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Royal Commission findings: Jehovah’s Witness elders left abuse survivors “silenced and unsupported”
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Posted on December 14, 2015

The shocking treatment of
The shocking treatment of BCB and BCG was brought to light by the Royal Commission

The previous two articles in this series have discussed Watchtower policy and scriptural debate. However, this is not some theoretical debate of interest only to scholars and lawyers. At the core of all this back and forth over scripture and law are real human beings.

What is the actual impact of Watchtower policy when put into practice for real abuse survivors?
Two of these survivors were able to give detailed and comprehensive testimony at the ARC hearings, and the submission of the Senior Counsel contains detailed findings related to their experiences.
The Case of BCB
The first survivor was a woman referred to as BCB in order to protect her identity. She described how Jehovah’s Witness elder Bill Neill repeatedly abused her from the age of 15. She outlined the various impacts of Watchtower’s policy on her case in harrowing detail. These included:
◾An instance where, as per Watchtower policy at the time, she was forced by the elders to confront Bill Neill, repeat her accusations directly to him, and hear him challenge and dismiss them – an experience she found deeply traumatic.
◾She was required to describe intimate details of her assault to a room full of men. As a result, she found herself unable to fully detail the worst aspects of her experience.
◾She was given no counseling or support for her extreme emotional trauma, and was simply instructed to read Watchtower literature.

Even though the elders claimed to believe her, due to the two witness rule, nothing significant could be done. Neill did step down as an elder, but the reason was not announced to the congregation. No further sanctions were imposed. Neill remained a Witness in good standing.
And almost unbelievably, BCB was forced to continue attending meetings in Neill’s home.
I’ll say that again.
◾BCB was required to continue attending meetings in the home of the man whom she had stated, and the elders apparently agreed, had abused her.

Additionally, elder Max Horley and Circuit Overseer Doug Jackson sent a letter to the branch described as follows by the Commission:

148  The letter of 1 February 1992 further reported that both Mr Horley and Mr Doug Jackson were ‘impressed by Brother Neill’s acceptance of counsel and his humility throughout the ordeal’ and recommended that he be appointed as an elder again ‘once this has died down’.
Unsurprisingly, BCB didn’t fare well as a result of this treatment. She testified that she’d since had a nervous breakdown and required ongoing expensive medical and therapeutic care to deal with the mental and physical injures Neill’s abuse had inflicted.
Max Horley and Doug Jackson appeared before the ARC to defend themselves. They didn’t impress.
Jackson gave meaningless responses that often verged on gibberish, and a shamefaced Horley, despite attempting initially to defend his actions and Watchtower policy, in the end agreed that BCB had been terribly failed by both.
Here are just some of the Commission’s many detailed findings on the case of BCB. They back up and validate all the claims BCB made (bold is mine):

F6  It was distressing for BCB to be required by the elders to tell of what had happened to her to a group of men, including the man whom she accused of abusing her, and it was not likely to, nor did it, result in BCB disclosing the full extent of her abuse.
F9  The application of the two‐witness rule meant that there was insufficient evidence for the elders to act against BCB’s abuser even though they believed her, which left her feeling disbelieved and unsupported, and it left the abuser in the congregation where he may have been a risk to other children.
F10  Mr Horley telling BCB that she should not discuss her abuse with anyone left her feeling silenced and unsupported.
F13  It was traumatic for BCB and inappropriate of Mr Horley for him to have required BCB to attend Bible study at Bill Neill’s home when he knew that BCB accused Bill Neill of abusing her.
F14  The recommendation of the elders to the Branch Office that Bill Neill be reinstated as an elder ‘once this has died down’ and their expressed concern ‘that there may also be worldly people who also know’ demonstrates that they were more concerned about the reputation of Bill Neill and the congregation than about the risk that he posed to children.
Max Horley departs after giving evidence at the Royal Commission
Max Horley departs after giving evidence at the Royal Commission

 
The Case of BCG
BCG was born into a Jehovah’s Witness family, and had three sisters. When she was 17 her father, a ministerial servant, began to abuse her. Her initial attempt to contact the elders were rebuffed, and when she finally was able to get their attention, her story took a sadly familiar path. Among the indignities the Watchtower process inflicted, BCG recounts that:
◾She was required to confront her father with the accusations, who became so angry and aggressive that he had to be restrained from violently attacking her. BCG found this experience terrifying.
◾She stated that the elders, all friends of her father, appeared to attack her credibility as a witnesses, rather than support and protect her as an abuse survivor. She was left with the distinct impression that they were not impartial in the matter.

One of the most troubling aspects of BCG’s story highlights how elders can act in defiance of Watchtower’s rules with impunity.
Remember the two witness rule? Well, BCG told told the elders that her father had abused her younger sisters as well her older sister. The elders dismissed this report, stating that the girls were too young to know what they were talking about, and were not witnesses to the same event, even though Watchtower policy at the time would have accepted their evidence as a second witness.
During the hearings, the elders involved (Ron De Rooy, Dino Ali, and Kevin Bowditch) flat out denied under oath that she had made this report to them. Ali in particular was quite adamant on this fact.
To the clear shock of Ali, the ARC then produced a set of handwritten notes, taken from the congregation archives, and written by Ali during the investigation. The notes confirm, in Ali’s own handwriting, that not only had BCG informed the elders as to her father’s abuse of her sisters (a charge her mother corroborated) but that her father had confessed to the abuse before the elders.
Yet, despite having more than enough evidence to act, even under the discredited process of Watchtower, Ron De Rooy, Dino Ali and Kevin Bowditch did not find that BCG’s father had abused his daughters.
Among the many findings on the case of BCG, the Senior Counsel finds: (bold is mine)

F21  The evidence presented to the judicial committee of BCH having abused his other daughters satisfied the Jehovah’s Witness organisation’s own rules with regard to sufficiency of evidence  to establish that BCH had abused BCG, but the elders wrongly ignored that evidence and accordingly failed to uphold BCG’s complaint against BCH.
F23  The elders inexplicably and wrongly ignored BCH’s confession to having abused BCG and thereby, within the precepts of the Jehovah’s Witness organisation’s own rules and procedures, failed to uphold BCG’s complaint against BCH.
F26  The failure by the elders to report BCH’s sexual abuse of BCG to the police had the result that BCH remained at large in the community and a risk to children, and reflects that the elders were not concerned with child safety but rather with keeping their organisation ‘clean’.
F27  The judicial committee’s failure to uphold BCG’s complaint of abuse by BCH conveyed to BCG that the organisation tolerated child sexual abuse within its ranks.
F28  The advice given by the elders to BCG that she not speak about her abuse to anyone had the effect of silencing her.
As a result of this bungled (or worse) investigation, BCG attempted suicide. Her father was later disfellowshipped on a separate charge of “loose conduct and lying,” though a later appeal did confirm the charges of sexual abuse as well.
However, he was still re-instated just three years later.
Upon being informed of this BCG, terrified for the safety of children in the congregation, decided to report her own abuse to the police. She alleges that Ron De Rooy threatened her with disfellowshipping if she did so. De Rooy denied this under oath, just as he denied BCG reporting the abuse of her sisters.
Ron de Rooy on the Witness stand
Ron de Rooy on the Witness stand

 
Among the many damning findings of Senior Counsel on the reinstatement are: (bold is mine)

F31  The decision to reinstate BCH took no account of the risk that BCH posed to children, paid little regard to the fact that he had been disfellowshipped because of child sexual abuse, and was focussed principally on his extra‐marital relationship.
F32  The decision to reinstate BCH took no account of BCH’s failure to apologise to BCG, a factor relevant to consideration of sincere repentance, or of what BCG might have had to say about BCH being reinstated.
F33  The decision to reinstate BCH was disrespectful and unsupportive of BCG.
Nonetheless, BCG took her case to the police. The ARC also found, after testimony from a legal professional involved, that the delays caused by the Watchtower process, and the clumsy nature of the process itself, had rendered much of the evidence inadmissible. Nonetheless, her father was finally convicted on the third trial. What did BCG have to say about this?

245  BCG told the Royal Commission that her experience of the three criminal trials was significantly less traumatic than her experience sitting through the committee meetings.
Today BCG is disfellowshipped, and is currently being shunned by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
A Plea to Elders
It may well be that you are an elder reading this. Perhaps you no longer believe in the faith, but are trapped, not wishing to be shunned by your family and friends. Perhaps you still consider yourself a Witness but believe, as other elders do, that in this specific area the Organization is making a terrible error of judgement.
Whatever the case, if a member of your congregation comes to you with an allegation of sexual abuse, please:
CONTACT THE POLICE

You may lose your privileges of service. But surely that is a small price to pay for being able to look yourself in the mirror and know that, when a vulnerable member of your congregation came to you for help, in the moment they needed you most, you did not fail them.
 
covert-fade-signature
 
 
 
 
 
 
Further reading…
◾Royal Commission findings: Governing Body member Geoffrey Jackson “evasive and unhelpful”
◾Royal Commission findings: Watchtower policies place JW children “at significant risk of sexual abuse”
◾Reveal article: Jehovah’s Witnesses shield child sex abusers from police, report says
◾12 things we learned from Geoffrey Jackson’s testimony at the Royal Commission
◾Royal Commission’s Angus Stewart accuses Watchtower representative of deliberate deception
◾Elders shamed under questioning by the Royal Commission
◾Australian Royal Commission hears that 1,006 alleged child sex abusers were covered up by Watchtower
◾Stephen Lett slams “apostate-driven lies and dishonesties” concerning child abuse record
◾JWsurvey articles on child abuse



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134 Responses to Royal Commission findings: Jehovah’s Witness elders left abuse survivors “silenced and unsupported”


Newer Comments →
 

 pj wilcox says:

 December 14, 2015 at 9:15 am
 

Thank you for this article. Job well done. These types of incidents need to be told. Keep up the good work
Reply
 
 

 Ruthlee says:

 December 14, 2015 at 9:38 am
 

Faithless wicked men Will be outed it is just time now. This is one crazy flawed religion that is not worth the paper it is written upon, let alone the heart of the people. They most certainly are Not followers of Jesus Christ. This enquiry flags up the most insensitve system conceived. It serves no purpose anymore. To purport to be doing God’s will and blatently refuse to honour God’s compassion, and trusting young people, who they schooled to be truthful in all things really goes to show who their father is who they should go to and who is laughing at all this pain to humanity. You know all Jehovah’s Witness children form an early age are taught to not tell lies so those wicked elders who could not give the young people the benefit of the doubt because of stupid policy and their own stupidity deserve condemnation and some recompense due for their error. As far as watchtower policy well the final analysis to me is let them have it from both barrels its too late for squirming behind naivety and ignorance. After all ignorance is no excuse of the law be that the secular one or the God law they are supposed to be under. Mercy not sacrifice.The measure they have been measuring out over the past 50 years is shoddy workmanship and will fall apart. There is nothing refined or pure about dirty policies just victims and distasteful conduct along with downright lies. I am officially ashamed to have been part of this religion. it is God dishonouring and we will all get tarred with the same brush. A reputation shot to bits cannot be patched together and made to look good it just won’t work. Those that have eyes OPEN THEM! ruthlee
Reply
 

 Willy says:

 December 14, 2015 at 12:23 pm
 

Ruth, knowing several victims of sexual abuse and gross incompetence on the part of the Elders and Watchtower Society, when will this Organization finally fail?
My friend in the Mid West was abused by her father along with her six sisters and the Elder Body did nothing.Seven Sisters were forced to provide explicit sexual descriptions while men in their 40s to 70s sat back. Her comment to me was “I always wondered if they had a bottle of lotion and sock under the table because it was horrible reliving our abuse, they were emotionless and immune to empath or had no compassion for my sisters!”
I don’t understand how the Elders and Watchtower Society could allow the father to continue as the PO when all these allegations were becoming more public. The girls were told to shut their mouths, they were told “don’t go to the police because it will bring reproach on Jehovah’s Name.” Did you know all seven of the sisters are obese, suffer severe depression and two of them killed them selves? Team Watchtower is a losing Team!
Watchtower want’s Happy Shiny People, they want all the members they destroyed to leave the Kingdom Hall so these Survivors won’t tell their stories and show the Watchtower Organization is a Fake Christian Religion! Its not fair to attack all Christian Religions as evil when their not following Christ’s Commandments, Jehovah’s Witnesses are a “Cult of Doom” and need their Tax Status along with other Cults removed and forced to pay back taxes on all donations they received.
How many Jehovah’s Witnesses do you see offering off help to victims of Mass Shooting, their MIA or might set up a Literature Cart near but they have no skills to help. Every evil event I hear “How many Brothers or Sisters were there?” and “Oh, those jobs required a education or college degree so I am sure no JW died, Praise Jehovah for keeping his People Safe!”
Reply
 
 

 Bad Penny says:

 December 14, 2015 at 7:29 pm
 

I agree with you ruthlee.
 I too am ashamed to think I was a part of this. I was only thinking today how much I hurt my dear Mother when I became a JW. It was a source of contention right up until she died. Now I just want to hug her and say I am sorry – but it’s too late.
 Let’s face it, we too were innocent victims of WT deceit and lies. If not physically abused we have certainly been mentally abused. Many have, (including me) gone through depression and some have even committed suicide because of the WT policies. We won’t get any compensation for our ‘abuse’. The best we can hope for is that, as you say, they get full recompense for their error.
 May the Royal Commission findings go Global and destroy this mind controlling cult, AMEN.

Reply
 
 
 

 Imgonaburn says:

 December 14, 2015 at 10:03 am
 

I left the jws 4 years ago. I am not disfellowshipped. My husband left too but returned a year later. I spoke with him about the commissions findings. His attitude was ‘its old news’ and ‘this sort of thing went on a lot in the 70’s’, ‘it’s not like that any longer’- ‘the society has made changes’ blah blah blah
 His response made me sooo angry I had to walk away. Even if what he claims is true (which it isn’t!) then why would anybody choose to gloss over the fact that regardless of how long ago this took place there were still CHILDREN that were damaged by the practises of this religion and its overseers. . My adult children who are still members would consider me an apostate if I mentioned it to them.
 I wish they would wake up and be brave enough to question the organisations behaviour!

Reply
 
 

 Ruthlee says:

 December 14, 2015 at 10:15 am
 

Ive had a thought about inheritance. Let’s say the current GB have inherited a weak structure with rotten policies. Not their fault technically but in a way even more reason to overhaul the whole system . To start with an unconditional apology would be a step in the right direction. Instead of denying it all happened and blaming everyone else ,its time to press on to maturity take some responsibility and acknowledge it all happened and God was not interested ,not one bit and that it was mankind’s doing. They could grow their book club along new lines and may get some credibility back.Some buildings do need demolishing for the safety of all concerned no point weeping over dryrot and faulty foundations Just because you have an inheritance does not mean you are rich that can be a delusion , a castle in the sky. They need a reality check and realise how poor they have become. ruthlee
Reply
 

 Simon Kestral says:

 December 14, 2015 at 11:30 am
 

In 1881 Russell said the body of Christ (144,000) was the faithful and discreet slave, and he thought himself to be among that number. As the GB does today, he falsely claimed the title for himself.
WT’s authority stands on its claim to the title “faithful and discreet slave.” Without that title, their associated claim of authority is false. From the beginning, WT never had any authority from God.
WT is a house with leprosy:
Leviticus 14:45 “He shall therefore tear down the house, its stones, and its timbers, and all the plaster of the house, and he shall take them outside the city to an unclean place (New American Standard Bible).
WT cannot be fixed. It can only be torn down. You can’t build a house of truth on a foundation of lies.
Reply
 

 Thinker says:

 December 14, 2015 at 10:31 pm
 

In response to the statement that the “WT never had any authority from God” here are my thoughts for what they are worth: I have been aware of, or witness to, a number of sinful acts by elders, and their relatives or friends. In every case, nothing more than a slap on the hand was given. These men remained in their positions of oversight, as their cohorts patted themselves on the back. Every time I prayed sincerely for these men to be fully exposed and dealt with appropriately. I could not understand why they got away with deeds that they should have been removed, reproved, or disfellowshipped for. Then duhhhhhhh……it finally dawned on me. Why should God care–it’s not His organization! A wake-up call that helped me get out of it.
Reply
 
 

 Depressed Sheep says:

 December 15, 2015 at 3:24 pm
 

Simon, well said………WT cannot be fixed.It is a house with leprosy. The God of mercy will destroy those who have mislead his sheeps.
Reply
 
 
 
 

 M Saurus says:

 December 14, 2015 at 11:01 am
 

Great article.
As someone who faded with my husband and son 4 years ago, I’ve had comments made to me on this site that it was easy for me since my husband and son faded as well. It was easier than for some, but still difficult.
I understand that it’s hard to do if your immediate family is still in. But usually the right thing to do IS hard.
My husband and I were in since early childhood and my son was born in. We had made hundreds of “friends” over the years – and all of them are shunning us. That is hard. But do I really want to be friends with someone who has no problem dropping me without a word if I leave their religion? What have I lost? Not a REAL friend.
My mother is still in – she hasn’t spoken to us in a long time. That is hard. I believe that a real mother would never shun her daughter for having different beliefs. It’s HER CHOICE to do so since I don’t believe what she does. The org means more to her than I do. It’s a sad realization, but in this case I really don’t have a mother – because a real one wouldn’t treat me this way.
We are calling the Witnesses hypocrites – how hypocritical is it to remain part of an organization when you know (and comment on) how horrible they are just to remain close to people who only care about you if you are “one of them”?
I’m sure I’ll get a lot of negative responses, and I know everyone’s case is different. But we can, and should do “hard” things – if they are the right thing to do. The freedom and relief you will feel cannot be explained.
Reply
 

 Cesar Arguelles says:

 December 14, 2015 at 11:55 am
 

I totally agree with you. Perhaps if all the ones that are in, started coming out, then it would be a wake up call for our those still in.
Reply
 
 

 John Baptist says:

 December 14, 2015 at 2:50 pm
 

Bravo for you in getting out. Is it better to have it hard but be true to oneself? Absolutely!! Everyone is always trying to be someone your not. Be yourself and do the right thing! Peace is priceless!
Reply
 
 

 ForestDaughter says:

 December 15, 2015 at 12:51 am
 

Yes, although it was a lot easier for me and my son to leave as we had no other relatives in, it was four years from wanting to leave to actually leaving due to the fear of Armageddon. The journey out for me included having a mental breakdown on the way, so we should never underestimate the dangerous hold and fear this organisation, and others like it, have on it’s members.
Reply
 

 dee says:

 December 15, 2015 at 2:11 am
 

Faith at gunpoint!
 The WT claims that hellfire is unscriptural, yet what is the difference between the threat of hellfire vs the threat of Armageddon?

Religion certainly knows how to exploit the power of fear to their advantage in order to control people emotionally.
Reply
 

 Will says:

 December 15, 2015 at 8:47 am
 

dee, no difference at all. A threat is a threat, either through eternal damnation or “everlasting destruction”. It’s all the same.
Reply
 
 
 

 Janice Gilbert says:

 December 16, 2015 at 5:03 pm
 

Bravo brave girl.
Reply
 
 
 

 Justin (formerly J*L*C*R) says:

 December 15, 2015 at 7:06 am
 

Excellent Comment @M Saurus! I know how difficult it can be to leave but after I realized that the JW’s were a mind controlling cult…I had to make the right choice and leave. Yes, that had consequences in regard to shunning but like you say…doing what’s right is often hard.
 Sometimes, in order to do what’s right…you have to be willing to accept the consequences…but it is still the right thing to do…continue to be true to yourself and enjoy your freedom. Congrats!

Reply
 
 
 

 Pow says:

 December 14, 2015 at 11:11 am
 

Wow, l fall in that final paragraph, still in, serving, but realize that we are sooo wrong.
 Kinda waiting for the shoe to drop…when I have been approached as of late my response has been “you need to call the authorities ” not me. But, the reality is the root of the problem is the same but the organization is aggressively attempting to cover their tracks and count on the sheeple to have a very short memory. Here it is we belong to a religion that is largely based on circumstantial evidence of events that took place 2000 years ago on one fateful nite, yet what happened 20 or 30 years ago, is considered ancient history and impractical and impossible to verify, and then even if it is, it’s considered irrelevant. ..really,…it’s for that reason that our real history (Rutherford, Russell and the like), mise well be the story of Santa Claus, great story who really cares about the facts.

Reply
 
 

 eyes opened says:

 December 14, 2015 at 11:42 am
 

A well done series of articles Covert Fade. Things going on within the organization make me want to shout it from the rooftop, however, it takes a lot of thought and discernment to reach such highly indoctrinated family and friends. Thanks for your research and thoughtful writing.
Regards
Reply
 
 

 Pow says:

 December 14, 2015 at 11:55 am
 

One more comment, ,,the apparent failure of the organization to properly handle child abuse cases, was not simply a failure to comprehend the magnitude of the problem, we keep far to many records for that, and besides, since the early 90s the branch has demanded to be directly involved in every case from the start. So there has to be another explanation…..
Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 14, 2015 at 9:56 pm
 

I would say, if there is a Devil, THAT’S the explanation — Satan, the “Father of the Lie”, the Tormentor of Humans.
Reply
 
 

 Sarah says:

 December 15, 2015 at 6:49 am
 

It’s willfully ignoring principles of justice which the Bible outlines. Judicial hearings should be public and if young people do not wish, or are unable, to relate their problems they should be allowed to have a spokesperson do it for them, even if it is a woman, while the abused person stays out of the hearing. There is an old article in the 1997 Awake on the Inquisition, which denounced it on the basis that the accused person was not allowed proper legal representation and much was kept secret. I’d say this article denounces WT quite well.
Reply
 

 Winston Smith says:

 December 16, 2015 at 10:37 am
 

@Sarah
 Matthew 23:23, 24:“Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! You pay a tenth of mint, dill, and cumin, yet you have neglected the more important matters of the law—justice, mercy, and faith. These things should have been done without neglecting the others. Blind guides! You strain out a gnat, yet gulp down a camel!

Justice and mercy elude this organization, while they prefer to waste time deliberating on which pagan practices are acceptable or not or which medical procedures are okay, or in whatever other ways they can go beyond what is written.
They are too busy nitpicking to be bothered with justice!
WS
Reply
 
 
 
 

 Hoodwinked says:

 December 14, 2015 at 11:59 am
 

Thank you for the article.
We unfortunately have had to endure the meeting with the elders after our child spoke up about being abused by an ex-elder. I can agree with BGC that what goes on in those meetings is truly traumatic!
 It’s been over 7 years and I still can close my eyes and see my young child being interrogated by elders. Men she was taught from infancy to respect sitting across the couch asking the same questions over and over again. Even at her young age, she felt they didn’t believe her.
 Imagine the guilt her father and I had after unknowingly exposing her to this type of questioning, I truly believed they were there to help us…that’s what we were taught after all!
 Elders are doing more damage then they know by questioning victims of abuse, they have no training whatsoever.
 Please, as a mother who is dealing with the aftermath of this, I beg any elder to follow what was said at the end of this article. Contact the police, let them do what they were professionally trained to do in these cases.

Reply
 
 

 Mama Joy says:

 December 14, 2015 at 12:13 pm
 

The violence that happens to someone who is sexually abused is horrific and monstrous. For the JW Org. to treat this lightly, it is showing everyone just how little they think of a child’s wellbeing and how much they think of protecting their own reputation. Karma is: They cause their own reputation to be ruined by hiding such evil.
Reply
 
 

 Rowland Nelken says:

 December 14, 2015 at 1:04 pm
 

It is tragic, but also encouraging, to read of so many Witnesses, who no longer believe all the ever changing Watchtower drivel, but feel obliged, for family unity, to go through the motions of dreary meeting attendance, book studies and door knocking.
Expansion is at a standstill, even with sanctions like shunning, and desperate moves to dunk the kids before they are old enough to think for themselves and defy their parents.
It will take time, but the oceans of well deserved ghastly and horrific publicity such as provided by this and forthcoming Royal Commissions, will surely be the end of this grubby little misery making cult.
Reply
 
 

 Searcher says:

 December 14, 2015 at 2:38 pm
 

We all need to write letters to major video news magazine shows in our respective countries to ‘tip-off’ the producers about this story. Stories like this, unfortunately, sell a lot of press here in the USA. Anything to do with sex scandals or sexual crime get front page billing. This should be a whopper for the press and they are missing the boat here. Should I bring dishonor on Jehoviah’s organization? YES. Because this is NOT Jehoviah’s, God’s, or whatever you wish to call it. This case and the uncaring leadership is proof. It should be exposed for all it’s worth!
Reply
 

 M Saurus says:

 December 14, 2015 at 2:55 pm
 

Searcher, you misspelled Jehovah twice in your comment. Not to be paranoid, but are you for real? No Witness would do that….
Reply
 

 Searcher says:

 December 15, 2015 at 10:00 am
 

Sorry. Fat fingers I guess?
Reply
 
 

 Searcher says:

 December 15, 2015 at 10:48 am
 

Or maybe a fat head. :)
Reply
 
 
 

 Janice Gilbert says:

 December 14, 2015 at 5:59 pm
 

Go for it. I have considered doing the same.
Reply
 

 ForestDaughter says:

 December 15, 2015 at 12:57 am
 

Lol! Me too. It’s a name I can’t read, say or think of without some feeling of distaste, so any misspelling or deliberate tinkering with the word sounds good to me. :)
Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 15, 2015 at 6:59 pm
 

Me too. I’m SICK of hearing the word “jehovah”.
Reply
 

 Ruthlee says:

 December 16, 2015 at 4:25 am
 

Dare I say It I would rather hear the name Jesus from Christians. Oh well Jdubs are not Christians shame isn’t it. It took 100 years to work that out .ruthlee

 
 

 Winston Smith says:

 December 16, 2015 at 6:19 pm
 

I started and cancelled a reply to this string 3 times – it’s hard to articulate my thoughts on this.
I do get uncomfortable when I hear or see the name “Jehovah” as well. But I have mixed feelings about that.
While we will likely never know the correct pronunciation of the Tetragrammaton, I still recognize the name “Jehovah” as assigned to it in the English language.
It’s sad – the reproach that the JW org has brought upon this name. There are Christian denominations out there that recognize this name as representing God, the Father, or the Creator in a positive way.
But the JW’s have associated the name with a vindictive, vengeful, mean-spirited punisher. They certainly have not sanctified this name as they claim. I definitely avoid use of the name and simply refer to God or the Creator.
That’s my two cents, anyway.
WS

 
 
 
 
 

 Meredith J says:

 December 17, 2015 at 7:40 pm
 

Probably people feel bad about using that name because it has been added to the Bible when it originally wasn’t there.http://www.bible.ca/jw-YHWH.htm
Reply
 
 
 

 jeff canning says:

 December 14, 2015 at 3:26 pm
 

Shouldn’t be surprised that they lie, they lied about 1975 and brought countless thousands into their nest. Survey is doing a great job and many years from now when the Watchtower is just a distant sad memory the good folks at Survey can kick back in their rocking chairs out on their porches and proclaim “We had a hand in that…” And they can be proud as we are of them.
Reply
 
 

 Average Joe says:

 December 14, 2015 at 3:36 pm
 

Lovely sentiments and plea at the end.
 I know there are still some decent elders amongst us. I would hate to come across an abuse case but even so, the victim needs all the love & support they can get, so it’s our human duty to get them the professional help they need.
 I would like to see the WTS TRY and remove me as an elder for reporting or for helping a victim report a JW abuse to the police! That’s publicity they wouldn’t want.

Reply
 

 Chiafade says:

 December 14, 2015 at 6:25 pm
 

Well Joe we know they wouldn’t say a word. Their policy already states that “any brother who contacts the authorities should not be criticised”.
Your outspokenness will likely spell the end of your service as an elder. There are alot of good men just trying to do the right thing. The right thing as they’ve been taught that is. I’ve known many that when presented with situations like BCGs have stepped down and stated ” serving as an elder is too awesome a responsibility for me”. After which they went inactive.

The watchtower society/JW.org will be their own undoing. They will push away their brightest and in many cases their most loyal which is very self defeating. It is possible that honest people will eventually take over the leadership but even that is a death sentence for the org.
One only needs to look at the end result for similar groups to see the direction watchtower is heading towards. An example can be found in the group known as the worldwide church of God. Their organizational structure closely mirrored that of the watchtower society complete with a governing body who yielded only to the President and founder of the group. Disfellowshipping, misleading and damaging policies, false prophecies, you name it. Many suffered as a result.
Eventually the founder died and left a successor. The successor was a very honest man who after his appointment wrote a letter to all congregations. The letter can be summed up in these words : “everything you were taught are lies and mistaken concepts of men. We are sorry for misleading you and the suffering that was caused”.
The organization shortly crumbled after that with small splinter groups forming. The most prominent being found in Pennsylvania. A mere shadow of its parent organization.
I believe that the watchtower organization knows that this will be the end result. Their goal is self preservation without the consideration of the people in mind. How long can this go on? Who knows, but it can’t and won’t go on forever.
Reply
 
 

 M Saurus says:

 December 15, 2015 at 11:05 am
 

Joe – you should remove yourself! How can you still be an elder with all this stuff going on??
Reply
 

 Average Joe says:

 December 16, 2015 at 12:40 am
 

@M SAURUS
 To answer your question: because
 1) Somebody has to make sure the congregation is looked after properly and ensure that the elders don’t enforce their own rules of men. The brothers & sisters need to have someone to back them up and it’s a lot harder to do that if you’re not an elder as unfortunately there’s always one who tries to abuse his power.
 2) To my knowledge we have not had a single case of child or domestic abuse. If we did ever come across one, then at least the congregation knows they can count on me for support, especially with helping them to get professional help or from the authorities.
 3) I have many good friends amongst my brothers & sisters in the cong.
 At times it is very difficult and maybe one day I will relinquish my privilege if things continue their spiral downwards in the WTS. In the meantime, I do what I can and have a very clear conscience with God. Thanks.

Reply
 

 Ruthlee says:

 December 16, 2015 at 4:31 am
 

Ave Joe I totally agree with you .Within we are rapidly losing the voice of reason and I believe brothers like you will be the safe haven at the end because when this does come crashing around their ears in ruins ,some of the weaker sheepw ill need solid support. It is tricky though because of continually having to listen to garbage and misapplied scripture .That becomes wearisome to the soul but Jesus put up with a lot rubbish so must we .Keep on keeping on bro reguards ruthlee
Reply
 

 Average Joe says:

 December 16, 2015 at 8:06 am
 

@RUTHLEE
 Thanks Ruth if I’m honest though, I’d like to think it will be the average brother & sister who will be the safe havens, the ones who already put themselves out for others in spite of hardships. Obviously there are some good elders & servants too but many already abuse their position so I wouldn’t expect to get much help from them when push comes to shove.


