise, well, they're just stupid and deserve to be treated as the utter morons they are. Enjoy your time in the sun as I think you might be expecting some snow or rain tomorrow.
 
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Bryan > Wynter Marie Starr  • 10 hours ago 




Honestly.
What a lame double-standard.
 
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Rod Steely  • 9 hours ago 




So does Australia plan to dissolve the marriage of every heterosexual couple who is unfaithful?
 
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boatboy_srq > Rod Steely  • 9 hours ago 




Maybe that's what he meant by "why not three? [or four or ten or twenty]"
 
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Bill  • 10 hours ago 




16 years of monogamy and counting, Mr. Day.
Also, just because 60% of men like you cheat on their women and lie to them about it, don't fault others who may take a more honest approach, huh, straight guys???
Morality indeed.
 
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Skeptical_Inquirer  • 9 hours ago 




Somehow I doubt he'd say that Donald Trump doesn't deserve the institution of marriage.
 
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Craig Howell > Skeptical_Inquirer  • 8 hours ago 




The institution of marriage does not deserve Donald Trump.
 
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Rebecca Gardner  • 10 hours ago 




They just keep bringing up the same arguments over and over again. Just grab it from the shit pile of history, dust it off, repackage it and use it to attack your newest target.
Just to post these two things one more time to drive the point home. First, my 90 year old uncle and his partner have been together for over 50 years. So fuck the gay men die young and are not monogamous argument. Second is this anti-womens suffrage flyer. Read it. The words and the reasoning are verbatim of what we here today and what we heard against inter-racial marriages.
When will these troglodytes just go away and leave the adults alone?!
 
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2guysnamedjoe > Rebecca Gardner  • 9 hours ago 




Looks like married women gave up their first names as well as their last names.
 
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Crimminy > 2guysnamedjoe  • 8 hours ago 




That tradition remained widespread for way longer than it should have.
My mother and grandmother were still using "Mrs. Husband's Name" up until the late 1980s/early 1990s.
 
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stuckinthewoods > 2guysnamedjoe  • 8 hours ago 




In the last couple years I've done a bit of idle historical research and have come up against that. Women who were identifiable when unmarried lost not only their last names but became indistinguishable from other women married to men having the same name. The only way I was going to separate the men was by who married whom and that was the problem I faced.
 
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Rebecca Gardner > 2guysnamedjoe  • 9 hours ago 




Yeah. Scary huh.
 
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Ninja0980  • 9 hours ago 




I'm seconding a point someone below brought up.
 If my sisters (especially when they worked in bars etc. during college) and female cousins had a buck every time a married man hit on them, they would have paid off their college loans in five months, if that.
Are there same sex couples that will cheat on each other?
Hell yes, my ex being one of them.
 No excuse to deny marriage anymore then to straights because some will cheat on their spouses.
 
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ECarpenter > Ninja0980  • 8 hours ago 




When a couple has an agreement about sex outside the marriage, and they abide by that agreement, sex outside their marriage is not "cheating".
 
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Treant > Ninja0980  • 9 hours ago 




Just for future reference, they can get a lot more than a dollar for that.
Er, not that I'd know from experience...
 
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Christopher Smith  • 10 hours ago 




Let's see....what's the average number of 'wives' and DIVORCES for an old, rich, white bigot?
 
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DaddyRay  • 10 hours ago 




Ashley Madison's $1 billion dollar valuation strongly disputes your argument sir
 
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Silver Badger  • 10 hours ago 




If fidelity was common in heterosexuals he might have a point. As it is, the gay people I know are more likely to be monogamous than the heterosexuals.
 
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Ed Burrow  • 10 hours ago 




...and here we go again.
i don't care if a couple is monogamous.
i don't care if you like to swing from the ceiling fan while your spouse masturbates while watching Poltergeist.
i don't care. it's not my business.
what i *do* care about is whatever agreement you have made within the bounds of your relationship is respected on both sides.
 
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DaddyRay > Ed Burrow  • 10 hours ago 




i don't care if you like to swing from the ceiling fan while your spouse masturbates while watching Poltergeist.
 
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Joseph Miceli > DaddyRay  • 10 hours ago 




The ascot used to be a dead giveaway.
 
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Lane  • 10 hours ago 




Also, if you're going on by anecdotal "evidence" about monogamy and partners, you should ban heteros from marriage, mandate that lesbians get married, and offer free lube to all gay men.
 
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Joseph Miceli > Lane  • 10 hours ago 




Free Lube Friday was yesterday!
 
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Richard B  • 6 hours ago 




In a civil marriage, a couple's personal arrangements for governing their sexual relationships is no ones business, but their own - it certainly is not government's business. For the record, Bob Day is wrong - many gay people chose to have fidelity and enjoy a monogamous relationship. I have been with my husband for almost 38 years and in our case, we are happily monogamous, but we have friends that have an open relationship, and this arrangement works nicely for them - and they are happy. Everyone is different and people should be free to do what they want to do.
 
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Ellipse Kirk  • 10 hours ago 




He sounds nice.
 
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Marla R. Stevens  • 7 hours ago 




Then he's gung-ho on lesbians' equal right to civil marriage, right?
 
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Circ09 > Marla R. Stevens  • 5 hours ago 




Interesting how they never consider gay women, isn't it? Misogyny at its finest.
Tangential to this: Lately I have been reading a lot of whiny bio-stories online from straight women about suddenly feeling invisible now that they have reached middle age. And I'm always thinking - try living as a lesbian at any age.
 
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ECarpenter  • 8 hours ago 




Just another red herring. No marriage is contingent on the couple promising the state that they will be monogamous. The private arrangements of married people are not the business of the state.
 
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Ragnar Lothbrok  • 9 hours ago 




" Family First Senator..." Um, I see the problem RIGHT there.
 
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LovesIrony  • 10 hours ago 




fucking bigot
 
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JaniceInToronto  • 10 hours ago 




He wins the "Assholes of Australia" award for 2016!
 
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j.martindale  • 10 hours ago 




When did adherence to monogamy become a test for marriage?
 
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sherman  • 10 hours ago 




"assume that opponents must be bigots"
Needs "But Cha Are Blanche" tag.
 
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Reality.Bites > sherman  • 8 hours ago 




We ain't ASSUMING anything!
 
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Little Kiwi  • 6 hours ago 




this old non-argument again? what century is it down there?
 
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Friday  • 7 hours ago 




More Christians claiming they must oppress gay monogamy in order to, err, prevent 'gay promiscuity?'
 
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Steven Leahy  • 8 hours ago 




Half of his married colleagues sitting in chamber have probably not been monogamous. Hell, since most RWNJ's are liars and phony by definition, how do we know HE'S been faithful? What a hypocrite.
 
