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Official Watchtower representative at Government / Religion meeting in Austria
by Gorbatchov 8 hours ago 4 Replies latest 3 hours ago   jw friends
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Gorbatchov
Gorbatchov 8 hours ago

Part 3 of maybe not so relevant information, but nice to know and opening my eyes during the past years, were this pictures of an official Watchtower representative attending a meeting between the Austrian government and the country's main religions. I don't know who the representative is, no names, no face, I cut and past it from some website.





 +1 / -0
TheOldHippie
TheOldHippie 7 hours ago
So what? A Meeting between some government institution and representatives of religious groups, what's the problem? Does that have to be some conspiracy-thing? The government perhaps wants to discuss some planned changes in legislation towards religious groups and wishes the opinion of the named groups. Perhaps they want to know how the climate can be better between them and the groups. Perhaps they want to know whether the groups want to be involved in some charity work towards refugges - who knows? Two pictures, so what?
 
Listener
Listener 4 hours ago
No wonder you can't identify them as they have set themselves associating with Christendom and other false religions.
 
wannaexit
wannaexit 3 hours ago
They say to stay separate but don't apply it to themselves. Hypocrites!!!

 
Gorbatchov
Gorbatchov 3 hours ago

oldhippy hi I wrote in a related toppic that there is nothing wrong with a meeting like this. I think it is just a good thing.
My main point is that the internal perception of jw.org is that it's wrong, and if a JW at a local level does the same he will be ousted.
That's the hypocritical point of the organization I hate so much.
 +2 / -0

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Waking People Up With Well Thought Out Comments
by JW_Rogue 10 hours ago 29 Replies latest 3 hours ago   jw experiences
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JW_Rogue
JW_Rogue 10 hours ago
Is it possible to have an effect from the inside? With well thought comments that reveal more of the history of the organization? The next book we study will be "God's Kingdom Rules!" which sets itself up for extra research into the Proclaimers book.
 +2 / -0
OUTLAW
OUTLAW 10 hours ago


Waking People Up With Well Thought Out Comments
....Your In A Cult!..
Get The F*CK OUT!!..
....................................http://i854.photobucket.com/albums/ab110/GeneralWaco/thsmilie_happy_251.gif
 +3 / -4
JW_Rogue
JW_Rogue 9 hours ago

Outlaw - That is really easy to say when you are already DF'd or DA'd let me give you a break down of my situation.
Immediate family: All JWs except one, includes an Elder and auxiliary pioneers. We've all been together in the same congregation since I was born.
Sister In Law and Nieces: All JWs
Wife: JW
Wife's Immediate family: All JWs
Childhood Friends: JWs
Social Circle: All JWs
So yeah I'd love to write a letter of disassociation and never go back. I could do that but that would not end things, that would only be the beginning of my troubles. If I have to put on a bit of act then I will do so. I have been doing it for a long time anyway.
 +7 / -0
JW_Rogue
JW_Rogue 9 hours ago
Hell, I've barely even started fading and am catching some negativity. When they announce I'm no longer an MS my mom might have a mental breakdown. I know it's nonsense but for them it's the only thing that matters.
 +2 / -0
OUTLAW
OUTLAW 9 hours ago


Outlaw - That is really easy to say when you are already DF'd or DA'd.....JW_Rogue
I`m not Da`d or DF`d..
One day I had enough and walked out..
There`s no easy way out,you walk away or stay..
There`s consequences either way..
.

Your not going to change the WBT$ from the inside..
Your not going to Save JW`s who are happy where they are..
So you better figure out what you need to do,for you..

 +7 / -0
JW_Rogue
JW_Rogue 9 hours ago

One day I had enough and walked out..
There`s no easy way out,you walk away or stay..
Don't think I can do it that way, too many people will push me until the truth comes out. Then it'll be off to a JC for me. Nope, gotta take it slow but steady.
 +1 / -0
OUTLAW
OUTLAW 9 hours ago


Don't think I can do it that way, too many people will push me until the truth comes out. Then it'll be off to a JC for me. Nope, gotta take it slow but steady.
Then stay..
There`s a price to pay either way..

 +4 / -0
JW_Rogue
JW_Rogue 9 hours ago

Your not going to change the WBT$ from the inside..
Your not going to Save JW`s who are happy where they are..
I don't see a ton of happy people when I look around my family included. We are all pretty much glued in because of other family members. Not looking to save anyone but for all I know there are already others there with severe doubts just like I had.
 +3 / -0
NeverAllowestobeMyself
NeverAllowestobeMyself 9 hours ago

I think you can. Over the last couple of years I have given well thought out comments that have resulted in people saying to me after the meeting "your comment really made me think."
The trick is to not say anything that can be used as a basis for an "investigation" conducted by two elders during a "shepherding call".
 +5 / -0
OUTLAW
OUTLAW 8 hours ago


I don't see a ton of happy people when I look around my family included.
Unhappy JWs will tell you how much they love being a JW..
They`ll fight to the death,to stay right where they are..
If you want to live a lie,that`s on you.
It will eat at you and you`ll die a little bit at a time..

It`s up to you,do what ever you want..

 +3 / -0

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Waking People Up With Well Thought Out Comments
by JW_Rogue 10 hours ago 30 Replies latest a minute ago   jw experiences
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JW_Rogue
JW_Rogue 8 hours ago

There`s a price to pay either way..
LOL Like I haven't thought about that, my situation doesn't exactly leave me with a ton of options. I have to distance myself from this org in a way that doesn't push away family or friends. Even non DF'd people can be marked and pretty much treated the same as DF'd. Nope, I have to seem like I slowly drifted away, that I'm "lazy" not that I'm an apostate.
 +3 / -0
Dreamerdude
Dreamerdude 8 hours ago
Maybe I'm idealistic, but I thing some comments with a tinge of TTATT can add some CD to get people thinking, maybe in combination with other things going around. In my case I found the CD to be cumulative, until I reached the tipping point during a particularly ridiculous talk by a GB member.
 +1 / -0
Dreamerdude
Dreamerdude 8 hours ago
Extremely cultish comments have the same effect. Like saying a guy that's 23 and still not a MS is not marriage material, or worthy of getting laid.
 +1 / -0
JW_Rogue
JW_Rogue 8 hours ago

If you want to live a lie,that`s on you.
Been doing it for 35 years...a few more months for a better outcome isn't going to hurt anybody.
 +1 / -0
OUTLAW
OUTLAW 8 hours ago


I have to distance myself from this org in a way that doesn't push away family or friends.
DA`d..DF`d..or...A Weak JW..
Not exactly desirable company to Loyal WBT$ JWs..
You`ll be marked..

 
OUTLAW
OUTLAW 8 hours ago


Been doing it for 35 years...
LOL!!..
35 years??!!..Wow..
You don`t have a lot of years left.....

 
smiddy
smiddy 8 hours ago

JW_ Rogue
You have been doing it for 35 years ? , and what have you achieved in that time ?what makes you think a few more months is going to make any difference ?
Just asking
You have to ask yourself this question : Do I want my life to be manipulated by other people ? or am I going to live my life the way I want to live it.
smiddy
 +1 / -0
JW_Rogue
JW_Rogue 8 hours ago

35 years??!!..Wow..
Yes, since the day I was born I was a JW. Was there really choice? No, might as well have been born with little suit and tie and tract to hand the householder. I don't think I ever really believed it though there was always part of me that knew it was all BS. That I was just acting, that believing was what I was "supposed" to do. That good people had faith or at least pretended like they did by doing and saying all the right things. Maybe some people feel differently but that's how I feel.
 +1 / -0
JW_Rogue
JW_Rogue 8 hours ago

You have to ask yourself this question : Do I want my life to be manipulated by other people ? or am I going to live my life the way I want to live it.
I gave away the power I had to truly do things on my terms at 12 years of age. You can say don't play their games but right now they are holding all the cards. The only power I have is to lie or be completely silent. Leaving on my terms would mean speaking my mind and not giving a damn. I can't do that...too much at stake.
 +1 / -0
disposable hero of hypocrisy
disposable hero of hypocrisy 8 hours ago

In answer to your original question, yes, you can.
But you must be careful, and in personal conversation frame things in questions. Just giving a fact here or a quotation there can get defenses up, and that can come back to bite you in the ass. I've had success in that way.
If you mean in the congregation, answering up, then I think possibly, but you have to be even more careful as the eldubs will be listening too and you don't want to get put on the radar.
If you have to be there (I share your pain bro) then good Christian answers can redirect the hate propaganda sometimes, and can show people that you know what you're talking about scripturally. This could come in handy in the future if word gets out about your doubts, 'brother rogue apparently has doubts? But he's such a knowledgeable brother. Maybe he's onto something...'




 +2 / -0

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Topic Summary
is it possible to have an effect from the inside?
with well thought comments that reveal more of the history of the organization?
the next book we study will be "god's kingdom rules!



