Jehovah's-Witness . com forum discussions

Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ Did any of us ever enjoy meetings?
/  





 

Did any of us ever enjoy meetings?
by stephanie61092 2 hours ago 8 Replies latest an hour ago   jw experiences
5
10
20
stephanie61092
stephanie61092 2 hours ago

This is a legitimate question. Did any of us ever find real joy in being at the meetings? Did any of us ever finish a meeting and think "I feel so enriched"? Since waking up, I've been able to admit that I've NEVER enjoyed the meetings - EVER! I have ALWAYS been bored and my mind has been elsewhere, but I felt too guilty to admit it. If anything, I've learned a great deal in patience and day dreaming. As an adult, every time I went to the meeting I only ever thought about where I would be going to eat after the meeting and with whom OR what things I needed to get done after the meeting was over. This was even true when I was an active "strong" witness, who commented and took notes during each meeting.
A little while ago I was hanging out with a friend who is also DFed but not 'coming back' and they said to me "religion is sitting in a church and thinking about going kayaking. Spirituality is sitting in a kayak and thinking about God." That thought has really been resonating with me these past few days.
 +8 / -0
brandnew
brandnew 2 hours ago
No
 
OneEyedJoe
OneEyedJoe 2 hours ago
I did when I was about 12 and could answer up as good as the adults. Made me feel like a grown-up. But that makes sense because the material studied was at roughly a 6th grade level back then (probably 3rd or 4th grade nowadays). After that it was all downhill.
 +3 / -0
Rattigan350
Rattigan350 2 hours ago

When I was in school I liked school because I could learn things and because there were girls there.
Back in the day, I liked meetings because I could learn things and because there were girls there.

 +1 / -0
GrreatTeacher
GrreatTeacher 2 hours ago

No, but I learned how to tolerate boredom for a looong time.
I also did a lot of what I imagine meditation to be: just sitting still and letting the thoughts flit by.
They say meditation is a good stress reducer, so maybe it was slightly beneficial?
And then I quit going once I was an adult, so it might have been stressful listening to the same thing for 30 years.
But, no, can't say I ever enjoyed them. Our bookstudy never even had goody night. Everyone just went right home. :frowning:
 +1 / -0
LisaRose
LisaRose 2 hours ago
No, never, I found them painful. I learned a few years ago that I have ADHD, so that was probably part of the reason. But really, knowing now that the purpose of the meetings was to create fear, obligation and guilt, it's not surprising they weren't enjoyable.
 
baker
baker 2 hours ago

no, i went outside and watched the old timers smoke
 
Lieu
Lieu an hour ago

Nope. They were solemn and boring. The WT study was particularly excruciatingly boring. Everyone has already read the article, just ask the dayum questions, don't bore us all to death reading it allowed.
Sometimes, I did enjoy the 2nd school where we would put candy corns in our teeth to make the 'student' laugh. The best part of the school were the sisters. That's the only time you heard a general conversation. (Takes far more work than a Bible reading)
 
Satan
Satan an hour ago

I always thought out strategies to conquer others in many war video games during the meetings.
lol
As you said, at least I developed the ability to daydream...
 

5
10
20




Share this topic






Related Topics
TTWSYF
What's up with the HEBREWS translation?
by TTWSYF 3 months ago
blondie
Blondie's Highlights from 11-15-2015 WT (FAITH)
by blondie 4 months ago
new boy
My Bethel Experience Part 13 "Love and Sex" at Bethel
by new boy 2 months ago
What Now?
Our Letter to Our Family
by What Now? 2 months ago
new boy
My Bthel Experince Part 19 The Last Chapter..(really) Bethel Overseers
by new boy 2 months ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/5633932280201216/did-any-us-ever-enjoy-meetings





Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ I no longer feel smart as a JW, I feel dumb...
/  





 

I no longer feel smart as a JW, I feel dumb...
by thedepressedsoul 6 hours ago 16 Replies latest 2 hours ago   watchtower bible
5
10
20
thedepressedsoul
thedepressedsoul 6 hours ago

I don't want anyone to take this the wrong way but I use to at least feel smart as a JW. When I went to Thursday night meetings, I at least felt like I was a student, that I was learning how to speak publicly, I could prepare my own comments, I could answer points that I learned from the weekly bible reading. I felt like at the door, a JW could put up a fight.
Anymore, I just feel like I'm being treated like an idiot, being a JW. I even feel like an "idiot" studying for the meetings.
We had a meeting for field service recently. An old time brother lead the group. He prepared how to put up a defense if someone at the door questions a certain way our bible is translated. He pulled out the Kingdom Interlinear, showed how the Greek texts were written and how it was translated. I actually felt like it was something in depth for once! To my surprise, all morning I heard nothing but fellow JW's making fun of this brother. How "no one will actually argue with us at the door over that" or "he's an old timer". While they were true, it still shocked me. The old time brother may not even know that they are no longer printing that book. This brother spent his whole life, dedicated, just to be mocked for how in depth he used to study.
The new Thursday nights is even worse! You no longer give what you learned from the bible reading. It's two pre-made answers followed by two specific questions. It's no longer what you found in your reading. The demos are now videos, in between demos it even says, "Take householder information" on the screen. They are such basic, and simple presentations. They even have to tell you to take information? I just feel dumb sitting there and when I prepare. The Watchtower has gotten even worse. I'm not even sure the point of it anymore. It's more about gloating about the organization and doctrine, then actually teaching you something. People just re-repeat the paragraph for their answers.
Cart witnessing we're being taught not to get into any doctrine issues but to just focus on getting the individuals information and leaving him with literature. In door to door if someone argues, we just leave now.
I don't believe this crap, I am stuck in and I feel like I am being treated like a pre-schooler with how they are setting everything up. Better yet, they tell you not to go to college... Can't say I'm feeling like I am getting the "best education" as they like to put it.
Sorry for the rant!


 +12 / -0
stuckinarut2
stuckinarut2 6 hours ago

Being a clone and a robot doesn't make one smart....
Being an individual who can think, reason and research facts for oneself...Well, THAT is smart!
 +2 / -0
sparrowdown
sparrowdown 6 hours ago

When they went into more detail with their literature and meeting talks it wasn't because the information was more intellient it was just bolder and more unapologetic in its lies. The dumbing down of the information you are observing just means they know they can't get away with as much anymore so they keep it vague and superficial.
They want you to feel dumb, but you are not dumb the information is dumb.
 +6 / -0
LostGeneration
LostGeneration 5 hours ago
They used to require you to know the doctrine. Now as long as you can say jw.org and hand out pieces of paper you are qualified. Oh and OBEY whatever the WT says.
 +5 / -0
Naoscillator
Naoscillator 5 hours ago

The dumbing down of the information you are observing just means they know they can't get away with as much anymore so they keep it vague and superficial.
Couldn't have said it better. This is especially true of the last couple of times they tried to tackle evolution in the magazines.
 +2 / -0
Finkelstein
Finkelstein 4 hours ago

The WTS has always been able to exploit people's ignorance of even what the bible says with intelligent honesty as a means to lure people into their pertaining version of bible wisdom, so they too can be turned into the organization's public sales representatives .

These doctrines were set to attract attention but they were not in binding accordance to what the bible really says or meant to say, most bible theologians today would agree to that.
Did the WTS's training help people to be able to talk to others in discussion ?
I would say yes if the person gave public talks and went out in service often, I did.

 +1 / -0
TheMark
TheMark 4 hours ago

In the past it only seemed in depth because they had all these calculations and prophecy interpretations applied to themselves. They kept going on about all that 1914 stuff until it became evident to everyone that the generation was not what they thought it was. After that, maybe starting 1994 or so, they had nothing left to say.
 +4 / -0
Finkelstein
Finkelstein 4 hours ago

The WTS sold a tainted commercialized version of the Gospel devised specifically to support the proliferation of the literature the organization published.
The ongoing pressing indoctrination to those doctrines created the reaction of what the WTS leaders wanted and expected.

So one shouldn't feel overly strung out with guilt or shame for being involved in this somewhat commercialized indoctrination. On the other hand better to be awoken to this reality of it and carry on with self respect and personal integrity .
I feel the Watchtower Corporation is on its way of winding down to a mere shadow of itself in next few years, ironically it will be the truth that is making this causative effect.

 +4 / -0
breakfast of champions
breakfast of champions 4 hours ago

I can appreciate the rant!
My wife feels similarly as you. Everything presented at the meetings is simplistic and dumbed down.
But I think you should feel smart, just for the fact you know this stuff is dumb! Others think it's thre greatest thing since sliced bread. . . .
 +7 / -0
cofty
cofty 4 hours ago

thedepressedsoul - I sympathise with your feelings. The rot began in the early 80s with the release of the "Reasoning" book. We were instructed that when a "householder" raised an objection to get the book out and read the answer.
I was a pioneer at the time and I never took the book out ever. I prided myself on being able to answer anything from the bible alone. It seems to be 100 times worse now. I couldn't stand it.
 +3 / -0
Crazyguy
Crazyguy 3 hours ago
I have met the brother who wrote the insight books as well as other stuff . He said the ones left are just idiots. With out fred franz, dulap, franz and a couple other that all left or died theres no one left to write anything of substance.
 +5 / -0
Magnum
Magnum 3 hours ago

Good rant. Don't apologize; I enjoyed it.
The new Thursday nights is even worse! You no longer give what you learned from the bible reading. It's two pre-made answers followed by two specific questions. It's no longer what you found in your reading.
That's because they want it all controlled. They know their doctrine has too many holes in it. Can you imagine what the meetings would be like if the weekly Bible reading was completely open to honest analysis, questioning, etc.? The org fears that so it formats the meetings such that that can't happen.
Even though I admire the older brother and prefer the old-timers like him and I agree with your general point, the sad truth is that what the old brother did was probably not really "in depth". He probably just pointed to single word translations and doesn't know anything about grammar, syntax, etc. - about the way whole clauses, sentences, and passages are translated. He probably couldn't in the least show that the NWT is well-translated.
JWdom is embarrassingly dumbed down now, but as I look back, I realize we were really "dumb" in the older days, too, even though the material was meatier. We thought we were Bible scholars, but I now realize that was an illusion.
sparrowdown: When they went into more detail with their literature and meeting talks it wasn't because the information was more intellient it was just bolder and more unapologetic in its lies. The dumbing down of the information you are observing just means they know they can't get away with as much anymore so they keep it vague and superficial.
Excellent insight and analysis! It was just bolder back then, and it had a confident, unapologetic, almost cocky tone. You're so right. The dumbing down is because they know now that if they try that bold, really specific stuff, they'll get pulverized and exposed online, in arguments, etc.
thedepressedsoul: Cart witnessing we're being taught not to get into any doctrine issues but to just focus on getting the individuals information and leaving him with literature. In door to door if someone argues, we just leave now.
That's because of what sparrowdown said (see above). The boldness is gone. They (the org and individual JWs) run from challenges now.
If JWs are right, then doesn't it seem that they should be getting bolder, louder, more confident, etc. since with every passing day they supposedly get closer to the end??? Instead, they get weaker, wimpier.
TheMark: In the past it only seemed in depth because they had all these calculations and prophecy interpretations applied to themselves. They kept going on about all that 1914 stuff until it became evident to everyone that the generation was not what they thought it was. After that, maybe starting 1994 or so, they had nothing left to say.
I agree
cofty: We were instructed that when a "householder" raised an objection to get the book out and read the answer. I was a pioneer at the time and I never took the book out ever. I prided myself on being able to answer anything from the bible alone.
Exactly the same with me.
It seems to be 100 times worse now. I couldn't stand it.
I agree that it is way worse now, and I couldn't stand it, either. It got so dumbed down that I just couldn't take it anymore; I had to get out of there.
 +4 / -0
sparrowdown
sparrowdown 3 hours ago

The other thing to be aware of is that ignorant people are easier to control. Do yourself a favor and research all WT teachings using non-WT sources. Really get your teeth into it and you will be shocked at how deceptive they are.
 +4 / -0
stephanie61092
stephanie61092 3 hours ago

Don't apologize. Your rant echos my thoughts as well as many others. Even my still very "in" JW mother says that the information presented in the literature and at the meetings is "fluff". The society knows that the new converts can't handle anything that involves much Bible research and merely relies on pulling on their heart strings. It's pathetic, really.

 +3 / -0
Billy the Ex-Bethelite
Billy the Ex-Bethelite 2 hours ago


When I went to Thursday night meetings, I at least felt like I was a student, that I was learning how to speak publicly, I could prepare my own comments, I could answer points that I learned from the weekly bible reading.
Judging from your OP, you are also a good writer! You're still smart. It's the organization that's gotten dumb. It's a 19th century apocalyptic sect that has survived into this 21st century by evolving. After all of their failed prophecies and now all the information on the Internet, they can't attract intelligent new recruits. So they have to go with "simplified" everything and appeal to emotions rather than intellect.

 +4 / -0
DesirousOfChange
DesirousOfChange 2 hours ago

They used to be much better disguising themselves as a religion. The internet has blown their cover. Now they are just a publishing & real estate empire in a clown's masquerade as a quasi religion (cult -- everyone in the "world" sees them as a weird cut).
Doc

 +3 / -0
EndofMysteries
EndofMysteries 2 hours ago

we're being taught not to get into any doctrine issues......In door to door if someone argues, we just leave now.
Pretty soon it will be a DFing matter if you get into doctrine or discuss anything if anybody brings up opposition or counter argument. The GB will say something about how satan has become super smart and has taught all the worldly people lies so powerful if anybody has a discussion with one who aren't sheep bible students who will unquestionably accept anything they are told, then it's as bad as talking to an apostate, etc. They are getting desperate since anybody who googles jehovah's witnesses will know more then members themselves.
 +2 / -0

5
10
20




Share this topic






Related Topics
Hurting
Leaving the JWs
by Hurting 5 days ago
Freeandclear
My Story
by Freeandclear a month ago
stephanie61092
Finally posting and I'm FRUSTRATED!!!
by stephanie61092 a month ago
new boy
How Did My Book Come About?
by new boy a month ago
wayoutthere
Chronic relapse - what do I do?
by wayoutthere 4 days ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/5748000974438400/no-longer-feel-smart-jw-feel-dumb





Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ Ok, just received my memorial invitation.
/  





 

Ok, just received my memorial invitation.
by Je.suis.oisif 18 hours ago 20 Replies latest 7 hours ago   watchtower beliefs
«
 1
 2
 »
 5
10
20
Je.suis.oisif
Je.suis.oisif 18 hours ago

Mornin' all. Saw the jdubs going from door to door just now. UK time 10:15 am. Pushed myself to answer door instead od hiding. They seemed embarrased to see me. I was polite. I accepted the invitation, but asked them why the memorial date this year didn't coincide with the Jewish passover! They responded with " that's the date of the memorial"
I said " I know, nut why is it a month out this year? Don't we always celebrate this event at the same time as the passover"?
One asked " How, when is the passover"?
I replied " It's 22cnd/23rd April".
No come back, just that they'd be happy to see me. I said sure. Then promptly put it in the waste paper bin.
 +7 / -0
Je.suis.oisif
Je.suis.oisif 18 hours ago
*od & nut should read of & but. Still cant edit posts from my tablet.
 
Phizzy
Phizzy 17 hours ago
I liked it as it was, I thought you were calling the Holy Jovo a nut !
 +2 / -0
jookbeard
jookbeard 17 hours ago
I'm in the UK as well and nothing through my letter box , nothing last year either
 
jhine
jhine 17 hours ago

I've had one . I'm in the MIdlands . UK
Jan
 
notsurewheretogo
notsurewheretogo 17 hours ago
I got mine too but had 2 elders pop round saying they were visiting inactive ones with the invite and the "Return t Jehoover" brochure...which I declined.
 +3 / -0
Je.suis.oisif
Je.suis.oisif 16 hours ago

The eldubs gave up after 2 attempts to speak to me. They're frightened of my husband hee hee. He's a dour burly Scotsman. Even before they'd ever met him. Could count on one hand how many times met in all these years. They'd come to me and say " we're frightened of your husband"! I'd ask why?, since they didn't know him. They told me they had a picture in their heads of an Aberdeen Angus cow. OK. We've been together 43yrs, and a more balanced nicer guy you'd ever hope to meet. We all used to say he's more humble than the majority at the Kh.
Says a lot about how they judge. They must have projected their opinion of me onto my partner and ran with it. Lol!
 +2 / -0
Sabin
Sabin 15 hours ago
They have got the date wrong, I checked it on my worldly calendar. What's the story with that one?
 
DATA-DOG
DATA-DOG 15 hours ago

This is the last memorial before the big A, so the GB figured they would celebrate it whenever they wanted to. 😎
DD
 +4 / -0
lriddle80
lriddle80 14 hours ago
I read some article that the Jewish calendar was incorrect for some reason
 
lriddle80
lriddle80 14 hours ago
http://www.studiesintheword.org/jewish_calendar_errors.htm
 
DATA-DOG
DATA-DOG 14 hours ago

I don't think anyone can know when the correct date is anymore. Everything is so messed up with Gregorian calendar vs Lunar calendar. We have leap years for who knows how long.. When was the first official day for humans, from Gods view? It could really be Saturday right now!!
Who the hell knows??? Is there a God who gives a rat's ass???
Early Xians met in private homes and had dinner together, and there is no clear indicator that they only celebrated the memorial once a year. Jesus said to "keep doing it" and mentioned "as often as you do it". Where does the Bible say to remember the death of The Christ only once a year, like we are still under the Mosaic Law and required to attend festivals?? That stuff is done....
DD
 +3 / -0
Heaven
Heaven 14 hours ago

It has been my experience that JWs don't know how to answer questions.
Got my invite this week as well. I'm in Ontario, Canada. It was a hit and run. No contact made No door knock and no video shown (I work from home).
Once again, I am busy on whatever date this thing is being held. My sock drawer is a mess and needs immediate attention... on that specific day!

 +3 / -0
Je.suis.oisif
Je.suis.oisif 14 hours ago

Heaven,
I've done everything to do with wardrobes, drawers etc. I've read up on the Maria Kondo's approach and applied it. I threw out the last shoes and handbags associated with my life as a jdub. Its so liberating. So I don't have the luxury of using the sock drawer as an excuse lol. I'm just not going.
 +1 / -0
Heaven
Heaven 14 hours ago


jso said: I don't have the luxury of using the sock drawer as an excuse lol. I'm just not going.
There's always the old standby of needing to change the tires on your jeep. Or needing to wash your hair. 

 +3 / -0
WTWizard
WTWizard 13 hours ago

They want my answer? I don't mind rejecting Jesus by blowing the whole thing off, but I am not going to waste my time pretending to accept that thing by showing up only to find out that I am in fact rejecting Jesus (and doing it the hard way to boot). And why are they rejecting Astaroth as well by not doing any of the things that honor spring? You know, the eggs, the chickens, the rabbits, the flowers?
As for showing up, they already got Astaroth permanently mad at me enough by getting me to attend too many of those things. I can only hope their electricity goes out (and their backup lighting system craps out) just in time for the "Everyone please find your seats, the memorial is about to start" announcement. And I hope it stays out, everywhere in every venue where these events are happening, for the duration of the events.

 +1 / -0
Half banana
Half banana 13 hours ago

Heaven, I like your idea of unrealistic excuses.
How about, "I can't come as I have no one to look after my pet wombat."
 +1 / -0
No Longer a JW Brother
No Longer a JW Brother 12 hours ago
Damn I better get to the memorial if I want to survive the big aramgeddon.

 +1 / -0
Heaven
Heaven 10 hours ago

LOL @ Half banana. I shall add that one to my list.

 
OUTLAW
OUTLAW 8 hours ago


I accepted the invitation, but asked them why the memorial date this year didn't coincide with the Jewish passover! They responded with " that's the date of the memorial"
It`s Not Easy To get An Intelligent Answer..
...............From JW`s At Your Door........................How Do They Find Their Way Home?

......Image result for Dumb and dumber...............Image result for Confused man
 +2 / -0

«
 1
 2
 »
 5
10
20




Share this topic






Related Topics
Pattytheperfect1
First post after a year or two of lurking on this site-Sorry for the length!
by Pattytheperfect1 2 years ago
Leela1
Closer/death/Funerals
by Leela1 2 days ago
stephanie61092
Finally posting and I'm FRUSTRATED!!!
by stephanie61092 a month ago
pandorasbox1914
Overlapping Generation
by pandorasbox1914 a month ago
The Hermit
The Hermit's story PART 3
by The Hermit 2 months ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/5740601282658304/ok-just-received-my-memorial-invitation





Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ Ok, just received my memorial invitation.
/  





 

Ok, just received my memorial invitation.
by Je.suis.oisif 18 hours ago 20 Replies latest 7 hours ago   watchtower beliefs
«
 1
 2
 »
5
10
20
sparrowdown
sparrowdown 7 hours ago

The problem is he was speaking JW the language of pure nonsense and you were speaking english.
 

«
 1
 2
 »
5
10
20




Share this topic



Topic Summary
mornin' all.
saw the jdubs going from door to door just now.
uk time 10:15 am.



Related Topics
Pattytheperfect1
First post after a year or two of lurking on this site-Sorry for the length!
by Pattytheperfect1 2 years ago
Leela1
Closer/death/Funerals
by Leela1 2 days ago
stephanie61092
Finally posting and I'm FRUSTRATED!!!
by stephanie61092 a month ago
pandorasbox1914
Overlapping Generation
by pandorasbox1914 a month ago
The Hermit
The Hermit's story PART 3
by The Hermit 2 months ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/5740601282658304/ok-just-received-my-memorial-invitation?page=2&size=20





Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ J R Brown
/  





 

J R Brown
by Slidin Fast 10 hours ago 6 Replies latest 28 minutes ago   watchtower scandals
5
10
20
Slidin Fast
Slidin Fast 10 hours ago

I have been reading John Bechtel's blog. Someone provided a link recently and it is brilliant. Anyone that enjoys personal experiences including bethel tales will love this. This quote is a great story at the expense of J R Brown. I challenge you to read it without a chuckle. Enjoy!
http://www.johnbechtelblog.com
Although these French-speaking congregations in Brooklyn and Newark were composed entirely of Haitians and a handful of us Bethelites, a black American Circuit Overseer named Brother Brown was assigned as our Circuit Overseer. Brother Brown’s French was considerably worse than mine, which in itself is a stretch of credulity, but I also thought he was very pompous and full of himself. Having completely forgotten my own egregious sins in the arrogance department just a few years before in Oil City, I felt it encumbent upon me to take some of the wind out of Brother Brown’s sails. I approached him after a church service one evening and asked to speak to him in private. Now when a member of the congregation asks for a private audience, you know something of grave concern is about to be brought up. I explained with a solemn expression that my roommate, a skinny French kid named Dominique, had been obfuscating for some time. I had not told anyone about it until now, but it was getting out of hand, I explained. Only this week Dominique had obfuscated publicly, right in the elevator at Bethel. Obviously, I was counting on (a) Brother Brown not knowing what obfuscation meant, and (b) his not being willing to acknowledge that fact and actually ask me what it meant. Brother Brown lived up to my expectations, nodded his head gravely, thanked me for bringing this to his attention, and told me he would keep it in confidence and take appropriate action. Of course when Brother Brown got home and looked up obfuscation in the dictionary, he knew he’d been had. Brother Brown was never able to look me in the face again. I learned recently that Brother Brown today is the Public Spokesperson for the organization. How utterly appropriate. (In explanation to my reader, the word obfuscate means to obscure. This word is perhaps most often used to refer to political speeches where the goal is to use a lot of words but conceal your real position on matters. I chose the word obfuscate because of its double meaning, and also because to a JW elder who is always on the lookout for sexual infractions, it sounded ominous and brought to mind masturbate ??? A triple twist in this situation was that the Latin root words of obfuscate are ob (in the way) and fuscus (dark brown), so my use of obfuscate was also a play on words with Brother Brown. Oh well, you had to be there.)

 +2 / -0
Barrold Bonds
Barrold Bonds 8 hours ago
I haven't heard a peep out of JR Brown in a long time.
 +1 / -0
wannaexit
wannaexit 7 hours ago
J.R Brown--another pompous ass

 +2 / -0
Slidin Fast
Slidin Fast 6 hours ago

The title was supposed to be J R Brown and Obfuscation but the end got chopped off.
I love the way he was set up in this story.
 +1 / -0
LostGeneration
LostGeneration 5 hours ago

I haven't heard a peep out of JR Brown in a long time.
Maybe because he is a shitty spokesman





 
Magnum
Magnum 4 hours ago

I haven't heard a peep out of JR Brown in a long time.

I haven't, either, and I've been wondering about him. Some years ago, I heard him give a couple of talks - one at a special city event in a big city auditorium and another at a Kingdom Hall dedication. He came across as being one of the most arrogant, pompous jerks I've ever been exposed to.
I'm surprised he hasn't appeared in any of the broadcasts (maybe he has and I'm just not aware of it).
 
compound complex
compound complex 28 minutes ago

John, Dom and I were together in the French congregation, but earlier than referred to here. I had already left. We were on the ground floor of the "French Work." It was a joy working with the loving and lovable Haitians.
Our weekends (once off work at noon on Saturday) were spent in the field and doing meetings. Our school and service meeting were Saturday night (we shared the Manhattan upstairs room with 3 other congregations), we returned home around midnight, got up early Sunday morning to spend the day in field service, took luncheon with the dear and generous Haitian friends (who stuffed us), then went to Sunday meeting at 4:00 p.m. and tried to stay awake.
After we cleaned up our rented meeting room, we took the subway home and arrived back to Bethel around 7:30 p.m. It was like this every weekend. It was fun but this nonstop routine eventually exhausted even the strongest of us.
I wouldn't have traded the above for anything. It made the NY experience bearable. Sadly, the physical and mental strain of meeting prep (We delivered all parts in French, of course.), travel, and helping the friends with their personal problems took its toll.
God, it was a blast!
CoCo
 

5
10
20




Share this topic






Related Topics
Terry
SPECIAL INTERVIEW with Jehovah!
by Terry 4 years ago
Terry
JEHOVAH consents to sit down with a reporter for a one on one INTERVIEW!
by Terry a year ago
Calebs Airplane
ANOTHER FREEMASON buys Watchtower properties... (Jared Kushner)
by Calebs Airplane 2 years ago
Pistoff
R and me
by Pistoff 2 years ago
Pistoff
R and me, part 2
by Pistoff 2 years ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/5638947996696576/j-r-brown






Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ Closer/death/Funerals
/  





 

Closer/death/Funerals
by Leela1 2 days ago 35 Replies latest a day ago   jw experiences
«
 1
 2
 »
 5
10
20
Leela1
Leela1 2 days ago

Hello all I am fairly new to this site even though I have been DA since I was 16 years old I am now 35 years old. I have had very little contact with my family since I left maybe a handful of times over the years. I thought I put the past behind me and moved on I have 4 amazing kids of my own really supportive partner and great friends who have become my family. However, through FB I have learned from an old family friend that my Dad who is now in his 70`s is very ill and is getting closer to passing away. I have major issues with my Dad way more than with any other member of my family. My apologies this will be a long post I really have no one who understands what I went through. Some background my Dad is an Elder and was an elder as I was growing up. My Dad was very strict JW on the extreme side followed every belief to the core and expected us to follow as well. I was baptized very young at 13 (my parents both pressured me) I remember growing up always feeling pressure from my dad to be the perfect JW daughter and I could never be good enough. After my baptism the expectations of perfection increased I couldn’t live up to it and I started to fade and over the next 2 years from 14-16 I gradually stopped going to meetings and quit filed service. I remember telling my parents that I couldn’t do it anymore I was not going to anymore meetings my dad looked me in the eye and told me if I didn’t go than I would be treated like a DF person in the home. They couldn’t kick me out they were still responsible for me until I was 18 but they could still start shunning me. From that day forward my Dad stopped talking to me unless he really had to and ordered the rest of the family to do so. I was not allowed to eat at the table with my family (as the bible teaches to not break bread with sinners) I would come down get my food and go eat it alone in my room. I was shunned in my home before I even left no one in my family barely talked to me for almost 2 years only talked to me when they had to or to make sure my physical needs were taken care of. Needless to say after almost 2 years of this treatment I suffered an episode of major depression and unfortunately when I was 16 I tried to end my life but taking a few bottles of pills. At the time I really felt like my life was over I saw no way out. My mom had fortunately found me the next morning when I didn’t get up for school. I was unconscious but I was rushed to the hospital and they revived me and I stayed in a psychiatric unit for 2 weeks. When I was released it was mandatory that my parents take me to my weekly appointment with my psychiatrist. I attended these sessions until I turned 18 and I can say that my psychiatrist saved my life. Unfortunately my family never came around and my Dad increased his negative manipulation of me after my suicide attempt and during my treatment. My dad never came to the hospital to see me (only my mom and she always came with an Elder) and when I came back from the hospital he told me that I would have to go to a judicial hearing because of my suicide attempt and was angry at me because my behavior might have caused him to lose his eldership. My dad really thought that I was demonized and told me often of that fact. We went from barely talking to him telling me daily that I was demonized. The day I was supposed to go for my Judicial hearing to find out if I would be DF because of my suicide attempt I was rescued by an amazing non JW friend and her family who moved me into their home and let me live with them until I was 18. I really think that had I went to the Judicial Committee the stress of it may have pushed me further into mental illness and I may have ended my life.
So the point of all of this if you’re still reading is that I struggled for years grieving the loss of my family. I have no blood relatives that I speak to or see. I have worked hard to live a good life and take care of my mental health and be a good mom for my kids so they never have to go through what I went through. But I have been thinking about trying to find my Dad and go and see him before he dies so I can tell him how much he hurt me but also to tell him that I forgive him and let go of all of the past and all of the hurt. I feel like maybe this would be final closer for me.
However, I am worried about going back and dealing with him again and all the emotions it will bring and whether it is really worth going through it as he probably has not changed.
My question is if any of you have been DA or DF from your family and have had little to no contact did you reach out to your family members for closer later on? Or do any of you have any direct experience dealing with a JW family member who passed away? Did you get to go to the funeral? What happened? were you allowed at the service or the wake? How did you find seeing your family members after such a long time with no contact? Any comments would be helpful before I make the decisions to try to see my dad.
 +21 / -0
Xanthippe
Xanthippe 2 days ago

Oh Leela I am so sorry the cult mind-controlled your family to that extent. You've been through so much my heart goes out to you. I will try and answer a few of your questions in case my experiences will help.
My family have had very little to do with me for 27 years since we Da'ed, mainly we do funerals. It was weird seeing them all at my mother's bedside in hospital, but they seemed like strangers. I did go to my mother's funeral at a KH. Basically the JWs didn't speak to me. My dad died four months later so I got together with my JW family to do that funeral. After that I tried to meet up with my sister for a coffee or a meal, I sent her a note suggesting this. I thought after all we'd been through the past few months... No dice, she wouldn't meet me, it might stumble someone.
Then my husband died, they came to his funeral, one sister and my brother plus their partners. They went back to not phoning me about six weeks later. They would allow me to phone them but made it clear that I was persona non grata. Even though I had a 13 year old daughter they didn't occasionally phone to see if she was ok. That isn't good enough for me I'm afraid so I left them to it.
I don't know, your father sounds very abusive to me so I don't think he is going to apologise and possibly he might not even speak to you. I don't know what to suggest but it's good to have you here. You've done so well making a new life and new family for yourself. 🌷
 +10 / -0
baker
baker 2 days ago
So sad to have to go thru this cause armageddon was supposed to have come already and this situation was never planned on. I watched a family member breathe their last breath who was a pioneer but most of the relatives were catholic. It was chaotic, with some saying she is in a better place and others saying she is now in Jehovah,s memory. I saw her pass and it was peaceful, but the people left behind were anything but peaceful. If I had my choice I would never have gone.
 +3 / -0
OrphanCrow
OrphanCrow 2 days ago

Leela: However, I am worried about going back and dealing with him again and all the emotions it will bring and whether it is really worth going through it as he probably has not changed.
My question is if any of you have been DA or DF from your family and have had little to no contact did you reach out to your family members for closer later on? Or do any of you have any direct experience dealing with a JW family member who passed away? Did you get to go to the funeral? What happened? were you allowed at the service or the wake? How did you find seeing your family members after such a long time with no contact? Any comments would be helpful before I make the decisions to try to see my dad.
Yes, if you decide to go see your father, it will bring up all sorts of extreme and difficult emotions.
However, on the plus side, you will be in the position of being the one with the power. Going to see your father could be quite healing for you - just to be physically in the room with him when he is powerless and you have all the power, could be very empowering for you.
He will be the one who is sick and without power - you will be the powerful one. You will have the strength when he has none. You will no longer be the child with the powerful father - you will be the adult with all the power.
Good luck. And don't forget that you are all grown up now - you are no longer that child without power. Walk into the room as the adult woman you are. Bravely and without fear.
 +18 / -0
Finkelstein
Finkelstein 2 days ago

The breaking apart of families is one the most damaging thing about this religions cult, which has indirectly caused numerous suicides over the years.

As a suggestion I would make a motion to show your concern over your father's health to your family, if he's in a hospital, try to make a visit with a card and some flowers if possible.

Show concern but don't bend over too much hurting yourself in the process if they reject your offer or attempt to make a visit.
JWS are a highly controlled indoctrinated people, so personal behavior and reaction can vary from one person to another.
In other words be prepared and have in place prepared motions for you to react to their actions.
If this meet up fails at least it is established that you cared and tried to make a motion of concern.
Also keep in mind that JWS like to taint people's character toward ones who left the organization, this reconfirms that they are sanctimoniously righteous themselves.

Best of luck otherwise.

 +6 / -0
steve2
steve2 2 days ago

What a tough road you were on in your later teen years, Leela! Two things stand out:
(1) Your father's hugely negative influence over others in the household to show utter disdain because of your courageous decision to stop attending meetings;
(2) despite a total absence of family support, you mustered your innate resilience in getting on with your life and now have your own family - your partner and your four children. Leela, these are your family - not the one that scorned you all those 27 years ago.
My view is that because your family of origin have treated you as one who is dead since 16, you have already said "Goodbye" to them. Sadly, you do not count in their eyes otherwise they would have told you directly about your father's illness. They didn't. You found out through Facebook.
Man, does that ever reflect their still treating you as one who is dead!
Weigh up the Pros and Cons of trying to resume even limited contact. My hunch is it will re-trigger extremely painful memories and simply subject you to further disdain and disapproval.
Unless you identify actual evidence of a softening towards you, Leela, refrain from contacting them. Focus insteand on looking after yourself and making your home a happy one for your partner and children. As much as you have been affected by what you were put through at 16, you are in actuality a pretty strong resilient woman who has got what it takes to make her own meaningful life away from parental condemnation. More power to you! 
 +14 / -0
brandnew
brandnew 2 days ago

Leela!!!!! Doncha love the barbecues where nobody cares whatcha drink, or smoke, or if theres a birthday cake ????
Its sooooooo freakin cooool!!!! Seize the day my friend.
 +6 / -0
LisaRose
LisaRose 2 days ago

I saw my mom a few months before she died, but then she said she wanted to die with a clean conscience and couldn't see me anymore. I did go to the funeral, I was even "allowed" to go to the reception afterword, although no one spoke to me. The usual JW hate you, but we are really just kind Christians thing.
 It can be freeing to tell someone that has hurt you that they did, in fact, hurt you, and just for your own healing to forgive is good. But he may not agree to see you, so be aware. It's very unlikely he will give you anything positive. Personally I feel he was very abusive and I wouldn't volunteer for any more of it, but only you can know if it's the right thing for you.
Maybe just write him a letter and call it good.
Congratulations on moving on in your life a being a good parent, you have really risen above.
Lisa🌹
 +12 / -0
Muddy Waters
Muddy Waters 2 days ago

Everything Fink said. So sorry you are going through this, let us know how things go and what you decide.... We are here for you.
If this helps, know that regret is powerful, and most people find they regret more the things they did not do.... (because then, you are always wondering or kicking yourself). But protect your self too. 🌷
 +4 / -0
WingCommander
WingCommander 2 days ago
I think I'd pour a gallon of urine and feces on this man's fresh grave. I pity that such a human being was your DNA donor. Go forth, be fruitful, and forget about this horrible man. You've got your own family, and I'm sure he doesn't give a crap.

 +7 / -0
Wasanelder Once
Wasanelder Once 2 days ago
It is amazing how we love those who gave birth to us, changed our diapers and sang songs to us as babies despite the way they turned on us later. Its in our DNA to love them I think. That's why the rejection from them hurts. I think perhaps you are trying to put your own feelings in order, reconciling how someone you love inherently could reject you so cruelly. If that is the case, stop, get a mirror and look at yourself. See the person that you are and how your children love you. I think your father proves the scripture where it says they "Have no natural affection". If you can come to terms with the fact you are lovable and worthy I would not give him the chance to look away from you on his death bed. A brief note saying you forgive him and wish him a painless death should suffice. You wouldn't expect him to ruin his track record of loyalty to the Governing Body by seeing you. Goodbye dad.

 +14 / -0
Daniel1555
Daniel1555 2 days ago

Dear Leela
Your story is very moving and honestly I have tears in my eyes as I write now.
I am so happy that you survived this ordeal and that you are a wonderful mother to your 4 children.
You are a very loving and courageous person. I think it is so good that you forgave your dad. So no matter how he or your family reacts, I think it is important that you let them know.
I am myself your age (36) and I am df because of conscience reasons.
I am lucky because I had a very nice childhood as JW with loving parents. Even though I am df they treat me the same as before and we are very close.
I wish you and your family all the best and looking forward to read more of your posts.
Love
Daniel
 +4 / -0
Incognito
Incognito 2 days ago

I agree with steve2's comments with regard to you already having said 'Goodbye'.
Apparently, your father hasn't asked to see you before he departs and others in your past family haven't seen any reason to inform you otherwise, I expect they would have informed you directly.
It appears none have had any relationship with you and probably have never met your partner or children.