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Steven Leahy  • 9 hours ago 




Wow, on this issue it's just like watching American anti-LGBT politics from 9,000 miles away.
Umm, to clarify, and I remind my narrow-minded heterosexual acquaintances who bring this up, many MEN are dogs, regardless of sexuality. This will get me a lot of flak here, but I think some people just aren't cut out for monogamy, which is why they cheat - it's not always all about "unhappiness" in marriage. Men, sexually, are very hormone-driven and so I think are likely more prone than females to be on the prowl. When you have two men as opposed to a woman + a man, it's even more pronounced. Doesn't mean all of them are, or that women can't be dogs, and many SS coupled men are quite content in monogamous relationships.
By this guy's logic, only lesbians should be allowed to get married.
 
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CB > Steven Leahy  • 8 hours ago 




Two words: Ashley Madison. Case in point, a dear hetero friend who adored his wife only to discover her on there and cheating. Their marriage is/was still valid.
You're completely right. And civil marriage has nothing to do with fidelity or monogamy. Heck every marriage is different in that respect. I know of open marriages, faithful marriages, etc. and guys and women who cheat. This has nothing to do with what the state recognizes or entitlement to equal treatment under the law.
 
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Clungeflaps > Steven Leahy  • 7 hours ago 




"Men are dogs"
Dogs are loyal though.
 
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Reality.Bites > Steven Leahy  • 8 hours ago 




It's like that because no one, anywhere in the world, has been able to come up with a single rational reason.
 
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HomerTh  • 9 hours ago 




Say gay couples are 10 percent of the population (perhaps way too high). Straight couples are at least 90 percent and they are busy cheating like crazy. Bob Day should be demanding that all straight marriages be dissolved.
 
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Paul in Leesburg > HomerTh  • 8 hours ago 




I believe that both Kinsey 6 and Kinsey 0 make up perhaps perhaps 25% of the population (coupled or not) the other 75% to 80% are somewhere between the two extremes
 
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Michael Rush  • 10 hours ago 




How do you say " EAT A BAG OF DICKS " in Australian ?
 
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2guysnamedjoe > Michael Rush  • 10 hours ago 




Put some dicks on the barbie?
 
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Reality.Bites > 2guysnamedjoe  • 8 hours ago 




Are you kidding? Mattel won't even put one on the Ken.
 
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Joseph Miceli > 2guysnamedjoe  • 9 hours ago 




Saving that!!!!
 
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zhera > Michael Rush  • 10 hours ago 




Eat croc, mate!
 
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ECarpenter > Michael Rush  • 8 hours ago 




I think it's "EAT A BAG OF DICKS", but the vowels are different.
 
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Skokieguy [Larry]  • 10 hours ago 




Oh this gets so tiresome. Since gay couples tend to have zero unplanned and unwanted children and about half of all children born to straight people are unplanned, seems to me we need to ban straight marriage and require by force of law only same sex marriage. Won't someone think about the children!
 
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Blake Jordan  • 10 hours ago 




If "faithfulness" was a requirement for marriage, a lot of straight people would be excluded from it!!!
 
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DaddyRay > Blake Jordan  • 10 hours ago 




Ronald Reagan - divorced the mother of two of his children. Married Nancy Davis who bore him a daughter only 7 months after the marriage.
Bob Dole - divorced the mother of his child, who had nursed him through the long recovery from his war wounds.
Newt Gingrich - divorced his wife who was dying of cancer.
Dick Armey - Former House Majority Leader - divorced
Sen. Phil Gramm of Texas - divorced
Gov. John Engler of Michigan - divorced
Former Gov. Pete Wilson of California - divorced
George Will - divorced
Sen. Lauch Faircloth - divorced
Rush Limbaugh - Rush and his current wife Marta have six marriages and four divorces between them.
Rep. Bob Barr of Georgia - Barr has been married three times. Barr had the audacity to author and push the "Defense of Marriage Act."
The current joke making the rounds on Capitol Hill is "Bob Barr, WHICH marriage are you defending?"
Sen. Alfonse D'Amato of New York - divorced
Sen. John Warner of Virginia - divorced (once married to Liz Taylor)
Gov. George Allen of Virginia - divorced
Henry Kissinger - divorced
Rep. Helen Chenoweth of Idaho - divorced
Sen. John McCain of Arizona - divorced
Rep. John Kasich of Ohio - divorced
Rep. Susan Molinari of New York (2000 Republican National Convention Keynote Speaker) - divorced
Donald Trump - on his 3rd mail order bride
 
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Cackalaquiano > DaddyRay  • 10 hours ago 




But see, there's nothing wrong with them because they're straight, they're "ordered," whereas we're "disordered" because Jesus made Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve, and... ah, you know how it goes...
 
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Steverino > DaddyRay  • 10 hours ago 




That list is a keeper.
Not only is that asshat's speech appallingly hypocritical (and stereotypical), it is totally irrelevant in civil discourse regarding a proposed civil law. He should save that speech for delivery in his fucking church, where it no doubt would be received gleefully.
 
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Joseph Miceli > DaddyRay  • 9 hours ago 




Jesus no-like divorce, but I guess they just ignore that so they can shake their fingers at us.
 
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Ragnar Lothbrok > Joseph Miceli  • 9 hours ago 




Some shake even more than a finger
 
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Joseph Miceli > Ragnar Lothbrok  • 8 hours ago 




Usually in a public restroom or park.
 
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D. J. > DaddyRay  • 4 hours ago 




Billy Graham's daughter - 3 divorces
 
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Stev84 > DaddyRay  • 7 hours ago 




Daily Kos has a list somewhere of Republicans caught in sex scandals. There are probably over a hundred names on it.
 
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Octavio > DaddyRay  • 8 hours ago 




Obviously, divorce is a Republican Family Value. :-)
 
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Lane  • 10 hours ago 




Right, because those anti-adultery laws worked so well for heteros.
 
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nocadrummer  • 10 hours ago 




And his adultery scandal is due in 3... 2... 1.....
 
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Jeffg166 > nocadrummer  • 10 hours ago 




Any minute now.
 
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Reality.Bites > Jeffg166  • 8 hours ago 




More like several decades ago, judging by the looks of him.
 
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biki  • 6 hours ago 




By this logic, anyone who has cheated on a spouse in a opposite sexed marriage should be denied a marriage license for any all future marriages.
 
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I.Smith > biki  • 6 hours ago 




By their logic Mary cheated on Joseph so they should be forced by law to call Jesus a bastard.
 
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biki > I.Smith  • 6 hours ago 




Shouldn't Mary have been stoned for adultery?
 