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Waking People Up With Well Thought Out Comments
by JW_Rogue 10 hours ago 30 Replies latest 2 minutes ago   jw experiences
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JW_Rogue
JW_Rogue 8 hours ago

Sometimes I get the impression that my wife wants me to come clean about what I'm thinking but then my brain says don't do it...



 
poopsiecakes
poopsiecakes 7 hours ago

It's so hard to see situations like this. I absolutely understand the family and social pull and breaking away from all of that is the most difficult scenario to be a part of. I've seen people who have just blown everything up and walked away, some who have tried to quietly walk away and ultimately been blown apart and those who are still trying to 'fade' and feel forced into living a lie every day of their lives. Outlaw is absolutely right, every choice has its consequences and all of them mean that you won't have the same relationship with the people you're allowing to control you at this moment. Short term pain is worth more than long term deceit and the toll that takes on everyone, including you. (my two cents)
 
JW_Rogue
JW_Rogue 7 hours ago

My wife: How do you feel about the truth?
Me: I don't want to talk about it
My wife: Actions speak louder than words and right now I don't see you doing much for the truth? Have you just gotten lazy?
Me: What do you think? Does that seem like me?
My wife: I guess not
END OF CONVERSATION
 +1 / -0
poopsiecakes
poopsiecakes 7 hours ago

And that's great, Rogue. Small victory there, until you break down the actual conversation. You're using JW speak (the truth) when you talk to her. I get what you're doing, but you're not helping the situation in the long term. Instead of saying 'the truth', try 'the religion' or 'the corporation' and see how that goes. Cognitive dissonance manifests itself in many different ways and you may be suffering from it somewhat. Be true to YOU and what YOU believe and want for YOU. Otherwise, you'll always be on this treadmill and nobody wants that for you or anyone.
 
Crazyguy
Crazyguy 7 hours ago
I was able to wake up a friend but he was already going threw marriage problems and the elders weren't treating him well either. It seems to me that people need to go through something emotional first to start the proccess.
 
smiddy
smiddy 7 hours ago

I don`t mean to sound cynical , do I get the impression there may be a financial loss in your walking away from your family and this religion ?
just asking
smiddy
 
Half banana
Half banana 5 hours ago

JW rogue, sympathy bro! I know others in your situation. One thing you are probably driven to is to live inside your head as it were, to think about reality outside of the JW delusion and enjoy the real world that way. To physically leave suddenly of could make matters worse.
Perhaps in your casual comments you could stress the facts that the early Christian congregation seemed to think that welfare within the community was a priority (widows and orphans), The GB couldn't care a fig about the welfare of their followers even for the suffering of victims of sexual abuse. In fact the more they suffer the more dependent they become...
JWs I think, might be likened to a troupe of high-wire artists who have all fallen into the safety net...that is the KH community. from their viewpoint there is nothing underneath the net left to save them. It is this crippling vision of their place in life which holds them there in fear.
People who believe they are worthless will punish themselves and make bad choices.
The Watchtower of course encourages this since fear and worthlessness are the very factors they routinely exploit. The only people useful to the organisation are those who are guilt ridden, emotionally and educationally stifled and who therefore remain totally dependent on it to give them the imaginary fix of paradise .
Suggestion 1
Have you thought about building up your wife's self confidence as opposed to her abject religious dependency? A new job or new interest?
Suggestion 2
How about continuing to take it slowly, keep them on your side but sharing things you have learned which get the family to start thinking for themselves? Make some allies in your mild scepticism, preferably including your wife.
Suggestions 3
Expressing the oddness that if Big J was behind the JW org, surely, you would have thought he would get his dates right? The WT teaching for seventy odd years that the generation which saw 1914 would also see the end? JWs have never got a prophecy right...nor did Jesus get his generation prophecy right. Mark 9,1.
It's a trap all right!
 
User99
User99 4 hours ago
Thanks for your insightful comments, Half Banana. I had to read the italicized sentence and the following paragraph a few times, as they really hit home to me as to the truth in those words..
 
stillin
stillin 4 hours ago

Then there's the fine line between making a comment that rattles people's cognitive dissonance and making a truly good comment. The latter actually adds to the quality of the meeting and as you fade, people will make conclusions about your absence. " a smart guy like Rogue is having less and less to do with being a Witness. Maybe he knows something..."
But in the end, people will do whatever it is they will do. You'd like to think that you are helping somebody to step out into the light, but they may just prefer the dark.
 
wannaexit
wannaexit 3 hours ago
As others have said , you can make some comments that can have an impact on others. I've done it many times. Just be careful not too say something that is too controversial because they will yank you to the back room.

 

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Topic Summary
is it possible to have an effect from the inside?
with well thought comments that reveal more of the history of the organization?
the next book we study will be "god's kingdom rules!



Related Topics
new boy
Chapter 2 of the Novel "New Boy"
by new boy a month ago
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by stuckinthemiddle 8 days ago
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by snare&racket 2 months ago
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Life After Disassociation (or really leaving by any means)
by dubstepped 2 months ago
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by jwfacts 3 months ago



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Waking People Up With Well Thought Out Comments
by JW_Rogue 10 hours ago 30 Replies latest 3 minutes ago   jw experiences
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OneEyedJoe
OneEyedJoe 3 minutes ago

It didn't take me long to give up on waking anyone else up. It wasn't worth the effort for me, and it's not my responsibility to force anyone to open their eyes. What I did do while I was still in, though, was try to give comments and talks that would get the JWs nodding in agreement, unknowingly condemning themselves.
◦Make mention of how we would want to avoid association with ANY organization that knowingly hides pedophiles to save face in the public eye, like the catholic church.
◦Talk about how religious organizations often join the UN (the scarlet colored beast from revelation!) and how we would want to avoid association with any organization that has (or ever had) a membership in the UN.
◦Tell the story of Harold Camping (or similar - there's lots to choose from) predicting armageddon then changing the date when it didn't happen on his schedule and liken him to a false prophet that in the days of isreal would've been given the death sentence.
◦When stories about isreal come up in which the people die because the king is misleading them or because he made some mistake, remind them that god holds us personally accountable for who we put our allegiance in. In the case of the isrealites they put their allegiance in what was "god's organization" at the time, but when men lead it astray they were punished for continuing to follow it - we must continue to examine what we put our allegiance in to ensure that we are not putting faith in men who are not following god.
I'm under no illusions that any of this would wake someone up (maybe if they're already really on the fence...) but it sure was fun to do stuff like this and get the clueless JWs unknowingly condemning themselves. I guess it was a bit of revenge for forcing me to give my tacit approval to the cult by forming a system that makes free speech and objection impossible.
 

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Topic Summary
is it possible to have an effect from the inside?
with well thought comments that reveal more of the history of the organization?
the next book we study will be "god's kingdom rules!



Related Topics
new boy
Chapter 2 of the Novel "New Boy"
by new boy a month ago
stuckinthemiddle
a unique situation
by stuckinthemiddle 8 days ago
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Ten years out.....
by snare&racket 2 months ago
dubstepped
Life After Disassociation (or really leaving by any means)
by dubstepped 2 months ago
jwfacts
Toasting is Pagan - How many contradictions can fit in 2 pages, I found 5?
by jwfacts 3 months ago



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Cult Think-How to deflate good news
by Captain Schmideo2 14 hours ago 1 Replies latest 28 minutes ago   jw friends
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Captain Schmideo2
Captain Schmideo2 14 hours ago
Me:"My son is going to South Korea to teach English. He'll get to live in another country, expand his horizons, and live comfortably while he is there!"
Deeply devout JW brother-in-law:"Oh, it's really bad in South Korea. The brothers have a bad time over there, they get thrown in prison because they won't serve in the military..."
or
Me:"My son has gotten an amazing opportunity to do an internship in Moscow! His lodgings are provided, he gets a living stipend, and he'll be working at Yandex, the Russian version of Google!"
Deeply devout JW mother-in-law:"They still ban Jehovah's Witnesses in Russia. They are not allowed to preach!"
I know I should realize by now that this is going to be the reaction to anything that doesn't have to do with Pioneering or Bethel, but it still just disappoints and makes me mad.
It also drives home the reason why I, as a young man, never really did anything like this, because I knew that there would be some form of disapproval, either vocal, or in the eyes, of family and members of the Hall.
So, eff all of them! My sons will get to have life experiences that my idiot brother-in-law will never have, or will never be sentenced to a life of waiting for a bus that will never, ever arrive, like my mother-in-law has done to herself.





 +6 / -0
WingCommander
WingCommander 28 minutes ago

Oh yeah, I am totally feeling this. Having been raised in "the crazy", I experienced this a lot myself. Nothing is ever positive or uplifting UNLESS it somehow benefits this crazy cult. If it benefits YOU as an individual human being, well that's just "Satan" try to negatively influence you into a sinful lifestyle. And all good JW's know, that anything not somehow pointing towards the benefit of the WTBTS is the broad path to a sinful lifestyle, hedonism, and "Satan", AKA - Everlasting Destruction!
It's all so crazy and self-defeating. No JW lives an authentic life NOW. It's all just going thru the motions for some promised FUTURE life, that MAYBE you will get to live IF you make it past the final judgement at the end of the 1,000 year reign. Maybe. And even after that, if you mess up you'll be instantly vaporized out of existence, because during that time YHWH will have a zero tolerance policy on subordination or independent thinking.