I also agree with Wasanelder Once comments about writing a note, but only if that would be beneficial for you. Even if it is not actually sent, sometimes writing down your thoughts and feelings can be therapeutic. I think seeing your father in person could stir-up emotions that were long ago put in storage.
While expressing forgiveness sounds as a great thing, if he doesn't feel bad for how things turned-out, he may not be accepting of forgiveness, especially if he thinks he hasn't done anything wrong. You could be left again reliving the emotions you had experienced 20 years ago.
I believe the desire to forgive is more of wanting to 'let go' and no longer hold things against him, having come to accept that nothing will change.
Feelings held in storage are a heavy emotional load and serve little benefit so letting go and acceptance lightens the load on you and provides a type of fresh start and outlook. That is a personal realization within yourself and does not require expressing that decision to him.
Ultimately, think about what is best for you and your immediate family.

 +4 / -0
Giordano
Giordano 2 days ago

I can never figure out why a situation like this, and illness and/or a pending death is not considered 'family business'.
Why would your children not have an opportunity to get to know their grandparents preferably their grand mother?
That is true family business.
When you took the pills did anyone understand that being shunned and abandoned by your family led you to this? Your fathers reaction was anger not concern, didn't care nor show love. He was angry because you might have cost him his Elder's position. We've all seen or heard stories like that.
Thank god you got therapy and another family to live with to become ......you.
The question I would ask myself is....... will it do more harm then good to visit him to tell him what you experienced.
 At the same time you need to look at a future when this autocratic man will no longer be the family head. Will the dynamics change? They might. I would work to that end. Maybe call your mother and remind her that she was the one that came to the hospital to visit you and helped to get the therapy that saved your life. Since she was there for you long ago you wanted to be there for her at this time.You want to be there for her sake but you don't want to cause harm.
If she says don't come then at least she knows that you cared enough to get in touch. Mention your children and the fact that they have not gotten to know their grandmother and you hope that will change. Plant a seed.




 +6 / -0
Sabin
Sabin 2 days ago

Hello Leela, my opinion is that you have changed because you chose to, your father has stayed the same because he chose to. No matter what you do now my guess is that his perception of things will not change. All the hurt that you have already been through will be brought back up & you may find yourself back emotionally as that 16yr old girl. That little girl you carry inside that is who should be worrying & looking out for, she is the one that needs you. Be there for her. You have nothing to feel guilty about, that is part of the reason your asking right? I know that feeling, how they love to say it's your fault, you made us do it, how you think that it is the right thing to do so if you don't go through with it you will feel like a bad person all over again. It isn't true, you are not a bad person, your father is a bad father. Isn't that the truth Leela, you are not accountable for your father or his choices. You are accountable for protecting your own inner child. Yes you may forgive your father but can will never forget. I think if you sit down & ask the 16yr old girl inside wether she wants you to go back she will tell you.
Whatever you decide to do Leela, do it for you. You owe no explanation to anybody else, especially not him.
Please don't leave this forum, you will find support/laughs/experiences/advise & the occasional argument here, you will also find big hearts & Big Hugs. SABIN.
 +5 / -0
brandnew
brandnew 2 days ago

Lisa...oh...oh....mygosh.....lisa i would have kicked everyones ass who didnt talk to you at your mammas funeral. Thats just me. My bad.....but yeah.
Love u.
 +2 / -0
Skedaddle
Skedaddle 2 days ago

Hi Leela,
I can't quite come to terms with how you've been treated by your father. A line was crossed even beyond anything it says in JW literature. You were a child. Where was his LOVE for you? The drastic action that you took by trying to take your own life was not a wake up call for him but rather was seen as a motivator for further persecution. Many years have passed. A long time for him to go over his actions in his more mellowed state of age. Chances have come and gone for him to step back into your life when you gave birth to his grandchildren and yet, he remained silent. Now he aproaches the end of his life and no word has been sent from him or anyone else (at his request?). The deathbed for many provides a time for reflection, for making peace with your past and yet, silence. That silence should be the loudest sound - it comes from those who are not sorry. I don't believe that a person capable of treating their own flesh in the way that he demonstrated is capable of understanding his wrongs by his own reasoning. Any regret, if he were to feel it now (which I personally doubt), would be born out of doubt that he would be eligible to enter paradise and not for his wrong treatment of you. It would be for his own needs.
And now you. A once broken little chick who managed to mend her own wings and grow into a beautiful bird and fly away. You nested and grew chicks of your own and cared for them. That nest is the most important nest in your world, not just for the sake of you but for your children. You need to take care of that. And the upkeep of that nest cannot be done by a bird with rebroken wings so think carefully is my advice. To forgive him does not render the need for your presence. It has been said, and therefore it is. My advice is to grieve the greif that was started a long time ago as its weight is lighter. If you were to visit and a negative situation arises, you may find yourself grieving a double rejection and one that has no second chance, it would be final and you would be left with that to face on your own with your own family. A family who has had no benefit from this passing person but a family who probably have dealt with some of the ramifications from the harm that he caused you. Are you strong enough to cope with this? Only you know.
My personal opinion agrees with other posters who have said to send a message to your mother to let her know that you are there for her if needed. In time, there may be a correspondance and I deeply wish that this will be the case, if it's what you want. The death of your father may soften the heart of your mother. That coupled with knowing that you were not told may play on her emotions. Without his iron rod at her side you may find she wishes to one day have some kind of relationship with your family. I do hope so, if it's what you wish for.
Anyway, as I say, these are just my thoughts. I wish you clarity of thinking to make your decision on whatever you feel is best.
Lots of love to you. I really do wish you the best.
 +5 / -0
JWdaughter
JWdaughter 2 days ago

He grew old and is dying in this system of things. He is a hateful, miserable humanoid. You are a loving mom, and partner, and in spite of them, a loving daughter and sister. You WIN.
He can't hurt you or help you anymore. You are nicer than I would be to the miserable old coot. Go there, say goodbye and once again be the bigger person. Tell you mom that you are here for her and give her contact info surreptitiously-you never know what she will do with her freedom.
You are a rock star.
 +6 / -0
AudeSapere
AudeSapere 2 days ago

Heartbreaking. You are in the absolute right place to find others who *get* what you have been through.
I'm so sorry. You were so very, very young when your family turned their back on you. It is criminal neglect, in my opinion.
Welcome to JWN. I'm really happy that you found us and look forward to hearing more of your story.
Aude.

 +5 / -0
GrreatTeacher
GrreatTeacher 2 days ago

You lost your family 20 years ago. Your dad has made no effort to see you and ease his conscience on his death bed because he feels no remorse. You can choose to let it go if you understand forgiveness and closure in this fashion, but you will not get closure from him.
And because of that, when he dies you will suffer complicated grief. You'll mourn the dad that you loved as a small child and you'll mourn the dad that he never was for you as a teenager and an adult.
So, cry and mourn and mourn and cry. Take all the time you need. Probe gently to find out whether your mother was just under his thumb and whether she's willing to start building some type of relationship with you and your kids.
We can't make it better, but we can be here for you, and we will be.
 +8 / -0

«
 1
 2
 »
 5
10
20




Share this topic






Related Topics
A.proclaimer
1914, leap years, and sticky math situation
by A.proclaimer 2 months ago
Pattytheperfect1
First post after a year or two of lurking on this site-Sorry for the length!
by Pattytheperfect1 2 years ago
pale.emperor
Trying To Leave - Im Going Crazy
by pale.emperor 14 days ago
GrownMidget
Long Story of my Life/Experience
by GrownMidget 4 months ago
stephanie61092
Finally posting and I'm FRUSTRATED!!!
by stephanie61092 a month ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/5719580638969856/closer-death-funerals





Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ Closer/death/Funerals
/  





 

Closer/death/Funerals
by Leela1 2 days ago 35 Replies latest a day ago   jw experiences
«
 1
 2
 »
5
10
20
Lieu
Lieu 2 days ago

Narcissists are incapable of love. Write a short note and include a family photo - tagline..."You missed all of this".
Go enjoy the day with your kids.
 +4 / -0
smiddy
smiddy 2 days ago

I totally agree with steve2`s comments
smiddy
 +1 / -0
freddo
freddo 2 days ago

Leela1 - I endorse what "Wing Commander" said.
Imagine if "THAT MAN" had joined the Nazi party - he'd have started like Irma Grise and ended like Heydrich - ending up like either of them would be a good end for him.
Actually Lieu has the best suggestion!
Edited to add: Steve 2 is "on the money" of course - being an x-jw and a prufeshnial an'all!
 
tiki
tiki 2 days ago
This is one of the saddest stories. It seems to me that he could have been just about any religion and would have been a cold uncaring bigot. Witnessdom and elder glory trip only exacerbated a basic aberration in the man. If I were in this situation I would not attempt to see the man or dredge up painful memories in any way. If child protective services had known of that abusive family situation chances are youd have been pulled from the home and hed have been in some serious trouble. You do not treat your teenagers like the family dog minus the petting and lovey stuff. The man is sick and he can only make you remember too much. Don't reach for the poison.
 +1 / -0
jamiebowers
jamiebowers 2 days ago

Please read and re-read what Steve2 had to say. Your family rejected you years ago and continue to do so by their silence about your father's illness.
On a personal note, I've had limited phone contact relating to necessary family medical history with my mother who has shunned me for 27 years. She took the opportunity during one of these brief few moments to defend her husband for attempting to rape me when I was 12 years old.
My mother now has cancer and is rejecting medically advised treatment. And, no, I will not attend her funeral when the time comes, because she is a stranger to me.
No good can come from communicating with cult members. They are manipulative predators, who if permitted, will use your kids as the next generation of victims. Write a letter to your father if it makes you feel better. But for the love of all that is holy, stay away from these twisted people.
 +3 / -0
ToesUp
ToesUp 2 days ago

So sorry you had to grow up this way. I would love to just hug the stuffing out of you. You have been through a lot.
I have to agree with Wing commander on this one. I'd piss on the mans grave. He wasn't your father he was an animal. Who does this to their child? I can assure you, not a normal person.
I know this sounds harsh but, he has not asked to see his own child before he dies. He doesn't deserve to see you, you are too good for him.
You sound like you have it all together now. Raise your family and enjoy what YOU have now. Your father is just a sperm donor. Nothing more.
Be very proud of how far you have come. YOU did it on your own.
Hugs to you.
 +3 / -0
Stirred
Stirred 2 days ago

Welcome and thank you for sharing. Your story is so painful to read. I wish the psychiatrist or family you moved in with had told child protective services about your parents so that you and your siblings could have been better protected.i have had to learn later in life that it is hard to see a person may have true psychiatric issues who is so close to you. My brother is the cruel one in my history. Since letting him bck in my life for a short time he caused harm to me again and my kids....affecting us emotionally, financially (huge), psychologically...

Read here about Narcissists: http://www.decision-making-confidence.com/symptoms-of-narcissism.html

Read here about Sociopaths: http://www.naturalnews.com/036112_sociopaths_cults_influence.html

That said, you could send a video message, you could send a recorded message to your parents. I agree sending your parents separate messages is a good thing. Perhaps send a letter with picture of your kids to her.
 +3 / -0
Morning Warship
Morning Warship 2 days ago
testing
 
just fine
just fine 2 days ago

I am so sorry you had to go through this. I wouldn't set myself up to be hurt by them.
The family members I have that shun me will be welcome back by me when they want to act like a normal human being.
Your family's treatment of you has been their choice, do not take responsibility for their bad actions.
 +3 / -0
NeverKnew
NeverKnew 2 days ago

I am absolutely mortified by his selfish behavior. My heart is broken thinking about your wandering in the world by yourself. A post I read recently described the WTS as the institution that makes weapons out of your very own family. I totally agree.
Nonetheless, it sounds like your Dad was insanely cruel to you and I can't help but blame the WTS. I can't see how everybody failed to recognize this for what it was - mental and emotional abuse.
I'm so very proud of what you've accomplished in spite of your upbringing.
On forgiveness, typically I am able to forgive once I have something to which I can attach the behavior. In this case it'd be the WTS. If you've truly forgiven? I'd say go tell him with your head held high, "I've come to say goodbye to you and to let you know I've forgiven you Good luck to you, Dad."
For me, that'd be it. I wouldn't do the funeral.
 +1 / -0
life is to short
life is to short a day ago

My heart just breaks for you. I come from a different background with my family but very similar to yours, I too have no one, expect my husband. I have tried to met with some of the elders who treated me horribly and it just brought back so much depression I wondered if it was worth it. I was just amazed at how cruel those men were, the one thing it did show me as an adult was how wrong and sick these men are.
I was trying to get my nerve up to go met with an elder last year who was one of the worst ones and he died suddenly of a heart attack. I just started crying and sobbing, I did not know I would react that way as this person really deeply hurt me and now I will never have a chance to ask why.
So on the one hand I say no because of the pain it would bring but on the other it leaves this whole in your heart as to why anyone would treat a child and young adult that way.
It is something you will have to live with and take care of yourself first, your mental health is the most important thing. I am just so sorry for your pain.
LITS
 +1 / -0
Leela1
Leela1 a day ago

Thank you all of you for your kind words and support I needed this I think that I knew deep down what I needed to do I just needed some reinforcement from others. I was able to get the phone number of one of my older sisters from a recently DF old family friend from FB. I called her last night her husband answered who I have only ever met 1 time I told him who I was and her put my sister on the phone. It was really strange talking to her as I think the last time I spoke with her was 8 years ago when my older daughter was in a very serious accident. The strange thing about it was that she was speaking to me normal like there was never any distance between us it struck me as strange. Anyway I asked about my dad being sick and she admitted that he is in hospice in another Province (I live in Canada) and that they were going to tell me but they did not have my phone number. She went on to basically to defend my dad for the ways he is. I tried to find out what hospice he was at but she would not give me any info. She did however give me my mom cell number so I can call her. I have not made the call yet and I am not sure if I will but at least I have it and if I decide too I can contact her. But I have decided that I will not be reaching out to my Dad nor going to try to attend his funeral. I agree with all of you that it probably wont do me any good and I think I should let things be.I dont want to spend anymore of my life greiving over a father who really never was a good father. Now my sister has my phone number so they cant say they dont know how to contact me so the rest up to them we will see what happens.Thanks everyone you don’t know what a help your support has been.
 +6 / -0
Leela1
Leela1 a day ago




Tiki: child protective services had known of that abusive family situation chances are youd have been pulled from the home and hed have been in some serious trouble.
Unfortunately in my case Children Services was involved when I was still living at Home they came and did a couple home visits after I was hospitalized. But because there was no physical abuse and they were not able to prove any mental abuse other than what I was telling them I was not removed from the home. My Psychiatrist tried to have me placed in a group home but authority was never given and based on the state of Govt group homes I might not have been better off. But luckily my friends family took me in I was so screwed up but they stuck with me and supported me.Proving there are really good wordly people :)



 +4 / -0
flipper
flipper a day ago

Leela- My wife and my heart goes out to you my friend in what you suffered. I had a strict elder dad who was very harsh as well. I admire you so much for moving on and creating a wonderful family of your own with your children and companion. What you have with them is priceless . It means everything. I feel you've made a good decision not to give your dad anymore of your time. You owe him nothing - because he gave you nothing but misery.
It may be that just sending condolences to your mom is the way to go, but to get involved with these emotional vampires who sucked the power away from you when young would just put you back in a bad place emotionally. You have regained your own power again as an adult woman and you have moved on in a positive way in life and your loving family that you live with now is what is important. Honor these ones that love you- give no quarter to the former family that dishonored you. Forgiveness is overrated. Forgiveness doesn't mean much to those who feel they did nothing wrong. They don't get it. It falls on deaf ears.
Wishing you and your partner and children all the happiness in the future. We are all here for you on this board. Take care, Sincerely, Mr. Flipper
 +2 / -0
OrphanCrow
OrphanCrow a day ago

Leela: I dont want to spend anymore of my life greiving over a father who really never was a good father.
You are right, you have no need to grieve for that man. That would be like saying that you miss the bad neighbors that moved out after making your life hell while they lived next door to you.
However, for those of us with estranged parents, the grieving is different. We grieve for the parents we should have had and didn't. Be prepared to miss the father you didn't have.
It's tough. Hang in there and give yourself permission to grieve if you have to. It's okay - it is a natural human response.
 +4 / -0
ToesUp
ToesUp a day ago

"However, for those of us with estranged parents, the grieving is different. We grieve for the parents we should have had and didn't. Be prepared to miss the father you didn't have."
Great way to put it OrphanCrow. So true!
 +1 / -0

«
 1
 2
 »
5
10
20




Share this topic



Topic Summary
hello all i am fairly new to this site even though i have been da since i was 16 years old i am now 35 years old.
i have had very little contact with my family since i left maybe a handful of times over the years.
i thought i put the past behind me and moved on i have 4 amazing kids of my own really supportive partner and great friends who have become my family.



Related Topics
A.proclaimer
1914, leap years, and sticky math situation
by A.proclaimer 2 months ago
Pattytheperfect1
First post after a year or two of lurking on this site-Sorry for the length!
by Pattytheperfect1 2 years ago
pale.emperor
Trying To Leave - Im Going Crazy
by pale.emperor 14 days ago
GrownMidget
Long Story of my Life/Experience
by GrownMidget 4 months ago
stephanie61092
Finally posting and I'm FRUSTRATED!!!
by stephanie61092 a month ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/5719580638969856/closer-death-funerals?page=2&size=20





Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ Ebony
/  





 

Ebony
by Joker10 13 years ago 2 Replies latest 13 years ago   jw friends
5
10
20
Joker10
Joker10 13 years ago

Everything you always wanted to know about Michael, Janet and LaToya: mother of Jackson family tells all. (excerpt from Katherine Jackson's 'My Family, The Jacksons') (Cover Story) Katherine Jackson.
 Full Text: COPYRIGHT Johnson Publishing Company Inc. 1990
 Everything You Always Wanted To Know About Michael, Janet and LaToya
 LATOYA nude in Playboy?
 I was shocked when I heard the rumor. My daughter may have been different from her eight brothers and sisters in some ways - she was the moodiest of my kids, for example - but in terms of her dress and manners, she'd been so conservative that she'd once dropped a friend who had begun wearing low-cut tops and skirts with slits in them. "She looks disgusting, like a hooker," LaToya remarked at the time. "I don't want any part of her."
 But the longer I thought about the Playboy rumor, the more I feared that it was true. The LaToya I saw in early 1989 was not the LaToya I thought I knew.
 I couldn't help but recall her 1988 engagement at Trump Plaza in Atlantic City, when she danced for the first time ever in a sexy, suggestive way. Watching her from the audience, I was surprised and, I admit, a little taken aback.
 "Jack told me that I had to change my image if I want to make it in the business," LaToya said when I questioned her about her new show.
 "Jack" was Jack Gordon, her smooth-talking manager. Her transformation had begun at the same time that he entered her life in 1987 with an offer for her to host a music video show that he had in the works. At the time LaToya was a confirmed homebody and mama's girl...
 She was the kind of little girl who a grandmother would love... When you'd clean her up, LaToya would sit on the couch like a little lady...
 Janet by contrast, was a tomboy. By the age of 2 she had the nickname "squirrel" because she loved to climb on the furniture and on the boys' bunkbeds...
 Janet had been on the plump side for years. Michael, who can be a merciless teaser, had nicknamed her "Dunk" - for donkey.
 I had a hard time getting Janet to wear dresses to kindergarden; she always wanted to wear jeans. To this day, she dresses like a tomboy. She'll show up at the house in army boots, blue jeans with patches in them, an oversized T-shirt and her hair stuffed in a cap.
 "Janet," I'll say, "wear some earrings or put on some lipstick. People are going to mistake you for a guy..."
 [Jack] Gordon's music video show never materialized, but he remained on the scene, showering LaToya with flowers and gifts.
 Gordon begged my husband, Joe, LaToya's manager, to allow him to co-manage her; he claimed that he had ideas for how to revitalize her stalled recording career. He kept pestering Joe until Joe finally asked LaToya, "Is this what you want?" She said it was, so her father agreed to share management responsibilities with Gordon.
 The next thing I knew, Gordon had my homebody of a daughter traveling the world. No sooner would they return from business in Japan than she'd announce, "Oh, I have a photo shoot to do in Austria," and she and Gordon would be on the next flight out of Los Angeles. While a part of me was happy that she was getting out into the world at long last and meeting new people, her turnabout was so sudden and dramatic that it left me confused.
 It wasn't until later, when I saw Jack Gordon for what he was ... that I understood his strategy in booking LaToya in far-flung corners of the globe. He was attempting to distance my naive, trusting daughter from her family, literally and figuratively, so that he could become the dominating influence in her life.
 The public learned just how successful Gordon had been in tearing LaToya away from the family when, in March of 1988, People magazine reported that LaToya had moved to New York City with Gordon and cut her professional ties with Joe. "Jack's a salesman," LaToya was quoted as saying. "He throws a good pitch and he delivers. Anyway he's doing better than my father." Adding a sensational touch was Jack Gordon's own parting "pitch" to Joe: "I love Joe like poison."
 Even though LaToya continued to talk to me almost daily on the telephone, our relationship deteriorated also. It seemed like LaToya had been taking lessons in the Big Lie from Gordon.
 I had raised my children to always tell the truth, so I was disappointed in her for indignantly denying to me that she had decided to write a competing, "tell-all" book about the Jackson family, even after I heard that Gordon had taken her around from publisher to publisher in New York.
 "No, mother, I'm not doing a book; I don't know how these rumors get started," she said again a few weeks later, after I learned that she had signed a book deal for more money that my son Michael had received for his autobiography, Moonwalk
 This exchange was repeated several more times after I was informed of "ugly family secrets" that Jack Gordon had circulated, including the Biggest Lie of them all: that LaToya had been molested by Joe when she was 8 years old. When I confronted Gordon about this outrageous charge he claimed that Rebbie, not LaToya, had told him.
 "That's not true!" Rebbie gasped when I checked with her. Michael was furious. "Mother," he exclaimed, "how can he lie like that!" The obvious answer: so Jack Gordon could create interest in LaToya's book, and make more money for himself.
 LaToya never did admit to me that she was writing a book. I had to read about it in a newspaper in early 1989. "Michael's book is nice but very light," she was quoted as saying. "There will be a lot of things in my book that weren't in his."
 LaToya denied to me that she had disrobed for a Playboy photographer as emphatically as she had denied that she was writing a book. I'm sad to say that, once again, I learned the truth from the media. In her interviews promoting her nude spread, LaToya defended her actions: "I have to live my life for LaToya and not for my family."
 I was personally so embarrassed that there were moments when I said to myself, "I wish I was on another planet." I felt like cringing when I went out in public, afraid that someone would recognize me and ask me about LaToya.
 Shortly after the Playboy issue with her face on the cover hit the newstands, LaToya appeared on "Donahue."
 "My parents laid down certain rules, and one of those rules, of course, was you were not to leave home unless you were married," she claimed. She didn't mention the fact that our "rule" was never enforced, and that Michael Marlon, Randy and Janet had moved out before her as single people.
 Needless to say, rescuing my daughter from Gordon had been the family's aim ever since she had moved to New York with him. But nothing I nor her brothers and sisters could say could persuade her to return home to us.
 Mixed in with my rage at Jack Gordon was a feeling of guilt. "Maybe I sheltered my children too much," I've thought many times since, "and not educated them enough about the sharks out there waiting to take advantage of them...."
 Even as the media was covering LaToya's rebellion, it was still feasting on rumors about Michael's private life, reports of Jackson "sibling jealousy" and tales about how Joe and I are alienated from most of our kids.
 "What a sorry family these Jacksons have become," I imagine people are saying today. "They couldn't handle their rags-to-riches success." If I depended on the press for all of my information on my family, I'd come to the same conclusion.
 But I'm able to see our story with a perspective that is lacking in an Entertainment Tonight sound bite, or an error-filled article in one of the tabloids.
 For the record, Michael doesn't own and has never slept in a hyperbaric chamber. He lay down in one once, just to see what it felt like, during a visit to the Michael Jackson Burn Center. A photographer took his picture, and the picture got out.
 As for the Elephant Man's bones, I have no idea whether or not [Frank] Dileo [Michael's former manager] made an attempt on Michael's behalf to buy them. If he did so, he did so in jest. And if by some miracle the London medical center that owns the bones agreed to sell them, Michael knows I wouldn't let him in the house with them.
 The most tired rumor of all was the rumor that Michael was gay.
 All I can say is, Michael is not gay. First of all, the Bible speaks against homosexuality, and he's very religious. Secondly, he intends to settle down and get married one day. We've talked about it. And he will.
 I wish he did have that special someone to share his life with right now; his life would be richer. I think that, deep down, he does, too.
 When Michael was younger he joked that "when the love bug bites me that's who I'm going to marry." By 1989 he was telling me, "When I marry a woman she's going to have a lot of money herself. That's the only way I'll know for sure that she's not marrying me for my money."
 And yet, Michael seems happy. Even though he knows that he will never be able to live a "normal" life, he seems comfortable with his fame. I believe that when he's good and ready to get married, he'll do it, despite the inevitable press uproar.
 While I firmly believe that a good marriage promotes happiness, the surest path to inner peace and fulfillment, I believe, is through religion. This is why I also wish that my children will draw closer to Jehovah.
 I'm not worried about Rebbie. As she says, "The most important thing in my life is my relationship with the Creator, Jehovah God."
 Dee Dee, Tito's wife, has also shown a strong interest in studying.
 But Randy and Janet attend Kingdom Hall only occasionally, and Jermaine, Jackie, Tito and LaToya not at all, even though LaToya was baptized a Witness several years ago. Marlon and Carol attend a Catholic church.
 Then there is Michael's unique situation: In 1987, he left the Jehovah's Witnesses.
 There was strong opposition to his "Thriller" video on the part of some Witnesses. Perhaps the controversy figured into his decision to leave.
 But I don't know that for a fact because I didn't talk to him about what he'd done. I couldn't. Witnesses do not discuss spiritual matters with a person who has disassociated himself from the Witnesses, including family members.
 But I want to stress that, contrary to published reports, I was not required to "shun" my son. Our relationship is as loving today as it was when he was a Witness. I just can't ask him, "Why, Michael?"
 Two more wishes:
 I wish for a reunited Jacksons. I wish that Michael and Marlon would consider rejoining the group, if only on a part-time basis. For old-time's sake. For my sake.
 And I dream of a reunited Jackson family.
 As much as LaToya hurt the family ... I long for her reconciliation with us. The Jackson family is not whole without her.
 PHOTO : At a family reunion in 1989, Katherine Jackson (seated center, yellow jacket) and her husband Joseph are surrounded by seven of their nine children, including Janet and Michael who flank their parents, and 11 of their grandchildren. Of the famous Jackson siblings, only Marlon and LaToya did not attend the reunion. LaToya (at right), whose nude spread in Playboy magazine and threats to write a tell-all book have shocked and disappointed her family, is estranged from her parents and siblings.
 PHOTO : Jack Gordon (at left with LaToya) did more than take over LaToya's career when he became her manager, Katherine Jackson says. He moved LaToya far from her family "so he could become the dominating influence in her life," Mrs. Jackson says. Yet, she says her relationship with her two superstar children, Janet and Michael (below), is as warm and loving as ever. Still, she gently chides Janet for "dressing like a tomboy," and she wishes that Michael, a former Jehovah's Witness, would return to the faith
 
cruzanheart
cruzanheart 13 years ago


She doesn't have to shun Michael because everybody else does, even the non-JWs. Except for Elizabeth Taylor. That is one very weird man . . . um, person . . . well, whatever.
Nina
 
ScoobySnax
ScoobySnax 13 years ago

...Janet Jackson still attends occasional meetings at the Kingdom Hall.............................  ...singing "Nasty Boys" lol
 

5
10
20




Share this topic






Related Topics
TTWSYF
What's up with the HEBREWS translation?
by TTWSYF 3 months ago
Divergent
November 22 Study Article: God is a hypocrite & is NOT impartial!
by Divergent 4 months ago
cappytan
Governing Body Letter details things that "have never been done before." - Really?
by cappytan 2 months ago
AndersonsInfo
Brownstoner: How the Jehovah’s Witnesses Acquired Some of Brooklyn’s Most Insanely Valuable Properties
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
AndersonsInfo
Trey Bundy: One Year of Reporting JW Child Abuse - Your comments please!
by AndersonsInfo a month ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/57292/ebony





Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ Mrs. Jackson doesn't shun Michael
/  





 

Mrs. Jackson doesn't shun Michael
by Joker10 13 years ago 0 Replies latest 13 years ago   jw friends
5
10
20
Joker10
Joker10 13 years ago


Everything you always wanted to know about Michael, Janet and LaToya: mother of Jackson family tells all. (excerpt from Katherine Jackson's 'My Family, The Jacksons') (Cover Story) Katherine Jackson.
Full Text: COPYRIGHT Johnson Publishing Company Inc. 1990
Everything You Always Wanted To Know About Michael, Janet and LaToya
LATOYA nude in Playboy?
I was shocked when I heard the rumor. My daughter may have been different from her eight brothers and sisters in some ways - she was the moodiest of my kids, for example - but in terms of her dress and manners, she'd been so conservative that she'd once dropped a friend who had begun wearing low-cut tops and skirts with slits in them. "She looks disgusting, like a hooker," LaToya remarked at the time. "I don't want any part of her."
But the longer I thought about the Playboy rumor, the more I feared that it was true. The LaToya I saw in early 1989 was not the LaToya I thought I knew.
I couldn't help but recall her 1988 engagement at Trump Plaza in Atlantic City, when she danced for the first time ever in a sexy, suggestive way. Watching her from the audience, I was surprised and, I admit, a little taken aback.
"Jack told me that I had to change my image if I want to make it in the business," LaToya said when I questioned her about her new show.
"Jack" was Jack Gordon, her smooth-talking manager. Her transformation had begun at the same time that he entered her life in 1987 with an offer for her to host a music video show that he had in the works. At the time LaToya was a confirmed homebody and mama's girl...
She was the kind of little girl who a grandmother would love... When you'd clean her up, LaToya would sit on the couch like a little lady...
Janet by contrast, was a tomboy. By the age of 2 she had the nickname "squirrel" because she loved to climb on the furniture and on the boys' bunkbeds...
Janet had been on the plump side for years. Michael, who can be a merciless teaser, had nicknamed her "Dunk" - for donkey.
I had a hard time getting Janet to wear dresses to kindergarden; she always wanted to wear jeans. To this day, she dresses like a tomboy. She'll show up at the house in army boots, blue jeans with patches in them, an oversized T-shirt and her hair stuffed in a cap.
"Janet," I'll say, "wear some earrings or put on some lipstick. People are going to mistake you for a guy..."
[Jack] Gordon's music video show never materialized, but he remained on the scene, showering LaToya with flowers and gifts.
Gordon begged my husband, Joe, LaToya's manager, to allow him to co-manage her; he claimed that he had ideas for how to revitalize her stalled recording career. He kept pestering Joe until Joe finally asked LaToya, "Is this what you want?" She said it was, so her father agreed to share management responsibilities with Gordon.
The next thing I knew, Gordon had my homebody of a daughter traveling the world. No sooner would they return from business in Japan than she'd announce, "Oh, I have a photo shoot to do in Austria," and she and Gordon would be on the next flight out of Los Angeles. While a part of me was happy that she was getting out into the world at long last and meeting new people, her turnabout was so sudden and dramatic that it left me confused.
It wasn't until later, when I saw Jack Gordon for what he was ... that I understood his strategy in booking LaToya in far-flung corners of the globe. He was attempting to distance my naive, trusting daughter from her family, literally and figuratively, so that he could become the dominating influence in her life.
The public learned just how successful Gordon had been in tearing LaToya away from the family when, in March of 1988, People magazine reported that LaToya had moved to New York City with Gordon and cut her professional ties with Joe. "Jack's a salesman," LaToya was quoted as saying. "He throws a good pitch and he delivers. Anyway he's doing better than my father." Adding a sensational touch was Jack Gordon's own parting "pitch" to Joe: "I love Joe like poison."
Even though LaToya continued to talk to me almost daily on the telephone, our relationship deteriorated also. It seemed like LaToya had been taking lessons in the Big Lie from Gordon.
I had raised my children to always tell the truth, so I was disappointed in her for indignantly denying to me that she had decided to write a competing, "tell-all" book about the Jackson family, even after I heard that Gordon had taken her around from publisher to publisher in New York.
"No, mother, I'm not doing a book; I don't know how these rumors get started," she said again a few weeks later, after I learned that she had signed a book deal for more money that my son Michael had received for his autobiography, Moonwalk
This exchange was repeated several more times after I was informed of "ugly family secrets" that Jack Gordon had circulated, including the Biggest Lie of them all: that LaToya had been molested by Joe when she was 8 years old. When I confronted Gordon about this outrageous charge he claimed that Rebbie, not LaToya, had told him.
"That's not true!" Rebbie gasped when I checked with her. Michael was furious. "Mother," he exclaimed, "how can he lie like that!" The obvious answer: so Jack Gordon could create interest in LaToya's book, and make more money for himself.
LaToya never did admit to me that she was writing a book. I had to read about it in a newspaper in early 1989. "Michael's book is nice but very light," she was quoted as saying. "There will be a lot of things in my book that weren't in his."
LaToya denied to me that she had disrobed for a Playboy photographer as emphatically as she had denied that she was writing a book. I'm sad to say that, once again, I learned the truth from the media. In her interviews promoting her nude spread, LaToya defended her actions: "I have to live my life for LaToya and not for my family."
I was personally so embarrassed that there were moments when I said to myself, "I wish I was on another planet." I felt like cringing when I went out in public, afraid that someone would recognize me and ask me about LaToya.
Shortly after the Playboy issue with her face on the cover hit the newstands, LaToya appeared on "Donahue."
"My parents laid down certain rules, and one of those rules, of course, was you were not to leave home unless you were married," she claimed. She didn't mention the fact that our "rule" was never enforced, and that Michael Marlon, Randy and Janet had moved out before her as single people.
Needless to say, rescuing my daughter from Gordon had been the family's aim ever since she had moved to New York with him. But nothing I nor her brothers and sisters could say could persuade her to return home to us.
Mixed in with my rage at Jack Gordon was a feeling of guilt. "Maybe I sheltered my children too much," I've thought many times since, "and not educated them enough about the sharks out there waiting to take advantage of them...."
Even as the media was covering LaToya's rebellion, it was still feasting on rumors about Michael's private life, reports of Jackson "sibling jealousy" and tales about how Joe and I are alienated from most of our kids.
"What a sorry family these Jacksons have become," I imagine people are saying today. "They couldn't handle their rags-to-riches success." If I depended on the press for all of my information on my family, I'd come to the same conclusion.
But I'm able to see our story with a perspective that is lacking in an Entertainment Tonight sound bite, or an error-filled article in one of the tabloids.
For the record, Michael doesn't own and has never slept in a hyperbaric chamber. He lay down in one once, just to see what it felt like, during a visit to the Michael Jackson Burn Center. A photographer took his picture, and the picture got out.
As for the Elephant Man's bones, I have no idea whether or not [Frank] Dileo [Michael's former manager] made an attempt on Michael's behalf to buy them. If he did so, he did so in jest. And if by some miracle the London medical center that owns the bones agreed to sell them, Michael knows I wouldn't let him in the house with them.
The most tired rumor of all was the rumor that Michael was gay.
All I can say is, Michael is not gay. First of all, the Bible speaks against homosexuality, and he's very religious. Secondly, he intends to settle down and get married one day. We've talked about it. And he will.
I wish he did have that special someone to share his life with right now; his life would be richer. I think that, deep down, he does, too.
When Michael was younger he joked that "when the love bug bites me that's who I'm going to marry." By 1989 he was telling me, "When I marry a woman she's going to have a lot of money herself. That's the only way I'll know for sure that she's not marrying me for my money."
And yet, Michael seems happy. Even though he knows that he will never be able to live a "normal" life, he seems comfortable with his fame. I believe that when he's good and ready to get married, he'll do it, despite the inevitable press uproar.
While I firmly believe that a good marriage promotes happiness, the surest path to inner peace and fulfillment, I believe, is through religion. This is why I also wish that my children will draw closer to Jehovah.
I'm not worried about Rebbie. As she says, "The most important thing in my life is my relationship with the Creator, Jehovah God."
Dee Dee, Tito's wife, has also shown a strong interest in studying.
But Randy and Janet attend Kingdom Hall only occasionally, and Jermaine, Jackie, Tito and LaToya not at all, even though LaToya was baptized a Witness several years ago. Marlon and Carol attend a Catholic church.
Then there is Michael's unique situation: In 1987, he left the Jehovah's Witnesses.
There was strong opposition to his "Thriller" video on the part of some Witnesses. Perhaps the controversy figured into his decision to leave.
But I don't know that for a fact because I didn't talk to him about what he'd done. I couldn't. Witnesses do not discuss spiritual matters with a person who has disassociated himself from the Witnesses, including family members.
But I want to stress that, contrary to published reports, I was not required to "shun" my son. Our relationship is as loving today as it was when he was a Witness. I just can't ask him, "Why, Michael?"
Two more wishes:
I wish for a reunited Jacksons. I wish that Michael and Marlon would consider rejoining the group, if only on a part-time basis. For old-time's sake. For my sake.
And I dream of a reunited Jackson family.
As much as LaToya hurt the family ... I long for her reconciliation with us. The Jackson family is not whole without her.
PHOTO : At a family reunion in 1989, Katherine Jackson (seated center, yellow jacket) and her husband Joseph are surrounded by seven of their nine children, including Janet and Michael who flank their parents, and 11 of their grandchildren. Of the famous Jackson siblings, only Marlon and LaToya did not attend the reunion. LaToya (at right), whose nude spread in Playboy magazine and threats to write a tell-all book have shocked and disappointed her family, is estranged from her parents and siblings.
PHOTO : Jack Gordon (at left with LaToya) did more than take over LaToya's career when he became her manager, Katherine Jackson says. He moved LaToya far from her family "so he could become the dominating influence in her life," Mrs. Jackson says. Yet, she says her relationship with her two superstar children, Janet and Michael (below), is as warm and loving as ever. Still, she gently chides Janet for "dressing like a tomboy," and she wishes that Michael, a former Jehovah's Witness, would return to the faith
 

5
10
20




Share this topic






Related Topics
TTWSYF
What's up with the HEBREWS translation?
by TTWSYF 3 months ago
Divergent
November 22 Study Article: God is a hypocrite & is NOT impartial!
by Divergent 4 months ago
cappytan
Governing Body Letter details things that "have never been done before." - Really?
by cappytan 2 months ago
AndersonsInfo
Brownstoner: How the Jehovah’s Witnesses Acquired Some of Brooklyn’s Most Insanely Valuable Properties
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
AndersonsInfo
Trey Bundy: One Year of Reporting JW Child Abuse - Your comments please!
by AndersonsInfo a month ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/56958/mrs-jackson-doesnt-shun-michael





Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ How many of the Jacksons are Disfellowshipped or Disassociated?
/  





 

How many of the Jacksons are Disfellowshipped or Disassociated?
by booker-t 11 years ago 26 Replies latest 11 years ago   watchtower bible
«
 1
 2
 »
 5
10
20
booker-t
booker-t 11 years ago

Does anybody know the current status of the Jackson family. Is Michael Jackson Disfellowshipped or Disassociated? What about LaToya Jackson? And Janet Jackson is she Disfellowshipped? I was talking to a co-worker or mine and she told me that she heard that Katherine Jackson( Mike's Mom) was Disfellowshipped but I don't think so because I heard Janet on a radio show and she said that her mom lives at the kingdom hall.( she might be a pioneer) So I hardly believe that she is DF'd but why do she still hang out with her DF'd and DA'd kids and not get into hot water with the elders?
 
blondie
blondie 11 years ago


To the best of my knowledge

Mother Jackson--JW
Rebbie Jackson--daughter--JW
LaToya--daughter--DF'd JW ( ?--reinstated?)
Michael Jackson--son--DA's per secret letter from WTS
http://www.freeminds.org/african/mjackson.htm
The father and the rest of the kids are not JWs and never were (except being forced to go as minor children, never baptized)
 
TresHappy
TresHappy 11 years ago

I remember hearing that some of the wives of the Jackson sons were Witnesses, specifically Randy. Anyone know if that's true?
 
blondie
blondie 11 years ago


I didn't find anything on Google about the spouses. Randy has been married twice, the last divorce was in 1992. Could be but I haven't found anything.
Blondie
 
jwsons
jwsons 11 years ago


I record to a VHS tape the inteview in David Letterman Show, Janet Jackson admitted she is a JW and she also said she now enjoy her birthday with a little bit feeling of guilty.
jwsons
 
under74
under74 11 years ago

I think it's kinda weird that Jermaine (convert to Islam) did a lecture type tour in the Middle East (and I think parts of Afriica) and Firpo Carr tagged along.
Anyone got any insight to why?
 
blondie
blondie 11 years ago


I record to a VHS tape the inteview in David Letterman Show, Janet Jackson admitted she is a JW and she also said she now enjoy her birthday with a little bit feeling of guilty.
Did she happen to mention if she is baptized? I don't think so. I have know people who grew up as JWs but weren't baptized consider themselves JWs. I have also know adults who studied with JWs say they were. Once I when I still went d2d I met a woman who told me about the JW family down the block, the one that put up Christmas lights every year. I had never heard of them and I had been in that congo for 15 years. So I went down and talked to the family. It turned out that they had studied for about 5 years but never were baptized and did not attend the meetings but told everyone they were JWs...hmmmm
The Wayans grew up with a JW father but I don't think any of them are baptized.