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pleasebereasonable > biki  • 6 hours ago 




The real question is why was Mary still a virgin is she was married to Joseph..........
 
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grada3784 > pleasebereasonable  • an hour ago 




Better question is how did JC get thru Mary's intact hymen.
 
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biki > pleasebereasonable  • 3 hours ago 




Well, now we know about Joseph, yeah?
 
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Reality.Bites > biki  • 5 hours ago 




Why do you think she and Joseph made up the patently absurd story?
 
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Friday > biki  • 6 hours ago 




I suppose if he were the type for *that* by that God's religious laws, he wouldn't have let her stay a 'virgin' in the first place. Interesting.
 
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biki > Friday  • 3 hours ago 




That part of the story never made sense to me. In the eyes of the laws at that time period a unconsummated marriage wasn't a legal marriage. So either Joseph was family, or the whole story was nothing more than a fireside fable. I'm going with fable.
 
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I.Smith > biki  • 6 hours ago 




Yes but she was smart and made up a lie about having Gods baby so she was let off.
 
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continuum  • 7 hours ago 




What about the 60 to 70 percent of hetero marriages where the partners are unfaithful?
 
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Raybob  • 7 hours ago 




When has "faithfulness" ever been a test for marriage eligibility? Never.
 
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ECarpenter  • 8 hours ago 




Eight to twelve percent of children, depending on the population studied, are not genetically related to the man who thinks he's their father. Modern genetics has exploded the myth of heterosexual monogamy in interesting ways.
 
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Ben in Oakland  • 9 hours ago 




The most reliable statistics indicate that some 25-33% of heterosexual marriages are adulterous. that already outnumbers the entire gay population by a factor of 6. If you add in the 40% of Hetero marriages that end in divorce, and assume that the 25% figure also applies...
Well, do the math.
 
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Joseph Miceli  • 10 hours ago 




First of all, I think we all know the stats on how faithful "monogamous" straight couples are. Secondly, since when did monogamy become a requirement for marriage? Although it is always held out as the ideal, there are plenty of relationships that have lasted 30 years and more where some kind of sexual adventurism is a part of the marriage.
This guy is just another bigot.
 
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Reality.Bites > Joseph Miceli  • 9 hours ago 




Thanks for saying that. I'm monogamous because I want to be, not because I have to be. My boyfriend is not monogamous because he doesn't want to be. And I never want to be in the position where he's lying to me because he's afraid of how I'll react.
 
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ECarpenter > Reality.Bites  • 8 hours ago 




@reality.bites An old friend of mine, now gone, was monogamous by nature and was in a very happy relationship with his non-monogamous partner for 41 years. There are so many different ways to have a successful relationship!
 
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Steven Leahy > Joseph Miceli  • 9 hours ago 




Seems to me that MANY of the enduring ones I have seen with men are ones in which both parties agreed to an open relationship of some type.
 
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chicago dyke  • 10 hours ago 




i want to again my record of support for polygamy/polygyny. that's another discussion, but i am in favor of it and don't think it's wrong. if three people truly and honestly want to get married and enjoin into a legal relationship as well as a personal one, i believe that is their right, and more importantly not my business.
as to the complicated matter of what str8 people think they know about us? meh.
i don't want to say that only people who have lived the Scene know what i mean. we are different; it's part of what makes us what we are.
but the real point here, and Aussie Asswipes know it: str8s cheat. a lot. they make books full of Holy Rules telling them not to, but they still do it.
whenever any of them bring up anything about they way we have, or don't have, sex, remind them of that point. you people invented "cheating." not us.
 
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Joseph Miceli > chicago dyke  • 10 hours ago 




I agree with you...to a point. This is going to sound awful, so bear with me...
After becoming intimately familiar with the costs of multiple marriage in Mormon cults, and witnessing the amount of "throw away" males that results and the abuse straight men get up to with women and minors when given the opportunity, I've come to the conclusion that multiple marriage between a straight man and more than one woman should not be allowed. Most of them simply could not behave themselves in a manner not damaging to society. Multiple marriages between one woman and more than one man, or any combination of gay people though would be fine. Straight men are simply too hard wired to amass harems, which then produce too many extra male 'throw away" children which then generates an enormous drain of misery and cost to society.
 
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McSwagg > Joseph Miceli  • 6 hours ago 




I'm surprised you didn't include the massive amount of Welfare fraud as one of the social costs that usually accompanies one-man-multiple-women polygamous marriages.
 
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Max_1  • 5 hours ago 




And he relates this to his experience of infidelity, how? Straight men can be nonmonagamists too... But some how THAT infidelity is OK. Thus, he earns the title bigot.
 
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Circ09  • 5 hours ago 




Since this was a parliamentary debate I wonder if there was any direct, point-by-point refutation on the floor to this asswipe's nonsense? And they are still on to spend millions for a public vote on minority rights. Shameful.
 
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BeccaM  • 5 hours ago 




Really? And straight guys never, ever cheat on their wives?
 
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I.Smith  • 6 hours ago 




Mary was unfaithful to Joseph, yet they built a whole Religion around her cheating.
Why don't they start with the followers of your God and introduce bills to stop their marriages then they can talk about other peoples marriages.
 
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SammySeattle  • 7 hours ago 




Two words: Ashley Madison
 
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DaveMiller135  • 7 hours ago 




Was it 10% of the US population that signed up for Ashley Madison accounts?
 
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Stev84 > DaveMiller135  • 7 hours ago 




Most of the women there are fake
 
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Friday > Stev84  • 6 hours ago 




He didn't say they were terribly *bright* Americans. :)
 
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Acronym Jim  • 8 hours ago 




To be fair, Australia does seem to have a comparatively lower divorce rate. But that's probably because one or both partners are more likely to be killed by the local flora and fauna before they can get sick of each other.
 
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iamvince > Acronym Jim  • 5 hours ago 




Got to watch out for the deadly drop bears!
 
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Sporkfighter  • 8 hours ago 




So the civil rights of some are granted or denied based on the legal behavior of others? They want to go there? Right-wing Christian Australian politicians wouldn't get oxygen.
 
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Stev84  • 8 hours ago 




Time to out all MPs having affairs. Probably a long list
 
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Schlukitz  • 8 hours ago 




Guess he hasn't heard about Trump's three marriage yet...let alone any of the bizarre characters on this site.
http://www.oddee.com/item_9858...
 
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Mark Neé Fuzz  • 8 hours ago 




If heterosexual men tend to be more faithful it's only because women are less likely to put out.
 
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ECarpenter > Mark Neé Fuzz  • 8 hours ago 




Heterosexual men aren't more faithful - they just get it off with their buddies and claim that's not sex, so it doesn't count.
 