 
 

 Winston Smith says:

 December 16, 2015 at 4:08 pm
 

“Within we are rapidly losing the voice of reason”
Ever read Atlas Shrugged by Ayn Rand? All the men of reason leave society because of inane control by the government.
I resigned several years back because i was being told I had to condemn the innocent and exonerate the wicked. It was a matter of principle. Faded sometime later.
WS

 
 
 

 Simon Kestral says:

 December 16, 2015 at 4:55 am
 

If someone asks who is “the faithful and discreet slave” what do you say? You believe the GB’s claim to that title?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ekh4wXdKTe4
To keep your circle of “friends” you must tell WT lies to householders when out in service.
Reply
 

 Average Joe says:

 December 16, 2015 at 7:57 am
 

@SIMON
 Thanks for the question but do you honestly think that is a question the average householder asks a JW? I’ve never come across it.
 In light of all current events, I very much doubt their claim, especially as the WT itself points out that the FDS won’t be appointed over all Christ’s belongings until just after the Great Tribulation.
 A lot of teachings I grew up with in the 70s & 80s I still believe as they make sense to me. I’d rather believe there is a supreme God with a Master Plan for this earth, instead of the alternative that there is nothing.
 As I’ve said in many other comments, I’m sorry if my stance annoys the JW and/or WTS haters but that’s me. I’m trying to be the best human being I can be and nobody else has the right to judge me at the end of the day, as long as I don’t purposefully harm anyone.
 Going back to your question though, I’d honestly have to say that “I have my doubts” and we will have to wait until the end to see who really are the FDS. Hope that answers your question.


 
 

 Chiafade says:

 December 16, 2015 at 8:23 am
 

Not only do you have to support and teach the lies Simon but you also have to participate in the kangaroo court as an elder. That means active participation in the process of judging and shunning.
I understand what Joe is trying to do and I applaud his desire to support his “friends”. But those same friends, good as they are, will drop him as soon as hes removed and disfellowshipped.
It’s him and other honest men against the JW system. The system can’t be beat or won over. It doesn’t want to change or sees any need to. It’s a cult and like any cult the leadership is always right no matter what. The good men with conscience’s the non robots are buried and often suffer physically and mentally. I personally have seen many examples of that. Heart trouble, depression, you name it. They would be the ones to say ” why is the society making the friends do that it’s too much” while the robot elders would say “MOTHER knows best brother honest”.

 
 
 

 Simon Kestral says:

 December 16, 2015 at 9:55 am
 

You can’t hide it from the householder forever. WT uses it to support their claim of authority. The householder must learn it to become a JW like you. You want them to get them baptized “as one of Jehovah’s Witnesses in association with God’s spirit-directed organization” don’t you?
If don’t want others judging you, how can you serve as an elder on JW judicial committees? You don’t consider that judging?
When I left WT, I retained Christian belief. I separate WT lies from Bible truth.
I can understand you don’t want to lose friends. That’s the real reason people waking up stay in. It’s hard to start over. But there is life beyond WT.
Please see the video link I posted above. It’s a Bible based talk in KH format, with convincing common sense reasoning.
Reply
 
 

 M Saurus says:

 December 16, 2015 at 10:48 am
 

Joe. How many of those “good” friends would still be friends with you if you left the org? Zero. So are you just afraid of being lonely? You will find better friends, ones that do not drop you when you no longer practice a certain religion.
And although it’s very noble of you to want to stay in to protect the congregation – it won’t work. You are guilty by association.
You can still retain some or all of your beliefs – you need to be true to yourself.
Reply
 

 Covert Fade says:

 December 16, 2015 at 4:59 pm
 

On this issue, it’s always very tempting to tell someone what they “should” do, or what we would do in their shoes, and I understand the reasons for that.
But whilst I understand the motives and know that they are will intentioned, please remember that we are not them. We are not in their shoes, we are not the ones living their life, and ultimately a choice like this is one on the person themselves can make.
They should make it based on their own conscience, and feel no obligation to justify it to others.
Awake JW’s who are still inside can perform significant acts of kindness towards the flock, and also are significantly placed to carry out activism that official exJW’s cannot (more than one victory against the cult has come from people inside the organisation, often awake Elders, leaking things out at the proper time).
Likewise, they will also encounter unique ethical hurdles that ex JW’s do not, such as how to cope with needing to be seen engaging in indoctrination.
The ethical dilemmas and stresses we all carry are unique to us, but whatever your choice and whatever your path, make the one you feel is genuinely right, and live it.
Just my 2 cents

 
 

 Winston Smith says:

 December 16, 2015 at 7:19 pm
 

Excellent point Covert Fade. We benefit from people like Average Joe on the inside.
WS

 
 
 

 Idontknowhatodo says:

 December 17, 2015 at 2:19 am
 

Average Joe I felt the same about you when I first came to this site but changed my opinion over a period of time and closely reading your comments… I think and hope that there are more like you because we need a source of sanity in the congregations of people allowing their lives to be ruled by incompetent men who care little for them….we need the Average Joe’s of this world to be that safe haven that ruthlee mentioned…I will say Average Joe you know they will come for you in the end because you will not be able to toe the party line…your improved conscience will not let you … so just build some relationships outside the congregation and make a life to fall onto when everything involved with jws disintegrates… Im trying to do that and though hard it is part of the awakening process… meanwhile thanks for trying to help the teetering rank and file… we need it…especially slow faders like me… just watch your back AJ.
Reply
 

 Average Joe says:

 December 17, 2015 at 10:09 am
 

@Idontknowwhatodo et al…
I also read your comments carefully and it is a great relief to know that others feel similar to me and can, to a lesser or greater degree, comprehend the major guilt that I still feel for speaking out against those who direct what I feel to be God’s spirit directed organisation. If I get destroyed at Armageddon for trying to display Christlike characteristics and speak out against injustice in the organisation then so be it, but I don’t believe in a vengeful God like that.
 I haven’t served on a JC as yet but I can assure you (and I know that’s difficult as you don’t know me) that I’m not easily swayed by what others think. We have had a few cases where some on the body have tried to impose their own opinions and harsh judgments on others and convince us to do the same but I have always spoken out and put a stop to it. I do speak up when needs be (the quiet ones are always the worst they say!) and have recently taken to quoting a passage from a recent WT study that stated ‘as elders, showing love to others is demonstrated by taking them at their word’. So until facts prove otherwise, if a brother or sister tells us something then we shouldn’t doubt it. Nor should we doubt their motives for doing/saying something. What really gets my goat is when an elder (or anyone for that matter) “befriends” you on Social Media then trolls your content to later report on what they don’t feel is “appropriate behaviour”. We have one like that in our cong so after he tried to get one of our youths disciplined (for something he’d jumped to conclusions about after seeing the photo), I had a private chat with all the youths in our cong that are on Social Media and warned them. I actually advised them to remove him from their list of contacts along with his kids so they wouldn’t be spied upon. So sad that we have to face this stuff in this day and age and that I have to protect the flock from some of the very shepherds who are supposed to be caring from it.
 I am in no way perfect, don’t get me wrong; I have many flaws but I would never resort to petty things like that or abuse my power to force what I think on others.

It’s very difficult waking up and, as has been pointed out by other posters, there is the real possibility of getting shunned by others within the cong. Thankfully though, I too have formed a very large network outside the organisation over the years and have many good friends who are not JWs so it wouldn’t be the end of the world for me. I suppose I’ve always been a bit of a rebel really in the view of the WTS standards. It’s more for my immediate family that I don’t want to disappoint.
Sorry for the lengthy post but thanks to all of you for your feedback. I do read it all even though I don’t always agree and for those of you in a similar difficult situation (and that still believe in God), you’re in my thoughts and prayers.
 AJ


 
 
 
 
 

 Depressed says:

 December 15, 2015 at 4:15 pm
 

You are brave and thank you for standing up. At times it is so difficult trying to help love ones wake up and see that the WT is a cult. I have to stay under the radar because some of the elders are working extremely hard to disfellowship me for warning members to report sex abuse cases to the police and not the elders. So far, to my knowledge no one has directly called my name. the elders are basing this on hearsay. Nevertheless, I am still afraid. It is very uncomfortable when the elders are watching my every move. Not a good feeling. I pray that soon the core of the WT and its policies are exposed for their wicked works.
Reply
 

 Bad Penny says:

 December 15, 2015 at 6:38 pm
 

Depressed –
I am sorry that you have to live in fear of the elders. Why? They should be shepherds and protectors of the flock. It is them that should feel guilty by allowing wolves to remain in the congregation, not you! Just think of them as ‘dust dressed up’, they cannot kill you. If they try to disfellowship you, count it as a privilege for standing up for truth. They would probably just try to reprove you. That could be an opportunity to slowly fade whilst still keeping contact with your family.
 If, or when, you do escape, it will feel like a weight has been lifted off your shoulders. You start to breathe the air and appreciate living free.

Reply
 
 
 
 

 Kat says:

 December 14, 2015 at 4:46 pm
 

Imgonaburn.
Maybe you could inform your husband that according to Tool’s testimony they still get 3 or 4 a month of complaints and allegations of child sexual abuse this in Australia alone, so the problem is not old and these are the ones they know about or have been reported.
So clearly shows that the GB policies have not worked and children are still suffering, their keeping this from the flock only gives the abusers more freedom to abuse, the two witness rule is dangerous and has to be addressed, only when the GB are forced by law will they do anything, and then it will be kept from the flock with elders being privy to information, until the elders allow their conscience to be their guide nothing much will change.
Its all about protecting the orgs image not children, but their days are numbered, all they can do now is make sure the flock believe its not their fault they will continue to do this by propaganda and blame.
Reply
 

 Imgonaburn says:

 December 14, 2015 at 6:32 pm
 

Kat,
 Thank you for your response. I will try and find the testimony that you referred to re 3-4 cases still occuring per month in Australia. Then I will mention it to my husband when I get the right opportunity. He’s a bit traumatised of late as I’ve put up a Christmas tree and garlands in one of our living rooms at the rear of our house. It’s the first time I’ve ever had the pleasure of doing such an outrageous thing lol. Out of respect for him it’s not in full view of passers by.
 I’ve told them (my jw family members) that life is for living and I’m getting on with mine. I’ve had the conversations with them about how disfellowshipping is a cruel and unusual punishment etc and that a person should be able to leave the religion without losing their family. They insist that they themselves are not forced to remain [within religion] out of fear of reprisal/ consequences and are happy to serve Jehovah as pioneers/volunteers. They also say that if I choose to celebrate Christmas by having a Xmas tree they will stay away from our home til the new year when the festivities are over.
 It will be interesting to see if the elders ‘come after me’ because of my celebrating Christmas because it’s been over 4 years since I last attended a meeting. It’s widely known in the local community that I’m not a jw any more, mainly because I tell everyone. Ha!
 I’m not aggressively opposed to the religion as I think it’s counter productive. What’s the saying?… Innocent as serpents and cautious as doves? I do try to slip a little something into the conversation just now and then to try and make them think independently though. How they can shut their powers of reason off when it comes to issues surrounding child abuse within the org though is beyond me!!

Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 14, 2015 at 10:12 pm
 

Nice work!! Resistance starts in the home! BTW I love your turnaround of the quote (still not sure if it was intentional): “Innocent as SERPENTS and cautious as DOVES” — I think it’s an improvement — after all, doves are probably a lot more cautious than serpents (which must take risks hunting), and being as innocent as a dove could get a person SQUASHED in this world. Nice work again!! That’s my new mantra.
Reply
 

 Imgonaburn says:

 December 15, 2015 at 5:50 pm
 

Yes, my mis-quoting scripture was intentional.
 Feet shod with the good shoes of Pete.
 Stay sane the vedil.
 I have a lot more time on my hands now that I’m no longer preparing for meetings, attending meetings, dragging children to meeting, going on ministry etc etc

Reply
 
 
 

 Tara says:

 December 15, 2015 at 8:52 am
 

My son in law is not a JW – his mother is. He married my daughter – JW (df’d because she got pregnant to him and df’d – now reinstated but fading) He put up a tree and lots of lights outside the house :) My living room has some small signs of rebellion – some baubles and shiny things… I have a stack of gifts for my grandbabies wrapped and in the corner. I gave Christmas cards to clients this year. No one visits me from the hall anyway so next year maybe a tree. The whole abuse thing makes me sick and ashamed. I am now telling clients I am fading from the Org. and they are supporting me.
Reply
 

 Imgonaburn says:

 December 15, 2015 at 6:12 pm
 

I purchased most of my Xmas decorations and tree in the post Xmas/ January sales last Xmas. I kept them all in a spare wardrobe for months. My husband knew about my plans well in advance. I told my 2 adult JW son and daughter more recently. We’ve always had coloured lights as part of our year round decor. I’d love to decorate the front of our house with xmas icicle type lights and have it all twinkly! Maybe next year you will have a Xmas tree in your home and I will throw some lights on a tree in my garden! πŸ˜‰
I like to think that my leaving the religion and demonstrating to my family that I’m happier without it will make it easier for them to leave should they decide to do so in the future. At least they won’t have to worry that by leaving they will lose me! It’s such a frightening prospect- getting dfd and being shunned by family and friends that I couldn’t criticise others for being too scared to leave. Everybody has to do what’s best for themselves until the time is right for them.

Reply
 
 
 

 Meredith J says:

 December 17, 2015 at 7:51 pm
 

Imgonaburn Go for it. How good does it feel? I feel proud to be a Christian and enjoy the festive season related to the birth of Christ. Did you know that the Cedars of Lebanon were pine trees?
Reply
 
 
 
 

 Janice Gilbert says:

 December 14, 2015 at 5:57 pm
 

Thank you for this article. I strongly believe this, since a former friend of mine told me that she had been told that she could be disfellowshipped if she went to the police. Talk about putting a muzzles on an innocent victim. This is not the loving organization I once believed in
Reply
 
 

 C says:

 December 14, 2015 at 8:42 pm
 

This is my first post on this website, tho I’ve lurked for awhile. This absolutely makes me ill. It is so freaking disgusting that it bothers me physically. I want to fight and puke and cry. There is absolutely no way this can be an organization directed by Jesus.
Despite my queasiness, the article was done very well.
Reply
 

 Searcher says:

 December 15, 2015 at 10:12 am
 

You are so right! Makes me sick too!
No way this can be God’s organization and have all this secrecy and lies.
Reply
 
 
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 14, 2015 at 10:31 pm
 

Speaking from personal experience, it is a real struggle making the decision, then leaving the Borg. No question. Just like any other major life decision. But, in considering the drawbacks, also take into account the benefits, such as FREEDOM, the ability to be an INDIVIDUAL, choose your OWN dress/grooming, lifestyle, associates, etc. “Every dark cloud has a silver lining.” “When one door closes, another one opens.” Think back through your life to times when something “negative” happened, which inadvertently and unexpectedly led to something positive, something positive which never would have happened otherwise. I know a guy who was DF’d last spring, and ended up having the best summer of his life, checking off one item after another on his “bucket list”. It may not be that dramatic for everyone, but, like I said, take time to consider the BENEFITS.
 Good Luck :)

Reply
 

 Searcher says:

 December 15, 2015 at 10:42 am
 

“Give me liberty or give me death!” – Patrick Henry, March 1775. That was spoken by an American revolutionary, but it is also very relevant to your thoughts. Freedom isn’t free! It comes with a big price and many people want to take that away from you to satisfy their power hungry ends. Once I got over the fact that they (the elders) would (and they did) destroy my marriage, then I found freedom that is OH SO SWEET. I don’t have to do anything for this evil cult, these self-servant leaders, or try to impress the rank and file in the Kingdom Hall. It is all about weighing the cost vs. the benefits of freedom. The benefits far outweigh the costs. Especially in self-respect.
Reply
 
 
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 14, 2015 at 10:46 pm
 

I put those who deny and/or suppress these cases of abuse, up there with those neo-Nazi Holocaust Deniers. These are horrible crimes and there is absolutely NO excuse for covering them up!!! If WT is concerned about their reputation, I say, “What reputation??” Their squeaky clean rep. is already tainted. By engaging in further coverups, it’s just going to get WORSE. It’s like trying to hold water in your hand, or trying to plug holes in a dam with bubble gum. Get a clue, Watchtower.
Reply
 
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 14, 2015 at 11:35 pm
 

Doesn’t the bible account of the flood say jehovah decided to destroy mankind because ‘the Earth came to be filled with violence’? Well, rape is, by definition, a VIOLENT crime. Ergo, Watchtower is GUILTY of covering up VIOLENCE, something which jehovah purportedly hates.
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 Enuffsenuff says:

 December 15, 2015 at 12:19 am
 

It is interesting about the Watchtower’s reaction to the Royal Commission.
 So far I haven’t seen or heard any sort of apology in an official manner by the WatchTower.
 I haven’t seen or heard any public acknowledgement that WT has changed any policies, re, women, shunning and child abuse.
 I haven’t seen any acts of genuine empathy for any victim and I haven’t heard of any elder standing down in shame over their behaviour at how they have conducted a (sham) judicial case.
 For example Dino Ali, elder on BCG’s case. A complete drongo who refused to accept the confession by the father of BCG.
 Is he still there, et al, dispensing their brand of kangaroo court justice?
 I have not had any word perhaps others have?

Reply
 

 Imgonaburn says:

 December 15, 2015 at 6:45 pm
 

An elder in my former cong stood down a few years ago because of the way a sexual abuse case was handled. There was a sister in the cong who had sexually assaulted her own son and daughters when they were young. Her husband at the time was also a jw. He raped his own daughter to show her how horrible men can be and to illustrate to her how she needs to be careful! (Go figure?!!). Apparently he was a domineering bully towards his entire household so his wife went along with his demands and encouraged her daughters to comply with the abuse. They eventually divorced and she married a brother from our hall. Her children went to the elders about the abuse. The sister denied everything and claimed she couldn’t remember what happened. It ended up a police matter. Both parents were sent to jail. She got 10 years on a charge of sexual assault! He got longer.
 The elder stood down because the sister was not disfellowshipped. She maintained her innocence throughout despite the testimony of her 3 children. It caused a lot of distress to many within the cong. I had already left by then so wasn’t involved in any of the hullabaloo. What I do know though is there was a rota drawn up by some do gooder in the cong to provide transport for her second husband to go visit with her in jail!! After sentencing she was moved to a prison many miles away so the rota was scrapped. The whole saga split the cong. The kh was vandalised and had graffiti spray painted on it about pedophiles. Her abused children got the blame for that but I know it wasn’t them.
 Anyway, in my old cong at least, the elders were very much in favour of getting the police involved. What’s more, one of them on the committee handling the judicial did stand down.

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 'Let it die' says:

 December 15, 2015 at 12:58 am
 

Disagreeing those who claim to speak for God is tantamount with disagreeing with God. You will be viewed by such ones as an apostate, a heretic, a disgruntled one, an a opposer, a Satan.
 Considering Matt 18 judicial procedure one can see that the two witnesses do not necessarily have to eye witness the incident. Bearing in mind the law regarding rape and the single witness in Deu it is quite evident that a single eye witness is sufficient.
 It is quite obvious that this ( the watchtowers stance) is in error and it is equally obvious that this issue is not about what is truthful but rather about power and control, and the believe that these one speak on behalf of God. Having watched a number of the Royal commissions videos again it is clearly apparent that the elders are under the Watchtowers influence to the point were common sense leaves their minds. How very brave of such young women, and all those abuse survivors, to highlight this issue.
 Has the Watchtower listened to these ones and changed their policy’s, after all they speak for God and can not be seen to be fallible.

Reply
 

 dee says:

 December 15, 2015 at 2:40 am
 

“…….after all they speak for God and can not be seen to be fallible”………
an important concept if one is to believe that the Governing Body will rule the world after Armageddon. LOL.
Reply
 

 Searcher says:

 December 15, 2015 at 10:19 am
 

If that bunch of circus clowns (GB) is running the place after Armageddon, then destruction at such event is a mercy kill!
Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 15, 2015 at 7:17 pm
 

LOL
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 dee says:

 December 15, 2015 at 11:37 pm
 

Isn’t it just grand, God is going to replace the governments of the world (including the Australian government which is now unearthing the WT’s child abuse policy flaws) with the GB past and present who will rule in his kingdom over the WT’s promised paradise earth after all these other governments have been destroyed. LOL.
If only the new system would come right now so that earth’s new rulers (the GB) will have their way and be the ones to call the shots! They can’t wait to get their hands on writing those new scrolls that will be opened in the new system – imagine a two witness rule in paradise to deal with the child molesters who will be resurrected from the dead. LOL.
Reply
 

 holy Connoli says:

 December 16, 2015 at 6:45 am
 

@dee. Maybe those child molesters that are resurrected in the New system won’t “desire” children since as the WT says, ” neither will they marry nor be given in marriage” but will be as a EUNECH! lol So that means they will be resurrected castrated.lol

 
 

 dee says:

 December 17, 2015 at 3:23 pm
 

Good one Holi Connoli! ROFLOL!
The new system can’t come soon enough. Castration – what better way to deal with those ressurrected child molesters especially given the fact that it won’t be possible to put resurrected persons to death if they should sin in paradise, since according to the bible: “NEITHER CAN THEY DIE ANYMORE”. Castrate them I say! LOL!
Luke 20:34-36:
“The children of this system of things marry and are given in marriage, but those who have been counted worthy of gaining that system of things and the resurrection from the dead NEITHER MARRY NOR ARE GIVEN IN MARRIAGE. In fact, NEITHER CAN THEY DIE ANY MORE, for THEY ARE LIKE THE ANGELS, and they are God’s children by being children of the resurrection.”

 
 
 
 
 
 

 'Let it die' says:

 December 15, 2015 at 1:54 am
 

Asking Jehovahs Witnesses:- To your knowledge has anyone ever challenged one of Gods decisions (besides the devil) and remained in good standing?
 Has the Watchtower ever enforced a false teaching upon its members with the penalty of disfellowshipping if that person refuses to accept that teaching?
 If it is the case that you accept the Watchtower has acted in this manner then you have to recognise this is not necessarily about what is truthful but rather about authority, control and power.
 In my opinion a Christians conscience, under these conditions, should be 1st and foremost on high alert. In spirit and in truth.

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 Let it die says:

 December 15, 2015 at 2:19 am
 

Dedicated to all those brave young people, fellow activists and my own daughter X
 Peter Gabriel Wallflower live.

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 redpilltwice says:

 December 15, 2015 at 2:38 am
 

Stephen Lett’s earlier comment that this is all “apostate-driven lies and dishonesties” becomes more painful by the day. A modern day WT lie, carved in stone, never to be lost in oblivion. Does this man (or his fellow brothers of Christ) ever look in the mirror and ask himself “What have we done? Let’s apologize, change policies immediately and ask for forgiveness”? Too late probably. Let justice be done for the victims and their families.
 By the way, Ron de Rooy (one of the elders pictured above) is a Dutch name. Is he from The Netherlands?

Reply
 
 

 Hakizimana Jean de Dieu says:

 December 15, 2015 at 2:56 am
 

Sexual abuse is another subtle way of testify Jehovah god and “his/her organization” is the ONLY solution of human problems. Consider the following in their own publications….
*** g81 2/8 p. 19 Incest—The Hidden Crime ***
 She was molested by her grandfather from the age of six until nine. She tried immorality, drugs and psychiatrists, but found in these no relief from her unhappiness.
 Happily, there is help for such a person. However confused and “down” we may be, there is One who is “raising up the lowly one from the very dust,” and we can get to know him by means of the Bible. (Ps. 113:7)

Reply
 
 

 holy Connoli says:

 December 15, 2015 at 5:26 am
 

In the early 80’s as a relatively new JW and a newly appointed Elder I sponsored some JW refugees from Cuba when Castro Kicked out many criminals and a lot of JW’s.I had little money in those days. I did it out of pure love. In my heart I wanted to help my brothers the best I could. I was only working part time at back then and I had 3 kids of my own at home but I had a large home and an extra area to put them in and felt Jehovah had blessed me and I wanted to share my blessings. I contacted the WT and told them I cloud help if anyone needed it. I lived on the West Coast in California and they were in Miami area with 1000’s of other refugees and were so HAPPY to get out. They sent me a family of 5 people. A Father and Mother and a 6 year old child along with the Fathers parents who were maybe in their late 60’s-early 70’s at the time. It was stressful having 5 extra people in the house and they did not speak English nor did we speak Spanish but we did the best we could and I was happy to help. Fast forward a few months and I had a 9 year old daughter and 2 younger boys. One night I got home late from work and it was a meeting night. I was rushing to the meeting as my wife and 2 boys had already gone. The Cubans had gone to their Spanish meeting except for the “grandfather”. Only me and my daughter and the “grandfather” were in my home. My daughter told me she was not feeling well and wanted to stay home that night. I said OK, I will see you in a few hours. The Cuban grandfather said he will watch her? When I left I had a bad feeling bc of the way he was acting and the nervousness he had about him like he was in a hurry to see me leave? After I left he approached my daughter in her bedroom and tried to entice her with some Yoghurt and tried to get into the bed with her and kiss her with his open MOUTH! She panicked and when he left the room for a split second to get food from the fridge she locked the bedroom door! Smart for her at a young age. The next morning she told my wife who immediately called me at work and as soon as my boss at work said I had an important phone call in my heart I knew what had happened bc of my gut feeling! I came home and made the entire family leave that day, He denied it to the Spanish Elders and lied in front of me and said he was only trying to get her some yoghurt? He had his hands on her body and was trying to kiss her mouth! I also found out he had a similar experience in CUBA so once a molester always a Molester! Bc of he 2 witness rule nothing could be done
 to him. I am only glad nothing more serious happened that night.The policy was not to go to the POLICE bc of the bad rap for the Org.Man, AM I glad to be out of that dirt and the “DRAMA” that religion causes wherever it goes. My heart goes out to all of you who have experienced worse abuse and worse experiences for yourselves and you r families. Time will do some healing. Not all but some. I pray for all of you.

Reply
 
 

 Justin (formerly J*L*C*R) says:

 December 15, 2015 at 7:13 am
 

The fallout from this Australian Commission’s hearing is going to shake the Watchtower to it’s core. If there were any undecided victims waiting for the outcome before perusing legal action…they are not waiting anymore.
The GB will need to continue it’s mad dash to unload it’s Brooklyn HQ real estate, and their branch offices, to pay for these cases.
To all JW’s still in…prepare to belly up to the contribution box…and DIG DEEP!
Reply
 

 Peggy says:

 December 15, 2015 at 8:00 am
 

I have to thank everyone here for working hard to keep us informed about the ARC hearings in child abuse. I favor them requiring all JW’s who work with children to under go a back round check. They may do something like this or take away their tax exempt status. In any case as stated the fall out should prove great! And I too bet many more abused victims will come after the WT corporation.
Reply
 
 
 

 Robert67 says:

 December 15, 2015 at 7:39 am
 

The moment when all these self appointed ursurpers who placed the will of a publishing company over that of the mercy Christ tought in scripture.
Elders quivering-
“What is that Jesus?…Wh wh why did we let the children suffer?, well you see the thing is we was just following orders. Did we not shun and tirade and lord ourselves over others in your name to keep them in line? Did we not expell your sheep when they were at their weakest, in your name and under prayer?
 Did we not wash our hands of widows and orphans that couldn’t meet the quotas? Did we not receive our full reward in applause and praise for our actions on the platform on a weekly basis in your name?
 Jesus reply-
 I never knew you! Get away from me, you workers of lawlessness!’

Reply
 

 Ruthlee says:

 December 15, 2015 at 11:35 am
 

spot on Robert ruthlee
Reply
 
 

 Bad Penny says:

 December 15, 2015 at 6:56 pm
 

Robert67 – Nice one!
Reply
 
 
 

 Doc Obvious says:

 December 15, 2015 at 7:49 am
 

There are several correlations between the movie “The Godfather” and the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society. The Godfather is movie about the mafia in New York City. The Godfather is claiming he owns an olive oil business and that he is thoroughly involved in the business. But in reality, it is about killing people who are not with the Godfather. Or, the Godfather wanting to be the top mafia boss, the Don. The Godfather’s family hires a “family lawyer” to protect his mafia from going to jail. The Family lawyer, Tom Hagen, is used when things go wrong and the police are trying to bring to justice the mafia. Later in The Godfather, the police chief has partnered with the Godfather and tries to smooth things over.
One similarity between the film and the Watchtower is their forcing their ideology down your throats and having conditions on their members. The Watchtower uses religion as business to cover the Watchtower’s illegal behavior. When the religion has been unmasked by the authorities and the media for having Child Sexual Abuse, the religion enacts the Bethel family’s lawyers. The Bethel family lawyers try to smooth talk the judicial system into thinking that they are doing their religion and the religion requires the cutting off of wicked people (called disfellowshipping). If the media tries to paint the Watchtower in a bad light. Guess what happens? The Bethel family’s lawyers are at their best trying to smooth over and cover up Watchtower’s illegal mistakes with laws that protect them. One of the Bethel Mafia bosses wishes the Child Sexual Abuse matter with the Watchtower would just “die”. In addition, the boss tries to discredit a journalist in Portugal for not getting two sides of the story. Who knew the Mafia boss was a journalism teacher. However, the journalist stuck to her story and went to the Bethel in Portugal for their side of the story. Unfortunately, the Mafia boss flew the coop with a statement and could not furnish his side of the story.
Another similarity, is how the Watchtower treats their members who think differently from them. Watchtower uses threats to get their members in line. Just like the mafia. You will be swimming with the fishes. You will die at Armageddon if you do not follow what we say.
The Watchtower’s family lawyer(s) have gone all the way to the United States Supreme Court and have smooth talked the Supreme Court justices to see that their way (“religion”) is wholesome for the whole family and they should not have to register with the authorities when recruiting new members in the mafia. I mean the Jehovah’s Witnesses. The buttering up of the authorities is how both the mafia and The Watchtower do things.
It is also amazing how both the movie and the Watchtower are based in New York City. Why do bad things happen in this city?
In order to get protection from the mafia or the Watchtower you need to “donate” to them. In the Godfather, people donate their services and fine gifts to the Godfather. Watchtower is asking for the finer things in life. Stocks and Bonds, CD’s, Savings accounts, etc.
I could go on and on with the similarities. However, these are just a few.
Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 15, 2015 at 7:31 pm
 

Your comparison of Organized Religion, especially this one, to the Mafia, is right on!
Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 15, 2015 at 7:36 pm
 

P.S.
 Why New York City? IMHO, probably because it is one of the World Hubs of money-grubbing Parasites and fame-craving Narcissists.

Reply
 

 Pow says:

 December 16, 2015 at 10:11 am
 

Or….Gotham city….signed the dark knight
Reply
 
 
 
 
 

 Pow says:

 December 15, 2015 at 12:01 pm
 

I will try to share a story, without giving away to much info, but to illustrate that the problems that we have are not just old cases. A few years ago a man moved to our area, he had recently been removed from an appointed position. The letter of introduction was very vague, in some respects inferring he was the victim of slanderous accusations, ,but when pressed for more info…sure enough he was a bonfide molester. …So, parameters were set, which He didn’t appreciate, so he bounced from hall to hall looking for a better reception. Anyway a while back he showed up for service at a combined meeting for service and was assigned to work with sisters from another hall, two of which were teenagers. this was arranged by a bro. from his current congregation. …well some heard about this and quickly called the COBE of his cong. It was reported that the branch had removed his restrictions? ??? This guy was guilty as Sin..the only explanation one can think of is that the victim was finally going to the police and the org. wanted to give impression that they knew nothing.
Reply
 
 

 rob says:

 December 15, 2015 at 12:12 pm
 

In my opinion, to really expose the greediness and corruption of this religion, the government should wipe out the tax free status, impose sanctions or court fines for covered up child abuse and enact legislation which requires this corporation to publish its financial statements.
I think that we would finally see the true colors of this religion. Hit them in the pocket book where it really really hurts.
Reply
 

 eyes opened says:

 December 16, 2015 at 1:34 pm
 

Agreed
Reply
 
 

 Chiafade says:

 December 16, 2015 at 9:22 pm
 

That would be the time when they SCREAM “the great tribulation is here! Satans system is trying to stamp out the good news!”
From there the gb would run and hide. I have absolutely no doubt about that. Especially after Losch’ cowardly refusal to appear before the superior court in California. When you make no qualms about losing millions in donated funds there’s nothing you won’t do to save your own skin.
The org would then crumble with the circuit overseers taking the lead of smaller splinter groups. All this while receiving instructions from the gb in their hidden location. Think it can’t happen? Those arrangements are already in place. What do you think the C.O.s are learning in the schools that they attend. It was a circuit overseer who told me this when I was a swirly eyed devotee being trained for the circuit work.
Reply
 
 
 

 Meredith J says:

 December 15, 2015 at 2:35 pm
 

Covert Fade, thank you so much for that further insight into Watchtower’s wicked flawed system of dealing with child abuse. It is so interesting when these dealings are put under the microscope by the legal profession.
I particularly liked your last point about ‘A Plea To The Elders’. Surely, any elder who is still calling himself that cannot read this and stay with the cult. May the true God and Jesus help them leave however means they can.
Reply
 
 

 Alexandria R says:

 December 15, 2015 at 3:25 pm
 

Jehovah’s Witnesses could get $1 billion for NYC properties
 Associated Press By KAREN MATTHEWS
 55 minutes ago
 Inline image
 NEW YORK (AP) — The Jehovah’s Witnesses, the door-knocking religious group that’s been based in Brooklyn for a century, is selling its headquarters and other properties for an expected price tag of $1 billion or more.

