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Memorial mixed emotions...
by Tornintwo 4 days ago 35 Replies latest 15 hours ago   jw friends
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Tornintwo
Tornintwo 4 days ago

Does anyone else feel 'pulled back in' at this time of year?
i still consider myself to a believer, believe in God and Jesus Christ, on the whole I think he taught tolerance, love, acceptance and I think we can benefit from following his example. I love Ray Franzs book In search of Christian freedom. So I sort of have to respect Jws for trying to bring peoples attention to his sacrifice at this time of year and I am toying with the idea of attending. For a few reasons, mainly because I want to acknowledge his sacrifice and don't know how or where else to do it and I want to test how I feel about things after 6 months since my last meeting.
BUT, I've no intention of going back, I disagree strongly with so much now, their superiority complex, believing everyone else will die and planning shamelessly to move into the slaughtered ones homes, the blood issue, cover up of child abuse, the entire judicial process, the hierarchy, GB worship, stupid stance on birthdays, judgementalism, cliques......
so why am I feeling this way? Is it just an emotional response to 25 years of indoctrination? Am I crazy to even consider opening myself up to their judgement or worse, their efforts to make me return!?! Anyone else feeling like this..?
 +4 / -0
prologos
prologos 4 days ago
No, Understanding now, how untenable the whole subject is, not only the idea that only the anointed partake, but even the need for a ransom, . so, what is left? a symbol in the form of bread and wine of belonging to the brotherhood ? like communion? like privately partaking just in case they could be right? The only satisfaction would be to raise a glass as you wait for the eclipse lineup to give a good light show.
 +2 / -0
smiddy
smiddy 4 days ago

I read your Bio Tornintwo , you don`t think the big guy in the sky would kill more than 99.0% of humans ? at the big " A" ?
Presuming you believe in the Bible , didn`t GOD kill off all of humankind ?, and not only all humans but animals as well in the flood of Noah`s day ?
Why did he kill off all the land animals along with humans in the flood .Some estimates millions of people ?Man Woman and Child.? After 2000 years of procreation
Why then didn`t he kill off all marine life in the oceans when he brought on the flood .?
He kills off everything on land including animals and birds along with humans , yet he does not destroy marine life , WHY NOT ?
If the whole world and land was covered in water ,shouldn`t the underground waters under land masses of continents , the lakes and streams that flow underground be salty ? like the sea water ?
How is it they are crystal clear fresh water ?
The sea`s are salty water , the underground rivers and lakes under land masses are freshwater crystal clear. water.
smiddy
 +5 / -0
Sabin
Sabin 4 days ago

Tornin2, i believe in the bible & God & Jesus also, this will will be the 2nd year i haven't attended & i don't want to. I don't owe an explanation to them or anyone else for my choice or what i believe. I know myself well enough now to know that if one of them spoke to me i would not be able to hold my tongue about the child abuse & of course in true JW fashion & ignorance they would blame the victims not the borg. The thing is they have so indoctrinated us that there is still apart of our mind/heart that makes us condem ourselves as if we are in some way at fault, so we cling to hope. Hope that it isn't as bad as we come to believe. The truth is, it is that bad. It is a CULT, a cult that is making you feel that you have to remember Jesus at the KH, yet there is no such scripture that says so. There are many religions that remember the Christ at this time of year, what do the JW's say about them? Do they make a positive gesture towards such ones in praise of Jesus (isn't it good Jesus that so many think of your wonderful gift at this time of year) No they just put such ones down, they don't attend at the KH so it doesn't count with God. Dont be fooled into thinking they give a shit about you. Yes they will all be friendly because that is exactly from the platform what they have been told to do. The next day you will be the subject of gossip. As for me i will sit at home read through those scriptures & remember Jesus humanity towards those less fortunate while JW's are counting how many were in attendance cause that is what matters to them most. What ever you do, do it because YOU want to.
 +8 / -0
Tornintwo
Tornintwo 4 days ago

Sabin, that's what I needed to hear thank you.
Smiddy, yes, I am one of those people who like to believe JC and the NT, the nice bits of the Bible and ignore the inconvenient parts of the OT. I accept entirely it may well be illogical and easy to criticise, but I can't shake belief in something/someone, a higher being that at least started the process of creation/evolution, a great scientist if you like. I also think it is entirely feasible that some of the scriptures are the product of man's desire to control but that there is some elements of truth in them also, and the fact that the entire Western calendar is based on Jesus birth tells me there was something special about him. Maybe one day I'll be strong enough to examine with logic my entire belief system, and perhaps it will come crashing down, for now I'm not ready for that and my faith brings me some comfort.
 +5 / -0
atomant
atomant 4 days ago
Tornintwo the longer you stay away the better off you will be mentally,You wont get your head straight with a foot in the door.l stopped going to the memorial a few years back.lve been to about 50 memorials and realized l only went to appease dad when he was alive.l never was baptized and most likely never will be.Having made the break lve been able to step back and evaluate the entirety of it all.Theres absolutely no point attending when you are having serious doubts.Those doubts will not go away and will always be with you.

 +5 / -0
atomant
atomant 4 days ago
Another reason l dont attend among many other reasons is the strong waft of wine.Being an alcoholic in remission for 10 years l do not appreciate the strong smell permeating as it passes by.l avoid alcohol like the plague and any reminder of it doesnt help.

 +11 / -0
Xanthippe
Xanthippe 4 days ago

Is it just an emotional response to 25 years of indoctrination? Am I crazy to even consider opening myself up to their judgement or worse, their efforts to make me return!?
Umm I think you know the answer to these questions.
 I love this time of year when spring is about to break. Personally I feel more of a connection to pre-Christianity and all their fertility festivals. I am longing for trees to bud and the sky to turn blue instead of this endless grey. For that first smell of things starting to grow when I go out into my garden.
 It has always been a special time of year since ancient times. A time to celebrate, we survived the winter. Our animals are giving birth safely. Food will be more plentiful now. Life will be easier for a while. I feel that connection to those that went before.
 +2 / -0
stuckinarut2
stuckinarut2 4 days ago

Ask yourself if you are feeling this way out of FOG.
Fear, Obligation, Guilt.
Is it because others expect you to attend? Or is it a sincere reason?
 +3 / -0
Ucantnome
Ucantnome 4 days ago

Does anyone else feel 'pulled back in' at this time of year?
no I always felt after I left that the memorial was the only meeting I couldn't attend
 +2 / -0

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Memorial mixed emotions...
by Tornintwo 4 days ago 35 Replies latest 15 hours ago   jw friends
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Alive!
Alive! 4 days ago

I feel somewhat ambivalent to the memorial time this year - because everyday is his memorial.
I won't sit in a KH, to be head counted.
I won't listen to a convoluted interpretation and discussion of scriptures,
Something extraordinary happened when Christ reached into our physical unverse and dimension.....it was a game changer.
Celebrate him in your heart.
 +5 / -0
Sabin
Sabin 4 days ago

Atomant, your an alcoholic in remission, well done you, that takes serious courage. Big Hug for you.
 +5 / -0
cha ching
cha ching 4 days ago

Hi TorninTwo.... My husband felt like you the first year we left...He had to go... just to see..... He did not believe it to be the truth, but something, something, drew him.... I went with him, as an observer... Kind of interesting to watch as a 'nonbeliever'...
We went to a congregation that was not "ours" that we had helped build, so some people may have recognized us.... We entered "late"... as in just before the song..... We listened to the meaningless, repetitive talk, and watched the wine go by.... then the bread.... (or is it the other way round?)
 But, to sit there and listen and realize.... Jesus did not say you had to "go to a Kingdom Hall" to remember him", and that if you did "celebrate" (does the Bible say 'Celebrate" or is the WT just trying to make JWs feel like they get tot 'celebrate' something???) at home, with your family "you are not remembering him" and "only those going nto heaaven should partake"...... Jesus did not have all those caveats, did he?
Maybe you can just go down close to the K Hall, sit in your car, close enough to observe, and look at how everyone is dressed.... They are thinking about how their brand new "memorial" clothes look.... and perhaps, "whose house they will go to afterwards" for refreshments.
The "memorial of Christ's death'?
 +8 / -0
rebelfighter
rebelfighter  4 days ago

Tornintwo,
Never a JW, but walked away from religion at 50 for good. I had been a member of the same church since the age of 12 even married there. That was the year my life fell apart. I had 2 dependent kids and an abusive husband. On 6/1 I was diagnosed with cancer and butt head husband response was thanks for telling me and turned around walked away from me, never showed up at the hospital.
When I went to the pastor and said I was ill. and my husband just upped the abuse, his response was sorry your going through this. Never heard another word from any member of the church. I have never returned.
I believe very strongly in a Supreme Being which I call God and Jesus. After much research I now believe ALL religions are man made, if God had created Religion he would have created ONE. Think of all the wars that would have never have happened. The more I think about it the less I believe in the Bible, there are some good points in the Bible like living a good truthful life with high morals. Loving one another. Help one another.
The way I worship God is sitting in one of God's beautiful nature environments (prefer sunrise on the east coast) and listening to several hours of wonderful Gospel music which reflect the gifts that God has given very special people. This allows me a wonderful time to meditate on all the great things that I have in my life. God and I also take a little time to talk about some of these crazy people in my life too.
 +4 / -0
Alive!
Alive! 4 days ago