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JT  • 8 hours ago 




So, why don't you oppose remarriage for adulterers, dipshit? Because most hetero men couldn't comply?
 
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Friday > JT  • 7 hours ago 




He's trying to scapegoat LGBT people for straight adultery by ...claiming LGBT people are all like adulterers. Thus I guess an inferior minority that don'[t deserve the same rights as proven straight adulterers....
 
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CCleverly  • 10 hours ago 




I didn't know that Australian politics had to endure shit stains like this clown.
 
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JVB  • 10 hours ago 




Asshole.
 
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another_steve  • 10 hours ago 




My man has always been faithful to me. Well, almost always.
I couldn't live with me. I don't know how he manages it.
 
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kirtanloorii  • 10 hours ago 




With logic like that, there will be full marriage equality in Australia in no time!
 
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Macbill  • 10 hours ago 




I'm cool with thruple unions. What you do in your bedroom mildly interests me in a prurient manner, but I don't really care.
 
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Aussie Dave  • 10 hours ago 




Thankfully he is the only Family First member in the Senate. I hope the Senate reforms that passed this week help ensure that after the next election there are no Family First members in the Senate.
 
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David L. Caster > Aussie Dave  • 10 hours ago 




Apparently this one is one too many.
 
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Aussie Dave > David L. Caster  • 10 hours ago 




Damn right. Also I just realised that because he only got his seat in the last election so he won't be up for re-election in the next election (barring a double dissolution which is being discussed as a real possibility this year anyhow).
 
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Cackalaquiano > Aussie Dave  • 10 hours ago 




I was about to type something about Parliamentary rules being so strange. Then I remembered the US election season is in full swing and none of it makes a damn bit of sense.
 
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Joseph Miceli > Cackalaquiano  • 9 hours ago 




Truly. When I look at the delegate scenarios for both parties, I've come to the conclusion that they are making it up as they go along.
 
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radiofreerome  • 32 minutes ago 




I guess when it comes to straight Australian males, sheep don't count. Word is that the senator taught drivers ed because he can really make a u (ewe?)- turn.
 
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TheSpinMonkey  • 39 minutes ago 




True, one thing politicians are known for is monogamy within the confines of marriage. hahahahaha
 
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grada3784  • an hour ago 




Considering the pigs that so many straight guys are,...........
 
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Gianni  • an hour ago 




I'm comforted to now know and realize that elected officials in the Land Down Under think, believe, and preach the same shit as here in the USA.
 
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Robert Conner  • an hour ago 




Fidelity test?
 
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Falconlights  • 4 hours ago 




Going with his bullshit rationalization of discrimination, many heterosexuals don't deserve marriage, either.
 
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rabbit_ears  • 4 hours ago 




Better ask Chumly's wife what she does while he's away. If she doesn't have several human partners I'm going to bet real money on a huge selection of adult toys, because this dude wouldn't produce sexual excitement in the worst horndogs.
 
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Gianni > rabbit_ears  • an hour ago 




:D That's putting it bluntly, but it makes a good point. :)
 
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Chris Baker  • 5 hours ago 




Marriage is a legal contract between two people, giving them certain rights and benefits. There are no conditions mandated after the couple enters into the legal status of 'marriage' whereby the marriage contract becomes invalid or forfeited. The state has no concern about the details of each particular marriage: whether they have sex or not; how often they have sex; if they have children or not; if they are faithful or not; what sexual positions they assume; etc.
 
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Robert Conner  • 5 hours ago 




Geriatric monkey with fuck ugly tie said what?
 
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david fairfield  • 6 hours ago 




"why not three?". Well, because that's not the issue on the table. And if you have to build your arguments on what ifs, you don't have an argument. NEXT!
 
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agcons  • 7 hours ago 




Do you really want to bring up any hint of "fidelity testing" as a condition of legal marriage, Bob? You cannot have thought this one through.
 
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Cuberly  • 9 hours ago 




I think it's sort of funny. Reading this then clicking on a tweet about Shirley Mclaine discussing her open marriage.
Yes, this asshole is an ignorant fucker. But to imply heteronormative marriage lacks nuance in the "faithful" Dept is pathetic.
http://abcnews.go.com/Entertai...
 
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LADY MABELINE  • 10 hours ago 




Fuck off Bob Day.
 
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Ninja0980  • 10 hours ago 




Right because straight people are always 100% faithful right?
 
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zhera  • 10 hours ago 




Family First Party unknowingly becomes activists for ALL families, while trying to stop gay families. There's a certain ironic karma to it. :D
 
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kanehau  • 10 hours ago 




Nothing beats a double standard.
 
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tcinsf  • 10 hours ago 




The "Family First" party, for troglodytes rejected by the Liberal (read Right wing) party for being too reactionary.
 
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Blake Jordan  • 10 hours ago 




Is he friends with Turnbull?
 
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Clungeflaps  • 10 hours ago 




Sounds like this dumb bogan is projecting/speaking from experience.....he's probably administered hand and oral relief multiple times in public toilets.
 
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Rebecca Gardner > Clungeflaps  • 10 hours ago 




He just has a wide stance.
 
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BobDay 

AUSTRALIA: Senator Tells Parliament That Gay Men Aren’t Faithful Enough To Deserve Marriage
March 19, 2016 LGBT News, Marriage Equality


We’ve heard this one before. Gay Star News reports:

Family First Senator and marriage equality opponent Bob Day on Friday hit out at same-sex marriage, saying that most gay men in relationships are unfaithful to their partners.
During the second reading of the Marriage Equality Amendment Bill, the Senator for South Australia started his speech calling it ‘shameful that activists for marriage equality assume that opponents must be bigots.’
He rhetorically asked the chamber why not allow three people to marry if same-sex marriage is to be legalized.
‘If this bill seeks marriage equality, what is it trying to protect equally? What relationships then are not marriages? Why would redefining marriage stop at same-sex relationships? The bill talks about two people, but why not three?’
The chairman of the Family First Party further quoted gay sex columnist Dan Savage and gay Australian academic and activist Dennis Altman as saying that gay men are typically ‘unfaithful’ and that having one partner to be ‘unrealistic and unnatural’.
There was no vote on marriage following the Senate debate.
  



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Avatar
Gustav2  • 2 days ago 




By the time a student reaches secondary school the damage is done. Just what the religionists want.
 
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Ninja0980 > Gustav2  • 2 days ago 




Indeed, they want them to have killed themselves by then.
 
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grada3784 > Ninja0980  • a day ago 




Christians want little children to suffer. The Bible says so.
 
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Bluto > grada3784  • a day ago 




"Suffering is a gift from god."
~Motherfucking Teresa
 
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Judas Peckerwood > Bluto  • a day ago 




That's SAINT Mother Teresa to you.
 