The Witnesses’ move to a town about an hour north of New York City will likely mean the end of the complex’s most well-known feature, the neon “Watchtower” sign advertising the church’s flagship publication. But it will free up hundreds of thousands of square feet for businesses and apartments in a now-trendy neighborhood at the foot of the Brooklyn Bridge.
“It’s going to be incredibly transformative,” said Alexandria Sica, executive director of the DUMBO Improvement District, a business group.
Jehovah’s Witnesses spokesman Richard Devine said the move will allow the organization to operate more efficiently. The church had owned 36 separate Brooklyn properties before it began selling them off in preparation for the move upstate to Warwick. The printing plant where the Witnesses produce Bibles and religious tracts moved from Brooklyn to the town of Wallkill in 2004.
“As we’ve grown as an organization we’ve had to buy scattered properties wherever we could find them,” Devine said. “With a big, scattered campus like that it’s challenging to administer and to maintain.”
The Witnesses bought their 733,000-square-foot headquarters from Squibb Pharmaceuticals for $3 million in 1969. It was placed on the market this month along with a nearby apartment building and a 135,000-square-foot lot. Despite the prominent “Watchtower” sign, the building has no historical designations that would place restrictions on the buyer.
The church has not announced an asking price but Tucker Reed, president of the Downtown Brooklyn Partnership, called $1 billion “a conservative estimate” for the Witnesses’ real estate portfolio.
A partnership including Donald Trump’s son-in-law Jared Kushner purchased a nearby 1.4 million-square-foot complex from the Witnesses in 2013 for $375 million and is developing it as a tech hub, while smaller buildings have sold for varying amounts.
In upstate New York, the Witnesses have purchased hotels and other properties for volunteers building the church’s new headquarters.
The Witnesses have more than 8 million active members worldwide and about 11 million more who attend some services, according to church officials.
Witnesses are required to spread their message door to door and are not allowed to vote, receive blood transfusions or serve in the military.
The organization has been in Brooklyn since 1908 but seems culturally distinct from its gritty-meets-yuppie surroundings.
Church members lead English- and Spanish-language tours of the headquarters, decorated with pastel-toned Bible paintings.
Devine said 100,000 people a year visit the Brooklyn headquarters but the Warwick facility an hour north of the city will get more visitors when it opens in 2017.
“To be honest with you,” he said, “many people find New York City intimidating.”
Sica said she is looking forward to the Witnesses’ move in part because the church’s properties seem off-limits to non-members, with fenced-in parking lots and no street-level retail. “It’s closed off,” she said. “You get that sense of ‘This place is not for the public.'”
But both Sica and Reed said that before they leave the Witnesses should follow through on a promise to redevelop a neighborhood park, which they agreed to do in exchange for a zoning change.
Devine said the Witnesses will fulfill the commitment to build the park “either through our efforts or through the efforts of the new owner. We won’t walk away from it.”
Reply
 
 

 Alexandria R says:

 December 15, 2015 at 3:47 pm
 

I didn’t realize how wealthy the org is.
Reply
 
 

 rikos says:

 December 15, 2015 at 4:33 pm
 

I just finish reading this article and i wish i could vomit at faces of the government body, at elders and any officer of the watchtower. this organization is so corrupt and disgusting. How these people stand on the platforms and preaching ethics?
Reply
 
 

 Alexandria R says:

 December 15, 2015 at 5:10 pm
 

I think many ideas and what many of you have been saying is true. The JW religion actually is a for profit organization. I remember the year they stopped serving food at a convention. I was at my convention at the Cow Palace in San Francisco. It was sad to see the homeless line up for food. They lined up because they had been given food and drink every year before. The brothers had to explain we no longer served free food. The JW organization acts like a for profit business.
Reply
 
 

 Bad Penny says:

 December 15, 2015 at 7:15 pm
 

The long asked question – What are they going to do with all the money from the sale of Brooklyn?
 In Stephen Lett’s broadcast he was saying, ‘There is more going out than there is coming in.’ Yes, come on brothers, ‘lets’ empty your pockets!
 Do they not know?
 Greedy persons will not inherit God’s Kingdom!

Reply
 
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 15, 2015 at 7:59 pm
 

Well, isn’t that just Jim-Dandy? Now that the Trump Family is involved, maybe they can work with WT to come up with a creative solution to their financial problems. How about a Watchtower Casino? I’m sure the GB could conveniently come up with “New Light” to justify it, like they did with the “Overlapping” thing. LOL Call it a form of “theocratic warfare”, or even “theocratic gambling”. The “Kingdom Hotel & Casino”. I wouldn’t put it past them. Like I said, money-grubbing parasites.
Reply
 
 

 Chiafade says:

 December 15, 2015 at 11:19 pm
 

I haven’t read through all of watchtowers rebuttal to the royal commission yet but there is something that I would like to bring to the attention of any and all elders who may be reading these comments.Its this :
9.67 Suggested finding F14 should be amended to : The recommendation of the elders to the branch office that Bill Neill be reappointed as an elder ‘once this has died down’ and their expressed concern ‘that there may be worldly people who also know’ were inappropriate and did not reflect the policy and practice of Jehovahs Witnesses.
This is part of watchtowers rebuttal. Notice that they made no excuses or defense for the brothers who made this statement. All of these years they had no problem with it now all of a sudden its a problem? It was inappropriate?
I want you to take a good hard look at that statement. Those brothers were torn to shreds trying to DEFEND the precious org. Did the org try to shield them for this seemingly harmless statement? Nope and nope. So why should YOU take a bullet for THEM?
Reply
 
 


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Royal Commission findings: Jehovah’s Witness elders left abuse survivors “silenced and unsupported”
avatar 

Posted on December 14, 2015

The shocking treatment of
The shocking treatment of BCB and BCG was brought to light by the Royal Commission

The previous two articles in this series have discussed Watchtower policy and scriptural debate. However, this is not some theoretical debate of interest only to scholars and lawyers. At the core of all this back and forth over scripture and law are real human beings.

What is the actual impact of Watchtower policy when put into practice for real abuse survivors?
Two of these survivors were able to give detailed and comprehensive testimony at the ARC hearings, and the submission of the Senior Counsel contains detailed findings related to their experiences.
The Case of BCB
The first survivor was a woman referred to as BCB in order to protect her identity. She described how Jehovah’s Witness elder Bill Neill repeatedly abused her from the age of 15. She outlined the various impacts of Watchtower’s policy on her case in harrowing detail. These included:
◾An instance where, as per Watchtower policy at the time, she was forced by the elders to confront Bill Neill, repeat her accusations directly to him, and hear him challenge and dismiss them – an experience she found deeply traumatic.
◾She was required to describe intimate details of her assault to a room full of men. As a result, she found herself unable to fully detail the worst aspects of her experience.
◾She was given no counseling or support for her extreme emotional trauma, and was simply instructed to read Watchtower literature.

Even though the elders claimed to believe her, due to the two witness rule, nothing significant could be done. Neill did step down as an elder, but the reason was not announced to the congregation. No further sanctions were imposed. Neill remained a Witness in good standing.
And almost unbelievably, BCB was forced to continue attending meetings in Neill’s home.
I’ll say that again.
◾BCB was required to continue attending meetings in the home of the man whom she had stated, and the elders apparently agreed, had abused her.

Additionally, elder Max Horley and Circuit Overseer Doug Jackson sent a letter to the branch described as follows by the Commission:

148  The letter of 1 February 1992 further reported that both Mr Horley and Mr Doug Jackson were ‘impressed by Brother Neill’s acceptance of counsel and his humility throughout the ordeal’ and recommended that he be appointed as an elder again ‘once this has died down’.
Unsurprisingly, BCB didn’t fare well as a result of this treatment. She testified that she’d since had a nervous breakdown and required ongoing expensive medical and therapeutic care to deal with the mental and physical injures Neill’s abuse had inflicted.
Max Horley and Doug Jackson appeared before the ARC to defend themselves. They didn’t impress.
Jackson gave meaningless responses that often verged on gibberish, and a shamefaced Horley, despite attempting initially to defend his actions and Watchtower policy, in the end agreed that BCB had been terribly failed by both.
Here are just some of the Commission’s many detailed findings on the case of BCB. They back up and validate all the claims BCB made (bold is mine):

F6  It was distressing for BCB to be required by the elders to tell of what had happened to her to a group of men, including the man whom she accused of abusing her, and it was not likely to, nor did it, result in BCB disclosing the full extent of her abuse.
F9  The application of the two‐witness rule meant that there was insufficient evidence for the elders to act against BCB’s abuser even though they believed her, which left her feeling disbelieved and unsupported, and it left the abuser in the congregation where he may have been a risk to other children.
F10  Mr Horley telling BCB that she should not discuss her abuse with anyone left her feeling silenced and unsupported.
F13  It was traumatic for BCB and inappropriate of Mr Horley for him to have required BCB to attend Bible study at Bill Neill’s home when he knew that BCB accused Bill Neill of abusing her.
F14  The recommendation of the elders to the Branch Office that Bill Neill be reinstated as an elder ‘once this has died down’ and their expressed concern ‘that there may also be worldly people who also know’ demonstrates that they were more concerned about the reputation of Bill Neill and the congregation than about the risk that he posed to children.
Max Horley departs after giving evidence at the Royal Commission
Max Horley departs after giving evidence at the Royal Commission

 
The Case of BCG
BCG was born into a Jehovah’s Witness family, and had three sisters. When she was 17 her father, a ministerial servant, began to abuse her. Her initial attempt to contact the elders were rebuffed, and when she finally was able to get their attention, her story took a sadly familiar path. Among the indignities the Watchtower process inflicted, BCG recounts that:
◾She was required to confront her father with the accusations, who became so angry and aggressive that he had to be restrained from violently attacking her. BCG found this experience terrifying.
◾She stated that the elders, all friends of her father, appeared to attack her credibility as a witnesses, rather than support and protect her as an abuse survivor. She was left with the distinct impression that they were not impartial in the matter.

One of the most troubling aspects of BCG’s story highlights how elders can act in defiance of Watchtower’s rules with impunity.
Remember the two witness rule? Well, BCG told told the elders that her father had abused her younger sisters as well her older sister. The elders dismissed this report, stating that the girls were too young to know what they were talking about, and were not witnesses to the same event, even though Watchtower policy at the time would have accepted their evidence as a second witness.
During the hearings, the elders involved (Ron De Rooy, Dino Ali, and Kevin Bowditch) flat out denied under oath that she had made this report to them. Ali in particular was quite adamant on this fact.
To the clear shock of Ali, the ARC then produced a set of handwritten notes, taken from the congregation archives, and written by Ali during the investigation. The notes confirm, in Ali’s own handwriting, that not only had BCG informed the elders as to her father’s abuse of her sisters (a charge her mother corroborated) but that her father had confessed to the abuse before the elders.
Yet, despite having more than enough evidence to act, even under the discredited process of Watchtower, Ron De Rooy, Dino Ali and Kevin Bowditch did not find that BCG’s father had abused his daughters.
Among the many findings on the case of BCG, the Senior Counsel finds: (bold is mine)

F21  The evidence presented to the judicial committee of BCH having abused his other daughters satisfied the Jehovah’s Witness organisation’s own rules with regard to sufficiency of evidence  to establish that BCH had abused BCG, but the elders wrongly ignored that evidence and accordingly failed to uphold BCG’s complaint against BCH.
F23  The elders inexplicably and wrongly ignored BCH’s confession to having abused BCG and thereby, within the precepts of the Jehovah’s Witness organisation’s own rules and procedures, failed to uphold BCG’s complaint against BCH.
F26  The failure by the elders to report BCH’s sexual abuse of BCG to the police had the result that BCH remained at large in the community and a risk to children, and reflects that the elders were not concerned with child safety but rather with keeping their organisation ‘clean’.
F27  The judicial committee’s failure to uphold BCG’s complaint of abuse by BCH conveyed to BCG that the organisation tolerated child sexual abuse within its ranks.
F28  The advice given by the elders to BCG that she not speak about her abuse to anyone had the effect of silencing her.
As a result of this bungled (or worse) investigation, BCG attempted suicide. Her father was later disfellowshipped on a separate charge of “loose conduct and lying,” though a later appeal did confirm the charges of sexual abuse as well.
However, he was still re-instated just three years later.
Upon being informed of this BCG, terrified for the safety of children in the congregation, decided to report her own abuse to the police. She alleges that Ron De Rooy threatened her with disfellowshipping if she did so. De Rooy denied this under oath, just as he denied BCG reporting the abuse of her sisters.
Ron de Rooy on the Witness stand
Ron de Rooy on the Witness stand

 
Among the many damning findings of Senior Counsel on the reinstatement are: (bold is mine)

F31  The decision to reinstate BCH took no account of the risk that BCH posed to children, paid little regard to the fact that he had been disfellowshipped because of child sexual abuse, and was focussed principally on his extra‐marital relationship.
F32  The decision to reinstate BCH took no account of BCH’s failure to apologise to BCG, a factor relevant to consideration of sincere repentance, or of what BCG might have had to say about BCH being reinstated.
F33  The decision to reinstate BCH was disrespectful and unsupportive of BCG.
Nonetheless, BCG took her case to the police. The ARC also found, after testimony from a legal professional involved, that the delays caused by the Watchtower process, and the clumsy nature of the process itself, had rendered much of the evidence inadmissible. Nonetheless, her father was finally convicted on the third trial. What did BCG have to say about this?

245  BCG told the Royal Commission that her experience of the three criminal trials was significantly less traumatic than her experience sitting through the committee meetings.
Today BCG is disfellowshipped, and is currently being shunned by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
A Plea to Elders
It may well be that you are an elder reading this. Perhaps you no longer believe in the faith, but are trapped, not wishing to be shunned by your family and friends. Perhaps you still consider yourself a Witness but believe, as other elders do, that in this specific area the Organization is making a terrible error of judgement.
Whatever the case, if a member of your congregation comes to you with an allegation of sexual abuse, please:
CONTACT THE POLICE

You may lose your privileges of service. But surely that is a small price to pay for being able to look yourself in the mirror and know that, when a vulnerable member of your congregation came to you for help, in the moment they needed you most, you did not fail them.
 
covert-fade-signature
 
 
 
 
 
 
Further reading…
◾Royal Commission findings: Governing Body member Geoffrey Jackson “evasive and unhelpful”
◾Royal Commission findings: Watchtower policies place JW children “at significant risk of sexual abuse”
◾Reveal article: Jehovah’s Witnesses shield child sex abusers from police, report says
◾12 things we learned from Geoffrey Jackson’s testimony at the Royal Commission
◾Royal Commission’s Angus Stewart accuses Watchtower representative of deliberate deception
◾Elders shamed under questioning by the Royal Commission
◾Australian Royal Commission hears that 1,006 alleged child sex abusers were covered up by Watchtower
◾Stephen Lett slams “apostate-driven lies and dishonesties” concerning child abuse record
◾JWsurvey articles on child abuse



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134 Responses to Royal Commission findings: Jehovah’s Witness elders left abuse survivors “silenced and unsupported”

← Older Comments
 
 dee says:

 December 15, 2015 at 11:45 pm
 

Isn’t it just grand, God is going to replace the governments of the world (including the Australian government which is now unearthing the WT’s child abuse policy flaws) with the GB past and present who will rule in his kingdom over the WT’s promised paradise earth after all these other governments have been destroyed. LOL.
If only the new system would come right now so that earth’s new rulers (the GB) will have their way and be the ones to call the shots! They can’t wait to get their hands on writing those new scrolls that will be opened in the new system – imagine a two witness rule in paradise to deal with the child molesters who will be resurrected from the dead. LOL.
Reply
 
 

 Doc Obvious says:

 December 16, 2015 at 8:20 am
 

The Watchtower Babble and Tract Society, along with the Jehovah’s Perverts, are well known throughout the world for their bad moral standards. The Governing Body, a.k.a. the Fateful and Deceit Slave Class, were deceiving the world regarding their over a thousand (1,006) pedophiles the world over.
What has happened over the sixty plus (60+) years from 1950 is a huge disgrace and extremely damning for the Watchtower Babble and Tract Society. The result has been a huge decline in their numbers. The inactive ones are swelling. People have no confidence in the Jehovah’s Perverts religion at all. The Apostate web sites are becoming more realistic and truthful. Mainly by quoting Watchtower literature and showing how outdated their written material is.
The brochure, “Return to Perversion (I mean Jehovah)” tries, but fails to bring back members. Now, with the recent Watchtower Babble and Tract Society layoffs, we see a rapid decline in the Bethelite population and more room for the Governing Body to expand their real estate endeavors. Hopefully, they can remove all the toxic waste from Warwick and enjoy their brand new lake front property at the expense of thousands of Bethelite who only make less than $200/USD per month.
Reply
 

 Pow says:

 December 16, 2015 at 9:55 am
 

Just to add to your point,
The 1006 pedophiles were from the SMALL Australia branch alone…..the world wide organizational number is 100 x that number.
Reply
 

 Doc Obvious says:

 December 17, 2015 at 7:25 am
 

I know there are more. Watchtower probably trashed the records. The 8 cases in the United States and the 1,006 cases in Australia show a great disparity and raises more questions than answers.
Reply
 
 
 
 

 Big B says:

 December 16, 2015 at 10:04 am
 

As always an excellent, informative and forthright article.
It is my sincerest hope that the majority of the worlds population will give these door-to-door, doomsday evangelists this ARC information on YouTube before shutting the door in their faces. Yes, plant a seed of doubt and maybe one of them will have the guts to investigate for themselves. Yeah, right; but one can always hope.
I also feel ashamed that it has taken me 55 years to do my own research and get out of this cult along with my immediate family.
This cult is truly a “spiritual paradise” for pedophiles! Where else can a pervert practice his fantasies and at the very worst be disfellowshipped only to sham repentance and be welcomed back in with open arms! They may even be considered for eldership positions although they had lost them before. Meanwhile they are not listed on any community registry for pedophiles as the Watchtower does not “divulge confidential information”! A pedophiles paradise indeed! Beware wolves in sheep’s clothing.
To anyone holding fast to this nonsense do to family ties please do the right thing and get out of this nasty, self-serving cult. Set an example for all so you can live with yourself. Anything worthwhile doing, including the correct thing, is always hard; despite the consequences of shunning.
To anyone reading this please remember that true “agape love”, supposedly what Jehovah’s Witnesses practice, is not conditional on what religion you choose or not choose to practice. If so, then their “loving, life-saving ministry” is verily a sham.
Reply
 

 M Saurus says:

 December 16, 2015 at 10:44 am
 

Well said, Big B !
Reply
 
 
 

 Winston Smith says:

 December 16, 2015 at 10:57 am
 

Congregation elders (even the ones who are not raving lunatics on a huge ego trip) are simply ill-equipped to deal with problems of this magnitude. They have no training in professional counseling and what little training they get from the org is a joke (I can speak from experience, it is mostly learning to follow a bunch of org rules, and what the latest “new light” is).
Since many elders grew up in the org, they are poorly educated and have a very limited worldview.
I recall one elder in my circuit realized how poorly equipped he was to deal with the issues in the congregation and so he started taking psychology and counseling courses in order to be better equipped to help the brothers and sisters; he caught all sorts of grief from the other elders in the circuit.
Matthew 7:20 – by their fruits you will know them.
 Years of these org policies of not reporting child abusers, forcing victims to rely on inept elders, and frowning on anyone seeking professional help has yielded very bad fruitage indeed.

WS
Reply
 

 James Broughton says:

 December 17, 2015 at 9:08 am
 

Winston, a good response. In the light of Jon Atack’s book on mind control, we need to remember that elders are under the jurisdiction of the Governing Body therefore they believe they are following correct procedures, until, of course, “new light” is received. Sometimes it takes a respected body such as a Royal Commission to shake things up.
Reply
 
 

 Doc Obvious says:

 December 17, 2015 at 2:35 pm
 

The only training they get is what Watchtower’s legal department gives them. Lawyers are not the most truthful people in the world. There are no other professional therapists to consider at Watchtower Babble and Tract Society. They consider psychiatrists and others not in line with the Bible. A psychologist and a sociologist would tell Watchtower to can their shunning policy.
Reply
 
 
 

 David says:

 December 16, 2015 at 11:10 am
 

The issue is that no single person or religious organisation is without blemish. When a religious claims to be the only right religion and heavily criticise others sooner or later it will be forced to lie or hide things. Russell was right to be against organised religions. No men nor organised religion is right or has the truth, because we are all humans. Who claims to have the truth simply lies. According to the Bible Jesus is truth!
Reply
 
 

 kaput says:

 December 16, 2015 at 12:14 pm
 

I am ashamed to say I was part of this organization, although powerless to protest the glaring abuse of mind, body and soul of all who are part of this when I was in – I do hold myself accountable for not leaving sooner and helping friends and family to see through this terrible travesty of human spirit, love and freedom. Please use your God given faculties friends – life is too short!
 To all Elders – the bible warns against doing anything out of egotism – you will not help anyone as long as the organization does not look after the lowly, “perceived as underperforming” publishers and is prepared to write them off. Jesus’ example stands to this day – the GB do not show the traits that Jesus said would identify his true followers.

Kaput
Reply
 

 James Broughton says:

 December 17, 2015 at 9:14 am
 

Kaput, there is no need to be ashamed. As in the case of the apostle Paul, his background and previous experience became a powerful tool in the message of truth of which he was not ashamed. Like him, maybe you should acquire a new name. Not Kaput but Mended (or its German equivalent).
Reply
 

 Kaput says:

 December 17, 2015 at 3:20 pm
 

Thanks for that James I did not think of it that way, we definitely need to use our past experiences to help others out of this prison. Yes and I need a new name.
Reply
 
 
 
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 16, 2015 at 11:16 pm
 

@ Doc Obvious
“The Watchtower Babble and Tract Society” — Awesome! :)
 After all, they ARE a part of “Babble On the Great”. πŸ˜‰

Reply
 
 

 Exhausted says:

 December 17, 2015 at 12:04 am
 

You know, I have been watching a lot of shows lately. Ncis, Law and Order, etc., and it seems so simple to me
 That if a predator lurks in the congregation, that he should
 Be made to submit his DNA profile to the people who would matter in such instances and then I bet the bastards would hold off on their unnatural lusts. Make sense??

Reply
 
 

 Exhausted says:

 December 17, 2015 at 12:21 am
 

Also, that would be the unrefutable WITNESS and it
 Wasn’t available when Christ walked the earth. Neither
 We’re blood transfusions, organ transplants, heart and
 Lung machinery, skin grafts, and on and on and on.
 Witnessing a sin does not have to be accomplished by
 Human eyes. it can be accomplished by SCIENCE as it
 Can attest to guilt or innocence. No question about that.
 so come on governing body, put that DNA requirement
 In you’re book of laws. Of course you would have to
 Guilt people into submitting to it because I think forcing
 It is against the law. come on guys, you can do it.
 After all, you scared the entire world of JW s that the
 World was ending in 1975.

Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 17, 2015 at 1:28 am
 

Good idea. I totally agree. But you’re probably correct, it probably would be illegal to force it. Might violate bad guys’ “rights” in this upside down world.
Reply
 
 
 

 Exhausted says:

 December 17, 2015 at 1:41 am
 

Yeah,a true pedophile would shudder at that proposition.
 but come on, once the edict is announced, I am sure there
 Would be those who would deliver.
 After all, what could be lost if you are straight.

Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 17, 2015 at 2:19 am
 

True, they could be “guilted” into it, as you said.
Reply
 
 
 

 Simon Kestral says:

 December 17, 2015 at 3:21 pm
 

@Average Joe
“it is a great relief to know that others …comprehend the major guilt that I still feel for speaking out against those who direct what I feel to be God’s spirit directed organisation”
Joe, my remarks are not meant to discourage you. They are intended to show you that WT is not ”God’s spirit directed organisation.”
WT has a good sales pitch: paradise earth and resurrection. But those promises were in the Bible long before WT appeared on the scene. Christian faith does not require WT. Jesus is head of the congregation, not the GB. You don’t need WT to mediate between you and Christ.
“It’s very difficult waking up … it’s more for my immediate family that I don’t want to disappoint”
That’s what it comes down to. But many people have lost family for the sake of Jesus. We know what he said about that …
Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 17, 2015 at 6:16 pm
 

Good points. After all, if it was God’s spirit-directed org., would they be using the cynical manipulation techniques that they do, and covering up the heinous crimes that they do? I respect people’s right to believe, but I believe all religions and cults are man-made.
Reply
 
 
 

 dee says:

 December 17, 2015 at 4:06 pm
 

@Holi Connoli
 Good one Holi Connoli! ROFLOL!

The new system can’t come soon enough. Castration – what better way to deal with those ressurrected child molesters especially given the fact that it won’t be possible to put resurrected persons to death if they should sin in paradise, since according to the bible: “NEITHER CAN THEY DIE ANYMORE”. Castrate them I say! LOL!
Luke 20:34-36:
“The children of this system of things marry and are given in marriage, but those who have been counted worthy of gaining that system of things and the resurrection from the dead NEITHER MARRY NOR ARE GIVEN IN MARRIAGE. In fact, NEITHER CAN THEY DIE ANY MORE, for THEY ARE LIKE THE ANGELS, and they are God’s children by being children of the resurrection.”
Reply
 

 Pow says:

 December 17, 2015 at 4:47 pm
 

Be careful Dee, they would probably castrate all the men and F.G.M. the woman, instead of deal with the real culprits. There is definitely a history of resorting to rash tactics to deal with one problem by legislating rules in completely unrelated areas…forbidding to marry in the 30s, beards in the 20s, higher education 50s, masterbation 60/70, rock music 60, rap music 90, Internet 90, organ transplants 60/70, jury duty 60, divorce/porniea 70, and so and so…..some of these positions obviously were changed or dropped , others just modified..many were a knee jerk reactions to a perceived problem.
Reply
 
 
 

 Pow says:

 December 17, 2015 at 4:58 pm
 

Just to clarify, its a frightening thing to comprehend justice in the hands of religious zealots, whether they be Jewish, Isis, Christian or JWs….
Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 17, 2015 at 6:39 pm
 

Well said.
@ dee
 Wow, I never realized the implication of that text. So I guess taken at face value it does mean that resurrected persons can’t die, even if they disobey. That, of course, makes no sense, as it is totally incongruous with biblical doctrine. Another reason I don’t believe the bible or any other “holy” book. LOL
 PS: I’m sure WT has already found a way to “INTERPRET” (read: “TWIST”) that verse (no doubt under the guidance of “Holy Spirit” LOL). Maybe they claim it only applies to “144000”, though it clearly specifies ‘those worthy of gaining THAT SYSTEM OF THINGS and THE RESURRECTION’, and ‘children of the resurrection’. More babble from Babble On the Great, anyway. :)

Reply
 

 dee says:

 December 17, 2015 at 7:55 pm
 

@anonymous 4
Good points.
 Also, what’s more, the test at the end of Christ’s 1000-year reign which the WT claims will determine who will live forever (Revelation 20: 7-10) will be meaningless for persons who have been resurrected. Whether or not persons who have been resurrected pass that test is neither here nor there since resurrected persons CAN NO LONGER DIE.