Just reading the above posts, regarding the bible - I was thinking of the scripture Hebrews 4:12
We choose what we want to hear from the 'bible' - one person will read and hear that many will burn in endless torment....and they is all they want to read from the scripture. It satisfies them.
Another will read and 'hear' that the one who is eternal Father of all things, rejects and destroys those who don't listen to 7 men in Brooklyn in our modern day....never mind the millions who pray to him and honour him in their lives.
Jesus made some observations regarding the Pharisees - he hated that they looked to keep the letter of the law and not seek the spirit of the law.
It's our journey, our search - keep searching he said, keep knocking.....
As witnesses, we learnt to read every biblical word with a view to wrenching out a meaning, letter by letter and word by word and we ended up with our man made religion of legalism, foolish conjecturing, mulling over the letter and muddling the 'spirit' of the word.
Seems to me, we are all on a journey, our own unique yet interdependent journey - and our place is reach out and hold another's hands, help our fellow up off the floor when he falls....
The life story of Jesus changed everything - whether we like it or not.
The story being that he dived into our dimension and brought us closer to something we have called 'glory' - that 'thing' humans have yearned for, completeness with the divine.
Whether he is a mere fabrication of the human heart's wishful thinking or truly our Lord - we don't need to sit inside Kingdom Hall to reach out to him, or think on him.






 +3 / -0
Alive!
Alive! 4 days ago

Hey, regarding my previous post - have had a heavy duty weekend emotionally re life and family and needed some restorative meditation time - and I wrote from 'that' meditative place - on retrospect it sounds a bit out of place.....
Anyway - take care everyone. If Christ/the divine has meaning to you, then that's all that matters between him and you.
 +1 / -0
just fine
just fine 4 days ago

Actually Alive I like your post it does give me something to ponder. I agree with you,in life it is our perception of things that shapes our beliefs. We can read the bible and all come away with something different.
to answer the original question - no nothing pulls me back to this religion. It is a false religion so there is no pull for me to go back to hateful people trying to control my life.
 +2 / -0
Tornintwo
Tornintwo 4 days ago

Thanks for all of your helpful responses.
Hey Alive, it's all good, found your post very interesting, actually.
I like that we all have different views and can share them respectfully, finding our own 'truth'.
I agree if God wanted us to believe and worship in a certain very specific way then he should have made it much, much clearer, as it is as clear as mud right now! The witnesses love to boast about they have the right interpretation, having researched honestly and logically scriptures in the bible to interpret other scriptures, then you just have to examine their generation teaching, or see them clinging to 1914-607 despite all evidence to the contrary, or the ridiculous Revelation book interpretations....(this trumpet blast corresponded to a convention in Ohio etc....) to see they haven't a clue and there are ulterior motives to promote their leadership.
I think I agree with those that have posted that to acknowledge the time of year from home, perhaps read the relevant scriptures, meditate, say thank you, should be enough. I think I was thinking attending might give me 'closure' but alternatively it might open up a can of worms.
 +3 / -0
MarkofCane
MarkofCane 4 days ago

I don't believe any of it, haven't contributed any funds for almost 3 yrs, haven't done service for over 3 years. When I go to a meeting it makes me physically sick to my stomach. I'm no longer comfortable in my old congregation I get a lot of weird stares like I'm the elusive yeti. I avoid the folks from my congregation, I've literally DF them from my life, I only see family still in. So why go?
Well they hold me hostage due to my family. If I don't go, my family will definitely find out. The elders will place me in a shepherding status to see whats happening. It will elevate more hostility from my family still in. I will create a lot of unneeded attention, so it easier to go and pretend. I just go and pretend it has meaning, that I might return, that i'm not an apostate. If they only knew? If they only knew how I really feel, that I participate on a internet forum that exposes all there lies, that I condemn their faith as complete bullshit. If they only knew? Would they want me there? What a tangled web we weave, indeed.
 +4 / -0
FayeDunaway
FayeDunaway 4 days ago

Torn, churches not only celebrate the resurrection (Easter) they also celebrate his death. Look up churches in your area online and see what they are doing this week. It could be Maundy Thursday or Good Friday or might have another name, but it will say. I can't express to you enough how much more meaningful these celebrations are than the witness memorial. The witness memorial seems like nothing compared to them. You don't have to just stay home, you can do this socially, and you can even partake for the first time if you go to a protestant church.
 

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Topic Summary
does anyone else feel 'pulled back in' at this time of year?.
i still consider myself to a believer, believe in god and jesus christ, on the whole i think he taught tolerance, love, acceptance and i think we can benefit from following his example.
i love ray franzs book in search of christian freedom.



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by new boy 3 months ago



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Memorial mixed emotions...
by Tornintwo 4 days ago 35 Replies latest 15 hours ago   jw friends
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FayeDunaway
FayeDunaway 4 days ago
Mark, your avatar particularly matches your post above.
 
MarkofCane
MarkofCane 4 days ago

Thanks Faye
The mask of truth!
 
blondie
blondie 3 days ago

Once I left I never went back to any meetings, even the memorial. They did not worship god, they made god into an entity to control others.
Ray Franz felt that you could not accurately worship God in a group especially one larger than a household. He and his wife and a few friends did so privately as part of their weekly worship. He felt as groups grew larger they twisted the original intent of Christ and his followers.
A Question of Conscience by Charles Davis
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Davis_(theologian)
Davis wrote about his departure in his autobiography, A Question of Conscience (1967). He criticised what he saw as the Church's abuse of authority, intellectual integrity and conscience and its teaching on celibacy. It was 'racked by fear, insecurity and anxiety with a consequent intolerance and lack of love'.
 +1 / -0
kaik
kaik 2 days ago

I get irritated by my family because they get hyped -up, and will try to inflict a guilt feeling that I was not there. I do not see a point why would anyone outside 144K to bother to go to memorial, even as JW. I remember back in the 1980's and 1990's that there were brothers and sisters, who had second memorial in the privacy and they partake because they thought that WT was excluding them from something that they should be part of it. Back then, I agreed with these people. Since I became involved with Judaism by association in marriage, I understand that memorial does not make a sense for Jewish faith. Jews (or at least the one I am married to) do not believe that anyone can redeem other person for his or her sins. Everyone is responsible for their own sins, and Jesus sacrifice just does not make sense and is not valid in their faith.
When it comes to Easter, I loved it. In many European countries, it is the second biggest holiday in the year after Xmas. In the Czech Republic it is an equivalent to Thanksgiving in overall atmosphere: entire families get together. The time of the year and the weather is always good to see relatives, because in winter, not everyone wants to travel, and in the summer, many people are vacationing. Easter associates with me one of the warmest memories, special food and baked cakes. JW memorial is far off from festivities that Easter is, and it is rather pitiful as the only holiday they celebrate.

 +8 / -0
Alive!
Alive! 2 days ago

I guess the concept of Jesus ( Whether he is an extraordinary and complex imaginary projection of our minds outside of our experience of our selves or not ) - calls for us to love and extol something higher than our daily experience.
I do believe ( actually 'believe' feels like weak word) but I think all this begs a question - what's going on with us organisms?
 
talesin
talesin 2 days ago

When I decided I was no longer going to meetings, that included the Memorial.
There are no mixed emotions for me. After years of being invited, I finally told my parents that "hell will freeze over before I set foot in a KH".
Why would anyone want to go to a place where they will be shunned? A place that is phony, abusive, and everything an ethical person would feel repulsed by?
xx
 +5 / -0
Khaleesi
Khaleesi 2 days ago
I'm debating to go to, i don't feel comfortable being part of a "black mass" & rejecting Jesus by not partaking!
 +2 / -0
kaik
kaik 2 days ago
I am still annoyed with conversation I had over the phone with the family last weekend. They just get too much excited but at the same time inflict guilt feeling that I am not there. They accept the WT dogma, and on memorial they just are observers instead of participants of the ritual. It never made sense to me even back then when I was in WT. I knew one elder (he is already DF) that he was partaking at home secretly with his family. JWs outside 144K are just observers, and do not really celebrates Jesus sacrifice.

 +2 / -0
Lostwun
Lostwun 2 days ago

think it through. you still got one more day to decide torn but don't feel pressured or guilted to do something if you really don't wanna. This one will be my first memorial that i miss and i've made my peace with it already. I'm tired of feeling like i need everyone's approval. I don't give a damn and i'm okay with that now.
At the end of the day, do what you feel is best but make sure its for you and what you want and not for anybody else or obligation.
Lost
 +6 / -0
Cheeto
Cheeto 2 days ago
Did anyone notice that the memorial is on Purim this year and not even near the Passover?
 

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Topic Summary
does anyone else feel 'pulled back in' at this time of year?.
i still consider myself to a believer, believe in god and jesus christ, on the whole i think he taught tolerance, love, acceptance and i think we can benefit from following his example.
i love ray franzs book in search of christian freedom.