 

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A flash from the past
by wasone 16 hours ago 18 Replies latest 26 minutes ago   jw friends
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wasone
wasone 16 hours ago

This is a photo of the Bethel Repair Shop taken in 1976. Anyone recognize any of these lads from 40 years ago. I know it's a long shot, but was wondering how many were still in after all these years. I remember a few of them. Front row center with stripped shirt is Brent McClean from Illinois, to his right is Steve Black from Louisiana to McClean's left is Donald Murray from Massachusetts. I'm looking over Murray's left shoulder, I was from Georgia. The big guy at the very top back row is John Mikruk from New Jersey. Can anyone identify any others and what happened to them.

 +2 / -0
prologos
prologos 16 hours ago
They are all a generation younger than I, but they all look that they would so much more content if allowed the permanent presence of a woman, and more time at the meal tables.
 +1 / -0
wasone
wasone 15 hours ago


, but they all look that they would so much more content if allowed the permanent presence of a woman, and more time at the meal table. prologos



Actually two of those guys had wives with them at Bethel. Can't imagine why any woman would want to make a home at that place.






 +2 / -0
Pete Zahut
Pete Zahut 15 hours ago

I came to Bethel in April 76 and left a year later. I don't recognize anyone in the photo but they all have that certain "Bethelite" look that you can't quite put your finger on. It must be the bad Bethel haircuts they forced us to get. I went to the Bethel Barber once and that was one too many times. My Mom used to cut hair so I was used to having good haircuts. At one point she had a broken wrist and taught me how to cut my own hair so that's what I did from then on. It used to just fry the floor overseer on haircut day when he'd tell me it was my turn to go and I'd decline his orders. The guys I worked with always wanted to know which of Bethel Barbers I went to so they could go to him because they hated the one size fits all haircuts they would get. Long on top....side part...shaved up the back. I took pity on my friends and eventually had a few customers of my own until the floor overseer put a stop to it.

Did you know :
Milton Carrion,
Johnny Tender (yes,his real name)
Hector Mendez,
Herman McMickens,
Alvin Morris.
Lance Canada,
Gil Acasio,
Clarence Scott
Ernie Grice.
Tibor Weise

 +2 / -0
wasone
wasone 15 hours ago

Pete Zahut


God forbid you missing a hair cut appointment. You got to do without. I made that mistake once. Looked pretty shabby before I was able to get another.
 +1 / -0
wasone
wasone 15 hours ago

Pete Zahut Sorry don't recognize any of those names. A lot of people there and a loong time ago.
 
Barrold Bonds
Barrold Bonds 15 hours ago
I used to love haircut day as it gave me an excuse to get off the floor for a while. I'd milk that for all it was worth. I would poop and change before the haircut. Afterwards, I would shower and change back into my work clothes. I got my money's worth lol.
 +2 / -0
Pete Zahut
Pete Zahut 13 hours ago

I found one of my old Bethel roommates a couple of years ago on facebook. I saw his facebook page and it was full of JW memes and the daily text etc. He was kind of a fun but mischievous guy at 19....used to skip out of work, drink beer on the roof, play pranks on others. He was now in his mid 50's and had been looking for me for years and was delighted to hear from me. I was looking forward to hooking up with him but after a few phone calls back and forth things got pretty sad.
What was once fun and crazy had become a bit odd with age and time. He was still single and had become one of the "anointed" and was living in an apartment alone and on Disability because he had an enlarged heart. He said he weighed over 300 pounds and only left the house a couple times a month. He was eligible for a heart transplant but declined because he was looking forward to being with " Lord God Jehovah" in heaven. Between testifying about the grand creator and quoting scriptures, he kept mentioning how his "Lord and God Jehovah" was miraculously making sure he was provided for. For example, he said he had been craving some barbecued ribs one evening and there was a knock at the door and someone from the rib place around the corner delivered an order of ribs for him. He said the congregation was visiting him regularly and as time went on he began hinting heavily that I send him money and food and told me about places near him that delivered. It seemed to me that heavy hinting is what was at the root of these miracles he spoke of.
This went on for a few months and got odder and odder until eventually I quit calling. I learned that he finally passed away last year and felt badly about not having kept in contact. I just couldn't stand having to bite my tongue every time he started in about his heavenly hope etc.

 +5 / -0
Barrold Bonds
Barrold Bonds 13 hours ago

ah yes the 'old weird single bethelite'
you can spot those guys a mile away.
 +1 / -0
wasone
wasone 12 hours ago

Pete Zahut I've only met up with a couple who were at Bethel when I was there. Brent and Bonnie McClean left shortly before I left in 76. They were special pioneers before Bethel. I met up with them in Chattanooga a few years ago when they were on their way to Florida. They left the organization long ago and were happy and successful .Brent was roommates at Bethel with Steve " Just2laws" who use to post here. Steve and his wife Joy were at Bethel when I was there also. Met up with them ounce when I and my son were driving through Florida . I think those are the only ones I've had any contact with in more recent years.
 +1 / -0

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A flash from the past
by wasone 16 hours ago 18 Replies latest 27 minutes ago   jw friends
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ShirleyW
ShirleyW 12 hours ago

The guy on the front row, brown shirt looks like a total wise ass. Like he's in Bethel but his room was probably party central with illegal substances and booze.
 +1 / -0
compound complex
compound complex 12 hours ago

Know Brent's family and knew Steve personally.
CC
 +1 / -0
wasone
wasone 12 hours ago

compound complex Is Steve still in? Use to G-job with him.
 +1 / -0
wasone
wasone 12 hours ago

ShirleyW Nope can't read a book by it's cover. Wise ass maybe but pretty straight up.
 +1 / -0
ShirleyW
ShirleyW 12 hours ago

Well, one strike for me ! But the guy on the far left of him kinda looks like Jack Nicholson.
 +2 / -0
wasone
wasone 12 hours ago

ShirleyW Are you saying he looks crazy like the rest of us?
 +1 / -0
wasone
wasone 11 hours ago

compound complex Sorry thought you were talking about knowing Steve Black.  I'm slow sometimes. Realise what you meant now.
 +1 / -0
berrygerry
berrygerry 10 hours ago


craving some barbecued ribs one evening
Someone is going to be disappointed -

For the Kingdom of God does not mean eating and drinking
 
WingCommander
WingCommander 27 minutes ago

My God! Are the two guys on the right (front, with hands in pocket and arms folded) - wearing TIGHT PANTS?
Someone notify Knorr! I feel a Newboy refresher talk is in order! NPG's are only allowed to bunk with Chitty, remember? lol

 +1 / -0

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Topic Summary
this is a photo of the bethel repair shop taken in 1976. anyone recognize any of these lads from 40 years ago.
i know it's a long shot, but was wondering how many were still in after all these years.
i remember a few of them.



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New ANTI-GAY video for Kids on jw.org
by ttdtt 18 hours ago 68 Replies latest 10 minutes ago   jw experiences
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ttdtt
ttdtt 18 hours ago

Lesson 22: One Man, One Woman
https://www.jw.org/en/bible-teachings/family/children/become-jehovahs-friend/videos/one-man-one-woman-marriage/
Disgusting!

 
FayeDunaway
FayeDunaway 18 hours ago
Sorry i dont watch witness videos because they make me physically ill, but this doesnt surprise me. Jehovahs witnesses: preaching intolerance from infancy.
 +4 / -0
freemindfade
freemindfade 18 hours ago
That was awful, I hope this one bites them in the ass like the Noah one! Sick!
 +4 / -0
ToesUp
ToesUp 18 hours ago
It will bite them!
 
JustVisting
JustVisting 18 hours ago
Gotta love the trademark WT seal of approval at the end of these productions.
 +1 / -0
BlackWolf
BlackWolf 18 hours ago

Man! My dads probably gonna make us watch this crap at our next family worship, and then my moms going to go on and on about how disgusting gay people are like usual. Little do they know I'm actually bisexual :frowning: This video makes me sad.
Edit: my mom just watched it and she thought it was risque!
 +6 / -0
Village Idiot
Village Idiot 18 hours ago







 +10 / -0
steve2
steve2 18 hours ago
Given the sheer number of gay and lesbian individuals "produced" in JW marriages, this is indeed rich in irony. The equivalent of being made to reject the very individuals they have brought into the world.
 +7 / -0
dbq407
dbq407 17 hours ago

Could be bad PR for them if the right person sees it.
I like how paradise is gonna have a security check point like at the airport now. Good job WT.
 +7 / -0
dubstepped
dubstepped 17 hours ago

Mom: "What can you tell Carrie at school?"
Sophia: "Well, I can tell Carrie about paradise and about how her mommies are going to die right on the cusp of it in a fiery Armageddon. Afterward Carrie and I can help bury their bodies once the birds pick them clean and we can live forever happy, because you know, Carrie won't even miss her mommies."
That's how it should have ended. Disgusting.
 +23 / -1

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New ANTI-GAY video for Kids on jw.org
by ttdtt 18 hours ago 68 Replies latest 11 minutes ago   jw experiences
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ToesUp
ToesUp 17 hours ago
dubstepped said it all. That is HOW it should have been portrayed. The reality!
 +3 / -0
Gefangene
Gefangene 17 hours ago
Dubstepped pls excuse the "dislike" on your posting. I wanted to hit "like" and I accidentally hit dislike by mistake. Great thoughts!
 +2 / -0
scotsman
scotsman 17 hours ago
Is it saying gay people are like bombs? Or maybe we're just like a large can of shaving gel?
 +1 / -0
Pete Zahut
Pete Zahut 17 hours ago


That was awful, I hope this one bites them in the ass like the Noah one! Sick!
What happened in regard to the Noah Video? I hadn't heard anything about that.