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Steve Teeter > Judas Peckerwood  • a day ago 




All right. Saint Motherfucking Teresa. Better?
 
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Sashineb > grada3784  • a day ago 




Yeah, Jeebiz said he did not come to bring peace, but to cause dissension. Matthew 10:34-37 — “Jesus said: Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I DID NOT COME TO BRING PEACE, BUT A SWORD. For I have come to turn a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law — a man’s enemies will be the members of his own household.”
 
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CCleverly > Sashineb  • a day ago 




So Jeebiz is actually Satan!?! Well that makes perfect sense.
 
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OSG > Gustav2  • a day ago 




Whatever they can do to maintain the popularity of heterosexuality and keep people breeding little tax payers and workers.
 
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CatApostrophe > Gustav2  • a day ago 




Came here to say just that. I was never bullied very badly, but grades 4-8 had some definite rough patches related to dating and cliques and popularity. Like, around that age, you're sort of beginning to figure out how to be cool and sometimes that means shitting on a kid nobody really likes, even if you don't really have a problem with them.
 
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Ninja0980  • 2 days ago 




All I'll say is this, as a gay man I've only come to associate Christianity with hate, and this is just another example in a long line of them proving that.
 
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bill@19D > Ninja0980  • 2 days ago 




and it is very easy for people to come to that conclusion when you have people putting what is good for belief in their moral code over the safety and well-being of kids. If they need to chose between kids being bullied/ committing suicide or telling people that it is okay to be gay they will go with the former every time.
 
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DaddyRay  • 2 days ago 




Christians - fierce defendors of bigots everywhere
 
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Todd20036 > DaddyRay  • 2 days ago 




It's really gotten to that point. Whenever I hear "Christian" or "religion" my first word association is bigotry or hatred or greed or molestation.
Depends on the day.
 
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CCleverly > Todd20036  • a day ago 




or insanity
 
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OSG > DaddyRay  • a day ago 




Most superficial people on the planet. What do you expect.
 
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bill@19D  • 2 days ago 




from refusing to let marriage equality come to a vote to now the Turnbull government is proving that any talk of supporting LGBT right is just that, talk. They are more then happy to put LGBT rights on the chopping block if it helps their political power.
 
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Diogenes Onionpants > bill@19D  • 2 days ago 




And it's even worse than this extract indicates. As one opponent of the anti-bullying program (George Christensen, the douchebag who claims that talking to kids about sex constitutes pedophilia) makes clear: the group that designs the program is expected to refuse to make the changes, at which point the plan is to eliminate the anti-bullying program altogether.
 
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TampaZeke > bill@19D  • a day ago 




But he went to gay Mardi Gras, so it's OK.
Just ask all the stupid queers who treated him like he was a rock star!
 
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Wynter Marie Starr  • 2 days ago 




I guess the christians that lobbied against this program don't give a shit about dead gay kids. They may think they are good and decent people, but nothing could be further from the truth. Every suicide of an LGBT child due to bullying is now on their hands. I have no doubt they will be swimming in blood. They've just given every bully a free pass and permission to bully.
 
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Herald > Wynter Marie Starr  • 2 days ago 




Remember, bullying impacts and traumatizes more than LGBT kids, straight kids who look effeminate or butch, short kids, skinny kinds, over weight kids, poor kids, ... Apparently they just hate all kids who are not like them.
This is an attack on kids in general, just like the awful RFRA laws impact many more people than just LGBT folks. Their bigotry really is spreading out to harm so many.
And this does not in any way diminish the harm they are doing to the LGBT children and adults.
 
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Wynter Marie Starr > Herald  • a day ago 




Yes, of course it does. All kinds of kids are bullied. It doesn't only impact the kids, it impacts the people who love them as well. It spreads and is costly as well. I didn't focus on those other children and I should have. There are no good reasons for anyone to be bullied. In schools today struggling students are also bullied as are the super bright ones. I blame parents for not teaching their children empathy. No one asks to be smart, struggling, gay, beautiful, unattractive, etc.
 
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Friday > Wynter Marie Starr  • a day ago 




If it's acceptable to bully or oppress LGBT people, nothing says the slurs and 'accusations' have to be 'true,' (Or relevant, for that matter.) ....Just like they'll attack Sikhs if it's OK to hate Muslims, they only care about their own flimsy sense of dominance. They'll as soon call you 'queer' for being 'too smart' as for not being interested in sex with them or whatever. It's about control.
 
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CCleverly > Friday  • a day ago 




Bullies aren't big on the truth.
 
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Wynter Marie Starr > Friday  • a day ago 




I completely agree with you, Friday. A lot of it is about control. Bullying for whatever reason is never acceptable. Bullying due to perception is equally wrong and should not be tolerated.
It's been my experience schools do a very poor job in this area. They are all too willing to sweep it under the rug and wait for victims to age out, drop out, or kill themselves.
 
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Ninja0980  • 2 days ago 




Right, and this party will actually allow a vote on marriage equality if the public demands it?
 Fat chance, you're low enough to go after kids, you sure as hell won't do anything for adults.
 
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bill@19D > Ninja0980  • 2 days ago 




time for electoral change indeed, the current coalition government deserves ZERO trust when it comes to anything having to do with LGBT rights.
 
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Todd20036  • 2 days ago 




Australia, you may think you are more accepting than the US, but we actually got pro-LBGT laws passed, and you can't even get an anti bullying law implemented.
Stop electing tea baggers.
 
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Reality.Bites > Todd20036  • 2 days ago 




This isn't even a law. This is just an anti-bullying educational program.
 
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Diogenes Onionpants > Reality.Bites  • 2 days ago 




That's true, but it's publicly funded, so it does go through parliament.
 
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Reality.Bites > Diogenes Onionpants  • a day ago 




Yes I know that - it's just not right to describe it as an anti bullying law, which implies forbidding the practice itself.
 
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chicago dyke  • 2 days ago 




what a bunch of assholes.
 
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Todd20036 > chicago dyke  • 2 days ago 




More assholes there than at an orgy
 
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j.martindale  • 2 days ago 




I recollect that the British split the number of prisoners they sent to their colonies in Georgia and Australia. That explains a lot.
 
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KCMC > j.martindale  • 2 days ago 




^^^This. History. And all the ,"Ships or Fools." mentally ill.
generations later both countries rate highest for kids diagnosed with ADD/ADHD. History.
 
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j.martindale > KCMC  • 2 days ago 




I had forgotten they also dumped their mental patients on us.
 