The only persons whom this test will apply to are the JW Armageddon survivors since they, although having lived 1000 years (without any freak accidents happening?), can still die. Interestingly, according to WT theology, the number of persons who will fail the test and be destroyed will be “as the sand of the sea” (Revelation 20:8), a large number. What a pity, the JWs managed to make it through Armageddon but a large number of them will fail this final test and be put to death.
Reply
 
 

 dee says:

 December 17, 2015 at 9:11 pm
 

According to WT theology the resurrection of the 144,000 commenced in 1918 and will conclude at the outbreak of the Great Tribulation (I suppose any of the 144,000 who are on the earth at the time of the outbreak of the Great Tribulation will be raptured) – that is, the heavenly resurrection of the 144,000 occurs in THIS system of things not in THAT (post Great Tribulation/Armageddon) system of things to which the resurrection spoken about at Luke 20:34-36 pertains.
“All the evidence indicates that this heavenly resurrection began in ****1918****, after Jesus’ enthronement in 1914 and his riding forth to start his kingly conquest by cleansing the heavens of Satan and his demons.” Revelation, Its Grand Climax At Hand! p. 103
Reply
 
 

 dee says:

 December 17, 2015 at 11:09 pm
 

Therefore, the resurrection of Luke 20:34-36 does not apply to the resurrection of the 144,000 since the resurrection of the 144,000 occurs in THIS system of things according to WT theology.
Reply
 

 Winston Smith says:

 December 18, 2015 at 9:05 am
 

Yes, current watchtower dogma is that the application of Luke 20:34-36 does not apply to the 144000 but to the other sheep. Even though they say that virtually everything else in the New Testament applies ONLY to the anointed. Completely inconsistent. They arbitrarily pick and choose what they want to apply to whom.
The whole concept of two distinct classes of individuals is completely out of harmony with the scriptures. Nothing more than a Rutherford brain-fart.
And yes, the JWs also believe any remaining anointed will be raptured during the great tribulation, but they dislike the use of the word “rapture.”
WS
Reply
 
 
 
 
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 17, 2015 at 6:49 pm
 

“Poets, Priests, and Politicians
 Have Words to thank for their Positions
 Words that scream for your submission…”
The Police
“De do do do, De da da da”

Reply
 
 

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← Royal Commission findings: Jehovah’s Witness elders left abuse survivors “silenced and unsupported”
 
The Friday Column: Everyone makes mistakes – except Watchtower
Posted on December 18, 2015

The mistakes of bible characters are owned up to in the scriptures
The mistakes of bible characters like Peter are owned up to in the scriptures

Everyone makes mistakes. The Bible characters certainly did. Think of the Apostle Peter, denying Jesus three times on the night of his arrest, his faith and courage failing him at the critical moment, leaving him a weeping, emotionally shattered wreck. (John 18:13-27)

Think of King David, sleeping with Bathsheba then panicking over the resulting pregnancy, so desperate to avoid scandal that he ultimately orchestrates events to get Bathsheba’s husband killed. (2 Samuel chapter 11)
Or think of Jonah, getting a commission from God to condemn the Ninevites, but instead running away in terror from that commission as fast as he can. (Jonah 1:3) After God readjusts Jonah’s thinking via the rather humiliating use of a whale’s digestive tract, Jonah finally gets his act together and goes forth to condemn the Ninavites. (Jonah 1:17-2:2)
Except the Ninivites promptly repent and God forgives them, so Jonah throws a hissy fit about how he will now look like a fool when all that fire and judgement he prophesied doesn’t show up on time. (Jonah 3:10) God rolls his eyes and has to school him again about not being a sulky little child, especially where people’s lives are concerned. (Jonah 4: 9-11)
Faithful men of old made some horrific mistakes, and Watchtower makes mistakes too. Think of prophecy.
“1914 will be the end of the world! Oh, that didn’t happen. Hmmm. We meant to say 1925, and Moses will be resurrected then as well! Huh, the world didn’t end and Moses is a no-show (but we can still use that lovely house we built for him). Wait right, 1975 will be the year it all ends! Oh…. well it’ll certainly come before the end of the 20th century!…huh…erm…before the generation that saw 1914 passes away? OH COME ON!”
Or think of medical advice.
For example, from 1921 to 1952, the Watchtower campaigned against vaccination, presenting it as unsuitable for Christians and nothing more than a malicious con on the part of the medical establishment.
During an era when mankind was poised to make great strides in eliminating diseases such as smallpox, Watchtower recklessly stood in the way, endangering not only the lives of its followers but of all those who came into contact with them. Only in the 1950’s did they start to reverse this position, apparently due to legal concerns more than anything else. It’s hard to argue that lives were not lost or ruined as a result.
What about organ transplants? From 1967 to 1980, the Watchtower considered transplants to be cannibalism, thus putting this life-saving and life-changing treatment out of the reach of its followers. This position was reversed after 13 years, but again it’s hard to argue that witnesses would not have suffered and even died as a result of this mistake
And how could we not mention child abuse? In Austraila alone, it was recently disclosed that over 1,006 alleged child abusers were known to Watchtower since the 1950’s as operating in their congregations. None of them were reported to the authorities.
None.
As a result of this inaction, Watchtower’s own internal records show that a significant number of these molesters continued to offend and re-offend with apparent impunity, and with no recourse available to the abuse survivors.
Of all their errors of judgement, this seems to be one of the gravest Watchtower has ever made.
So, just like the faithful men of old, Watchtower has made some terrible mistakes. There is, however, one significant difference between the faithful men of God in the bible, and Watchtower today.
In the bible, God’s people admitted their mistakes.
Peter, for example, is never recorded as having contested the accounts of his failure on the night of Jesus’ arrest. Rather, the bible narrative makes clear that he fully admitted his failures and did his best to atone for them.
Additionally, all in the congregations of the first century would be aware of Peter’s history. There was no whitewashing, no denial. Peter owned his mistake and learned from it, later being recorded as a courageous man who successfully stood firm in situations similar to the one in which he succumbed.
Likewise David, upon being confronted with the gravity of his sins, tore his garments apart and went into mourning.
If one assumes the bible as being the word of God and accepts the biblical narrative of who wrote what, then it was David himself who recorded the full depths of his mistakes in Psalm 51, acknowledging the full horror and human cost of his error. No excuses. No passing the buck. No editing of his personal history. David took it full on the chin, accepting whatever consequences God felt fitting.
Likewise, according to the religious text, Jonah himself is the author of the book that bares his name – even if most bible scholars consider the book allegorical. But assuming it is a historical account with Jonah as the writer, as befitting a humble man of God he did not attempt to whitewash his own history, or belittle his mistakes. Rather, he recorded them in excruciating detail, presenting a brutally honest chronicle of his worst failures that often cast him in a poor light.
Jonah didn’t care that it made him look bad. He knew that it was more important to acknowledge his serious mistakes, own them, and learn from them.
How does this compare to Watchtower? Let’s start with the succession of failed prophecies littering the feet of the Organization.
It has to be said, the founder of the religion, Charles Taze Russell, did occasionally admit that he’d blundered in this regard, although this didn’t stop him from setting new dates to replace the failed ones with seemingly endless enthusiasm and very little self reflection.
However as time went by and the leadership changed, this trait faded from Watchtower’s skill set. For example, the only acknowledgement of the 1975 debacle was a single published article that essentially threw the rank and file Witnesses under the bus for believing what they were told by Watchtower from the platform and in publications (never mind the fact that they are not allowed to dispute what they are told from the platform and in publications by Watchtower).
Since then, failed prophecies have not even been acknowledged as errors. They have instead been re-framed as “new understandings” or “new light.”
So the next time I leave home without my wallet, that’s not a mistake. That’s new light about the location of my wallet. And the next time I burn the toast it is not a mistake, just a new understanding about the desired status of the toast. I mean yes, I still had to eat carbonized bread for breakfast, and I’m standing at the bus stop with no money to pay the fare, but I didn’t make any mistakes, you see…
What about the other subjects? Issues where Watchtower mistakes have had a grave cost in physical and mental health? A cost in human lives? Issues such as banning vaccination and organ transplants? Or the covering up of numerous cases of child sexual abuse?
Watchtower has never apologized for these mistakes. Ever.
In fact, if you are a Jehovah’s Witness reading this, it might be the first you’ve even heard of some of these issues, so thoroughly has Watchtower whitewashed them from history and made sure that the congregation does not know.
Y’know, exactly the way Peter didn’t.
And the way David didn’t.
And the way Jonah didn’t.
I guess you can draw your own conclusions from that.
 
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← Royal Commission findings: Jehovah’s Witness elders left abuse survivors “silenced and unsupported”
 
315 Responses to The Friday Column: Everyone makes mistakes – except Watchtower


Newer Comments →
 

 Markie says:

 December 18, 2015 at 5:25 am
 

Mr. Covert Fade, everything you wrote is old news.
Reply
 

 Covert Fade says:

 December 18, 2015 at 5:37 am
 

Yep. The Friday Column isn’t a “breaking news” style article, it’s more a free ranging look at general topics about Watchtower and JW issues.
Also, keep in mind that JW stumble across this site on a regular basis, and for them a lot of this won’t be old news, it will be the first they’ve heard of it. That was certainly the case when I began my awakening, articles like this were old news to the exJW’s but stunning revelations to me.
Always good to keep discussion on these topics in the spotlight.
Reply
 
 

 Chiafade says:

 December 18, 2015 at 5:44 am
 

Markie I certainly hope that you aren’t implying that this history doesn’t matter. It speaks directly to watchtowers stubborn refusal to admit and correct mistakes even when they’re harming people.
Its hard to tell from your one sentence what you meant. So I’ll show some restraint.
Reply
 

 Markie says:

 December 18, 2015 at 8:20 am
 

Gosh! Good for you. Thanks for showing me some restraint. Give yourself a nice pat on the back.
Reply
 

 Alexandria R says:

 December 19, 2015 at 5:40 pm
 

There are three facts I didn’t know about until I read this. It isn’t old news for me.
Reply
 
 
 

 Holly Chu says:

 December 18, 2015 at 8:23 am
 

Chiafade, I echo your comment. This is important history that needs to be brought front and center, Markie.
Excellent job Covert Fade!
Reply
 
 
 

 nullandvoidboy says:

 December 18, 2015 at 6:03 am
 

Hey Markie…..this is not about “preaching to the choir”…of course old timers know this stuff. It’s for a newbie who is thinking about getting out of the Matrix….I wish my niece and nephew knew about the WT hall of shame, but hey never will as it’s an organization that practices revisionist history….anyway, did you ever learn anything “new”at the kingdom fall? This is more of a validation for us and an awakening for new ones who have the nerve and courage to look at the borg.
Reply
 

 Adam Heckathorn says:

 December 19, 2015 at 8:06 am
 

I remember learning something new. “Taking lifesaving blood components is now OK” last week you should have refused them even if it meant an early grave for you but this week It’s OK.
Reply
 
 
 

 Caltanzee says:

 December 18, 2015 at 8:25 am
 

#Markie, Din’t you ever heard that’s what is old becomes new again especially when it’s revelant to the situation now at hand ? The situation now at hand is the information age made powerful by the internet. Because of this medium many have access to information they can’t get at the kingdom halls where information is spoon fed. It was articles such as this that awoken my critical thinking skills when I accidentally stumbled onto this website and started searching for more information on other sites..I never knew about Beth sarin , The Menlo park scandals as well as other nefarious things going on behind the scenes in the organization. As I observed the things in the watchtower publications get more And more delusional..So it may be old to you, because you know about the wackiness. But don’t you think in all fairness that others has a right to have this vital information made readily available to them? Well: I certainly do!!!
Reply
 
 

 Robert67 says:

 December 18, 2015 at 9:26 am
 

Old facts that are needed here on a loop for new visitors to the site. Everything can’t be the latest scandal at WT. Would love to see Throw back Thursdays, where articles focus on the false prophecies and old scandals in the Watchtowers history.
Reply
 

 Eric Arthur Blair says:

 December 18, 2015 at 4:39 pm
 

Haha, great comment Robert67, throwback thursdays, love it! The good news is there is no end of material to work with!
And the more the watchtower tries to bury its history the more activist sites like this need to dig it up, whether it’s old news or not. Until the watchtower shows the same candour it praises the bible writers for it needs to be exposed and held to account.
Reply
 
 
 

 Hadriel says:

 December 18, 2015 at 9:35 am
 

Yes much of this is old news but to a point. For those just now breaking from the psychosis it provokes thought. Isn’t that the point? Why do commercials run and present the same “old news” as they did 30 minutes prior? Because some may have been in the kitchen, the bathroom or just flat missed it. The same can be said of those waking. What if today is the day a person just happens to see this “old news” and it causes them to not “critically think” but just plain think?
You could run this article once a month for the next 10 years and it would be appropriate. So although it might be old news to you or stale others may have just opened the door and for them it takes on that “new car” smell.
Reply
 
 

 Billy's Views says:

 December 19, 2015 at 1:36 am
 

Its new to all the Jokers who wrongfully put their faith in a Organization that’s left them entirely broke now their approaching retirement.
It’s bad enough regular employees who worked 30-40 years for Large Corporations are wondering how their going to make it during retirement with unstable pensions or volatile Economics in our Global Economy. What about the JWs who put their trust in the Watchtower?
Will the Watchtower Apologize the Janitors and Window Washers who cheated on their taxes by not reporting their income or never paid Self-Employment Tax will probably be collecting $900 a month in Social Security once they turn 65 years old? Oh, that’s right, JWs can file for Disability and Pioneer because its cool sucking off the Government’s Tits like Rutherford’s men said.
Yes, it’s New to all the JW “Baby Boomers” approaching retirement without pensions, 401k plans and hoping the Republicans don’t repel Obamacare because that’s the only way they will have any decent insurance they can afford.
Thank’s for your article, JWs can look at the New Light of having no Retirement Accounts as a “Vow of Poverty” like the Governing Body take. Their “Vow of Poverty is quite different from their members, they will be taking the monies for their poor members and telling their members to “pay your vows” so we can get that adjustable Lake fixed!
Reply
 
 

 Eric Arthur Blair says:

 December 19, 2015 at 2:57 am
 

Actually, I have only just “awoken” this year and discovered all of this “old news.” I wish I had discovered it all years ago, but even though I had doubts and concerns over many things, I fell for the Watchtower’s Jedi mind trick and remained loyal to the organisation (to my dying shame) by refusing to look outside. Well, fortunately this year that spell was broken thanks to sites like this. I undedicated myself in May, and this site has been central to me coping with the transition back into the human race, and healing from 25 years of captivity.
And for the record anyway, this is current news because they still refuse to apologise, that’s the point. It is what they are doing now that is the issue. Even in the face of overwhelming evidence presented to them at the ARC (and that’s just the tip of the global iceberg,) this very month they still remain entrenched in their position and insist on defending the indefensible. So as far as I’m concerned, as long as they refer to their religion as the “THE truth,” then all the truths regarding it should be exposed so they can considered by everybody, and their bold claims scrutinised properly.
Reply
 
 
 

 Garrett says:

 December 18, 2015 at 5:29 am
 

Even Darth Vader admitted he had made mistakes and came around in the end.
 Looks like the GB are the Evil Emperor and will never admit wrong .

;-D
Reply
 

 Chiafade says:

 December 18, 2015 at 5:48 am
 

“Can I learn the power of the resurrection?”
“(Geoffrey Jackson glares over and says)
 Not from a Jedi/apostate”

Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 18, 2015 at 6:23 am
 

Han Solo: “No reward is worth THIS.”
Reply
 

 Covert Fade says:

 December 18, 2015 at 6:27 am
 

“Now witness the firepower of these FULLLY TIGHTENED and HOMOSEXUAL PANTS! Mince at will, brother Lett!”
Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 18, 2015 at 6:40 am
 

Beware of The Watchtower…
 “IT’S A TRAP”


 
 

 Hadriel says:

 December 18, 2015 at 9:25 am
 

O.K. I’m officially dying now LOL. BTW from one fade to another these recent articles…crushed it!

 
 

 Robert67 says:

 December 18, 2015 at 9:31 am
 

May the farce be with you

 
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 18, 2015 at 5:38 pm
 

I’m gonna start sprinkling “midichlorians” on my breakfast cereal so I can be more like the GB. :)

 
 
 
 
 

 Searcher says:

 December 18, 2015 at 7:04 am
 

When the GB announced that they themselves are the ‘Faithful and Discrete Slave’, they should have been saying, “We meet again self-anointed, delusional people. Now WE are the master!!!”
Reply
 

 Searcher says:

 December 18, 2015 at 9:03 am
 

Of course, I’m speaking of the ‘remnant’ of the 144,000 self-anointed delusionists and not the ‘Greater Crowd’ that are looked upon as slave-labor commoners and not capable of thought for themselves.
Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 18, 2015 at 5:44 pm
 

“Self-ANOINTED” — Good one!
Reply
 

 Bret says:

 December 19, 2015 at 7:39 am
 

Idea… We appostates should all find a KH unfamiliar to us this coming memorial and go partake… See if we can inflate their growing number of delusionists past 20,000….lol

 
 

 Pow says:

 December 19, 2015 at 10:59 am
 

Brett,
 I can see it now, Caleb and Sophia pretake, then Dad has to explain how there not part of that Class, their part of the lower class..the secondary, earthly class where Jesus is not your mediator and his blood is not apply to your sins….After alot of crying, the children are reminded that they can eat ice cream in the new system, seeing how they had to give it up to support the building of the new warwick club med.


 
 
 
 

 Peggy says:

 December 18, 2015 at 2:15 pm
 

I was beginning to question the truth when the GB became self appointed FDS. This put me over the edge. I woke up. I began to investigate the organization. I stumbled upon this site and others. I learned about the numerous failed prophecy, and horrible mistakes they made. The fact the GB has never once admitted their wrong, and apologized seriously angered me. I hope they will be brought to justice one day. I am very grateful for the Friday Column.
Reply
 
 
 

 Anonymous says:

 December 18, 2015 at 12:02 pm
 

Spoiling bast*d!!
Reply
 
 

 Tara says:

 December 19, 2015 at 8:41 am
 

Obi Wan Kenobi looking down over Warwick…. ‘You will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy. We must be cautious.”
Master Yoda ‘The dark side it is’.
Reply
 

 Winston Smith says:

 December 19, 2015 at 12:43 pm
 

Spot on. Yub-yub.
WS
Reply
 
 
 
 

 Kat says:

 December 18, 2015 at 6:57 am
 

Difference in making mistakes admitting them than lying and covering them up. The GB have lied to JW and the public by publishing over a 100 yrs of vomit, I think this article is current because they continue to publish lie about their history.
And what was the final straw for me waking was research on their quotes after reading JW. facts looking up all those quotes to find they had misrepresented the scholars and lied, this is new news to many JW that may be viewing this site.
Once you know you have been lied to that is it, you cannot trust those claiming such a high position as appointed by Christ himself to be un repented liars.
Thank you covered excellent material.
Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 18, 2015 at 5:49 pm
 

“Over 100 yrs of vomit” — LOL — That pretty much sums it up.
Reply
 
 
 

 James Broughton says:

 December 18, 2015 at 7:01 am
 

Very good article. There is a world of difference between imperfect human beings making mistakes and the “only organization on earth through whom Jehovah reveals his will.” How can we rely on God if he keeps getting it wrong? (He doesn’t, of course, but we do.)
Reply
 

 redpilltwice says:

 December 18, 2015 at 8:24 am
 

Your point regarding the difference between imperfect humans & God’s only organization on earth is SPOT ON James (to speak with Searcher’s words below). Yesterday a concerned brother (wrongly assuming I’m only taking a temporary break from WT activities) visited me at home for a cup of coffee and some encouragement (lol!). He told me he knew about Australia and I told him I saw only fear and denial in the elders’ eyes and facial expressions, not the power of Holy Spirit (Matth. 10:10-16). I also asked him if he had heard Geoffrey Jackson’s denial before the Royal Commission that “they” (the GB) are God’s only mouthpiece on earth. This brother compared Geoffrey’s shocking statement with the apostle Peter, denying Christ three times. I told him that this was something completely different and today I found out why, according to the WT’s own literature: *** w03 8/15 p. 5 How Some Are Remembered ***
 When Peter realized his mistake, he wept bitterly. He was not afraid to express his sorrow and regret. … He was humble enough to admit his failings. Do you have that virtue?—
Would we see Geoffrey jackson admit and regret his mistakes the same way as Peter? It’s a rhetorical question… we know the answer, don’t we?

Reply
 

 Chiafade says:

 December 18, 2015 at 1:08 pm
 

Great reply! By referencing the apostle Peter you showed a stark contrast between the apostles and the gb.
That’s one thing that really gets under my skin. The audacity to claim to be the modern day apostles and NEVER EVER admit or apologize about anything.
Reply
 
 
 
 

 Searcher says:

 December 18, 2015 at 7:11 am
 

This article is SPOT ON! I know I harp on this, but this is the examples of how the GB and WTS leadership have no concept of RESPONSIBILITY of their policy or actions. Of course they won’t admit to any of the deadly and dangerous policies of this destructive cult. The WTS would be held liable in so many courts and class-action suits, the whole organization would collapse. Maybe the internet information, ARC hearings, vids like Cedars make, and reminders like this article will do that job for the GB’s cowardly irresponsibility. Then the WTS will burn to ground! Good riddance!
Reply
 
 

 Malachi says:

 December 18, 2015 at 7:24 am
 

Nice article. I think the point that was missed is that all the mistakes on the part of actors in the Bible were due to ‘human imperfection’ not misinterpretation of what their message was. David gave in to temptation, Peter gave in to fear of man etc. I would wager that the individual members of the GB would freely admit that they make mistakes on a personal level. They are, after all, human but one of their biggest problems is that together they think they speak for god and give themselves equal footing. Through the magic of Orwellian ‘doublethink’ they claim they are not divinely inspired and simultaneously claim to be god’s sole channel of communication. The abused, indoctrinated masses blindly follow along and happily disregard any seeming contradiction, failed prediction or poorly implemented practices and procedures because this same group of men claim that any changes are a result of ‘revealed truth’ which is just a refined version of their former ‘present truth’. If the GB were to all of a sudden admit that they have made mistakes in the past this would likely open many eyes to the fact that what they say is no more than conjecture or at best an educated guess. That does not take into consideration the downright falsehood that they propagate through fabricated history including their stubborn and impossible to reverse insistence on 607BCE as the date for the fall of Jerusalem. It is as untenable a position as they could possibly find and yet they cannot reverse it because their entire claim to authority rests on that house of cards. I feel this is one of the reasons that they have upped the fear meter, telling people to beware of apostates on risk of shunning. They cannot justify their position with any logical reasoning based on facts so they force people to accept it with threat of punishment.
Reply
 

 Covert Fade says:

 December 18, 2015 at 7:54 am
 

This is an excellent point
Reply
 
 

 Bright Lightbulb says:

 December 18, 2015 at 11:25 am
 

Wow. Could not have said it better myself. 2 thumbs up.
Reply
 
 

 Winston Smith says:

 December 18, 2015 at 9:34 pm
 

@Malachi
 Great points! “Oh we are not inspired, just spirit directed.” What’s the friggin difference? Nothing, just a bunch of word games. This was one of the first things to become clear to me during my awakening. Great tie in to 1984
– WAR IS PEACE
 FREEDOM IS SLAVERY
 IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH

WS
Reply
 
 

 Man from the lions pit says:

 December 18, 2015 at 9:40 pm
 

Malachi good point reasoning & conclusion ! Thanks!
Reply
 
 

 Meredith J says:

 December 21, 2015 at 2:25 pm
 

Yes Malachi, with Jonah it was cowardice and disobedience. With David and Peter, it was just plain human weakness. With the Watchtower it is just pure evil because it is deceiving people about their mistakes and as a result misguiding on their way into the kingdom of God. This has to be dealt with sooner or later. And there is only one powerful enough to deal with it and that is God Himself because they are claiming to represent Him.
Reply
 
 
 

 Stephane Laliberte says:

 December 18, 2015 at 7:24 am
 

Awesome article. I am bookmarking it into my favorites. Thanks!
Reply
 
 

 Doc Obvious says:

 December 18, 2015 at 7:54 am
 

Humility is admitting your shortcomings and mistakes openly. Humility is knowing that you have limitations and know that you are dealing with them in a human way. Humility is knowing that the organization has made mistakes and trying to change course to prevent other mistakes of the same nature.
The Watchtower leadership has no humility. They use the juvenile defense mechanism, deflection. For example, they tell parents whose children are in the university that it was not their fault that their child is no longer a witness. One GB even stated asked the question, who dropped them off at the university in the first place. My question is what shepherd is partial enough to choose which sheep he wants to shepherd and what ones he doesn’t. I’m sure Jesus was not too thrilled by these remarks either.
In addition, have you ever heard the Watchtower explain what humility is. Their version is quite confusing.
The Apostles had their issues and were spiritually strong men to admit they have made mistakes during their life by writing it in the Bible.
Reply
 
 

 Caltanzee says:

 December 18, 2015 at 7:56 am
 

This is an article well researched and expertly presented in a way that’s easily understood.#Consise and on point.This article should serve as a light bulb moment for all present jws.There’s nothing more I can say, except to say thank you and well done.
Reply
 
 

 eyes opened says:

 December 18, 2015 at 8:51 am
 

Well written article. Thanks. A review of history is very necessary. I have decades in the org and there are certainly things I wasn’t aware of. Also in some respects the org is quite young when you consider most of the growth has been, what, the last 15 years perhaps. My husband recently quoted James T Kirk referring to the gb he said “sounds like they have delusions of grandeur and tin plated godship”. Not sure if that’s an exact quote but I like it. Keep up the good writing.
 Regards

Reply
 

 RetiredLE says:

 December 18, 2015 at 9:39 pm
 

Another great ‘Kirk’ moment…”Excuse me..excuse.. I’d like to ask a question…What does God need with a Starship?” https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xnxvKJAv5Ik What does God need with an organization? Doesn’t he desire all to be saved?
 Surely, he has the will and the power. He ’causes to become’. If you wouldn’t hold your child’s hand over a flame for punishment (see Reasoning with Scriptures – Hell) why would the God who IS LOVE destroy billions, who simply didn’t have the opportunity to know the ‘truth’ or didn’t choose to be governed by a group of delusional men.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o14DOOlsOkY GB – “Why have you done this to my friend?” Shakari = Spitual Pardigm
Reply
 
 
 

 eyes opened says:

 December 18, 2015 at 8:59 am
 

For those who are aware of Rutherfords letter to Hitler as shown in the 1934 yearbook, even Hitler was smart enough not to get involved with the witnesses. You don’t read much about that major faux pas. It got some mention in an awake article around 1995. They admitted there was increased persecution after that letter. How many lives lost? Yet we are to believe Rutherford would be counted as a faithful and discreet slave. Hmm.
Reply
 

 Searcher says:

 December 18, 2015 at 9:13 am
 

Eyes Opened, you are correct. Rutherford was neither ‘Faithful’ nor ‘Discreet’. Rutherford may not have started the cult, but he was the bombastic blowhard that set up the destructive cult as it is today along with his little demented minion Fred Franz.
Reply
 

 Winston Smith says:

 December 18, 2015 at 9:40 pm
 

@Searcher: Well said!
WS
Reply
 
 

 Bret says:

 December 19, 2015 at 7:53 am
 

Very true… Russell may have believed the delusional dates of 1874 (parousia) and 1914 (Great tribulation) but at least he taught the Ransom covers every human and all would be resurrected to a probational period even those destroyed at Armegeddon. Rutherford’s reign of terror and cult mind control began with a scheme aka fear fobia… All who do not follow the big “O”, will be destroyed forever either Armegeddon or second death and no resurrection if you die before Armegeddon during the seperating of the “Sheep and Goats”..,
That terrorists kept me and my family captive for over 20 years in constant fear.. Yes Rutherfords reign of terror constitutes him a terrorist….

Reply
 
 
 

 JBob says:

 December 18, 2015 at 12:12 pm
 

The 1995 confession about Nazi relationships was not some noble act that the Watchtower initiated of its own will. About this time many major corporations were being unveiled regarding ties to Nazi regime–many USA-based, some German, and some UK. A major PR move to get ahead of an incoming tsunami of “disgust” expressed by the public. But, who knew child molestation would be coming in from the other direction?
Reply
 
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 18, 2015 at 6:08 pm
 

“Even Hitler was smart enough NOT to get involved with the Witnesses” — LMAO
 PS: Can you picture Hitler going door-to-door with the “Watchtower”? :)

Reply
 

 Eric Arthur Blair says:

 December 19, 2015 at 4:40 pm
 

Yes, I lmao too. I think this is going to become a catchphrase in our household from today. Thanks for brightening my day eyes opened.
Reply
 
 
 
 

 Ruthlee says:

 December 18, 2015 at 9:24 am
 

Umm! Guess what folks I made a mistake. I was in error ,I blundered made a fool of myself, jumped through endless hoops to please my parents, in laws, husband,and anyone else who presumed I was less than a human being. Now then to err is human and to forgive is divine. Where I went wrong was believing all and everything I ever read by the watchtower and I mean that most sincerely folks. When the stirrings of awakening came upon me I realised that I have genuinely been in error for the very best part of my life all the flower of my youth and ignorance. So where does this leave me! I’m at the place where I ask the watchtower bible and tract society to truly forgive me for believing all that they printed and I mean I read the lot since my baptism until this year. I unconditionally loved them and gave them my life my wealth and my health and I was sincerely wrong I hope they understand my plea and will let me go with a warm smile and a wave. Because now iv’e seen the light I read THE HOLY BIBLE daily and it’s not what they taught me so I hope to die an ignorant fool who can quote the Bible and not watchtower. Tears fading away……… ruthlee
Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 18, 2015 at 6:14 pm
 

U’re forgiven. :)
Reply
 
 
 

 Bill Covert says:

 December 18, 2015 at 10:06 am
 

Covert Fade Nice name, I like it.
 For 25 years I have been playing a mental chess game with the church Service dept. Knowing the history is very important for the purpose of closing all the escape routes. There is a researcher who has taken on scriptural basis and has stated that with what I started with they were able to uncover information that “is sure to amaze”. So after all these years I get to see if I have just been pissing in the wind or have emulated the guy in Eccl.9: 15.
 Hopefully I will have put the church in a position to where they have to go through the same judicial process they force on women, kids and the rank and file of their church, to where the church has to confess sins, repent and right the wrong. If successful it is the knowledge of church history, especially the past two years that is a important part. It has been a long fight made difficult by the out of the box thinking and that I am challenged in writing skills.

Again nice name Bill Covert
Reply
 
 

 Bright Lightbulb says:

 December 18, 2015 at 10:47 am
 

Always very well written articles. I think it’s so interesting to see that WT always reference historical information when condemning things, for example “the original Greek word is such and such and because of that we can’t do A B and C”. Clearly history
 matters, albeit not at all when it comes to dark(er) WT history. That’s out the window and no longer important…unless of course that dark light one day turns into bright light! What recently did it for me was the overlapping generation nonsense. Good grief.

Reply
 

 Shane Green says:

 December 18, 2015 at 11:15 am
 

That’s what tipped the balance for me as well…after a long time stuffing doubts down and ignoring them…that was the last straw….what utter bilge!!
 DA’ed sept 3rd this year

Reply
 

 Man from the lions pit says:

 December 18, 2015 at 9:54 pm
 

Just few months ago my bro . I’m sure it’s not ease especially if you have family or close friends in! best wishes hugs & peace
Reply
 
 
 

 Eric Arthur Blair says:

 December 19, 2015 at 5:05 pm
 

Yes, they also have been running a series in the mags called “from our archives.” This is selective history of course – they are guilty of all the things they have blamed governments for and those throughout history who have written their own convenient history. I would love to see a similar series online pulling out all the stuff in their archives they ignore “from their archives”!
The honesty of the bible writers is one of the things that still gives the bible some credibility in my eyes. It’s ironic they use this as evidence to draw people in, ensnare them, and then never display the same kind of honesty they apparently regard so highly. This is very sinister.
The same sad irony is there with their handling of sexual abuse victims. They form their policies based on their non-negotiable interpretation of selective scriptures (which is itself ironic given the amount of times they have changed their teachings on so many other things of lesser import). These policies then provide the perfect environment for predators to operate with impunity, and when the WTS is held to account for all of this by a “worldly” organisation, they claim that they are being persecuted by Satan’ system and apostates, and this is further evidence that they are gods organisation.
So they are effectively arguing that their policies and handling of child sexual abuse is PROOF they are God’s organisation. That’s beyond sinister, it’s just sick. I consider the entire organisation to be a paedophile ring. And the GB to be its ringleaders. I’m just glad I left seven months ago.
Reply
 
 
 

 Hakizimana Jean de Dieu says:

 December 18, 2015 at 11:44 am
 

In some cases, mistakes and crimes are MADE “courage”….
*** w12 2/15 p. 12 par. 9 “Be Courageous and Very Strong” ***
Sisera himself sought refuge in the tent of Jael, but she killed him while he slept. In line with Deborah’s prophetic words to Barak, “the beautifying thing” of this victory went to the woman Jael. Because Deborah, Barak, and Jael acted courageously, Israel “had no further disturbance for forty years.” (Judg. 4:1-9, 14-22; 5:20, 21, 31) Many godly men and women have displayed similar faith and courage.