I think JW's would probably call this a "Pro Hetro Marriage video" rather than an "Anti-Gay Marriage Video".
I can't help but notice how the messages in these videos are way too obvious "on the nose".  Everything they support is portrayed in a hyper-idealistic way. The homes are as neat as a pin and nicely decorated, the Dad's are always handsome and strapping and the moms are always pretty and feminine and the kids are cute, chipper and easy to reason with.
Did you notice that in the idealistic "paradise scene", the boys jumping into the water were wearing shirts? Wouldn't want to anyone to get the wrong idea by showing boys swimming immodestly without their shirts on. Even the most subtle detail is covered by their calculated message.

 +7 / -0
fulltimestudent
fulltimestudent 16 hours ago

steve2: Given the sheer number of gay and lesbian individuals "produced" in JW marriages, this is indeed rich in irony.
And, we should not forget that the witnesses say that same sex attracted people can 'change.' But the evidence is that they do not change, they merely live a life of deceit, attempting to be 'straight.' Ask the wives (or, former wives) of so many people who tried to 'change' in the watchtower way. These sad guys do not experience heterosexual sexual attraction. They are the victims of christian fraud (the JWs are not the only christian group who make this claim).
The second false claim in the above video, is that God created humans, "male and female." Simplistic thinkers like the witnesses think that having a penis or vagina, makes you male of female. But the reality is that sex and gender (two different things) is much more complex than that.
All humans born of women (and that includes the historical Jesus) started life in a form that can be described as gender neutral, or even female. Take a look at the following 2 videos to glimpse reality and not the fake social construction foisted on the poor bloody kids in the above JW video.



And, as for women (and the so-called womanly virtues in the fake 'christian' social construction) they too are very different to the image of women in the above video, as the following video will demonstrate.



The reality of human life, contrasted with the fake social construction taught by the witnesses, tells us something else. It tells us why the witnesses discourage tertiary (university) education. Never let the facts spoil a fictional story.
One last thing: There were many males in ancient Israel who were prepared to have sex with other men. Open your bibles children and turn to 1 Kings 14:24:
And there were also sodomites in the land. (KJV):
An interesting story, because a more accurate translation is that they were male temple prostitutes. So now we have a mental picture of many small temples across Israel, and inside you could find a man prepared to have sex with another man. Now prostitutes have customers, so we may imagine a number of visitors each day to each of these temples and inside an (unknown) number of 'male temple prostitutes' all offering an exalted spiritual experience through their sexual skills. Not quite what the WTS teaches about ancient Israel.
Viewed from that perspective, the description of David at 1 Samuel 18:1 take on a special poignancy:
1Now it came about when he had finished speaking to Saul, that the soul of Jonathan was knit to the soul of David, and Jonathan loved him as himself.
Now jump across to 2 samuel 1: 26:
How I weep for you, my brother Jonathan! Oh, how much I loved you! And your love for me was deep, deeper than the love of women! (NLT)
or this version:
English Standard Version : I am distressed for you, my brother Jonathan; very pleasant have you been to me; your love to me was extraordinary, surpassing the love of women.
Faced with this information, how can anyone argue that the relationship between the younger David and the older Jonathon, did not have a sexual connection?



It may distress some whose minds refuse to accept the evidence to think of David ( a type of Jesus) kissing Jonathon, but however much conservative Christians may try to argue it away, the evidence stares us in the face, since in the ancient world the older usually penetrated the younger, we must imagine Jonathon penetrating David (likely not just once, but a number of times), and providing such a memorable experience that David never forgot how wonderful his love affair with Jonathon was.
Now lets skip through the centuries to the time of King James himself,


King James I

as I'm sure everyone knows, James set up a committee and personally presided at many of its meetings to produce a new translation o the Bible, a translation that had a marked affect on the English language, and is particularly liked by many modern Christians.
I find it also poignant that James (even though married with children) preferred to have sex with men. In a different world arrangement his Royal partner would have been a male.
Here's a quote from a web-site on the British Royal family:
He also sought solace with extravagant and unsavoury male favourites ( http://www.britroyals.com/kings.asp?id=james1 )
I'm not sure about the judgemental statements evident in the word unsavoury. The English nobility could likely be said to have been 'unsavoury.'



 +5 / -0
Captain Schmideo2
Captain Schmideo2 16 hours ago

"And after you tell her about the Paradise, be sure to tell her that if her mommies don't change, they'll die at Armageddon! Share the fear!"
 +6 / -0
Heaven
Heaven 16 hours ago

Is this JW video available on YouTube? I don't like going to jw dot Borg.
And remember, Paul, Christianity's foundational figure, circumcised his adult male friend Timothy. We all know the ancient Jewish circumcision technique, right...right?

 +1 / -0
respectful_observer
respectful_observer 16 hours ago

@1:55 "...people can change!" I'm sure LGBT would all agree with that statement.
And what would she tell her classmate? The paradise, the animals (everyone gets a pet panda), and the resurrection. Hmmmm....nothing about God killing her moms first? I wonder why not?
 +1 / -0
wifibandit
wifibandit 15 hours ago



 
Wasanelder Once
Wasanelder Once 15 hours ago
Carrie will obviously drop her moms like carry on luggage. So clear and clever. In this case carry on would become carrion. Ba Dum Tish!

 +1 / -0

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https://www.jw.org/en/bible-teachings/family/children/become-jehovahs-friend/videos/one-man-one-woman-marriage/.
disgusting!.



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New ANTI-GAY video for Kids on jw.org
by ttdtt 18 hours ago 68 Replies latest 12 minutes ago   jw experiences
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Heaven
Heaven 14 hours ago

Thanks wifibandit.
Jehovah wants everyone to be in paradise?
Uh, no he doesn't. He doesn't want the Catholics, the Jews, the homosexuals, the transgenders, the bisexuals, the transvestites, the hemophiliacs, the apostates, people with turrets syndrome ... you know, anyone who isn't a healthy, young, able-bodied, able-minded heterosexual Jehovah's Witness.

 +13 / -0
jwjono
jwjono 14 hours ago
I find this rather sad. Homosexuals don't hurt anyone. They are just two people who love each other. They didn't show what happens if the man does take the bag through the check portal. Will he get zapped by lightening? Or will the angels come and take him away?
 +1 / -0
breakfast of champions
breakfast of champions 14 hours ago

Why are they even going here? Gay marriage and parenting is EXTREMELY rare. It is likely your school-age child will NEVER meet a classmate with two moms or dads.
So why do they produce this shit? Why is this issue so fucking important they have to make a cartoon?
Because they don't have an original thought of their own and are following right along with all of the religious Right propaganda bullshit.

What a bunch of assholes.
 +4 / -0
stuckinarut2
stuckinarut2 14 hours ago

Wow!
Perhaps this could be forwarded to some relevant anti discrimination organisations?
Is this to combat the influence of shows like "modern family"?
 +7 / -0
Jehalapeno
Jehalapeno 13 hours ago
This video makes Jehalapeño sad.
 +8 / -0
just fine
just fine 13 hours ago

This kind of crap is just them trying to judge others as less worthy of God. I have met some really wonderful people who happen to be gay. I was just visiting with a lesbian couple I know tonight and one of them has Mormon family that are giving her a really hard time right now. Why can't they just love other people the way they are. It's so sad.
 +6 / -0
kairos
kairos 13 hours ago

What they don't show is the practice session to follow:
Tactics to fool the young school girl into having a secret bible study, joining the cult so she can shun the two women that raised her.
Real nice...
 +9 / -0
konceptual99
konceptual99 13 hours ago

The great thing about this video is that it shows that anyone who is doing anything that the Bible condemns can't get through the big A. It is a clear example of the reality of Armageddon as requiring the destruction of billions and the truth about what Witness doctrine really teaches despite the protestations that it's all up to God to judge and won't kill anyone deserving of life.
So the next time a Witness throws that wishy washy line at you just use their own kids video against them and ask them what it's really saying about who can get on the narrow road to life found by few as compared to the broad and spacious road full of billions of people trudging off to destruction
 
Billy the Ex-Bethelite
Billy the Ex-Bethelite 12 hours ago

It would seem from this video that the only reason JWs get married is because it makes Hojovah happy. Mom made no statements about how much she enjoyed being married to her husband and how wonderful the "one man and one woman" marriage and "biblical" family arrangement was.
Nope. No personal testimony from Sophia's mom about the wonderfulness of heterosexuality. Rather, she made it sound like homosexuality was something that everyone had to give up in order to please god. You know, like birthday parties and Christmas presents and Halloween costumes and Easter candy and after-school sports and music and a university education and a hundred other fun and potentially beneficial activities.
So, it's not that people really want to be straight. It's just that they have to give up being gay or being "two moms" in order to please Hojovah.
I suspect that the parents of Caleb and Sophia may have a sham marriage.