Related Topics
blondie
If a year is really 365 1/4 days why 360 days to calculate 1914
by blondie 3 months ago
new boy
My Bethel Experience Part 13 "Love and Sex" at Bethel
by new boy 2 months ago
Terry
I COLLECT QUOTES. . . Here are some of my favorites
by Terry a day ago
Dogpatch
"How Awful This Place Can Be!" Life at Bethel by Keith Casarona
by Dogpatch 5 years ago
new boy
Chapter 1 My Bethel Experience First Posted 9 Years Ago A Walk Down Memory Lane
by new boy 3 months ago



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Memorial mixed emotions...
by Tornintwo 4 days ago 35 Replies latest 15 hours ago   jw friends
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darth frosty
darth frosty 2 days ago

No feeling of being pulled back but you must understand that JW's are programed to see this as a time to reach out to those inactive or who left.
I remember folks used to get excited oh my son/daughter doesn't go anymore BUT THEY WENT TO THE MEMORIAL?!?
Its sad really my wifes bat shit crazy aunt called and asked are we going to the memorial this year...HUH!!!
We haven't set foot in a hall since 2006 or 7 and she thinks we are going to the memorial?!?
Can you say delusional?
 +3 / -0
sowhatnow
sowhatnow 2 days ago

all i feel is stress, and condemnation. nothing positive.
my mom decided to rope me into a heated discussion again, she has nothing else to talk about after all shes 73.she starts reading the article to me from her tablet, and i asked her where a print article was, she got it and i proceeded to underline and ask her how any of the scriptures prove anything that is mentioned in the paragraphs.
i said you know if you look in the yearbook, the number of partakers is going up not down, and years ago they claimed that when all those remaining 8000 or so were dead Armageddon must be here.
so gee how many people are mentally unstable? lol is this their only explanation of why the number is going up?

i asked my mom all the time, show me the scripture to support the idea that people who think they are anointed but are not, would mistake that, since the holy spirit is supposed to make sure they do not doubt. and who judges those ones as to whether they are mistaken? lol.
and where do you get the idea that god can take away your gift he gave you of being anointed. you don't give a gift freely then make it conditional. were all imperfect people, and that's a wrong conclusion. nothing should be conditional based on imperfection.

that means then, the holy spirit or god of jesus, doesn't make himself clear. they would be telling a lie or holding back important information.

and what extra 'special' attributes do those who feel they are anointed have, from so many people other loyal good people on earth, that these particular people are chosen to be kings over everyone else?
so they have special exp in being a judge?

and where, oh where , does it say that women were ever anointed or are of the 144000? where does it say 144000 are even anointed? does it?
how can you take half a scripture and say its symbolic and claim the other half is real?

she cannot show me.

then i see in that magazine that stupid picture of flames over peoples heads, which is something that sets me off.
so i said, mom , lets read the whole account in Acts.

so i read it to her verse by verse, and asked her how the society came to the conclusion, other than wild imagination and speculation as assumption, that the approximately 120 men who were casting lots, [no holy spirit involved there, lol] who were to come together for the sole purpose of choosing a replacement for Judas, [so for some reason that number12 was maintained], has anything to do with the scene at the Pentecost, which is clearly identifying the persons involved as only the apostles, and only men, who received the holy spirits help, as they were told in acts chapter one verse 8. he wasn't talking to anyone else, no one else was there.
she simply refuses to see the obvious. three separate events, not one. she knows it she just doesn't know what to d about it.
she always always somehow brings up holidays and how everyone celebrates pagan holidays and that is how she knows she has the truth.

wow.
for her its all about attacking holidays.

I said, now why, if the society can change their mind about something, and I knew years ago that what they were thinking was wrong, why are they ok to be wrong but not me? why am I criticized but not them? why am i called names, but not them? why dd the holy spirit allow them to make such mistakes? if they are always learning and having new light, then why is ot not ok for me to have my own thoughts?
because by defending them, you in fact are worshiping those ones who print that info up, and preach it, and believe their ideas as infallible,
and I do not.

boy that pisses her off. lol
she hates it when I tell her she worships the governing body and their media empire.
somehow someway i have to keep myself sane.

 +3 / -0
flipper
flipper 2 days ago

I respect people who feel they might still believe in the Bible or have the need for believing in Jesus. I'm just not one of those people who need to believe in it because I feel I've already saved myself.
I'm the one who escaped from a mind control cult teaching fantasy and unrealities. With the help of sites like this one, reading books like Ray Franz's books and Steve Hassan's books and much access to information that helped me gain freedom of mind- I have no need of a savior. I saved myself by educating myself. Now these last almost 13 years or so I have a bright new perspective on life- without what I would consider superstitious beliefs. But if others feel they need it- that's up to them, it's freedom of choice in this world we live in. Peace out, Mr. Flipper
 +1 / -0
OnTheWayOut
OnTheWayOut 2 days ago


...I sort of have to respect Jws for trying to bring peoples attention to his sacrifice at this time of year and I am toying with the idea of attending. For a few reasons, mainly because I want to acknowledge his sacrifice and don't know how or where else to do it and I want to test how I feel about things after 6 months since my last meeting.
Do as you must. But know this- JW's do not respect anyone outside of JW's and the way they bring attention to "his sacrifice." They are not trying to bring attention to Jesus at this time of year, but rather to the Watchtower Cult and their way of observing such.


As for myself, I wouldn't want to open a can of worms and send a message that I might come back because I attend the Memorial. Besides my becoming an atheist (not the thread to debate that, but has to be mentioned in my reasoning), I would not want to be dragged into a judicial matter because the elders thought I was starting to "fellowship" again. If I felt the need to go, I would go somewhere that my elders are not attending.


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 +1 / -0
Doubtfully Yours
Doubtfully Yours 2 days ago

I like the Memorial. It is only 1 hr, everyone looks so pretty and in really good spirits, then we go out to eat and drink at some nice restaurant. Yeah, I enjoy the Memorial.
DY😀
 +1 / -0
Joliette
Joliette 15 hours ago
Yeah I couldnt agree with you more. Mixed emotions about the memorial, conventions, assemblies, etc.

 

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Topic Summary
does anyone else feel 'pulled back in' at this time of year?.
i still consider myself to a believer, believe in god and jesus christ, on the whole i think he taught tolerance, love, acceptance and i think we can benefit from following his example.
i love ray franzs book in search of christian freedom.



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Never Allowed to be Myself
by NeverAllowestobeMyself 5 days ago 19 Replies latest 4 days ago   jw experiences
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NeverAllowestobeMyself
NeverAllowestobeMyself 5 days ago

So my handle has a typo, it is supposed to be Never Allowed to be Myself but I'm okay with that because it is kind of symbolic of my situation.
As a born-in I have always had expectations forced on me, this is what you are to think, feel and do as a Jehovah's Witness. My earliest memories involve being upset that I would die at Armageddon because I was bad. I just never have fit in, even at the tender age of 5.
As a child I learned quickly how to tell my parents, my friends parents, my friends, the elders, other members of the congregation, my teachers and eventually as an adult my co-workers, friends, children and spouse what they want to hear. It has become so ingrained in my personality that I do it subconsciously. So basically no one on this planet really knows who I am, what I think and how I truly feel about things.
In my late teens and early 20's I was disfellowshiped and I used that time to try almost everything. In the end my experimentation led to heavy drug use and I destroyed my life. That forced me into a tough decision. So I went back and got reinstated.
Since that time I have remarried, had children, started three businesses (one failed, two are successful), served as a Pioneer, MS and an Elder. I have also learned TTAT and woke up. So now for the first time in my life I am just going to be Myself.
 +34 / -0
OneEyedJoe
OneEyedJoe 5 days ago

As a child I learned quickly how to tell my parents, my friends parents, my friends, the elders, other members of the congregation, my teachers and eventually as an adult my co-workers, friends, children and spouse what they want to hear. It has become so ingrained in my personality that I do it subconsciously. So basically no one on this planet really knows who I am, what I think and how I truly feel about things.
Very well said. I'm sure many here can relate to this, I know I can. I'm starting to learn the joy that comes from being your genuine self and finding people that accept and appreciate you for it. It's so much better than any "friendship" I've ever had with JWs... If I'm honest it's brought me to tears a few times.
Wishing you the best of luck on your journey! You'll never look back!
 +7 / -0
tiki
tiki 5 days ago
We get it....and I most certainly can relate with the feeling. It is hard for me to open up and show my real self because I learned to build and remain behind a very strong wall growing up and the wall remains intact. Only two people now truly know the whole real me.
 +6 / -0
Divergent
Divergent 5 days ago

As a born-in I have always had expectations forced on me, this is what you are to think, feel and do as a Jehovah's Witness. My earliest memories involve being upset that I would die at Armageddon because I was bad. I just never have fit in, even at the tender age of 5.
I'm a born-in too & I can relate to this part very well! As a kid, I had unpleasant thoughts of dying at Armageddon for the stupidest reasons - biting my tongue & accidentally tasting blood, masturbating, watching porn, celebrating my friends' birthdays at school & other festivals, saluting the flag (I was never good at making a stand when it came to stupid things like these), not giving a witness to my non-JW friends & not calling back on RV's in the ministry (bloodguilt!), etc. A religion who can make a young kid feel bloodguilty is a sick religion!
On the positive side, I made it out eventually & so can you also. Congrats on your enlightenment & hope that you can make it out soon together with your family! =)
 +6 / -0
Skedaddle
Skedaddle 5 days ago