Janet's not being baptized could explain why she could admit to celebrating her birthday publicly and not worry about being DF'd. But then I have been told that it is not an automatic DFing offense by some ex-JWs or that it is by others.
Notice how Janet is quoted in this 2001 interview:
I grew up a Jehovah's Witness, that's my mother's religion, and you're not supposed to think of dating unless you're ready to get married."
http://archives.cnn.com/2001/SHOWBIZ/Music/07/03/janet.jackson.lkl/
 
under74
under74 11 years ago

Am I the only one who knows who Firpo Carr is?
 
glitter
glitter 11 years ago

How old was Jacko when he was baptised then?
 
Cicatrix
Cicatrix 11 years ago

Am I the only one who knows who Firpo Carr is? Nope. He's the guy that wrote the book defending the divine name as being Jehovah. I used to have that book. In fact, his intro in which he explained how he attended seminary without the elder's express permission got me to thinking:) As to why he is touring and lecturing, I haven't a clue.
 
under74
under74 11 years ago

Ahh...glad someone else has heard of him and I'm not crazy.
Yeah, didn't he also say at one point that he was in school working towards a phd...even though he's a Witness and shouldn't be schoolin' himself?
The whole lecture thing seemed too weird to me because Jermaine Jackson was the headliner and he was lecturing and meeting with people about Islamic peoples in the US.
 
Big Tex
Big Tex 11 years ago


Mother Jackson--JW
Rebbie Jackson--daughter--JW
LaToya--daughter--DF'd JW ( ?--reinstated?)
Michael Jackson--son--DA's per secret letter from WTS
http://www.freeminds.org/african/mjackson.htm
The father and the rest of the kids are not JWs and never were (except being forced to go as minor children, never baptized)

I think Blondie has it right. To my knowledge Janet was never baptized.
 
sandy
sandy 11 years ago


Does anybody know if MJ still contributes $ to the WT?


http://www.freeminds.org/african/mjackson.htm
Interesting clue: Former bro. Jackson is reportedly still contributing to the "worldwide publishing work" (financially, of course.)
 
Gill
Gill 11 years ago

If MJ is disassociated then how come they'll take his money?
 
blondie
blondie 11 years ago


If a DF'd person puts money in the contribution box at the KH, I have never seen the elders give it back.
Blondie
 
simplesally
simplesally 11 years ago

They will take anybodies money.
 
freedom96
freedom96 11 years ago

Firpo Carr loves media attention, and is a complete idiot. He offers nothing of value to anyone watching him. He also has tried to make himself the un-official Jackson spokesman.
 
TheOldHippie
TheOldHippie 11 years ago


I've read all of Firpo's books, and have communicated with him per e-mail, and he strikes me as being somewhat - to put it mildly - egocentric; he was the first man ever to discover this and that, to travel here and there, so gain access to this and that etc. The center of the Universe, whereas in fact whathe produces are things already published or more or less commonly known, or self-evident things.
But then, if you're a poor black JW in the US and has a good head for reading and gets a good education, and wants to tell the world something - I gues it is understandable that it somehow gets into your head and you take off .........
 
under74
under74 11 years ago

"But then, if you're a poor black JW in the US and has a good head for reading and gets a good education, and wants to tell the world something - I gues it is understandable that it somehow gets into your head and you take off ........."

I don't really think I agree. One, he's tried to re-write JW history. Two, I question his "education." Three, I don't think that just because you're black, poor, and a JW with reading skills and an agenda makes one an egomaniac. Four, I question his Dubism...why would he go on an Islamic lecturing tour?
 
Quotes
Quotes 11 years ago

But if Janet ever was baptised, there would be a crowd hoping to catch a glimpse of another "wardrobe malfunction" caused nipple exposure!
~Quotes, of the "A Slacks Malfunction In The Subway got me arrested" class http://quotes.watchtower.ca/
 

«
 1
 2
 »
 5
10
20




Share this topic






Related Topics
John Aquila
A Judicial experience.
by John Aquila 6 months ago
Esse quam videri
Caleb's Logic - Do the math
by Esse quam videri 8 months ago
The Hermit
The Hermit's story PART 1
by The Hermit 2 months ago
kepler
Mr. Geoffrey William Jackson = Humpty Dumpty
by kepler 7 months ago
atacrossroads
I lied to the elders
by atacrossroads 25 days ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/81735/how-many-jacksons-disfellowshipped-disassociated





Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ How many of the Jacksons are Disfellowshipped or Disassociated?
/  





 

How many of the Jacksons are Disfellowshipped or Disassociated?
by booker-t 11 years ago 26 Replies latest 11 years ago   watchtower bible
«
 1
 2
 »
5
10
20
AK - Jeff
AK - Jeff 11 years ago


I've read all of Firpo's books, and have communicated with him per e-mail, and he strikes me as being somewhat - to put it mildly - egocentric; he was the first man ever to discover this and that, to travel here and there, so gain access to this and that etc. The center of the Universe, whereas in fact whathe produces are things already published or more or less commonly known, or self-evident things.
OldHippy - are you referring to Firpo or to Al Gore, great 'inventor of the internet'? LOL
 
toreador
toreador 11 years ago


Blondie says:


If a DF'd person puts money in the contribution box at the KH, I have never seen the elders give it back.
Blondie
Yeah, but they wont accept field service time. They accept money but not time, that BS IMO.
 
happyout
happyout 11 years ago


I knew Firpo growing up, and his brother Ryan. Firpo is completely out of his mind, has been for years. His ego is not just huge, it enables him to take credit for damn near any information discovered in the last 100 years or so. I think it comes from having to grow up with a name like Firpo  Anything he says is suspect, and I usually believe the total opposite just to be on the safe side.
Happyout
 
TresHappy
TresHappy 11 years ago

I remember several years ago (when it was Regis & Kathie Lee) Rebbie Jackson was on and she talked about her religion. She stated that just she and her Mom were still active JW's. I remember hearing also that some of the daughters-in-law were JW's, but maybe they just studied...I think Rebbie still pioneers.
 
IT Support
IT Support 11 years ago


I understand Firpo describes himself as the Jacksons' "spiritual adviser."
Regards,
Ken
 
under74
under74 11 years ago

*"I understand Firpo describes himself as the Jacksons' "spiritual adviser."
Yeah, I saw him on CNN over this summer (?) and he was given that title as well as the title of "Jackson family spokesman."

*Happyout- I kind of gathered he was a bit off...I don't know why I keep harping on this Firpo Carr thing...just don't understand why he would be allowed to go on an Islamic speaking tour with Jermaine Jackson...unless, Jermaine's actually a JW posing as a Muslim American in order to convert Muslims to Dubism...Okay, I'll stop.




 
Raphael
Raphael 11 years ago


I know many who have grown up as Witnesses , but nolonger associate or were never baptised or are even d'fd...such as myself who for many years still refer to themselves as JW's when fillling out hospital forms or census documents etc...kinda like nominal christians who have never really personally accepted christ as a saviour and made a commitment to christianity call themselves christians ...when in reallity they are not.
As far as monetary contributions are concerned..to be fair...if I think back to my old congregation , the contribution boxes were at the back of the Kingdom Hall , and it was almost impossible to see who was or wasn't putting money in ...so it would stand to reason then that money could not be given back if it's source was not known.
Being new to this site , but having read posts for some time now, I still do not understand why some seem to pick on every little thing that the WTBTS does or doesn't do ..while no longer a witness, some of the posts seem malicious. I understand peoples anger , but some of it really seems kinda harsh and almost unfair.
 

«
 1
 2
 »
5
10
20




Share this topic



Topic Summary
does anybody know the current status of the jackson family.
is michael jackson disfellowshipped or disassociated?
what about latoya jackson?



Related Topics
John Aquila
A Judicial experience.
by John Aquila 6 months ago
Esse quam videri
Caleb's Logic - Do the math
by Esse quam videri 8 months ago
The Hermit
The Hermit's story PART 1
by The Hermit 2 months ago
kepler
Mr. Geoffrey William Jackson = Humpty Dumpty
by kepler 7 months ago
atacrossroads
I lied to the elders
by atacrossroads 25 days ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/81735/how-many-jacksons-disfellowshipped-disassociated?page=2&size=20






Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ Favorite JW Celebs!
/  





 

Favorite JW Celebs!
by professor 14 years ago 51 Replies latest 13 years ago   jw friends
«
 1
 2
 3
 »
 5
10
20
professor
professor 14 years ago


Who is your favorite JW celebrity, past and present?
Who is your least favorite?
Could it be...

Ja Rule 
Janet Jackson 
Larry Graham 
Latoya Jackson 
Lou Whitaker 
Michael Jackson 
Mickey Spillane 
Prince 
Rustom Padilla 
Salena 
Viv Nicholson 
Venus & Serena Williams 

The Wayans Brothers  
 
not interested
not interested 14 years ago

id have to say Prince since he is local and i have met him a few times actualy he was a very nice guy to meet seemed kinda shy actualy but i like his music also
 
DakotaRed
DakotaRed 14 years ago


I would have to choose Mickey Spillane as my favorite. I used to really enjoy reading his Mike hammer series.
As for last favorite, nearly any of the rest. Take your pick.

Lew
 
SoulJah
SoulJah 14 years ago

THE WAYANS BROTHERS,but i never knew they were dubs
My most favorite peice they did was, "Don't Be A Menace to Society..."
 
Golden Girl
Golden Girl 14 years ago


Hey! I actually heard of 5 of them!
I am a great Grandma so I think that's pretty good!
I would say Prince is my favorite..I love his music.
And my least favorite would be The Jacksons. Do you think Michael and Janet wanted to look like that?I love Michaels songs..but his looks scare me! That's the only reason I said least favorite!
 
Robdar
Robdar 14 years ago

Since when are the Wayan Brothers JW's?
 
professor
professor 14 years ago

See this story at Freeminds.
 
Gopher
Gopher 14 years ago


LaToya, for her nude Playboy pictures! Or Janet, for her near nudity at all times! These fine ladies praise Jehovah by bearing witness to the fine femine form!
I spoke with Larry Graham at a district convention, and he was totally down to earth and "real". And what a fine-looking wife and daughter too! mmm mmm good!
 
Francois
Francois 14 years ago


Well, my favorite almost JW celeb is Dwight Eisenhower, whose mother was a JW. If old Ike handn't had a good head on his shoulders we might be speaking German today.
Francois
 
ISP
ISP 14 years ago


Ray Franz was mine. He doesn't go so much now.....
ISP
 
Prisca
Prisca 14 years ago


Why are so many celeb ex-jws are non-white? Just occurred to me when I was looking at those pics.
Well, since I don't know half of them, I'll select someone else
This is Kate Langbroek -
She is a presenter on an Australian chat show called The Panel. She and her brother recently had an article written about them in The Sydney Morning Herald, detailing their life as JWs with their Gilead-trained parents in PNG and Australia. Her wit, charm and personality makes her a great advertisement for life outside the WTS.
 
LyinEyes
LyinEyes 14 years ago

Selena!!! My daughter and I love her music, and would dance around the house together to it. We watched her home movies and she seemed to be a young person full of life. She was just beginning to find her way in the world and then she was gone. Very traggic. She was always laughing and smiling on the home movies and seemed very down to earth. We miss her music.
 
ozziepost
ozziepost 14 years ago


How about adding this guy to the list?


Hank Marvin of The Shadows.
Does this date me? Too bad, this is a great guy and a great guitarist. And he's JW.
Cheers, Ozzie
 
Lady Lee
Lady Lee 14 years ago


Here is another Theresa Graves from Laugh0in and Get Christy Love


 
scootergirl
scootergirl 14 years ago


Larry Grahams......is that the actor from "My Wife and Kids"?
And, who is Viv Nicholson? Never heard of heard of her...
 
Gopher
Gopher 14 years ago


Scootergirl,
Larry Graham was in the music group "Sly and the Family Stone" before becoming a JW. Here is a site regarding his musical background: http://www.funkvibe.com/artists/graham/graham.htm He introduced the artist known as Prince to the JW philosophy, leading to Prince sightings at district conventions here in Minnesota the past few years.
The actor on "My Wife and Kids" is another person who grew up in a JW background: Damon Wayans. Here's the official website for that show from ABC television: http://abc.abcnews.go.com/primetime/wifeandkids/index.html
Viv Nicholson is well known in the UK, and a play called "Spend Spend Spend" is based on her book about her life. Here is a website for the play: http://www.albemarle-london.com/spend.html Here is a snippet from that site:
A new musical by Steve Brown and Justin Greene inspired by the life of Viv Nicholson from the book by Viv Nicholson and Stephen Smith. Directed by Jeremy Sams. Lighting by Mark Henderson. Choreographed by Craig Revel Horwood. Designed by Lez Brotherston. Sound by Rick Clarke.
In 1961, before The Beatles, moonwalking and the mini skirt, housewife Viv Nicholson won the first mega-jackpot on the football pools. When the papers asked Viv Nicholson what she'd do with her new fortune, her answer turned her into a household name: "I'm going to spend, spend, spend!".
Her rags to riches and back to rags story took her through five husbands, fast cars, bankruptcy and booze. She woke up spent.
This riveting new musical charts the tragedy, the comedy and the love story that is the legend of Viv Nicholson


Edited by - Gopher on 23 June 2002 9:41:53
 
Lady Lee
Lady Lee 14 years ago


Viv Nicholson
A British actress see above
Edited by - Lady Lee on 23 June 2002 9:39:56
 
William Penwell
William Penwell 14 years ago



I recall as a kid being told that the old TV actress Eve Arden was a JW although I don't know if this was a nasty dub rumor. She was a contemporary of Lucy Balls 1950 TV show, I think it was call "Our Miss Brooks". Maybe some older person here can verify. Also the jazz singer George Benzen was one. As a matter of fact I know some dubs that met him at the Kingdom hall in Hawaii. Someone commented that he couldn't have been a very good JW being an entertainer and all and I replied that he was an elder in the congregation.

Will

Edited by - William Penwell on 23 June 2002 9:52:24
 
TheStar
TheStar 14 years ago


I had no idea Ja Rule, The Wayans or Mikey Spillane were JWS!!
My favorite is SELENA, although I don't think she was ever baptized. She grew up in the same area I grew up in and my bestfriend in High school was a close friend of hers.
Her death is such a tragedy. I never knew there was a JW connection until her death. Her death happened just about the time I started studying in 1995. I hope her parents have sought help in getting themselves deprogrammed, because there may have been much guilt after that whole ordeal.
In the movie about her life there's a shot with her father and mother in bed, the father is talking about wanting to open up a restaurant. In that shot on the dresser is the "You can live forever in Paradise on Earth" book and that is the only mention of JWs in the movie (and only JWs would have caught it), so I wonder if they may have only studied. I heard a rumor that the father was an elder and stepped down to dedicate himself to his children's music career but I don't know if that rumor is true.
Edited to include: Who is Rustom Padilla?
Edited by - TheStar on 23 June 2002 10:7:58

Edited by - TheStar on 23 June 2002 10:10:8
 
Tanalyst
Tanalyst 14 years ago


False Prophet Fred Franz.
Scared the beegee's out of me as a kid, when I heard him speak at Assemblies in the 60's. You just knew God was piping the info into him.
At the start of one talk, he starts talking in Hebrew, it was so cool I paid attention for the remainder of the talk, hoping he'd do it again. No, it just was a scam to get my attention.
 

«
 1
 2
 3
 »
 5
10
20




Share this topic






Related Topics
objectivetruth
Over 300 Partakers in Reno, Nevada! Men Women & Children 12 Years old,
by objectivetruth 2 years ago
AndersonsInfo
Washington Post Artical: Prince emerges from apolitical purple wormhole and will play in Baltimore, honor Freddie Gray
by AndersonsInfo 10 months ago
avaddohn94
Misappropriation of funds (Project for an Assembly Hall in Guadalajara)
by avaddohn94 2 years ago
thewalker
Is the JW Broadcasting having good results for the Org?
by thewalker 3 months ago
blondie
Blondie's Comments You Will Not Hear at the 02-23-2014 WT Study (MEMORIAL1)
by blondie 2 years ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/30770/favorite-jw-celebs





Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ Favorite JW Celebs!
/  





 

Favorite JW Celebs!
by professor 14 years ago 51 Replies latest 13 years ago   jw friends
«
 1
 2
 3
 »
 5
10
20
meat pie
meat pie 14 years ago

What about Trevor McDonald? ITV news and current affairs presenter, I heard he had been an elder.Wouldn't say he's a favourite of mine though, horribly sycophantic. As for a least favourite, don't quote me, it might have come to nothing, but a couple of years ago I heard Peter William Sutcliffe (The Yorkshire Ripper) was working towards baptism...
 
Sam Beli
Sam Beli 14 years ago


I have to agree with LL "... Theresa Graves from Laugh0in and Get Christy Love."
Theresa was a big name JW in the 60s in the USA. She made a big hit with Brooklyn when she gave up her "worldly career" to become a full time preacher for the JWs. What a shame; she was beautiful, talented and had a bright future in front of her. She threw it all away to pioneer. Ugh!
Edited by - Sam Beli on 23 June 2002 13:39:17
 
terafera
terafera 14 years ago


George Benson was a jw....I lived in Kauai for over 13 years and met him a few times at the assemblies in Honolulu. My mother and I were shocked when watching Arsenio (back in the early 90's)...he came out singing wearing a huge glittery cross!!!
So he must be answering another calling?
and Ja Rule!????!?? I've never heard he was a jw! ?? Really?? 'Everybody start livin it up..' Well if he is/was, he sure knows how to party now!
Edited by - terafera on 23 June 2002 14:24:40
 
Mac
Mac 14 years ago

You left out Eve Arden and Leslie Uggums (and don't forget , everybodies best friend or mother-in-law saw Glenn Campbell get Baptized!)
 
Solace
Solace 14 years ago

I didnt even know Selina was a witness.. Boy, she was a victim wasnt she?. Its so tragic how her life ended. She was beautiful and very talented.
 
blondie
blondie 14 years ago


http://www.jacksonville.com/special/athletes_of_century/stories/16.shtml
Mark McCumber, the golfer, is a JW and even went to Bethel.
http://www.adherents.com/largecom/fam_jw.html
Famous Jehovah's Witnesses
◦Venus and Serena Williams - world chamption/Olympic gold medalist tennis players
◦Michael Jackson - singer, pop superstar
◦Prince - singer; convert to JWs
◦Janet Jackson - singer
◦La Toya Jackson - singer
◦Jackson Five - musical group
◦Selena - Tejano singer (Selena Quintanilla)
◦Larry Graham - singer; member of Sly And The Family Stone between 1967 and 1972, founder of Graham Central Station
◦David Thomas - songwriter/vocalist for Pere Ubu; convert to JWs
◦Herman Pizzanelli - leading Uruguayan concert guitarist in the 1960's; convert to JWs
◦Lou Whitaker - professional basketball player (Detroit Tigers)
◦Evelyn Mandela - first wife of South African president Nelson Mandela; a convert to JWs
◦Lieby Piliso - Nelson Mandela's younger sister
◦Rene Montes de Oca Martija -- dissident human-rights activist in Cuba (son of JW)
◦Wayans Brothers - comedians, actors, filmmakers
◦Rustom Padilla - Filipino movie star
◦Carmina Villarroel - Filipino actress
◦Gloria Naylor - novelist, author of The Women of Brewster Place (1982, American Book Award)
◦Mickey Spillane - best-selling crime novelist; convert to JWs in 1952 (still active)
◦Viv Nicholson - famous London lottery winner in 1961. She then became a devout JW. The musical Spend, Spend, Spend was based on her story.

Edited by - Blondie on 23 June 2002 18:30:23
 
HomebutHiding
HomebutHiding 14 years ago

Jeanette McDonald and/or her husband Nelson Eddie. Man, am I old. ALso one of the Supremes...(not Diana)
 
yrs2long
yrs2long 14 years ago

Don't forget about Naomi Campbell! I think there was a recent post about her JW upbringing.
 
HomebutHiding
HomebutHiding 14 years ago

Pardon my ignorance, but who is Naomi Cambell?
 
Gopher
Gopher 14 years ago


Naomi Campbell is a supermodel. OOOH LA LA.




Edited by - Gopher on 23 June 2002 20:16:24
 
Beck_Melbourne
Beck_Melbourne 14 years ago


What about Geri who claims her JW mother dragged her from door to door as a kid in her zealous years....I don't think her mother is still a jw now though...cos she seems to be soaking up all the limelight.
Beck

ps...I didn't know about the Waylon Brothers...how ironic...I spent Sunday listening to the Waylon Brother's best impersonators - Pappusan and Refiners Fire doing Major Payne. Best lisp spitting misdah-handicap-man insulters I've ever met.
Edited by - Beck_Melbourne on 23 June 2002 20:25:3
 
hillary_step
hillary_step 14 years ago


Not forgetting the Jazz world :
Trummy Young ( trombonist, next to Louis Armstrong ).

Don Rendell, one of the greatest tenor sax, clarinet and flautist of the age :

Edited by - hillary_step on 23 June 2002 20:34:14
Edited by - hillary_step on 23 June 2002 21:39:3
 
hillary_step
hillary_step 14 years ago


And last but not least Sid Vicious, who sadly turned to drugs the day before his first Public Discourse, after battling with his local elders over their reluctance to allow him to use four letter words to describe his feelings about Field Service and S8 Report Slips:

Edited by - hillary_step on 23 June 2002 20:43:0
 
Gopher
Gopher 14 years ago


LOL @ Hillary STEP:
Elders to Sid Vicious:
What EXACTLY do you mean by the phrase, "Sex PIstols"?
Sid's answer :
Sex pistils? That's actually part of a FLOWER , yeah that's it! Pistils -- part of Jehovah's creation that we can all enjoy!
 
Dismembered
Dismembered 14 years ago


Hey All
Don't forget the trumpeteer Chuck Winfield, of Blood Sweat & Tears, still an elder to this day in the August Maine Congregation
 
hillary_step
hillary_step 14 years ago


Dismembered,
I also heard way back that Lew Soloff had entered the WTS kingdom, bought along it seems by Don Rendell.
HS
 
RunningMan
RunningMan 14 years ago

Here's my favorite: Mark Barton:
 
LDH
LDH 14 years ago


I am LMAO @ Running Man!
Prisca, it doesn't count if they're in the same family, LOL. For instance, by default the Jacksons should count as one, as should the Williams sisters and the Wayans.


What about the Navy Pilot dude who crashed his jet into the mountain? I can't remember his name but 60 Minutes did a segment.
Lisa
 
Reborn2002
Reborn2002 14 years ago


LDH-
A Navy pilot Jehovah's Witness? By default would that not be an act constituting disassociation?
I mean serving in the Armed Forces and even piloting a fighter? C'mon.
NO WAY he could claim to be an active JDub.
 
termite 35
termite 35 14 years ago


Apparently the multi -talented (???!!) -Geri and mother left a few years ago.
Trevor MacDonald?Really?! How come all there celebs get to miss meetings?

(I heard Naomi Campbells' mother was; but not Naomi.)
 

«
 1
 2
 3
 »
 5
10
20




Share this topic



Topic Summary
who is your favorite jw celebrity, past and present?.
who is your least favorite?
ja rule



Related Topics
objectivetruth
Over 300 Partakers in Reno, Nevada! Men Women & Children 12 Years old,
by objectivetruth 2 years ago
AndersonsInfo
Washington Post Artical: Prince emerges from apolitical purple wormhole and will play in Baltimore, honor Freddie Gray
by AndersonsInfo 10 months ago
avaddohn94
Misappropriation of funds (Project for an Assembly Hall in Guadalajara)
by avaddohn94 2 years ago
thewalker
Is the JW Broadcasting having good results for the Org?
by thewalker 3 months ago
blondie
Blondie's Comments You Will Not Hear at the 02-23-2014 WT Study (MEMORIAL1)
by blondie 2 years ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/30770/favorite-jw-celebs?page=2&size=20





Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ Favorite JW Celebs!
/  





 

Favorite JW Celebs!
by professor 14 years ago 51 Replies latest 13 years ago   jw friends
«
 1
 2
 3
 »
5
10
20
scootergirl
scootergirl 14 years ago

Well now I am p.o'd......that outfit that Naomi Campbell has on.......well I wore that exact one at a assembly once! Geez.....can't a "sister" have something of her own?
 
Matty
Matty 14 years ago

I heard Trevor MacDonald only studied. I have never heard he was baptized let alone an Elder. His "Tonight with Trevor MacDonald" show is the UK equivalent of Dateline or 60 Minutes.
 
LDH
LDH 14 years ago


For Reborn.

Lisa
 
joannadandy
joannadandy 14 years ago

I am gonna have to say LaToilet because she so CRAZEE!
 
Swan
Swan 13 years ago


Welsh actor Luke Evans was brought up as a Jehovah's Witness. He is starring in the West End musical Taboo with Boy George.
http://www.advocate.com/html/stories/871/871_finalcut.asp
 
myself
myself 13 years ago



Lou Whitaker - professional basketball player (Detroit Tigers)
Did they change teams?
 
PopeOfEruke
PopeOfEruke 13 years ago


Van The Man (Morrison) had some JW in him, during childhood or so I think? But never baptized...
And of course Bob Dylan must be a JW because he wrote "All Along the Watchtower", and "Man in the Long Black Coat", which is about Charles Taze Russell, and "If not for You" which has these lyrics:
If not for you,
Babe, I'd read Awake all night,
Wait for the mornin' light
To shine in through,
But it would not be new,
If not for you.
Pope
PS Maybe Bob is not REALLY a JW, I could be wrong on that one.......
 
Beck_Melbourne
Beck_Melbourne 13 years ago


Bob Dylan also wrote about the Pope of Eruke...don't believe everything he says, I think he's on drugs or something
"Well, I got back and took
The parkin' ticket off the mast
I was ripping it to shreds
When this coastguard boat went past
They asked me my name
And I said, "Captain Kidd"
They believed me but
They wanted to know
What exactly that I did
I said for the Pope of Eruke
I was employed
They let me go right away
They were very paranoid
Not a real person, just a jokey made up name. Eruke is Greek for restrain, curb, hold back. The Pope of Restraint. The song,
Bob Dylan's 115th Dream, aka Bob Dylan's Later Dream, is not about restraint!"
Beck
Edited by - Beck_Melbourne on 13 September 2002 1:37:27
 
PopeOfEruke
PopeOfEruke 13 years ago


Beck, thats such a GREAT song, do you have it? It has that great false start where everyone starts laughing......the laughing was going to be edited out but His Bobness said No, Leave it in...
Its on the album Bringin' It All Back Home..............
Pope
 
Beck_Melbourne
Beck_Melbourne 13 years ago


thats such a GREAT song
Now how did I know you liked it?? Yes I have the song/ablum, haven't heard it in a while. I like all of his music.
I usually poach phrases out of a song for usernames also, my yahoo username is Carelesshair, borrowed from Jewel's song Foolish Games.
And you thought you were unique LOL, well, actually you are, your username is the coolest on the board IMO.
Beck
 
William Penwell
William Penwell 13 years ago


Bob Dylan is on drugs!! You must be kidding I would never know.

Will
 
The_Bad_Seed
The_Bad_Seed 13 years ago

Probably Comforter
 

«
 1
 2
 3
 »
5
10
20




Share this topic



Topic Summary
who is your favorite jw celebrity, past and present?.
who is your least favorite?
ja rule



Related Topics
objectivetruth
Over 300 Partakers in Reno, Nevada! Men Women & Children 12 Years old,
by objectivetruth 2 years ago
AndersonsInfo
Washington Post Artical: Prince emerges from apolitical purple wormhole and will play in Baltimore, honor Freddie Gray
by AndersonsInfo 10 months ago
avaddohn94
Misappropriation of funds (Project for an Assembly Hall in Guadalajara)
by avaddohn94 2 years ago
thewalker
Is the JW Broadcasting having good results for the Org?
by thewalker 3 months ago
blondie
Blondie's Comments You Will Not Hear at the 02-23-2014 WT Study (MEMORIAL1)
by blondie 2 years ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/30770/favorite-jw-celebs?page=3&size=20





Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ Interesting Words from LaToya Jackson
/  





 

Interesting Words from LaToya Jackson
by jamiebowers 7 years ago 47 Replies latest 7 years ago   watchtower scandals
«
 1
 2
 3
 »
 5
10
20
jamiebowers
jamiebowers 7 years ago

Article posted on JWS:
http://www.boston.com/news/local/articles_of_faith/2009/07/michael_jackson.html Scroll down to readers comments and see quotes from LaToya's book (#29)
Credit posting to:http://www.jwsupportforum.com/index.php?topic=6677.0
 
Hope4Others
Hope4Others 7 years ago

That's quite an interesting comment by Latoya, it might be an interesting book to read....
Sad, it seems by her words her mother really condoned her fathers behavior, goes to show you never really
know what goes on behind closed doors.
h4o
 
Mickey mouse
Mickey mouse 7 years ago

Excerpts from LaToya Jackson's own 1991 biography, LATOTA: GROWING UP IN THE JACKSON FAMILY:
 " ... neither I nor my siblings ever led a normal existence, not even as small children, years before celebrity transformed our lives. We were a not-so-typical but classic dysfunctional family. Yes, there was love and happiness, but it was poisoned by emotional and physical abuse, duplicity, and denial. ... The proscriptions of my Jehovah's Witness faith, my mother's seeming love and devotion, and my father's inability to express any emotion but anger kept us all entangled in a web of guilt disguised as love, brutality that was called 'discipline,' and blind obedience that felt like loyalty. ... We couldn't identify it, but we all sensed something was wrong in our house. Most of my siblings 'rebelled' by essentially running away from home to teenage marriages. ... I was Mother's best friend, and the quietest, shyest, most obedient child of all. I surprised everyone. I also broke the cardinal rule of a dysfunctional family. I stopped living the lie and playing the destructive game. -- pages 1-2.
 "Thinking back over all those years, I realized that Mother was the guiding force behind the cruelty and abuse. This lady who pretended to be so gentle on the surface had in fact caused all the turmoil in our lives. We'd always thought that it was Joseph, but it was her, telling him what to do and how to do it. Like I'd said to her before, she was always throwing the rock and hiding her hand, convincing everyone -- outsiders and my own
 siblings -- that she was sweet, kindhearted, and compassionate. Little did they know that the minute they were out of earshot she talked about them very, very viciously. After seeing it so many times, I finally had to face the fact that this was her true personality. -- page 257.
 "Michael and I were very active in the Jehovah's Witness faith. ... Five days a week the two of us and Mother studied the Bible at home and attended the Kingdom Hall. ... Every morning Michael and I witnessed, knocking on doors around Los Angeles, spreading the word of Jehovah. ... As my brother's fame grew, he had to don convincing disguises, like a rubber fat suit he bought years later, -- pages 53-4.
 "... because we were supposed to associate exclusively with other members, Michael and I made few friends at the private high school ... We did, however, become close with another [Jehovah's] Witness. Darles was my first and only friend outside the family, and I treasured the time we spent together. ... Each day at lunch the three of us studied the Bible together. She also joined us at the Kingdom Hall. During a meeting, Darles bravely challenged one of the elders. ... The elder's reply was typical. He cited the scripture, which supported his position but did not really address Darles's
 point. So she wrote a letter ... This outraged the other elders. One day Rebbie's husband, Nathaniel [Brown], also an elder, cornered me. 'LaToya,' he said, 'you're never allowed to speak to Darles again. Ever. ... She's been disfellowshipped.' ... After that neither Michael nor I had anything to do with Darles. We missed her so much and for the first time began to privately reconsider some of the [WatchTower Society's] teachings. We felt that questions should be encouraged, not silenced through threats of disfellowship. -- pages 55-56.
 "Mother ... frowned on our socializing with white kids, an attitude I found hypocritical coming from a Christian. -- page 34.
"... both my parents harbor racist attitudes, particularly against Jews, ... 'Wherever you go, whatever you do in this business, you find a Jew,' Mother used to complain bitterly all the time, 'I can't stand it.' ... She'd go on and on. 'They're always on top. Jews are so nosy. They like controlling you. I hate 'em all.' To their faces, however, my mother was as sweet as could be. ... Hearing talk like this turned my stomach, especially when it came from my mother's mouth. How could a religious woman be so hateful? ... The depth of Mother's loathing was expressed in one of her oft-repeated opinions: 'There's one mistake Hitler made in his life -- he didn't kill all those Jews. He left too many dxxx Jews on this earth, and they multiplied,' --pages 132-4.
 "On the Victory tour, ... , [Michael] hired someone whose sole task was to locate a Kingdom Hall in each town so that Michael wouldn't miss a single meeting. ... Michael ... won those record-breaking eight honors at the 1984 Grammy Awards. The very next morning one elder issued him an ultimatum that my brother must choose between music and the [Jehovah's Witness] religion. ... Because Michael diligently studied the Bible, he could usually cite chapter and verse supporting his contention that entertaining people was not wrong. 'I'm still living according to the [WatchTower Society's] teachings,' he pointed out, as he'd done so many times before. I still go door to door wherever I am, even if I'm on tour. I can't help it if people hang up my poster on their wall or tear my picture out of a magazine. I don't ask them to idolize me. I only want them to enjoy my music.' ... many Jehovah's Witnesses used to congregate outside the Kingdom Hall hoping to catch a glimpse of Michael Jackson,
 knowing full well this kind of adulation was forbidden. Michael did everything humanly possible to demonstrate his dedication to Jehovah. Once when an elder criticized, 'Your movements on stage suggest sex; don't do them anymore,' my brother complied without protest and promptly changed the routine. He also invited an elder on tour to see for himself that he lived in harmony with all the [WatchTower] faith's rules, canvassed door to door, and attended all the meetings. ... One day I walked into Janet's room to find Michael crying his eyes out. 'LaToya, ... I can't talk to you ever again. ... The elders had a big meeting, and they told me never to speak to you because you haven't been coming to the Kingdom Hall. ... they said that if I don't stop talking to you, they'll kick me out of the religion.' ... Michael decided to disobey the elders' edict and after that never attended any more meetings. ... he subsequently severed his ties to the organization through a formal letter. What made this painful episode even more agonizing was that for a long time I believed Michael might be one of the Remnant, the select 144,000. -- pages 196-200.