 +10 / -0
kairos
kairos 11 hours ago
I still can't get over the fact they promote a web site and watch cartoons in the KH...
 +5 / -0

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https://www.jw.org/en/bible-teachings/family/children/become-jehovahs-friend/videos/one-man-one-woman-marriage/.
disgusting!.



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New ANTI-GAY video for Kids on jw.org
by ttdtt 18 hours ago 68 Replies latest 13 minutes ago   jw experiences
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wizzstick
wizzstick 10 hours ago

This way well go viral.
I truly hope so.

 +3 / -0
atomant
atomant 10 hours ago
Just imagine being married to the same partner for eternity. Just imagine.

 +2 / -0
stuckinarut2
stuckinarut2 9 hours ago

I wonder if witnesses will use THIS video out in service?
Hmmm....guess not!
Its a typical "in house" video!
 +2 / -0
poopsiecakes
poopsiecakes 8 hours ago

I saw this video today. Made me feel horrible that I actually thought this way in my life. :frowning:
 +3 / -0
punkofnice
punkofnice 7 hours ago
This video needs getting out there and exposing. The media needs to see this. Gay rights organisations need to see this too.............not sure who or how, but..hey...
 +3 / -0
sir82
sir82 7 hours ago

"people can change"
Lovely.
As if it were as simple as dropping a suitcase, or changing from purple socks to black ones.

The WTS has just reinforced their policy of driving gay JW kids (and adults, for that matter) to suicide because they can't just "change". And if they can't "change", well then they aren't "Jehovah's friend".
"Better to off myself on my own terms than wait for Jehovah to do it with a flaming hailstone at Armageddon."

WTS, you have blood on your hands....yet again.

 +2 / -0
Defianttruth
Defianttruth 6 hours ago

Poor Children. Both of the children in the video have it tough. The girl with the two mom's has to live with being the "not normal" child, and the other child has to deal with being raised a Jehovah's Witness. Essentially, WTBS is encouraging a little girl to go to school and disrespect the beliefs of others constitutionally given rights. Can you imagine the damage that could be done to this sweet child with two momma's. Hey your mommas are going to roast like bbq on armageddon.
 +1 / -0
jookbeard
jookbeard 6 hours ago
pretty sick vile stuff even by their standards ,force-feeding hate and homophobia to very young children. Their simplistic dumb answers to this issue leave me speechless, their stupidity seems to grow even deeper. I really do struggle to watch this utter evil persona of Caleb and Sophia's mother, this is the second vid I've watched after the Sparlock Wizard one, she comes across as deeply mentally disturbed , borderline or on the way to a full psychopath, with a narcissistic streak, probably asexual, and a victim of abuse herself, a dictator, even possibly bipolar,someone who would be classed as "wearing the trousers" in the household but strangely diametrically opposed to the meek,submissive,quiet archetypical jw housewife, a truly vile character.
 +2 / -0
steve2
steve2 5 hours ago

Even from a heterosexual perspective,Biblical marriage is depicted as between a man and a women, with citations from Genesis. Really? So thousands of men having more than one wife are wiped from the record in order to portray the idyllic one mother and one father and children.
Given the topic, I think the video played it very safe: Not one pejorative comment was made about "the two moms" beyond "people have their own ideas". It will be hard to classify any of it as hate speech.
 +2 / -0
sir82
sir82 5 hours ago


I think the video played it very safe: Not one pejorative comment was made about "the two moms" beyond "people have their own ideas". It will be hard to classify any of it as hate speech.
WTS lawyers were undoubtedly ALL OVER this, reviewing every syllable with excruciating detail.
The WTS is reprehensibly homophobic, but they retain their cleverness quotient.

 +1 / -0

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disgusting!.



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New ANTI-GAY video for Kids on jw.org
by ttdtt 18 hours ago 68 Replies latest 14 minutes ago   jw experiences
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tiki
tiki 5 hours ago
Well....I got as far as eve popping the flower behind her ear.....corny, lame....pathetic....and a total lack of anything meaningful....sick stuff to be brainwashing innocent kids with....they'll blindly accept it because its all they know or are subjected to....dystopia.
 
Darkknight757
Darkknight757 4 hours ago
Hopefully some of the smarter parents will preview this video before showing it to their kids. Teaching them to hate others at such an early ago is beyond disgusting.
 +2 / -0
ttdtt
ttdtt 3 hours ago

I guess when guys in ancient israel had Harems (i.e. David - Soloman..) the few hundred wives and concubines never ever had sex with each other?  They just took a turn every few years or so with their king.
And I'm sure the godly man David was never banging 2, 3, 4 or more of his wives and sex slaves (concubines) at the same time.
And I'm sure that never happened in the majority of polygamous marriages, especially since they all lived in big homes with separate rooms the other wives could go to when it wasn't their turn.
And didnt one of the old story books talk about the Male Temple prostitutes? I don't think they were there for the pleasure of women:smile:
 +3 / -0
stuckinarut2
stuckinarut2 3 hours ago

Good point ttdtt!
so many of the "examples" in the bible DID NOT live a "moral" life! They would be disfellowshipped nowadays.
And yet, they are held us as models to imitate.....
 +1 / -0
bohm
bohm 2 hours ago

I have long been trying to form an opinion on The Gay marrying. After seeing this totally-for-humans-with-a-brain video I finally realize gay marriage is like bringing a can of soda into the airport.
The Gays are literally trying to bring a too large bottle of shampoo into paradise. I for one appreciate Jehovah magnificent body scanner and strong hands and fingers that will grope and prod me to ensure I do not blow up the new system with any Gay.
Thank you, Jehovah, and the seven fuckwits. I hope future videos will explain to me how I brush my teeth.

 +1 / -0
punkofnice
punkofnice 2 hours ago

For what it's worth, I sent the link, via email to Stonewall and the Gay Times. Let's see if anything comes back.



Anyone else reported this anywhere?
Is it worth it?
 +3 / -0
Doubtfully Yours
Doubtfully Yours 2 hours ago

Well.....
It is a JW belief and, in this case, it's put in simple terms for a child to understand.
At the beginning of the video the mother mentioned that people have different ideas on what's right and wrong, then proceeded to explain very tactfully the JW belief.
JWs don't hate on others, but definitely the homosexual lifestyle is not at this time part of the culture; and the same way perhaps gun nuts or a radical right wingers or a racists indoctrinate their offspring, JWs do the very same on their ways.
Actually, for JW children, this needs to be emphasized more and more these days where the homosexual lifestyle has become the norm in so many places, so much so that the Law of the land is ruling in favor.
I feel so sorry for people whom I'm sure are born this way, but it's a JW belief and they must teach it to their young.
It is what it is.
DY
 +0 / -4
Darkknight757
Darkknight757 2 hours ago
I get what your saying DY but now instead of JW kids showing their classmates that Santa also spells Satan, they will show their classmates that it's wrong to have 2 moms or 2 dads. As if those poor kids don't have it bad enough...
 
StephaneLaliberte
StephaneLaliberte 2 hours ago

Raised as a JW, I was homophobic myself. Until I became friends with one in High School. I realized that he was just like everyone else, except that he liked boys; and to my surprise, I wasn't his type! Then one of my cousin came out of the closet. I had no issues with that either. Then she got married and adopted kids. Whoa… I felt it was wrong; just plain wrong! That is, until my wife pointed out that she was able to adopt kids simply because heterosexual parents could not, or would not, give the love these kids deserved. The years have since passed and I can tell you that these kids are just like any other kids. The only significant suffering they would encounter would not be from their loving mothers, it would be from kids at school telling them that their mothers are evil individuals deserving of God’s wrath as they are, according to the Apostle Paul, an abomination.
 +5 / -0
Doubtfully Yours
Doubtfully Yours an hour ago

I know, and trust that these JW kids will only speak up when questioned and not make it a campaign. Tough and sad all at the same time.
Things like this is what's making me understand why more and more JW parents decide to do homeschooling rather than mix up with the non-believers.
There is now JW oriented homeschooling online and it's very well structured, at least here in the States. I checked it out, and was so glad to know that it meets the USA standards for public school education; actually know a couple of kids that are now taking college courses towards a 2-year degree. In this model, the kids do not waste so much time as regular kids in public/private school do when the different holidays roll around, so it's possible to graduate much earlier than a regular high school; also, there's a lot of time wasting with vague subjects that are not needed to meet the Law requirements in public high school, plus, this homeschooling method I checked emphasizes the S.T.E.M. model. parents team up and create an actual classroom while obtaining the info online; sports, laboratory, music, etc., are covered up in association with some local school or library. It's fantastic!!!
I can honestly say that if all our kids would've had this neat tool while growing up, sure we would've used it rather than put them through the grief of not being accepted and being so different from all the non-JW school kids; much grief was endured, and so many absences to avoid the holiday celebrations at school because the JW way is such a different way of life.
It is what it is.
DY
 

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https://www.jw.org/en/bible-teachings/family/children/become-jehovahs-friend/videos/one-man-one-woman-marriage/.
disgusting!.