They did so much damage to us. More than they'll ever know or admit to. The problem you describe has been a big one for me. I'm still trying to get over the fear of being myself after nearly 20 years of being out. That's the problem with brainwashing from babies:frowning:
Welcome!.. and I love the irony of your handle! It's really fab!
I wish you well on your journey!
 +4 / -0
Still Totally ADD
Still Totally ADD 5 days ago
You are right on spot with what you said. As a born-in myself I can relate to everything you are talking about. The nightmares of dying at Armageddon was the worst. Because they did not use age appropriate material at any of the meetings I am sure many adults who are born-ins to the cult suffer with PTSD. I would not be surprised the WT purposely used this technique to control the young ones. I hope you can escape the nightmare. Good luck to you. Still Totally ADD

 +6 / -0
DesirousOfChange
DesirousOfChange 5 days ago

Oh yes..........to everyone on the outside looking in, we had to appear to be the Ward & June Cleaver Family (US TV series -- Leave It to Beaver), when in reality we were the Dan & "Roseanne" Connors clan.
Doc

 +3 / -0
LisaRose
LisaRose 5 days ago

Good for you for knowing that you must learn how to be yourself. I am sure many people go through life never knowing who they are or what they want in life, they have so buried their true nature they don't even know it exists. It's not an easy path if you have been doing only what others expect of you, but it can be done if you are willing to put in the time and effort and the rewards are great.
I highly recommend two things for excavating your authentic self, meditation and journaling. Writing three pages in a journal every day is useful to start picking up the threads. No filters, do not edit, just write down any thing that comes to you, what is important is that you write, not what you write. You can burn the paper when you are done if you feel someone finding it might be a problem, it's the exercise of writing that is important. You are looking for some common threads, bits and pieces of your real self that will poke through here and there. Eventually you will start to see a pattern, focus on that and work with it.
Meditation has proven benefits, it's known to reduce blood pressure and stress and relieve depression. It takes only a few minutes a day, and is not hard. It does take practice, so keep at it every day.
At first it will be difficult, you will experience difficult emotions and it will not be easy, but keep at it and it will get easier with time.
Lisa 🌹
 +3 / -0
KateWild
KateWild 5 days ago

Wow that's terrible to find out, I probably did that to my kids, but as a convert I always expressed my true self which for a long time was a zealous believer who wanted to follow the GB.
I understand now what that did to my kids. I feel so sorry for you and also my kids. Thank you for your story. It's opened my eyes.
Kate xx
 +1 / -0
Village Idiot
Village Idiot 5 days ago

Welcome to the forum Myself. Are you fading right now or completely out?
You might want to ask Simon about changing your name or, if that is not possible, just come back with a different account with your correct name.
 +1 / -0

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Never Allowed to be Myself
by NeverAllowestobeMyself 5 days ago 19 Replies latest 4 days ago   jw experiences
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Island Man
Island Man 4 days ago


"So my handle has a typo..."
Is it now? And here I thought it was a creative way of illustrating the point that you're not allowed to be yourself - not even to have your own name the exact way you want it. It's a nice artistic typo, if I may say so.

 +1 / -0
sparrowdown
sparrowdown 4 days ago

Oh yes, I feel for you. I think many that were raised as JWs have a problem with emotional honesty and assertiveness, so it's great you realize this and have decided to start being yourself.
Many don't ever stop lying to themselves and others about what they really think, feel, want and don't want etc and will continue to be unhappy as a result. It may not always be prudent to say what you really think out loud, but always be honest with yourself. It's your choice.
All the best with your awakening, the more you wake up to the more you will find.
 
Mandrake
Mandrake 4 days ago
it's never late to be yourself... time ago, a professor told me; you need to be like the elephant, it has thick skin to resist, superb memory to not forget who hurt, and big tusks to fight back.. you have proven yourself resilient :smile:
 +2 / -0
crazy_flickering_light
crazy_flickering_light 4 days ago

Welcome.
I also fight with beeing myself. So much new. On the other site, who I am? Then go back to the other site and fake to be a beliver.
So I wish you the best. Keep fighting!

 +2 / -0
zeb
zeb 4 days ago

double post.
 
zeb
zeb 4 days ago

Be an individual? wash your mouth out!
Don't you know the wts runs on OSFA! (One Size Fits All) and we will all be pressed into the same mold.
There is no allowance for age. Realize that none of the gb have kids none of the Beth élites have kids while serving there. There is therefore a huge hole in their understanding of life.
Now be yourself take up a creative hobby, mix with those who pursue the same you will find to your amazement how many nice people there are in the world.
 
millie210
millie210 4 days ago

Hi and welcome.
I like your name also!
 
stuckinarut2
stuckinarut2 4 days ago

Great post!
Yes, I completely relate!
We simply BECAME what we were SUPPOSED to be, rather than develop into genuine individuals.....learning who we are, what we like and dislike, what interests to pursue, etc etc....
 
scary21
scary21 4 days ago

Welcome, I too was a born in who believed I would die in the big A. I never got baptized so I just tried to have as much fun and live like it was 1999 or should I say 1975 lol......................My life could have been much different.
I must say I was very very lucky (yes I will say the word lucky lucky lucky} that it all turned out good for me because it could have been very very bad ..
Yes, being a born in can be bad for your mental health !
Sherry

 
Vidiot
Vidiot 4 days ago


"...my handle has a typo..."
...would also be a clever username.
 

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Topic Summary
so my handle has a typo, it is supposed to be never allowed to be myself but i'm okay with that because it is kind of symbolic of my situation.
as a born-in i have always had expectations forced on me, this is what you are to think, feel and do as a jehovah's witness.
my earliest memories involve being upset that i would die at armageddon because i was bad.



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Lostandfound
12
TheNew World Society in Action....
by Lostandfound in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 4 days ago
back in the early 60s the phrase .

"the new world society..." was used a lot to promote assemblies and even congregations.

of course no new world has come but that saying appears to have been quietly buried along with any hope of a new world..

Vidiot
blondie
Landy
3 days ago
Sanath
13
Ekala Convention Hall To be Sold - Sri Lanka
by Sanath in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Personal Experiences & Reunions
 4 days ago
sri lanka has only one convention hall which is situated at 44, agaraduguru mawatha,ekala,ja-ela wp.

this was built on some where around 1990's.

now the sri lanka branch committee has decided to sale the property.what is the reason behind this??????????????

Magnum
Vidiot
pepperheart
3 days ago
joe134cd
13
Not that I'm complaining but I'm wondering if something is up
by joe134cd in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Personal Experiences & Reunions
 4 days ago
i have physically not attended a meeting in 3 years and knew ttatt for about 6-18 months before that.

in that time i have only had 2 physical visit from the jws.

no return to jehovah brochure or memorial invite place under my door mat.

steve2
sparrowdown
steve2
3 days ago
Tornintwo
35
Memorial mixed emotions...
by Tornintwo in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 4 days ago
does anyone else feel 'pulled back in' at this time of year?.

i still consider myself to a believer, believe in god and jesus christ, on the whole i think he taught tolerance, love, acceptance and i think we can benefit from following his example.

i love ray franzs book in search of christian freedom.

OnTheWayOut
Doubtfully Yours
Joliette
15 hours ago
Gorbatchov
3
WTS trade with China in an earlier stage.
by Gorbatchov in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 5 days ago
with the recent thread about wts buying materials for their new warwick hq in china, i want to refer to another story some 10 years ago.. there was then a china government visit to the usa.

they paid a visit to wts in brooklyn and did in the aftermath a return visit to china for the sake of lean production management.. wts learned the china government producing lean, and they got something in return for that.. what they got, i don't know.

.

OrphanCrow
Backinthebox
Gorbatchov
3 days ago
ivanatahan
10
Talking to a wall
by ivanatahan in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 5 days ago
why must these people be figurative walls when talking about the lies of the jw cult?.

the other day, i had a conversation with my mother.

we started talking about the election and how the candidates differ (me being a supporter of bernie).

Divergent
ivanatahan
Diogenesister
4 days ago
NeverAllowestobeMyself
19
Never Allowed to be Myself
by NeverAllowestobeMyself in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Personal Experiences & Reunions
 5 days ago
so my handle has a typo, it is supposed to be never allowed to be myself but i'm okay with that because it is kind of symbolic of my situation.

as a born-in i have always had expectations forced on me, this is what you are to think, feel and do as a jehovah's witness.

my earliest memories involve being upset that i would die at armageddon because i was bad.

stuckinarut2
scary21
Vidiot
4 days ago
Gorbatchov
12
JW Broadcasting: How to make memorial bread
by Gorbatchov in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 5 days ago
i don't believe it, but it is on jw broadcasting: how to make memorial bread.. it is just like the 24/kitchen broadcasting.. http://tv.jw.org/#en/video/vodministry/pub-jwbrd_201603_2_video.