Copied over from http://www.boston.com/news/local/articles_of_faith/2009/07/michael_jackson.html
 
AK - Jeff
AK - Jeff 7 years ago

How deeply the knife cuts. Interesting excerpts. Thanx for posting them.
Jeff
 
wha happened?
wha happened? 7 years ago

I used to think she was a loon. I was of course an active JW. Well I guess the oxygen gets cut off when u stick your head up your own ass. These quotes sound so sincire and real to me now. The comment about the elders answer and his double speak was so close to the truth
 
brinjen
brinjen 7 years ago

I used to also think she was a loon and yep, that was way back when I was a JW myself. Looking at those excerpts now... I find them very real and sincere.
 
wha happened?
wha happened? 7 years ago

My opinion of the family has changed alot recently. The old JW rumour machine is so out of touch now
 
brinjen
brinjen 7 years ago

It still blows me away how much common ground everyone's story has. Doesn't matter what background, country, culture etc we come from, we've all had very similar experiences... and they claim they're not a cult...
 
Black Sheep
Black Sheep 7 years ago

Well I guess the oxygen gets cut off when u stick your head up your own ass.
That description fitted me so well.
Thanks for the laugh.

Cheers
Chris
 
BabaYaga
BabaYaga 7 years ago

Wow.
Thank you.
 
quietlyleaving
quietlyleaving 7 years ago

I guess LaToya wants her book to sell.
 
Black Sheep
Black Sheep 7 years ago

It is very easy to find differences between myself, and my upbringing, and Michael and his family and their upbringing, but over the past few days I keep bumping into similarities.
I have known for a long time that we did have some common factors in our background and even in current issues, but I had no idea of how many.
It seems like not a day goes by and I find out something about him and his family that has a parallel in my life.

I am sure I am not the only 'born in' that is noticing this.

His family has my deepest sympathy for their loss.

My greatest fear for their family is for the children. I know what it is like to be a child victim of a family controlled by a cult and a tyrant father.

Chris








    

Consciousness expresses itself through creation.
This world we live in is the dance of the creator.
Dancers come and go in the twinkling of an eye but the dance lives on.
On many an occasion when I'm dancing, I've felt touched by something sacred.
In those moments, I've felt my spirit soar and become one with everything that exists. I become the stars and the moon. I become the lover and the beloved.
I become the victor and the vanquished. I become the master and the slave.
I become the singer and the song. I become the knower and the known.
I keep on dancing and then, it is the eternal dance of creation.
The creator and creation merge into one wholeness of joy.

I keep on dancing and dancing.......and dancing, until there is only......the dance.......
 


© Michael Jackson
 
 


 
 
quietlyleaving
quietlyleaving 7 years ago

wow Michael Jackson wrote that- sounds like he could see beyond his "abusive father and abusive cult background".
 
wha happened?
wha happened? 7 years ago

It"s such an odd Scenario and it's sad how the politics and legal behavior and so called family reacts .....
 
Satanus
Satanus 7 years ago

'We couldn't identify it, but we all sensed something was wrong in our house. Most of my siblings 'rebelled' by essentially running away from home to teenage marriages. ... I was Mother's best friend, and the quietest, shyest, most obedient child of all. I surprised everyone. I also broke the cardinal rule of a dysfunctional family. I stopped living the lie and playing the destructive game. -- pages 1-2.
 "Thinking back over all those years, I realized that Mother was the guiding force behind the cruelty and abuse. This lady who pretended to be so gentle on the surface had in fact caused all the turmoil in our lives. We'd always thought that it was Joseph, but it was her,'
I find this part so interesting, cuz, in my family, it was similar. Growing up, we thought my dad was the bastard, but after having left home for many yrs and reading a lot, we found out it was my mother who was the source of the trouble, and she skillfully passed the blame onto my dad. My jw sister also has said the something similar to me.
The quote about dance, also very interesting. It seems that for michael, dance was his mystical step into the spiritual. No wonder. It was what kept him going, perhaps. Kinda glad that he went while he was doing the one thing that he loved, that allowed him to transcend the physical.
S
 
Satanus
Satanus 7 years ago

Thanks micky mouse and blacksheep for providing those quotes, btw:smile:
S
 
quietlyleaving
quietlyleaving 7 years ago

satanus, being a mother myself, the way I see it, it seems mother nature has a lot to answer for
 
frozen one
frozen one 7 years ago

"...one elder issued him an ultimatum that my brother must choose between music and the [Jehovah's Witness] religion."
To me this quote represents the greatest sin the wbts commits against God. The wbts pressures followers with ultimatums to turn their backs on God given talents and replace them with sales pitch meetings and distribution campaigns. How many people who were meant by God to be doctors, scientists, authors, actors, athletes, etc are instead sitting through mind numbing meetings and going through the motions searching for converts that don't exist? The belief that people must choose between developing real gifts given freely by a loving God or discarding that God given potential to live a life planned and structured by a book bindery based in NYC is sickening and sinful.
 
Satanus
Satanus 7 years ago

quietlyleaving
'seems mother nature has a lot to answer for'
Do you mean that 'mother nature' is a bit on the cruel side to her children on this planet, being that evolutionary processes of survival of the fittest is one of her processes?
S
 
quietlyleaving
quietlyleaving 7 years ago

Satanus, not exactly but mother nature does have an "appearance of gentleness", she can appear to be "very cruel" and to be as the "source of all our troubles". when we say that our mothers are like this too, it makes me wonder what we are really talking about and describing.
 

«
 1
 2
 3
 »
 5
10
20




Share this topic






Related Topics
blondie
Blondie's Comments You Will Not Hear at the 09-20-2015 WT Study (LOYALTY)
by blondie 6 months ago
blondie
Blondie's Comments You Will Not Hear at the 11-22-2015 WT Study (God Loves us?)
by blondie 4 months ago
blondie
Blondie's Comments You Will Not Hear at the 10-11-2015 WT Study (EXPECTATION)
by blondie 5 months ago
AndersonsInfo
Long but interesting article: Russia: Religious literature banned and blocked
by AndersonsInfo 6 months ago
AndersonsInfo
Trey Bundy: One Year of Reporting JW Child Abuse - Your comments please!
by AndersonsInfo a month ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/178081/interesting-words-from-latoya-jackson






Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ Interesting Words from LaToya Jackson
/  





 

Interesting Words from LaToya Jackson
by jamiebowers 7 years ago 47 Replies latest 7 years ago   watchtower scandals
«
 1
 2
 3
 »
 5
10
20
Satanus
Satanus 7 years ago

Quietly
Actually, i didn't say that my or michael's mother was similar to 'mother nature'. I had more in mind examples in nature, where the cubs go w the mother, and the mother defends them against dangers, which could include even their biological fathers. A good example of this is bears. Seems to me, that michael's mother could have stood between him and abusers and exploiters. But, wt corporate teaching is that wtgod, the elders, the wt corp and the father come between the child and the mother. Not natural or healthy, imo. 'Course, as the child grows up, this picture changes. Michael, however, didn't grow up, emotionally.
S
 
Satanus
Satanus 7 years ago

Quietly
Actually, i didn't say that my or michael's mother was similar to 'mother nature'. I had more in mind examples in nature, where the cubs go w the mother, and the mother defends them against dangers, which could include even their biological fathers. A good example of this is bears. Seems to me, that michael's mother could have stood between him and abusers and exploiters. But, wt corporate teaching is that wtgod, the elders, the wt corp and the father come between the child and the mother. Not natural or healthy, imo. 'Course, as the child grows up, this picture changes. Michael, however, didn't grow up, emotionally.
S
 
poppers
poppers 7 years ago

The Dancing the Dream quote was incredible.
 
truthlover
truthlover 7 years ago

When Latoya wrote this tell all book she was under the influence of her abusive husband - completely controlled by him, she dabbled in phsyic, card reading, fortune telling, etc.. he was not a member of the Jackson family and they really disliked him - she eventually broke away and went back to the family, who accepted her , Katherine even getting on the tv to support her.. so it makes one wonder if all she said was truthful, yet some of what she said does have her perspective, cant be all bad if Rebbie is still in, most anyone who dealt with Mrs jackson speaks very highly of her - she cant keep her guard up all the time unless she is genuine

This book was written years ago
TL
 
quietlyleaving
quietlyleaving 7 years ago

Satanus
I think the point I want to make is that nature is innocent both in her metaphorical role of mother and as impersonal powers and forces interacting, destroying and creating. I wonder if mothers like Mrs Jackson can be assigned such innocence and that she did whatever she was capable of to protect and care for Michael just as mothers do in the wild (but I would argue that in the wild, they are more unsucessful than successful).
I think to an extent Michael Jackson fulfilled his own desires and the persona of child/youth was one he himself cultivated for himself

edit: but yes I agree that nature is inspiring whether she is beautiful or terrifying and we can learn from her "successes"
 
purplesofa
purplesofa 7 years ago

Latoya did an interview, I think when she was on Big Brother, and talked of the JW's.
I have looked to find it,
I first saw it posted here and thought crazyblondeb posted it, but I have yet to find it.

Wondering if anyone knows what I am talking about and has the link to this youtube video?

thanks,

purps
 
Scarred for life
Scarred for life 7 years ago

That's an interesting series of quotes from LaToya. It all sounds perfectly plausible to me. I do think they were negatively impacted by their JW upbringing like many of us were. And the way she describes Mrs. Jackson reminds me of my own mother in many ways. My father was not a tyrant or abusive but my mother acted one way to people outside our family and quite another way to my sister and myself. Most people would not believe how she acted toward me and my sister. She had everyone fooled.
As far as Mr Jackson being abusive, I find it very difficult to believe that Mrs. Jackson was not aware of it. And I feel that way about all mothers where physical and sexual abuse is happening to their children.
 
brinjen
brinjen 7 years ago

I know the video you mean Purps... having a look on YouTube right now and can't seem to find it either.
 
purplesofa
purplesofa 7 years ago

thanks brinjen,
I have spent allot of time looking, I appreciate it, and have taken a break from it. hope it has not been pulled.

purps
 
SouthCentral
SouthCentral 7 years ago

GREAT POST!!!
As mentioned, this was typical attitude of the witnesses. I remember our elder (early 1980's) saying that if you play pac-man, you could get reproved. The ghost were related to spiritism.

We all have endured the harsh, BS for many years!!
 
Scarred for life
Scarred for life 7 years ago

Everything she writes about the JWs sounds totally true to me. It's consistent with what I saw when I was a JW.
 
Quirky1
Quirky1 7 years ago

CNN had Jermaine on this AM and he spoke of their first religion as being JW's and even mentioned the name Jehovah. He said MJ had researched several other religions as Jewish and last was Islam, which is Jermaines religion of choice. They also mentioned that MJ's mother and one sister were still active JW's.
 
brinjen
brinjen 7 years ago

I'll have another look tomorrow, looking to me like it was pulled I can't find a mention of it anywhere.
 
purplesofa
purplesofa 7 years ago

thanks brinjen,
I have been going through JWD trying to find it, and then I get distracted.

purps
 
purplesofa
purplesofa 7 years ago

I found the thread with the youtube link, the video is now private
http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/beliefs/170595/1/LaToya-Jacksons-D-C-with-Michael-because-of-the-WTS
 
Odrade
Odrade 7 years ago

" most anyone who dealt with Mrs jackson speaks very highly of her - she cant keep her guard up all the time unless she is genuine"

I beg to differ. My mother has been accomplishing this for 35+ years, being one way with her family, and another completely different way with everyone else. If she can do it, why not Mrs. Jackson?
 
Scarred for life
Scarred for life 7 years ago

My mother accomplished this all the way up to the point of her death, being one way with my sister and myself and another completely different way with everybody else.
 
brinjen
brinjen 7 years ago

Yep, my grandmother managed to fool a lot of people into thinking she was a sweet and loving woman... and when there were other people around she was. As soon as they were gone, she was a completely different person. Not hard to imagine Katherine Jackson managing to pull off the same thing at all.
 
brinjen
brinjen 7 years ago

I found the thread with the youtube link, the video is now private
Buggar.
 
choosing life
choosing life 7 years ago

Loved the poem Dancing The Dream. Is it part of a song?
I have to say that Katherine Jackson had to see the brutal way her children were treated by their father. Also, the kids sang in bars and experienced a lot of the bad side of life at a very young age.
Where was their mom's protection? Always wondered if the possibility of making it big and the money involved bought her silence.
 

«
 1
 2
 3
 »
 5
10
20




Share this topic



Topic Summary
article posted on jws:.
http://www.boston.com/news/local/articles_of_faith/2009/07/michael_jackson.html scroll down to readers comments and see quotes from latoya's book (#29).
credit posting to:http://www.jwsupportforum.com/index.php?topic=6677.0.



Related Topics
blondie
Blondie's Comments You Will Not Hear at the 09-20-2015 WT Study (LOYALTY)
by blondie 6 months ago
blondie
Blondie's Comments You Will Not Hear at the 11-22-2015 WT Study (God Loves us?)
by blondie 4 months ago
blondie
Blondie's Comments You Will Not Hear at the 10-11-2015 WT Study (EXPECTATION)
by blondie 5 months ago
AndersonsInfo
Long but interesting article: Russia: Religious literature banned and blocked
by AndersonsInfo 6 months ago
AndersonsInfo
Trey Bundy: One Year of Reporting JW Child Abuse - Your comments please!
by AndersonsInfo a month ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/178081/interesting-words-from-latoya-jackson?page=2&size=20





Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ Interesting Words from LaToya Jackson
/  





 

Interesting Words from LaToya Jackson
by jamiebowers 7 years ago 47 Replies latest 7 years ago   watchtower scandals
«
 1
 2
 3
 »
5
10
20
ziddina
ziddina 7 years ago

Jamie - GREAT thread! MM - thanks (as Satanus said) for posting those quotes - I'm intrinsically lazy, and that made it SO much easier!
This quote - and what Satanus said about it:
"Thinking back over all those years, I realized that Mother was the guiding force behind the cruelty and abuse. This lady who pretended to be so gentle on the surface had in fact caused all the turmoil in our lives. We'd always thought that it was Joseph, but it was her, telling him what to do and how to do it. Like I'd said to her before, she was always throwing the rock and hiding her hand, convincing everyone -- outsiders and my own siblings -- that she was sweet, kindhearted, and compassionate. Little did they know that the minute they were out of earshot she talked about them very, very viciously. After seeing it so many times, I finally had to face the fact that this was her true personality."
As Satanus said - this was ALSO the pattern of behavior in my dysfunctional family, too. I've often wondered - since JW women are, in effect, stuck in a system that mimics the structure and attitudes of Middle Eastern cultures, whether the women actually IN Middle Eastern cultures are as passive-aggressively controlling, manipulative and dishonest as the patterns of behavior I observed within the JW org...
Yes, and the men frequently indulged in such behavior too, but as Satanus said about his family, I too particularly noticed it in my mother - my father was the 'visible tool', the one with the illusion of dominance and power within the biblical system.
Things are probably much worse in Middle Eastern family dynamics - threats of beheading, stoning, and all of that - the actual Middle Eastern religio-governmental systems [with the exception of Morocco, and some other forward-looking Middle Eastern countries] are even MORE totalitarian than the WTBTS system...
Zid
 
Hoping4Change
Hoping4Change 7 years ago

These interviews have Latoya mentioning the Witnesses a few times, (not much though)

&feature=related

&feature=related

Mostly explaining why she is so shy, though she does she she doesnt believe one needs an organization to have a relationship with God.
 
steve2
steve2 7 years ago

The Jackson siblings have a limitless ability to nurse wounds and preserve those wounds in verbals vats: LaToya and her late brother have made complaining about their "lot" a specialty. MJ's more recent music was unbearably self-pitying and his untimely death will ensure the complaints will live on and on and on.
Meanwhile, around the globe, numbering in the hundreds of thousands over time, truckloads of uncared-for people die from the direct or indirect effects of drug abuse every day. MJ is just one more statistic.
 
daniel-p
daniel-p 7 years ago


MJ is just one more statistic.
Death only takes on meaning when life is shared. People dying around the world means less to us than someone we know dying. They are statistics, but not the people with whom we may share something. With Michael Jackson, we share his experience of spiritual abuse at the hands of the WTS and his JW mother.
 
purplesofa
purplesofa 7 years ago

The video I wanted to find was just a talk she was having with someone .....from Big Brother, an informal interview. It was very damaging to the WT, I am so sorry it is private now.
I wish there was a way to contact the person that had it posted at YOUTuBe so we could see it again.

purps
 
steve2
steve2 7 years ago


With Michael Jackson, we share his experience of spiritual abuse at the hands of the WTS and his JW mother.
Ah, a shared experience! That's news to me. Of all the nonsense this man was exposed to during his abundantly self-indulged life, spiritual abuse at the hands of the WTS and his mother must surely rank as the least probelmatic.
No, sadly you must wake up: "we" don't share his experience: he lived in a child-obsessed fantasy world, bewildered by ordinary rules of conduct and shame-facedly focused on nursing his wounds. Don't blame it on the WTS; don't blame it on his mother; blame it on the "Boogie".
 
quietlyleaving
quietlyleaving 7 years ago

lol @ steve - blame it on the boogie



 
ziddina
ziddina 7 years ago

Well, the fact that he was STILL dragging his parents around with him [think dead albatross around the neck...] thru his adult life, gave him something VALID to complain about, in my opinion.
As a matter of fact, both parents seemed parasitically attached to him - and I saw a similar behavior in my own JW family... Mumsy Dearest and Dimwit Daddsy weren't very fond of me - I was just a lowly FEMALE - but they attached themselves to my brother - to the extent that he NEVER DATED AND NEVER GOT MARRIED.
They controlled him and parasitically fed off of him [still are, far as I know...] for his entire adult life - well into his 50's! He was ALWAYS supporting them financially as well as 'spiritually'... Guess they must have caluculated his earning power versus mine when he was born, and decided to latch onto him instead.
Which worked out very well for me, in the end. Too often, in families where the male child/children are valued so much more than the female, it's the female child/children who end up taking care of the very parents who denigrated and belittled them for being born female, when said parent becomes old, feeble, and incapable of caring for themselves.
And THEN the daughter has that same selfish, skewed lack of justice and preference for an often-spoiled male child squatting in HER home until the feeble parent expires - NEVER soon enough, either.
Yuk. I escaped that fate, however - gotta love being disassociated and considered the 'spawn of the devil'! That means my bratty kid brother HAS TO TAKE CARE OF THEM, instead of me!
Getting back to Michael Jackson and Latoya's words, however, I can see how the thought of dragging his hated parents around with him for the rest of his life could have negatively affected Michael's state of mind.
 

«
 1
 2
 3
 »
5
10
20




Share this topic



Topic Summary
article posted on jws:.
http://www.boston.com/news/local/articles_of_faith/2009/07/michael_jackson.html scroll down to readers comments and see quotes from latoya's book (#29).
credit posting to:http://www.jwsupportforum.com/index.php?topic=6677.0.



Related Topics
blondie
Blondie's Comments You Will Not Hear at the 09-20-2015 WT Study (LOYALTY)
by blondie 6 months ago
blondie
Blondie's Comments You Will Not Hear at the 11-22-2015 WT Study (God Loves us?)
by blondie 4 months ago
blondie
Blondie's Comments You Will Not Hear at the 10-11-2015 WT Study (EXPECTATION)
by blondie 5 months ago
AndersonsInfo
Long but interesting article: Russia: Religious literature banned and blocked
by AndersonsInfo 6 months ago
AndersonsInfo
Trey Bundy: One Year of Reporting JW Child Abuse - Your comments please!
by AndersonsInfo a month ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/178081/interesting-words-from-latoya-jackson?page=3&size=20





Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ LaToya Jackson's D/C with Michael because of the WTS
/  





 

LaToya Jackson's D/C with Michael because of the WTS
by XxJazzxX 7 years ago 7 Replies latest 7 years ago   watchtower beliefs
5
10
20
XxJazzxX
XxJazzxX 7 years ago





Couldn't embed because it is disabled.
Watch it and weep.
And didnt Marlin Brando became an Athiest?
 
Mrs. Fiorini
Mrs. Fiorini 7 years ago

So sad.
 
Scarred for life
Scarred for life 7 years ago

The WTS is a dangerous, abusive cult.
 
purplesofa
purplesofa 7 years ago

Thanks for posting,

purps
 
crazyblondeb
crazyblondeb 7 years ago

damn, wish there were more on this topic!!
 
Nathan Natas
Nathan Natas 7 years ago

Brando may be athier, but he's not the athiest.
 
purplesofa
purplesofa 7 years ago

Did anyone happen to DL this video before it was made private?

Thanks,
purps
 
Scarred for life
Scarred for life 7 years ago

I didn't see it. Does anybody have it?
 

5
10
20




Share this topic






Related Topics
Simon
Doing the Right Thing, Making a Choice (shunning)
by Simon 5 months ago
blondie
Blondie's Comments You Will Not Hear at the 11-22-2015 WT Study (God Loves us?)
by blondie 4 months ago
blondie
BLONDIE'S COMMENTS YOU WILL NOT HEAR AT THE 07-05-2015 WT STUDY (SATAN)
by blondie 8 months ago
Bangalore
Abuse redress depends on God: Jehovah's Witnesses
by Bangalore 6 months ago
OrphanCrow
"We don't run a spy network"
by OrphanCrow 7 months ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/170595/latoya-jacksons-d-c-michael-because-wts




Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ Michael Jackson cries after celebrating first christmas
/  





 

Michael Jackson cries after celebrating first christmas
by shopaholic 7 years ago 18 Replies latest 6 years ago   jw friends
5
10
20
shopaholic
shopaholic 7 years ago

I know you all are tired of hearing about Michael Jackson but after seeing this video, I was reminded of the guilt that lingers after the leaving the JW religion. As I understand it, his primary reason for leaving was because LaToya was DF'd and he didn't like having to chose between religion and family. Sounds familiar?
This clip shows a side of him that we rarely saw...its from a FOX special that showed a collection of his home movies.



 
Satanus
Satanus 7 years ago

Wow. He was lucky to have liz as a friend.
S
 
Thechickennest
Thechickennest 7 years ago

It's sad how much baggage a former JW will always carry. This video was made about 15 years ago. Has the borg let up about the holidays or, are they still considered taboo? I have been away for a lot of years.
 
Yizuman
Yizuman 7 years ago

Wow, that was so cool.
I think they have never let up about holidays, especially Christmas. It's one of my favorite holidays.
It was awesome to see the kids playing with their super soaker with their dad.
Can someone make a transcript of what MJ is saying other than what Liz has been subtitled?
I'm deaf as some of you know.
Yiz
 
outofservice
outofservice 7 years ago

So sad the amount of guilt, we all have it. I worry that his children will now be denied the holidays that they had enjoyed with there father.No win situation for the kids.
 
C. T. Russell
C. T. Russell 7 years ago

Neverland Ranch, MJ, Christmas, Liz.
I've never done LSD but I picture it being like this. Liz knocking door "Michael!" the ghost of Christmas past is here. Along with some creepy xmas music and some human sized nut crackers.
 
Mary
Mary 7 years ago

This video was made about 15 years ago. Has the borg let up about the holidays or, are they still considered taboo?
You've got 3 guesses and the first two don't count.
 
Big Tex
Big Tex 7 years ago

Hey whatever the guy was, or wasn't, in this life, he does share something we've all been through once we have celebrated a holdiay -- the thrill of excitement mixed with a dash of guilt and wrapped around a sense of wonder about this whole new experience.
Personally Christmas is my favourite. I love watching the kiddos coming downstairs and the rest of the family opening their pressies. Way way cool.
 
BurnTheShips
BurnTheShips 7 years ago

Wow.
BTS
 
No Apologies
No Apologies 7 years ago

Thats a nice clip of him, one of the few where he seems like a real person, not like he's not acting or reading from a script. And the fact that he felt guilty about it, I think we can all relate to that.

No Apologies
 
lrkr
lrkr 7 years ago

I really hope he resolved in his deepest thoughts- that all of JWdom is shite- before he died. If he didn't- he lived with guilt that would explain some of his psychosis
 
brinjen
brinjen 7 years ago

That video made me want to laugh and cry at the same time.  I do hope he got over the guilt and just enjoyed all the holidays (christmas included) for what they are... FUN!
 
Wasanelder Once
Wasanelder Once 7 years ago

I couldn't tell which one was Liz and which one was Michael. Even though I'm out, christmas here looks like such a manafactured event. I'd rather have good friends over for pizza on a friday. W.Once
 
Hope4Others
Hope4Others 7 years ago

Christmas is a hard ting to get past after leaving...I've been gone 10 years, it was only this year I put a little tree up in my office.
But no where else, I still worried someone would see it...
I can understand how he felt overwhelmed and excited yet feeling a measure of guilt.
h4o
 
Tatiana
Tatiana 7 years ago

Wonderful video...thanks.
 
ohiocowboy
ohiocowboy 7 years ago

I am speechless. What a nice friend Liz Taylor was to him.
 
Yizuman
Yizuman 7 years ago


&feature=related
More of the super soaker fun.
Yiz
 
GoddessRachel
GoddessRachel 6 years ago

Michael seemed so sweet and innocent in that video. It made me wonder if that is part of why I come across to people as so much younger than I really am, because of all the childhood stuff I never experienced so it makes me seem sort of childlike now. Like Brinjen, that video made me want to laugh and cry all at the same time too.

Rachel
 
PSacramento
PSacramento 6 years ago

breaks your heart...
 

5
10
20




Share this topic






Related Topics
What Now?
Our Letter to Our Family
by What Now? 2 months ago
Leela1
Closer/death/Funerals
by Leela1 3 days ago
AndersonsInfo
Article: "Why God Won't Go Away" (Contains an example of a JW) An excellent read!
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
David_Jay
Your Jehovah’s Witness Is Showing
by David_Jay 2 months ago
Pattytheperfect1
First post after a year or two of lurking on this site-Sorry for the length!
by Pattytheperfect1 2 years ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/178546/michael-jackson-cries-after-celebrating-first-christmas





Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ Sister Venus Williams
/  





 

Sister Venus Williams
by messenger 14 years ago 2 Replies latest 14 years ago   jw friends
5
10
20
messenger
messenger 14 years ago


. http://observer.co.uk/osm/story/0,6903,727737,00.html
What planet is she on?
She was a prodigy who was trained by her father, but that's where the likeness to the other focused, driven champions ends. This one likes doughnuts, admits she can be lazy and enjoys teasing interviewers.
Tim Adams
Sunday June 9, 2002
Venus Williams lounges, all arms and legs, in the corner of the bar in a Hamburg hotel. She's telling me about her competitive debut on a tennis court. It all started, she says, in her sleepy, giggly way, back when she was three and a half years old, and her Daddy took her down to the nearest club in Los Angeles, and organised a game for her against the pro. She had a cut-down racket, and was a bit shy at first, but soon she was 'serving overarm, aces and everything, hitting forehands down the line'.
I'm leaning forward a little while she recounts the detail of this story, imagining the toddler with the corn-row hair, swinging her modified racket for all she was worth, already refusing to take a step back for anyone, her Daddy urging her on. 'And how did you do?' I wonder.
'I was used to beating guys by then, so I beat this guy, too...' she says, her eyes wide and her mouth breaking into its spectacular grin. 'Straight sets.'
I'm near the edge of my seat by now. 'Really?' I say, 'You beat him? When you were three?'
She pauses a beat, then looks at me.
'Nahhhh!' she says, and throws back her head, laughing hugely. 'Course not!'
There are not too many prodigies who can make fun of the idea of their genius, but Venus Williams can't take any of her charmed life quite seriously. When she first came on to the tennis circuit, her easy self-assurance was interpreted as arrogance; tour players who had been told all their life that tennis was a complicated grind where only those who focused, focused and focused would succeed, were unnerved by the gangly teenager in the locker room, laughing about her laziness, about how she found it hard to concentrate on practice. She was frozen out for a long time, dismissed with her younger sister, Serena, as disrespectful, uppity, but she did not care about that too much.
In retrospect, it seems that Williams, now the world's leading player as she and her family always suggested she would be, was not so much boasting about her natural talent, rather - like a young Muhammad Ali - just excitedly letting the world in on her great secret. There was an idea that women's tennis would, after Navratilova and her pumped-up forearms, be dominated by those who worked the hardest, started the youngest and practised the longest; but there had always been a sense in the Williams family of the importance of doing things a little differently.
Venus has inherited much of her attitude from her father and coach, Richard, though she can laugh languidly about him, too. This is a man whose pride at seeing his daughters fulfil the wild, sponsorship-friendly prophecies he made for them as juniors, has been matched only by his subsequent delight in winding up the white male tennis establishment in general, and its journalists in particular. For a while, his telephone carried the following answer machine message: 'Hi, I'm Richard Williams. There are those who want to ask me what I think of inter-marriage. Anyone that's marrying outside of this race that's black should be hung by their necks until sundown. Please leave a message after the tone...'
Like many tennis dads - Mike Agassi, Stefano Capriati - Richard Williams had plotted Venus and Serena's success ante-natally. The legend has it that while watching a satellite women's tennis tournament in the late Seventies, Williams, the son of a sharecropper from the Deep South, was amazed at the prize money - more than he earned in a year running a security firm - and wondered how he might tap into it. He had three daughters, but he believed they were already too old to turn into champions, and his wife, Oracene (known as 'Brandi'), was not eager to have any more. Williams's solution, by his own account, was to sabotage her contraceptive pills and, in 1980, Venus was born. Two years later his wife gave birth to Serena.
Like all Williams's claims, this family lore is to be taken not entirely in earnest - but if he planned Grand Slam winners from conception, it is really there that the comparisons with most of the more driven sporting parents end. Rather than sending Venus and Serena to a hothouse academy or travelling with them on the junior circuit, he put his youngest daughters on a training programme of his own devising, taking them out every day on the municipal courts in the rough and ready borough of Compton in Los Angeles.
His story goes that while the girls were perfecting their topspin, they were witnesses to drive-by gang shootings (Venus herself suggests that on one occasion she and her sister had to 'dive for cover when bullets started flying'). Her father claims that he made a deal with the gangs in the neighbourhood to let his daughters - his 'ghetto Cinderellas' - practise in relative peace, because the 'lily white world of tennis' needed to be shaken up a bit.
In many ways the purpose of this mythology has long been served - since the Williams sisters' Grand Slam wins the lily white world of tennis will perhaps never be quite the same again - and these days Venus seems keen to play down the tales from the 'hood. Ask her now about the character of her growing up and she says only that 'you just take the childhood you're given, right? You don't question it! We were all just so happy!'
I wonder at one point if there were drug casualties around among her friends?
'I was 10 years old,' she says. 'I wasn't in the drugs scene. I guess some kids around me had to grow up quickly, had all those problems. But I wasn't one of those kids, or around those kids, not at all.'
Still, when I ask her if she thinks she will ever regret not having a 'normal' childhood (as Agassi and Capriati have done over the years) she puts her head in her hands and suddenly exclaims: 'But our Mom was so cruel! I'm always telling her that! We were so deprived!'
In what way exactly?
Her face crumbles in mock-despair. 'I can't say,' she says.
Go on...
'Well, you know most kids in their lunch boxes have little happy juices and stuff - we didn't get juices, we got milk! It ruined my childhood, you know. All my friends got Captain Crunch cereal or Froot Loops, and we had to have Puff Wheat...'
And she's rocking back laughing again. 'So cruel! No Froot Loops! Of course, when I confront her Mom makes excuses - she didn't want us to have sugar because we were already all bouncing off the walls - but that's no good to me now! The damage is done!'
Venus is here in Hamburg with her mother, and her dog, Bobby, a Yorkshire terrier (he travels everywhere with her, she says, 'except England, or any of England's old colonies. You guys really left your mark on the world...') Her parents divide their time between their daughters' matches, and both still spend a lot of time on court with them, advising and coaching.
When Venus first came on the tour, Brandi, like her husband and children a Jehovah's Witness, was keen to warn her of the dangers she might face. 'They are in the locker room talking with these older women - undressed - who are lesbians,' she once explained. 'The kids get caught up in something and think "Maybe that's really me" when it's not. So, yeah, I taught Venus and Serena about that...'
In describing the differences between her daughters, Brandi has been apt to say that Serena has always had to work hard for her success, but that everything has always come easy to Venus, whether it was at school or on the tennis court.
When I put this description to Venus she smiles at the suggestion, and says a little half-heartedly, 'I feel I've always worked pretty hard. I'm no flash in the pan, you know. I think I'm demonstrating some kind of longstanding commitment...'
And then she concedes her mother maybe has a point: 'I guess I always knew I'd be a champ. That's what I was told, and at that age that's what you believe...' She smiles shyly, stretches out her legs still further, giggles some more to herself. 'You know I was always really very, very, very good. Serena, on the other hand, wasn't very good at all. She was small, really slim and the racket was way too big for her. Hopeless. Believe it or not she used to lob and slice. That was her game.' She thinks of the aggressive power her little sister now possesses, shakes her head. 'She's moved on from there. She started playing especially good tennis at around 15, which was soon enough - I mean she won the US Open two years later - but still it was quite late compared to me. You know,' she says, 'I guess I was always Venus...'
Venus seems to have a very clear idea of who Venus is, and where Venus came from, and where Venus is going - so much so that she often talks about herself in the third person, or at least about that version of herself that is a product or a phenomenon. She seems amused by many of the trials this Venus has to go through, and by some of the nonsense that surrounds her role as the world's most bankable player. Later in the day I see her on top of a crane in the city centre with the tournament organiser, a portly German gentleman, signing a billboard of herself, cheek to cheek with a gigantic image of her own backside, and unable to stop giggling. I begin to see how her irony might keep her sane.
Some of this distance comes from her religious faith. Or at least, she says, that is certainly why she's as laid back as she is. 'I know for sure that all this is not the only thing in life,' she suggests. 'I know it's not the most important thing for me to win the most Grand Slams and be remembered in this world. I certainly don't have to win little tournaments here, there and everywhere, I don't have to win at all,' she says, before remembering herself and adding: 'Although I do want to.'
Her attitude to competition is also perhaps a product of her father's prescient judgment in not letting his daughters really play competitively until they were late into their teens. While he had always been quick to tell anyone that would listen, and many that wouldn't, of his girls' great prowess, (Venus had already signed six-figure endorsement deals with Reebok when she was 10) Richard Williams did not put them up against the best of their peers as they were growing up, didn't think it right that girls should have to experience that kind of competitive pressure. 'Don't get too tied up in this,' he claims to have told Venus in an attempt to limit her time on the practice court, 'or you'll be like the rest of them. You'll be a dummy and a fool.'
Some coaches told him he was throwing away their chances with this attitude, but when Venus eventually joined the circuit full time at 17, with good exam grades behind her, and ambitions to learn Chinese and play the guitar, she won the first tournament she entered. Her father, of course, sat in the stands holding a placard that read: 'I told you so.'
Martina Hingis, who is exactly Venus's contemporary, had already won more than 100 professional matches at the same age and the strain of that early success seems now to have caught up with her body. Hingis's feet and ankles and knees have suffered the shocks of the relentless schedule, and she is already contemplating retirement at 22. Jennifer Capriati (Venus's greatest rival in the last year) struggled with different demons before getting her head together, and the stories of Carling Bassett and Andrea Jaeger should be admonitory.
In contrast, Venus seems possessed of a kind of balance that perhaps comes from being allowed to grow into her extraordinary body at her own pace. She also has no sense of yet having fulfilled a fraction of her potential - she has four Grand Slam victories, two at Wimbledon, two at the US Open, and it is hard not to see her achieving many more.
Her father once suggested - and he has suggested many, many things - that he wanted her to be out of tennis by the time she was 25, ('By 26, she can graduate college and then start setting her businesses up. By 30, 31 she'll be set, and by 35 she can give me a grandchild.') but she does not see much prospect of that. 'That's just Dad,' she says, rolling her eyes slightly. 'No, I intend on playing for a while. It's getting easier I think. A forehand crosscourt, backhand down the line, a couple of aces. Game. This life's not so complicated...'
I wonder how much of her motivation she still derives from being a black player at the top of a still overwhelmingly white sport. She says that though she 'never forgets she is a black player on court, and it would be hard to think otherwise,' she doesn't really believe that fact gives her extra motivation.
Over the years, she has been smart, gracious, enough to let others, notably her father, of course - address this subject for her. (When he used to sit in on her original interviews and press conferences Richard Williams would routinely preface them with the words: 'Now, don't be intimidated by us. We won't hurt you.') Her mother, too, was less circumspect. 'They don't even look at her,' Brandi Williams said of Venus, when she first joined the tour. 'I think they're afraid of her. They want her to be their Stepin Fetchit.'
Venus says simply now that she's never experienced any racism in tennis, and smiles brightly. The obvious comparison in this respect, and in many others, is with Tiger Woods. Is she driven by a sense of history, like Woods, a desire to take the sport to another level?
She shakes her head a little wearily at the thought, which seems to sound far too much like hard work. 'Nah, not really,' she says, quietly. 'My ambition is to enjoy my life and to do exactly what I want to do...' And then a little more determinedly: 'And I'll do that. I will be free.'
Some of this independence has led Venus into trouble over the past few years. In the same way that they protested against the rigours of the junior tour by not playing it, Venus and her sister have also been criticised for picking and choosing their matches, not perhaps fulfilling all their ludicrous tournament commitments.
Venus says she has no trouble getting psyched up for nothing events like the one in Hamburg, and it is where she played some of the best tennis of her life last year, but you get the sense she believes it is a necessary evil rather than something to get overly excited about. Tellingly, Serena is not here, and the sisters let their schedules ensure these days that they only meet on the biggest stages. When Venus pulled out of a semi-final against her sister in Indian Wells last year, blaming a mystery injury, Serena was booed through the final against Kim Clijsters, and there was much agonising in the press box.
She remains philosophical about this 'problem', saying only that they try to keep apart as much as they can in smaller events. Venus leads the series 4-1, including a crushing straight sets win in the US Open final last year. Will there be special pressures on their matches after that?
'Well,' she says, 'Serena's always real tough you know. I just hope she gives me a second serve to hit every now and then when we play.'
Do they worry if they play too often it might get in the way of their special relationship?
'No,' she says, 'that would be idiotic, and just being the big sister I would never let that happen. If we argued about it once we got off court, she'd shake me or we'd have a hug or whatever. It would never get personal.'
Does she still feel she has to look out for her sister on the tour?
'I think in the beginning she thought she was me,' Venus says smiling, 'But in the last couple of years - she's 20 now! Little Serena, all grown up! - she's realised that she's not me. She's pretty much an extrovert character and I'm an introvert. She likes to go out, party, make friends. Whereas me I like being at home, hanging out with Bobby, reading books,'
Venus was widely criticised, too, for missing a few events after 11 September. Her rival Lindsay Davenport suggested that Venus had 'lied' about an injury she had in order to miss an event. Talking about it now, it seems that Davenport perhaps had a point, though Venus will not be specific. 'It was a difficult time,' she says. 'I cancelled a couple of things because I didn't want to go, I guess. I wanted to be at home.'
How did she feel about being called a liar?
'I must have forgotten about that, I guess,' she says, smiling faintly.
Does any of that kind of animosity come out in the locker room?
'No. If I had to confront someone I suppose I would. But then I'm not so bothered what anyone else thinks.'
Venus is quite aware that the tour, and perhaps the US tour in particular needs her, a little bit more than she needs it. Since the retirement of Steffi Graf and with the demise of any real challenge from the poster girl, Anna Kournikova, Williams is the one whom everyone wants to see. I wonder if the money that attends this position has come to seem absurd to a girl who grew up with a five-dollar allowance - which she blew on secret doughnuts and ice cream.
'Not really absurd,' she says, enjoying the idea. 'I mean I guess there's always going to be jobs that pay more than others, and I suppose I have one of those...'
I suggest this is perhaps a slight understatement, given that she earned $10 million last year from prize money and endorsements (even more than Kournikova).
She giggles. 'I'm just blessed, I guess.' And then in her best mock hand-wringing tones. 'If I didn't play tennis I don't know where I'd be. I don't know if I'd be in trouble or fighting or in college, getting thin on noodles and rice - I'd be thrilled about that - or maybe I wouldn't have gone to college. I would be faced with so many decisions!'
Her wealth must bring its own decisions: what does she do with it all?
She says, of course, she does a lot of shopping - 'I shop very well' - gives some to charity and has along the way become something of a connoisseur of begging letters.
'Though these days I don't open my mail any more unless I'm expecting something. Still I get all these weird letters! One from a guy in South Africa recently who sent me a letter proposing that I regularly sent him a few thousand dollars and in return he would send me more letters. I'm not sure about that deal! My favourite was from a lady who wrote me saying, "My name is so and so and I have seven children to support, and what's more I am a clown." And she sent a picture of herself in a clown suit. I loved that letter,' she grins. 'I didn't send any money. But still I loved the letter.'
In between tournaments she's doing her correspondence course in interior design at the London Guildhall. 'I'm going to have my diploma soon,' she says brightly. 'Once you take an interest, you're eyes kind of open up to interiors you know.'
She's fixing up her own place?
'Of course!'
We gaze round the lobby of the Intercontinental Hotel Hamburg, with its mock rococo flourishes and burnished wood fittings.
What would she change about this?
'I think it's beautiful just the way it is,' she says.
Williams does not really moan too much about the price of fame. When I ask how it has been to do her growing up in public, she laughs and says she's not grown up yet. She's a bit wary of the British press since one tabloid reporter staked out her home before Wimbledon last year, kept trying to get into her house - and probably not, she supposes, to write an interiors piece - but mostly, she says, she can hold on to a private life of sorts.
Does she find that who she is gets in the way of relationships?
She smiles some more. 'I suppose it might if I was looking for one, but I mean I'm not really on the market right now. I'm only 21, I wouldn't say I was especially desperate to get that ring on my finger. When I'm 40, maybe, and it still hasn't happened perhaps I'll be wondering what's going on, but I'm OK for now...' In this, and all things, it seems, she's still happy enough to listen to the advice of her parents.
I wonder if she had been looking forward to dancing with her fellow champion Goran Ivanisevic at last year's Wimbledon Ball. 'Yeah,' she says, 'but I didn't have a dress. I mean I thought that I might have to go to the ball so I'd bought this dress. A shirt dress, strapless, bright red, you know, quite short. A lovely dress. But when I put it on my Mom said, all concerned, you know, "Haven't you got anything else?" And after that of course I couldn't wear it. So I just wore... whatever. And anyway I think that they cancelled the dancing, when it got to be my turn...'
Does she see a time when she will want to break free of that family involvement in her life, doesn't she ever feel it stifling?
'No!' she says, firmly. 'I love it! When we all get together, us five girls, Mom and Dad, we have such a jolly time, as you say in London.'
And if they clash, all these formidable forces, who tends to get the last word?
'I guess we all do,' she says. 'Or at least,' and this sounds much more like it, 'we all have the last laugh.'
 