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New ANTI-GAY video for Kids on jw.org
by ttdtt 18 hours ago 68 Replies latest 15 minutes ago   jw experiences
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StephaneLaliberte
StephaneLaliberte an hour ago

Doubtfully Yours: Young kids see things as black and white. They decided to cover just one aspect of their teachings on sexual conduct and focused on homosexuals. A mature JW would understand that homosexuals are just as wrong as any fornicators. This also includes heterosexual parents who are not married. However, looking at this video, how likely is the kid to ask his school mates: “Hey, are your parents married? No? Then, they won’t make it through the metal detector!” It is obvious that this video will generate discrimination based on sexual orientation rather than spiritual beliefs.
 +3 / -0
StephaneLaliberte
StephaneLaliberte an hour ago

Doubtfully Yours: Concerning home-school, I could not disagree more. I was raised a JW and attended school. One of the reasons I have a strong character today is precisely due to the fact that I learned to challenge the group’s thinking while standing up for my beliefs. It also allowed me to compare myself against the bests in various areas such as sport, mathematics, history, etc. and to push myself to excellence.
I have personally seen others be home-school and noticed that they were either behind expected results socially, emotionally or academically speaking. If they don’t learn how to deal with the world outside as kids, how will they face the world as adults?
 +3 / -0
Doubtfully Yours
Doubtfully Yours an hour ago

I believe the video was done tactfully and in good taste.
It's a very tough subject to cover with children in this "everything goes/everything is correct as long as you're not hurting anyone" world we live in.
The video does not incite hate/violence, just exposes how the JW God sees this lifestyle.
DY
 +0 / -2
Lisbet
Lisbet  an hour ago
I loved how they used Adam and Eve as an example. After all, that marriage worked out so well for humanity.
 +5 / -0
Amelia Ashton
Amelia Ashton an hour ago

http://www.gaystarnews.com/
The video is here
I have been contacted by The Mirror and so have several other ex jws about this video.
 +2 / -0
Doubtfully Yours
Doubtfully Yours an hour ago

Yes, SL, I agree that there's a socialization disadvantage for homeschooled children. However, this type of online/real-life classroom style model of homeschooling does meet the education requirements for Public School here in the States.
Socialization, well, that's definitely an issue.
DY
 
StephaneLaliberte
StephaneLaliberte an hour ago
Doubtfully Yours: If they had to cover homosexuality, why didn't they cover single mothers who have kids outside of marriage? Sophia: "My friend only has ONE mother - NO father..." I don't question their right to have their own ideas on morality. What I have a problem with is that they focused an entire video on homosexuals alone.
 +3 / -0
StephaneLaliberte
StephaneLaliberte an hour ago

.... does meet the education requirements for Public School
Its not because its legal that I should agree with it :smile: By the way, I was bullied in school for two years. Largely because I was a JW: It was the worst period of my life. However, I lived through it and passed it. In the end, I believe I am much stronger today because of that experience. I can now both sympathise with victims and fearlessly face adversity.
 
Doubtfully Yours
Doubtfully Yours an hour ago

Called a JW mom that has her kids in this homeschool program and she answered that the kids interacted with non-JW kids when they covered gym/sports, lab, library work with the help with a local public school and library; that these programs are created for homeschooled kids and that it works very well for either religious schools as well.
So, the JW kids do interact with non-JW kids weekly, however, it's done in a 'supervised' manner.
Here's the thing: These devout JW parents want their kids to grow up JW and remain JW throughout their lives. They sincerely believe is the best way for their children to live their lives.
DY
 
Amelia Ashton
Amelia Ashton an hour ago


Can it really have had this many shares?
 

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https://www.jw.org/en/bible-teachings/family/children/become-jehovahs-friend/videos/one-man-one-woman-marriage/.
disgusting!.



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New ANTI-GAY video for Kids on jw.org
by ttdtt 18 hours ago 68 Replies latest 16 minutes ago   jw experiences
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Doubtfully Yours
Doubtfully Yours 40 minutes ago

One subject at a time.
The fornication/pregnancy out of wedlock along with other 'JW-God does not approve' subjects are pretty well covered at the KH.
DY
 +0 / -1
StephaneLaliberte
StephaneLaliberte 39 minutes ago

Doubtfully Yours: Objectively speaking, you are right in saying that home-school is not a bad thing. Statistically speaking, at least, in Quebec (Canada), they even get slightly better results than the public school system.
My fear in regards to JWs is that some parents want to shield their kids completely from the world until they end up learning about these things on their own. Than, things can get out of hands.

 
StephaneLaliberte
StephaneLaliberte 38 minutes ago
Then why not cover the fornication/pregnancy in the video and the gays and lesbians at the hall? Keep in mind here that I have seen plenty of kids not listen to the program at all. Rather, they would listen to videos of sophia and caleb on their tablet.
 
Doubtfully Yours
Doubtfully Yours 33 minutes ago

Actually, around here is becoming somewhat frowned upon to send JW kids to regular school; it's being viewed as putting their kids in danger, so somewhat like the parents not doing the 'spiritual' thing for their kids' interest.
So, when kids act up in school I've heard other parents comment that it wouldn't have happened if the child was in the homeschool set up.
So glad all the children in our immediate families are all grown up.
DY
 
StephaneLaliberte
StephaneLaliberte 31 minutes ago

Actually, around here is becoming somewhat frowned upon to send JW kids to regular school;
Wow! I haven't seen this around my place... the home-schooled were rather the exception.
 
Doubtfully Yours
Doubtfully Yours 30 minutes ago

I'm sure they'll sun this video at the KH sometime soon.
Sorry. The JW world is what it is. Rejoice though for it may evolve at some future time the way it has with other doctrines.
DY
 
Amelia Ashton
Amelia Ashton 29 minutes ago

Pink News have it too
http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2016/05/03/watch-jehovahs-witnesses-are-using-this-creepy-anti-gay-cartoon-to-indoctrinate-kids/?utm_source=PNT&utm_medium=SocialTwitter&utm_content=TwitterN&utm_campaign=PNTwitter
Ī
 
littlerockguy
littlerockguy 25 minutes ago

Here's the thing: These devout JW parents want their kids to grow up JW and remain JW throughout their lives. They sincerely believe is the best way for their children to live their lives.
DY:
If these JW parents are as "devout" as they say, they wouldn't even have children to begin with "deep into the conclusion of the system of things" when "armageddon could come at any time".
LRG
 
Giordano
Giordano 16 minutes ago

The video does not incite hate/violence, just exposes how the JW God sees this lifestyle.
Correct me if I am wrong but didn't the JW God create the circumstances that lead to the type of gene's that incline a person to be Gay? Is this not a natural event? Did these babies ask to be gay?
What the JW's teach and demand along with other high control nut case religions is that a Gay person can not act on their sexual preference even if they join another person in a legal marriage.
The Mormon's are facing a huge problem because of their policy to not recognize that being Gay is as natural as being straight.
Instead you have this:
While there are conflicting reports regarding numerous suicides involving LGBT Mormon youth, there's no question that there's been an increase of suicidal teens and twenty-somethings following the Church's new anti gay policy.
Instituted in November, the new rules label any Mormon in a same-sex marriage as an "apostate," which could include excommunication from the church, and bars children of all same-sex couples from being baptized. Reaction to the new rules was swift, with thousands severing ties from the Church of Latter-Day Saints in response.
http://www.advocate.com/religion/2016/1/31/suicide-epidemic-ravaging-gay-mormon-youth

 

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disgusting!.



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Official Watchtower representative at Government / Religion meeting in Austria
by Gorbatchov 9 hours ago 6 Replies latest 41 minutes ago   jw friends
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Gorbatchov
Gorbatchov 9 hours ago

Part 3 of maybe not so relevant information, but nice to know and opening my eyes during the past years, were this pictures of an official Watchtower representative attending a meeting between the Austrian government and the country's main religions. I don't know who the representative is, no names, no face, I cut and past it from some website.





 +1 / -0
TheOldHippie
TheOldHippie 8 hours ago
So what? A Meeting between some government institution and representatives of religious groups, what's the problem? Does that have to be some conspiracy-thing? The government perhaps wants to discuss some planned changes in legislation towards religious groups and wishes the opinion of the named groups. Perhaps they want to know how the climate can be better between them and the groups. Perhaps they want to know whether the groups want to be involved in some charity work towards refugges - who knows? Two pictures, so what?
 
Listener
Listener 5 hours ago
No wonder you can't identify them as they have set themselves associating with Christendom and other false religions.
 
wannaexit
wannaexit 4 hours ago
They say to stay separate but don't apply it to themselves. Hypocrites!!!

 
Gorbatchov
Gorbatchov 4 hours ago

oldhippy hi I wrote in a related toppic that there is nothing wrong with a meeting like this. I think it is just a good thing.
My main point is that the internal perception of jw.org is that it's wrong, and if a JW at a local level does the same he will be ousted.
That's the hypocritical point of the organization I hate so much.
 +2 / -0
Crazy Angel
Crazy Angel an hour ago

Hypocrisy on highest level.
Me:I have to confess I ate on a birthday cake but its not my intention.
Eldub:we will investigate.
Me: f*ck.
 
