DIU blog posts and comments

Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 28 January 2012Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
You probably think that being a Muslim involves praying five times a day, eating halal food, fasting during Ramadan, and traveling to Mecca once in your lifetime. And, for many Muslims, it does. But there's a heck of lot more to it than that.
Take going to the bathroom, for instance.
Now it's true that Allah doesn't provide much bathroom guidance in the Quran, although there is this bit of helpful advice:
When ye rise up for prayer ... if ye ... cometh from the closet, or ye have had contact with women, and ye find not water, then go to clean, high ground and rub your faces and your hands with some of it. Quran 5:6
Which tells us that that kind of thing is important to Allah. He cares about your bathroom routine.
And so does Muhammad (PB&J be upon him). He was absolutely obsessed with it. Here is what he had to say:
Your Apostle (may Allah bless him and grant him peace) teaches you about everything, even about excrement. (1)
So let's take a look at some of the things that Muhammad taught about excrement.
Before entering the bathroom, cover your head, put shoes on your feet, and say this little prayer: "O Allah I seek your protection from the male and female devils."
When going to the toilet the messenger of Allah (may Allah bless him and grant him peace) would wear footwear. He would cover his blessed head and before stepping into the room, he would read: 'O Allah I seek your protection from the male and female devils.' (1)
Enter the bathroom with your left foot.
The Messenger of Allah (may Allah bless him and grant him peace) would enter the toilet with his left foot. (1)
Don't read the Quran while on the toilet.
Any verse of the Qur'an, should be removed before entering the toilet. (1)
Don't let anyone see you pee. (No one ever saw Muhammad do it -- except for all those eyewitnesses who provided the glorious details about his peeing technique.)
Jabir (may Allah be pleased with him) states that, 'When the Messenger of Allah (may Allah bless him and grant him peace) would go to relieve himself he would go so far that no-one could see him.' We should make sure that there is complete privacy whilst relieving one's self; this is modesty that every Muslim should have. (1)
A person should be concealed from the sight of others when answering the call of nature. ... How can anybody uncover in front of other people the ‘awrah (private parts) which Allaah has placed between his legs to conceal it and commanded him to cover it? (2)
One should move and hide himself from others, as the prophet SAAWS only relieved himself when he was out of site. (2)
Don't try to hold it before prayer. If you do, your prayer won't count. (Allah knows who has to pee or fart and who doesn't, and he gets pissed off when he sees people praying when they should be peeing.)
When the time for prayer comes and one of you needs to relieve himself, he should do that first ... it is Makrooh-e-Tehrimi to hold urine/wind or the need to go to the toilet. One should relieve themselves first as the Salaah will have to be repeated. (1)
Keep all of your clothes on until the very last second. Then take off only the clothes that are absolutely necessary while getting as close to the ground as possible. (God hates to see you naked.)
'When the Messenger of Allah (may Allah bless him and grant him peace) would go to relieve himself, he would not remove the clothing from his body until he was close to the ground. (1)
A person should not uncover his ‘awrah (private parts) until after he has squatted close to the ground, because this is more concealing, as Anas (may Allaah be pleased with him) reported: “When the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) wanted to answer the call of nature, he would not lift his garment until he had squatted close to the ground.” (2)
Point your face in some other direction besides Mecca while pooping or peeing -- but for God's sake don't point your butt or penis in that direction either. (If your toilet at home is facing Mecca, you're up shit creek, so to speak. If you're a good Muslim, you'll remodel the bathroom so the toilet faces New York, Rome, or Salt Lake City instead.)
Facing or keeping the back towards the Qibla whilst going to the toilet is forbidden. We should take care of this at all times. If the toilet is facing the Qibla in your home then try and sacrifice some money and have it changed as you will be sinning every time you use the toilet. (1)
“Your Prophet has taught you everything, even how to defecate!” Salmaan said: “Yes, he forbade us to face the qiblah when urinating or defecating…” (2)
The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “When any one of you sits down to answer the call of nature, he should not face the qiblah or turn his back towards it.” (2)
When you're doing your business, don't touch your penis with your right hand. Use your left hand to hold it while peeing and to wipe your butt after you're done pooping. (Don't let your right hand know what your left hand is doing.)