dustrabbit
dustrabbit 14 years ago


Their father is a JW? I thought he smoked and all that.
 Just curious, do you think they ever get "counselled" for those skimpy tennis outfits, esp. the ones with cleavage?
To do list:
1.Still waiting to goose the Organization.
 
Klaus Vollmer
Klaus Vollmer 14 years ago

yesterrday she had a match in Paris - against her litttle sister.
wow what sexy femmes, frozen nipples and lages until the venus hill.
Guess that is a witnessing for the hitch tower
 

5
10
20




Share this topic






Related Topics
AndersonsInfo
Trey Bundy: One Year of Reporting JW Child Abuse - Your comments please!
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
Greybeard
The KEY WORD in Isaiah 44:25-26 is "Predictions" and the apostles NEVER made any predictions setting dates.
by Greybeard 3 months ago
Tenacious
Has anyone noticed how in the October JW Broadcast, Losch encourages good works towards ALL people?
by Tenacious 5 months ago
AndersonsInfo
Brownstoner: How the Jehovah’s Witnesses Acquired Some of Brooklyn’s Most Insanely Valuable Properties
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
punkofnice
Questions for JW lurkers
by punkofnice 5 months ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/29768/sister-venus-williams






Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ Sister Venus Williams
/  





 

Sister Venus Williams
by messenger 14 years ago 2 Replies latest 14 years ago   jw friends
5
10
20
messenger
messenger 14 years ago


. http://observer.co.uk/osm/story/0,6903,727737,00.html
What planet is she on?
She was a prodigy who was trained by her father, but that's where the likeness to the other focused, driven champions ends. This one likes doughnuts, admits she can be lazy and enjoys teasing interviewers.
Tim Adams
Sunday June 9, 2002
Venus Williams lounges, all arms and legs, in the corner of the bar in a Hamburg hotel. She's telling me about her competitive debut on a tennis court. It all started, she says, in her sleepy, giggly way, back when she was three and a half years old, and her Daddy took her down to the nearest club in Los Angeles, and organised a game for her against the pro. She had a cut-down racket, and was a bit shy at first, but soon she was 'serving overarm, aces and everything, hitting forehands down the line'.
I'm leaning forward a little while she recounts the detail of this story, imagining the toddler with the corn-row hair, swinging her modified racket for all she was worth, already refusing to take a step back for anyone, her Daddy urging her on. 'And how did you do?' I wonder.
'I was used to beating guys by then, so I beat this guy, too...' she says, her eyes wide and her mouth breaking into its spectacular grin. 'Straight sets.'
I'm near the edge of my seat by now. 'Really?' I say, 'You beat him? When you were three?'
She pauses a beat, then looks at me.
'Nahhhh!' she says, and throws back her head, laughing hugely. 'Course not!'
There are not too many prodigies who can make fun of the idea of their genius, but Venus Williams can't take any of her charmed life quite seriously. When she first came on to the tennis circuit, her easy self-assurance was interpreted as arrogance; tour players who had been told all their life that tennis was a complicated grind where only those who focused, focused and focused would succeed, were unnerved by the gangly teenager in the locker room, laughing about her laziness, about how she found it hard to concentrate on practice. She was frozen out for a long time, dismissed with her younger sister, Serena, as disrespectful, uppity, but she did not care about that too much.
In retrospect, it seems that Williams, now the world's leading player as she and her family always suggested she would be, was not so much boasting about her natural talent, rather - like a young Muhammad Ali - just excitedly letting the world in on her great secret. There was an idea that women's tennis would, after Navratilova and her pumped-up forearms, be dominated by those who worked the hardest, started the youngest and practised the longest; but there had always been a sense in the Williams family of the importance of doing things a little differently.
Venus has inherited much of her attitude from her father and coach, Richard, though she can laugh languidly about him, too. This is a man whose pride at seeing his daughters fulfil the wild, sponsorship-friendly prophecies he made for them as juniors, has been matched only by his subsequent delight in winding up the white male tennis establishment in general, and its journalists in particular. For a while, his telephone carried the following answer machine message: 'Hi, I'm Richard Williams. There are those who want to ask me what I think of inter-marriage. Anyone that's marrying outside of this race that's black should be hung by their necks until sundown. Please leave a message after the tone...'
Like many tennis dads - Mike Agassi, Stefano Capriati - Richard Williams had plotted Venus and Serena's success ante-natally. The legend has it that while watching a satellite women's tennis tournament in the late Seventies, Williams, the son of a sharecropper from the Deep South, was amazed at the prize money - more than he earned in a year running a security firm - and wondered how he might tap into it. He had three daughters, but he believed they were already too old to turn into champions, and his wife, Oracene (known as 'Brandi'), was not eager to have any more. Williams's solution, by his own account, was to sabotage her contraceptive pills and, in 1980, Venus was born. Two years later his wife gave birth to Serena.
Like all Williams's claims, this family lore is to be taken not entirely in earnest - but if he planned Grand Slam winners from conception, it is really there that the comparisons with most of the more driven sporting parents end. Rather than sending Venus and Serena to a hothouse academy or travelling with them on the junior circuit, he put his youngest daughters on a training programme of his own devising, taking them out every day on the municipal courts in the rough and ready borough of Compton in Los Angeles.
His story goes that while the girls were perfecting their topspin, they were witnesses to drive-by gang shootings (Venus herself suggests that on one occasion she and her sister had to 'dive for cover when bullets started flying'). Her father claims that he made a deal with the gangs in the neighbourhood to let his daughters - his 'ghetto Cinderellas' - practise in relative peace, because the 'lily white world of tennis' needed to be shaken up a bit.
In many ways the purpose of this mythology has long been served - since the Williams sisters' Grand Slam wins the lily white world of tennis will perhaps never be quite the same again - and these days Venus seems keen to play down the tales from the 'hood. Ask her now about the character of her growing up and she says only that 'you just take the childhood you're given, right? You don't question it! We were all just so happy!'
I wonder at one point if there were drug casualties around among her friends?
'I was 10 years old,' she says. 'I wasn't in the drugs scene. I guess some kids around me had to grow up quickly, had all those problems. But I wasn't one of those kids, or around those kids, not at all.'
Still, when I ask her if she thinks she will ever regret not having a 'normal' childhood (as Agassi and Capriati have done over the years) she puts her head in her hands and suddenly exclaims: 'But our Mom was so cruel! I'm always telling her that! We were so deprived!'
In what way exactly?
Her face crumbles in mock-despair. 'I can't say,' she says.
Go on...
'Well, you know most kids in their lunch boxes have little happy juices and stuff - we didn't get juices, we got milk! It ruined my childhood, you know. All my friends got Captain Crunch cereal or Froot Loops, and we had to have Puff Wheat...'
And she's rocking back laughing again. 'So cruel! No Froot Loops! Of course, when I confront her Mom makes excuses - she didn't want us to have sugar because we were already all bouncing off the walls - but that's no good to me now! The damage is done!'
Venus is here in Hamburg with her mother, and her dog, Bobby, a Yorkshire terrier (he travels everywhere with her, she says, 'except England, or any of England's old colonies. You guys really left your mark on the world...') Her parents divide their time between their daughters' matches, and both still spend a lot of time on court with them, advising and coaching.
When Venus first came on the tour, Brandi, like her husband and children a Jehovah's Witness, was keen to warn her of the dangers she might face. 'They are in the locker room talking with these older women - undressed - who are lesbians,' she once explained. 'The kids get caught up in something and think "Maybe that's really me" when it's not. So, yeah, I taught Venus and Serena about that...'
In describing the differences between her daughters, Brandi has been apt to say that Serena has always had to work hard for her success, but that everything has always come easy to Venus, whether it was at school or on the tennis court.
When I put this description to Venus she smiles at the suggestion, and says a little half-heartedly, 'I feel I've always worked pretty hard. I'm no flash in the pan, you know. I think I'm demonstrating some kind of longstanding commitment...'
And then she concedes her mother maybe has a point: 'I guess I always knew I'd be a champ. That's what I was told, and at that age that's what you believe...' She smiles shyly, stretches out her legs still further, giggles some more to herself. 'You know I was always really very, very, very good. Serena, on the other hand, wasn't very good at all. She was small, really slim and the racket was way too big for her. Hopeless. Believe it or not she used to lob and slice. That was her game.' She thinks of the aggressive power her little sister now possesses, shakes her head. 'She's moved on from there. She started playing especially good tennis at around 15, which was soon enough - I mean she won the US Open two years later - but still it was quite late compared to me. You know,' she says, 'I guess I was always Venus...'
Venus seems to have a very clear idea of who Venus is, and where Venus came from, and where Venus is going - so much so that she often talks about herself in the third person, or at least about that version of herself that is a product or a phenomenon. She seems amused by many of the trials this Venus has to go through, and by some of the nonsense that surrounds her role as the world's most bankable player. Later in the day I see her on top of a crane in the city centre with the tournament organiser, a portly German gentleman, signing a billboard of herself, cheek to cheek with a gigantic image of her own backside, and unable to stop giggling. I begin to see how her irony might keep her sane.
Some of this distance comes from her religious faith. Or at least, she says, that is certainly why she's as laid back as she is. 'I know for sure that all this is not the only thing in life,' she suggests. 'I know it's not the most important thing for me to win the most Grand Slams and be remembered in this world. I certainly don't have to win little tournaments here, there and everywhere, I don't have to win at all,' she says, before remembering herself and adding: 'Although I do want to.'
Her attitude to competition is also perhaps a product of her father's prescient judgment in not letting his daughters really play competitively until they were late into their teens. While he had always been quick to tell anyone that would listen, and many that wouldn't, of his girls' great prowess, (Venus had already signed six-figure endorsement deals with Reebok when she was 10) Richard Williams did not put them up against the best of their peers as they were growing up, didn't think it right that girls should have to experience that kind of competitive pressure. 'Don't get too tied up in this,' he claims to have told Venus in an attempt to limit her time on the practice court, 'or you'll be like the rest of them. You'll be a dummy and a fool.'
Some coaches told him he was throwing away their chances with this attitude, but when Venus eventually joined the circuit full time at 17, with good exam grades behind her, and ambitions to learn Chinese and play the guitar, she won the first tournament she entered. Her father, of course, sat in the stands holding a placard that read: 'I told you so.'
Martina Hingis, who is exactly Venus's contemporary, had already won more than 100 professional matches at the same age and the strain of that early success seems now to have caught up with her body. Hingis's feet and ankles and knees have suffered the shocks of the relentless schedule, and she is already contemplating retirement at 22. Jennifer Capriati (Venus's greatest rival in the last year) struggled with different demons before getting her head together, and the stories of Carling Bassett and Andrea Jaeger should be admonitory.
In contrast, Venus seems possessed of a kind of balance that perhaps comes from being allowed to grow into her extraordinary body at her own pace. She also has no sense of yet having fulfilled a fraction of her potential - she has four Grand Slam victories, two at Wimbledon, two at the US Open, and it is hard not to see her achieving many more.
Her father once suggested - and he has suggested many, many things - that he wanted her to be out of tennis by the time she was 25, ('By 26, she can graduate college and then start setting her businesses up. By 30, 31 she'll be set, and by 35 she can give me a grandchild.') but she does not see much prospect of that. 'That's just Dad,' she says, rolling her eyes slightly. 'No, I intend on playing for a while. It's getting easier I think. A forehand crosscourt, backhand down the line, a couple of aces. Game. This life's not so complicated...'
I wonder how much of her motivation she still derives from being a black player at the top of a still overwhelmingly white sport. She says that though she 'never forgets she is a black player on court, and it would be hard to think otherwise,' she doesn't really believe that fact gives her extra motivation.
Over the years, she has been smart, gracious, enough to let others, notably her father, of course - address this subject for her. (When he used to sit in on her original interviews and press conferences Richard Williams would routinely preface them with the words: 'Now, don't be intimidated by us. We won't hurt you.') Her mother, too, was less circumspect. 'They don't even look at her,' Brandi Williams said of Venus, when she first joined the tour. 'I think they're afraid of her. They want her to be their Stepin Fetchit.'
Venus says simply now that she's never experienced any racism in tennis, and smiles brightly. The obvious comparison in this respect, and in many others, is with Tiger Woods. Is she driven by a sense of history, like Woods, a desire to take the sport to another level?
She shakes her head a little wearily at the thought, which seems to sound far too much like hard work. 'Nah, not really,' she says, quietly. 'My ambition is to enjoy my life and to do exactly what I want to do...' And then a little more determinedly: 'And I'll do that. I will be free.'
Some of this independence has led Venus into trouble over the past few years. In the same way that they protested against the rigours of the junior tour by not playing it, Venus and her sister have also been criticised for picking and choosing their matches, not perhaps fulfilling all their ludicrous tournament commitments.
Venus says she has no trouble getting psyched up for nothing events like the one in Hamburg, and it is where she played some of the best tennis of her life last year, but you get the sense she believes it is a necessary evil rather than something to get overly excited about. Tellingly, Serena is not here, and the sisters let their schedules ensure these days that they only meet on the biggest stages. When Venus pulled out of a semi-final against her sister in Indian Wells last year, blaming a mystery injury, Serena was booed through the final against Kim Clijsters, and there was much agonising in the press box.
She remains philosophical about this 'problem', saying only that they try to keep apart as much as they can in smaller events. Venus leads the series 4-1, including a crushing straight sets win in the US Open final last year. Will there be special pressures on their matches after that?
'Well,' she says, 'Serena's always real tough you know. I just hope she gives me a second serve to hit every now and then when we play.'
Do they worry if they play too often it might get in the way of their special relationship?
'No,' she says, 'that would be idiotic, and just being the big sister I would never let that happen. If we argued about it once we got off court, she'd shake me or we'd have a hug or whatever. It would never get personal.'
Does she still feel she has to look out for her sister on the tour?
'I think in the beginning she thought she was me,' Venus says smiling, 'But in the last couple of years - she's 20 now! Little Serena, all grown up! - she's realised that she's not me. She's pretty much an extrovert character and I'm an introvert. She likes to go out, party, make friends. Whereas me I like being at home, hanging out with Bobby, reading books,'
Venus was widely criticised, too, for missing a few events after 11 September. Her rival Lindsay Davenport suggested that Venus had 'lied' about an injury she had in order to miss an event. Talking about it now, it seems that Davenport perhaps had a point, though Venus will not be specific. 'It was a difficult time,' she says. 'I cancelled a couple of things because I didn't want to go, I guess. I wanted to be at home.'
How did she feel about being called a liar?
'I must have forgotten about that, I guess,' she says, smiling faintly.
Does any of that kind of animosity come out in the locker room?
'No. If I had to confront someone I suppose I would. But then I'm not so bothered what anyone else thinks.'
Venus is quite aware that the tour, and perhaps the US tour in particular needs her, a little bit more than she needs it. Since the retirement of Steffi Graf and with the demise of any real challenge from the poster girl, Anna Kournikova, Williams is the one whom everyone wants to see. I wonder if the money that attends this position has come to seem absurd to a girl who grew up with a five-dollar allowance - which she blew on secret doughnuts and ice cream.
'Not really absurd,' she says, enjoying the idea. 'I mean I guess there's always going to be jobs that pay more than others, and I suppose I have one of those...'
I suggest this is perhaps a slight understatement, given that she earned $10 million last year from prize money and endorsements (even more than Kournikova).
She giggles. 'I'm just blessed, I guess.' And then in her best mock hand-wringing tones. 'If I didn't play tennis I don't know where I'd be. I don't know if I'd be in trouble or fighting or in college, getting thin on noodles and rice - I'd be thrilled about that - or maybe I wouldn't have gone to college. I would be faced with so many decisions!'
Her wealth must bring its own decisions: what does she do with it all?
She says, of course, she does a lot of shopping - 'I shop very well' - gives some to charity and has along the way become something of a connoisseur of begging letters.
'Though these days I don't open my mail any more unless I'm expecting something. Still I get all these weird letters! One from a guy in South Africa recently who sent me a letter proposing that I regularly sent him a few thousand dollars and in return he would send me more letters. I'm not sure about that deal! My favourite was from a lady who wrote me saying, "My name is so and so and I have seven children to support, and what's more I am a clown." And she sent a picture of herself in a clown suit. I loved that letter,' she grins. 'I didn't send any money. But still I loved the letter.'
In between tournaments she's doing her correspondence course in interior design at the London Guildhall. 'I'm going to have my diploma soon,' she says brightly. 'Once you take an interest, you're eyes kind of open up to interiors you know.'
She's fixing up her own place?
'Of course!'
We gaze round the lobby of the Intercontinental Hotel Hamburg, with its mock rococo flourishes and burnished wood fittings.
What would she change about this?
'I think it's beautiful just the way it is,' she says.
Williams does not really moan too much about the price of fame. When I ask how it has been to do her growing up in public, she laughs and says she's not grown up yet. She's a bit wary of the British press since one tabloid reporter staked out her home before Wimbledon last year, kept trying to get into her house - and probably not, she supposes, to write an interiors piece - but mostly, she says, she can hold on to a private life of sorts.
Does she find that who she is gets in the way of relationships?
She smiles some more. 'I suppose it might if I was looking for one, but I mean I'm not really on the market right now. I'm only 21, I wouldn't say I was especially desperate to get that ring on my finger. When I'm 40, maybe, and it still hasn't happened perhaps I'll be wondering what's going on, but I'm OK for now...' In this, and all things, it seems, she's still happy enough to listen to the advice of her parents.
I wonder if she had been looking forward to dancing with her fellow champion Goran Ivanisevic at last year's Wimbledon Ball. 'Yeah,' she says, 'but I didn't have a dress. I mean I thought that I might have to go to the ball so I'd bought this dress. A shirt dress, strapless, bright red, you know, quite short. A lovely dress. But when I put it on my Mom said, all concerned, you know, "Haven't you got anything else?" And after that of course I couldn't wear it. So I just wore... whatever. And anyway I think that they cancelled the dancing, when it got to be my turn...'
Does she see a time when she will want to break free of that family involvement in her life, doesn't she ever feel it stifling?
'No!' she says, firmly. 'I love it! When we all get together, us five girls, Mom and Dad, we have such a jolly time, as you say in London.'
And if they clash, all these formidable forces, who tends to get the last word?
'I guess we all do,' she says. 'Or at least,' and this sounds much more like it, 'we all have the last laugh.'
 
dustrabbit
dustrabbit 14 years ago


Their father is a JW? I thought he smoked and all that.
 Just curious, do you think they ever get "counselled" for those skimpy tennis outfits, esp. the ones with cleavage?
To do list:
1.Still waiting to goose the Organization.
 
Klaus Vollmer
Klaus Vollmer 14 years ago

yesterrday she had a match in Paris - against her litttle sister.
wow what sexy femmes, frozen nipples and lages until the venus hill.
Guess that is a witnessing for the hitch tower
 

5
10
20




Share this topic






Related Topics
AndersonsInfo
Trey Bundy: One Year of Reporting JW Child Abuse - Your comments please!
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
Greybeard
The KEY WORD in Isaiah 44:25-26 is "Predictions" and the apostles NEVER made any predictions setting dates.
by Greybeard 3 months ago
Tenacious
Has anyone noticed how in the October JW Broadcast, Losch encourages good works towards ALL people?
by Tenacious 5 months ago
AndersonsInfo
Brownstoner: How the Jehovah’s Witnesses Acquired Some of Brooklyn’s Most Insanely Valuable Properties
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
punkofnice
Questions for JW lurkers
by punkofnice 5 months ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/29768/sister-venus-williams





Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ The Real Whore of Babylon
/  





 

The Real Whore of Babylon
by Uncanny 15 years ago 21 Replies latest 15 years ago   jw friends
«
 1
 2
 »
 5
10
20
Uncanny
Uncanny 15 years ago


Today I noticed on Television via 'Entertainment Tonight' how that supposed, self-proclaiming Jehovah's Witness 'sister' and top rating professional tennis player, Venus Williams, is back in the news again.
This time she was shown cuddling up to her Italian bodyguard. She had quite a loving expression on her face, while he had a glint in his eyes which seemed to say he'd like to do more things with Venus' well toned body than just protect it from intruders or perceived danger.
Last year, I posted on H 20 how appalled I was on viewing Sr Venus running around courtside with an American flag after she won Wimbledon in England. Then there were those stationary TV close-ups while she stood reverently at attention as they played the U.S. national anthem.
My gripe in all this blatant display of double standards not so much concerns Ms. Williams' antics, but rather how they continue to be tolerated by her religion's Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses. Yet again, these out of touch old fogeys continue to prove how there is one law for their rich and famous members, and another for rank and file JayDubs. Or do the powers that be continue to look the other way as long as the Williams girls keep pumping some of their multi-million dollar earnings into the bulging coffers at Brooklyn?
The real tragedy here concerns those faithful JW youngsters who still toe the line - often under much sufferance - to this incredibly outdated form of a Christian religion. Just think of all the potential sport champions who never were, simply because they were denied even their basic rights for participation in so called competitive sports at school. Once again, I offer my sympathy for how let down, ripped off and disappointed many Witness kids must feel in seeing this latest example of a baptised Witness living a life which is in direct contradiction to what they have been taught.
And yet, I refuse to condemn Venus Williams for such playful actions which are considered highly normal out here in the real world. But what next, Venus? A drug bust? Or maybe you'll be seen dining with Prince William next year at Wimbledon. (I hope so.)
No, Venus Williams is not the new whore of Babylon.
It is this world's number one instrument of Christian hypocrisy - the Watchtower Society itself - which continues to commit fornication in the Holy Place.
Bring on Dateline, NBC. As soon as possible.
Uncanny
 
Prisca
Prisca 15 years ago


Good points, Uncanny.
Even though I am now an adult, I remember my disappointment in not being able to participate in any extra-curricular sports. I loved playing tennis and soccer, but I was not allowed to participate in anything that involved extra association with "wordly" people!
It will be interesting to see what the WTS does in relation to these girls. They seem pretty tolerant, although as we don't know any of the JW elders involved, we won't know the full story.
Even so, I congratulate these girls for their accomplishments. They would have forfeited many things to get to where they are, so good on 'em!
 
AGuest
AGuest 15 years ago


Dearest Uncanny... may you have peace!
May I ask, dear one, why the 'ire' at Ms. Williams? Has she personally done you some harm? Have you never been attracted to another? It would appear to me that if you have a problem with a 'double standard', then perhaps your chagrin should be at those who teach and OPERATE under a double standard... and not those who choose to live their lives regardless of what such 'teacher' of double standards has to say. Yes?
I cannot see in what you have observed, ANYTHING deserving of implying Ms. Williams to be a 'whore of Babylon', as you have stated. Do you know her heart or her devotion... to God OR to the WTBTS? Methinks you know what you read, and we ALL know that great care must be taken there, yes? I say this because of the implications of the TITLE of your post, in conjunction with its subject.
There are many young people who say positive things about the 'borg... publicly... for the love a parent, etc. But such ones are just as able to see the hypocrisy... and want to live a life FREE from it... as the next. It seems to ME that Ms. Williams is not as 'dedicated' to the 'borg as some would have her... but had NO problem declaring her love for God (Jehovah), as she knows Him.
There is no 'law' against love... and the only 'laws' I have EVER seen the Williams sisters 'break', are those set up by a false prophet anyway.
Prisca, dear one... I congratulate YOU... for your 'insight' and tolerance with regard to these girls. Again, we don't know EVERYTHING about everyone... yes?
I bid you both peace... and may JAH bless!
YOUR servant and a slave of Christ,
SJ
 
Moxy
Moxy 15 years ago


with all due respect aguest, it seems you didnt read uncanny's post beyond the subject line and a glance to note venus williams was the topic.
mox
 
nytelecom1
nytelecom1 15 years ago


with all due respect to everyone.......do you know the current standing of the sisters in the org?...are they in good standing?
to what extent are they involved in the org?
proclaiming you are a witness does not a dub mak
 
Utopian Reformist
Utopian Reformist 15 years ago


While I am elated at the media coverage of the WTBS, I am also annoyed at the reports of "so-called witnesses" like the Williams sisters.
Unless someone from the congregation that they or their family supposedly attended posts some clarification here, then all we have is another case that resembles the idiot in GA a few years ago who had studied, then stopped and was never baptized, but killed his family or committed suicide. I don't remember exactly, but the point is it accomplishes absolutely nothing!
 
AGuest
AGuest 15 years ago


Hello, dear Moxy... and may you have peace!
I actually did read it; I just read it from Uncanny's perspective... and from what may be other's. I just think the Williams sister's get a bad 'rap' from people who don't even know them due to their association(?) with the WTBTS. Yes, I know Uncanny has no problem with 'em, really, but his/her depiction of Venus and her bodyguard was, IMHO, unfair... and an 'opinion'. Anyone else may have seen it differently...)
I mean, the Wayans brothers were raised Witnesses and NO ONE says too much about them. What's up with that?
I bid you peace.
A slave of Christ,
SJ
 
Naeblis
Naeblis 15 years ago


"And yet, I refuse to condemn Venus Williams for such playful actions which are considered highly normal out here in the real world. But what next, Venus? A drug bust? Or maybe you'll be seen dining with Prince William next year at Wimbledon. (I hope so.)
No, Venus Williams is not the new whore of Babylon.
It is this world's number one instrument of Christian hypocrisy - the Watchtower Society itself - which continues to commit fornication in the Holy Place."
Did NOONE read this part????? Criminy.
 
Utopian Reformist
Utopian Reformist 15 years ago


Whether we discuss the Jacksons, the Wayans, and now the Williams Sisters, what we are really examining are not actual JW's. Irregardless of their baptized status or lack thereof, all are essentially convinced and reconciled in their consciences and have no qualms whatsoever about exercising personal freedom and pursuing their goals.
That exercise of freedom is precisely what invalidates these expose stories! If they had the gumption to exercise it, then they were never really hard core rank and file JW's to begin with, only casuals.
So they are NOT a reflection of the WTBS or its policies, rather they prove that many who are under the WTBS umbrella do not actually believe and pounce on the most promising opportunity. I do not find them or their choices objectionable. They are actually stronger than many double-life JW's currently in the borg.
 
JanH
JanH 15 years ago


UR,
Irregardless...
Tsk tsk tsk!
Sorry, could not resist
- Jan
--
Faith, n. Belief without evidence in what is told by one who speaks without knowledge, of things without parallel. [Ambrose Bierce, The Devil´s Dictionary, 1911]
 
logical
logical 15 years ago


Naeblis, I read it.
AGuest,

I just think the Williams sister's get a bad 'rap' from people who don't even know them due to their association(?) with the WTBTS. Yes, I know Uncanny has no problem with 'em, really, but his/her depiction of Venus and her bodyguard was, IMHO, unfair... and an 'opinion'. Anyone else may have seen it differently...)
I hear you. But, most heterosexual males (or homosexual females) in the bodyguard's position would be thinking those sort of things, I know I would. Ooops.
The main topic of the post was an attack on the WTS from how I read it.
Although its the so-called "annointed" who have committed spiritual idolatory and rode the wild beast (WTS) who comprise the Great Harlot... Babylon the Great (am I correct?)


 
Utopian Reformist
Utopian Reformist 15 years ago


JanH:
I don't understand your inflective disdain? Please explain. Keep in mind I am not trolling or defending the WTBS, I am just saying information about supposedly public JW figures is of very little value.
Michael Jackson had very little effect one way or the other for the average householder or rank and file JW.
 
humble
humble 15 years ago


but rather how they continue to be tolerated by her religion's Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses. Yet again, these out of touch old fogeys continue to prove how there is one law for their rich and famous members, and another for rank and file JayDubs.
This is a silly accusation. How can you keep spreading these rumors without knowing anything about it.
Venus Williams is not a baptized Witness. Only her mother is baptized. Her father is not and was never a Witness. Now if she is not a baptized Witness, what do you want the Watchtower to do about it? I guess you could call up the public affairs office and ask about it if you are so interested.

Or do the powers that be continue to look the other way as long as the Williams girls keep pumping some of their multi-million dollar earnings into the bulging coffers at Brooklyn?
This is unfounded gossip, my friend. There is no proof to make such a serious accusation against Jehovah's Witnesses.
 
Silverleaf
Silverleaf 15 years ago


In response to Uncanny, I think the reason that famous JWs tend to 'get away' with a different standard than the rank and file is because if they encountered some of the horrible situations described here, their accounts might appear in national or international media, and wouldn't that be bad for the organization?
Silverleaf
 
humble
humble 15 years ago


silverleaf: Again you are only spreading false rumors and gossip.
No famous JWs 'get away' with anything. If a person is not a baptized member then he/she cannot be disciplined by the congregation for leading an inmoral lifestyle. Many call themselves one of Jehovah's Witnesses, but could only be a son/daughter of a baptized member. Some were just raised as Witnesses and are inactive now.
 
logical
logical 15 years ago


Humble,
Absolute rubbish. You know exactly how two faced the WTS is. You are a perfect example. You are going against their laws and associating with apostates on the internet.
Personally, I dont care what you do. Hopefully in time you will realise the golden calf you worship isnt worth it, like so many on this board have found out.
If a famous BAPTISED witness was indeed being a bit naughty, then they WOULD get away with it, we all know exactly how precious their image is, they want to look good from the outside, they dont want their true nature exposed in the mass media, which would happen if they treated the famous JW like they treat the rest of the JW's.

 
humble
humble 15 years ago


logical: There is no need for you to call me two faced. If you don't want me posting here, that is o.k, but no need to insult. We can be mature adults.

If a famous BAPTISED witness was indeed being a bit naughty, then they WOULD get away with it, we all know exactly how precious their image is
Again, this is only gossip because it can't be proven. If this was true, they wouldn't have cleaned up the GB in the 80's, would they?
 
JanH
JanH 15 years ago


logical,
I hear you. But, most heterosexual males (or homosexual females) in the bodyguard's position would be thinking those sort of things, I know I would. Ooops.
About Venus Williams? Yuck! Not me. She's ugly. She doesn't know how to dress. And I'd hate to think what all those steroids have done to her body.
Oh well, personal preferences and all that. She's at least fit.
- Jan
--
Faith, n. Belief without evidence in what is told by one who speaks without knowledge, of things without parallel. [Ambrose Bierce, The Devil´s Dictionary, 1911]
 
JanH
JanH 15 years ago


UR
I don't understand your inflective disdain?
Calm down, man. I quoted the one word I commented on. I was just in a pedantic mood. I get there when I do computer programming all day. So there!
- Jan
--
Faith, n. Belief without evidence in what is told by one who speaks without knowledge, of things without parallel. [Ambrose Bierce, The Devil´s Dictionary, 1911]
 
Hojon
Hojon 15 years ago


If a person is not a baptized member then he/she cannot be disciplined by the congregation for leading an inmoral lifestyle.
Huh? I used to always here announcements in the Hall that So and so (and unbaptized person attending the meetings) was not good association and should be avoided. They are always doing that stuff when they find out an unbaptized member of the cong is committing some act the Society frowns on.
The fact that the Williams sisters are going around calling themselves witnesses leads me to believe they are active, if not baptized. The very fact they associate themselves with the Witnesses and the WTS doesn't do anything to distance themselves from them means that they are accepting them by default.
Think about this, if Marilyn Manson started going around calling himself a Witness how long do you think it would be before the WTS made some kind of public statement disassociating themselves from him? The Society likes the publicity from the Williams and therefore is willing to look the other way at times.
 