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CatApostrophe > j.martindale  • a day ago 




I wanna be a little offended by this thread, but I kinda can't be 'cause I'm really comfortable and, at times, even a little proud of my bipolar. My mom's from Sicily, and Greece used to use Sicily the same way the Brits used Australia: prisoners and mental patients. So there's a higher incidence of mental illness among Sicilians compared to other Italians. There's a joke(ish thing) about us being "half Crazy Greek." So, sorry we got "dumped" on you, but it's important to me that I don't get lumped in with the wrong group of crazies, 'cause my queer, atheistic, bipolar circle is a lot more fun than the puritanical, kid-screwing-over, religious one. Plus, sometimes we get the fun meds, all they get is, like, prayer 'n shit.
 
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j.martindale > CatApostrophe  • a day ago 




Sorry, didn't mean to be insensitive. If it makes you feel better, though, I have spent my days in state mental wards, too...long ago, during my middle age coming out years.
 
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camel54 > j.martindale  • a day ago 




And the crazy Jesus people too.
 
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Luther Kreiger  • a day ago 




We didn't really need more proof of how closely tied bullying and religion really are, but thanks anyway.
 
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bryan  • 2 days ago 




Christianity worldwide synonymous with hate, ignorance and bigotry.
 
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Jean-Marc in Canada > bryan  • a day ago 




.....and Islam, Judaism and many others. Religion is the poison, no matter what its name.
 
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Friday > Jean-Marc in Canada  • a day ago 




Funny how when Atheists keep saying that it's always regarding things done by the same few religions.
 
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Jean-Marc in Canada > Friday  • a day ago 




Why is that funny?
 
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Blake Jordan  • 2 days ago 




Abbott accomplished less in the fight against LGBT+'s than Turnbull has... but I guess Turnball thinks his observing Mardi Gras on location cancels all this out...
 
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tcinsf > Blake Jordan  • a day ago 




I suspect the net effect of Turnbull observing Mardi Gras was "we have to stop these people."
 
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bill@19D  • 2 days ago 




so you have the other side saying that they are opposed to violence against gay people and yet they are opposed to anti-bullying measures or hate crime laws.
this would be like insisting that they are opposed to people running red lights and yet oppose any effort to use red light cameras or special enforcement efforts at intersections.
 
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Elliott > bill@19D  • a day ago 




Or even letting kids know that running red lights is wrong, and letting them see the potential consequences.
 
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BrotherFlounder  • a day ago 




Measured response MY ASS.
 
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Raising_Rlyeh  • a day ago 




"add a requirement that students get parental consent and schools get parent-body consent before opting to use its materials."
Ah yes, because those we like to bully and/or their bigoted parents are really going to want to use this. Also, secondary school, really? By that point beliefs are already ingrained and thus makes this program completely pointless. At least this new PM is showing that he is exactly like Abbott. I hope this costs his party lots of seats and Turbull loses his position as PM as a result.
 
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TrollopeReader  • 2 days ago 




"promotes Marxism" .....um, taking cues from the Cruz campaign? Marxism doesn't think what they think it means ....
 
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TampaZeke  • a day ago 




Oh, but it's OK, because the PM went to gay Mardi Gras, and as we all know, THAT'S what's important. THAT'S what shows a politician's support for the LGBT community; not supporting silly things like a conscience vote on marriage equality or anti-bullying measures.
 
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Hank  • a day ago 




It seems, that each successive Aussie government goes from Bad to Worse, when it comes to LGBT.
 
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Jean-Marc in Canada  • a day ago 




Once again, Christianity, like most religion, continues to promote hatred of the "other" and by doing so, all but codifies the bullying of innocents to death.
 
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bill@19D  • 2 days ago 




" had links to pedophilia" what links? the other side seems to think that recognizing the reality that someone under the age of 18 might have sex = pedophilia.
 
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Silver Badger  • 2 days ago 




"suffer little children to come unto me" Don't these people ever read their bible?
 
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Bomer > Silver Badger  • 2 days ago 




Sure they do. However they read it as suffer as in: to undergo or feel pain, or distress and not the intended archaic form which means to permit.
 
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Silver Badger > Bomer  • a day ago 




I doubt it seriously. The real problem is with including gay people in the basic rights everyone should enjoy. Gay children are still children. Gay people are still people. Hate mongers don't seem to understand this simple fact.
 
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boatboy_srq  • a day ago 




Gotta keep on top of those Marxist paedophiliac pornographers...
/snark
 
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chris10858  • a day ago 




It is surprising that amongst all of the 1st world nations, Australia is so far behind on equality for LGBT people.
 
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Tempus Fuggit > chris10858  • a day ago 




Not really.
 
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Reality.Bites > Tempus Fuggit  • a day ago 




Canada would be just as bad, as would the United States, if we didn't both have constitutionally binding Bill/Charter of Rights. Australia doesn't.
The Chrétien/Martin government wouldn't have done it without the pressure of court rulings and the Harper government wouldn't have done it at all even with court rulings. Were it not for the Charter, we wouldn't be having marriage in Canada till Trudeau took power.
The list of US states that recognized marriage of their own volition because it was the right thing to do is rather pathetically small, even if we include the states that had it vetoed by their governor. In Canada, the provinces don't have jurisdiction over marriage, but Quebec did bring in civil union legislation of its own volition that included everything they legally could do, including automatic recognition of parental rights for lesbian couples and allowing for the ceremonies to be performed by clergy. It was also the only place in the world where the legislation passed unanimously.
http://www.nawl.ca/en/jurisfem...
 
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NancyP  • a day ago 




It sounds as if Australian parents are over-protective of their special snowflakes, and won't brook any teacher dragging a non-Aboriginal bully-snowflake to the principal's office for some discipline. We've corrupted them. Who cares why a kid is bullied? There are plenty of targets, not just gay kids - Aboriginal kids (of course), ugly kids, fat kids, early maturing girls aka "sluts", the poorest kid in the class, smart kids, etc. MOST parents should want some kind of "safe schools" policy. Bullying behavior should not be tolerated on school grounds.
 
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CB  • a day ago 




That's not what jeezus meant by "suffer the little children." What a bunch of cruel, arrogant and heartless people.
 
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Gerry Fisher  • a day ago 




Profiles in courage. [cough, cough]
 
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GuestStop  • a day ago 




What do you expect from a man who probably rapes wallabies? I'm not saying he does, but, I haven't not seen him do it when given the chance.
To think I thought he was more liberal than the last probable wallaby rapist.
 
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CCleverly  • a day ago 




I didn't realize that the Aussie gov. was so tainted with religion.
 
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Circ09  • a day ago 




But did those gay kids still get to put on their prom?
 
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tim  • a day ago 




Once again trans activists infiltrated the anti-bullying program with their "chop off your penis" agenda.
 
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Porkie > tim  • a day ago 




Talking about penises.....
 