The Messenger of Allah (may Allah bless him and grant him peace) said that, 'None of you should hold the private parts with the right hand while urinating, or wipe with the right hand in the privy. (1)
[T]he Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “When any one of you wipes himself, he should not use his right hand.” (2)
Don't use the right hand for cleaning either. It's pretty much useless while in the bathroom. (I try to keep mine over my head or behind my back.)
Do not use the right hand for cleansing (Istinja) as it goes against the Sunnah unless you have a problem with your right hand. We use the right hand for eating, drinking, shaking hands, reading the Qur'an etc. we should use the other hand for cleaning, holding shoes, cleaning the nose etc. (1)
The Prophet’s wife Hafsah (may Allaah be pleased with her) reported that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) used to use his right hand for eating, drinking, making wudoo (?), getting dressed, and giving and taking things, and he used to use his left hand for other things. (2)
Wash and wipe an odd number of times.
Wash in odd numbers i.e. 1, 3, 5 or 7 times. (1)
[T]he Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) used to wash his posterior three times. Ibn ‘Umar said: “We did this too and found it to be healing and cleansing.” (2)
Do all your clean-up with just three fingers: the middle fingers of your left hand. (May take some practice.)
Use the left hand middle three fingers for cleanings. (1)
For an easier pee, try pushing on your left leg.
Put slight pressure on the left leg it makes it relieving easier. (1)
Pee sitting down. Whoever pees standing up will go straight to hell when they die. (Muhammad's nine year old wife, Aisha, swore he was a sit-down pee-er.)
Aisha (may Allah be pleased with her) says that, 'Whosoever says that the Messenger of Allah (may Allah bless him and grant him peace) would stand up and urinate do not believe them, he would urinate but sitting down ... One of the reasons of the punishment in the grave is because of urinating standing up, Islam has given us a method to follow not only will you relieve yourself but you will be rewarded too. (1)
Don't get any urine on yourself. If you do you, Allah will torture you in hell for it. As the Prophet of Pee said so well, "Most of the punishment of the grave will be because of urine."
Once the Messenger of Allah (may Allah bless him and grant him peace) while passing through a graveyard heard the voices of two persons who were being punished in their graves. The Messenger of Allah (may Allah bless him and grant him peace) said, 'These two persons are being punished not for something major (it is not difficult to be save from it).' The Prophet (may Allah bless him and grant him peace) then added, 'Yes! (They are being tortured for a major sin) Indeed, one of them never saved himself from being soiled with his urine... (1)
He should be careful to remove all impurity after answering the call of nature, because the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) warned against being careless in cleaning oneself after urinating: “Most of the punishment of the grave will be because of urine.” (2)
Females should wipe with the heel of the left palm, being careful not to separate the legs too much.
The sister should cleanse themselves with the lower palm of the left hand and do not separate the legs to wide. (1)
Males should hold the penis from the top with the left hand index finger and thumb, gently milking it until all the drops come out.
When cleaning yourself, males should hold their penis from the top with the left hand index finger and the thumb. Gently work your way down (as if milking an animal) so if drops are left they will come out. (1)
Whatever you do, be sure to get that last drop out. Force the little bugger if you have to.
After performing urination, if you feel that another drop of urine will come, then it is wajib for you to perform 'Istibrao' meaning after urination to perform some act that would force the urine left inside, to come out . (1)
First wash the front of the penis and then the back.
First wash the front then the back. (1)
In all of this, try hard not to even look at your penis. Looking at your own penis can cause severe memory loss.
Do not look at your private parts as there is a chance of the memory becoming weak. (1)
When you finally force that last drop out and you've washed your penis, front and back, wash your hands three times.
After you have relieved yourself, wash your hands up to the wrists thrice. (1)
Don't talk in the bathroom. If someone else talks, cough three times. (God doesn't like it when people talk while not fully clothed.)