NeverKnew
Billy the Ex-Bethelite
stuckinarut2
4 days ago
Gorbatchov
14
Elders at the gates
by Gorbatchov in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 5 days ago
my lovely wife warned me from the upper floor: close the windows, brother x is at the front door.

so, there they are again, for their required visit before the memorial.

i don't like it, you never hear from them, only in the week before the memorial.

Finkelstein
Vidiot
OnTheWayOut
4 days ago
The Rebel
9
Proof for the resurrection of Chrisr...
by The Rebel in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 5 days ago
posted on friends :-) anyway i hope everyone agrees even in disagreement, the discussion can be fruitful.

personally i usually find the atheism views more compelling than the christian view point, however i value both insights and conversations when the comments are respectful.. as it's coming up to eater, could i therefore pose the question to christians can you offer compelling evidence for the resurrection of christ?

evidence is a fact or a set of facts, or maybe i should rephrase my question " the resurrection is reasonable to hold to because of reasonable evidence that can be submitted for that conclusion" .

Finkelstein
ttdtt
The Rebel
4 days ago
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How to Tell When Someone Is Evangelizing to You Versus Trying to Be a Genuine Friend
by JACOB Meza 3 days ago 6 Replies latest 3 days ago   jw friends
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JACOB Meza
JACOB Meza 3 days ago

Hello everyone,
I've had this question on my mind for the last two years. First off, I'm still a follower of Jesus. Second, I don't go to church but rather a topical Skype Bible study with some fellow ex-JWs. I will likely never attend any church again, even once.
Third, I feel super suspicious of certain church going evangelicals that I meet here in Austin, TX. Particularly, there is a Baptist mega-church here that is big on evangelism and has tons of families who attend their services regularly. It is kind of a hip, young church. The Church is 5 point Calvanist, has multiple "campuses", gives membership classes, and has anyone in an official full member capacity sign a statement of faith (excuse me while I throw up). Don't worry, I will never attend there!
My wife will sometimes meetup with a moms, who will bring their husband and kids. I'm there as well, and usually the topic of what they do for work comes up. The most uncomfortable times come when they identify themselves as a Pastor or "Church-planter" (she doesn't only meetup with church-goers). These kind of remind me of, go figure, JW Elders a bit. They usually ask if I go to a church. When I respond no, I find they get that same expression I used to when getting a good return visit. They don't push as much as JWs do, but they offer to hear my "story" sometime.
Other evangelicals I meet, who are not in leadership positions, find my ex-JW background very interesting. And, they will usually ask me what church I go to. I say none and then the rest of the time wonder if they are only spending time with me because they want to get me into Church, same as with the Pastors/Church planters.
Am I being too paranoid? I find myself believing that almost everyone has "an angle" these days, with exception to a couple EX-JWs that I know personally. I have always been a bit paranoid...its probably a result of where I grew up & being a JW.
Thanks!
P.S. - Karma can really bite ya, right? Here I love bombed people for all those years and now I have to struggle with paranoia for the same reason! I deserve it!
 +1 / -0
Simon
Simon 3 days ago

Tell them you worship Satan. See if they still want to be your friend.
I think any evangelical group will always be trying to recruit you even if they don't know it themselves. It's the underlying goal of their group to recruit and to grow in order to survive.
I prefer to have real friends. I don't think many religious people know what that really means. They are brought up on a diet of constant judgement.
 +3 / -0
cofty
cofty 3 days ago

Am I being too paranoid?
No.
All evangelicals believe that if you don't see the world the way you do then you will spend eternity writhing in unimaginable agony in the fires of hell every second of every day for all eternity.
That kind of colours their relationships.
Christians drop ex-members just like JWs do. They are just more subtle about it.
Religion spoils everything.

 +6 / -0
JACOB Meza
JACOB Meza 3 days ago

@simon
I lol'd. It goes both ways. I have an acquaintance who is a bit of an militant atheist (Dawkins words). He pretty much told me, once we had a few discussions about belief/non-belief in God, that believers like me make the world a dangerous place for his children.
@cofty: I don't know about "all evangelicals". It is definitely a doctrine "on the church's books" but check this out:
Only 59% of Americans believe in hell, compared with 74% who believe in heaven, according to the recent surveys from the Pew Forum on Religion and Public Life. (http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/religion/2009-08-01-hell-damnation_N.htm)
 
OutsiderLookingIn
OutsiderLookingIn 3 days ago

It's not quite paranoia as much as caution. I've never been a dub. I don't particularly go for some mega churches. You can't possibly know 10,000 members. The house churches of Acts were much more of a community.
That said, I don't think everyone who invites you to church is being disingenuous about wanting to be your friend. I invite friends or family to my church who show an interest, have mentioned they're looking for a church, or if we're having a special event. It's an open invitation and they're welcome anytime. I don't do this to gain membership for my church but because I attend there (I've picked it from among weeds and can give some sort of personal recommendation). It's not perfect because we're all imperfect but it's doctrinally sound and we're all striving to be more like Christ. I simply don't know that about other churches.
If I extend an invitation and they don't come, I don't stop talking to them. That's a HUGE difference from JWs. My churchgoing friends are the same. I'll give an example.
-When I moved, I was looking for a new church. I visited many I heard about and one on the invitation of a friend. I went once and it wasn't my scene for whatever reason. We're still friends. I'm going to her son's birthday next month.
-I made friends with someone who goes to another church. She invited me but I haven't gone because I feel I'm at my church for a purpose. There are no hard feelings. I'm seeing her tonight in fact. It's not about competition in my mind. I'm glad worship is going on in other parts of the city.
Visit churches as you feel comfortable and take your time. They're not all the same. And there's nothing wrong with just continuing your Bible study in a small group. Church should grow you as a Christian. You don't need a building for that.
 +1 / -0
FayeDunaway
FayeDunaway 3 days ago

Mega churches give me an icky feeling too. Probably because they remind me too much of a district convention. I would never go to one (I do belong to a church with about 300 members tho and love it). I invite people to church whenever it seems natural. It doesn't make a difference to me if they come or not.I treat them the same. I have as many atheist or agnostic, buddhist or muslim friends as Christian friends.
Maybe you are a bit paranoid cuz of your life experience. But there might be something behind it, especially if these same people kind of ignore you after you reject going to their church. Mega churches seem kind of both culty and impersonal at the same time. There's nothing whatsoever desirable about that for me.
 +1 / -0
baker
baker 3 days ago
In the 60,s I remember some finatical schoolmates that would wear their bible on their chest and there was a term for them back then called "Jesus Freaks". If they saw you, they would love bomb you to go to their church and were so obnoxious , that if I saw one at school, I would turn the other way, kinda like not answering the door when JW,s knock. They never learned to be discrete, so I'm sure they drove more people away, than they got to go...
 

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JACOB Meza
6
How to Tell When Someone Is Evangelizing to You Versus Trying to Be a Genuine Friend
by JACOB Meza in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 3 days ago
i've had this question on my mind for the last two years.

first off, i'm still a follower of jesus.

second, i don't go to church but rather a topical skype bible study with some fellow ex-jws.

OutsiderLookingIn
FayeDunaway
baker
3 days ago
The Rebel
35
Money....
by The Rebel in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 3 days ago
i believe all our worst nightmare are believing money will make our life's complete.

i am not talking about money providing life's comforts, but i am mortified that contentment and happiness always requires " more money"..ummm i need a window cleaner, a flashy car and a 50inch t.v screen to be happy.

money...well in my opinion we need money integrity to be happy, but it seems such a waste of life to search for the making of money more than ....well what i mean "hey" most of us have more money than most, and would the making or having more money really make you happier?.

Doubtfully Yours
rebelfighter
Billzfan23
15 hours ago
Gorbatchov
19
A New Watchtower trade name: Hudson Valley
by Gorbatchov in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 3 days ago
watchtower and trading business is a never ending combination, now under the new name of hudson valley, selling their building machines online: .

http://used-tools-equipment.com.

Tech49
talesin
JeffT
2 days ago
ILoveTTATT2
15
This was in 2011 (when you get it)
by ILoveTTATT2 in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 3 days ago
it's not the rings... that was highlighted for a different reason..

ILoveTTATT2
fastJehu
Listener
2 days ago
Gorbatchov
8
An old friend in another appearance: used-tools-equipment.com (Hudson Valley - WTS shell)
by Gorbatchov in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 3 days ago
since 1995 gorby likes to investigate the organizational behind the jehovah's witnesses, and is working now on a publication about it.

i will keep you updated about that.

now, in the memorial week, i found a new watchtower trade brand under the wings of kingdom support service, inc. and it's name is hudson valley.

Hadriel
startingover
oppostate
5 hours ago
JW_Rogue
15
Which delusion will you choose?
by JW_Rogue in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Personal Experiences & Reunions
 3 days ago
it occurred to me while at today's wt study that over 100 people were wasting an hour of their life studiously examining the differences between two delusions, paradise earth and the heavenly hope.

everyone made it sound so serious when in reality it means nothing at all.

either choice is wrong and foolish nonsense.. it was mentioned that mark sanderson found his heavenly calling at very young age.