«
 1
 2
 »
 5
10
20




Share this topic






Related Topics
AndersonsInfo
Brownstoner: How the Jehovah’s Witnesses Acquired Some of Brooklyn’s Most Insanely Valuable Properties
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
AndersonsInfo
Trey Bundy: One Year of Reporting JW Child Abuse - Your comments please!
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
Saved_JW
Jehovah's Witnesses - People of Integrity
by Saved_JW 5 months ago
The Searcher
A First Stepping-Stone For Bethelites & Lurkers?
by The Searcher 5 months ago
Mephis
Australian Royal Commission Findings released
by Mephis 3 months ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/10160/real-whore-babylon





Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ The Real Whore of Babylon
/  





 

The Real Whore of Babylon
by Uncanny 15 years ago 21 Replies latest 15 years ago   jw friends
«
 1
 2
 »
5
10
20
logical
logical 15 years ago


Humble:

Personally, I dont care what you do.

 
Utopian Reformist
Utopian Reformist 15 years ago

10-4 JanH!
 

«
 1
 2
 »
5
10
20




Share this topic



Topic Summary
today i noticed on television via 'entertainment tonight' how that supposed, self-proclaiming jehovah's witness 'sister' and top rating professional tennis player, venus williams, is back in the news again.. this time she was shown cuddling up to her italian bodyguard.
she had quite a loving expression on her face, while he had a glint in his eyes which seemed to say he'd like to do more things with venus' well toned body than just protect it from intruders or perceived danger.. last year, i posted on h 20 how appalled i was on viewing sr venus running around courtside with an american flag after she won wimbledon in england.
then there were those stationary tv close-ups while she stood reverently at attention as they played the u.s. national anthem.. my gripe in all this blatant display of double standards not so much concerns ms. williams' antics, but rather how they continue to be tolerated by her religion's governing body of jehovah's witnesses.



Related Topics
AndersonsInfo
Brownstoner: How the Jehovah’s Witnesses Acquired Some of Brooklyn’s Most Insanely Valuable Properties
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
AndersonsInfo
Trey Bundy: One Year of Reporting JW Child Abuse - Your comments please!
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
Saved_JW
Jehovah's Witnesses - People of Integrity
by Saved_JW 5 months ago
The Searcher
A First Stepping-Stone For Bethelites & Lurkers?
by The Searcher 5 months ago
Mephis
Australian Royal Commission Findings released
by Mephis 3 months ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/10160/real-whore-babylon?page=2&size=20




Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ Williams girls pick and choose what they like about the watchtower
/  





 

Williams girls pick and choose what they like about the watchtower
by sspo 7 years ago 6 Replies latest 7 years ago   jw friends
5
10
20
sspo
sspo 7 years ago


The 'unworldly' Williams, Hewitt's competitiveness and cramping up
Story Highlights
Venus has this incredible global platform to influence thought and opinion
Realistically Lleyton Hewitt's days of winning Grand Slams are over
Tennis players shouldn't get a break any more than tired marathoners

Decrease fontDecrease fontEnlarge fontEnlarge fontwilliams.jpg The Williams sisters chose to duck questions about Barack Obama's inauguration. AP ADVERTISEMENT /01/2342009" /></a></noscript> </form></form>
 
OnTheWayOut
OnTheWayOut 7 years ago

Celebrity types don't know more about politics than others.
I appreciate her honesty about knowing ZERO, but she uses it
as a soapbox to proclaim her neutrality and still say that B.O. was
the "best" candidate.
Keep in mind that reporters were trying to corner the Williams sisters
on this. Keep in mind that they put their celebrity status and popularity
ahead of their JWism. They should have just said they are politically
neutral but are interested in what's happening in this country.
A gung-ho pioneer who happens to be a tennis star would have said,
"While it is good that many people have overcome racial inequality in
the United States, I put all my trust in Jehovah to correct the problems
that imperfect men cannot solve, regardless of who they are or where
they come from."
 
LDH
LDH 7 years ago

OTWO,

You took the words right out of my mouth.
 
jws
jws 7 years ago


Voting is ungodly but chasing Slams isn't? Your opinion?
To answer that first guy in the quote's comments.
I'd say neither fall into the realm of religion. Her profession is a tennis player. How would doing her job be "ungodly"? Unless you want to say competition is ungodly. Then every contractor who competes for a contract, or any worker competing for a job is ungodly. I could see if her profession was the world's oldest profession or mafia hit-woman. You might call that ungodly. But what's wrong with tennis?

As for Venus Williams' quotes, I agree with OnTheWayOut. If you do know "zero" about politics, you shouldn't be able to give an opinion on the "best" candidate.
 
IP_SEC
IP_SEC 7 years ago

good for them. you go girls.
 
smiddy
smiddy 7 years ago

When I was a witness my kids and others in the congregation were discouraged from playing sports or joining teams because it was competetive,a no no. Gal.5:26 was used to support this veiw.
smiddy
 
PEC
PEC 7 years ago

Am I the only one that has figured out; that, Barack Obama is the Antichrist?
Philip
 

5
10
20




Share this topic






Related Topics
AndersonsInfo
Brownstoner: How the Jehovah’s Witnesses Acquired Some of Brooklyn’s Most Insanely Valuable Properties
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
The Searcher
Missionary Deceptively/Mistakenly Misquotes Scripture.........
by The Searcher 6 months ago
The Searcher
A First Stepping-Stone For Bethelites & Lurkers?
by The Searcher 5 months ago
AndersonsInfo
Trey Bundy: One Year of Reporting JW Child Abuse - Your comments please!
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
Tenacious
Has anyone noticed how in the October JW Broadcast, Losch encourages good works towards ALL people?
by Tenacious 5 months ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/170772/williams-girls-pick-choose-what-they-like-about-watchtower





Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ Williams Sisters can't vote, but can be part of the U.N.!!!
/  





 

Williams Sisters can't vote, but can be part of the U.N.!!!
by ohiocowboy 8 years ago 18 Replies latest 8 years ago   watchtower beliefs
5
10
20
ohiocowboy
ohiocowboy 8 years ago

http://sports.yahoo.com/ten/news?slug=ap-wimbledonnotebook&prov=ap&type=lgns
Williams sisters can’t vote because of their religion
By JOHN PYE, AP Sports Writer 7 hours, 37 minutes ago

◦Buzz Up </form>

◦Print

WIMBLEDON, England (AP)—Serena Williams would vote for Barack Obama if she could. Don’t even ask Venus Williams what her political leanings are.
The Williams sisters, vocal on so many issues from fashion to gender equality and equal pay for women, say they’re not allowed to vote because of their religion. The sisters, who have 14 Grand Slam singles titles between them and are among the most recognizable athletes in sports, are Jehovah’s Witnesses.
After their first-round wins at Wimbledon, both were asked about the Nov. 4 presidential election.
“I feel that what I do in tennis isn’t really political,” Venus said after her 7-6 (5), 6-1 win over British wild card entry Naomi Cavaday on Tuesday. The work she does for UNESCO and other agencies was about helping people, she said, “I don’t see it as political. I don’t vote.”

Younger sister Serena said she was “excited to see Obama out there doing his thing.”
“I’m a Jehovah’s Witness, so I don’t get involved in politics. We stay neutral. We don’t vote,” she said. “So I’m not going to necessarily go out and vote for him. I would if it wasn’t for my religion.”
BYE, BYE BJORKMAN: Jonas Bjorkman’s 15th and last Wimbledon singles campaign was among his shortest. The 36-year-old Swede lost in the first-round Tuesday 4-6, 7-6 (4), 6-4, 7-6 (4) to Frenchman Arnaud Clement.
Bjorkman made the semifinals here two years ago at 34 before losing to eventual champion Roger Federer, equaling his best run at a major. He made the U.S. Open semis in 1997, the year he reached a career-high No. 4 in singles.
Bjorkman plans to play until the Stockholm Open in October. His more immediate plan is to add a 10th Grand Slam doubles title. He has three at Wimbledon among his nine.
His favorite moments involved the three Davis Cup titles he helped Sweden win.
“To win it three times, it’s something very special I think—it’s something we’re very proud of back home in Sweden,” he said.
BIZZ BUZZ BEES: There’s a buzz going around Wimbledon about the birds and the bees.
Two days after having to deal with a swarm of bees around the player locker rooms, Wimbledon organizers received a letter from an animal rights group condemning the treatment of pigeons at the All England Club.
People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals (PETA) said it had seen newspaper reports that army marksmen were being used to shoot pigeons around the club.
PETA sent a letter to Tim Phillips, chairman of the All England Lawn Tennis and Croquet Club, and members of the Metropolitan Police Wildlife Crime Unit to outline Wimbledon’s “apparently illegal action.”
“We believe that the club should be prosecuted for cruelty to animals,” said the letter, which was released to the media Tuesday.
PETA urged Phillips to call an immediate halt to the eradication plans if the reports were correct.
Under the Animal Welfare Act, a property owner can only use lethal control as a last resort if it can demonstrate, in a court of law, which non-lethal methods had been used and only if the target species presents a demonstrable risk to public health and safety.
All England Club spokesman Johnny Perkins confirmed contract pest controllers had used marksmen to shoot at pigeons on Sunday, and defended the club’s policy.
MAJOR MOMENT: Japanese player Ai Sugiyama set a record for most consecutive Grand Slam main draw appearances—by a woman or man—when she started her 57th with a 6-4, 6-2 win over Belgian Yanina Wickmayer.
“I’m very happy. When I heard the number of Grand Slams I played it’s actually really huge numbers,” said Sugiyama, who will turn 33 next week. “Even here I came 16 times—this is my 16th Wimbledon—it’s been great. I just don’t want to just be here but I want to perform well as well.”
Sugiyama said she has never had a serious injury, and travels with a trainer and has a massage everyday to prolong her career.
“I still need to play good. I need to feel that I can keep going, not only being in the first round to participate,” she said, giving no hint of retirement. “Tomorrow is the only day that I can think of. I never thought I could play this long. … I would like to play the next U.S Open for sure.”
Sugiyama played her first major at Wimbledon in 1993. Her unbroken stretch of majors started at Wimbledon in 1994, before she had graduated from high school. Her best results at Grand Slam events have been quarterfinals, in 2000 at Australia and in 2004 at Wimbledon.
 
momzcrazy
momzcrazy 8 years ago

BUT if they could vote they WOULD, for Obama. Doesn't sound very neutral to me. Sounds like trying to ride the fence.
 
justhuman
justhuman 8 years ago

Yeah, she can't vote for Obama but she can enjoy all the millions of dollars she earned by participating in Tennis Tournaments, advertize promotions, and God knows what else they do to get money being Tennis superstars. And this star system that they are involved in, and they have became f*ck*ng rich because the use it so well, it was actually created by "wordly"people, or even worsed, it was created by the Commercial part of "Satan's system".
 
ohiocowboy
ohiocowboy 8 years ago

Yes, and Venus does work for UNESCO, the United Nations Educational Scientific and Cultural Org. How come She doesn't get in trouble for being part of the U.N.? Could it be the big donations the sisters make to the Borg??? That would be a good thing to bring up to those questioning the "Truth".
 
snowbird
snowbird 8 years ago

The both them are a hot mess!
Sylvia
 
ohiocowboy
ohiocowboy 8 years ago

I just Googled Venus Williams UNESCO, and what came up is she is the GLOBAL AMBASSADOR for UNESCO!
I wonder what the WT would say if someone were to call and ask why a JW in supposed good standing can be a Global Ambassador for the UN???
 
booby
booby 8 years ago

I am NOT advocating for the society, faithful slave, governing body, et al, however to be realistic or "fair" this is a case of two girls making their way through a wall of reporters saying what they can to be as politically correct as they can. It is they that are using the "we are Jehovah's Witnesses" when it is beneficial for them. It is not like the witnesses coming out with a statement like "the williams sisters are "'sister sisters'" and we advocate that you young ones in the organization should emulate their example. Just my two bits worth.
 
civicsi00
civicsi00 8 years ago

I don't agree with this. They get to be mega-star tennis players, but if any local microphone boy decides to pursue "higher learning" at a university, he is looked down upon...
WTF?
 
jamiebowers
jamiebowers 8 years ago

Just like the WB&TS.
 
Rabbit
Rabbit 8 years ago

Ohio, good find !
Even tho' these young women seem to live their lives far differently, in a good way, than other 'high profile' JW's like Prince & Michael Jackson -- they all have something in common...BIG $$$ and the WT hasn't tossed them out.
Makes ya' think, doesn't it ?
WT has to get BIG $$$ from somebody to pay off their multi-million dollar pedophile lawsuits.
 
blondie
blondie 8 years ago

Actually, the official WTS position on voting is that the individual jw makes a personal choice not to vote just like choosing not to have a blood transfusion and not to enter the military. The WTS does not want to get into trouble with governments by "telling" their members they can't do these things. I remember during the draft era that the elders were cautioned not to tell young jws not to enter the military.



*** w99 11/1 p. 29 Questions From Readers ***There may be people who are stumbled when they observe that during an election in their country, some Witnesses of Jehovah go to the polling booth and others do not. They may say, ‘Jehovah’s Witnesses are not consistent.’ People should recognize, though, that in matters of individual conscience such as this, each Christian has to make his own decision before Jehovah God.—Romans 14:12.
Whatever personal decisions Jehovah’s Witnesses make in the face of different situations, they take care to preserve their Christian neutrality and freeness of speech.

 
Alexia
Alexia 8 years ago

I have known of people proudly proclaim that they are JW, yet they haven’t stepped foot into a KH since the Regan Administration. It’s not like the WTBTS is going to DF them if they are not even seen near a KH.
 
AK - Jeff
AK - Jeff 8 years ago

they are as close as it gets to 'Jw in name only'. I saw them wrap themselves in the American flag in Sydney several years ago after victory in the Olympics. I knew then they were just wearing the badge.
Jeff
 
ohiocowboy
ohiocowboy 8 years ago

Funny how celebrities, or those with megabucks can get away with anything they want.
They are some of the most hypocritical people on earth.
 
Celia
Celia 8 years ago

Have you seen this ? Anyone wants to leave a comment on that site ? (bottom of article)
http://msn.foxsports.com/tennis/story/8284622?MSNHPHCP>1=39002
the link doesn't seem to be working....

pearblossom
6/27/2008
4:01 AM (report inappropriate content)
Please do not judge Jehovah's Witnesses by these two yoiung women. Theyare a far cry from our fine young people who truly live up to God'a standards as set out in the Bible. And as suggested,If you want to know what we truly believe ask us when we knock on your door.
 
 Changamwe
6/27/2008
3:58 AM (report inappropriate content)
It's a Free Country isn't? Being a Jehova's witness is her reason why she will not VOTE. She was asked a question, what did you want her to answer, if what she say's is not good enough for you????????????..You have no religion that's cool..so do a lot of people around the country.
 
 LEADPIPECINCH
6/27/2008
3:45 AM (report inappropriate content)
I'm a Jehova's witness and we don't get involved in politics?????????????????
?
WHY THE H-E-L-L EVEN BRING IT INTO THE CONVERSATION?????????
Bestdes, it's TENNIS..........WHO CARES????????
 
 LEADPIPECINCH
6/27/2008
3:41 AM (report inappropriate content)
She's not gonna vote because she doesn't know how to make an X....
Must be nice for her to be able to pick when she's gonna get religion....What a big joke,,,
 
 rubyreba
6/27/2008
3:40 AM (report inappropriate content)
I am done with organized religion. It took me 48 years to reach this conclusion but I am so relieved to have finally understood that very little good comes of it. Join the YMCA, the PTA, any other group of humans that does good works but more evil has been done in the name of organized religion than any single human being could of his own volition. How sad! How incredibly sad.
 
 sharpgirl82
6/27/2008
3:31 AM (report inappropriate content)
Any Jehovah's Witness who reads this article and knows how the girls have portrayed themselves in the media, etc., would be appalled at the fact that we now have to explain why certain people pick and choose when their beliefs kick in. Please don't consider the Williams' sisters representative of all Witnesses. And if you have questions about why we do or do not do certain things, talk to one of us personally when we knock on your door.
 
 boredsilly
6/27/2008
2:36 AM (report inappropriate content)
PeterGuns.. I think you should read your own posting; they are like the rest of this planet...self serving jerks that place their values, opinions and self importance far above where it actually lies...In the gutter!
 
 PeterGuns
6/27/2008
2:16 AM (report inappropriate content)
Who cares what tennis stars, football stars, baseball players,hollywood stars, or religous freaks think. they are like the rest of this planet...self serving jerks that place their values, opinions and self importance far above where it actually lies...In the gutter! Using religion to justify anything is just like religion itself, useless, worthless, and a waste of time. Enjoy your sunday service this week and remember your wallet because without it your curch does not want you! Think about them apples.
 
 tkeoa529
6/27/2008
2:13 AM (report inappropriate content)
one final item before i turn in, how many times have you gotten suckered into a candidate by the phrase "no new taxes" and when is the last time our taxes were lessened? look at our gas prices! it's not a tax in the true name of taxes, but it is a tax, maybe not on individual citizens, but a tax on us as a country. jehovah's witness, mormon, baptist, catholic, jewish, muslim, lutheran, or methodist, you and the williams sisters need not bother with voting, it's choosing the lesser of two evils. politicians don't care about us or our needs. they're rich, they have no need for us except to give them more power
 
 tkeoa529
6/27/2008
2:01 AM (report inappropriate content)
since we read ths article. besides, my reason for not voting is better than hers. all politicians are liars and ####'s. they'll tell you what you want to hear to get your vote, but they have their own personal agendas, and that's what they care about.
 
 ryan517
6/27/2008
1:56 AM (report inappropriate content)
She's a JW?
Really?
Since when?
 
 tkeoa529
6/27/2008
1:46 AM (report inappropriate content)
not to talk smack about jw's, but do you think you'll ever see the williams sisters going door-to-door? one of the main focuses of the jw's is spreading the word.
 
 mclemm
6/27/2008
1:27 AM (report inappropriate content)
They made their votes already, it is for God's Kingdom with Jesus reigning as King
 
 Novboy
6/27/2008
1:22 AM (report inappropriate content)
Serena doesn't vote because she's a JW, but she was seen in a club cheesn' with Zab Judah that same night Zab and his wife got into an argument.
 
 ryno657
6/27/2008
12:52 AM (report inappropriate content)
Most people are only religious when it suits them. I am not bashing JW's or Mormons or any specific religion. The people who talk about it the most are usually the ones who use it to their advantage and only when its convenient.
 
 SoulRebelJC
6/27/2008
12:41 AM (report inappropriate content)
Religion. What a stupid thing it is.
 
 SIERRAFJZ
6/27/2008
12:39 AM (report inappropriate content)
Her religion does not prohibit her from voting. Every Jahovah's Witness makes decisions based on what they have learned from deeply studying the Bible.
 
 BradLWoods
6/27/2008
12:28 AM (report inappropriate content)
I guess Serena is a Jehovah's Witness whenever it suits her. She's certainly done a lot of things most Jehovah's Witnesses don't.
 
 ehsraptors
6/27/2008
12:13 AM (report inappropriate content)
Yeah, no ones cares who they vote for but Michelle Obama is not hot hahaha crazy ppl
 
 L8Nite
6/26/2008
7:35 PM (report inappropriate content)
Like he cares what they think anyway. Michelle Obama is extremely hot.
 
 
ohiocowboy
ohiocowboy 8 years ago

Thanks for the link Celia. I can't wait til the page comes back online, so I can make a comment or two...
 
undercover
undercover 8 years ago

I saw in this morning's paper (6-27-08) that the Williams sisters would be representing the USA in the Olympics...

...but yet they don't get involved in politics...

The Olympics are supposed to transcend politics but the reality is that it's as political as any event on earth. Maybe not for the participants themselves but for the respective governments and most of the people watching, national pride takes 1st place over the sport or athlete. And now Sister Williams is going to go on this flag waving propaganda trip...
 
joebin
joebin 8 years ago

Maybe the WT is a sponsor. Every mention of JW and they cash in..kinda like a pay per click.
 
Sasha
Sasha 8 years ago

I thought you could not be a "celebrity" of sorts if you were in the JW's????
She should have kept her mouth shut....makes them look worse.
I remember Donna Summer was a witness at some point, now I just read an article saying she is a "born again Christian"
and what about Michael Jackson.?... ha ha ha
 

5
10
20




Share this topic






Related Topics
Wonderment
John-1-1-Colossians-1-16-all-other-things - Part 2
by Wonderment 3 months ago
Cold Steel
Jehovah or Jesus: Who Is To Come?
by Cold Steel a month ago
Freeandclear
My experience with the people in my hall
by Freeandclear a month ago
dubstepped
Life After Disassociation (or really leaving by any means)
by dubstepped 11 days ago
snare&racket
Ten years out.....
by snare&racket 10 days ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/161034/williams-sisters-cant-vote-but-can-part-u-n






Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ Venus and Serena Williams Get Their Own Reality Show
/  





 

Venus and Serena Williams Get Their Own Reality Show
by Dogpatch 11 years ago 25 Replies latest 9 years ago   jw friends
«
 1
 2
 »
 5
10
20
Dogpatch
Dogpatch 11 years ago


Venus and Serena Williams Get Their Own Reality Show
Tennis sisters Venus and Serena Williams have signed up for a summer reality TV show on ABC Family. In a press release, Serena said "the series will provide our fans with an up-close, inside look at our lives away from the tennis courts. " Hmmm. The lives of these sexy sibs must be pretty tame if their show will be airing on ABC Family!

http://realitytv.about.com/b/a/157387.htm
Can you imagine we can all go to a virtual kingdom hall meeting by watching tv?
Randy
Net Soup!
http://www.freeminds.org
 
Markfromcali
Markfromcali 11 years ago

Good times...
 
blondie
blondie 11 years ago

It will be interesting to see if they mention their "spiriitual" life with any directness.
 
luna2
luna2 11 years ago

I was just wondering that, blondie. Could make for some rather surreal shows....attending celebrity parties, going on photoshoots, and hitting movie premiers one day and out in service the next. Hey, if they talk about dub stuff on the show, can they count that as service?
 
Sunnygal41
Sunnygal41 11 years ago

Are they still even "active" in the organization? I would find that very hard to believe.
 
rebel8
rebel8 11 years ago


I would have watched it if it weren't for that immodest picture you posted. One of them is showing an inch of cleavage. I now consider them bad association. If I watched the show, I could be stumbled.
I'm getting a bit ansy waiting 'til it's time to go to the pagan fireworks. tick, tock
 
DannyHaszard
DannyHaszard 11 years ago






Sisters Venus, right, and Serena Williams of the United States celebrate with American flags after they won gold during the Olympic women's doubles tennis Thursday, September 28, 2000, in Sydney's Olympic Park.

I got the shit beaten outta me in school from 1963 on esp second grade when president John Kennedy was slain and the usa was whipped into nationalistic fervor.
I repeat... no gold medal from jehover just the shit beaten outta me in the playground no less, and i was forbidden to seek athletic achievement.
F**k you watchtower.
------- Danny Haszard Bangor Maine now seeking my apostate gold medal
 
Netty
Netty 11 years ago


Wow Danny, a picture truly is worth a thousand words. They couldn't possibly be considered very spiritual in their congregation, no matter how much they profess to outsiders, that they are.
I remember the panic attacks I suffered as a kid, when it came time to pledge the flag, and we were supposed to remain seated, and not participate. And here they are waving the flag around, celebrating.
 
luna2
luna2 11 years ago


No kidding, Netty! Not that I had to suffer with the not saying the pledge and junk growning up as I wasn't a dub then. But I used to be worried sick when I'd send my kids to school knowing that they were going to have to "take a stand for Jehover". Makes me cringe now. Ugh.
Wonder if the Williams girls have received any counsel on this or if everybody is too busy kissing their toned tushies cuz they are celebrities.
I can just imagine the orgasms some dubs had over Venus thanking Jah after winning Wimbeldon. Like that makes up for wearing provocative clothing (which even the tennis world frowns on) and horsing around with flags like the non-dub tennis players.
 
Netty
Netty 11 years ago


can just imagine the orgasms some dubs had over Venus thanking Jah after winning Wimbeldon.
I think you're on to something here. How many regular JW's would be df'd or reproved, if they did some of the stuff the Williams sisters do? Guess an exception can be made in this case, due to all the free advertisement they provide for the WTS.
 
Carol
Carol 11 years ago


Danny,
I feel your pain. I don't know where you grew up, but in the late 50's early 60's, we were allowed to stand at attention, however my younger brother and I both were hit in the back of the head (by the teacher) with whatever book she had in her hand...and then she'd say something on the line of "oh, I forgot, you don't respect the flag that many people died to defend......"
Netty, Luna2 and everyone else,
Having had a brother in Bethel (yes the same one mentioned above), be assured.......as long as the Williams family can contribute generously (through their Mother most likely), nothing will be said to the girls. Michael Jackson finally sent a letter of withdrawal to the GB they only gave talks from the platform saying his actions at the time were in poor taste, they never df'd him and Prince (yeh kids I know, he changed his name to a sign, but he's going by Prince again) is allowed to record and hang with hollywood, as long as he contributes generously. The GB will take their gold any way they can get it. It has been that way for many, many, many years!
There was a brother in South Jersey a number of years ago that was df'd for gambling......then he won several Million dollars.......his JW family members had no problem with him paying off their debts and the congo had no problem reinstating him, amazingly just before they build a new KH???
My brother served at Bethel and knew Brother Knorr and the Franz's quite well...he went to NYC a true believer in the "truth" and came home tired and disillusioned, our Mother's best friend was married to one of the GB, so we had firsthand knowledge of the attitudes.....and saw how those with assets to be contributed to the WTBTS were cultivated and allowed latitude in their practicing of the "truth"
 
Frog
Frog 11 years ago

double standards all over the shop
 
loosie
loosie 11 years ago


ok the reality show would be really funny if the cameras followed them to the kingdom hall, then as one of them raised their hand to answer a question the camera would zoom in on her clevage. ( you know from the mike handlers point of view)....lmao
It would even better if the WT study was about how wonderfully we are made.
 
I quit!
I quit! 11 years ago

What would make for a really good show would be one where they were confronted by some former JWs who asked them some really tough questions about the Watchtower. Like did they know the wt originally taught Christ came in 1874, end of the world in 1914, Rutherford was pro Nazi. Wouldn't it be great if they found out the wt was full of crap and became out spoken against it?
 
gumby
gumby 11 years ago


I remember the flag being in whatever facility we used for assemblies and it feeling weird. Here these two dance with it as if to say......hooray for the good ol' USA.
What gets me is these two little hypocrits know damn well that patriotism isn't tolerated within the organisation. They KNOW of the millions of witness kids who cannot salute it and who must sit during the star bangled banner......yet they flash the flag around as if to say....."we can do it, but other witnesses can't". Little bitches. If I was still an elder and was in their congregation, I'd announce that both of them had disassociated themselves and humble their spoiled hypocritical arses.
Gumby
 
DannyHaszard
DannyHaszard 11 years ago

Is the Watchtower condoning anything goes to seek out star power like Scientology? Stars unleash their passion
USA Today - 6 hours ago
... Says actor Terrence Howard (Ray, Hustle & Flow), a Jehovah's Witness: "Anything that's dealing with the heart and the spirit is something that should be spoken ... "Says actor Terrence Howard (Ray, Hustle & Flow), a Jehovah's Witness: "Anything that's dealing with the heart and the spirit is something that should be spoken about, because it lifts and encourages people." http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=+Terrence+Howard+Ray%2C+Hustle+%26+Flow&btnG=Google+Search Check out his keywords Rated R flick,as a popular CO used to say; "rated R for ROTTEN"
 
sf
sf 11 years ago



with American flags
Well, according to the WTBTS and our new friend Rambaldi, it's just a piece of cloth. It means nothing.
I'm sure these girls feel the same way.
LOOK CLOSELY EVERYONE. Don't you see what I see on their faces??
LOLOLOL That's right. They are adorned with one of many masks that jws have handy at any given moment when they encounter the wicked world and it's people, that they can't wait for jehovah to destroy at armageddon. They sure wear them well.
sKally

 
rebel8
rebel8 11 years ago

Does anyone know for sure the sisters weren't DFd or reproofed for this stuff? Isn't the WTS silent about celebrities. I mean, even when MJ did Thriller, they never came out and confirmed he was a JW nor did they say what discipline did or did not occur.
 
Carol
Carol 11 years ago

My mother through her 40+ years of social climbing and connections at Bether.....hasn't mentioned anything about the Williams sister being df'd or reproved. When MJ did thriller, it was mentioned from the platform that his conduct was questionable.....dear mom had word from "headquarters" that MJ had eventually withdrawn from the "truth" or is that disassociated himself? Whatever, I'll bet the GB cried of the loss of all that $$$$$
 
Faith
Faith 11 years ago


I had one teacher in Elementary School who refused to allow me to be in the classroom if I refused to salute the flag. She escorted me out every stinking morning to the steps where I waited until she allowed me to come in. She often forgot about me, or maybe she just wanted to punish mr more. An entire school year starting my day as a shunned freak. Being a shunned freak was better than being tortured and dieing at Armageddon at 15 in 1975.
Maybe we shouldn't be too hard on the sisters. If they were raised in it by two faced parents, they may be clueless.
 

«
 1
 2
 »
 5
10
20




Share this topic






Related Topics
Leela1
Closer/death/Funerals
by Leela1 3 days ago
What Now?
Our Letter to Our Family
by What Now? 2 months ago
Pattytheperfect1
First post after a year or two of lurking on this site-Sorry for the length!
by Pattytheperfect1 2 years ago
KiddingMe
Police: Teen killed in N.Y. church assault wanted out
by KiddingMe 5 months ago
Esse quam videri
Questions for Serena Williams
by Esse quam videri 2 months ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/93759/venus-serena-williams-get-their-own-reality-show






Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ Venus and Serena Williams Get Their Own Reality Show
/  





 

Venus and Serena Williams Get Their Own Reality Show
by Dogpatch 11 years ago 25 Replies latest 9 years ago   jw friends
«
 1
 2
 »
5
10
20
rebel8
rebel8 11 years ago


Danny Haszard Bangor Maine now seeking my apostate gold medal
If anyone deserves a medal, you do!
<rebel8 places shiny gold medal around Danny's neck while playing the apostate anthem and saluting the apostate flag--cameras flash all around--Danny is offered lucrative contracts from Nike and Kellogg's--Danny is on the Today Show and interviewed by Vanity Fair--WTS gets tons of bad press and closes headquarters>
<end of rebel8's wishful thinking>
 
Faith
Faith 11 years ago


Rebel for one moment that fantasy gave me hope. IT COULD HAPPEN! Like I said before;
YOU DA MAN DANNY!
Keep going strong we got your back,
Love,
Faith
 
willyloman
willyloman 11 years ago


saw how those with assets to be contributed to the WTBTS were cultivated and allowed latitude
This kind of double standard is rampant in the witness organization... as it is in any organization on the planet. Money talks.
As for MJ, how do we know his mother doesn't continue to write big, big checks to the WTS to this day? Despite Michael's well publicized "money problems," there's plenty of cash in that family. Don't forget, the father was the manager of the Jackson kids' careers. What's 10 to 20% of hundreds of millions?
 
Sunnygal41
Sunnygal41 11 years ago

How times have changed, indeed! I gave up track, even tho I was the fastest girl on our team, because I was told that a career in sports was less important than seeking God's kingdom and I couldn't do both. Then, I was assigned a talk, my first, on the theocratic ministry school about a brother who gave up his career and aspirations for the Olympics to serve Jehovah.
 
DannyHaszard
DannyHaszard 9 years ago

This is a goodie
 Hitting the beach, Serena warms up ahead of Wimbledonadd comment Daily Mail, UK - 34 minutes ago
 She is known to draw strength from her fans' support and her faith as a Jehovah's Witness. "I can't thank those of Y'all who were with me through Thick
 
mouthy
mouthy 9 years ago

One of them is showing an inch of cleavage. I now consider them bad association.
When you know my grand-daughter was counselled because she showed her cleavege in her graduation gown.She left over the problems of how she was told. They just had a talk on" going to the one you have a problem with," then they took her Mother into the library & told her to correct her daughter...
Oh but she wasnt a "STAR"
 

«
 1
 2
 »
5
10
20




Share this topic



Topic Summary
venus and serena williams get their own reality show .
in a press release, serena said "the series will provide our fans with an up-close, inside look at our lives away from the tennis courts.
" hmmm.



Related Topics
Leela1
Closer/death/Funerals
by Leela1 3 days ago
What Now?
Our Letter to Our Family
by What Now? 2 months ago
Pattytheperfect1
First post after a year or two of lurking on this site-Sorry for the length!
by Pattytheperfect1 2 years ago
KiddingMe
Police: Teen killed in N.Y. church assault wanted out
by KiddingMe 5 months ago
Esse quam videri
Questions for Serena Williams
by Esse quam videri 2 months ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/93759/venus-serena-williams-get-their-own-reality-show?page=2&size=20




Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ Jehovah blesses Serena-Craps on Venus
/  





 

Jehovah blesses Serena-Craps on Venus
by messenger 14 years ago 8 Replies latest 14 years ago   jw friends
5
10
20
messenger
messenger 14 years ago


http://news.scotsman.com/latest.cfm?id=4914699
Serena Seizes Crown and Thanks God
By Tom Whitehead, PA News
Wimbledon champion Serena Williams tonight said she was blessed by God after seizing tenniss most prestigious crown.
The 20-year-old outclassed her 22-year-old sister, Venus, to take the title in a power-hitting final on Centre Court earlier today.
It was the first Wimbledon final between sisters since the first ever womens clash in 1884 when Briton Maud Watson beat her sibling Lilian two sets to one.
And next door on Court One, Argentinian David Nalbandian smashed the record books to reach tomorrows mens final against world number one Lleyton Hewitt.
In a glory run that has stunned the tennis world, the 20-year-old South American outsider has reached the final on his debut senior visit to Wimbledon.
He is the first to complete such a feat and is also the first Argentinian in a Wimbledon final.
When the number 28 seed steps on to Centre Court tomorrow it will be his first time on the hallowed turf.
He should have played there in yesterdays semi-final but had to switch to Court One because rain delays had caused a backlog of matches.
But today was Serenas day as the new womens world number one showed why she is top, beating her sister 7-6, 6-3.
Serena said after the match: Im a Jehovahs Witness. Obviously we believe in God and the Bible.
Without Him, I wouldnt be here right now. I really thank Him for everything. Ive been blessed really.
Serena admitted Wimbledon was the title she wanted more than anything and thanked her parents, Oracene and Richard, for their support.
She said: My dad always said that one day we would play in the finals at Wimbledon and here we are 10, 15 years later. Its really amazing if you think about it.
My dad, and my mom, its hard to get one champion, but now he has two.
Todays match was the ninth time the sisters have met in a top tournament with Venus just ahead of her younger competitor five wins to four.
Serenas victory ended Venuss hope of becoming the first black woman to win a hat-trick of Wimbledon titles.
American flags were few and far between and most onlookers would have struggled to know the nationality of either player if they relied on the crowd.
The scenes were a far cry from many of the previous matches witnessed over the Wimbledon fortnight, especially during Tim Henmans clashes and his ever present Henmania crowd.
Asked if she was disappointed at losing, Venus said: Well obviously, a Grand Slam this is where it is at and especially at Wimbledon, this is where it all started.
At least, I know, that sometimes I can look at the trophy.
Venus also revealed she gave her sister advice on how to curtsey to royalty during the trophy presentation, which was carried out by the Duke of Kent and his sister Princess Alexandra.
All eyes in SW19 will now focus on tomorrows mens final between Nalbandian and Hewitt, the man who dramatically ended Henmans dreams of Wimbledon glory in the semi-finals.
And the two players could not be further apart in their careers with Nalbandian earning less than 400,000 so far while Hewitt has amassed millions and already won the US Open.
The Argentinian earned his spot after beating Belgiums Xavier Malisse in a five set thriller, 7-6, 6-4, 1-6, 2-6, 6-2.
Nalbandian said: I think this is the best week of my life. This is very great for me. For me, this is a dream.
Asked if he was worried about his first Centre Court appearance, the Argentinian said: No, I never played on Court One, so its the same.
Last year Croat Goran Ivanisevic stunned the tennis world when he won the Wimbledon title after entering the tournament as a wildcard.
 
LB
LB 14 years ago


So will Serena count her time today??
I do recall now negative the brothers were when my son was competing in sports.
I wonder if the Williams sisters are baptised even?
 
professor
professor 14 years ago

Let's hope this doesn't turn into another Genesis chapter 4!
 
DakotaRed
DakotaRed 14 years ago


I wonder if Serena will be facing counsel or a Judicial Hearing?

*** w99 6/15 13 Should You Broaden Your Viewpoint? *** Some years ago young brothers from several congregations got together to engage in sports. Unfortunately, a spirit of competition developed among them, resulting in harsh verbal encounters. How did the local elders handle the problem? Recognizing the need for young ones to have recreation, they did not recommend that they stop altogether. (Ephesians 5:17; 1 Timothy 4:8) Rather, they gave firm yet reasonable warnings about what the spirit of competition could lead to. They also offered helpful suggestions, such as having older, responsible ones present. The youths appreciated the wisdom and balance of the counsel and responded well. Moreover, their respect and affection for the elders grew.

*** w99 8/1 11-12 "Gird Yourselves With Lowliness of Mind" *** Rivalry among nations is mirrored by rivalry among individuals. In competitive sports, for example, many athletes desire to be number one regardless of how this hurts others emotionally or even physically. This self-centered spirit is promoted in children and continues in many areas of adult life. It results in enmities, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, contentions, divisions.Galatians 5:19-21.
*** w96 2/1 25 Trust in Jehovah and His Word *** Satan has craftily promoted this spirit in school textbooks, in much of the available music, in sports, and in other forms of entertainment. Parents need to be alert to offset such influences by helping their children grow up trusting in Jehovah and his Word.