One should not talk in the toilet without absolute necessity but if a person outside is calling and does not know then cough thrice to make them aware. ... When two people talk when the body is uncovered Allah (The Exalted) is displeased. (1)
[A] man passed by the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) whilst he was urinating, and greeted him. The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said to him: “If you see me in this state, do not greet me, because if you do, I will not respond.” (Reported by Ibn Maajah, 346; see also Saheeh al-Jaami’, 575). The majority of scholars say that it is makrooh (disliked) to speak in the restroom unnecessarily. (2)
Wipe your butt with your left hand, using at least three pebbles. But don't use bones or dung, for, as Muhammad said, "They are the food of the jinn."
Abu Hurayrah (may Allaah be pleased with him) reported that he used to carry a vessel for the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) to do wudoo’ and clean himself after answering the call of nature. Whilst he was following him, he (the Prophet) asked, “Who is that?” He said: “I am Abu Hurayrah.” He said: “Get me some stones I can use to clean myself, but do not bring me any bones or dung.” So I brought him some stones, carrying them in the hem of my garment, and placed them by his side, then I went away. When he had finished, I came back and asked him, “What is wrong with bones and dung?” He said: “They are the food of the jinn.” (2)
No one shall make "Estinjaa" without using three stones. ... The prophet SAAWS asked his servant (Abdullah Ibn Masood) to bring him three stones for "Estinja", Ibn Masood RAA only found two stones so he brought him a piece of animal's droppings (dung) that was dry. When the prophet saw it, he threw it away and said that it is Najasah (impure). ... "Salman was once asked: Your prophet teaches you everything, even how to relieve yourselves? Salman said: Certainly.... he forbade us from facing the Qiblah while doing so, from cleaning ourselves with our right hand, and from cleaning ourselves with less than three stones. (3)
When you're done, wash your private parts with water. (Muhammad didn't have to do this, though, because his pee was special.)
Aisha (may Allah be pleased with her) narrates that, 'The Messenger of Allah (may Allah bless him and grant him peace) went to answer the call of nature, 'Umar (may Allah be pleased with him) bought some water. The Messenger of Allah (may Allah bless him and grant him peace) said, 'What is this'' He replied, 'Water for cleansing (Istinja).' The Messenger of Allah (may Allah bless him and grant him peace) said, 'It has not been made necessary (Wajib) upon me after urinating to cleanse myself with water.'(1)
Watch out for jinns and devils. They like to hang out in bathrooms and mess with your private parts.
[T]he Messenger of Allah (may Allah bless him and grant him peace) said, 'These toilets are peopled by Jinn and devils, so when one of you goes there say, 'I seek protection in you from the male and female devil.'' Meaning pray the supplication before entering the toilet.
The Messenger of Allah (may Allah bless him and grant him peace) said, 'When one of you intends to go to the toilet then recite 'Bismillah' a veil will be placed between the jinn and the parts of your body.' This should be recited before entering the toilet. (1)
When you're all done, leave with your right foot.
When leaving the toilet one should step out with the right foot. (1)
After leaving, say a little prayer to the toilet god.
Once outside the toilet read this supplication: 'O Allah I seek Your pardon. All praises are due to Allah who has taken away from me discomfort and granted me relief.' (1)
When leaving the toilet, he should say: “Ghufraanak (I seek Your forgiveness).” (2)
If you fail to follow any of these rules, the invisible bathroom devils will give you some sort of mental illness.
We should try and learn these short supplications and practise them too. If we do not seek Allah's (The Exalted) protection from the devils, then there is a chance we can be affected with mental illnesses from the devils. We can not see the devils and when you can not see your enemy they are more dangerous. (1)
So you see what I mean. If you follow all those rules every time you go to the bathroom, you won't have much time for anything else.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1 Sunnah of Going to the Bathroom (Toilet)
2 Muslim Bathroom Etiquette
3 Istinjaa - Bathroom Etiquette
Posted by Steve Wells at 1/28/2012 12:35:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
63 comments:
 JustJoeP said...
what a total load of excrement!
Very thoroughly compiled, too! Or... number 2?
Sat Jan 28, 01:08:00 PM 2012 
 Anders said...