Absalom
JW_Rogue
zeb
2 days ago
fulano
14
Missionary suicide..
by fulano in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Personal Experiences & Reunions
 3 days ago
i just read this.... http://avoidjw.org/2014/12/suicide-jehovahs-witness-missionary/.

does anybody know if this was a "real", missionary, or a need greater and who was it?

if you don't want to mention it here please a pm..

fulano
Lostwun
fulano
2 days ago
PaintedToeNail
6
Insufferable Presumption
by PaintedToeNail in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 3 days ago
today, sunday, my son and i returned from a real estate investor meeting that we attend once a month with other active investors.

we discussed our latest projects, financing needs, advertising and so on.

we meet at 11:00 and don't usually get done before 2:00 pm and today was no different.

sir82
PaintedToeNail
steve2
3 days ago
ILoveTTATT2
13
The Evolution of the Awake's Back Cover
by ILoveTTATT2 in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 4 days ago
i don't think anyone's actually considered this, but a post in the extj.com forum made me think about the many changes (not just one) on the back cover of the awake!

magazine.

thanks to avoidjw.org for scanning all of the magazines in pdf format, since there is a lot lost with the wt library.. take a look at the following paragraphs in the awake´s back cover throughout the years:awake!

jwfacts
steve2
ILoveTTATT2
2 days ago
ILoveTTATT2
18
New Movie: Blood, dealing with Blood Transfusions. Coming to a theater near you soon!
by ILoveTTATT2 in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 4 days ago https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=121&v=b-tcy86as6i.

omg i cannot believe that someone is making a hollywood-like movie based on the topic of blood transfusions and jehovah's witnesses!

here is the trailer..

Gayle
redvip2000
ariker
3 days ago
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I like the fact that XJW's are passionate about politics
by minimus 2 days ago 17 Replies latest a day ago   jw friends
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minimus
minimus 2 days ago
The fact is we could never talk about politics or of use toward political issues as witnesses now we can and we can disagree without being disagreeable .
 +5 / -0
talesin
talesin 2 days ago
Me, too! Remember the 2004 election? Wow, the flame wars were fun - it's American politics, so entertaining!
 +3 / -0
minimus
minimus 2 days ago
Even if some of our views may not be excepted by the majority I think that it's good to have the dialogue open
 +2 / -0
Terry
Terry 2 days ago

Passionate? Mmmm, I'd say puerile and snippy and thin-skinned,
and wound up tight and ready to burst a blood vessel. :smile:
Lots of folks get personal in a hurry. Generalities are taken as specifics. Hearts are eager to be broken.
I'm going to avoid political posts from now on. There is too much drama in the trauma. Too much heat and very little light.
The crowds with pitchforks and torches are on the march. Jackboots are clipping on the cobblestones.
Get me outta here--I seem to be the monster!
Ahhhhhhhgggggh!



 +1 / -1
just fine
just fine 2 days ago
I think I am more passionate about just having the freedom to have an opinion. It's kinda funny sometimes because people get so mad and think we all have to agree on what's best, but we don't. And it's ok. In fact it's great, because we are all thinking without the cult telling us what to do.
 +5 / -0
scary21
scary21 2 days ago

I like to see how other people think and WHY they think that way.........We don't have to agree..


 +3 / -0
smiddy
smiddy 2 days ago

Jehovah`s Witnesses are passionate about politics too , and they are also Monarchists .
No they don`t accept Democracy , Communism ,Totalitarianism ,Fascism .etc.etc.
However they do believe in a Theocracy , a Government by GOD ,and a Monarchy with JESUS as King .
So in my view they are as political as the next man or woman.
And they will die upholding those beliefs .
smiddy
 +3 / -0
kaik
kaik 2 days ago

Political discussions are always heated and everyone can look into French Revolution where disagreement was solved by guillotine. Robespierre said that even if person does not make any choice, he already did showed his or her political views. When I go to foreigner boards, the political discussions are far worse than on JWN.

 +2 / -0
sir82
sir82 2 days ago


Even if some of our views may not be excepted by the majority
Don't worry, I take exception to all your views!

 +1 / -0
The Rebel
The Rebel 2 days ago

I am sure a % of ex-jws are passionate about politics, but I am not sure it is such a blanket rule. As for being able to disagree without being disagreeable, it's a testimony to many here that threads on God and Politics are debated in an agreeable way, but I have noted the threads can become disagreeable and at times rather unpleasant.
The Rebel.
 +1 / -0

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I like the fact that XJW's are passionate about politics
by minimus 2 days ago 17 Replies latest a day ago   jw friends
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LoveUniHateExams
LoveUniHateExams 2 days ago

I agree, Min.
It's good that ex-JWs take an interest in politics and can come to a place to express themselves.
Voting for sensible policies can achieve some good, unlike waiting on God's Kingdom!
 +1 / -0
Sabin
Sabin 2 days ago
I hate politics, HATE it i tell you. I spent most of my childhood having Margaret Thatcher shoved down my throat. My father couldn't stand her. We always had people round our house campaigning for the Labour Party. I remember going out in the cars with the loud speakers handing out leaflets. He was always off to give bloody union speeches. I told him when i was about 13 or 14, "i'm never voting" he went up the wall. And i'm proud to say to the right honourable gentleman on the left, i never have.
 +1 / -1
minimus
minimus 2 days ago
Everyone has an opinion and as long as it is respect fully expressed it's all good
 +1 / -0
Sabin
Sabin 2 days ago
Minimus, although what i have stated is true, the 1st sentence (i hate politics) was my attempt at humor. I really dont have an issue with other people who like to get involved. Please dont misunderstand. It's just my father i hate really. Biggest Hug for Minimus.
 +2 / -0
MarkofCane
MarkofCane 2 days ago

Being a witness for so long and not having a opinion my entire upbringing. (well I always had an opinion just was very selective with who I shared it with) I just wasn't passionate about politics I really believed that God Kingdom was mans only solution to all of our problems. So I'm still trying to figure it all out, meaning politics. Not even sure at time's if I'm a democrat, independent or republican? I'm thinking republican. I would like to vote but would create to many issues if the family found out. But soon enough, I will register and will cast my first ballot.
If you don't vote, then don't complain.
 +2 / -0
FayeDunaway
FayeDunaway 2 days ago
The year 2000 election showed me the importance of voting (Gore/Bush). Every morning my radio alarm went off and I heard the latest updates on the result of that election, which was so close, it was ultimately decided by a republican judge in Florida. The Iraq war would never have been started if Gore had won. Afghanistan, yes. Elections matter. At the local, state and national level. Throughout history millions of people have died for the right to vote. I don't take that lightly.
 +3 / -0
Simon
Simon 2 days ago

At some point you realize that no magical god is going to come and wave a magic wand to put everything right. What society we have is up to us and it's all of our responsibilities to make sure that the people elected to act on our behalf are competent and will do a decent enough job.
It's good for people to have an interest and get involved in politics as long as they are capable of expressing themselves properly.
Sadly, politics in some countries is descending into mod wrestling. I really do blame the very poor level of media coverage where rating are chased and crazy = more airtime.
Thankfully though, so far, major western electorates elect governments that are not too far off the deep-end and the institutions are sufficient to protect against abuses and hold people to account. They and the principles that protect us can't ever be taken for granted though - it's a short and slippy road to democracy being undermined.
 +3 / -0
OnTheWayOut
OnTheWayOut a day ago

Terry:
Passionate? Mmmm, I'd say puerile and snippy and thin-skinned,
and wound up tight and ready to burst a blood vessel.
Isn't it enough to insult all the ex-JW's on your own thread?
Minimus, many of us are able to disagree without being disagreeable. But some aren't.
 

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the fact is we could never talk about politics or of use toward political issues as witnesses now we can and we can disagree without being disagreeable .



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...the relief of Congregation Members
by Lostandfound 2 days ago 13 Replies latest 19 hours ago   jw friends
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Lostandfound
Lostandfound 2 days ago

Just clearing out all old stuff and came across tyhis line in my copy of the UK Memorandum of Constitution, passed by each UK cong in (I think) 1997)
This line bemused me as I know of no witness who ever receiver financial help from their congregation
Clause 4.2.4 read for other charitable purposes including the relief of Congregation Members who are in conditions of need hardship or distress
Lots of congregations CAUSED Distress but I wonder if anyone knows of a congregation giving financial aid locally to a brother?