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 anonymous4 says:

 December 18, 2015 at 6:24 pm
 

Seems to be an awful lot o’ killin’ in the Old Testament!
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 ILOVE XMAS says:

 December 18, 2015 at 12:16 pm
 

#Brightlightbulb..that overlapping generation BS was the last straw for me. It shows just how desperate they are to keep some fire lit under their drones….how can anyone swallow that? Its embarassing for them and they don’t even realize it .
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 Robert67 says:

 December 18, 2015 at 9:00 pm
 

Their reasoning is “where else will we go, you speak of everlasting life”, sadly they have forgotten it is Jesus, not this self appointed slave that is offering that. When judgement day does come these people are going to realize they were in the Enron section of Christianity. Foundation completely built on clay and mud, perfect for molding temporarily into whatever moves the product.
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 Man from the lions pit says:

 December 18, 2015 at 9:57 pm
 

well said :-) or :-(
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 ILOVE XMAS says:

 December 19, 2015 at 12:39 pm
 

Well Said Robert67!!
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 Idontknowhatodo says:

 December 23, 2015 at 4:37 am
 

My spouse swallowed it lock stock and barrell… a clever logical practical person who has let all critical reasoning pass by… I have not been to a meeting for months…have not reported for two months… Im slowly fading… but I cant even mention the ridiculousness of the broadcasts or the absolute tosh of the overlapping explanation…it causes too much trouble…Im finding this time so difficult… Im torn… my family will not look at anything ARC included…its crazy man.
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 James Wittinger says:

 December 18, 2015 at 12:27 pm
 

The only answer for me is to close down all religions including mine and start over. No more paid clergy or collection plates. Everyone chip in and pay the gas bill. Just meet and discuss faithful men like David and Peter and Jonah. Learn from them. All property gets taxed. How peaceful that would be.
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 anonymous4 says:

 December 18, 2015 at 6:27 pm
 

Sounds like that might make too much sense. πŸ˜‰
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 Will says:

 December 18, 2015 at 12:42 pm
 

So true. Great job. I look forward to these Friday columns.
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 Winston Smith says:

 December 18, 2015 at 1:12 pm
 

I recently read about truly great leaders and the “window or the mirror” analogy. When a greater leader experiences success, he/she ‘looks out the window’ for the team members he/she can give credit to. But when failure occurs he/she ‘looks in the mirror’ taking responsibility for their mistakes.
The Wathtower Org is the polar opposite. Gives testimony to their leadership skills.
WS
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 Man from the lions pit says:

 December 18, 2015 at 9:59 pm
 

yap ur right bro !
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 Scag says:

 December 18, 2015 at 1:53 pm
 

The next big thing will be the current “generation” teaching. It appears that Watchtower is continually having to explain and support its position. There have been 3 broadcasts in the last few months trying to explain and reconfirm the current understanding. Many JW’s I talk to are confused, others reject the notion of an overlapping generation outright as wholly unsupported by scripture and still others are questioning the ridiculous attempts to justify the current teaching. Compare Matthew 24:34, Luke 17:25, Mark 8:31, 38. Make sure your read these verses in context. You will notice that although the accounts are not parallel ( that is they are not reporting the same event) the subject matter is identical. These verses clearly show that Jesus was referring to a wicked generation. If you take the time to read these accounts carefully and in context you will see very clearly that Matthew 24:34 cannot apply to the anointed.
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 Winston Smith says:

 December 19, 2015 at 7:34 am
 

@Scag
 They have to keep re-explaining the overlapping generation teaching because it is complete BS. But as we have seen with their other erroneous teachings if they repeat them enough the rank & file drones eventually accept it. It’s just a form of brain washing.

My advice to the R&F: Set your BS detectors to ON.
WS
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 Scag says:

 December 19, 2015 at 1:51 pm
 

What you say is right. People abdicate their thinking and responsibility so easily without blinking an eye. Instead of checking things out for themselves they just roll over and accept whatever slop they are fed. It’s really quite sad, alarming and disheartening.
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 Meredith J says:

 December 21, 2015 at 2:34 pm
 

You know what, in the back of my mind I always believed that. I guess I just ignored Watchtower’s pathetic explanation. Anyone who knows their bible knows that. When I think of how they kept trying to make it all fit, just makes me feel stupid that I put up with those ridiculous explanations.
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 Big B says:

 December 18, 2015 at 1:55 pm
 

Many thanks to Covert Fade for a well written and informative article.
Although this Adventist cult was started by C.T Russell it now bares little markings of his original teachings and if were possible to resurrect him today he would not recognize what it has become.
What it has become is an avarice, corrupt, manipulative cult.
Historically speaking, the Jehovah’s Witnesses today evolved from the teachings of a drunken sot, namely J.F. (the Judge) Rutherford.
Examples: the door to door ministry. Although having no trouble sending others out to “advertise, advertise, advertise the King and his kingdom” was to busy himself going from drink to drink.
The year of 1914 went from being the end of the Gentile times (as Charles Taze Russell believed) to the start of Jesus Christ’s invisible reign.
The erroneous teaching that the “other sheep”, mentioned by Jesus in the Gospels and the “great crowd”, mentioned in Revelation that survive Armageddon, are one in the same group is also his legacy.
The name Jehovah’s Witnesses and the meeting places themselves (Kingdom Halls) were also contrived during his tenure as President (changed from International Bible Student Association).
To everyone reading my comments and to all seekers of the truth about the “Truth” let me point out my following observations;
 1. no religion, that I am aware of, advises its adherents to reject the sacraments during their communion services;
 2.no religion, that I am aware of, asks that their adherents of how much time is spent serving their religion and keep records of it;
 3.no scripture I have read says that Jesus died only for the “slave class” and “other sheep” are a ‘secondary beneficiary’;
4.no scripture instructs me to follow this self-appointed “faithful and discrete slave” class that has absolute power over medical decisions, internet or television viewing, literature reading, what movies, sporting events, shows and hobbies I can participate in, what standards in dress and grooming I should adhere to, how much secular education and what career choices I can pursue, who is worthy of consideration as a marriage mate and what sort of sexual acts can married consenting adults perform in the privacy of their bedroom;
 5. and finally what questions of ever-changing doctrine I am allowed to ask and which people are worthy or non-worthy of my association.

What finally convinced me that “something was rotten in Denmark” was the New Light doctrine of overlapping generations, followed by the ten year membership to the United Nations. The icing on the cake was these child molestation cases.
I, for one, am fully convinced that this doomsday “Armageddon is just around the corner”, pedophile protecting, time bandit, money hungry, self-serving cult has no more relationship with God than any other religion, denomination, cult or sect-Christian or otherwise.
Finally “to thy own self be true” do your research and see just how far the rabbit hole goes; if you can stomach it.
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 Searcher says:

 December 18, 2015 at 2:52 pm
 

Well put Big B!
What you say here is a full account of all the rants and anger that I have felt after disassociating myself from this cult. How can people that are in this circus of a religion not see these problems?
The rabbit hole and any other investigation into the true creation of this monstrous cult machine boils down to a greedy, drunken, arrogant blowhard named Rutherford. He’s been dead for decades and his style and intimidation tactics live on. The chain of leaders from Rutherford to the newly self-appointed ‘F&D Slave’ have perpetuated this control freak’s method of lie upon lie and arrogant all-knowing behavior. The current governing body must either really buy in to their delusion of grandeur for themselves, or know this whole religion is a farce and continue to live off the power they get from it. Once you peel the layers of the onion (so to speak), you really see what this ‘religion’ is and the lies that are behind it. No wonder they strongly forbid people from asking questions, reading other literature about JW’s, and seeing the real truth on the internet sites upon pain of DF and fear. They would truly loose control. If Rutherford tried to run the religion today as he did in the early 20th century, he would have been called out and shown to be a real con-artist extraordinaire.
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 Winston Smith says:

 December 19, 2015 at 7:50 am
 

I agree with the comments about Rutherford. From everything I have read, I believe that all the major issues, including the use of the cult mind control, start with him.
IF, and this is a BIG IF, the organization Russell started ever had God’s favor, it was surely lost with Rutherford at the helm. He took control through slick legalistic maneuvering and had all his rivals figuratively “killed off” (thrown out of the Org) in order to maintain control. It’s reminiscent of Queen Athaliah in the OT. How could such behavior ever receive divine favor?
WS
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 JBob says:

 December 18, 2015 at 4:12 pm
 

So Big B, just a question–to play part of challenger–what if some “truth seeking JDubs” are saying to self, but this group does positive things–turning prostitutes and thugs and substance-abusers into “silk purses” (from wretch to saved)? True the dogma is somewhat murky, but look at the end results… Doesn’t every religion have some bit of non-sense going on when given deep-thought and scrutiny?
Reply
 

 Justin says:

 December 18, 2015 at 5:47 pm
 

Great Comment Big B!
@Jbob: Not to steal Big B’s Thunder but my response to a challenger with that kind of straw man argument would be this…(after laughing hysterically)
To say the watchtower does some good in “cleaning up” the lives of those leading a self destructive lifestyle is ridiculous…especially when viewed from a subjective standpoint.
Considering that the Watchtower could care less about their individual members…case in point child molestation…the Watchtower only indoctrinates people so that they can use and abuse them for the rest of that person’s natural life.
That challenger’s argument is reminiscent of the “Civilized Savage” and “White Man’s Burden” argument used by American slave-holders and European Imperialists. Yes…the ingenuous peoples have no rights, liberty, or freedoms of any kind what-so-ever…BUT…at-least they are not living like a bunch of mindless, third world savages and have the benefits of “white man’s society”.
So, the Watchtower only cleans people up so that they can, in turn, be abused and used for the selfish purposes of peddling the Watchtower’s interests for the rest of their lives…like a slave.
To exchange one self destructive lifestyle for another is not an improvement…but merely a change of scenery and self denial.
For every so called “good dead” the Watchtower does…it in turn does 10 horrible, unspeakable things.
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 anonymous4 says:

 December 18, 2015 at 6:47 pm
 

Well put!!
 Going from smoking crack to following a mindless cult is just switching one drug for another. And let’s not forget WT IS a cult, not a “religion”. Watchtower does not go around the world building schools, hospitals, homeless shelters, soup kitchens, charities, etc. As you stated, compared to the all the NEGATIVES, the good they do is MINIMAL.

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 dee says:

 December 18, 2015 at 7:12 pm
 

@JBob, Justin, anonymous 4
Just about every Christian religion can claim that they do some good in cleaning up the lives of those leading a self destructive lifestyle. This is not something unique to JWs.
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 JBob says:

 December 18, 2015 at 9:45 pm
 

@Justin – amazing, you answered without underlining anything? or reading the paragraphs above my questions?
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 minion says:

 December 21, 2015 at 7:25 pm
 

@ Big B,
 are you from big D, Texas, that’s a helluva big size observations, and a dandy at that.

Spot on – all points.
However, I have an observation you left out and a major league at that, Texas size – whopper. And it goes like this,
Watchtower Corporation, cherry picks scriptures, and we All agree, right?
 They quote, Matt, 24:36, the man Jesus, said, ‘no one knows the hour, or day, no angels, not him, only God. Of his return, Right?

However, they have chosen 1914 as the start of Jesus 1,000 year reigning, right?
Then why does WT Corporation mandates, the annual memorial of Jesus death. If Jesus reigning already started, then the observation of Jesus death has no significance.
Heck, I have a CD recording of G.Loush, ( i know mispell) explaining the man Jesus will have accomplish during the 1,000 years – everything in the new world, and he will be forgotten.
 Imagine that, I think WT, has a big start on forgetting the man name Jesus – in 2015.

If the scriptures are true and real, then, I would not want to be present when Jesus Christ has the one on one talk with the 7 want to bee gods. – GB, the GB will be having a bad hair day.
Then the man Jesus, will say, so you thought You knew me, -what to be gods.
 The hell with you. You are a freaking goat, get the heck out of face, down to hell you go burn baby burn – to the 7 men, want to be gods.

Peace out,
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 Jake says:

 December 18, 2015 at 4:07 pm
 

Great information!. Appreciate all your efforts!.
I informed my father-in-law about the child sex abuse cases from BBC and CNN, he says, its all completely FAKE, never believe all that and never watch any of that. !… what a joke!.. they are so much spiritually blind. Me and my wife are not having any interest to attend the meetings anymore, I was baptised in 2011 and my wife is a born JW we got married 6 months ago, but when i told her all the truth, she agreed. she also says she used to ask many questions when she was younger but she never got a meaningful answer and always been told that they should do only what the organization says and never think anything against. Now we are not interested to attend the meetings but still going to the meetings just for her parents and her dumb JW family. Recently we were unable to attend couple of meetings because of some work schedule etc, but one of her relative in our congregation reported this to her parents, and they are getting very much worried and bugging us everyday on the phone and keep advising to attend meetings. i am getting very much uncomfortable, time is getting wasted everyday talking about this and worriying for no real reason! . the problem is, the engligh news channels have no big reach in my country so people are not at all aware of what is happening with the JW cases and warwick development. JW’s here are too much dumb. So i was planning couple of ideas and i need some advice from you friends in executing!.
#1. I am preparing a letter and have collected all the address newspapers and News TV channels of my country, and going to post the hardcopy with all the references on the child sex abuse cases to check the policies of watchtower could be a threat to our country. I will also send an email regarding this.
#2. I plan to consult an attorney to find if there are possibilities to make this as a pulic issue and file a complaint to check and re-evaluate the JW policies for the welfare of the country.
I would like to know if this will work out? or if you have any better ideas? I cannot tell which country i am from now, I can explain more in detail in personal emails. This is my first priority, as this has started to cause lots of trouble in our family. i want to get this news to my family as they are not going to believe if i try to explain them.
Reply
 

 Winston Smith says:

 December 19, 2015 at 8:13 am
 

Jake,
Keep in mind that the JWs are under the undue influence of a cult that employs methods of mind control. A single stroke will not usually wake them up, but only a sustained effort to slowly overturn cult thinking.
I highly recommend the book “Freedom Of Mind: Helping Loved Ones Leave Controlling People, Cults, and Beliefs” by Steve Hassan. It has some excellent strategies for getting people to awaken to cult mind control.
If your wife does not want to loose her family connections, a slow fade from the organization might be your best bet. It sounds like you have woken up and now you just want to shout out all that has come to light. BE CAUTIOUS. If you start spreading information, make sure you remain anonymous. Although your wife agrees with you, she may not be ready to choose you over her family. It is amazing the amount of control this org can have over someone, especially if they were raised in it.
WS
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 Simon Kestral says:

 December 19, 2015 at 8:55 am
 

Jake, as Winston said:
“your wife … may not … choose you over her family … it is amazing the amount of control this org can have over someone.”
To keep your wife, be careful and “keep a a low profile.” Avoid becoming a target for enemy fire.
But if you can abandon family and possessions for the sake of Jesus name, the reward, and suffering, are yours to choose.
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 Velvia Blue says:

 December 19, 2015 at 11:01 am
 

Take it softly softly. Chose only battles that you can win and are worth winning. Enjoy a happy married life.
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 Searcher says:

 December 20, 2015 at 7:33 am
 

Hi Jake,
I’m with the others that have responded to you. Please take a deep breath and take this with some wisdom from the others. I agree with you, that we need to get this cult exposed publicly, but I also agree that you should do this anonymously. You can be a better help to your family if you don’t make them martyrs (we all know that JW’s LOVE to be martyrs) or yourself a pariah to your family.
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 Sardec says:

 December 18, 2015 at 4:26 pm
 

Yes this is old news, but I thank the floating teapot that there is something different to read at least once a week. Thank you all at jwsurvey for guest writers who contribute their stories. I remember back when I would check daily to see if there were new articles…now I know that every Friday there will be something.
Reply
 
 

 Graeme Hammond says:

 December 18, 2015 at 5:46 pm
 

The UN debacle was a classic case of Watch Tower denial. Instead of design up, they created a story about joining in order to qualify for a library card. It was the response to that mess that focused my mind on their pride, their refusal to admit error, and the fact that this is an entirely human organization led by humans with the usual human flaws.
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 JBob says:

 December 18, 2015 at 10:09 pm
 

@Graeme – whoa… I just had a chill go down my spine, again, because you mention the excuse that it was to qualify for a UN Library card, but a few scant decades earlier, they boasted about “brothers and [mostly] sisters” being raped and beaten in Malawi for resisting government demands to register for a political party card [nevermind about Mexico, just now].
And, maybe the registrant realized that demons jumping out of the UN was “fake magic” but the literature (especially the “You May Survive Armaggedon” book and others up through the 1960’s) ranted on and on about the UN being a spawn of Satan–literally–and near-to equal of a demonized Babylon the Great church. JW’s expected a demon to swoop down and seize them just putting a toe across the threshhold of a church parking lot [some wouldn’t use a church lot to turn car around on a one-lane road bounded by flood ditches], so UN Library visit would be like feasting with the “King of Apostates”.
OTOH, if the intent was to follow-up with an easing of UN = Satan rhetoric, the boat sailed without that accomplishment.
So, integrity–window–out flying of.
But, that’s one example of JW conflicted thoughts, the literature also made it apparent that commercial entities (corporations and legal partnerships–apparently over a certain asset value on the books(?)) were also “spawns of Satan,” but Watchtower, Inc. and now so many “daughters of Watchtower, Inc” apparently exceeding the same asset value [J* adjusts for inflation?] as the previous mentioned demonic corporations are “divine instruments (entities)”? Same amount of ‘paper-chase’ to form as the “demonic” entities, yet somehow set apart. Was there a libation poured out to sanctify these entities? Or, maybe it’s the “dedication ceremony” to expunge unclean spirits?
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 anonymous4 says:

 December 18, 2015 at 7:02 pm
 

@ Jake
 I think your ideas are awesome! I have done similar things, and plan to do more. My advice is: DO IT!!!
 I always say, There’s no harm in trying. You can’t win the lottery if you don’t play. Other than that, all I can say is talk about this stuff to “worldly” people when you have a chance (they don’t have a clue either) and keep coming to this site.
 PS: I suppose it wouldn’t hurt to inform “worldly” folks of this site, either. Who knows, some may be curious enough to check it out. Word spreads fast.

Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 18, 2015 at 7:11 pm
 

P.S.
 Does your father-in-law believe the Moon Landings were fake too? :))

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 anonymous4 says:

 December 18, 2015 at 7:22 pm
 

I have nothing to add to the “overlapping” argument, except the blatantly obvious: Jesus did say “THIS generation will by no means pass away…”, NOT “The OVERLAPPING generation…”. I don’t believe the word “overlapping” even exists in the New Testament. I certainly do not recall Jesus EVER using that word. Adding a word or concept like that would seem to be an act of, oh, I don’t know………..APOSTASY??! :)
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 Searcher says:

 December 20, 2015 at 7:42 am
 

Good point! The overlapping generation thing is the biggest ‘tap-dance’ I have ever seen come out of the WTS leadership yet. It’s all I could do not to split my gut laughing at David Splane explain the overlapping generation. It’s a pathetically desperate attempt by the current GB body trying their level-best to cover the complete _ _ _ _ ups their predecessors set up for them. (insert your expletive at the blank) It showed this is definitely not God’s one and only spokespeople for the earth.
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 anonymous4 says:

 December 18, 2015 at 7:29 pm
 

Watchtower considers itself to be Guardians Of Doctrine — G.O.D.
 They are more like Guardians Of Old Forgotten Scrolls — G.O.O.F.S.

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 anonymous4 says:

 December 18, 2015 at 7:36 pm
 

As long as I’m being silly, here’s a suggested name for a (conceivable) Watchtower Casino: Jehovah’s Awesome Christian Casino Of Victory — J.A.C.C.O.V.
 P.S. This post may get deleted (justifiably so). But it was worth it. πŸ˜‰

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 Robert67 says:

 December 18, 2015 at 9:24 pm
 

Jesus would teach “the way” to live during his ministry, not “the denomination” to belong to.
36 “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?”
37 Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. 38 This is the first and greatest commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”

Love above all else in the law or prophets words. The Watchtower teaches pharisaical conditional love, pending amount of hours dedicated to pushing magazines.
The Watchtower conditions its members to seek glory and applause for themselves and deals harshly with those not interested in praise from their “platforms”. Their faithful and discreet slave is anything but faithful to Gods word or discreet about their service. They love being under lights in front of cameras, receiving the praise and let’s face it worship of the rank and file wherever they go. Jesus refused to be called good, because only God in heaven was good. Jesus showed his disciples humility by washing their feet and repeated what he thought of those wanting all the attention.
1″Take care not to practice your righteousness in front of men to be noticed by them; otherwise you will have no reward with your Father who is in the heavens. 2 So when you make gifts of mercy, do not blow a trumpet ahead of you, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and in the streets, so that they may be glorified by men. Truly I say to you, they have their reward in full”.
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 Man from the lions pit says:

 December 18, 2015 at 10:20 pm
 

Thank you for this even previous articles CF !
 Any individual,company or entity who lost the ability of self reflection or self critique it’s on the way to oblivion.
 This apply to WT and JW.org as we know it.
 The question is not IF just WHEN.
 MENE MENE TEKEL

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 Man from the lions pit says:

 December 18, 2015 at 10:23 pm
 

UPHARSIN …. I forgot to finisht it….
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 ScotWm says:

 December 19, 2015 at 12:51 am
 

Rather than admit wrongdoing, the Watchtower’s Guardians Of Doctrine (GOD) use endless self-adulating repetition as a powerful brainwashing tool. The Governing Body’s mind bending technique is to continually state that Jehovah’s Witnesses have the only true religion, which is being directed by the seven self-appointed (and self-anointed) members of Jesus’ faithful slave. The “new light” explanations, which previously painted over failed prophesy, are now called “adjustments.”
The claim is made that this faithful slave directs congregations which are overseen by spirit-appointed elders and ministerial servants who must be obeyed. Bible laws are then mixed with Watchtower laws which must be strictly followed if cult members are to have Jehovah’s approval. The constant repetition of these key points has the effect of negating all past and present Watchtower mistakes.
As a loving provision, the Governing Body is now providing its published propaganda in PDF format, which allows global word searches. The key words found in the March 2016 Watchtower Study Edition reveal a lot about what Jehovah’s Witnesses are expected to think and what they are expected to believe. Certain key words appear in this issue:
congregation: 51
 law: 26
 baptism: 41
 dedication: 20
 young ones: 15
 elder: 11
 servant: 14
 unity: 10
 obey: 6

This issue of the Watchtower is designed to lure young and impressionable ones into getting baptized as soon as possible. Too young to be aware of the Watchtower’s dubious past and present, these youths are a vulnerable target. The message clear: Young ones (particularly boys) need to get baptized now and reach out for positions of responsibility in their congregations, or risk being killed during the great tribulation.
Paragraph 18, page 21: “Indeed, to keep receiving God’s blessing, we need to pay attention to all the directions provided through the Christian congregation. Having an obedient spirit now will help us to follow directions during the “great tribulation,” which will eliminate Satan’s entire evil system.” (Matt. 24:21)
http://www.jw.org/en/publications/magazines/watchtower-study-march-2016/
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 anonymous4 says:

 December 19, 2015 at 5:07 am
 

“Listen, obey, and be enslaved…”
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 rikos says:

 December 19, 2015 at 5:47 am
 

jehovah’s witnesses (Fred franz 1975 discourses)
 the first minute is not very clear,but after the first minute you can here, the and will come on OCT/05/1975.Bles is those who left this organization.

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 Nathan says:

 December 19, 2015 at 6:53 am
 

It is the Devil’s latest historical trick to mix Watcthtower Witnesses with the biblical name ”Jehovahs Witnesses”. They call themselves spiritual jews. Therefore WW fits the Pharisees perfect. They say one thing, and does another”.
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 Adam Heckathorn says:

 December 19, 2015 at 7:59 am
 

Great article and You could write it all over again and using a whole other set of mistakes not mentioned here. Mistakes that like some of these mentioned have ruined the lives if not ended the lives of countless individuals. Then You could write it again with yet another set of mistakes. I’m not sure how many times this could be rewritten using a whole new set of mistakes.
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 Robert67 says:

 December 19, 2015 at 8:25 am
 

Very relevant to the articles topic.
 If you weren’t awake yet…




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 JWChange says:

 December 19, 2015 at 12:00 pm
 

Very well written article. Simple to the point. JWs have a saying, ‘new things learned’. Also known as ‘old things remembered’. I think this article should be put on this website and other JW ones (such as forums) every year to increase the chance of new persons learning the real Truth about ‘the truth’
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 Doc Obvious says:

 December 19, 2015 at 2:52 pm
 

Does Watchtower follow the Civil Rights act of 1964?
As one company puts on their job information board, This company is an Equal Opportunity Employer. All qualified applicants will receive consideration for employment without regard to race, color, religion, sex, pregnancy, sexual orientation, gender identity, national origin, age, protected veteran status, or disability status.
The answer is that Watchtower discriminates on sexual orientation and gender identity.
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 Karen says:

 December 19, 2015 at 4:03 pm
 

I am utterly gutted at the findings of the Royal Commission…. A crisis of conscience indeed ….. For without the ‘Truth’ where do we go? Where is God’s organisation on earth? I have been advised to trust in Jehovah he will set matters straight, not to turn against the organisation into apostasy …… However the God I know and love also loves children and would not condone nor hide theses atrocities against anyone.
 I am so filled with guilt because I am not attending meetings …. but I cannot walk out the door ….. I love Jehovah and I love his Bible and the promises he makes to us ….. BUT …… I am lost …..

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 Winston Smith says:

 December 19, 2015 at 8:52 pm
 

@Karen,
 Keep in mind that you don’t need to be a part of a large organization to serve God through Christ. Jesus said that ‘if just two or three are gathered in my name there I am with them.’

Russell didn’t believe that there should be any divisions among Christians. The various denominations (including the JWs) only serve to divide the true followers of Christ.
I highly recommend Ray Franz’s second book: In Search of Christian Freedom. He gives a very good perspective on how to serve God without the support of some large organization.
WS
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 Robert67 says:

 December 20, 2015 at 11:02 am
 

The God of the Bible requests that you worship him in Truth and Spirit. There is no truth to the everchanging doctrines of the Watchtower publishing company and its stock. There is only one middle man between you and God, that is the Christ. Focus on him as Paul adviced the Colosseans when they were swamped by a plethora of opinions on doctrine.
Reply
 
 
 

 BeenMislead says:

 December 19, 2015 at 5:20 pm
 

Yes so true!! And yet they want un-questioning obedience!!
The Watchtower Bible and Tract Society have become extreme and cult-like. If it really was Jehovah’s Organization this would not be happening!
Notice this quote from a recent 2013 Watchtower magazine:
“At that time, the life-saving direction that we receive from Jehovah’s organization may not appear practical from a human standpoint. All of us must be ready to obey any instructions we may receive, whether these appear sound from a strategic or human standpoint or not.” – (Watchtower 2013, 11/15, Pg. 20, Seven Shepherds, Eight Dukes—What They Mean for Us Today)
Here is another cult-like quote:
“We need to obey the faithful and discreet slave to have Jehovah’s approval.” – (Watchtower 2011, 7/15, Pg. 24, Simplified English Edition)
Requiring un-questioning obedience to 7 imperfect men (the Governing Body of Jehovah’s Witnesses) whether these instructions appear sound from a strategic or human standpoint or not, is extremism and is cult-like!
This is coming from the same Organization (The Watchtower Bible and Tract Society) that thought Armageddon was coming in 1914, then again in 1925, and then again in 1975.
This is especially disturbing and dangerous given the fact that they have not been right about anything yet. The Watchtower Bible and Tract Society have a 100% failure rate in their predictions and/or interpretations for future events.
Sorry to say, but if you think anything they say now is going to happen or come true, then you are being gullible and naive!
This 1969 Awake magazine quote testifies to their failure rate:
“If you are a young person, you also need to face the fact that you will never grow old in this present system of things. Why not? Because all the evidence in fulfillment of Bible prophecy indicates that this corrupt system is due to end in a few years.
 Of the generation that observed the beginning of the “last days” in 1914, Jesus foretold: “This generation will by no means pass away until all these things occur.”-Matt. 24:34. Therefore, as a young person, you will never fulfill any career that this system offers. If you are in high school and thinking about a college education, it means at least four, perhaps even six or eight more years to graduate into a specialized career. But where will this system of things be by that time? It will be well on the way toward its finish, if not actually gone!” – (Awake, May 22, 1969, P. 14, What Future For The Young?)

(Psalm 146:3) “Do not put your trust in princes Nor in a son of man, who cannot bring salvation.”
Reply
 

 Tara says:

 December 20, 2015 at 8:12 am
 

I am prepared to use the above quotes if asked about my loyalty to the FDS. I will follow it up by asking if they are prepared to drink the kool aid. Are they prepared to forcibly make children and old ones drink it. You see, if absolute obedience means just that, then they would have to say yes. At that point I would smile and say ‘I rest my case, I am done’.
Reply
 
 
 


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← Royal Commission findings: Jehovah’s Witness elders left abuse survivors “silenced and unsupported”
 
The Friday Column: Everyone makes mistakes – except Watchtower
Posted on December 18, 2015

The mistakes of bible characters are owned up to in the scriptures
The mistakes of bible characters like Peter are owned up to in the scriptures

Everyone makes mistakes. The Bible characters certainly did. Think of the Apostle Peter, denying Jesus three times on the night of his arrest, his faith and courage failing him at the critical moment, leaving him a weeping, emotionally shattered wreck. (John 18:13-27)

Think of King David, sleeping with Bathsheba then panicking over the resulting pregnancy, so desperate to avoid scandal that he ultimately orchestrates events to get Bathsheba’s husband killed. (2 Samuel chapter 11)
Or think of Jonah, getting a commission from God to condemn the Ninevites, but instead running away in terror from that commission as fast as he can. (Jonah 1:3) After God readjusts Jonah’s thinking via the rather humiliating use of a whale’s digestive tract, Jonah finally gets his act together and goes forth to condemn the Ninavites. (Jonah 1:17-2:2)
Except the Ninivites promptly repent and God forgives them, so Jonah throws a hissy fit about how he will now look like a fool when all that fire and judgement he prophesied doesn’t show up on time. (Jonah 3:10) God rolls his eyes and has to school him again about not being a sulky little child, especially where people’s lives are concerned. (Jonah 4: 9-11)
Faithful men of old made some horrific mistakes, and Watchtower makes mistakes too. Think of prophecy.
“1914 will be the end of the world! Oh, that didn’t happen. Hmmm. We meant to say 1925, and Moses will be resurrected then as well! Huh, the world didn’t end and Moses is a no-show (but we can still use that lovely house we built for him). Wait right, 1975 will be the year it all ends! Oh…. well it’ll certainly come before the end of the 20th century!…huh…erm…before the generation that saw 1914 passes away? OH COME ON!”
Or think of medical advice.
For example, from 1921 to 1952, the Watchtower campaigned against vaccination, presenting it as unsuitable for Christians and nothing more than a malicious con on the part of the medical establishment.
During an era when mankind was poised to make great strides in eliminating diseases such as smallpox, Watchtower recklessly stood in the way, endangering not only the lives of its followers but of all those who came into contact with them. Only in the 1950’s did they start to reverse this position, apparently due to legal concerns more than anything else. It’s hard to argue that lives were not lost or ruined as a result.
What about organ transplants? From 1967 to 1980, the Watchtower considered transplants to be cannibalism, thus putting this life-saving and life-changing treatment out of the reach of its followers. This position was reversed after 13 years, but again it’s hard to argue that witnesses would not have suffered and even died as a result of this mistake
And how could we not mention child abuse? In Austraila alone, it was recently disclosed that over 1,006 alleged child abusers were known to Watchtower since the 1950’s as operating in their congregations. None of them were reported to the authorities.
None.
As a result of this inaction, Watchtower’s own internal records show that a significant number of these molesters continued to offend and re-offend with apparent impunity, and with no recourse available to the abuse survivors.
Of all their errors of judgement, this seems to be one of the gravest Watchtower has ever made.
So, just like the faithful men of old, Watchtower has made some terrible mistakes. There is, however, one significant difference between the faithful men of God in the bible, and Watchtower today.
In the bible, God’s people admitted their mistakes.
Peter, for example, is never recorded as having contested the accounts of his failure on the night of Jesus’ arrest. Rather, the bible narrative makes clear that he fully admitted his failures and did his best to atone for them.
Additionally, all in the congregations of the first century would be aware of Peter’s history. There was no whitewashing, no denial. Peter owned his mistake and learned from it, later being recorded as a courageous man who successfully stood firm in situations similar to the one in which he succumbed.
Likewise David, upon being confronted with the gravity of his sins, tore his garments apart and went into mourning.
If one assumes the bible as being the word of God and accepts the biblical narrative of who wrote what, then it was David himself who recorded the full depths of his mistakes in Psalm 51, acknowledging the full horror and human cost of his error. No excuses. No passing the buck. No editing of his personal history. David took it full on the chin, accepting whatever consequences God felt fitting.
Likewise, according to the religious text, Jonah himself is the author of the book that bares his name – even if most bible scholars consider the book allegorical. But assuming it is a historical account with Jonah as the writer, as befitting a humble man of God he did not attempt to whitewash his own history, or belittle his mistakes. Rather, he recorded them in excruciating detail, presenting a brutally honest chronicle of his worst failures that often cast him in a poor light.
Jonah didn’t care that it made him look bad. He knew that it was more important to acknowledge his serious mistakes, own them, and learn from them.
How does this compare to Watchtower? Let’s start with the succession of failed prophecies littering the feet of the Organization.
It has to be said, the founder of the religion, Charles Taze Russell, did occasionally admit that he’d blundered in this regard, although this didn’t stop him from setting new dates to replace the failed ones with seemingly endless enthusiasm and very little self reflection.
However as time went by and the leadership changed, this trait faded from Watchtower’s skill set. For example, the only acknowledgement of the 1975 debacle was a single published article that essentially threw the rank and file Witnesses under the bus for believing what they were told by Watchtower from the platform and in publications (never mind the fact that they are not allowed to dispute what they are told from the platform and in publications by Watchtower).
Since then, failed prophecies have not even been acknowledged as errors. They have instead been re-framed as “new understandings” or “new light.”
So the next time I leave home without my wallet, that’s not a mistake. That’s new light about the location of my wallet. And the next time I burn the toast it is not a mistake, just a new understanding about the desired status of the toast. I mean yes, I still had to eat carbonized bread for breakfast, and I’m standing at the bus stop with no money to pay the fare, but I didn’t make any mistakes, you see…
What about the other subjects? Issues where Watchtower mistakes have had a grave cost in physical and mental health? A cost in human lives? Issues such as banning vaccination and organ transplants? Or the covering up of numerous cases of child sexual abuse?
Watchtower has never apologized for these mistakes. Ever.
In fact, if you are a Jehovah’s Witness reading this, it might be the first you’ve even heard of some of these issues, so thoroughly has Watchtower whitewashed them from history and made sure that the congregation does not know.
Y’know, exactly the way Peter didn’t.
And the way David didn’t.
And the way Jonah didn’t.
I guess you can draw your own conclusions from that.
 