*** w96 2/1 25-6 Trust in Jehovah and His Word *** While not all desires incidental to youth are bad in themselves, youths should flee from them in that they should not let these things be a preoccupation, leaving little, if any, time for godly pursuits. Bodybuilding, sports, music, entertainment, hobbies, and travel, while not necessarily wrong, can be a snare if they become the big things in life.

*** w96 6/15 18 Blessings or Maledictions-Examples for Us Today *** Antitypical EgyptSatans worldvirtually worships entertainment. (1 John 5:19; Revelation 11:8) It idolizes actors, singers, and sports stars, as well as their dancing, their music, their concepts of fun and good times. Many have been tempted to drench themselves in entertainment while still claiming to worship Jehovah. When a Christian must be reproved for wrongdoing, his weakened spiritual state can often be traced back to drinking alcoholic beverages, dancing, and the having of a good time in some way that may border on idolatry.

*** w94 11/1 9 Jehovah-Our Tenderly Compassionate Father *** A number of role models in entertainment and sports are machos who do not shed tears or show tender affection.

*** w94 11/1 20 Be Tenderly Compassionate *** Another obstacle to our being compassionate can result from unnecessarily exposing ourselves to violence. Sports and entertainment that feature violence promote bloodlust
*** w93 2/15 12 "Let Marriage Be Honorable Among All" *** : The world has virtually abandoned any serious attempt to live by a moral code. Chaste conduct has come to be viewed as old-fashioned. Prominent political, sports, and entertainment personalities openly violate the Bibles standards of moral conduct, and such people continue to be lionized.

*** w93 3/1 10 Be Transformed in Mind and Enlightened in Heart *** People speak of success and achievement in science, art, music, sports, politics, and so on. They revel in their fleeting moments of glory. Nonetheless, the annals of history and the record books of today are full of forgotten heroes. All of this is nothing but emptiness, idleness, vanity, foolishness, purposelessness, and frustration.
Lew W
 
AjaxMan
AjaxMan 14 years ago


LB:

I do recall now negative the brothers were when my son was competing in sports.
Dakota:

I wonder if Serena will be facing counsel or a Judicial Hearing?
Good points and observations from both of you. However, given the total prize money that both Williams sister earned (Singles Winner, Runner up and Doubles Winner), the elders and the GB will look the other way. To that organization, Money is the bottom line: if you're a big cash cow, they don't care what you do as long as you bring in the $CH-CHING$.
Regards,
Ajax
 
moman
moman 14 years ago

We use to to the dubhall with them. Their meeting parts were a gas!
 
jack2
jack2 14 years ago

Yeah, the Williams sisters. Every jw kid who ever gave up a good opportunity to engage in sports should remember these gals. And the kids who have a chance now should remember them too, and so should their parents. They should mention them to the elders when they are given 'counsel' about engaging in organized atheltics.
 
teejay
teejay 14 years ago


And the kids who have a chance now should remember them too, and so should their parents. They should mention them to the elders when they are given 'counsel' about engaging in organized atheltics.
Well said, Jack2. Very nice idea!!
 
Satanus
Satanus 14 years ago


The GB is certifiably nuts, split personalitied, big time hypocrits, turncoats, coffins full of rotten bones.... *gasp* *breathe* Sorry, i lived by their counsel in the 60's and seventies. Now they allow this!!!??? Fucking hypocrits!
SS consternated
 

5
10
20




Share this topic






Related Topics
AndersonsInfo
Brownstoner: How the Jehovah’s Witnesses Acquired Some of Brooklyn’s Most Insanely Valuable Properties
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
The Searcher
Missionary Deceptively/Mistakenly Misquotes Scripture.........
by The Searcher 6 months ago
The Searcher
A First Stepping-Stone For Bethelites & Lurkers?
by The Searcher 5 months ago
AndersonsInfo
Trey Bundy: One Year of Reporting JW Child Abuse - Your comments please!
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
The Hermit
The Hermit's story PART 1
by The Hermit 2 months ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/31656/jehovah-blesses-serena-craps-on-venus





Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ Jehovahs Witness Williams sisters revel in Obama win
/  





 

Jehovahs Witness Williams sisters revel in Obama win
by What-A-Coincidence 7 years ago 13 Replies latest 7 years ago   social entertainment
5
10
20
What-A-Coincidence
What-A-Coincidence 7 years ago

http://www.stuff.co.nz/4753181a10393.html
The impact of Barack Obama's historic election win has extended to the tennis court, at the WTA's year-end Sony Ericsson Championships in the politically sensitive Middle East.

As Jehovah's Witnesses, the Williams sisters do not vote - but that does not mean they do not care.
Nine-time grand slam champion Serena Williams said she walked out for Wednesday's round-robin match against Dinara Safina with her shoulders back and her chest puffed out with pride after the momentous events in her home country. Struggling to sleep on Wednesday night in her Doha hotel, she had watched the results unfold and was "choked up" watching Obama's victory confirmed.
"It's just a great time to be black right now in the United States," she said. "Everyone's proud."
Her sister Venus, the winner of five Wimbledon and two US Open titles, had earlier spoken eloquently of her love for a country that nevertheless "since its beginning was supposed to be a place where people were escaping intolerance, [but] became a country that was really intolerant of different minorities and skin colours.
"So it's interesting, because … my dad grew up in Louisiana, a place where he was called 'Boy' and shown no respect. Where he couldn't say anything. I'm very close to what things were like in the past … So I think it's amazing that America has the opportunity to have someone who is a minority or mixed race, or whatever you want to call it. Hopefully, it will just give more people opportunities and more people will work hard and say, 'Yeah, I can be my best, too, no matter what my background is'."
Serena, too, spoke of her excitement and her thoughts for her father, back home in Florida. "It's just everything that I think African Americans have been through, I mean even 40 years ago, even 30 years ago, and even today still," she said.
Serena said she was almost speechless to think of the Obama family in the White House. "I got choked up. I was just thinking about everything - Martin Luther King and Malcolm X and all the pioneers … Althea Gibson, why I'm playing tennis today. All of these people. Arthur Ashe, who led the way for us … it's amazing."

• • Tennis star Serena Williams, to the New York Times: ''I don't really get involved in political affairs because of the way I was brought up and being a Jehovah's Witness, but it's exciting to see someone like Barack Obama have a chance to lead one of the world's biggest nations.''
 
loosie
loosie 7 years ago

Witness aren't supossed to be republican or democrat they are registered THEOCRATS
 
halcyon
halcyon 7 years ago

The more I think about theocracy, the more it repulses me.
God-rule, yes. No problems with that. But God-rule always has to come through humans, which is repugnant.
 
justhuman
justhuman 7 years ago

The Williams Sisters need urgently a Bible Study because they ignore basic teachings of the Watchtower Society. Or the generous contributions by them to the WT really "washes"their sins and misconceptions of the Bible "truth"
 
Witness 007
Witness 007 7 years ago

Jehovahs Angel of Vengence is sharpening his sword for them!.......You don't need a President at all when you can pray to Jehovah to fix things....it really does work try it!
 
undercover
undercover 7 years ago

Back when I was in, it was stressed pretty hard that not only were we supposed to be neutral in political matters, we weren't even supposed to have an opinion. I remember hearing talks that stressed to us about not even referring to "we" or "us" when talking about being a citizen of the nation. We weren't US citizens, we were citizens of God's Government. Any actions taken by worldly governments were to be of no concern to us.
I remember trying to be neutral and not having an opinion. It was easy when I was young but when I got a little older, married and a homeowner things changed. Everything from the tax rate to interest rates to unemployment was now a concern in my life. How could I not have an opinion in the political strategies that could affect my well-being?
If a local non-famous JW were to make the statements uttered by the Williams' they'd be hauled in on the carpet quicker'n you can say "judicial committee meeting". I was often "reminded" about "our" neutral stance whenever I "allowed" conversations to spill over into politics or national events.
OTOH, I'm glad that the Williams' have an opinion...maybe in time their free-thinking will allow them to realize that the JWs are just too cultish and they'll make a clean break. They could really be a good example to other free-thinking people trapped in the organization who see them stand up against the Society if and when they decide to think for themselves.
 
willyloman
willyloman 7 years ago

If they were truly good little dubs, they'd be righteously opposed to the foolish notion that man could bring about any positive change in these last days when the end is so very close. They would attribute the euphoria and general goodwill brought on by the Obama victory as a sure sign that Satan is misleading the entire inhabited earth. And they'd remind all their fans that only Jehovah can bring about real change, that the only real hope is in the new system.
But, hey, they're only human. And showing a little humanity is a good thing.
 
Octarine Prince
Octarine Prince 7 years ago

Serena is far from a virgin. She has never even had a judicial committee, as far as I know.
 
sir82
sir82 7 years ago

I don't think the Williams sisters were ever baptized (correct me if I'm wrong). I have a strong hunch they don't do door-to-door witnessing, either. As such, they are at most "inactive unbaptized publishers".
But they continue to self-identify as JWs, and often pepper their comments to the press with references to "Jehovah" and "Jehovah's Witnesses". The public, who have zero knowledge of the distinction that JWs make among themselves regarding the staus & prestige of "baptized" vs. "unbaptized publisher" vs. "active" vs. "inactive", view them as JWs.
And the WTS has never, to my knowledge, made any effort to disclaim them. I kind of suspect the WTS tolerates them, because it makes them (the WTS) appear less "cultish" in the public eye ("Look! The Williams sisters are JWs - maybe JWs aren't so weird after all"). And there is precious little that is more important to Bethel than their public image.
That, and I suspect the sisters make generous contributions to the "worldwide work" to assuage their consciences (all those references to "Jehovah" indicate that their Kingdom Hall indoctrination sessions made a deep impression).
 
minimus
minimus 7 years ago

"As Jehovah's Witnesses, we don't get involved in politics-------but I'm thrilled we have Barack Obama as our new President."
Huh??/ Somethin' ain't right!
 
mary stewart
mary stewart 7 years ago

a theoracy is a chuch-run regime. the wtbts are pro-nwo and want o be the ditators.
 
DanTheMan
DanTheMan 7 years ago

There's a lotta black r&f jaydubs that have similar feelings I'm sure, even if they won't admit it. Being black in America is a tough row to hoe no matter what your religion is, and so how could they not feel a degree of 'hell yeah' at Obama's election.
 
kool aid man06
kool aid man06 7 years ago



http://www.youtube.com/user/araretreat
 
smiddy
smiddy 7 years ago

If I remember correctly the WTB&TS had segregated congregations. ( All blacks or all whites ) Where blacks did attend white congregations they were segregated.Certainly in the 60`s and prior to that.Of course they would say they were being obedient to the law of the land.
smiddy
 

5
10
20




Share this topic






Related Topics
AndersonsInfo
Brownstoner: How the Jehovah’s Witnesses Acquired Some of Brooklyn’s Most Insanely Valuable Properties
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
The Searcher
Missionary Deceptively/Mistakenly Misquotes Scripture.........
by The Searcher 6 months ago
The Searcher
A First Stepping-Stone For Bethelites & Lurkers?
by The Searcher 5 months ago
AndersonsInfo
Trey Bundy: One Year of Reporting JW Child Abuse - Your comments please!
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
OrphanCrow
Deaf Aotearoa flooded with complaints about Jehovah's Witness church
by OrphanCrow 5 months ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/167691/jehovahs-witness-williams-sisters-revel-obama-win





Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ "Serena soaks up the pressure" Fame + JW
/  





 

"Serena soaks up the pressure" Fame + JW
by DannyHaszard 11 years ago 48 Replies latest 9 years ago   social current
«
 1
 2
 3
 »
 5
10
20
DannyHaszard
DannyHaszard 11 years ago


Serena soaks up the pressure
Telegraph.co.uk, UK - 9 minutes ago
... be that, separated from the world by her own fame and restrained from regular boy-girl relationships by her lifestyle and being a Jehovah's Witness, she had ...
Serener Serena soaks up the pressure
 By Sue Mott
 (Filed: 21/05/2005)


No Star Wars in Paris then. Serena Williams has pulled out of the French Open next week with the recurrence of an ankle injury, so the hotly-anticipated sequel to the Australian Open - Serena v Maria - cannot happen. Williams has flown back to America and may not reappear before Wimbledon. Her sojourn in Europe was brief. Nothing to do with leaving her make-up bag behind in Los Angles. Everything to do with dumb shame of injury.
She arrived, she lost, she left. A whirlwind in an orange tracksuit but stable just about long enough one afternoon to offer an intimate portrait of her state of mind.
 
Causing a racquet: Serena Williams on her way to winning in Melbourne
For a start: there was a sub-plot, as bizarre as they come, to that victory four months ago at the Australian Open. We thought we were watching Serena Williams, guns blazing, avenge her loss at Wimbledon and reinstate herself as the most formidable female tennis player on earth. She beat her Wimbledon nemesis, Sharapova, in the semi-final and top-seed Lindsay Davenport in the final, having trailed by a set in both matches before unleashing the predatory ruthlessness that had won her six Grand Slam titles beforehand.
Sheer guts. Ambition. Muscle fibre. The victory was related to all of the above. But in truth - it was love.
William's mother, Oracene, has always called her youngest daughter "a nut". Now here she was proving it. Believe it or not, the whole Australian fight-back scenario sprang from her passion for an American band. How nutty is that? "Oh Green Day!" she cried, her head swivelling to see the screen in a players' lounge that sported the band of her dreams crashing away at their guitars.
"They're my favourite favourite. Actually, I have an unhealthy obsession with them. I cried when I met them. I'm not even allowed to listen to their music any more because it's gotten so bad. But, you know, I don't even want to talk about it because they weren't very nice to me. Well, they were nice to me the first time but when I saw them again, they were like, 'OK, here's this crazy, obsessed fan again'!" She looked crestfallen.
"It's not like I'm trying to be obsessed. I still think they should have been honoured. I'd have been honoured. Anyway, it's a very bitter subject."
For the youngest Williams sibling, one of the most famous women in America, to be lamenting the indifference of celebrities towards their loyal supporters was a curious juxtaposition. She decided to take affirmative action. She vowed to gain their attention.
"You see, I met them in the November and they told me they were going to be going to Australia in March to play at the same arena as the Australian Open. Every day when I was playing there, I'd pass this wall that had the pictures of the champions along it. I'd see my face because I won it in 2003. So I kept thinking I've got to get my face back on that wall. So they can see me. Green Day is not going to see anybody else on that wall but me!
"This is the truth. Honestly, that was my motivation. 'I gotta be on that wall'. I thought they'd think about me if they saw me twice as opposed to once. Like I said, I have a real unhealthy obsession." She chortled with laughter, which went some way to relieving the impression that the girl is really suffering with her passion. Even she, however, admits it has gone a little too far.
"I have all their 10 albums. I know all their songs, back to front. Each word. It's more or less a case of a neurotic, psychotic stalker," she giggled helplessly. "I really believe that's what ruined me. But that's OK. I'm trying to understand what happened and I never want to meet them again. It's too painful."
While having every sympathy with Mrs Williams and her nutcase diagnosis, you feel that her endearingly candid daughter needs a little more amateur psychology than that. Could it not be that, separated from the world by her own fame and restrained from regular boy-girl relationships by her lifestyle and being a Jehovah's Witness, she had turned to a surrogate love life? She did not dismiss this out of hand. "Maybe it is," she mused carefully. "Maybe I'm living vicariously through Green Day." A vast grin lit up her face. Her teeth flashed neon. You realise that beneath her clear talent to terrify all terrestrial human life lurks a quaintly amiable young woman.
"I don't have a man. I'm just on my own. It's hard, you know, especially being a young female. I don't know what to suggest. It does get a bit lonely but I've just learnt to turn to the Bible. I know it sounds really crazy-spiritual but it's not really. It's just the fact that you can find a lot of solace in the scriptures.
"You have to rely on yourself. If you have an aura about you that's positive and full of aplomb, people will pick that up. People like positive vibes. People fall in love with that. But if you're - like - negative, down, people will pick up on that, too. They'll use you as a trash can and then leave." She heard the "trash can" line on Oprah Winfrey's show when she and sister, Venus, were guests to plug their new book: Serving From The Hip: 10 Rules for Living, Loving and Winning.
Certainly, two of the three are proving tricky. This time two years ago, she ruled the female tennis roost to the virtual expunging of all opposition. She held all the major Grand Slam titles concurrently, christened the Serena Slam. She was 21, an actress, a clothes designer, a princess in all but coat of arms. The land she surveyed had no horizon. But as fellow American star, Jennifer Capriati once noticed: "Stuff happens." It did to Serena.
Her parents divorced, her half-sister, Yetunda, was murdered in Los Angeles in September 2003 and - though this cannot be related to life and death - she won no Grand Slam titles in 2004. This career dearth included Wimbledon, where 17-year-old Sharapova ascended the SW19 throne with all the poise and certainly the body of a newly-crowned Miss World.
Even Serena's personal life came under scrutiny. Despite possessing the same  publicist as Michael Jackson, she was powerless to halt allegations of relationships with at least two gridiron footballers appearing on the pages of the sort of newspapers that you would hesitate to put under your hamster.
She called the year she had just been through "nice", in that vague, dreamy way she summons up when stating the flat-out unbelievable. We've seen it in her press conferences. "Oh, it was nice," she will say, eyes gazing off to the middle distance in order to clang shut a line of questioning.
But when she is ready, she opens again. It is at moments like these, you can ask her about Sharapova who, being tall, blonde and Russian, is an obvious foil to Williams's black American heft. They are opposites except in divine ambition. But Williams got there first and she would barely be human if she did not thoroughly (in a professional sense) hate the intrusion of the teenage Wimbledon champion on her patch of South London lawn.
"The word 'hate' isn't in my ? well, yes it is in my vocabulary," she said with disarming honesty. She tried for a more realistic sentence. "To be honest with you, I don't think about her like a lot of people say. I think about her when I play her, but she doesn't permeate my thoughts. Yeah, it's nice to watch when we play each other" - here comes the vagueness again - "but I've been on one side of so many rivalries. Me and my sister Venus. Me and Henin. Me and Hingis. Now it's me and this one."
But surely, this is The One. The one who challenges her more fiercely than all who have gone before? They have played each other four times. The score is two-all. "Um, at Wimbledon last year I just couldn't play because I put too much pressure on myself. At the year-end Championships, when I lost to her again, I pulled a stomach muscle. I couldn't move. I was pretty upset about that."
As a result of that injury, she barely practised before the Australian Open. "How would I be if I practised?" she asked, wide-eyed in estimation of just how good she could have been. No tennising Williams sister suffered from lack of self-esteem, not ostensibly any way. But there is no doubt that talk has exceeded walk sometimes, if only because the two bright girls are intelligent enough to be thoroughly distracted. For a while it seemed that the lure of acting, designing, dressing and shopping would supercede the repetitious demands of tennis.
But at this moment, despite the flaring ankle, Williams claims she has rediscovered her single-mindedness. "I'm motivated. It feels as if I definitely want to come back and dominate again. It's just putting my mind to it. Things happen and you realise what you want to do in life. I want to play tennis. It's got me this far. It's the base of my career.
"Tennis is what I want to do. Just watching some of the players practise makes me think, 'Oh, I could take her. Right now'. I'm so confident. If my game's on. I'm pretty much unstoppable."
Not in Italy she wasn't. Losing in the second round to Francesca Schiavone, perhaps due to her injury and not really helped by the film crew following devotedly in her wake. She and Venus are shooting their own reality TV show. "A lot of reality shows don't deal in reality. You noticed that? But Venus and I live real lives. We work really hard, on and off the court, so we decided to make the film.
"People will be surprised. First of all, by how sweet we are. How, like, we're real crazy. We laugh a lot. We're big jokers. People are used to seeing us all serious on court."
So does this mean we're going to see her just out of bed with straggly hair and no make up? She fixed me with a don't-be-stupid look and said: "It's not that real."
Later she was asked by a journalist with a staggering lack of concern for his own safety whether "there was any sex in it?" "Any what?" she squeaked. "Sex," he repeated, still bent on self-annihilation. "Absolutely not," she boomed. "This is for a family network not the Playboy Channel." But she was smiling. This is not to suggest she has relaxed her prohibition on sex before marriage, as she insisted last year. She just seems a little older and wiser. At 23, she is maturing into a young woman who sees more light and shade.
"I think you have to love yourself before you fall in love," she said. "I'm still learning to love myself." She laughed to undermine the seriousness of her words but it could be that her monumental confidence is a partial bluff, even to herself.
But she is fighter. The opportunity to win the French Open for the second time is now gone but she has unfinished business at Wimbledon. The French crowds have never warmed to her but Wimbledon crowd will be kinder. Whether they go as far as the Australians and roar her on as the underdog remains to be seen. Either way, she only knows one way to play it. "I like to believe I'll just go there and win the tournament. I love Wimbledon. I love the grass. I've got a really cute dress. I loved my dress last year too but, obviously, you can't wear the same one twice.
"That's my problem with fashion. I'm photographed too often. And now there's the reality show. I can only ever wear a dress once." I wondered if this applied to every single item of apparel she possessed. It could get hideously expensive, even for a woman who has won $15 million in prize-money.
"No, not knickers," she conceded. "I get to re-wear those. No one's seeing my knickers."
www.telegraph.co.uk/mott
 
unbeliever
unbeliever 11 years ago


Serena is a devoted jdub alright.

 
sf
sf 11 years ago


Gives a whole new meaning to : Watchtower is a snare and a RACKETT!
sKally
 
loosie
loosie 11 years ago


lol@ sKally

Ok forgive me for being catty which I am about to do. But doing this make me feel better for getting ragged on about the way I dressed, which wasn't at all like this.

Does she know the meaning of the word bra?

 
loosie
loosie 11 years ago


That slit is waaay to high. But I bet the bro's in her congo. love mic duty.


 
loosie
loosie 11 years ago


this one needs no words

 
loosie
loosie 11 years ago


I guess she forgot to turn in her field service time slip in this one...


alt

Ok I feel much better now.
 
avishai
avishai 11 years ago

Wow!!!
 
avishai
avishai 11 years ago


"I don't have a man. I'm just on my own. It's hard, you know, especially being a young female. I don't know what to suggest.  It does get a bit lonely but I've just learnt to turn to the Bible
And lookin' like that, it's a damn shame!!! How much wasted time does this org. cause when peeps could be having fun, having a relationship, love....
 
DanTheMan
DanTheMan 11 years ago


Green Day huh?
Sing along with me Serena!
"Don't wanna be an American a Watchtower idiot!.....The subliminal mind f*ck America Jehovahs..."
I think she's headed for a fork in the road - leave JW's or surrender and become a borg drone. I hope she chooses the former. She's *very* obviously on the fence, although she doesn't seem to be completely conscious of it...yet.
She seems really likeable, neurotic as hell though.
 
fleaman uk
fleaman uk 11 years ago

Loosie...loads of red crosses luv.
 
GetBusyLiving
GetBusyLiving 11 years ago


I read an interview with her once wherein she explained that she loved being a Jehovah's Witness and having high moral standards. A couple of paragraphs later she was asked who her favorite music artist was and she responded, "50 Cent". I had to laugh.
I think the religion works differently for celebs like her and Prince than for the regular lowly r&f, the same as Scientology is different for guys like John Travolta and Tom Cruise.
GBL
 
Sunspot
Sunspot 11 years ago


On the pic that Unbeliever showed, not only was our loyal and modest sister's clothing not too "well-arranged", it looks as if the moths lunched on her "blouse" too. How sad that she doesn't have any $$$ to buy something new before being SEEN in public!
Annie
 
kaykay_mp
kaykay_mp 11 years ago


I don't know what she's so damned worried about. You can make the GB look the other way with just a little cash...

laters
kaykay_mp
 
loosie
loosie 11 years ago

I don't know why you're getting little red x's. I am hosting the pics on the web not my hard drive. I can see them fine. What's going on? Can anyone else see the pics?
 
Sunspot
Sunspot 11 years ago

Fraid not dear.
 
avishai
avishai 11 years ago

I can see 'em jes' FINE!!!!
 
Sunspot
Sunspot 11 years ago


Avi,
Are you serious?
 
avishai
avishai 11 years ago

Yep, i can see all the pics. Is it your browser, maybe?
 
luna2
luna2 11 years ago

Awww, me neither on the pics...except for the first one with the transparent top.
 

«
 1
 2
 3
 »
 5
10
20




Share this topic






Related Topics
AndersonsInfo
Trey Bundy: One Year of Reporting JW Child Abuse - Your comments please!
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
AndersonsInfo
Brownstoner: How the Jehovah’s Witnesses Acquired Some of Brooklyn’s Most Insanely Valuable Properties
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
Saintbertholdt
Transcription of interview with Rabbi Michael Berenbaum regarding German JW's in the concentration camps
by Saintbertholdt 8 months ago
Esse quam videri
Google.ca search bar 'royal commission'
by Esse quam videri 7 months ago
Tenacious
Has anyone noticed how in the October JW Broadcast, Losch encourages good works towards ALL people?
by Tenacious 5 months ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/91073/serena-soaks-up-pressure-fame-jw






Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ "Serena soaks up the pressure" Fame + JW
/  





 

"Serena soaks up the pressure" Fame + JW
by DannyHaszard 11 years ago 48 Replies latest 9 years ago   social current
«
 1
 2
 3
 »
 5
10
20
talesin
talesin 11 years ago


No, I can't see them either, and have IE, usually no problem with pics.

I feel sorry for her. She is (gonna be) so messed-up ....
But, it's a good demonstration how there are different rules for the rich , the famous , the popular , just like in real life.
tal
 
loosie
loosie 11 years ago

Now I feel really smart... not. The JW dress code pics should work now.
 
loosie
loosie 11 years ago

Now I got the pics working, nobody's saying anything.
 
AuntieJane
AuntieJane 11 years ago


OK, I will say something...YIKES! If the WTS powers that be had half a brain, they'd
put her in the centerfold and really bring up the numbers!
AuntieJ, who is actually disgusted by the hypocrisy.
 
JW83
JW83 11 years ago

Hey, Green Day is my favourite band, too! That's about it on the 'having anything in common with Serena' - I definitely didn't get to have a career or wear what I wanted when I was a dub!
 
fifi
fifi 11 years ago


Funny, but it doesn't seem to look like what was considered "suitable attire for christians" when I was a dub. "Sisters" in my congo were couselled to be sure to wear a camisole under their blouse to be sure that no "brothers" could see the marks of their bras through their clothing. And my dad used to make me and my sisters kneel down before leaving the house to make sure that our skirts were long enough. Any skirt which didn't reach the floor while kneeling wasn't long enough and should be worn in NO circumstances.
Fifi
 
itsallgoodnow
itsallgoodnow 11 years ago


All I can say is.... if she still needs to learn how to love herself ....
I thought she was seeing that film producer guy? I don't know his name. Does she really come out and say she is a Witness, or does she just hint around it? I don't know, but I definitely think she, and her family, are a bunch of whack jobs.
 
Preston
Preston 11 years ago


I'm sorry all the attention was given to her appearance....this was actually a very well-written article which I think reveals more about the life of a sports star than that of a someone who just happens to be a JW. The pressure that they have to go through is..tremedous: travel time, playing in the heat, practice, photo shoots, publicity appearances. It may seem luxurious but her statements regarding her favorite band are telling. It's like you dont have time to do anything you like anymore once you've been put in that position. The rest of her life is already spelled out for her.
- Preston
 
mapleaf18
mapleaf18 11 years ago

oh, yeah, i was grilled for having what was considered a "low cut" blouse and it was nowhere as revealing as those duds. that would be instant loose conduct and marking for a non-celeb JW.
 
Chia
Chia 11 years ago


Itsallgoodnow said:
I thought she was seeing that film producer guy?
Yeah, Brett Ratner, the director of Rush Hour and lots of music videos. That's what I heard, too.
 
DannyHaszard
DannyHaszard 11 years ago




Sisters Venus, right, and Serena Williams of the United States celebrate with American flags after they won gold during the Olympic women's doubles tennis Thursday, September 28, 2000, in Sydney's Olympic Park.
 
DannyHaszard
DannyHaszard 11 years ago




SPORTS 'OUTSCORING' JEHOVAH WITNESSES
Pressbox.co.uk (press release), UK - 1 hour ago
 Jehovah's Witnesses say it is wrong to salute the flag, but it is alright to parade it around the tennis court and encourage others to salute it. ...
---------------
William's sisters to get their own show!

http://realitytv.about.com/b/a/157387.htm
 
March 29, 2005
Venus and Serena Williams Get Their Own Reality Show
Tennis sisters Venus and Serena Williams have signed up for a summer reality TV show on ABC Family. In a press release, Serena said "the series will provide our fans with an up-close, inside look at our lives away from the tennis courts. " Hmmm. The lives of these sexy sibs must be pretty tame if their show will
 
DannyHaszard
DannyHaszard 11 years ago

Is the Watchtower condoning anything goes to seek out star power like Scientology? Stars unleash their passion
USA Today - 6 hours ago
... Says actor Terrence Howard (Ray, Hustle & Flow), a Jehovah's Witness: "Anything that's dealing with the heart and the spirit is something that should be spoken ... "Says actor Terrence Howard (Ray, Hustle & Flow), a Jehovah's Witness: "Anything that's dealing with the heart and the spirit is something that should be spoken about, because it lifts and encourages people." http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=+Terrence+Howard+Ray%2C+Hustle+%26+Flow&btnG=Google+Search Check out his keywords Rated R flick,as a popular CO used to say; "rated R for ROTTEN"
 
DannyHaszard
DannyHaszard 11 years ago


Venus & Serena keep it clean
New York Daily News, NY - 2 hours ago
... And as for the cursing and stuff [now almost a tradition on most "reality" shows], we don't believe in that, because we were brought up Jehovah's Witnesses and ...



Venus & Serena
keep it clean

 

By DAVID BIANCULLI
DAILY NEWS TV CRITIC
 

Venus and Serena Williams show off the clothes they don't wear to work. 

BEVERLY HILLS - Tennis-playing superstar sisters Venus and Serena Williams explained to TV writers here why their new reality series on the ABC Family network, "Venus & Serena: For Real," differs from most follow-the-celebrities reality shows.
"We're working girls," Venus Williams said. "We do not take days off. We're fighting.... I think this show is going to show that element of how hard we work. And it's going to show when you lift the Wimbledon trophy, what it really takes - and then all the drama in between."
The ABC Family show was filmed over a six-week period that ended before Venus' thrilling comeback win at Wimbledon earlier this month.
A postscript is planned to reflect that victory in the final episode of "Venus & Serena." The rest of it will show the sisters training, playing and living their daily lives - which includes, in Serena's case, a lot of interaction with her Jack Russell terrier, Jackie.
Who was not acquired, she says, as an accessory.
"Honestly, I haven't gotten on that train where all the celebrities have a dog," Serena said, laughing. "I've had her for six years, and she's been traveling with me since 1999 - since I was 17 years old."
The sisters took the show to ABC Family, rather than go the MTV route of "The Osbournes" or somewhere similarly edgy, because they saw their series not as another study in celebrities behaving badly, but as more positive, reserved and inspirational.
"We consider ourselves role models," Serena said Friday, adding, "We thought we were a perfect match with ABC Family, even down to the name. It's ABC Family. We're the Williams sisters. We're a really close family.
"And as for the cursing and stuff [now almost a tradition on most "reality" shows], we don't believe in that, because we were brought up Jehovah's Witnesses and Christians."
Venus agreed, noting also that they knew the rest of their family will be watching the show, too.
"In the end," Venus explained, "what we have is our reputation, who we are, and what we've been taught. And I want my mom and dad to be proud of me, and I think they'll be very proud to have this show on ABC Family as the right venue for us."
While it wasn't part of the TV show, critics couldn't resist also asking Venus about that Wimbledon victory, in which she came from behind numerous times to beat top-seeded Lindsay Davenport, 4-6, 7-6, 9-7.
Did she know it was a classic match while she was playing it?
"I knew I was behind," said Venus, "until the last two minutes."
Originally published on July 18, 2005

 
-----------------------------
http://www.freeminds.org/psych/lifton.htm Eight Marks of a Mind-Control Cult
 
# 3 Demand for Purity
The world is depicted as black and white, with little room for making personal decisions based on a trained conscience. One's conduct is modeled after the ideology of the group, as taught in its literature. People and organizations are pictured as either good or evil, depending on their relationship to the cult.
Universal tendencies of guilt and shame are used to control individuals, even after they leave. There is great difficulty in understanding the complexities of human morality, since everything is polarized and oversimplified. All things classified as evil are to be avoided, and purity is attainable through immersion into the cult's ideology.
 
rebel8
rebel8 11 years ago


You guys who can't see the pics are really missing quite a shocker......  1 step away from going completely topless......the only time I've ever seen someone dress that way in public was the prostitutes in NYC.........I mean to call yourself a devoted Christian of any variety and wear TOTALLY transparent tops w/o bras is ridiculous.....totally tacky
...and to think I had to go in the back room with the elders because I wore a skirt showing part of my kneecaps with a 3 inch slit.......of course I had also committed the sin of telling a brother off for calling me a whore for wearing that skirt.....tsk, tsk
thanks danny for sharing that news story
 
DannyHaszard
DannyHaszard 11 years ago


Summer competition ready to heat up
Houston Chronicle, TX - 6 hours ago
... their beliefs. "We were brought up Jehovah's Witnesses and Christians," Serena said. "We consider ourselves role models.". "Absolutely ...  ABC Family exec Paul Lee admits "we really got lucky with this one." Hot off her Wimbledon win, Venus Williams and her sister Serena star in a six-episode reality series, Venus & Serena: For Real (9 p.m. Wednesday). The show, which follows the pair off the court and on, was shot before Wimbledon so it could air in the window between that tournament and the U.S. Open.

The series will show "how hard we work and all the drama in between," Venus said. "People are going to see that we laugh more than anything else and that we're normal people in somewhat of an abnormal environment."
"We thought we were a perfect match with ABC Family," said Serena, explaining why the show is airing there instead of, say, MTV. "We're the Williams sisters. We're a really close family."
You won't see them cursing or doing anything that would compromise their beliefs.
"We were brought up Jehovah's Witnesses and Christians," Serena said. "We consider ourselves role models."
"Absolutely," Venus added, "because in the end, what we have is our reputation. And I want my mom and dad (who will be seen in the series) to be proud of us."


Sisters Venus, right, and Serena Williams of the United States celebrate with American flags after they won gold during the Olympic women's doubles tennis Thursday, September 28, 2000, in Sydney's Olympic Park.
 
Sunspot
Sunspot 11 years ago


...and to think I had to go in the back room with the elders because I wore a skirt showing part of my kneecaps with a 3 inch slit.......of course I had also committed the sin of telling a brother off for calling me a whore for wearing that skirt.....tsk, tsk
So THAT'S where you went to, Hilary!!! I've often wondered about you after you were told to go home and change your very long skirt with the slit right AT the knee line! I saw you crying in the library just before the Ministry School, and heard later what had happened.
As you know, I left the WTS a few months after this happened and haven't seen you since that night in 1999. I felt SO awful for you. I had heard (when JWs were still speaking to me) that you left the area and got married in Arizona. I also heard that you weren't "doing so well" in the troof any more.
I doubt if Rebel8 is Hilary, but she very well could be, seeing as how many "sisters" were judged and made to feel subhuman because of what a JWman thought. Hilary IS a real person and this actually happened. Her Dad was an elder, and HE moved to another KH after this incident.
Annie
 
rebel8
rebel8 11 years ago


Nope, I'm not Hilary*, but I do try to be hilary-ous, LOL! Wherever she is, she's better off than she would have been if she stayed. I'm sure there are many stories just like mine, as you said. I'm so glad it happened because it was one of the things that helped me realize it's a cult.
The hilary-ous thing about that story too was that a fellow 18-yr-old was considered my spiritual head and questioning him was considered wrong. As if an 18-yr-old is infallible just because he has a penis and I don't.
I was recently reading some really old literature "litter-ature" as you say, Sunspot. It was rabid misogyny. Sounded like a KKK leader or any other fanatic....saying it is a blasphemy and horror that women were getting jobs and speaking their opinions to males. How sad.
*At first, I thought you were going to make a joke about Hillary Clinton, but we were talking about a red skirt, not a blue dress.
 