 +4 / -0
talesin
talesin 2 days ago

How ironic. That is a bald-faced lie.
EG: We had a very poor family, who rented from a rich and powerful elder. They had no furnace oil and 5 kids, and asked him for help with the oil. He said 'we are here to take care of your spiritual needs, not your physical ones'.
This was something I learned decades later, from a relative and reliable source. And that particular elder was a mean and scary man, to which I can personally attest. :' (
[Edit and note: individuals do help others - I am talking about church aid, which in the above case, could have been provided - other churches would]
I'm kinda old, and 4th generation JW, and have never heard of the JWS organization ever helping any of their members by giving them help, be it clothing, cash, food, housing, you name it. 
 +9 / -0
LongHairGal
LongHairGal 2 days ago

LOSTANDFOUND:
That charter you found is a joke if applied to the Witness religion since there is no organized effort to HELP anybody!
Aid to somebody in need? Maybe if they're related to the elders! Sometimes a kind individual here and there may help. Otherwise, they are out of luck! That was my observation back in the day.
I agree with your statement that lots of congregations CAUSED distress....Well, of course they did!! No need to go into the myriad of reasons this religion can do this, which is why we are OUT of there!
This religion is all about TAKING from people and certainly not helping anybody!
 +6 / -0
Iown Mylife
Iown Mylife 2 days ago

I heard second-hand from an elder's wife: elders in the Spanish cong were so concerned about some of their members who were having a very hard time and wanted to withdraw money from the building fund (or land-buying fund). There was over a million and counting, pending purchase of a location for building a new kh.
There were several congs using the kh including one Spanish speaking. All these elders had a huge fight about the saved money. The Spanish elders said they needed to help some of the friends get through a disaster of some sort, and why could they not take back some of the money that the Spanish friends had contributed?
They were told that the money was dedicated for building a new worship center and using it for any other reason would be stealing from Jehovah.
Outrage, animosity, hateful looks from the Spanish friends. Why didn't this crap "stumble" me?! Because I kept making excuses for the little princely rulers.
Marina
 +7 / -0
stuckinarut2
stuckinarut2 a day ago

Yes....just see how firmly the society WILL NOT give Spohia's icecream money BACK to her if her family ever falls on desperate times!
Rather, they will take the opportunity to counsel them on how they didn't act shrewdly with their money, thus putting them in a bad situation. Then they will be told to "preach more and rely on Jehovah" and it will all be ok...the rent will be paid and food will magically appear!.....
NEVER has a congregation used money from its official account to help a member!!
 +5 / -0
JWdaughter
JWdaughter a day ago
I have been in churches and now in a different religious organization (keep the catcalls down, please:) ) and all but the JWs have funds to help the community (not just the church members) in need. BOTH in charitable (such as food pantries etc.) outreaches and specific funds to help with emergencies such as evictions after job loss, electric bills, even (surprisingly) the last bit to pay community college tuition that had to be diverted after a smallish medical emergency. I have seen car repairs, etc. One church had a deal with a member who owned a car repair place that he would donate labor if the churchwould pay for materials when a hard case came through
 +6 / -0
Doctor Who
Doctor Who a day ago

Being a former account servant, I was privy to one occasion where the BOE gave a family some financial help from a Congregation account. If I remember right, it was like $2000 to help them with bills after the husband died suddenly without any insurance. He left a wife and 3 kids.
Here's the kicker. After a CO visit about 2 months later, the Elders where asking all the servants if they could help 'pay back Jehovah's things' so as to replace $2000 into the Congregation's account. I believe one of the Elders step down because of this.

 +2 / -0
Robo Bobo
Robo Bobo a day ago
Ahhh but they meant spiritual relief - far more valuable then food, clothing, shelter
 +1 / -0
pepperheart
pepperheart a day ago
In the uk the watchtower has been fighting the uk charity commission in the courts and these past days the watchtoer have taken their fight up to the uk supreme court to fight the commission about what i dont know but i sure can guess

 +2 / -0
WingCommander
WingCommander 21 hours ago

Official WatchTower Charity's Mission Statement:
"Go forth, be warm and well fed................"

 +1 / -0

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...the relief of Congregation Members
by Lostandfound 2 days ago 13 Replies latest 19 hours ago   jw friends
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Lostandfound
Lostandfound 21 hours ago

WingCommander5 minutes ago

Official WatchTower Charity's Mission Statement:
"Go forth, be warm and well fed................"
......................................................and wear a Rolex"
 +1 / -0
adjusted knowledge
adjusted knowledge 20 hours ago
I never in my 15 year association with the Watchtower know of it giving material help to members. There was help given in the congregation but it came from the pockets of a few generous elders. The clean up and repairs done for example in Home Stead Florida during I think hurricane Andrew did help some members but was more of a PR stunt.

 +1 / -0
punkofnice
punkofnice 20 hours ago

LAF - Lots of congregations CAUSED Distress but I wonder if anyone knows of a congregation giving financial aid locally to a brother?
No. Not in all my 50 years in the filthy cult. The organisation did less than nothing. Individuals helped others but out of their own pockets.
 
Crazyguy
Crazyguy 19 hours ago
In the cong. I grew up in a family needed help so the members have a whole bunch of food and probably some cash. In my last cong. there was a find to help people in need and I knew one that got help. I dont think this fund exists anymore because someone needed help badly a year ago and no cong. money was offered up.
 

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Topic Summary
just clearing out all old stuff and came across tyhis line in my copy of the uk memorandum of constitution, passed by each uk cong in (i think) 1997).
this line bemused me as i know of no witness who ever receiver financial help from their congregation.
clause 4.2.4 read for other charitable purposes including the relief of congregation members who are in conditions of need hardship or distress.



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by sir82 4 months ago



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Lostandfound
13
...the relief of Congregation Members
by Lostandfound in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 2 days ago
just clearing out all old stuff and came across tyhis line in my copy of the uk memorandum of constitution, passed by each uk cong in (i think) 1997).

this line bemused me as i know of no witness who ever receiver financial help from their congregation.

clause 4.2.4 read for other charitable purposes including the relief of congregation members who are in conditions of need hardship or distress.

adjusted knowledge
punkofnice
Crazyguy
19 hours ago
ILoveTTATT2
39
Terrorist attack in Belgium
by ILoveTTATT2 in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 2 days ago
check the news.

there was a terrorist attack in brussells, couple of bombs detonated in the brussell airport and the metro.. 36 dead so far.. i send my sincerest condolences to the people of belgium.. the motive seems to be revenge for the capture of the last surviving member of the paris terrorist attacks..

talesin
Finkelstein
kaik
6 hours ago
poopie
3
New light wt last Sunday Para 14 you can now
by poopie in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 2 days ago
enjoy your friends and families company as your annointed even if you are df i guess thst applies to everyone

Listener
prologos
Aroq
2 days ago
bobld
3
paying a price or ransom
by bobld in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 2 days ago
if i pay a ransom do i get my money back?.

jesus' paid the price (ransom) but he got his life back.. he was dead like 6.41e-13 years of his long life..

oppostate
Simon
bobld
2 days ago
rebel8
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 » Friends
 2 days ago
is there an app for that?

seriously, in this day and age, there has to be a way to find someone you lost contact with.

i know, facebook...but i'm having no luck there.

smiddy
talesin
JRK
2 days ago
minimus
17
I like the fact that XJW's are passionate about politics
by minimus in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 2 days ago
the fact is we could never talk about politics or of use toward political issues as witnesses now we can and we can disagree without being disagreeable .

FayeDunaway
Simon
OnTheWayOut
a day ago
babygirl30
51
Lost on how to respond...
by babygirl30 in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 3 days ago
so an old friend of mine from the congregation hit me up today.

the story goes like this when we were jw's:.

- this guy used to be madly in love with me but i didn't see him as anything more than a friend.

steve2
Terry
OnTheWayOut
a day ago
StarTrekAngel
2
The use of quotes to explain/confront life...
by StarTrekAngel in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Personal Experiences & Reunions
 3 days ago
anyone who's ever confronted the hr department at your job, especially in professional/technical environments, or a counselor, or, to keep this on topic, your elders.

knows that there is a number of well crafted quotes out there, that are good to make a point across.

quotes that are used to attempt to inspire you, challenge you or make you think out of the box.

Simon
StarTrekAngel
3 days ago
Viva la Vida
5
Activism idea. Get former JWs celebrities to raise awareness
by Viva la Vida in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 3 days ago
it just occurred to me that former jws celebrities could help in a campaign to raise awareness on some of the most controversial jw's practices (two witness rule in relation to child abuse, shunning, blood).

we would need some of them to record brief videos and share them through social media.

this can be more effective than what any of us could individually do.

Barrold Bonds
Simon
steve2
3 days ago
JACOB Meza
6
How to Tell When Someone Is Evangelizing to You Versus Trying to Be a Genuine Friend
by JACOB Meza in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 3 days ago
i've had this question on my mind for the last two years.

first off, i'm still a follower of jesus.

second, i don't go to church but rather a topical skype bible study with some fellow ex-jws.

OutsiderLookingIn
FayeDunaway
baker
3 days ago
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Discuss anything Jehovah Witness, JW.org or WatchTower society related
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Replies
poopie
7
Regional con program released jw.org shun again
by poopie in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 14 hours ago
wow

NeverKnew
JW_Rogue
sir82
2 hours ago
Bangalore
Religious Freedom
by Bangalore in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 17 hours ago
.

bangalore.

OnTheWayOut
12
"M" is for "Memorial"
by OnTheWayOut in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 19 hours ago
many weeks ago, i apparently put "m" on today's date- wednesday, march 23rd, in my google calendar.

it was supposed to remind me that the memorial that jehovah's witnesses observe would be held today.

i was flipping through my calendar this past weekend and asked my wife "what in the world is 'm' for (that day)?

OnTheWayOut
jambon1
Dagney
11 hours ago
jambon1
3
Tony Morris and his ill fitting suits
by jambon1 in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 a day ago
looking at him on these jw org videos.

his suits look so bad.

can't he afford a tailor?