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← Royal Commission findings: Jehovah’s Witness elders left abuse survivors “silenced and unsupported”
 
315 Responses to The Friday Column: Everyone makes mistakes – except Watchtower

← Older Comments
Newer Comments →
 

 Alexandria R says:

 December 19, 2015 at 5:36 pm
 

I never knew the society bad mouthed vacinations. That’s interesting. People listen and obey. Awful.
Reply
 
 

 enuffsenuff says:

 December 19, 2015 at 8:42 pm
 

I am always concerned over the use of the term “spirit directed”, what does that mean? Put simply,the WT uses it to imply (by innuendo, subterfuge, suggestion) that somehow they are enveloped by the HS. There exists no proof that any one has God’s spirit (power) to do anything, with one exception-: the Bible itself. As someone once said to me, “captured HS on the printed page”. I think that is correct and the Bible does exert power (Heb4:12) if you let it.
 I think the WTS has back away from the claim of spirit appointed men, these days, since it has become patently false and unprovable, more than that, some of their appointments have proved that HS had nothing to do with it.
 What the WTS has done is hijack the consciences of people with claims of being spirit directed. As one sister put it regarding the WT mag, “this is so good that we don’t even have to think for ourselves, the GB does that for us.” I nearly walked outside that day so that I wouldn’t say something offensive.
 So what does all this mean? The 1940 WT spoke about ALL religion as coming from the devil, Satan, so why would Jehovah give religion, ANY religion, his spirit in the form of power? Watchtower 1940 pages 104-105, 125
 Therefore if religion is an invention of Satan, would Jehovah give the Israelites (or anyone else) LAWS of Governance, or a religion to live by? Did Christ come to fulfil LAW or fulfil religion? Did Christ leave us with religion or just two LAWS and ask that worship be done in spirit and truth? Did the Aaronic priesthood teach the LAW or religion to people? Some people argue that because animal sacrifices were involved then wasn’t that religious? One answer is that the animals were prescribed as atonement for sins, which means that by LAW they had to pay a fine because of their sinful imperfections (which has put us all under a death penalty). Israel was always referred to as the “Nation of” implying Governance, not religion.
 So in some ways, even though Russell had a lot of ideas that can be described as “unusual” ( I am trying to be kind) it was his thinking, as I understand it, not to become a religion, but always remain a Society. That is, a free association of people but without domination of another’s conscience.
 It was Rutherford that went down the path of religion because he saw benefits that flowed from Govt. He switched to the dark side the day that happened (my allusion to Star Wars) and it looks like they joined Babylon TG?

Reply
 

 Winston Smith says:

 December 19, 2015 at 9:11 pm
 

@enuffsenuff,
They engage in doublespeak when they say they are not inspired but are spirit-directed.
They are not inspired when one of their many predictions fail or they have to change their stand on some teaching. But they claim spirit direction when they want the rank and file to blindly accept their latest psycho-babble.
WS
Reply
 
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 20, 2015 at 4:36 am
 

“‘This is so good we don’t even have to think for ourselves.'”
LMAO
 Talk about a Fool’s Paradise!

Reply
 
 

 Meredith J says:

 December 20, 2015 at 9:23 pm
 

enuffsenuff, you speak so much sense. I would have walked out too if I had heard some sister come out with that wayout thought. Actually, it was no thought as she was ascribing all her thought to the Watchtower. Oh my goodness. Surely someone corrected her, but probably not, because they were all so asleep, most agreed with her. the GB would have loved that comment.
The society used to speak a lot about atonement and as I recall, it was heavily embedded in much of the literature. And that atonement was that John outlined in 1John2:2 when he said “He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the sins of the whole world.” He was the reason why we didn’t need to make a fire and sacrifice a cow or a sheep. We didn’t need to because the sacrificial lamb Jesus Christ paid that price for us forever. Shows how strictly legal God is.
Instead of a whole bunch of laws, Jesus gave us the two to love God and love our neighbour as ourself. Not easy to do but oh so simple. With these basic laws, how refreshing and nonburdensome would life be. And of course we have the Bible and that is where the Holy Spirit comes from I am sure. If we drift away from it or keep inventing our own spin on stuff that is controversial then is the Holy Spirit going to bless us? If it is not inline with it how can it? If the GB had any Holy Spirit then they would admit their mistakes. This would be the honest thing to do, otherwise it is a lie.
Reply
 
 

 eyes opened says:

 December 22, 2015 at 7:52 am
 

The statement of not having to think for ourselves could have easily come from the 2015 district convention. At the convention I attended one of the speakers said “Jehovah’s people want to be told what to think”. Not! Anyone know what a lemming is, haha. That is what the gb are looking for. That is not intended to be offensive but it’s a reminder that we could become that the moment we stop thinking for ourselves. We should question and research. Even Luke thoroughly researched the things he was inspired to write. They say we should be Boereans (sp?) but not if it means questioning them.
Regards
Reply
 
 
 

 sally says:

 December 20, 2015 at 4:16 am
 

Another great article! Thank you!
Reply
 
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 20, 2015 at 4:41 am
 

@ Man from the lion’s pit
 Good point about individuals and entities who cannot self-analyze or self-critique, being headed for Oblivion.
 It is also a trait of psychopaths, sociopaths, and Narcissists.

Reply
 
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 20, 2015 at 4:46 am
 

If a man who builds a house on the sand is asking for trouble, what about a watchtower built on sand??!
 Without their Watchtower, the Armies of Darkness will be blind.

Reply
 
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 20, 2015 at 5:09 am
 

I was just thinking of how the human race has historically turned to religion as a source of comfort and security. After all, here we are on this tiny speck of dust, spinning aimlessly through the incomprehensibly vast Universe. It can be daunting, even terrifying. But what level of security has organized religion provided through the eons? Well, religion has been the cause of many, many wars, genocides, abuses, mutilations, murders, deaths, assassinations, physical traumas, psychological traumas, emotional traumas, family breakups, suppressions of Freedom of Speech, Freedom of Thought, Freedom of the Press, Freedom of Association, Freedom of Movement, suppression of healthy sexual expression, countless incidences of religious persecution on an organizational and personal level, greed, more greed, and, yes, even more greed, and the actions taken to satisfy said greed. Have I forgotten anything? And btw, no one can use the “guns don’t kill people; people kill people” argument. These are not just the acts of individuals. They are premeditated, institutionalized acts, “justified” by religious doctrine and dogma. (btw guns don’t kill people; bullets kill people)
 Conclusion: If that’s the kind of “security” organized religion provides, I prefer to go it alone, Thank you very much.

Reply
 

 RetiredLE says:

 December 20, 2015 at 7:36 am
 

If you are a passenger in a cab and the driver ignores your instructions, is in fact going to drive over a high cliff…then you notice the posted sign.. “obey any instructions (you) may receive, whether these appear sound from a strategic or human standpoint or not”…
What does one do? …..
Jump out of the cab!…it may hurt a bit, perhaps even a broken bone or two…..
However, what if your wife and infant children are in the back seat and cannot see what is happening?
What does one do?……
Shoot the cab driver…..(metaphorically speaking)….. in the head….
Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 20, 2015 at 9:22 pm
 

I like your metaphor. πŸ˜‰
Reply
 
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 20, 2015 at 9:30 pm
 

‘Better to enter the Kingdom of Freedom with a broken bone or two, than be pitched with bones intact into the Pit of Slavery and Submission.’
Reply
 

 RetiredLE says:

 December 21, 2015 at 9:45 am
 

anonymous 4 . Thank you and appreciate your ‘Insight on the Scriptures- Vol IV’.
Reply
 
 
 
 
 

 Ron says:

 December 20, 2015 at 5:51 am
 

A nicely put article. Any JW reading it can or should grasp the point. I love the illustrations of new light, (Wallet, toast. Bus fare). Such things are easily to the point and do not overcomplicate matters.
Reply
 
 

 Openmind says:

 December 20, 2015 at 8:25 am
 

Hi everyone. I’ve been visiting this site for a very long time but this is my first comment.
 I would like to thank Lloyd for his hard work and research, all who contribute excellent articles and the thought provoking comments posted.
 I am an ex-JW (D/A’d) with some family still in, thankfully not immediate family. Since leaving NOT ONE PERSON has ever tried to get me back into the cult – probably because, at the time, I gave solid logical reasons that could not be argued with and were not reasons to warrant me being D/F’d.
 I fully agree that no apologies are ever given for wrong doing or wrong teachings on the part of JW’s. They think they are NEVER wrong but the huge problem of covering up child sexual abuse I find disgustingly sickening and stomach churning. It took a few years for me to realise that I had had some very, separate, uncomfortable minutes with a Brother Feeler and Brother Fondler. Thank goodness it was only minutes.
 There are many good JW’s out there, and good elders as evidenced by comments from them on this site, and for them I do have respect. However, and unfortunately, I do feel the majority of elders, who sit on committes and have the arrogant presumption that they are fit to judge others, sometimes with catastrophic results, fall into 2 categories – 1) Those with some intelligence, which surely would make them know it is all SO wrong. Maybe they feel trapped and stay for fear of shunning. 2) Those who are ill educated and extremely deluded but love their elevated congregational status and go about with an air of unfounded arrogant superiority.
 I think though that most of us here feel the GB are ultimately responsible for all the wrongs. Who do they think they are? An ounce of intelligence between the lot of them surely means they know they are not directed by some holy spirit. Has anyone else noticed what awful public speakers they all are? Did the TMS not teach them anything?
 I hope I’m not going too far off topic here, but last week I came across an article in the May 15th 2015 study edition of Watchtower, ‘Remembering my first love for Jehovah’ as told by Anthony Morris 111. BTW, doesn’t that mean he must have/had 2 blood relatives with exactly the same name, including middle names, to use the 111 after his name to differentiate one from the other? And does he really need the 111 living in his little Bethel bubble of lies and deceit, or is it a matter of wanting some kind of mis-placed status?
 Anyway, back to his article. I could spend hours going through his story sentence by sentence but a few points really stood out for me. 1) He speaks with great pride about the “privilege it was for me to be taught by that anointed brother who had personally known Charles T. Russell!” If Russell were still alive today, holding on to his original beliefs, and AM 111 with his beliefs, which one would be D/F’d for Apostacy? 2) He married Susan and they have 2 sons and “because they made the truth their own, they make Susan and me look good”. Oh my, he is so full of self admiration! BTW, will those 2 sons be amongst the Bethelites kicked to the kerb to save some money? 3) Regarding his preaching work, he “even placed tracts with men in the restrooms”. Really, REally, REAlly, REALly, REALLy, REALLY?! I have 3 sons and I asked them how they would respond if approached by some religious zealot in a public toilet. Due ro respecting the comment posting guidelines I am unable to say what their responses were!
 No doubt the R and F who read the article thought it wonderful, touching, uplifting and blah blah blah, which shows how blinded such ones are as are those responsible are for actually allowing it to be printed! Please, please don’t let this encourage their young ones to go preaching from public toilet to public toilet.
 I apologise for the lengthy post but thank you to those who read it.

Reply
 

 Tara says:

 December 20, 2015 at 8:57 am
 

Some really interesting points there Openmind. T3 gets my goat with his presumptuous use of III, his personal views on ‘tight pants’… I for one have made great effort in wearing yoga pants and leggings as much as possible since his silly comments. I would also deem it an invasion of privacy if someone offered me a tract whilst I was on the loo. Ugh, these men make me want to puke.
 Yesterday I handed over a bag of beautifully wrapped Christmas gifts to my daughter in law and it felt good. I have listened to Christmas carols and cried like a baby. Maybe some of it is pagan but it makes me think of Jesus and I feel humble. Beats the hell out of sitting in a KH with the rest of the bobble heads nodding in agreement as the Kool aid is poured.

Reply
 

 Openmind says:

 December 20, 2015 at 9:32 am
 

Thanks Tara – I too just love my skinny jeans! Merry Christmas to you and yours! What fun we’ll all have!
Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 20, 2015 at 9:47 pm
 

I agree, that 99.9% of WT “speakers” are awful, and BORING.
 As for handing out tracts in men’s washrooms…….CREEPY. Who knows, perhaps that’s where the obsession with tight pants all began. ‘Then is Finished the Mystery of the Tight Pants!’ :)

Reply
 
 

 Tara says:

 December 21, 2015 at 8:31 pm
 

Merry Christmas to you too :)
Reply
 
 
 
 

 Meredith J says:

 December 20, 2015 at 9:37 pm
 

Having not been near the literature for a while, I am out of touch with these recent articles. My impression from what I have seen of Tony Tight Pants is that I would not have liked him to have been my teacher if I was a child at school. He has a rather scarey look. You are right though, these GB members seem to lack good public speaking ability. I wonder why they picked now to publish such an article.
Reply
 

 Openmind says:

 December 21, 2015 at 3:39 am
 

A few of the GB members have done life stories – Jackson did one in the August WT. I sometimes go online just to read various mags, it makes me cringe but can also be a great laugh. The Kingdom Ministry used to be hilarious with instructions on how to get folk hooked when going door to door.
 Maybe AMIII just got the concept of public speaking all so wrong in his early enthusiasm!!!

Reply
 
 
 

 minion says:

 December 24, 2015 at 5:39 pm
 

@ O,
Welcome, and may the force be with us.
JWSurvey has many friends near and far – with unconditional love.
You have taken one giant step to Freedom, Liberty, Empowerment, and recovery. Your journey in Life has begun. Make the best of it, and we are here to help you along the way.
You have taken the scripture to the next level, of John 8:32, “and You will know the Truth – by way of JWSurvey, the Truth will set You Free from enslavement to the Watchtower Corporation – by way of JWSurvey.
Stay strong and remember, – We answer to No one inside the KH. – No one!
JWSurvey = you will know the Truth – John 8:32.
Peace out,
Reply
 
 
 

 John Allaire says:

 December 20, 2015 at 12:33 pm
 

I was shunt in 1984,for the simple reason,i was no longer attending church for merely a month and a half.So they kicked me out,not for,committing any fornication,adultery,murder,blaspheming,stealing or any wrong doing of what so ever.But,yet,i was brought up in this world ,this cult,thinking that God only,will judge me and no one else,,,,to my big surprise,,,,tadaa,,,i was not good enough for their cult.I have kept record of all speach,and talks i have done for them,,all the research i did for my speeches,i was really devoted in this thing,not that i had a choice,but,anyway.I had that big 5 on 1 talk when i was booted out,mind you,i more or less booted myself out,why ?? Cause i`ve always had issues growing up,myself and 2 sisters,we would always get a beating,with a hockey stick,by my aunt,my father was smart enough not to join the cult.Yep,my father got divorced so my aunt,his sister took care of us.She was a nun pretty well all her life,then turned jw in 1964.So you can imagine how cranky them old ladies get,alone all her life,then raising 3 kids.So,yes,we were beating up many times,she broke 3 hockey sticks on my back,4 operations on my ears because she would lift me off the ground by my ears,of course,i was little though,lol .Anyway,we got beaten so bad,and not allowed to say a word about any of this to our father,to jw friends,not allowed to play with nobody but our kins,at school.Anyways,she died in a car accident on our way to a Quebec international assembly.A year later is when i started to open my eyes,and realize,that was not any Gods way or wanting his children to grow up as what myself and 2 sisters have been through.IT WAS HELL !!!! So,when it came time to shun me,NOT one elder believed any words i had told them.They called me a liar,it was wrong to lie ??!!! So,now,i literally had no one to turn to,no one to recite the life i was living,so what do i do? they won`t believe me,who will.So,i pretty well didn`t want no more part of any of them.The sad part,is my younger sister,had just got out of the cult in 1986,and later died in a car crash a year later,so that was the only one year we cherished together.We loved each other more than when we were in the cult,always spending time together,hugged,held hands etc etc,lived the true brother sister life,we were so happy to have that closeness together.Sadly,only for 1 year.Then,there`s that other sister,that has still never spoken a word to me since 1983,but yet,will go door to door,and talk to who knows who,???? child molesters,murderers,woman beaters,list goes on and on.So,they`re trying to preach us,that is Gods way to do things on this earth??? I don`t think we have the same God ????? God said to forgive and forget a thousand times for our mistakes,God said to love one another til death,God said,thou shalt not judge,They,the jw,are not acting upon what they are preaching.at all,at all…!!!!!????? Thank you for reading my friends,i still have very much of that nice,kind,giving personality,and still can recite some bible chapter and verses.Not being in their cult made me a better man,and believe more in God now than when it was forced upon me.Excuse my writting,for i am french,i done my best.. :) :)
Reply
 
 

 John Allaire says:

 December 20, 2015 at 12:45 pm
 

By the way,i feel so sad not having my older sister with me anymore,or ever will,she is way too far gone.She was so brainwashed,it`s sad.How do they expect us to go back,if none of them will talk you in,not that i would,but it could mean a little discussion here and there with my sis.lol There you go,,,,another proof that they don`t love you unless you adore THEIR God,another act against God`s will .
Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 20, 2015 at 10:02 pm
 

Raised by a Nun-turned-JW. Man, it MUST have been Hell! My sympathies. And sorry for the loss of your sister. I am happy you escaped the Borg.
 P.S.: Interesting that you were DF’d in 1984. Don’t know if you’ve heard of the novel ‘1984’ by George Orwell, but the parallels between The Watchtower Society and the Totalitarian Society in the novel are eye-opening. BTW there is a good synopsis of the story on Wikipedia.

Reply
 
 
 

 Ejecting to Sanity says:

 December 20, 2015 at 5:48 pm
 

Interesting idea in this thread : Find a KH where u r not known and partake at Memorial. I’m in!
Reply
 

 dee says:

 December 20, 2015 at 9:18 pm
 

Should the JWs even be commemorating the memorial of Christ’s death?
1Corinthians 11:25-26:
“In the same way, after supper he took the cup, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in my blood; do this, whenever you drink it, in remembrance of me.” For whenever you eat this bread and drink this cup, you proclaim the Lord’s death UNTIL HE COMES.”

The JWs teach that Jesus has already come – he began ruling as king of god’s kingdom in 1914, so the JWs should have ceased commemorating Christ’s death in 1914.
Also, if according to JW theology, Jesus will rule for 1000 years, then since Jesus began ruling in 1914 wouldn’t that mean that 101 years out of his 1000- year reign have already elapsed? (that is, 101 years from 1914 to 2015).
 There would now only be 899 years of Christ 1000-year reign remaining as of 2015.

Reply
 

 dee says:

 December 20, 2015 at 9:27 pm
 

http://mmoutreachinc.com/jehovahs_witnesses/1914.html
Reply
 
 

 minion says:

 December 21, 2015 at 9:28 pm
 

@ Dee,
My thoughts,
 Watchtower Corporation, cherry picks scriptures, and we All agree, right?
 They quote, Matt, 24:36, the man Jesus, said, ‘no one knows the hour, or day, no angels, not him, only God. Of his return, Right?

However, they have chosen 1914 as the start of Jesus 1,000 year reigning, right?
Then why does WT Corporation mandates, the annual memorial of Jesus death? If Jesus reigning already started, then the observation of Jesus death has no significance.
Heck, I have a CD recording of G.Loush, ( i know mispell) explaining the man Jesus will have accomplish everything during the 1,000 years reign – everything in the new world, and he will be forgotten.
 Imagine that, I think WT, has a big start on forgetting the man name Jesus – in 2015.

If the scriptures are true and real, then, I would not want to be present when Jesus Christ has the one on one talk with the 7 men – want to bee gods. – GB, the GB will be having a bad hair day.
Then the man Jesus, will say, so you thought You knew me, -want to be gods.
 The hell with you. You are a freaking goat, get the heck out of my face, down to hell you go, – burn baby burn – to the 7 men, want to be gods.

The 7 men will not be in the presence of Jesus, would you want these 7 men, want-to-be-gods with you – for eternity? I think not!
Peace out,
Reply
 
 
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 20, 2015 at 10:08 pm
 

“Find a kh where u r not known & partake at memorial.” — Hey, great way to be popular!
Reply
 
 
 

 Doc Obvious says:

 December 20, 2015 at 8:49 pm
 

Why is Watchtower Babble and Tract Society so fixated on construction and asking for money from their publisher ranks? The publishers are not a commercial banker and should not be burdened with such materialistic endeavors. Publishers should not be distracted by Watchtower’s insistance of their physical pursuits or their expanding real estate portfolio.
Jesus did not say “Go therefore and build me a resort near the lake”. He was focused on preaching work. Not construction. Furthermore, Jesus was not burdened with physical things of the world and did not own a house, a bed, or a tent. He owned nothing.
New York City is the most distracted city in the world. Jesus Christ, if he were alive today, would not even go near that city. New York City is the home for Wall Street and greedy businessmen the world over. Also, the famous New York Stock Exchange is located in Manhattan, New York City. Remember this is where the World Trade Center was located. Big Business indeed!
Actually Jesus Christ would have warned people to stay away from a city like that. It is too dangerous for Christians to be in. Way too many distractions. This is a place where physical men live.
True Christian should keep their eye simple, just like Jesus Christ. Taking care of their neighbors and helping their neighbors. Is it any wonder why religious leaders who live in New York City would be asking for your “valuable things”?
Reply
 
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 20, 2015 at 10:16 pm
 

Excellent points.
 Imagine a center for “pure worship” being located in the middle of, say, Babylon, or Sodom & Gomorrah. lol

Reply
 
 

 RetiredLE says:

 December 20, 2015 at 11:04 pm
 

Pondering how congregations have become so polarized, with just a small minority of servants and pioneers making up a core of those marching to the GB beat. They carry the banners of loyalty and superiority while ‘goose stepping’ over the average publisher or struggling ones. Something about the music? Didn’t you hate it when they changed the words or tunes around on the old songs? Did you notice how the majority of new songs/lyrics are themed to ‘loyalty’ and the ‘faithful slave’? Did you notice how the ‘core’ shouts out these new songs with no regard to any real musical beauty?
Reply
 

 Winston Smith says:

 December 21, 2015 at 6:40 am
 

@RetiredLE
 100% agree on the music. It totally lost all meaning for me. It was shortly after that switch over that my awakening began. I wonder if there was a connection.
 WS

Reply
 

 RetiredLE says:

 December 21, 2015 at 8:59 am
 

The GB will make a huge production about translating into some obscure language of a few hundred people. These people OBVIOUSLY have a ‘second’ language, a known ‘main stream’ language in order to exist.
 The GB will make some comment about how the “Truth” resonates in the heart of those who hear it in their mother tongue.

This is one recruiting tool in distracting ‘bored’ publishers into joining or forming foreign language groups, who may only have a handful of ‘natives’ attending. 99.9% of the time the ‘natives’ have, at least a plausible understanding of the main stream language. These, btw, usually have a much more cautious and practical approach to life, derived from the reality of having to ‘fact check’ whatever situation or circumstance has brought them this far.
The result, not much result. Some bored or overzealous witnesses ‘doing their time’, learning a language they will never use. Wasting their lives and any lonely ‘native sheeples’ lives that feel inclined to humor these domestic missionaries.
The round about point on music, it DID, in fact, speak to our hearts. Music is a powerful medium and tool for those inclined to use it, as such. So like you, Winston, myself and thousands of others were ‘shocked and awed’ when the GB decided to change our ‘mother tongue’ of music. Thank God, (or reason) it was the catalyst for questioning ..WHY?…
Reply
 
 

 Bad Penny says:

 December 24, 2015 at 6:53 pm
 

RetiredLE and Winston
 Yes, totally agree on the songs and music. Many were ruined for me – after years of committing them to memory, suddenly they’re changed -Why? My awakening began shortly after this also – maybe it’s a common thing.

Reply
 
 
 
 

 RetiredLE says:

 December 20, 2015 at 11:33 pm
 

“Before we begin the meeting….Oh, isn’t this a PART of the meeting….anyway”… I’ve taken the liberty to change around the lyrics of the Beatles, Eleanor Rigby, as new song #144,000 – “Publisher Rigby – All the Lonely Sheeple”
Ah, look at all the lonely Sheeple.
 Ah, look at all the lonely Sheeple.

Publisher Rigby, ponders the ‘new light’ where ‘old light’ had been.
 Lives in a dream.
 Waits for the Kingdom, trudging along, all alone, door to door.
 Who is it for?

All the lonely Sheeple where do they all come from?
 All the ‘thrown about’ Sheeple where do they all belong?

Elder McKenzie, reading the words of a LETTER that no one can hear.
 No one comes near.
 Look at him working, writing the LOCAL NEEDS for those who aren’t there.
 What does he care.

All the lonely Sheeple where do they all come from?
 All the ‘thrown about’ Sheeple where do they all belong?

Ah, look at all the lonely Sheeple.
 Ah, look at all the lonely Sheeple.

‘Irregular’ Rigby, died with no ‘time’ but was buried as ‘ONE’ all the same.
 Nobody came.
 Elder McKenzie, shaking his head as he bleeds for the ‘SLAVE’.
No one is saved.

All the lonely Sheeple where do they all come from?
 All the ‘thrown about’ Sheeple where do they all belong?

Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 21, 2015 at 1:18 am
 

APPLAUSE
 -Put it on the Top Ten!

Reply
 
 

 Winston Smith says:

 December 21, 2015 at 6:43 am
 

RetiredLE – very creative lyrics!
 WS

Reply
 
 

 eyes opened says:

 December 21, 2015 at 8:17 am
 

Okay that’s way cool! Too funny!
Reply
 
 

 JJ says:

 December 25, 2015 at 5:48 am
 

Excellent! Fits perfectly!
Reply
 
 
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 21, 2015 at 1:28 am
 

Speaking of Rat-holes like New York City, we are still expected to believe that we are living in the most enlightened period in all of human existence. Mostly because we are so technologically advanced. Unfortunately, what most of the droning, eDevice-obsessed masses don’t realize is that Technology does NOT = Enlightenment. Technological advancement = TECHnical advancement, which is a product of the BRAIN, not the MIND, or soul. That is why I don’t pay much attention to the babbling monkeys on the Television anymore.
Reply
 
 

 It ain't over says:

 December 21, 2015 at 6:33 am
 

DiiffiCULT to realise there’s ‘two Suns in the sunset”.
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 It's me says:

 December 21, 2015 at 6:41 am
 

So I was walking around the assembly hall wondering is it just me?
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 Tara says:

 December 21, 2015 at 8:06 am
 

Yesterdays talk was on loyalty – to whom? lots of talk of FDS with a handful of Jehovah and Jesus sprinkled on top. Loyalty to whom? def. not to those who are disloyal to the org. and dare break the rules… oh how bad we are if we put family members first. Loyalty to whom? Our wonderful leaders in the field, our pioneers and elders. Loyalty to whom? at this point I shut off because I was sick to my stomach. Then the WT… distraction… lol they even mentioned some movie that was distracting people from their study. Said movie contains bad things that those loyal to Jehovah should hate… No name was mentioned but I bet you could have ‘force’ed it out of them using an old Jedi mind trick. Then when I was completely distracted I read the last article that was waffling on about sending emails that contain anti witness stuff. ‘Even if it is true you shouldn’t send it to others as it may upset them’. Oh bless, lets hide the truth from the bobbleheads in case they feel upset that their spiritual leaders hide child abuse.
Reply
 

 Winston Smith says:

 December 21, 2015 at 11:47 am
 

@Tara,
 Several years ago I decided I could not sit there and listen to that stuff anymore. For a while I would just replay my favorite movies in my head – probably some were related to the one they were condemning. Now I can just barely sit through the memorial talk ( to which I only go to appease relatives).

So while I did not attend any meetings this past weekend, I did attend a certain movie that shall remain nameless. When I think of all that talk of loyalty to the org, elders, etc., all I can think is: “Who’s the more foolish: the fool or the fool who follows him?”
WS

Reply
 

 Tara says:

 December 21, 2015 at 1:17 pm
 

I too attended a certain movie :) Now I can sit back and enjoy the festivus without having to attend another meeting for a while. I am fading but this rebel doesn’t have a tie fighter to steal so I got to go by stealth.
Reply
 
 
 
 

 Openmind says:

 December 21, 2015 at 10:06 am
 

Everyone makes mistakes – except Watchtower.
 Collins English Dictionary definition of ‘mistake’ – An error or blunder in action, opinion or judgement.
 Please, this is not a debate on creation V evolution but I’ll quote the following to point out a WT ‘mistake’.
NWT Genesis chapter 1:3,4 Let there be light and God divided light/darkness into day/night ‘a first day’. Verses 14-19, creation of the luminaries (sun, moon etc) ‘a fourth day’. Whatever the light was on the first day couldn’t have been the the sun, it could have come from anywhere, after all God is supposed to be omnipotent and Genesis 1:2 says ‘God’s active force was moving about over the surface of the waters’. So, how did vegetation grow when God created it on the third day BEFORE THE SUN without it’s heat, as photosynthesis needs water, light and heat?
 Now to the JW ‘My Book of Bible Stories’ for children. The introduction says ‘all these stories are true’. Story 1 ‘God Begins to Make Things’. Paragraph 5 – “Well, first the earth needed light. So God made the light from the sun to shine on the earth. Afterward God caused the land to come up” etc., etc. After the story there are study questions one of which is ‘What occurred during the fourth creative day?’ (Gen. 1:16). So all these small people will read that scripture which CONFIRMS that the sun was not actually created until the fourth day?
 Now, have WT made a genuine MISTAKE here or LIED to the children with their outright contradiction in this they call a ‘true story’. Whichever it is, now is the time for you, WT, to apologise to these impressionable young people – after all, you do lurk on these so called ‘apostate’ sites don’t you?