DannyHaszard
DannyHaszard 11 years ago


JW customized sweet sixteen party  (Danny Haszard sez; good for them,im pissed that i was forbidden to do this for my baby sis.The Rockland Massachusetts Jehovah's Witnesses elders would have DFed my whole family.) Marking a rite of passage
Bakersfield Californian (subscription), CA - 6 hours ago
... Daisy's mother, Irma Serrano, is a Jehovah's Witness and originally didn't want to have the party because of the religious aspects. ... Marking a rite of passage
Hispanic ritual a chance for girls to leave childhood behind  By GABRIEL RAMIREZ, Californian staff writer
e-mail: gramirez@bakersfield.com 
Posted: Sunday July 17th, 2005, 11:30 PM
Last Updated: Sunday July 17th, 2005, 11:57 PM
Quinceañeras are a time-honored rite of passage for many Hispanic girls on the verge of womanhood.
 For parents, it's a time to introduce their daughter to the world.
For daughters, it's a time to dress up and hold court.
Daisy Estrada Serrano had her quinceañera on July 9. To her, it represented leaving behind the child she was and stepping into her young lady shoes.
Daisy's mother, Irma Serrano, is a Jehovah's Witness and originally didn't want to have the party because of the religious aspects.
Typically in quinceañeras, the young lady is taken to Catholic Mass where she recites a prayer and is introduced to God as a young lady.
They decided to tweak the event by taking that part out.
The compromise worked, not to mention saved money as the church would have charged a fee.
And money can be a big issue.
Quinceañeras can cost $4,500 to $15,000, said Reina Benitez, owner of Party Plus Design by Reina Corporation, a quinceañera and wedding store in Bakersfield.
The event calls for just about everything a wedding does: A hall, decorations, the church (though not in Daisy's case) a lavish dinner, invitations, photos or videos, music, flowers, attendants and, of course, the quinceañera dress.
Unlike a wedding, however, parents can, and often do, turn to godparents and other family members to help with the expenses.
And instead of bridesmaids and groomsmen, quinceañeras have "royal courts," which can be as many as 14 friends and family members.
Daisy had four couples in her court: Teresa Rivas, Azucena Vences, Yessica Vega, Karla Barajas, Ricardo Aldaco, Carlos Chavez, Irvin Valenzuela and Jose Vargas.
Her companion was Albert Aldaco.
"I chose Albert because he is close to me. I have known him since sixth grade," Daisy said.
But the highlight is the dress.
"It's the dress that stands out. It's the dress that makes people go 'WOW.' It separates you from everybody else," Daisy said.
Daisy chose blue, though most quinceañera dresses are off-white or pink.
The pinnacle of the evening is when the quinceañera and her court dance. Daisy choreographed it herself and it took weeks of practice for her and the court to learn to waltz.
Daisy's event went smoothly and after dinner Daisy's father, Jose Abel Estrada, placed on her what were her first high-heeled shoes.
Then came the much anticipated waltz. And finally Daisy was given her last doll, which signified her leaving her childhood behind.
Afterward, there was a lot to clean up.
"It was all so messy. But I didn't have to clean up, my family did it," Daisy said. "I have a lot of memories and overall I had a great time."
She is looking forward to more responsibilities now, and perhaps even being allowed to date.

 
DannyHaszard
DannyHaszard 11 years ago


Serena returns money won in gambling:-
Webindia123, India - 24 minutes ago
 Tennis star and TV actress Serena Williams returned her winnings in gambling recently as she is a Jehovah's Witness and it is against her faith to gamble. ...




Serena returns money won in gambling
New York: Tennis star and TV actress Serena Williams returned her winnings in gambling recently as she is a Jehovah's Witness and it is against her faith to gamble.
According to the New York Post, Williams was gambling at the casino-themed Rogers Cup gala at the Toronto Hilton.
Williams stayed true to her faith. As she was leaving she gave back all the chips she had won worth around $400 to a stranger at a a table.
------------
8 marks of a cult
# 3 Demand for Purity
The world is depicted as black and white, with little room for making personal decisions based on a trained conscience. One's conduct is modeled after the ideology of the group, as taught in its literature. People and organizations are pictured as either good or evil, depending on their relationship to the cult.
Universal tendencies of guilt and shame are used to control individuals, even after they leave. There is great difficulty in understanding the complexities of human morality, since everything is polarized and oversimplified. All things classified as evil are to be avoided, and purity is attainable through immersion into the cult's ideology. ------ Watchtower Whistleblower: Danny Haszard Bangor Maine Jehovah's Witnesses are the 'perfect storm' of deception-in a word they are the cult of Innuendo



 
 

«
 1
 2
 3
 »
 5
10
20




Share this topic



Topic Summary
serena soaks up the pressure
people are used to seeing us all serious on court.".
i love wimbledon.



Related Topics
AndersonsInfo
Trey Bundy: One Year of Reporting JW Child Abuse - Your comments please!
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
AndersonsInfo
Brownstoner: How the Jehovah’s Witnesses Acquired Some of Brooklyn’s Most Insanely Valuable Properties
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
Saintbertholdt
Transcription of interview with Rabbi Michael Berenbaum regarding German JW's in the concentration camps
by Saintbertholdt 8 months ago
Esse quam videri
Google.ca search bar 'royal commission'
by Esse quam videri 7 months ago
Tenacious
Has anyone noticed how in the October JW Broadcast, Losch encourages good works towards ALL people?
by Tenacious 5 months ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/91073/serena-soaks-up-pressure-fame-jw?page=2&size=20





Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ "Serena soaks up the pressure" Fame + JW
/  





 

"Serena soaks up the pressure" Fame + JW
by DannyHaszard 11 years ago 48 Replies latest 9 years ago   social current
«
 1
 2
 3
 »
5
10
20
DannyHaszard
DannyHaszard 10 years ago

williams_flags_sep28-ap.jpg 'We really believe in what we're doing'
Financial Times, UK - 7 hours ago
... There'll be something better coming next, so there'll be a time when records don't really matter." For a Jehovah's witness, Venus isn't much of a proselytiser. ... ........Yet she doesn't aspire to establish a hegemony in tennis? "I just see this life as - what word am I looking for? - kind of just temporary. Because you know, most people - a lot of people believe in afterlife, or going to heaven, or things like that. I see this life as not necessarily the true life. There'll be something better coming next, so there'll be a time when records don't really matter." For a Jehovah's witness, Venus isn't much of a proselytiser. She'll win Wimbledon ..........
 
DannyHaszard
DannyHaszard 10 years ago

BLUE STATES
San Francisco Chronicle, USA - 48 minutes ago
... Venus and Serena Williams were home-schooled Jehovah's Witnesses who were steered away from junior tennis and appeared only fleetingly on the academy scene. ....The Williams sisters had a considerable impact on African American youth, the results of which are starting to emerge in the women's game, but ....
 
wednesday
wednesday 10 years ago

The pic of her in the red dress-well her nipples area is showing. That is disgraceful for anyone. She is not even dressed as well as a street walker would. Who would call themselves a christian and dress like that? Usually you have to pay to see that much of the body. I guess she just gives it away - if that is catty-don't care, her dress is a complete disgrace.
 
LDH
LDH 10 years ago

I *KNEW* that I knew that Terrence Howard dude! SHUT UP! He is not a JW!
What gets me about the whole Serena thing, I wonder hwo she would be faring if she was not lucky enough to have a worldly dad who insisted on those girls doing something other than sell magazines.
Those two don't even know what it means to be Jehovah's Witness kids, really.
 
DannyHaszard
DannyHaszard 10 years ago

wonder hwo she would be faring if she was not lucky enough to have a worldly dad who insisted on those girls doing something other than sell magazines.
Same with the Jackson 5
 
blondie
blondie 10 years ago

Terence Howard's soon to be if not already ex-wife is a JW. He probably went to some meetings and conventions to please his wife. Now that they are no longer married............
Last I knew the Williams sisters were unbaptized publishers; only mother, Oracene, is a baptized JW. They were attending a West Palm Beach congregation. I wonder if they were removed as unbaptized publishers after the flag incident?
Blondie
 
DannyHaszard
DannyHaszard 9 years ago

Williams Trial Concludes; ATP, WTA Under Fire comment box Tennis-X.com, MI - 3 hours ago
...Serena likes to make the party scene with Hollywood directors and NFL players in tow, yet tells London’s Daily Telegraph that as Jehovah’s Witnesses, “We... .....now it’s up to the jury to decide who. The jury will undoubtedly focus solely on the case, and not take into considerationthe culture of lying that has always surrounded the Williams clan. Or maybe justlying to oneself, then going about the arduous task of making the rest of the world believe it. You can’t count the number of press conferences where one of the sisters denies being injured, or denies something that just happened in a match, or denies reality. Last January Serena showed up at the Australian Open exceedingly overweight, yet as the press danced around the question, she insisted she was in great shape. Serena likes to make the party scene with Hollywood directors and NFL players in tow, yet tells London’s Daily Telegraph that as Jehovah’s Witnesses, “We don’t believe in dating unless you’re ready to get married. I’ve never dated anybody.”  Back in the day as the sisters were rising on the tennis scene and in the public eye, Richard Williams also saw himself as a celebrity, holding up signs for the television audience which watching their matches and making outrageous claims for the media. “This was a man who just doesn’t distinguish between fact and fiction,” said an unidentified industry insider during a CNN special on the family. “And he’s buying Rockefeller Center for $3.9 billion. And he owns thousands of buses. And he has a seat on the Shanghai Stock Exchange. And I’m not sure if it’s sort of controversy, so much as it’s amusement.” Back in the day if you called Richard Williams on any of his b.s., you were likely to see the race card .
 
Abaddon
Abaddon 9 years ago

I wonder what chromosomes they have?
If you cut out photos of them and of male athletes and swap heads around you can see that aside from tits they have male torsos and upper bodies... wanna see what a black male athlete would look like in drag? Stick his head on a Williams sister!
Now they could just be gifted female athletes with very male physiques... they could have been fed steroids with their Cheerios throughout puberty... or maybe they're XXX'ers.
 
lisavegas420
lisavegas420 9 years ago

Can someone explain to me why Serena is still a JW and
Jacob and Joshua Miller of Nemesis get df'd? http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/6/126086/1.ashx

WTH...are there different degrees of improper conduct?
lisa
 

«
 1
 2
 3
 »
5
10
20




Share this topic



Topic Summary
serena soaks up the pressure
people are used to seeing us all serious on court.".
i love wimbledon.



Related Topics
AndersonsInfo
Trey Bundy: One Year of Reporting JW Child Abuse - Your comments please!
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
AndersonsInfo
Brownstoner: How the Jehovah’s Witnesses Acquired Some of Brooklyn’s Most Insanely Valuable Properties
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
Saintbertholdt
Transcription of interview with Rabbi Michael Berenbaum regarding German JW's in the concentration camps
by Saintbertholdt 8 months ago
Esse quam videri
Google.ca search bar 'royal commission'
by Esse quam videri 7 months ago
Tenacious
Has anyone noticed how in the October JW Broadcast, Losch encourages good works towards ALL people?
by Tenacious 5 months ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/91073/serena-soaks-up-pressure-fame-jw?page=3&size=20





Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ Serena and Teresa--JWs with different goals
/  





 

Serena and Teresa--JWs with different goals
by blondie 13 years ago 9 Replies latest 13 years ago   social current
5
10
20
blondie
blondie 13 years ago


Recently, there was a brief mention of the death of Teresa Graves who left a promising career in entertainment to become a JW.
What about today? Would she have made the same decision based on Serena Williams' career goals?
http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?click_id=4&art_id=qw1036048322262S163&set_id=6
Serena to star on the small screen

October 31 2002 at 09:54AM

Los Angeles - Serena Williams has gone Hollywood with a guest spot on Wednesday night as a kindergarten teacher on ABC's "My Wife and Kids."
"I've never considered tennis as my only outlet," the world's top-ranked player said, adding she performed as a child in plays written by sister Venus.
"I've always liked doing different things when I was younger. I just never really liked focusing on tennis. I do see myself as a crossover."
Serena and Venus have won four Grand Slam titles apiece, and Serena has won the past three majors.
But Serena also has been working with acting coaches, and signed with agent Jill Smoller at the William Morris Agency, which also represents "My Wife and Kids" star Damon Wayans.
"I've had lots of (acting) opportunities. It's just that other career that I have - that other small career - that's putting a hindrance on my acting," the 21-year-old Williams said with a smile.
She is competing in the WTA Championships, which start next week in Los Angeles. - Sapa-AP
TERESA GRAVES
Actor dies in fire
Actor Teresa Graves, who appeared regularly on Rowan and Martin's Laugh-In and went on to star in her own television series, Get Christy Love!, died early Thursday after a fire swept through the back of her home in the Hyde Park district of Los Angeles, fire officials said.
Ms. Graves, 54, was found unconscious in a bedroom where the fire apparently broke out. Doctors at Daniel Freeman Hospital in Inglewood were unable to revive her.
Fire investigators said the blaze, which broke out about 12:30 a.m., was apparently caused by a faulty space heater in the bedroom, which had been added by enclosing a porch on the house.
A smoke detector in the front of the house apparently went off but failed to awaken the actor, officials said.
Hollywood publications indicate that she abandoned her acting career in 1983 to concentrate on her involvement with the Jehovah's Witnesses.
Officials say she leaves her mother, who had lived with her but was hospitalized recently after a stroke.

Edited by - Blondie on 31 October 2002 8:11:4
 
teenyuck
teenyuck 13 years ago


All I can say is that my husband saw a trailer for the TV show and asked if she really were a man in drag.....he also mentioned how "large" she was for a tennis player.
He made the catty comments, on his own, without any prompting from me. My response was she was a JW; who cares?
I love the comment:
I've had lots of (acting) opportunities. It's just that other career that I have - that other small career - that's putting a hindrance on my acting," the 21-year-old Williams said with a smile.
So has Tiger Woods....she needs to try to keep some dignity and concentrate on what she does well. Why screw up your tennis career when you are not even at your peak?
BTW, I did not watch the show last night. I watched Bernie Mac....He is funny!! I love that show and Cedric the Entertainer afterwards.
Knowing that the Damon bros were brought up in a JW household; I just cannot look at him anymore without a WTS logo above his head.
 
blondie
blondie 13 years ago


I want to watch Bernie Mac, but I have so many shows on that night and only 1 VCR. I'm hoping I can see it later when reruns start in the spring.
I watch the Wayans knowing that they may have had to go because of their dad, but it hasn't carried over into the adult life. We can pick our friends but not our family.
Blondie
 
Shakita
Shakita 13 years ago


Are the Williams' sisters really JW's?
I know that it has been said before, I even watched the tennis match where one of them thanked Jehovah for her win.(or the strength to win, whatever)
If they were/are JW's, they wouldn't be able to be who they are now. No REAL JW parents would allow their kids to devote all their spare time to a game that brings them no "spiritual gain." "My goal is to auxiliary pioneer this month!", "My goal is to pioneer this month!", ..............."My goal is to win the Wimbelton this month!" I DON'T THINK SO! See what this kind of thinking brought Michael Jackson$$$$$$$$
 
blondie
blondie 13 years ago


Shakita, they may be unbaptized JWs. But Venus and Serena have identified themselves as JWs. What their definition of that is, is questionable. They attend a congregation down in the Palm Beach Florida area with their mother.
It would be interesting to contact their congregation elders and ask what the scoop is?
 
Shakita
Shakita 13 years ago


Oh....That's interesting. A congregation in Florida. Betcha that congregation doesn't ever need a "special needs" talk on meetinng the congregation's $$$ needs.
With the bucks they make, and if they are truly "cheerful givers" then that must be one happy congregation accounts servant they have there!!!!!!
 
blondie
blondie 13 years ago


Shakita, actually the Palm Beach is quite a wealthy area in general so most JWs living in that area would have a few bucks.
Blondie
 
TR
TR 13 years ago


Los Angeles - Serena Williams has gone Hollywood with a guest spot on Wednesday night as a kindergarten teacher on ABC's "My Wife and Kids."
I watched that episode last night. Funny! So, if Daman Wayans is a former 'hovah himself, can't Serena be DF'd for associating with him? Or, is this under the venue of "work" responsibilities and not association?
TR
 
LB
LB 13 years ago

Good thought TR. But like you reasoned, it's work related so approved. Plus if Serena is just an unbaptized publisher as has been mentioned in other threads they couldn't and wouldn't do much anyway.
 
Mum
Mum 13 years ago

Excuse me, but aren't the Wayans brothers "apostates"? Sweet little Serena has sold her soul to Satan (or is she merely "flirting" with Satan?) by appearing on an "apostate's" TV series?
 

5
10
20




Share this topic






Related Topics
AndersonsInfo
Trey Bundy: One Year of Reporting JW Child Abuse - Your comments please!
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
Esse quam videri
Google.ca search bar 'royal commission'
by Esse quam videri 7 months ago
AndersonsInfo
Brownstoner: How the Jehovah’s Witnesses Acquired Some of Brooklyn’s Most Insanely Valuable Properties
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
Tenacious
Has anyone noticed how in the October JW Broadcast, Losch encourages good works towards ALL people?
by Tenacious 5 months ago
Island Man
Massive Bible contradiction of the Draw Close to Jehovah book. Or Jehovah is not loving.
by Island Man 5 months ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/39680/serena-teresa-jws-different-goals





Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ Serena thanks "Jehovah" after US Open...
/  





 

Serena thanks "Jehovah" after US Open...
by jack2 14 years ago 34 Replies latest 13 years ago   jw friends
«
 1
 2
 »
 5
10
20
jack2
jack2 14 years ago


Serena Williams, after winning the US Open women's tennis championship tonight, thanked "Jehovah" for blessing her family. In the background were numerous US flags, and of course, prior to the match, the Williams sisters were there and standing while various patriotic songs were played (oh, that's right....they were already standing since they had to walk out onto the court....guess that's okay).
While watching all that I could not help but think of all the JW youths who have been told that they could not particicpate in organized sports at school or otherwise. I just wonder what they, and their parents, might be thinking as they watch the Williams girls attain to the highest level of participation and success in the sport of tennis - and that is what bothers me when I watch these sisters compete. I think it's fine that they do so and that they are achieving great success (and making some nice $$$, $450,000 for Venus, $900,000 for Serena) but I am always bothered by the thought of all those Witness youths who never had a chance to do the same.
 
dsgal
dsgal 14 years ago

Maybe if other youths were making some nice $$$ to donate to the Society,they could participate too.
 
kenpodragon
kenpodragon 14 years ago

JW's are not the only one's that use that name.
 
Mimilly
Mimilly 14 years ago


Yes - how interesting it is that their family is 'blessed' for doing exactly what the borg prohibits and many would be marked for. Just goes to prove that the borg will bend its rules for anyone with status and money.
Mimilly
 
Kaethra
Kaethra 14 years ago


Yeah...that makes me want to barf!
Should I thank "Jehovah" that I turned down full scholarships to university in order to take a one-year dental assisting course so that I could support my pioneer ass? And should I thank "Jehovah" that I was STILL looked down upon by the congregation and made to feel guilty at every turn for the horrible SIN of pursuing "post-secondary" education?
<gag> <hack> <puke>
Still, I see the Serena thing as on par with other fundie Xtians. I absolutely HATE it when rap/soul artists get on stage and thank JESUS for blessing them. Give me a fucking break! If Jesus exists, shouldn't he be a bit more concerned with all of the babies dying in Africa, China, and elsewhere rather than whether or not Boyz to Men have a number one hit?
ecchhhh!
 
plmkrzy
plmkrzy 14 years ago


A lot of it does also depend on the parents. I was always taught by my parents (3 generations of jws here not just newbies) to never show blantant disrespect for the flag. It is sacred to our country. No one can deny that.
A flag is incapable of being evil. It is an inatament object that represents who we are. SO we ALWAYS stood during flag salute at any event we went to that saluted the flag as part of the program and there are quite a few.
We never saluted it. But showed respect.
I know there were parents even during that time that would not even stand during the flag salute and that is being disrespectful and not necessary.
It's also drawing major attention to your self which is somathing not condoned in the Bible.
More and more JWs started refusing to even stand but there are still some from the old school who aren't that ignorant.
Standing is not a Dfping offense or at least it wasn't. It was a matter of ones concience and if the WT could plant enough inuendo to make someone feel guilty for standing up then it's nothing less then really really sad.
 
StinkyPantz
StinkyPantz 14 years ago


I absolutely HATE it when rap/soul artists get on stage and thank JESUS for blessing them.
I just had to insert that "rap/soul" artists are not the only ones to thank Jesus, so do country music and most any musical artists.
And kenpo-
I missed your point. You do realize that Serena and Venus were raised JW's don't you?
 
teejay
teejay 14 years ago


She said *what*?
I missed it. Must-a been distracted by what she had on!
 
jack2
jack2 14 years ago


Thanks Stinky - yes, the Williams sisters were indeed raised as JWs.
My point was not to condemn the Williams girls for standing or being there, but rather the fact that so many other JW kids will never even have that chance. I was a bit sarcastic in the first paragraph of my post - but the again, these sisters once posed in Sports Illustrated with a US flag draped across their bodies. Is that wrong? Technically, no, but it sure looked odd for people who profess to serve "Jehovah". And I can't help but think that there are many JWs out there who would receive strong "counsel" against doing exactly what the Williams girls do or have done in the past.
Kaethra - what you mentioned about being looked down upon for pursuing "post-secondary" education is very sad.
lol@teejay.....I guess you were too busy staring at her skin-tight shorts.
Edited by - jack2 on 8 September 2002 0:24:59
 
Kaethra
Kaethra 14 years ago


SP -
You're right, of course. It is not only soul/rap artists who thank Jesus. But, in my experience with award shows, which is admittedly and thankfully limited, I've yet to see a rock/alternative band get on stage and thank Jesus for their grammy or AMA or whatever.
I feel sure that you are correct in saying that many country artists also thank Jesus. Not being a huge fan of that musical genre however, I have not seen many award shows dedicated to that particular type of music.
 
deddaisy
deddaisy 14 years ago

I don't know these girls and truly have nothing against them, but I'm with Kaethra on this one. Maybe not intended, but I find it nothing short of arrogant when someone in the limelight that is hurting for nothing, thanks God for blessing them......It's like, yea right, God is soooooo preoccupied with their life, career, family, that he has blessed them and to hell with starving people, dying people, babies that end up in garbage cans.......
 
kenpodragon
kenpodragon 14 years ago


StinkyPantz
How sad for them. No I did not know that ... I knew there was a reason I hated Tennis and never followed the news. Do you have any references to this, as I have never heard that before now.
This is what I found ...
Venus and Serena Williams as Jehovah's Witnesses
SYDNEY -- "Unstoppable Venus Williams laughed off the suggestion she had nothing left to achieve in tennis after adding an Olympic gold medal to her growing list of triumphs." [NBC Olympics.com]
The fact that Venus (and her sister Serena) are both active Jehovah's Witnesses participating in the Olympics has provoked an interesting reaction from the organization. None at all. So while many Witnesses cheer for Venus, they know deep in their hearts that they would be subject to judicial procedures for much lesser offenses. And when Venus stood on the podium to receive the gold medal to the tune of the American national anthem, she became a different kind of pioneer than to which we are accustomed.
 A usual matter of contention among Witnesses is whether the Williams sisters are actually Jehovah's Witnesses or not. Their mother certainly is one of us, and has been for years. The father certainly is not. (He often takes cigarrette breaks during the sister's matches.)


It's Serena warrior princess
 By Patrick Miles, Wimbledon
 July 08, 2002
AS a sporting spectacle, it was not of the highest order; as a psycho-drama, it was riveting. At least it was a vast improvement on the last time the Williams sisters met, in the final of the French Open last month.
This time, there was much more to admire on an athletic level and less of which to despair, as far as skills and execution were concerned.
Serena, who beat older sister Venus 7-6 (7-4) 6-3 for her third Grand Slam title and her first at Wimbledon, displayed more power and more powerful emotions on court.
Venus, hampered by a strain in her right arm, played with an expression of stone and the body language of someone who does not want to lord it over her younger sister Venus, 22, was aiming for a Wimbledon hat-trick on Saturday night, while Serena, 20, was trying for her first on the sacred grass court.
Right from the start of the fortnight, it seemed that Serena had the greater desire to win the title no matter who she met in the final.
Just as she had been at Roland Garros, the older sibling appeared subdued, to the extent that her normal weapons the serve and the backhand were lacking their usual penetration.
Venus, who afterwards played down the pain in her arm, hit one ace, two service winners and six double faults. Even though her first-serving percentage was 70, it had little effect on Serena.
The count of unforced errors, so high in Paris, was down to 25 for Venus and 22 for Serena from a total of 133 points.
However they match up against each other, there is a conviction that the sisters will dominate for years to come.
Of all the leading players, possibly only Lindsay Davenport, who was unable to play at Wimbledon due to injury, can challenge the Williams duopoly.
It is to be hoped that Davenport will make her presence felt again by the time the US Open starts on August 26.
Nine-time Wimbledon champion Martina Navratilova has warned that Serena's triumph represents the start of what could be a decade of Grand Slam domination by the American sister act.
"I think if they both stay committed they can do this for another 10 years, easy," Navratilova said.
"Right now they are dominating and they have been doing it all year. Lindsay Davenport matches up with power but not the speed, and Martina Hingis needs to get a better serve she is losing too many points on her second serve."
Serena, who will be officially installed today as world No. 1 when the new computer rankings are released, and Venus are likely to be seeded to meet again in the final at Flushing Meadows, where the former won her first Grand Slam title in 1999 and Venus is reigning back-to-back champion.
"I can't become satisfied," Serena said, "because if I get satisfied, I'll be like: 'Oh, I've won Wimbledon, I've won the US Open, now I can relax'. But now people are really going to be fighting to beat me.
"In the beginning of the year, I said: 'I don't care what happens this year, I want to win Wimbledon' and it was an extra bonus for me to win the French.
"Sure, I really wanted to win the French . . . I just couldn't even believe I won. But I just wanted Wimbledon. I wanted to become a member of so much prestige, so much history. I want to be a part of history."
That much is taken care of: the extraordinary phenomenon of two sisters becoming the two best players in the world.
The crowd for the final, though fully appreciative, was muted compared with other such occasions on centre court. No one knew quite who to support.
But there were many glad to witness Serena's win, after which she thanked Jehovah, as well as her support team.
"If you don't believe in God, it's going to be tough to live life because pretty much that's the basis of life it comes from God," Serena said.
"So being a Jehovah's Witness, obviously we believe in God and the Bible. Without Him, I wouldn't be here right now; I really thank him for everything."
Famous Jehovah's Witnesses
◦Venus and Serena Williams - world chamption/Olympic gold medalist tennis players
◦Michael Jackson - singer, pop superstar
◦Prince - singer; convert to JWs
◦Janet Jackson - singer
◦La Toya Jackson - singer
◦Jackson Five - musical group
◦Selena - Tejano singer (Selena Quintanilla)
◦Larry Graham - singer; member of Sly And The Family Stone between 1967 and 1972, founder of Graham Central Station
◦David Thomas - songwriter/vocalist for Pere Ubu; convert to JWs
◦Herman Pizzanelli - leading Uruguayan concert guitarist in the 1960's; convert to JWs
◦Lou Whitaker - professional basketball player (Detroit Tigers)
◦Evelyn Mandela - first wife of South African president Nelson Mandela; a convert to JWs
◦Lieby Piliso - Nelson Mandela's younger sister
◦Rene Montes de Oca Martija -- dissident human-rights activist in Cuba (son of JW)
◦Wayans Brothers - comedians, actors, filmmakers
◦Rustom Padilla - Filipino movie star
◦Carmina Villarroel - Filipino actress
◦Gloria Naylor - novelist, author of The Women of Brewster Place (1982, American Book Award)
◦Mickey Spillane - best-selling crime novelist; convert to JWs in 1952 (still active)
◦Carol Swain - political scientist; professor at Vanderbilt University; author of Black Faces, Black Interests and The New White Nationalism in America: Its Challenge to Integration
◦Viv Nicholson - famous London lottery winner in 1961. She then became a devout JW. The musical Spend, Spend, Spend was based on her story.
... first time I ever hear they were on here. Now I know ... but I am wondering. Were they baptized?
Take Care
Dragon
Edited by - kenpodragon on 8 September 2002 1:26:22
 
Farkel
Farkel 14 years ago


jack,
: I think it's fine that they do so and that they are achieving great success (and making some nice $$$, $450,000 for Venus, $900,000 for Serena) but I am always bothered by the thought of all those Witness youths who never had a chance to do the same.
Obviously, you are too stupid to understand that this is all "Bible-Based(tm)."
Shame on you.
Farkel
 
HarshlyTaken
HarshlyTaken 14 years ago

I love that cat suit....She has a great ass. Would love to bang both sisters in the back of hall..and there mom too..
 
plmkrzy
plmkrzy 14 years ago


... first time I ever hear they were on here. Now I know ... but I am wondering. Were they baptized?
Why would you even give a rats ass one way or another?
Pretend they were not, then what does the mother have to shun them?
Like Ive said many times before. I was born and raised a JW and never shuned anyone even when told to do so.
If know one likes it then tough sh**
 
Guest 77
Guest 77 14 years ago


Jack2, I've played competitive golf for forty years, eleven of those years as a professional. I never once had any problems from the friends. If anything, they sought golf tips.
Guest 77
 
gumby
gumby 14 years ago


Quote: If Jesus exists, shouldn't he be a bit more concerned with all of the babies dying in Africa, China, and elsewhere rather than whether or not Boyz to Men have a number one hit?
Good point! also....What determines which player Jesus chooses to pick as winner? Didn't the loser pray also to God, before they lost? Boxers are also famous for this. After beating the hell out of the other guy....they thank Jesus for the victory......truely horse shit.
Does anyone know the STANDING in the congregation of the two sisters? Have they been reproved as was Jackson for the thriller skit? Perhaps their playing is not condoned by others. Playing sports is not a judicial action event.
I've never known one who had a POSITION in the cong. who played active sports
Edited by - Gumby on 8 September 2002 9:52:28
 
Sentinel
Sentinel 14 years ago


Simply using the name "Jehovah" does not necessarily mark these girls as JW's. There are many groups who feel that this is god's name, but they use it sparingly.
Has there been a press interview or other information that would prove they are JW's? Otherwise, without substantiation, perhaps it would be prudent not to make any snap judgements on people and their religious affiliation.
Point in case" I say "Jehovah" on ocassion during conversation, and I am definitely no longer a JW. Anyone that heard me might "think" otherwise. It would be their misinterpretation of the facts.
Sentinel/Karen
Edited by - Sentinel on 8 September 2002 10:23:16
 
OrbitingTheSun
OrbitingTheSun 14 years ago


Whether or not Venus and Serena are in good standing, I think we should be happy for them. They are very talented young women and have remained true to their dreams. I know that "Jehovah" has much better things to do than follow tennis and "bless" certain players with success, but if they want to give Him the credit...let them.
By criticizing Venus and Serena and their actions, we are no better than JWs...who make sport of gossiping about other people' lives (because they have no lives of their own). Being ex-JWs and, for the most part, open minded I think we should be proud of anyone who refuses to let the WTBTS dictate what they do with their lives (active or inactive).
Edited by - OrbitingTheSun on 8 September 2002 10:28:58
 
Sentinel
Sentinel 14 years ago


Ooops,
Well, had I waited just a bit longer, someone would have supplied me with the FACTS. Seems that these two girls are "active" JW's. Thanks for the info...
That leads me to wonder how in the world they managed to do what they did without being disfellowshipped???
Karen
 

«
 1
 2
 »
 5
10
20




Share this topic






Related Topics
AndersonsInfo
Brownstoner: How the Jehovah’s Witnesses Acquired Some of Brooklyn’s Most Insanely Valuable Properties
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
The Searcher
Missionary Deceptively/Mistakenly Misquotes Scripture.........
by The Searcher 6 months ago
The Searcher
A First Stepping-Stone For Bethelites & Lurkers?
by The Searcher 5 months ago
AndersonsInfo
Trey Bundy: One Year of Reporting JW Child Abuse - Your comments please!
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
The Hermit
The Hermit's story PART 1
by The Hermit 2 months ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/36224/serena-thanks-jehovah-after-us-open





Got it!
We use cookies to personalize content & ads, provide features and analyze traffic. We share data about site usage with social media, ad & analytics partners. More info





 src
Latest

Topics

Users
 
 


Welcome Visitor!
Sign up Sign in
Home
/ Topics
/ Serena thanks "Jehovah" after US Open...
/  





 

Serena thanks "Jehovah" after US Open...
by jack2 14 years ago 34 Replies latest 13 years ago   jw friends
«
 1
 2
 »
5
10
20
Big Tex
Big Tex 14 years ago

The only way you can participate in competive sports is if you become successful and contribute a great deal of money and positive publicity to the Witnesses. The same thing applies to the entertainment field (singer, actor, etc.). It's pandering at its best.
 
AuntieJane
AuntieJane 14 years ago

Not having been a JW, I am amazed at the strange, stringent rules they follow. Did any of you have to quit competitive sports due to the org? If so, what sports and how old were you?
 
minimus
minimus 14 years ago

EVERYBODY says they are JW's. Does anyone know which congregation they go to? EVERYONE said last year PRINCE was a JW. He was NOT a baptized JW....Even if the Williams sisters say they are, are they baptized? If nobody can verify which KH they go to I am not convinced.
 
kenpodragon
kenpodragon 14 years ago


plmkrzy
I want to know, so I can shun them. LOL No really, I was wondering as many times the news calls people JW that just have relatives that attend, or they go occasionally. I would like to know which one is the case here, as they do call them JW's and from what I remember in the organization ... you are not really a JW until you are officially baptized.
Take Care
Dragon
 
mrs rocky2
mrs rocky2 14 years ago


My youngest played tennis all four years of high school. She was not baptized, but had not made 'worldly' kids her best friends, was a pillar in the congregation as far as meeting participation, comments, fields service, conduct. She was shunned/avoided by the kids in the hall. Fortunately for her we stopped going to meetings after her first year in tennis - didn't seem to make a difference if we were there or not. She has been shunned in and out of the Organization. So when I see the Williams sisters in the limelight focusing on their religion it really bothers me. I know the Dubs are falling all over themselves because these girls publicly acknowledge their association with the Witnesses but someone like my daughter was less than a speck of dirt on the carpet. Just my two cents.....
Mrs R
 
Guest 77
Guest 77 14 years ago


I'm with you Orbitingthesun. Competitive sports is a different mind set.

Guest 77
 
mrs rocky2
mrs rocky2 14 years ago


to Orbiting and Guest - you do have a point about the 'not judging' stuff. But in the real world my kid has suffered because of the inconsistent application of guidelines and rules. I don't wish the Williams sisters any harm, and it's great they can make money doing something they like, wish we could all make that kind of money doing what we like. It's just that I have to deal with the real world emotional scarsleft on my daughter. It's hard to explain double standards to a teenager, especially when they are battling loneliness and trying to develop some social skills they didn't have to have in the Borg.
Mrs R
 
Quincy
Quincy 14 years ago

I dont think they are JW's???
 
gumby
gumby 14 years ago


The point is this folks.
The Organisation of Jehovahs Witnesses does not honor these actions. The point is....are they allowed to do these things while others are not?
A school brochure is to be used by a parent as guidelines as to what activities a child will or will not be participating published by the WTBTS.....remember?
In it it says...."Children will not be participating in after school activities such as, sports and various clubs......remember?
To hold the american flag up is a big no no....remember
Sports puts you in with needless bad association, and causes a competative spirit.....remember?
All of you who are saying nothing more than we should be glad for the girls is true.......but the point of the thread is.......about the double standards of the borg. Many others have been ostracized for less than this. Many of you haven't been around long enough to know.
 
Yerusalyim
Yerusalyim 14 years ago


As I understand it, neither girl is baptized and Dad isn't either.

I had NO IDEA Selena was a JW
 
teejay
teejay 14 years ago


... in my experience with award shows, which is admittedly and thankfully limited, I've yet
to see a rock/alternative band get on stage and thank Jesus for their grammy or AMA or
whatever. -- Kaethra
That's because rock/alternative bands are all made up of
pagans who are going straight to hell when they die.


 
kenpodragon
kenpodragon 14 years ago


Yerusalyim
I think the only reason I knew Selena was (although she was not baptized) was because I had friends in the Spanish Congregation in our area and they liked her music.
Dragon
 
Yerusalyim
Yerusalyim 14 years ago


Kenpo,

I just find it amazing that as much as my wife likes Selena she didn't mention it. My wife's cousin is Mark Anthony by the way (ooooo, nearness to fame, ahhhhhh!)
 
OrbitingTheSun
OrbitingTheSun 14 years ago


I, too, despise double standards. But I havent heard anything about the WTBTS honoring the Williams sisters or giving them preferential treatment. The only reason the girls are "allowed" to play tennis competitively is because they dont care what the WTBTS thinks. They do what they want to, and I bet their congregation talks trash about them behind their backs (the same way they talked/talk about all of us). Simply because Serena thanked Jehovah doesnt mean she has the Jehovahs Witnesses favor. She may have made that public statement to regain their favor for all we know.
I guess what Im trying to say isI am truly sympathetic to all of you who have been hurt by the double standards of the WTBTS, but I dont think Venus or Serena have done anything wrong by playing tennis and making their own decisions.
 
jack2
jack2 13 years ago


Gumby and Mrs Rocky summed up the point I was making exactly.
No, the Williams girls are not doing anything wrong.
Yes, there is a double-standard that exists, and yes, youth who choose sports and many other organized activities are, as Gumby points out, not acting in line with the WTS's "guidelines". Just check the "School" brochure, as he suggests. And that brochure has not been superceded by the "Education" brochure. I had a service meeting part on that subject not long ago. It was the "School" brochure that was used to make points about the need to avoid such activities.
 

«
 1
 2
 »
5
10
20




Share this topic



Topic Summary
serena williams, after winning the us open women's tennis championship tonight, thanked "jehovah" for blessing her family.
in the background were numerous us flags, and of course, prior to the match, the williams sisters were there and standing while various patriotic songs were played (oh, that's right....they were already standing since they had to walk out onto the court....guess that's okay).
while watching all that i could not help but think of all the jw youths who have been told that they could not particicpate in organized sports at school or otherwise.



Related Topics
AndersonsInfo
Brownstoner: How the Jehovah’s Witnesses Acquired Some of Brooklyn’s Most Insanely Valuable Properties
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
The Searcher
Missionary Deceptively/Mistakenly Misquotes Scripture.........
by The Searcher 6 months ago
The Searcher
A First Stepping-Stone For Bethelites & Lurkers?
by The Searcher 5 months ago
AndersonsInfo
Trey Bundy: One Year of Reporting JW Child Abuse - Your comments please!
by AndersonsInfo a month ago
The Hermit
The Hermit's story PART 1
by The Hermit 2 months ago



Community Guidelines

Posting Rules

Terms of Service

Privacy Policy

DMCA

Copyright © 2001-2015 Jehovah's Witness Discussion Forum | JW.Org Community Information.
 


http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/36224/serena-thanks-jehovah-after-us-open?page=2&size=20