SecretSlaveClass
fulano
WTWizard
20 hours ago
The Rebel
23
Is this a site controlled by atheists?
by The Rebel in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 a day ago
under the exterior of being an ex- witness site, is this site simply converting atheism?.

i pose the question, because many come here in distress and insecurity with the realization that the w.t is wrong but still retain a belief in god.

my personal opinion is the threads on god are not challenged by an atheists personal animosity to believers, they are challenged and become confrontational because the atheist wants an elaboration and factual proof to a believers faith.. is this unreasonable?

Simon
cofty
Crazyguy
8 hours ago
jhine
1
You may find this interesting ( or not )
by jhine in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Personal Experiences & Reunions
 a day ago
this is from the premier christian radio website .

i think that it gives an insight into how different christendom is from the wt , this is an interdenominational site .. .

jan. .

jhine
a day ago
Truth and Justice
7
In regards to memorial, what I am going to do
by Truth and Justice in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 a day ago
wow!

what a list of new friends we have on this forum, i don't know if i'll ever be able to keep up, but that's ok.. i wanted to dive in to the post to talk about the memorial.

i do not have any intentions of going, even if i was invited.

tornapart
FayeDunaway
compound complex
19 hours ago
hoser
18
We can now donate by credit card in canada on jw.org
by hoser in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 a day ago
what a fine privelege to support jehovah with our valuable things.

Half banana
punkofnice
Anders Andersen
15 hours ago
Terry
42
I COLLECT QUOTES. . . Here are some of my favorites
by Terry in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 a day ago
please post your favorites too.

my favorite quotations:.

you cannot change what you refuse to confront.. sometimes good things fall apart so better things can fall together.. don’t think of cost.

punkofnice
HBH
closed
16 hours ago
Lostandfound
13
...the relief of Congregation Members
by Lostandfound in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 2 days ago
just clearing out all old stuff and came across tyhis line in my copy of the uk memorandum of constitution, passed by each uk cong in (i think) 1997).

this line bemused me as i know of no witness who ever receiver financial help from their congregation.

clause 4.2.4 read for other charitable purposes including the relief of congregation members who are in conditions of need hardship or distress.

adjusted knowledge
punkofnice
Crazyguy
19 hours ago
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Discuss anything Jehovah Witness, JW.org or WatchTower society related
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ILoveTTATT2
2011 Drama Clip - "We are not a cult"!
by ILoveTTATT2 in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 6 hours ago https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ywtgbd1db9y&feature=youtu.be.

it is interesting to me to see how even back in 2011 the witnesses knew about the "mind control" and "cult" concepts.

it is very likely that relatives or loved ones of jw's stumble upon hassan and read "mind control" and go and warn their loved ones.

silent
10
Didn't go to memorial this year
by silent in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 6 hours ago
my wife and i had business to attend to out of town today and i had thought if we made it back home in time, we'd go to the memorial.

as it turned out, we didn't get home in time and we missed it, but we had a real good talk with each other on the way home.

we are largely successful faders and at the very least, i like to try and make the memorial.

slimboyfat
Crazyguy
jookbeard
an hour ago
rebelfighter
10
Go my invite / think I am now a Do Not Call
by rebelfighter  in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 12 hours ago
my son says hey mom that's your doorbell.

so answer it.

next i get, mom it is the jehovah witnesses.

Pete Zahut
zeb
rebelfighter
7 hours ago
Ding
19
Did You Get Invited to the Memorial?
by Ding in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Personal Experiences & Reunions
 13 hours ago
i'm just wondering if jws keep inviting you back or if they've given up on you.. they haven't invited me for years..

Xanthippe
Black Sheep
punkofnice
an hour ago
new boy
3
Calling on all EX Bethelites From The 1960s, 1970s and 1980s
by new boy in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 13 hours ago
many have commented here about my bethel experiences.

even though it's been over 40 years since i was there, many have found the stories to be interesting and amusing.

some have even mentioned writing a book about them.

Freeandclear
talesin
new boy
3 hours ago
All for show
7
Those of us going to memorial
by All for show in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 13 hours ago
how are you feeling?.

we weren't going... but a confrontation with family blew things up.

we decided we are going- because we are planning on moving and this is the last jw thing.

Khaleesi
stan livedeath
Spiral
10 hours ago
SonoftheTrinity
14
Wearing a Guy Fawkes mask outside a JW Convention.
by SonoftheTrinity in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Personal Experiences & Reunions
 13 hours ago
i don't want my wife recognizing me, but i feel like making an anti-jw scene.

talesin
steve2
jhine
2 hours ago
undercover
1
The Kindness of an Atheist
by undercover in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 13 hours ago
a song lyric i heard the other day, paraphrased:.

nothing is as good as the kindness from an atheistan act of selflessness that never has to be repaid.

interesting thought.

Island Man
13 hours ago
Terry
21
Whatever happened to "YOU'RE WELCOME"? Has "NO PROBLEM" replaced it?
by Terry in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 14 hours ago
wherever i go, i say "thank you" to clerks, servers, delivery people, hosts and hostesses and the response has become invariable: "no problem!".

have i aged to the point i'm now an old fuddy duddy who doesn't "get it"?.

is it counted mannerly to avoid, "you're welcome" in favor of "no problem"?.

Lieu
berrygerry
truthlover
6 hours ago
poopie
7
Regional con program released jw.org shun again
by poopie in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 14 hours ago
wow

NeverKnew
JW_Rogue
sir82
2 hours ago
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 4,053,831 posts in  124,595 topics

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Lost touch with old friends from your old congregation? Find them here!
 254,446 posts in  11,800 topics

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 628 posts in  70 topics




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Discuss anything Jehovah Witness, JW.org or WatchTower society related
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Replies
Crazyguy
5
To those who attended, attendance up or down at your memorial?
by Crazyguy in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 an hour ago
interesting to see if there's a noticeable trend in memorial attendance.

also did they talk more then usual about ones not to partake?

crazy_flickering_light
sir82
Da.Furious
5 minutes ago
Ruby456
7
Easter, the memorial ... is there any worthwhile message for secularists?
by Ruby456 in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 2 hours ago
an innocent man killed in the most awful manner replayed countless time all over the world has desire for justice writ large all it.

is this something that secularists can take from a religious event.

i think so.

Ruby456
2+2=5
zeb
5 minutes ago
Labate
5
Evolution vs Creationism.
by Labate in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 2 hours ago
perhaps this has been discussed in the past, but i can't help noticing that on many posts creation vs evolution seems to equal theist vs atheist.

granted, a creationist by defination would have to believe in a creator.

on the other hand, believing in evolution doesn't automatically make one an atheist, a small point perhaps, but i think it would be more accurate to say believer vs nonbeliever.. just sayin'..

cofty
Landy
Crazyguy
an hour ago
ILoveTTATT2
2011 Drama Clip - "We are not a cult"!
by ILoveTTATT2 in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 6 hours ago https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ywtgbd1db9y&feature=youtu.be.

it is interesting to me to see how even back in 2011 the witnesses knew about the "mind control" and "cult" concepts.

it is very likely that relatives or loved ones of jw's stumble upon hassan and read "mind control" and go and warn their loved ones.

silent
10
Didn't go to memorial this year
by silent in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 7 hours ago
my wife and i had business to attend to out of town today and i had thought if we made it back home in time, we'd go to the memorial.

as it turned out, we didn't get home in time and we missed it, but we had a real good talk with each other on the way home.

we are largely successful faders and at the very least, i like to try and make the memorial.

slimboyfat
Crazyguy
jookbeard
an hour ago
rebelfighter
10
Go my invite / think I am now a Do Not Call
by rebelfighter  in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 12 hours ago
my son says hey mom that's your doorbell.

so answer it.

next i get, mom it is the jehovah witnesses.

Pete Zahut
zeb
rebelfighter
7 hours ago
Ding
19
Did You Get Invited to the Memorial?
by Ding in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Personal Experiences & Reunions
 13 hours ago
i'm just wondering if jws keep inviting you back or if they've given up on you.. they haven't invited me for years..

Xanthippe
Black Sheep
punkofnice
an hour ago
new boy
3
Calling on all EX Bethelites From The 1960s, 1970s and 1980s
by new boy in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 13 hours ago
many have commented here about my bethel experiences.

even though it's been over 40 years since i was there, many have found the stories to be interesting and amusing.

some have even mentioned writing a book about them.

Freeandclear
talesin
new boy
3 hours ago
All for show
7
Those of us going to memorial
by All for show in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 13 hours ago
how are you feeling?.

we weren't going... but a confrontation with family blew things up.

we decided we are going- because we are planning on moving and this is the last jw thing.

Khaleesi
stan livedeath
Spiral
10 hours ago
SonoftheTrinity
14
Wearing a Guy Fawkes mask outside a JW Convention.
by SonoftheTrinity in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Personal Experiences & Reunions
 13 hours ago
i don't want my wife recognizing me, but i feel like making an anti-jw scene.

talesin
steve2
jhine
2 hours ago
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 254,446 posts in  11,800 topics

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Top 'best of' topics, articles and posts. First stop for new visitors.
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