Reply
 

 Winston Smith says:

 December 21, 2015 at 11:59 am
 

Openmind,
 Good points of reason and logic (two things religion has always had a problem with). There are some scholars who admit that the Genesis creation account is nothing more than allegory. It is certainly written from a very human point of view. It is the Watchtower’s (as well as some other fundamentalist group’s) insistence that all biblical “history” is literal that leads to these conflicts of reason. Whether an individual puts faith in the Bible or not is a personal choice. But one should be willing to consider what is written with a view to what we know about science and consider another potential interpretation, rather than insisting on some dogmatic point of view.
 WS

Reply
 

 Openmind says:

 December 21, 2015 at 12:33 pm
 

Winston Smith,
 Thank you so much for your reply. I totally agree with all you say. Perhaps I rambled on a bit but my point was, why would WT make a statement followed by a question with a scriptural reference which completely contradicts that statement! Surely it would be best if they told the story for children as the bible told it and not twist things themselves.

Reply
 

 Winston Smith says:

 December 21, 2015 at 5:01 pm
 

I agree they should be true to the source. Are they perhaps thinking that children will see the obvious disconnect and so they need to twist things so it makes sense? I doubt most kids would bother to look up the scriptures and thus take it all at face value. I certainly did as a child.
I also recall reading at one time (though I don’t recall the source) that they (the org) felt that the sun, moon, stars, etc. we’re created in the first day, but did not become visible to the earth until the fourth day. Maybe their justification is that they are “simplifying” this concept for the young?
WS
Reply
 
 
 
 
 

 Doc Obvious says:

 December 21, 2015 at 12:19 pm
 

Watchtower Babble and Tract Society is run by lawyers. Since this pandemic issue of child abuse in the Jehovah’s Perverts religion has been around for over 60 years, people should write letters to the American Bar Association and request that they investigate the conduct of Watchtower’s lawyers. When a case of ethics and misconduct by a legal department is too great, a disbarment is a common practice to revoke the license of a lawyer from practicing law.
Disbarment: “Disbarment is the removal of a lawyer from a bar association or the practice of law, thus revoking his or her law license or admission to practice law. Disbarment is usually a punishment for unethical or criminal conduct. Procedures vary depending on the law society.” URL: Disbarment – Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
I am sure Watchtower would welcome paying real retainers for real lawyers in the near future.
Reply
 

 RetiredLE says:

 December 21, 2015 at 3:40 pm
 

Doc,
This is an outstanding idea.
Here’s a link to some info on WT lawyers..
http://www.zoominfo.com/p/Philip-Brumley/13369142
http://www.zoominfo.com/p/Carolyn-Wah/72843979 21 listed with this reference.
Google – Phillip Brumley, General Counsel.
Also, listed in the Carolyn Wah link is
 Gregory Olds (involved with Religious Order of JW’s)
 he carried a lot of weight behind the scenes prior to my retirement.

The lawyers are driving the ‘clown car’ with the GB in the back seats and the ‘sheeple’ strapped to the grill.
Reply
 

 Ruthlee says:

 December 23, 2015 at 5:25 am
 

LE this carries some clout thanks for the info cheers ruthlee
Reply
 
 
 

 Doc Obviuos says:

 December 22, 2015 at 12:11 pm
 

Let’s not forget Watchtower’s stand on discrimination against sexual orientation. This goes against the law. This is unethical and criminal conduct. Time to act. Time to write, call, or email the American Bar Association.
Reply
 
 
 

 William Draper says:

 December 21, 2015 at 5:23 pm
 

Very good article . 850- 532- 5053 any may call me if they are looking for somebody to talk to , if they are a Jehovah Witness , or former Jehovah Witness if they have sincere intent .
Reply
 
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 21, 2015 at 9:42 pm
 

@ Tara
 You should have raised your hand during the WT study and used the old Han Solo quote: “No reward is worth THIS.” LOL
 If you wanted to get them to tell you which movie they were talking about, a Jedi mind trick would probably be overdoing it. A Dr. Seuss mind trick would suffice, I’m sure.

Reply
 

 Tara says:

 December 21, 2015 at 10:22 pm
 

Bahahaha
 Yub nub
 eee chop yub nub
 ah toe meet toe pee-chee keene
 g’noop dock fling oh ah
 Yah wah
 eee chop yah wah
 ah toe meet toe pee-chee keene
 g’noop dock fling oh ah
 Coatee chah tu yub nub
 coatee chah tu yahwah
 coatee chah tu glowah
 allay loo ta nuv
 Glowah
 eee chop glowah
 ya glowah pee chu nee foam
 ah toot dee awe goon daa
 Coatee cha tu goo (Yub nub!)
 coatee cha tu doo (Yahwah!)
 coatee cha tu too (Ya chaa!)
 allay loo ta nuv
 allay loo ta nuv
 allay loo ta nuv
 Glowah
 eee chop glowah
 ya glowah pee chu nee foam
 ah toot dee awe goon daa
 Allay loo ta nuv

Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 22, 2015 at 4:50 am
 

Wow. That actually makes a lot more sense than anything I’ve ever read in the “Watchtower”!
Reply
 

 Tara says:

 December 22, 2015 at 7:51 am
 

I’m adopting the Ewok freedom song as the ex jw freedom song.
Reply
 
 

 dee says:

 December 22, 2015 at 8:25 am
 

LOL! and more LOL!
Reply
 

 Winston Smith says:

 December 22, 2015 at 9:00 am
 

I never cared for the re-release of Return of the Jedi (c. 1997) where they replaced the Ewok freedom song with instrumental music. Give me a rousing chorus of Yub Nub any day.
Maybe Ewokee will become the code language of ex-JWs. LOL.
WS

 
 
 
 
 
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 21, 2015 at 9:48 pm
 

@ Openmind
 It is, of course, doubtful that the Watchtower Society would EVER apologize to ANYONE, ESPECIALLY children. To them, children are just ASSETS, to be dedicated and baptized as early as possible, so they can join all the other Pawns on the Watchtower Chessboard.

Reply
 
 

 Hakizimana Jean de Dieu says:

 December 21, 2015 at 11:20 pm
 

Same god same people!!!!!!!
 *** g82 8/22 p. 9 Divine Monarchy Is Coming! ***
 God does not purpose to conduct a worldwide referendum to see if people will accept his kingdom, his monarchy.

Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 22, 2015 at 1:01 am
 

They expect yahweh to shove it down their throats, just like they do. People create their gods in their own image.
Reply
 

 Hakizimana Jean de Dieu says:

 December 22, 2015 at 4:17 am
 

You are right, People create their gods in their own image…
(Genesis 1:27) . . .And God went on to create the man in his image, in God’s image he created him; male and female he created them. . .
(Genesis 6:6) . . .Jehovah regretted that he had made men on the earth, and his heart was saddened. . .
Here, if God = Jehovah, we should rewrite the Bible where it is now man’s turn to regret having created gods in his image.
Genesis 6:6 should read: . . .Man should regrets that he has made gods on the earth, and his heart should be saddened. . .
Reply
 
 
 
 

 PaxRomana says:

 December 22, 2015 at 1:57 am
 

My witness family members always beam with joy when ‘new light’ changes previous doctrine. Not seeing the logical flaw in this, they embrace the new doctrine with unquestioning enthusiasm.
There is absolutely zero precedence for this in scripture, and the new light they refer to, in its full context, refers to not understanding prophesy in the time it was given. It does NOT refer to a changing doctrine.
To accept the new light theology of the witnesses, you would have to accept that God knowingly and willingly feeds false information to the organization. And for reasons unknown, allows his followers to preach false information to all corners of the globe. Only to later change that information, sometimes continually. it is an absurd way of looking at scripture.
Reply
 

 Winston Smith says:

 December 22, 2015 at 6:57 am
 

@PaxRomana
 My family has the same attitude toward “new light.” I believe it is because of the mental conditioning (nice way to say brainwashing) they have undergone in this organization.

I recall that I was always disturbed when so called “new light” was “revealed.” My thinking was “So they were wrong about something else? I thought we were supposed to have the truth.” I guess I was never fully indoctrinated enough to accept the constant change.
I recall when in the Daniel Book they finally admitted that they did not know whether there would arise another “King of the North” to replace the USSR in their ridiculous application of that prophecy and thinking they may finally be getting some sense about making unwarranted claims. Then a mere hand full of years later they flip flopped back again and said that they were looking for another “King of the North” to appear. At that point I decided I was not going no to try to keep up with constant changes. Seemed useless.
WS
Reply
 
 

 Alexandria R says:

 December 22, 2015 at 10:20 am
 

PoxRomana, Your point is right on and excellent. I want to add, even if God wasn’t knowingly and willingly feeding false information to the organization, his followers would still be preaching false information to all corners of the globe. Christ, the Apostle Paul and all the other Apostles didn’t do that. Their information was always correct.
Reply
 
 

 Pow says:

 December 22, 2015 at 10:23 am
 

“New Light” kinda like getting your 30th recall notice on your new car…oh, happy days….it just keeps getting better and better. What a lemon.
Reply
 
 
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 22, 2015 at 5:35 am
 

@ RetiredLE
 You have inspired me to compose my own song, probably better adapted to a “rap” tune. I hope it measures up. Here goes:

Jehovah’s Witnesses are supposed to have the truth
 Just like Superman changes in a ‘phone booth
 They go door-to-door, countin’ all the hours
 To wash off all those lies, would take an awful lot of showers
 They hug each other up in the kingdom hall
 To put on a splendid show for everyone and all
 Like they haven’t seen each other in 80,000 years
 When just the other nite they were havin’ beers
 They wear their fancy suits and their pretty Bling
 Make sure the pants are not too tight or Tony’ll give u a sting
 They preach good modesty then dress like prostitutes
 They could go to meetings naked – I don’t give a hoot
 They drive their BMWs, Lexus, & Mercedes
 Then tell everybody else, “You’re all goin’ to Hades”
They like to think they’re Amish, with a horse and plough
 They’re gonna get a wake-up call when Apocalypse is Now
 They make kiddie propaganda with Caleb and Sophia
 If a kid doesn’t buy it, then, “Sorry Jack, See Ya”
They’re not allowed to contact relatives gone “astray”
Unless u owe them money, then they’ll make bloody sure u pay
 They say “Don’t persecute me”, timid as a mouse
 But if u don’t believe as them, U get booted out ‘ the house
 When they said This Generation, everyone was clappin’
But things have changed a lot since then, ’cause now it’s Overlappin’
They told me now the End is near, so a Career u should hate
 In all the time that’s passed since then, I could’ve had freakin’ 8!
 They brainwash little children to be loyal to the “truth”
Yeah, how did that work out for all the Hitler Youth???
 People like to say Jehovah’s Witnesses are ‘nice’
Yeah, so was Adolf Hitler
 He liked puppies, kids, and opera
 But mostly he liked Hitler
 The GB think they’re wise, faithful and discreet
 They’re about as wise as my big ol’ smelly feet
 They don’t want you to stand when they’re playin’ ur ol’ anthem
‘Cause ur country’s good for nothin’, except enacting and preserving laws which protect the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society
 They like to say that Love is the bestest Way
 And they always will embrace u, unless u’re freakin’ Gay
 One of them went to ‘Nam, where Charlie won the day
 But when he flashed his “Watchtower” Charlie ran away
 I used to read it too, and study – what a caper!
 Now the only thing I use it for is freakin’ toilet paper
 They say they are no part of “Satan’s wicked world”
But u would see the Devil’s ugly face if their banner u unfurled
 They are always happy to be ur life-long friend
 As long as u conform
 Just like Nazis
 THE END

Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 22, 2015 at 6:54 am
 

P.S.
 The GB don’t know Jack, they don’t even know Jill
 All they want from u is to take their little Pill
 The GB say they’re guided by the Mighty Holy Spirit
 I say “So am I!” then make a Tin Foil hat and wear it! :)

Reply
 
 

 RetiredLE says:

 December 22, 2015 at 8:39 am
 

“One of them went to ‘Nam, where Charlie won the day
 But when he flashed his “Watchtower” Charlie ran away” –

PEACE OUT! /:{ X
Reply
 
 

 minion says:

 December 23, 2015 at 8:00 pm
 

@ A4,
Cool beat, – I feel the holy spirit & rolling on the floor.
Here’s my Spin, to: Watchtower Corporation ‘who makes no mistakes’.
Chorus; 1.) LA LA LA LA LA – I don’t hear you,
2.). Blah blah blah – blah (whole note) – I don’t see you,
3.) LA blah LA blah LA (whole note 2) – I don’t read you,
4.). LA LA LA LA – I don’t give a rats __ (Lloyd said keep it real and clean) – see you in hell WT.
Peace out, and merry Christmas to all!
Reply
 
 
 

 Hakizimana Jean de Dieu says:

 December 22, 2015 at 12:56 pm
 

The GB will always have a room to brainwash their followers. The Yearbook 2012 is mainly about Rwanda! Here they are talking of a woman who had refused to study their Bible and finally… she was won after the atrocities she had witnessed…
*** yb12 pp. 220-221 Rwanda ***
“All these events had a profound influence on my wife, who had, for the preceding ten years, refused to study the Bible with Jehovah’s Witnesses. Now, though, she started to study the Bible. When people asked her why, she replied: ‘I was moved by the love that the brothers showed us and the sacrifices they made to save us. I also sensed the powerful hand of Jehovah, who saved us from the machetes of the killers.’ She dedicated her life to Jehovah and was baptized at the first assembly after the war.

Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 22, 2015 at 1:08 pm
 

You can see the self-centered, EGOcentric attitude right there. It’s like they’re saying all those people were massacred just so SHE could get the “truth”. Pitiful.
Reply
 

 dee says:

 December 22, 2015 at 5:00 pm
 

“I also sensed the powerful hand of Jehovah, who saved us from the machetes of the killers.”
Oh wow, one wonders why Jehovah didn’t also save the other persons who died from the machetes of the killers just like he did this lady.
This also reminds me of the publications of the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society which have given examples of Jehovah’s direction in which angels have helped those searching for a new religion, to come in contact with Jehovah’s Witnesses (eg. Watchtower May 15, 2009 ‘The Angels – “Spirits for Public Service”).
What has allowed Jehovah’s spiritual forces to help people find the JW religion, but has not allowed those same spiritual forces to prevent atrocities such as, for example, teenage girls being gang raped during the same modern time period?

Reply
 
 
 
 

 Kat says:

 December 22, 2015 at 2:15 pm
 

On the other hand the WT proudly proclaims that many JW were tortured raped and murdered for you faithfulness.
So here we have on bible study that was saved while others were murdered raped and tortured.
Reply
 
 

 minion says:

 December 22, 2015 at 10:05 pm
 

So Watchtower Corporation doesn’t make mistakes, due to holy spirit is directing the organization, right? We all agree?
And we all agree – ‘WT upholds they are right in all aspects in handling child abuse’ and will Not pay damages etc, or pay any redress. WTs response.’
Jwsurvey has been reporting all along, WT new Hdqtrs site is built over a contaminated area.
WT is suing the previous land owners for millions.
Imagine all the hired contractors and your local volunteers, that worked on this contaminated site. Soon they will not be feeling well and develop lumps and lose there hair and such.
Time to get a ‘Strong Arm Attorney’.
This may well be a 2″ metal tread screw into WTs coffin.
article; Battle over contamination at Watchtower site in Warwick
The former International Nickle Inc., property was purchased by the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society, with plans to build its world headquarters there. TIMES HERALD-RECORD FILE PHOTO
 By Hema Easley
 Times Herald-Record
 Posted Dec 14, 2015 at 8:20 PM
 Updated Dec 15, 2015 at 12:41 AM

WARWICK – A slew of companies sued by Watchtower Bible and Tract Society say they don’t bear responsibility for contaminating the Warwick site where the religious group is building its massive world headquarters, and will therefore not pay for it.
Remember, WT Corporation does not make mistakes, right? Because of holy spirit, directed by god.
Peace out,
Reply
 

 Bad Penny says:

 December 24, 2015 at 7:20 pm
 

So, who is really directing this organisation? When we consider the facts –
Warwick – Contaminated site.
 Chelmsford, England – Contaminated site.
 Watchtower Society – Contaminated with child abuse and lies!
 Jesus advice – “Touch nothing unclean”.

Reply
 

 minion says:

 December 25, 2015 at 10:35 am
 

@ BP, – WT makes no mistakes, really?
Good morning to you and all, far and near.
Let’s established some facts about the 7 men and Watchtower Corporation directors;
1). They have limited education, G.Jackson only attained 8th grade. They have no college education, or trade school of business management.
2). They never learn or understood the expression ‘street smarts’ or ‘school of hard knocks’.
3). A man once said, “You have fooled me, O god, so that I was fooled. You used your strength against me, so that you prevailed. I became an object of laughter all day long”.
4). WTs men have been expose to ‘who they really are’ and now we see the after effects.
5). The 7 men and directors are dumb asses, headless and shameless bast@#ds.
6). So – who really is the sheep class in Brooklyn, Walkhill & Patterson?
7). Looks to me, – the 7 men and directors are the sheep and are getting fleeced by the Attorneys and the Illuminati.
Numeralogy, I will stop at #7, 7 means perfection – and complete, who knows?
Watchtower Corporation is in a game called ‘play with fire – religion. You best have a big ass fire extinguisher and have checked yearly by the fire marshal.
WT last visit from a fire marshal over 150 years ago.
No spirit direction from “any god” in Brooklyn.
WT Corporation is on its on, the ship is headed in to a hurricane, the ship is half empty and not a good place to be – for surviving the storm.
It’s the truth or its not.
JWSurvey = “You will know the Truth, and the truth will set you Free, from enslavement to Watchtower Corporation”, by way of JWSurvey – John 8:32
Peace out,
Reply
 
 
 
 

 Wanderer says:

 December 22, 2015 at 10:47 pm
 

I heard from the platform quite a lot as a child that God created all of the heavens and earth, and with such precision that if we were much closer to the sun we would roast, much further away we would freeze. So much precision that we can set our watches and calendars to the earths rotation of the sun. Our solar system is just a tiny grain of sand in relation to the size of what we know of the galaxies we now know of. Then we have the wonder of our earth, animals, the exact mix of oxygen, Gravity, rain, food, the wonderful human body etc. etc.
Why would this fantastic creator, this awesomely powerful all knowing God, after proving himself to be perfection in every way choose the JW’s to be his only people on earth, then send mis information after mis information that has to be “fixed” with new light over and over again? Why has their understanding and interpretation of the bible changed so much over the years? Why does God have a terrible policy for the protection of his children? Why would he with his spirit direction get them to say Armageddon was due in 1914? Then in the 1920’s millions now living will never die? Or later on the generation alive to see the difference before 1914 to after 1914 would be without doubt the last generation before Armageddon?
These are genuine questions, if a practicing JW could answer them for me I would be interested to hear their thoughts.
Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 22, 2015 at 10:57 pm
 

I have an answer — people have historically created their gods in their own image. And that’s why Yahweh is lost, confused, and clueless. :)
Reply
 
 

 Let die says:

 December 23, 2015 at 2:04 am
 

Because when you speak for God you can not afford to be wrong and so the indoctrination, tyranny, theocracy and control begin.
Reply
 

 Hakizimana Jean de Dieu says:

 December 23, 2015 at 2:33 am
 

And theocracy to be tyrannical will go hand in hand with “theocratic war”!!
(Isaiah 13:12-16) . . .I will make mortal man scarcer than refined gold, And humans scarcer than the gold of OΚΉphir. 13 That is why I will make the heavens tremble, And the earth will be shaken out of its place At the fury of Jehovah of armies in the day of his burning anger. 14 Like a hunted gazelle and like a flock with no one to gather them, Each will return to his own people; Each will flee to his own land. 15 Whoever is found will be pierced through, And whoever is caught will fall by the sword. 16 Their children will be dashed to pieces before their eyes, Their houses will be looted, And their wives will be raped.
I fear Jehovah’s witnesses than the god they have created in their image….
How can this be holy? “Their children will be dashed to pieces before their eyes, Their houses will be looted, And their wives will be raped.”
Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 23, 2015 at 6:14 am
 

Yahweh is a delight, isn’t he? lol
Reply
 
 

 dee says:

 December 24, 2015 at 8:50 am
 

@Hakizimana
One wonders: what was the point of all the killing which the Israelites did? They exterminated the non-Israelites from the land yet in the end the nation of Israel was rejected by god – it seems all of those non-Israelites lossed their lives for nothing.
Reply
 
 
 
 

 Winston Smith says:

 December 23, 2015 at 9:16 am
 

Excellent points Wanderer.
 It reminds of a bit of a situation I encountered during my awakening (hopefully not too far off topic):

My wife had had made friends with what I consider a JW zealot from another congregation. This zealot related an “experience” from her hall about a pioneer couple that inherited a business from the husband’s “worldly” father. They couldn’t run the business and keep up their pioneering, so they put it up for sale and it sold inside of a week. The zealot’s conclusion? “You can see Jehovah’s hand in answering their prayers!”
About a month prior my cousin (she and her husband both active JWs) lost her 5 year old son due to a heart disorder. Upon hearing sister Zealot’s story, I thought “So that’s why God could not answer my cousin’s prayers that her son would live: he was too busy taking care of a business transaction?” Other thoughts included that perhaps the JW God only could control business and real estate issues, saving children from death was beyond him? Or perhaps his priorities are just really off?
The JW perspective of what God is or is not responsible for is just so twisted as can be seen in the comments of that zealot. Might explain how they can accept all the times he has allowed his “spirit-directed” organization to go down the completely wrong path.
WS
Reply
 
 
 

 Ruthlee says:

 December 23, 2015 at 5:47 am
 

Great postings folks over the past few days, The song lyrics great loved them I do think humour helps. It certainly opens up the eyes. Last nights meeting was the Christmas begging one, sadly I could not attend as my headache returned as it does at alarming regularity these days. Apparently there was a letter (can anyone confirm) assuring the jellybrains that all their donations go towards kingdumb interests isn’t that a lie! Why say it unless there is vicious rumours abounding. My aspie son does not miss a trick I asked him how many times Jesus was mentioned Guess what folks NOT ONCE! isn’t that amazing after all no one would want to be accused of being part of the pagan season. I wonder if they will wangle it to make The Lord a pagan. That would be a great twist on their daft spinning interpretations.I think we could have a whole Friday column dedicated to the strangest teachings/new light inventions forjdubs.We could predict their future and see which ones they adopt. I have another Friday column idea All the nasty and wacky things the circus overseer said , did, got away with. My name for the CO and COW is spongy as in what they do and what they are. that’s it for now, cheers all, your friendly sarcastic unholy dub ruthless ruthlee
Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 23, 2015 at 6:27 am
 

“kingdumb interests”, “circus overseer” — I love this Site! How ’bout “districk overseer”? πŸ˜‰
P.S. Yeah, those nasty headaches can be a b**ch! πŸ˜‰

Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 23, 2015 at 6:33 am
 

U may as well get a “headache” before the meeting, ’cause if u go, u may very well get 1 after. lol Consider it a “pre-emptive headache”. πŸ˜‰
Reply
 
 
 

 Searcher says:

 December 23, 2015 at 6:48 am
 

That headache is a blessing in disguise if it happens before the meetings. Lord knows I would have a headache afterward thinking, “Now that’s 2 hours of my life wasted that I will never get back.” Not to mention brain cells.
Pagan or not, I’m ENJOYING the season this year for once. The scripture says ‘in spirit and in truth’. I think JW’s forget about the ‘spirit’ part and want only the ‘truth’ as they see it or dished out to them.
Reply
 

 Tara says:

 December 23, 2015 at 8:29 am
 

few interesting conversations this week with non witnesses.
 Spoke to a very high ranking ex police officer about the whole thing. His professional advice was to tell them to ‘Piss off’.

A friend who knows a number of witnesses from work said two of them backed out of the Christmas party stuff. One refused the bonus but one almost snatched it out of his hand. He told the one who refused ‘well you may as well take it because such and such is an elder and he had no problem.’
Such and such has also been the topic of conversation at work as his car contains many little dolls and soft toys…. he has no children… hmm.
Other stories of jw’s buying all the Christmas food and trimmings and then calling it a turkey dinner for friends and family. hmm.
Reply
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 23, 2015 at 9:48 am
 

Had similar experiences when I was “in”. Family getting together for Not-Thanksgiving Dinner or Not-Christmas Dinner. lol
Reply
 
 

 Openmind says:

 December 23, 2015 at 9:58 am
 

Hi Tara, I used to know an elder who had loads of ‘worldly’ contacts due to his ‘secular work’ (familiar words? Ugh!) He used to accept bottles of whisky “because of what I’ve done for them all year”, Christmas cake “it’s only fruit cake” and turkeys “we won’t eat any on Christmas day”. Words fail me!
Reply
 

 M Saurus says:

 December 23, 2015 at 10:15 am
 

I accepted my “Christmas” bonus every year even when I was “devout”. I worked as hard or harder than my “worldly” colleagues and deserved monetary compensation for it just like they did. I had absolutely no problem with it.

 
 

 Tara says:

 December 23, 2015 at 2:20 pm
 

I accept my tips and bottles of wine also. It is showing gratitude if nothing else. However one person I used to work with would refuse it and glared at me for doing so. What I was getting at is the fact non witnesses notice and make comments on it.

 
 
 
 
 

 M Saurus says:

 December 23, 2015 at 9:41 am
 

Ruthlee – Please don’t take this the wrong way – but WHY are you still associated? You make such insightful (insulting?) comments about the org – I had no idea until this post that you still attend meetings and put on the show? If you think they are so silly, stupid, brainwashed, horrible (and they are!) how can you still be one of them? Why would you want to keep up the masquerade? Is it to be able to keep associating with someone, friend or family? Is the charade worth it?
Reply
 

 Pow says:

 December 23, 2015 at 10:55 am
 

I don’t want to put words in Ruthlee’s mouth, but. Alot of us are in this same boat..why do people live in N.Korea?,or work in a coal mine?, obliviously we would rather not however, losing your entire family, friends and perhaps livelihood is a strong incentive to keep putting on a brave face and enduring to the bitter end….it’s also why these discussions hold a glimmer of hope, because if the issues get widely known then change might be inevitable. ..my hope is that the organization will someday be forced to stop disfellowshipping /punishing individuals for simple questioning them. Then a honest discussion can ensue. Change would be inevitable.
Reply
 

 M Saurus says:

 December 23, 2015 at 11:06 am
 

I can’t say what’s right for anyone but myself. But if your family members or friends will disown you for any reason – they are not true family members or friends and are not worth keeping. In her post above, Ruthlee slams the org – calling them all kinds of insulting, sarcastic names, etc all the while pretending to be one. I personally could not do that, I find it hypocritical no matter what the reason.
Reply
 

 Pow says:

 December 23, 2015 at 11:42 am
 

Your point is reasonably and logically it’s hard to argue against. But when you are emotionally attached to someone/something it does change the equation
 Why do people stay with abusive mates, or ones with drug dependencys , dead-end jobs, crime ridden town? We are all slaves to our environments to some degree, most have deep sense of family and community, which in this case is not espousing war and nationalism but adherence to abertiary laws and a human corporation masquerading as the spokesman for god. The one good thing about this discussion though, is once you start to realize the true situation, you never stop planning your escape, you are now keeping an eye out for the exit doors.


 
 

 Robert67 says:

 December 24, 2015 at 10:39 am
 

Valid points, but you completely left out the most important factor which is the mind control/ brainwashing that holds these friends and family captives.
We are free while those we love, who are wonderful human beings for the most part are still victims of these Bible distorting lies.
I don’t have kids, but even I can’t fathom a parent purposely pulling themselves out of their children’s lives. There are many ways to fight the good fight against this cult without hitting eject. Even Paul said he pretended to be something he wasn’t for the sake of saving others.
Activism and spreading the truth about this organization as far and wide is the key to freeing these captive minds. We have to make all of these truths common knowledge in the world. Jump on social media ask friends and neighbors to place signs on their doors asking JW’s to visit http://www.jwfacts.com before knocking. Next time they knock at your door confront them with the truth about their lies. If you know where they live knock on their doors and preach the real truth to them.

 
 
 

 minion says:

 December 23, 2015 at 8:23 pm
 

@ POW,
It’s true we all have valid and justifiable reasons – why some still attend the KH worship service.
N.Korea, was uncool – this society of life does not have a choice in the matter, its you do or else. Damn ,- sounds like WT.
Some things in life – at times are complicated.
Take for example, – explain the process of a Lunar Eclipse, why does the moon and sun during eclipse – are the same size – if one is farther than the other? and earth in the middle of the two?
It’s complicated.
@ Ruthlee, you go girl – keep it real.
 And keep us posted with ‘new light’ , Ruthlee the under cover agent.