Room 215
Room 215 41 minutes ago
Old Hippie, your constant nay-braying is really beyond tiresome; if you can't see that the WT's atttendance as events such as these is blatant hyprocrisy given all they've said about dalliances with world politics and false religion, you need a new pair of glasses.
 

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Waking People Up With Well Thought Out Comments
by JW_Rogue 11 hours ago 30 Replies latest an hour ago   jw experiences
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JW_Rogue
JW_Rogue 11 hours ago
Is it possible to have an effect from the inside? With well thought comments that reveal more of the history of the organization? The next book we study will be "God's Kingdom Rules!" which sets itself up for extra research into the Proclaimers book.
 +2 / -0
OUTLAW
OUTLAW 10 hours ago


Waking People Up With Well Thought Out Comments
....Your In A Cult!..
Get The F*CK OUT!!..
....................................http://i854.photobucket.com/albums/ab110/GeneralWaco/thsmilie_happy_251.gif
 +3 / -4
JW_Rogue
JW_Rogue 10 hours ago

Outlaw - That is really easy to say when you are already DF'd or DA'd let me give you a break down of my situation.
Immediate family: All JWs except one, includes an Elder and auxiliary pioneers. We've all been together in the same congregation since I was born.
Sister In Law and Nieces: All JWs
Wife: JW
Wife's Immediate family: All JWs
Childhood Friends: JWs
Social Circle: All JWs
So yeah I'd love to write a letter of disassociation and never go back. I could do that but that would not end things, that would only be the beginning of my troubles. If I have to put on a bit of act then I will do so. I have been doing it for a long time anyway.
 +9 / -0
JW_Rogue
JW_Rogue 10 hours ago
Hell, I've barely even started fading and am catching some negativity. When they announce I'm no longer an MS my mom might have a mental breakdown. I know it's nonsense but for them it's the only thing that matters.
 +3 / -0
OUTLAW
OUTLAW 10 hours ago


Outlaw - That is really easy to say when you are already DF'd or DA'd.....JW_Rogue
I`m not Da`d or DF`d..
One day I had enough and walked out..
There`s no easy way out,you walk away or stay..
There`s consequences either way..
.

Your not going to change the WBT$ from the inside..
Your not going to Save JW`s who are happy where they are..
So you better figure out what you need to do,for you..

 +8 / -0
JW_Rogue
JW_Rogue 10 hours ago

One day I had enough and walked out..
There`s no easy way out,you walk away or stay..
Don't think I can do it that way, too many people will push me until the truth comes out. Then it'll be off to a JC for me. Nope, gotta take it slow but steady.
 +1 / -0
OUTLAW
OUTLAW 10 hours ago


Don't think I can do it that way, too many people will push me until the truth comes out. Then it'll be off to a JC for me. Nope, gotta take it slow but steady.
Then stay..
There`s a price to pay either way..

 +5 / -0
JW_Rogue
JW_Rogue 10 hours ago

Your not going to change the WBT$ from the inside..
Your not going to Save JW`s who are happy where they are..
I don't see a ton of happy people when I look around my family included. We are all pretty much glued in because of other family members. Not looking to save anyone but for all I know there are already others there with severe doubts just like I had.
 +4 / -0
NeverAllowestobeMyself
NeverAllowestobeMyself 9 hours ago

I think you can. Over the last couple of years I have given well thought out comments that have resulted in people saying to me after the meeting "your comment really made me think."
The trick is to not say anything that can be used as a basis for an "investigation" conducted by two elders during a "shepherding call".
 +6 / -0
OUTLAW
OUTLAW 9 hours ago


I don't see a ton of happy people when I look around my family included.
Unhappy JWs will tell you how much they love being a JW..
They`ll fight to the death,to stay right where they are..
If you want to live a lie,that`s on you.
It will eat at you and you`ll die a little bit at a time..

It`s up to you,do what ever you want..

 +4 / -0

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Waking People Up With Well Thought Out Comments
by JW_Rogue 11 hours ago 30 Replies latest an hour ago   jw experiences
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JW_Rogue
JW_Rogue 9 hours ago

There`s a price to pay either way..
LOL Like I haven't thought about that, my situation doesn't exactly leave me with a ton of options. I have to distance myself from this org in a way that doesn't push away family or friends. Even non DF'd people can be marked and pretty much treated the same as DF'd. Nope, I have to seem like I slowly drifted away, that I'm "lazy" not that I'm an apostate.
 +3 / -0
Dreamerdude
Dreamerdude 9 hours ago
Maybe I'm idealistic, but I thing some comments with a tinge of TTATT can add some CD to get people thinking, maybe in combination with other things going around. In my case I found the CD to be cumulative, until I reached the tipping point during a particularly ridiculous talk by a GB member.
 +1 / -0
Dreamerdude
Dreamerdude 9 hours ago
Extremely cultish comments have the same effect. Like saying a guy that's 23 and still not a MS is not marriage material, or worthy of getting laid.
 +1 / -0
JW_Rogue
JW_Rogue 9 hours ago

If you want to live a lie,that`s on you.
Been doing it for 35 years...a few more months for a better outcome isn't going to hurt anybody.
 +1 / -0
OUTLAW
OUTLAW 9 hours ago


I have to distance myself from this org in a way that doesn't push away family or friends.
DA`d..DF`d..or...A Weak JW..
Not exactly desirable company to Loyal WBT$ JWs..
You`ll be marked..

 
OUTLAW
OUTLAW 9 hours ago


Been doing it for 35 years...
LOL!!..
35 years??!!..Wow..
You don`t have a lot of years left.....

 
smiddy
smiddy 9 hours ago

JW_ Rogue
You have been doing it for 35 years ? , and what have you achieved in that time ?what makes you think a few more months is going to make any difference ?
Just asking
You have to ask yourself this question : Do I want my life to be manipulated by other people ? or am I going to live my life the way I want to live it.
smiddy
 +1 / -0
JW_Rogue
JW_Rogue 9 hours ago

35 years??!!..Wow..
Yes, since the day I was born I was a JW. Was there really choice? No, might as well have been born with little suit and tie and tract to hand the householder. I don't think I ever really believed it though there was always part of me that knew it was all BS. That I was just acting, that believing was what I was "supposed" to do. That good people had faith or at least pretended like they did by doing and saying all the right things. Maybe some people feel differently but that's how I feel.
 +1 / -0
JW_Rogue
JW_Rogue 9 hours ago

You have to ask yourself this question : Do I want my life to be manipulated by other people ? or am I going to live my life the way I want to live it.
I gave away the power I had to truly do things on my terms at 12 years of age. You can say don't play their games but right now they are holding all the cards. The only power I have is to lie or be completely silent. Leaving on my terms would mean speaking my mind and not giving a damn. I can't do that...too much at stake.
 +1 / -0
disposable hero of hypocrisy
disposable hero of hypocrisy 8 hours ago

In answer to your original question, yes, you can.
But you must be careful, and in personal conversation frame things in questions. Just giving a fact here or a quotation there can get defenses up, and that can come back to bite you in the ass. I've had success in that way.
If you mean in the congregation, answering up, then I think possibly, but you have to be even more careful as the eldubs will be listening too and you don't want to get put on the radar.
If you have to be there (I share your pain bro) then good Christian answers can redirect the hate propaganda sometimes, and can show people that you know what you're talking about scripturally. This could come in handy in the future if word gets out about your doubts, 'brother rogue apparently has doubts? But he's such a knowledgeable brother. Maybe he's onto something...'




 +2 / -0

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Topic Summary
is it possible to have an effect from the inside?
with well thought comments that reveal more of the history of the organization?
the next book we study will be "god's kingdom rules!



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Chapter 2 of the Novel "New Boy"
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Waking People Up With Well Thought Out Comments
by JW_Rogue 11 hours ago 30 Replies latest an hour ago   jw experiences
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JW_Rogue
JW_Rogue 8 hours ago

Sometimes I get the impression that my wife wants me to come clean about what I'm thinking but then my brain says don't do it...



 
poopsiecakes
poopsiecakes 8 hours ago

It's so hard to see situations like this. I absolutely understand the family and social pull and breaking away from all of that is the most difficult scenario to be a part of. I've seen people who have just blown everything up and walked away, some who have tried to quietly walk away and ultimately been blown apart and those who are still trying to 'fade' and feel forced into living a lie every day of their lives. Outlaw is absolutely right, every choice has its consequences and all of them mean that you won't have the same relationship with the people you're allowing to control you at this moment. Short term pain is worth more than long term deceit and the toll that takes on everyone, including you. (my two cents)
 +1 / -0
JW_Rogue
JW_Rogue 8 hours ago

My wife: How do you feel about the truth?
Me: I don't want to talk about it
My wife: Actions speak louder than words and right now I don't see you doing much for the truth? Have you just gotten lazy?
Me: What do you think? Does that seem like me?
My wife: I guess not
END OF CONVERSATION
 +1 / -0
poopsiecakes
poopsiecakes 8 hours ago

And that's great, Rogue. Small victory there, until you break down the actual conversation. You're using JW speak (the truth) when you talk to her. I get what you're doing, but you're not helping the situation in the long term. Instead of saying 'the truth', try 'the religion' or 'the corporation' and see how that goes. Cognitive dissonance manifests itself in many different ways and you may be suffering from it somewhat. Be true to YOU and what YOU believe and want for YOU. Otherwise, you'll always be on this treadmill and nobody wants that for you or anyone.
 