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Marc  • 2 days ago 




I said this elsewhere, I agree with this decision. Schools are not the right place for this sort of things.
 
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j.martindale > Marc  • 2 days ago 




Huh? The bullying occurs in the schools. Where the hell are they supposed to stop it if not in the schools?
 
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Marc > j.martindale  • 2 days ago 




Stopping bullying is one thing, ideology is another.
 
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Gustav2 > Marc  • 2 days ago 




Yeah, teaching that Golden Rule thingy is sooo ideological. No society can survive with that!
 
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Marc > Gustav2  • 2 days ago 




I don't think anyone would have a problem with that.
 
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Gustav2 > Marc  • 2 days ago 




Yes, they do. That's the problem.
 
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j.martindale > Gustav2  • 2 days ago 




There is that really stupid element of society that has a dog eat dog mentality that thinks you "toughen people up" by making them submit to bullying. They actually believe that if you follow the teachings of Christ and treat people the way you would like to be treated, you end up with a bunch of sissies. In fact, what you would end up with is a bunch of happy and well-adjusted adults. And when you allow the bullying to continue unabated, you end up with a bunch of thuggish malicious brutes on the one hand, and a bunch of emotionally scarred youths and adults on the other.
 
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Mark_in_MN > j.martindale  • a day ago 




Which makes it all the easier for the thuggish, malicious brutes to dominate the emotionally scarred adults for the rest of their lives, so it serves the thuggish, malicious brutes quite well when they get positions of authority and power. So, of course they don't want to stop their stupidity. It gives them power, or at least the illusion of power.
 
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Ninja0980 > Marc  • 2 days ago 




You were probably someone who enjoyed bullying LGBT youth back in the day as well.
 
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Wynter Marie Starr > Marc  • 2 days ago 




Enlighten us. Where is the "right" place for this sort of thing? If you think bigots are teaching their kids tolerance, you might be deluded.
 
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Marc > Wynter Marie Starr  • 2 days ago 




Parents should be allowed to teach their kids whatever they want.
 
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Bj Lincoln > Marc  • 2 days ago 




The problem is some parents teach their kids to hate others and bullying is ok. When these same kids go into a public place and school, they must learn how to behave according to social norms which include respect for other and that bullying is wrong. Kids spend more time with teachers and friends than they do with their parents 5 days a week. It is the schools where our kids learn to be good adults who can function out in the world.
 
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Reality.Bites > Bj Lincoln  • 2 days ago 




Stop arguing with the troll as if he's a rational person. He is in FAVOUR of anti-gay bullying.
 
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Bj Lincoln > Reality.Bites  • 2 days ago 




He does seem that way. We have been getting a lot of trolls lately.
 
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Wynter Marie Starr > Bj Lincoln  • 2 days ago 




Maybe we should also forget about teaching kids hygiene, Bj. Or maybe science and math. This is obviously a person who hasn't been in a school since he dropped out and has no idea what goes on in schools today.
 
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Bj Lincoln > Wynter Marie Starr  • 2 days ago 




I'm sure most kids would be glad to give up showers after gym class. LOL
 
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Wynter Marie Starr > Bj Lincoln  • 2 days ago 




That isn't how it works in my neck of the woods. Kids go into school in their gym uniforms and stay in them all day. There isn't any showering. Unfortunately, far too many parents who produce bullies and bigots let tv and their bible raise them. By the time they get into school, they have to be taught even basic things like washing their hands after they use the bathroom.
 
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Bj Lincoln > Wynter Marie Starr  • 2 days ago 




From middle school on up, we had gym class then had to shower. I refused to shower and took a D in gym every year for it. It screwed up my GPA as I was an A student in all other classes.
 
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Wynter Marie Starr > Bj Lincoln  • 2 days ago 




Gym was the only class I failed in my senior year of HS because I only went twice.
 
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Paula > Wynter Marie Starr  • a day ago 




I found a class picture form a small Aussie school district where they stopped teaching all of that. The x-stains teach the kids now,
 
Thumbnail
 
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Wynter Marie Starr > Paula  • a day ago 




Lord of The Flies? Australia already has a lot to answer for on that front. They stole an entire generation of indigenous children to christianize them. You'd think they would have learned from that disaster.
 
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Marc > Bj Lincoln  • 2 days ago 




Just teach them that bully is wrong. Leave ideology out of it.
 
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Gustav2 > Marc  • 2 days ago 




What ideology?
 
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Bj Lincoln > Gustav2  • 2 days ago 




Good question. Bullying is wrong but no explanation of why?
 
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Gustav2 > Bj Lincoln  • 2 days ago 




I guess all citizens should be treated equally and with respect is an ideology that should be banned.
 
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DaddyRay > Gustav2  • 2 days ago 




That is just crazy talk - if their kids can't bully other kids how else can they feel they are better than everyone else
 
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Bj Lincoln > Gustav2  • 2 days ago 




Can you imagine what this country would be like if we did? All out war on each other.
 
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grada3784 > Bj Lincoln  • a day ago 




We'd do the last chapter of The Sheep Look Up, by John Brunner. Where America burns itself down.
 
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Wynter Marie Starr > Marc  • 2 days ago 




Okay. I was wrong. You aren't deluded, you're an asshole. If I wanted to teach my children that it would be okay to go and beat up assholes named Marc, that should be allowed? I don't like bullies. I don't like bigots. I don't like stupid people. I have a feeling you qualify in all three categories.
I hope you don't have children for their sake.
 
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j.martindale > Marc  • 2 days ago 




Like hell they should! Society has an interest in how children are raised, not just their parents!
 
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Marc > j.martindale  • 2 days ago 




And who decides what ideology and values should be taught?
 
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j.martindale > Marc  • 2 days ago 




We live in a democracy. School systems make some of these decisions, legislatures make others--just like the people in Australia are doing, except they are making very bad decisions.
 
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Marc > j.martindale  • 2 days ago 




That's why schools should be "neutral".
 
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j.martindale > Marc  • 2 days ago 




Oh, neutral? You mean like letting bullying go on without working to stop it? No, don't answer, please. I know your response already.
 
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bill@19D > Marc  • 2 days ago 




no one is saying that the parents can't teach their kids what they want, but at the same time that doesn't mean the school must not teach them something else.
for example if the parents teach their kids that the earth is only around 6,000 years old would you also say that the school should not teach anything to contradict that?
 
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DaddyRay > bill@19D  • 2 days ago 




The world is also flat and the sun revolves around it
 
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Reality.Bites > DaddyRay  • 2 days ago 




Same as Marc's head.
 
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Porkie > bill@19D  • 2 days ago 




I am! Children have the right to be protected from abuse both physical and psychological.
Teaching your child that they are less, evil or worthless is abuse.
 