Peace out,
Reply
 
 
 
 
 

 M Saurus says:

 December 23, 2015 at 11:54 am
 

Pow – I get it. Making the initial “get-away” is the hardest part. For myself, even though I had been emotionally entrenched in it from age 8 to age 50, I realized that I’m not getting any younger. I knew that if I was going to enjoy what little bit of life I had left, I needed to make my escape. It is a shame that some people have a false sense of loyalty to friends and family members and don’t have the emotional fortitude to be true to themselves.
Reply
 

 Ruthlee says:

 December 23, 2015 at 12:50 pm
 

hi I’m still in it for several reasons. If you want to know. My kids are of age to be baptised and i’m doing my best to discourage this it’s my number one priority. I have absolutely no one, no family, no work colleagues (I don’t have a job) and have limited health. (not a jw excuse I might add) and my husband has a huge huge all jw family. So I have to choose my exit at the right time.Believe me if it was just me I would have gone in the summer.Its like stepping in doggy do every time I go to kh but I do the bare minimum because of my kids. As I have said before if I wrote the book of my life you would understand the whole picture. This forum is my life line because we hopefully understand each other and don’t judge. I hope that explains a little. If I left I would actually not have a penny to my name and unlike JC I don’t have the faith to think there is a fox den waiting for me. I really would be out on the street so for base level survival means this charade is a means to an end . That is the brutal truth no job ,no collateral, no security. The bald facts of surrendering my whole life to a cult and the narcissists who “protect” me. M saurus you are quite unkind to me and you have no right. Ive given you a few reasons why I stay it is not out of loyalty to the org but I am loyal to my family commitments and try to be true hopefully all. In good time I will be able to break free. But I don’t need you to remind me of my hypocrisy I need friends who understand this plight I and others are in. If I had some security and a plan I would take the kids and go tomorrow but I don’t. You know wit and the humor on this site have been my therapy. So don’t judge me till you know all the story and if you can’t be nice at Christmas then bog off! ruthlee
Reply
 

 M Saurus says:

 December 23, 2015 at 2:01 pm
 

Ruthlee I was not unkind to you. I asked a question and you answered it. I appreciate your honesty and don’t know what I would do if in your situation. My comments were all prefaced by my saying that I can only speak for myself and what I would do. What I consider hypocritical for myself may not apply to you. I am not judging you. Hopefully you will find a way out soon.
Reply
 
 

 Tara says:

 December 23, 2015 at 2:29 pm
 

I feel exactly the same Ruthlee. My oldest granddaughter is trapped within a family of strong JW’s. My son is df’d and fighting for custody to get her away from it all. If I walked away they would make sure I had no contact. Right now I believe the only reason we have some leeway is because I am a jw…. I say that very loosely because one of my gd’s family members on her mothers side is an elder in my hall and I am under scrutiny. I believe they are watching my every move and like you, this site is my lifeline.
Reply
 
 

 minion says:

 December 23, 2015 at 9:14 pm
 

@ Ruthlee,
My perspective and outlook on employment,
1). Construction – remodel companys always need phone reps to sell there products, – remodeling is greater volume then new homes sells. You can work from home and set your own hours. Be sure to sign an independent contract, most pay based on project $.
2). Your local cable company always need phone sales rep and offer there net service, phone – bundle packages etc.
3). Your local storage units always needs moonlighters – part time help.
4). Surveyors are in great demand. If your willing to learn a skill and trade – your in. Real estate and construction is booming and will be for a long time. New bridges, resurfaced streets, new skyscrapers buildings, are at an all time high.
5). Check your local apartments and see how much they pay for new tenants – referral fee can be up to $400.
6). Check your local new home builder and see how much they pay for new home buyers – referral fee can be up to $1,000.
Peace out, and merry Christmas to all!
Reply
 

 Ruthlee says:

 December 24, 2015 at 6:04 am
 

thank you dear friend
Reply
 
 
 

 Average Joe says:

 December 24, 2015 at 10:43 am
 

@RUTHLEE
 I always appreciate your comments and I for one can sympathise with you. You are totally within your rights to discourage your children from rushing in to getting baptised.
 I use the reasoning (when someone starts pressuring the youths in our Cong that they should be thinking of getting baptised) that they are in being like the Catholics who believe if you die and are not baptised then you will go to Hell or Purgatory. Whilst we don’t believe in that, the attitude is the same. Jehovah can read hearts and knows if a person is serving him for the right reasons. Even Proverbs says better it is that you vow not than you vow and don’t pay. If we truly believe that we will live forever on a paradise earth then what’s the rush to get baptised? Jesus didn’t get baptised until he was 30 (an adult in Jewish culture) and if he was here on earth today, TM3 would have already judged him as spiritually weak when he hit 23 for not being baptised!
 This weeks SM had another part about donating money; it’s becoming just like the churches. I enjoy the meetings for the most part as the items are usually quite lively and I have some good friends & acquaintances there so you should do the same if that’s what you feel comfortable doing. In the talks that you don’t agree with, catch up on some other reading or take a stroll to the back and chat with the others standing there: there’s always someone to talk to at the back of the hall!
 Hugs Ruthlee.
 AJ

Reply
 

 minion says:

 December 24, 2015 at 4:29 pm
 

@ AJ,
I laughed when I read the part about TM3 labeling the man Jesus Christ – spiritually weak. The 7 men are headless and shameless bast@#ds.
Get this, if the man Jesus was alive today – WT would have done the following:
1st offense – Jesus publicly reproved.
2nd offense – Jesus marked.
3rd offense – Jesus disfellowship.
4th offense – Jesus shun for eternity.
The 7 men, want-to-gods.
Peace out,
Reply
 
 
 
 

 Wanderer says:

 December 23, 2015 at 1:11 pm
 

That’s great for you, what works for one person doesn’t necessarily work for another, every situation is different. Let’s not become one size fits all like the JWs, we should be supportive of each other, especially at Christmas.
Merry Christmas everyone and I hope everyone has a happy new year, and for any JWs reading have a great festivus for the rest of us!
P.S. I saw Fallon do a version of Bing Crosbys I’m dreaming of a white Christmas, but he changed it to I’m dreaming of a tight Christmas, he was wearing his tight pants πŸ˜‰ very funny, I wondered if TM lll would ever get to see it.
Reply
 

 Wanderer says:

 December 23, 2015 at 1:19 pm
 

@Ruthlee I meant for my post to be a reply under M Saurus’ post.
Reply
 
 
 
 

 Ruthlee says:

 December 23, 2015 at 2:41 pm
 

Thanks m saurus I have read your reply and like you have less time ahead. so decisions impact much more now . When we were young we might have had the courage to jump ship on impulse but now all I have is old age to embrace I have to think twice about any decision I make as there is not the time to make up the financial shortfall etc. Sometimes on the bleak days I wished I hadn’t woken up because it does not do you any favours to self sabotage. But then I read something on this site and it makes me laugh and I get a reality check because ALL of us are in recovery. This jw addiction leaves such deep scars that I sometimes think there is no full recovery. So no I’m not true to myself for staying and a while back someone said that I’m living in two worlds and they will collide one day, never a truer word of warning given I feel that day looming nearer and when I am true to the truth you will know it. for sure cheers ruthlee
Reply
 

 Caroline says:

 December 25, 2015 at 4:58 am
 

@Ruthlee, I sympathize so much with your situation. I too am old (69) and I haven’t gone to meetings now for about a year and half and my husband is in the “truth” and now he’s got stage 4 cancer and it’s not curable and he’s been in the hospital a lot in the last few months.
About 2 weeks ago he almost died and was in intensive care for a week because of a bleed and now he’s in the nursing home until he is strong enough to come home.
There have been a lot of friends and relatives coming to see him in the hospital and nursing home during this time and I am with him to keep him company and for support during this difficult time for him most of the time during the day.
So, when these people from the Kingdom Hall and our two children who are still entrenched heavily come to see him and give him support, they have to sit there with me and it is so terribly uncomfortable for all of us.
They want to show support for my husband but they all wonder why I don’t go to meetings anymore. Some of them take me aside and cry over the whole situation, when they start talking to me and I have to tell them that I can’t tell them why I am not going to meetings anymore because if I do tell them, then I’d be disfellowshipped for apostasy.
That is the position that I am in at this time. If I had disassociated myself, I would still be there to support my husband but those people probably wouldn’t even come to see my husband because of me being disfellowshipped by them and they wouldn’t want to see me there.
No religion should do that to a person simply because they no longer “believe” in it anymore.
Reply
 

 Winston Smith says:

 December 25, 2015 at 7:21 am
 

@Caroline,
 It is a sick and twisted system that serves to dehunanize anyone who disagrees with it. You are wise not to share your thoughts on it with visitors from the KH, especially if you have children still in it.

My heart goes out to you in regard to your husband’s illness. Try to maintain your strength. Try to get enough rest if you can. I hope for the best possible outcome for you under these trying circumstances.
WS
Reply
 
 

 minion says:

 December 25, 2015 at 1:22 pm
 

@ Caroline,
You hang in there, and pray for strength during the struggle of the state of your husband – stage 4 cancer.
The ‘little silver sword’ reads, ‘that You love one another, (then follows up with) by this all will know that You are my disciples’.
These are action words, the friends at your KH should all be at your bed side, caring for your every need. That’s the true meaning of the word love.
Love does not attack with ‘why are you not at the meetings’, the setting does Not call for this type of action, or lack thereof.
The man name Jesus, did an extraordinary feat in bringing back to life his friend name Lazarus. Jesus is mentioned he broke out in tears. Can you imagine Jesus ask, Martha – why has Lazarus not present at Sunday worship?
And if they do mess up (kh friends) and ask you silly questions, you can always reply –
1) its not your concern.
 2) this is not the proper setting and your way out of line.
 3) I don’t answer to you or anyone else.
 4) see 1.
 5) see 2.
 6) my favorite – see 3.
 7) see 3.

Hang in there, be strong and you believe what you believe, and that’s a good thing.
My concerns and prayers goes out to you. I hope you have your responsibilities All in order. . . .
Stay strong and Peace out,
Reply
 
 
 
 

 Alexandria R says:

 December 23, 2015 at 7:22 pm
 

Ruthlee and Tara, Don’t allow anybody’s personal opinions, beliefs or advice to cause you to do anything you don’t feel comfortable with doing. While in the JW religion we have spent to much time being robots mindlessly obeying what we’re told to think and believe. When the right time arrives you’ll be able to walk away and not mind or care about being shunned. Like in Tara’s situation, she isnt being selfish, self centered or only thinking of herself by not walking away that she will help family wake up. That’s unselfish. No need to criticize personal decision.
Reply
 
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 23, 2015 at 9:23 pm
 

@ Tara
Re: ‘”worldly” folks noticing and commenting’ on how some JWs accept Xmas bonuses, tips, booze, etc., and others don’t — Hopefully this causes some of these folks to open their eyes and see what a discordant organization the Watchtower truly is. The only thing really holding them together is FEAR.
Reply
 
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 23, 2015 at 9:29 pm
 

@ M Saurus
You said, ‘some people…don’t have the emotional fortitude to be true to themselves.’
Then later you said that you were only speaking for yourself, and not judging anyone.
 However, when I use the phrase ‘some people’, I’m not usually talking about myself. Can you clarify?

Reply
 

 Winston Smith says:

 December 23, 2015 at 9:43 pm
 

Just adding my two cents to this chain:
We have all been damaged by this cult and are at different stages of recovery. And everyone deals and copes differently. Plus we all have different family circumstances that we must manage as best as possible and how we see fit.
Some have been able to physically leave either through disassociation or just fading. Others have left the mentally/intellectually, but circumstances prevent leaving physically.
Therefore let no one pass judgement or even suggest that we may have the answers for someone else. Certainly, we can offer helpful suggestions. But if we begin to think we are in a position to tell someone else how to deal with this, we are no better than the deluded JW org we are trying to escape from.
WS
Reply
 
 
 

 Alexandria R says:

 December 23, 2015 at 9:36 pm
 

I just watched Cedar’s latest video about 607bce. The org most likely knows the truth about that date. It’s another mistake they wont admit they have made, accidently – on purpose. :)
Reply
 

 Robert67 says:

 December 24, 2015 at 10:04 am
 

The Watchtower knows about the falseness of the 607 date, it cleaned house of all Watchtower family members in the early 80’s who weren’t willing to deny the truth for the sake of the companies “truth”. Life long and very faithful witnesses were kicked out into the cold and a war was declared against any in the company across the globe that would question the falseness of 607.
You are not allowed to speak on this or any other Bible subject, even amongst life long witnesses, unless your directly quoting their magazine articles and their fabricated dates and altered Bible passages. You are programmed from the beginning to identify anyone questioning these dates as an “apostate” a term reserved in scripture specifically for those that deny the Christ.
They have been summoned before the courts on numerous occasions and called out on their lies and have commonly retorted with a “it is what WE believe is the truth( never mind unquestionable facts) and the law allows us to worship freely.”
Most Jehovahs Witnesses have never learned the truth about their “truth” because they are terrorized, threatened and held hostage by a guaranteed marking, dissfelowshipping and Watchtower Bible and Tract society enforced seperation from family still in their “truth”, unless they want to face the same Watchtower Jihadi consequences.
Christ said you would learn the truth and the truth would set you free. He also said “I have showed them the truth, your word(Gods-Bible) is the truth.”
Many of us here have suffered the consequences of not listening to Christ instructions and allowing our ears to be tickled by these failed prophets. The consequences of listening to a publishing company that has built a multi billion dollar empire by going beyond what is written and self deputizing themselves to alter add, delete scripture as they see fit for their agenda Shame on us, but NO MORE.

The truth has set us free.
Reply
 

 minion says:

 December 24, 2015 at 4:57 pm
 

@ R67,
Wow, thunder and lightening – will set you Free.
 Good outline, bro.

JWSurvey is and stands for Truth. No Spin zone here, an issue Watchtower Corporation can’t replicate. It’s the Truth or its not!
For those active JWs – read the scripture of which R67 was paraphrasing – John 8:32, – allow me to read it;
“and You will know the Truth, (by way of JWSurvey) and the Truth will set you Free, from enslavement to Watchtower Corporation.”
You see, its time to exit the merry-go-round.
Peace out,
Reply
 
 

 Winston Smith says:

 December 25, 2015 at 7:36 am
 

@Robert67
 Great points! Interesting how they had the need to clean house of anyone that had shown even an inkling about the falseness of the 607 date. What paranoia. Almost on the level of the McCarthy communist scare in the US in the 1950’s.

Having seen about 2/3 of Lloyd’s video (JW wife walked in and I had to shut it down) and having in the past read “The Gentile Times Reconsidered” I think it is all just a numbers game: you can manipulate the dates to be almost whatever you want them to be.
In my opinion, the most important takeaway is that there is no evidence for a secondary fullfilmemt of the tree dream of Daniel 4. It is complete with its own prophetical fulfillment already stated in the scripture as to what happened to Nebuchadnezzar.
WS
Reply
 

 minion says:

 December 25, 2015 at 11:35 am
 

@ WS
Get ready to hear about ‘flat earth’, that’s right you read correct.
 Lloyd mentions the Hugh ass tree that could be seen from all continents, this could only be seen on a flat earth and not a globe.

America’s President – Obama, once said, “we don’t have time for flat earthers”, .
Then why bring it up, if its not true. Or, you hide it in plain sight.
Flat earth,
 please explain – on any giving day (am) around 10:30 am locate the moon, then locate the sun. It appears the moon uses gods chariot, but during the day – the sun will move to the west, however, the moon (once located) seems to stall and hang around 10:30 am to 12:00 noon, then starts to move to the west.

Something to think about, what if we have more than 1 moon.? ?
This can only be seen if we live on a flat earth and not a globe. The sun and moon together during the day. . . .
Enjoy the movie,
JWSurvey = ” and You will know the Truth, (by way of JWSurvey) and the truth will set You Free, from Watchtower Corporation enslavement.” John 8:32.
Peace out,
Reply
 
 
 
 
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 23, 2015 at 9:50 pm
 

To say it’s hypocritical for someone to still go to meetings, etc., while no longer a JW in their heart, is like saying an FBI Narc is a hypocrite for pretending to be drug dealer.
‘Emotional fortitude’ is great, but it takes a HELL of a lot more than that to survive in this world. Life on Planet Earth is a Survival Situation from Day 1. We have it pretty good. But we are in the minority. Anyone who doesn’t understand these concepts is living in Fantasy Land, and is almost as deluded as the JWs. Life in the Borg really is like North Korea. You are controlled, and if you leave, there ARE repercussions, SERIOUS repercussions. No point pretending it’s not what it is. Sometimes those repercussions can be ECONOMIC. Once again, SURVIVAL. Let’s not make the mistake of living in a Dream World like the JWs do. The problem with dreams is, they END. In the REAL world, people do what is necessary to survive. And no one can fault them for that, because we would ALL do the SAME thing in their situation. I never pay attention to Monday Morning Quarterbacks and Armchair Generals.
 I see a difference in attitude between males and females. I see the Maternal Instinct in the females, which is an extension of the basic Survival Instinct, in their thinking of their children and grandchildren. My advice to M Saurus (I’m assuming you’re male) is: Don’t get between a Grizzly and her Cubs!!! :)

Reply
 

 Average Joe says:

 December 24, 2015 at 10:52 am
 

@ANONYMOUS4
 I have a suspicion that M Saurus is none other than that individual with rotating IPs who Lloyd keeps kicking off for his flaming comments. I think Markie could be the same person too. Unfortunately there are some on here with nothing better to do with their time than provoke arguments. Perhaps they are one of the idiots employed at Bethel to scour “apostate” sites for Intel and put a spanner in the works!

Reply
 

 Winston Smith says:

 December 25, 2015 at 7:43 am
 

@AJ
 Interesting possibility. I tend to give everyone the benefit of the doubt and assume they are honestly giving an opinion or suggestion. But you could be right. There may be a few pro-JW trolls out there seeking to undermine the intent of this site – and probably counting their time while doing so!

WS
Reply
 
 
 
 

 anonymous4 says:

 December 23, 2015 at 10:01 pm
 

My advice to ALL is: Beware of Gaslighters.
Reply
 
 

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← Royal Commission findings: Jehovah’s Witness elders left abuse survivors “silenced and unsupported”
 
The Friday Column: Everyone makes mistakes – except Watchtower
Posted on December 18, 2015

The mistakes of bible characters are owned up to in the scriptures
The mistakes of bible characters like Peter are owned up to in the scriptures

Everyone makes mistakes. The Bible characters certainly did. Think of the Apostle Peter, denying Jesus three times on the night of his arrest, his faith and courage failing him at the critical moment, leaving him a weeping, emotionally shattered wreck. (John 18:13-27)

Think of King David, sleeping with Bathsheba then panicking over the resulting pregnancy, so desperate to avoid scandal that he ultimately orchestrates events to get Bathsheba’s husband killed. (2 Samuel chapter 11)
Or think of Jonah, getting a commission from God to condemn the Ninevites, but instead running away in terror from that commission as fast as he can. (Jonah 1:3) After God readjusts Jonah’s thinking via the rather humiliating use of a whale’s digestive tract, Jonah finally gets his act together and goes forth to condemn the Ninavites. (Jonah 1:17-2:2)
Except the Ninivites promptly repent and God forgives them, so Jonah throws a hissy fit about how he will now look like a fool when all that fire and judgement he prophesied doesn’t show up on time. (Jonah 3:10) God rolls his eyes and has to school him again about not being a sulky little child, especially where people’s lives are concerned. (Jonah 4: 9-11)
Faithful men of old made some horrific mistakes, and Watchtower makes mistakes too. Think of prophecy.
“1914 will be the end of the world! Oh, that didn’t happen. Hmmm. We meant to say 1925, and Moses will be resurrected then as well! Huh, the world didn’t end and Moses is a no-show (but we can still use that lovely house we built for him). Wait right, 1975 will be the year it all ends! Oh…. well it’ll certainly come before the end of the 20th century!…huh…erm…before the generation that saw 1914 passes away? OH COME ON!”
Or think of medical advice.
For example, from 1921 to 1952, the Watchtower campaigned against vaccination, presenting it as unsuitable for Christians and nothing more than a malicious con on the part of the medical establishment.
During an era when mankind was poised to make great strides in eliminating diseases such as smallpox, Watchtower recklessly stood in the way, endangering not only the lives of its followers but of all those who came into contact with them. Only in the 1950’s did they start to reverse this position, apparently due to legal concerns more than anything else. It’s hard to argue that lives were not lost or ruined as a result.
What about organ transplants? From 1967 to 1980, the Watchtower considered transplants to be cannibalism, thus putting this life-saving and life-changing treatment out of the reach of its followers. This position was reversed after 13 years, but again it’s hard to argue that witnesses would not have suffered and even died as a result of this mistake
And how could we not mention child abuse? In Austraila alone, it was recently disclosed that over 1,006 alleged child abusers were known to Watchtower since the 1950’s as operating in their congregations. None of them were reported to the authorities.
None.
As a result of this inaction, Watchtower’s own internal records show that a significant number of these molesters continued to offend and re-offend with apparent impunity, and with no recourse available to the abuse survivors.
Of all their errors of judgement, this seems to be one of the gravest Watchtower has ever made.
So, just like the faithful men of old, Watchtower has made some terrible mistakes. There is, however, one significant difference between the faithful men of God in the bible, and Watchtower today.
In the bible, God’s people admitted their mistakes.
Peter, for example, is never recorded as having contested the accounts of his failure on the night of Jesus’ arrest. Rather, the bible narrative makes clear that he fully admitted his failures and did his best to atone for them.
Additionally, all in the congregations of the first century would be aware of Peter’s history. There was no whitewashing, no denial. Peter owned his mistake and learned from it, later being recorded as a courageous man who successfully stood firm in situations similar to the one in which he succumbed.
Likewise David, upon being confronted with the gravity of his sins, tore his garments apart and went into mourning.
If one assumes the bible as being the word of God and accepts the biblical narrative of who wrote what, then it was David himself who recorded the full depths of his mistakes in Psalm 51, acknowledging the full horror and human cost of his error. No excuses. No passing the buck. No editing of his personal history. David took it full on the chin, accepting whatever consequences God felt fitting.
Likewise, according to the religious text, Jonah himself is the author of the book that bares his name – even if most bible scholars consider the book allegorical. But assuming it is a historical account with Jonah as the writer, as befitting a humble man of God he did not attempt to whitewash his own history, or belittle his mistakes. Rather, he recorded them in excruciating detail, presenting a brutally honest chronicle of his worst failures that often cast him in a poor light.
Jonah didn’t care that it made him look bad. He knew that it was more important to acknowledge his serious mistakes, own them, and learn from them.
How does this compare to Watchtower? Let’s start with the succession of failed prophecies littering the feet of the Organization.
It has to be said, the founder of the religion, Charles Taze Russell, did occasionally admit that he’d blundered in this regard, although this didn’t stop him from setting new dates to replace the failed ones with seemingly endless enthusiasm and very little self reflection.
However as time went by and the leadership changed, this trait faded from Watchtower’s skill set. For example, the only acknowledgement of the 1975 debacle was a single published article that essentially threw the rank and file Witnesses under the bus for believing what they were told by Watchtower from the platform and in publications (never mind the fact that they are not allowed to dispute what they are told from the platform and in publications by Watchtower).
Since then, failed prophecies have not even been acknowledged as errors. They have instead been re-framed as “new understandings” or “new light.”
So the next time I leave home without my wallet, that’s not a mistake. That’s new light about the location of my wallet. And the next time I burn the toast it is not a mistake, just a new understanding about the desired status of the toast. I mean yes, I still had to eat carbonized bread for breakfast, and I’m standing at the bus stop with no money to pay the fare, but I didn’t make any mistakes, you see…
What about the other subjects? Issues where Watchtower mistakes have had a grave cost in physical and mental health? A cost in human lives? Issues such as banning vaccination and organ transplants? Or the covering up of numerous cases of child sexual abuse?
Watchtower has never apologized for these mistakes. Ever.
In fact, if you are a Jehovah’s Witness reading this, it might be the first you’ve even heard of some of these issues, so thoroughly has Watchtower whitewashed them from history and made sure that the congregation does not know.
Y’know, exactly the way Peter didn’t.
And the way David didn’t.
And the way Jonah didn’t.
I guess you can draw your own conclusions from that.
 
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 KtotheRAD "Konrad" says:

 August 25, 2013 at 6:55 pm
 

With every word they reveal and “impart” far more than they ever intended…
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 george says:

 August 27, 2013 at 4:45 am
 

Sorry Cedars, I can only access the first video on my I pad. There are a lot of over sized play icons and they won’t work.
Reply
 
 

 Luke says:

 October 27, 2013 at 5:27 pm
 

Continue the good work on this site that expose what Watchtower Organization really are — a fanatic end-time driven cult that only serve interests of its leaders. I left this
 cult three years ago for good. My only regret is that I had not left the Watchtower Cult earlier! On Easter Sunday this year, I was baptized in the Name of the Father, Son, Holy Spirit and received into Eastern Orthodox Church, apostolic Church that preserved the Faith that was once for all delivered to the saints.

Cedar, you have my blessings of your work on this site that
 will yet help millions of JWs to see the truth of so-called ‘Truth’.

Reply
 
 

 Fred says:

 November 2, 2013 at 12:09 pm
 

Forget taking your numbers from a 1974 yearbook if you question the amount of those killed, interned, etc get the numbers from the Holocaust museum. You forgot to mention the ‘JEWS’ were and its quoted several times in the Watchtower publications as it is related in the bible, “ONCE GOD’S CHOSEN PEOPLE” but they did not remain that because of their actions. Your quotes from WT publications are based on the latter that they fell out of favour in God’s eyes. They therefor were NOT written in an anti-Semitic nature. Many Jews have become JW’s over the years are they lesser beings because they were of Jewish blood?…ABSOLUTELY NOT! All races are equal so this video in my opinion is twisted in its presentation. Not to mention the ridiculous claim of Rutherford’s so called love letter to Adolf Hitler. No blinders on here, I have checked the facts. Sorry but this video paints an untruthful twist of events and statements about the WT as regards the comments on the Nazi’s and Jews.
Reply
 
 

 Palma says:

 February 28, 2014 at 3:48 am
 

Hi everybody! Hi cedars!
 I found this article about a discovery in egypt that brings light to the origin of story of joseph in the bible.
 What do you think?
http://www.davidovits.info/the-lost-fresco-and-the-bible-my-new-book-in-french/
Reply
 
 

 Idris says:

 March 27, 2014 at 8:12 am
 

Thank you for this page, it has been a great help to me, as I seek the truth of the word of God, however I noticed in the video ‘Does the Bible speak of ‘Paradise Earth’ the speaker quotes Luke 21v43 twice, regarding Jesus word on the cross, there should be a correction note as the verse he mentions is in Luke 23 v 43.
 Keep up the good work

Reply
 
 

 Julia Orwell says:

 July 17, 2014 at 3:47 am
 

Been to internationals before and this elaborate souvenir thing is entirely new. The last one I went to in 2009, the last ones they had, had nothing like this so it’s not a matter of you having not noticed it in the past, it’s a matter of it being a new phenomenon.
 I theorize that the wt motives for this involve keeping the masses busy and therefore obedient. Jws would volunteer to do this because there are no other legitimate outlets for creative expression. Armageddon being near has nothing to do with it: it’s about keeping the sheeple busy and happy. Making stupid trinkets is also a team building activity as it involves jws working together, thus reinforcing the herd mentality jws have.

Reply
 
 

 frankie fernandez says:

 February 27, 2015 at 4:44 pm
 

dear friends I was baptized in 1974. Thank God I am no longer a member of the WT. Free at last and oh what a relief it is. A member of my former congregation who I considerd my best friend molested a minor. There was a big argument amognst the elders on the judicial committee. One elder who was a maverick, wanted to notify the police. But, instead they followed the instuctions of the society. They kept this crime against the child, hush hush. So as not to tarnish the name of Jehovah. But in reality it was a coverup to protect the wt’s reputation. Meanwhile this poor child that was raped has to carry the heavy burden of a victim for the rest of thier lives without compensation and without justice. While the abuser has remaind a member in good standing. The congregation he is attending now has not been notified that he is a sexual preditor.
Reply
 

 Holy Connoli says:

 November 17, 2015 at 1:14 am
 

Frankie.If I were you I would turn him into the police now even though it may have been several years ago he committed this crime. Many sexual predators get turned in years later after the crime is reveled. At the very least he will be investigated and his Name will be mud for being a creep.
 He deserves it and so does the WT for its NON protection of the flock and not caring for the victim but only their phony reputation.

Reply
 
 
 

 Kirtley W. Burggraf says:

 March 11, 2015 at 11:16 am
 

Tell me, since governing body members are elected (replacing someone who dies) at what point do do they become “divinely inspired” or “spirit guided”? Were they always thus in the lower ranks or does this just “happen” the moment that they are appointed? What’s Watchtower’s take on this?
Reply
 
 

 Alone in MD says:

 March 31, 2015 at 6:00 pm
 

Regards your video on the Memorial Service. I am one of those “non believers” married to a baptized witness. I go to just keep the peace but I’ve made it known that I consider this service one of the worst religious ceremonies that I have ever been to. “Anointed What”. Also it was announced at last years meeting that “this may be the last memorial service”. They are at it again. Thanks for the great videos.
Reply
 
 

 frankie fernandez says:

 May 10, 2015 at 9:50 pm
 

IF CHRIST WAS ENTHRONGED IN 1914, WHY ARE THE WITNESES STILL CELEBRATING THE MEMORIAL? CHRIST SAID THAT AFTER HIS ARRIVAL NO ONE WAS TO CELEBRATE THE MEMORIAL .ALSO HE SAID THAT THE DAY OF HIS PRESENSE, IT WILL BE LIKE LIGHTNING FROM ONE POINT OF THE EARTH TO ANOTHER. LIGHTNING TRAVELS AT THE SPEED OF 3500 MILES PER SECOUND. SO IT WILL TRAVEL AROUND THE GLOBE IN LESS THAN A MINUTE. HE ALSO SAID THAT ALL EYES WILL SEE HIM. NOT LIKE THE WTS THAT SAYS WE ARE IN HIS INVISIBLE PRESENSE.
Reply
 
 

 pj wilcox says:

 July 31, 2015 at 3:21 am
 

I watched the latest video of the inept elder being questioned by the commission. Who prepared this man for testimony? You all are aware of the dentist who shot Cecil the lion in Kenya? Well his life is over. He is in hiding. What he did ,did not break laws in Kenya and his is in a world of trouble with public sentiment. But this elder being questioned is far worse. He covered deeds that drove people to think of killing themselves. Should he not go into hiding? Is his life over? Has he know conscience? Emotion, caring? You know the answer. Bet ya, damage control is working overtime on this.
Reply
 
 

 Adrian says:

 September 8, 2015 at 3:32 am
 

I think the Royal Commission videos demonstrate that fragility of the governance within the WT society. Yes, it’s an Australia branch issue but cross examination only points to the seat of control on which the governing body members sit. Everything starts and stops with the governing body, they set the policy but where are they? Sitting comfortably in NY watching from a distance ready to abdicate any responsibility whatsoever. A governing body governs and leads but I see no leadership I see the followers talking and being bashed around the head with questions, all too easy for the legal team.
However, it might just be me but does anyone else not see the lawyer’s gap in knowledge regarding the fundamental rationale for the WT society policies, they fall back in their comfort zone knowing that they can say ‘well we don’t have the authority to go beyond the bible.’
It’s this gap in knowledge of the legal representatives which the WT society exploit. I mean nobody is going to ask ‘ where actually did this translation come from anyway?’ What were the academic qualifications of the translators? Is there a possibility that you have interpreted things wrongly or even worse, translated things incorrectly? If there’s a possibility that your interpretation on how to deal with modern day child abuse cases in congregations may be flawed, then are you in agreement that your policies could result in lasting harm to victims of abuse? In my view that translation is the ‘elephant in the room’ every scholar knows it’s perverse but no one is holding this cult to account. So easy to say it’s all in the bible but should they really be saying it’s all in the NWT instead?
The WT society in the videos almost give of an innocence as if to say, ‘ but that’s what we understand from the scriptures’, and I think it works in their favor, but a savvy legal representative would do well to tease out the basis for the rendering of certain verses on which doctrine, policy and organisational decisions are based. So far the WT Society appears to be one step ahead because their authority is not a person but a book, which they are ‘only trying to understand and live by’. Expose the origin of the NWT and the basis for so many ridiculous uncaring decisions is called into question.
Reply
 
 

 Rick Viger says:

 November 10, 2015 at 3:26 pm
 

Thanks John for all you do with your videos.
 I’m an ex JW for 40 years now. I hope your videos reach some witnesses and make them think. For all of you that have left Watchtower remember you made the right decision.

Reply
 
 

 S.T. says:

 November 24, 2015 at 9:48 pm
 

I was wondering if anyone has heard that Jehovah’s witnesses are telling there congregations that the end of this system could have only hours left? My sister who is a Jehovah’s Witness said they are preaching this at the congregations. Has anyone else heard this?
Reply
 
 

 mary ruth says:

 December 26, 2015 at 7:21 pm
 

I heard a retired CO’s wife say that the end must come within the next two years. That was a year and a half ago. but not heard anyone say that you tell people that at the doors. But this is not new news. they have been saying this for years. I am 48 and my parents told me I wouldn’t make it to school, now my kids will be graduating from college.
Reply
 
 

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