Crazyguy
Crazyguy 7 hours ago
I was able to wake up a friend but he was already going threw marriage problems and the elders weren't treating him well either. It seems to me that people need to go through something emotional first to start the proccess.
 
smiddy
smiddy 7 hours ago

I don`t mean to sound cynical , do I get the impression there may be a financial loss in your walking away from your family and this religion ?
just asking
smiddy
 
Half banana
Half banana 6 hours ago

JW rogue, sympathy bro! I know others in your situation. One thing you are probably driven to is to live inside your head as it were, to think about reality outside of the JW delusion and enjoy the real world that way. To physically leave suddenly of could make matters worse.
Perhaps in your casual comments you could stress the facts that the early Christian congregation seemed to think that welfare within the community was a priority (widows and orphans), The GB couldn't care a fig about the welfare of their followers even for the suffering of victims of sexual abuse. In fact the more they suffer the more dependent they become...
JWs I think, might be likened to a troupe of high-wire artists who have all fallen into the safety net...that is the KH community. from their viewpoint there is nothing underneath the net left to save them. It is this crippling vision of their place in life which holds them there in fear.
People who believe they are worthless will punish themselves and make bad choices.
The Watchtower of course encourages this since fear and worthlessness are the very factors they routinely exploit. The only people useful to the organisation are those who are guilt ridden, emotionally and educationally stifled and who therefore remain totally dependent on it to give them the imaginary fix of paradise .
Suggestion 1
Have you thought about building up your wife's self confidence as opposed to her abject religious dependency? A new job or new interest?
Suggestion 2
How about continuing to take it slowly, keep them on your side but sharing things you have learned which get the family to start thinking for themselves? Make some allies in your mild scepticism, preferably including your wife.
Suggestions 3
Expressing the oddness that if Big J was behind the JW org, surely, you would have thought he would get his dates right? The WT teaching for seventy odd years that the generation which saw 1914 would also see the end? JWs have never got a prophecy right...nor did Jesus get his generation prophecy right. Mark 9,1.
It's a trap all right!
 
User99
User99 5 hours ago
Thanks for your insightful comments, Half Banana. I had to read the italicized sentence and the following paragraph a few times, as they really hit home to me as to the truth in those words..
 
stillin
stillin 5 hours ago

Then there's the fine line between making a comment that rattles people's cognitive dissonance and making a truly good comment. The latter actually adds to the quality of the meeting and as you fade, people will make conclusions about your absence. " a smart guy like Rogue is having less and less to do with being a Witness. Maybe he knows something..."
But in the end, people will do whatever it is they will do. You'd like to think that you are helping somebody to step out into the light, but they may just prefer the dark.
 
wannaexit
wannaexit 4 hours ago
As others have said , you can make some comments that can have an impact on others. I've done it many times. Just be careful not too say something that is too controversial because they will yank you to the back room.

 

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Topic Summary
is it possible to have an effect from the inside?
with well thought comments that reveal more of the history of the organization?
the next book we study will be "god's kingdom rules!



Related Topics
new boy
Chapter 2 of the Novel "New Boy"
by new boy a month ago
stuckinthemiddle
a unique situation
by stuckinthemiddle 8 days ago
snare&racket
Ten years out.....
by snare&racket 2 months ago
dubstepped
Life After Disassociation (or really leaving by any means)
by dubstepped 2 months ago
jwfacts
Toasting is Pagan - How many contradictions can fit in 2 pages, I found 5?
by jwfacts 3 months ago



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Waking People Up With Well Thought Out Comments
by JW_Rogue 11 hours ago 30 Replies latest an hour ago   jw experiences
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OneEyedJoe
OneEyedJoe an hour ago

It didn't take me long to give up on waking anyone else up. It wasn't worth the effort for me, and it's not my responsibility to force anyone to open their eyes. What I did do while I was still in, though, was try to give comments and talks that would get the JWs nodding in agreement, unknowingly condemning themselves.
◦Make mention of how we would want to avoid association with ANY organization that knowingly hides pedophiles to save face in the public eye, like the catholic church.
◦Talk about how religious organizations often join the UN (the scarlet colored beast from revelation!) and how we would want to avoid association with any organization that has (or ever had) a membership in the UN.
◦Tell the story of Harold Camping (or similar - there's lots to choose from) predicting armageddon then changing the date when it didn't happen on his schedule and liken him to a false prophet that in the days of isreal would've been given the death sentence.
◦When stories about isreal come up in which the people die because the king is misleading them or because he made some mistake, remind them that god holds us personally accountable for who we put our allegiance in. In the case of the isrealites they put their allegiance in what was "god's organization" at the time, but when men lead it astray they were punished for continuing to follow it - we must continue to examine what we put our allegiance in to ensure that we are not putting faith in men who are not following god.
I'm under no illusions that any of this would wake someone up (maybe if they're already really on the fence...) but it sure was fun to do stuff like this and get the clueless JWs unknowingly condemning themselves. I guess it was a bit of revenge for forcing me to give my tacit approval to the cult by forming a system that makes free speech and objection impossible.
 

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Topic Summary
is it possible to have an effect from the inside?
with well thought comments that reveal more of the history of the organization?
the next book we study will be "god's kingdom rules!



Related Topics
new boy
Chapter 2 of the Novel "New Boy"
by new boy a month ago
stuckinthemiddle
a unique situation
by stuckinthemiddle 8 days ago
snare&racket
Ten years out.....
by snare&racket 2 months ago
dubstepped
Life After Disassociation (or really leaving by any means)
by dubstepped 2 months ago
jwfacts
Toasting is Pagan - How many contradictions can fit in 2 pages, I found 5?
by jwfacts 3 months ago



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Gorbatchov
6
Official Watchtower representative at Government / Religion meeting in Austria
by Gorbatchov in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 9 hours ago
part 3 of maybe not so relevant information, but nice to know and opening my eyes during the past years, were this pictures of an official watchtower representative attending a meeting between the austrian government and the country's main religions.

i don't know who the representative is, no names, no face, i cut and past it from some website.

.

Gorbatchov
Crazy Angel
Room 215
an hour ago
JW_Rogue
30
Waking People Up With Well Thought Out Comments
by JW_Rogue in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Personal Experiences & Reunions
 11 hours ago
is it possible to have an effect from the inside?

with well thought comments that reveal more of the history of the organization?

the next book we study will be "god's kingdom rules!

stillin
wannaexit
OneEyedJoe
an hour ago
Captain Schmideo2
1
Cult Think-How to deflate good news
by Captain Schmideo2 in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 15 hours ago
me:"my son is going to south korea to teach english.

he'll get to live in another country, expand his horizons, and live comfortably while he is there!

"deeply devout jw brother-in-law:"oh, it's really bad in south korea.

WingCommander
an hour ago
Gorbatchov
2
Watchtower delegation present at Austria government meeting with religion leaders
by Gorbatchov in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 16 hours ago
maybe not relevant at all, another picture from my deep storage archive, with on it an official austria watchtower delegation meeting with government and religion leaders of that country.. .

wifibandit
wannaexit
15 hours ago
purrpurr
33
Were you beaten as a child?
by purrpurr in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Personal Experiences & Reunions
 17 hours ago
i've been confronting my mother with her dubious parenting skills (abuse) of me as a child.

particularly the beatings i would get with the wooden spoon.

not a light smack but hitting me as hard as she could for as long as she could.

Aprostate Exam
stuckinarut2
joey jojo
9 hours ago
wasone
18
A flash from the past
by wasone in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 17 hours ago
this is a photo of the bethel repair shop taken in 1976. anyone recognize any of these lads from 40 years ago.

i know it's a long shot, but was wondering how many were still in after all these years.

i remember a few of them.

wasone
berrygerry
WingCommander
an hour ago
ttdtt
68
New ANTI-GAY video for Kids on jw.org
by ttdtt in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Personal Experiences & Reunions
 18 hours ago https://www.jw.org/en/bible-teachings/family/children/become-jehovahs-friend/videos/one-man-one-woman-marriage/.

disgusting!.

Amelia Ashton
littlerockguy
Giordano
23 minutes ago
Crazyguy
3
Can a small child be taken out of state without the other parents permission?
by Crazyguy in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 20 hours ago
parents are still together not divorced.

one parent a jw wants to take a small child around age 7 out of state for a few months but other parents wants the child to stay home.

if the child is taken out of state can the parent that doesn't want him to go do anything?

OnTheWayOut
the girl next door
the girl next door
19 hours ago
stephanie61092
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A memoir in the making - good read
by stephanie61092 in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Personal Experiences & Reunions
 21 hours ago
hello friends,.

i was on he ex jw reddit page the other day and came across a posting from a woman who has become a successful author.

she was raised a jw in new york and pioneered at one point in her life.

jaydee
ShirleyW
WingCommander
2 hours ago
arwen
13
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by arwen in Jehovah's Witnesses
 » Friends
 a day ago
found some old books of my ex.

any suggestions??

is it worth ebay?

Pete Zahut
berrygerry
smiddy
7 hours ago
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