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Marc > bill@19D  • 2 days ago 




Schools should teach science, not ideology of any kind.
 
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bill@19D > Marc  • 2 days ago 




first of that homosexuality is a normal variation of human sexuality is not ideology, it is science.
secondly it is not only the job of schools to teach science but to also teach people to be good members of society. ensuring that they do not use violence against people becasue of who they are is a big part of that. so nothing about a bulling program that includes the topic of sexual orientation is ideology.
 
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Gustav2 > Marc  • 2 days ago 




Those against these programs want their ideology of shunning gays and lesbians to rule elementary schools.
 
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BobSF_94117 > Marc  • a day ago 




Silence about minorities -- religious, racial, sexual -- is an ideology itself.
 
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Marc > BobSF_94117  • a day ago 




Then don't complain when they'll teach an ideology you won't like.
 
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BobSF_94117 > Marc  • a day ago 




Find me a school that has been "neutral" about sexuality and I'll show you an empty school.
 
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Bj Lincoln > Marc  • 2 days ago 




Explain what you mean by ideology, because I don't understand or it doesn't mean what you think it does.
 
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Marc > Bj Lincoln  • 2 days ago 




Look at the material that was used.
Schools should teach facts, not opinion and values.
 
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Bj Lincoln > Marc  • 2 days ago 




The fact is people can not go around bullying others because of something they don't like. Society will not permit you to bully or fight with people in public or on the job. Respecting others even when you don't agree with them is the civilized thing to do. You need to go visit a class or 2 and see just what goes on. I was a teacher and just teaching the lessons is only a part of what they have to do. I'm guessing you are not a parent because you would know dealing with children is so much more that teaching facts.
 
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Ninja0980 > Marc  • 2 days ago 




They can do that, just don't expect others to put up with the crap they teach them.
 
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Marc > Ninja0980  • 2 days ago 




They don't have to.
 
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rabbit_ears > Marc  • 2 days ago 




I agree with the thought, but the reliability of some parents is questionable. Some of them should never have been parents to begin with. There should be a qualification exam I think ;-)
 
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chicago dyke > rabbit_ears  • a day ago 




yeah, it sounds nice. but then think of all the really bad parents you know or have seen, people with good educations and high IQs.
some of the most messed up people i've ever known were the children of people who would ace any test you could give them.
 
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tcinsf > chicago dyke  • a day ago 




I don't think he wants to test intelligence, but common sense, and common sense can be sadly lacking in intelligent, wealthy folk.
 
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Porkie > Marc  • 2 days ago 




Follow this link or just google "christian parents murder child"...https://www.google.fr/webhp?so...
 
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Sk3ptic > Marc  • 2 days ago 




They already are. Fool!
 
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Mark > Marc  • 2 days ago 




Wrong! One has to be carefully taught to hate and if not in the schools, then who the hell is going to teach them? So many parents hate and pass it on to their children. Fail!!!!!
 
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Sk3ptic > Marc  • 2 days ago 




Elsewhere beckons you back.
 
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Reality.Bites > Marc  • 2 days ago 




No one cares what you say here or elsewhere. In the kind of language you understand and approve of, shut your fucking mouth before someone shuts it for you.
 
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MalcolmTurnbull 

AUSTRALIA: Government Guts Anti-Bullying Program
March 18, 2016 LGBT News, Religion


Christian groups have won their battle against Australia’s anti-bullying “Safe Schools” program. Via the Guardian:

The Turnbull government has made dramatic changes to its Safe Schools anti-bullying program that have been described by the scheme’s opponents as “gutting” its content.
The changes sharply reduce the lesson content, restrict it to secondary schools, shift the program to a government website, remove all links to other material and sites, and add a requirement that students get parental consent and schools get parent-body consent before opting to use its materials.
The education minister, Simon Birmingham, said this was a “strong but measured response” to the concerns raised by Christian groups and conservative MPs, including the former prime minister Tony Abbott, who demanded for the program to be defunded. There were also claims made that it promoted Marxism and had links to paedophilia and pornography.
The campaign against the program was launched by the virulently anti-LGBT Australian Christian Lobby.
  



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Tag Archives: religion 



AUSTRALIA: Senator Tells Parliament That Gay Men Aren’t Faithful Enough To Deserve Marriage
March 19, 2016 268 Comments

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March 18, 2016 240 Comments

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Peter Montgomery reports at Right Wing Watch: In an interview with the Christian Broadcasting Network this week, right-wing evangelist Franklin Graham declared that Christians have a duty to vote even if their options do not include a candidate with a strong biblical worldview: “And I’m not going to tell people who to vote for, I’m not going to do that ...
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March 18, 2016 277 Comments

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GEORGIA: Big Business Turns Up Heat On Gov. Nathan Deal, Demands Veto On Anti-LGBT RFRA Bill
March 18, 2016 150 Comments

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From the Associated Press: Georgia’s business community and other opponents of a bill protecting those who object to same-sex marriage called Thursday for Gov. Nathan Deal to veto it, likely starting weeks of intense lobbying on the Republican. Some religious and political officials hailed the bill’s passage on Wednesday, thanking GOP leaders of the General Assembly for increasing “religious liberty” ...
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KENTUCKY: Atheist Group Seeks To Troll Ark Encounter Theme Park With “Genocide & Incest” Billboards
March 18, 2016 199 Comments

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March 18, 2016 144 Comments

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From the petition: We request the Obama administration to remove the U.S. ambassador in the Dominican Republic, James W. Brewster for primarily promoting in his official duties an LGBT agenda inconsistent with the Christian cultural values and tradition of the Dominican Republic. Since his arrival in November 2013, he has supported the inauguration of an LGBT Chamber of Commerce. Amb. ...
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AUSTRALIA: Government Guts Anti-Bullying Program
March 18, 2016 129 Comments

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Christian groups have won their battle against Australia’s anti-bullying “Safe Schools” program. Via the Guardian:  The Turnbull government has made dramatic changes to its Safe Schools anti-bullying program that have been described by the scheme’s opponents as “gutting” its content. The changes sharply reduce the lesson content, restrict it to secondary schools, shift the program to a government website, remove ...
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Family Research Council Prayer: Please Ask God To Make The Senate Block Obama’s SCOTUS Nominee
March 17, 2016 125 Comments

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From the setup to the Family Research Council’s prayer of the day: President Obama, now a lame duck in an Election Year has just named his choice for Supreme Court Justice to fill Justice Antonin Scalia’s vacant seat: Merrick Garland, a Chicago born, Harvard educated liberal, currently serving as Chief Judge of the U.S. Court of Appeals for the D.C. ...
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