So every time they tell us we shouldn't take the piss out of the Koran, this is what they're talking about - they just want to keep it intact.
Sat Jan 28, 01:10:00 PM 2012 
 The Wise Fool said...
That is incredibly fascinating! And hilarious!
I guess it is a grave reminder that you can't get away from Allah, even for private matters.
Great research!
Sat Jan 28, 01:15:00 PM 2012 
 The Nerd said...
Could not stop laughing.
Sat Jan 28, 02:13:00 PM 2012 
 Bukko Canukko said...
I work in a hospital psychiatric ward. Reading these rules for bathroom behaviour, I am reminded of the thought pattern of obsessive-compulsives. Rigid rules about filth and fetishized cleaning practices (especially the bit about numbers.)
Nothing against Muslims in particular. Their religious craziness is no more insane than any other faith's lunacy. I used to have respect for religion, even though I did not believe a whit of it myself, until I started noticing how many paranoid schizophrenics expressed their violent antisocial feelings in religious terms. "God wants me to kill so-and-so" etc.
That's when it hit me that religion is like a computer worm for the human brain; a bit of bad code that somehow fits into a programming hole in how we're wired to think. Lots of people don't have the anti-virus protection of rationality, so their grey-matter hard drives become corrupted and start spewing out garbage. Reboot! Reboot!
Sun Jan 29, 04:29:00 AM 2012 
 diogenes0007 said...
I must compliment the author for the thorough research associated with this Blog. Of course whenever we read about a religion that is so legalistic on procedures, it is so tempting to wisecrack on such an obvious topic as bathroom etiquette.
Yet as Christians, we must look upon Islam as a religion developed by Muhammad to unify his followers and establish a legalistic system by which a Muslim would believe that Paradise awaits the righteous Muslim who follows all the rules.
Conversely, a Christian understands that it is by grace (unmerited favor)not works, and faith in Jesus Christ, that God gives the gift of eternal salvation.
According to Muhammad, a Muslim that performs all the rituals at the Hajj will come out as sinless as the day they were born. Only Muslims are allowed to enter Mecca for the Hajj.
Christianity is all inclusive, while Islam is exclusive.
Sun Jan 29, 02:36:00 PM 2012 
 Girl Atheist said...
This is absolutely amazing, in the best way! I had no idea Islam had so much focus on poo.
Sun Jan 29, 07:26:00 PM 2012 
 Anders said...
diogenes0007 "a christian understands that it is by grace (unmerited favor)not works"
I take it you don't consider catholics to be christians then. They consider your idea of grace without works to be blasphemy
"Christianity is all inclusive" - so first you say that catholics aren't christians, and then you say it's all-inclusive.
You have to laugh at the statements of True Believers (tm), when they argue over whose imaginary friend has the biggest genital equipment
"Christianity is all inclusive - except for those guys, they're going straight to hell; oh, and except for you, I'll laugh when you burn; oh, and except for these guys; ah, and I forgot those guys over there.....but we're all-inclusive, really. You just have to do and think exactly as we say, isn't that what freedom is all about?"
Captcha: tripp. Yes, it's a real tripp
Mon Jan 30, 10:06:00 AM 2012 
 Tony said...
I'm always shocked by these self proclaimed Xtians (diogenese0007, im talking to you) who don't read their bibles! As Steve points out, there are 194 distinct ways to be saved (by the most recent count). This "grace alone" crap has to stop.
Wed Feb 01, 02:29:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
"Don't read the Quran while on the toilet."
Damn! My favorite loo reading material... really stimulates the peristalsis.
Congratulations, Steve: you've outed the Big Mo as one of the earliest documented sufferers of OCD!
Steve Weeks
Wed Feb 01, 06:50:00 PM 2012 
 lunedreams said...
"Most of the punishment of the grave will be because of urine."
I knew it.
Thu Mar 01, 07:31:00 PM 2012 
 Anubis said...
You probably won't accept this comment so I don't know why I'm bothering.
But 90% of the bathroom etiquette mentioned by Islam is just common sense (like washing yourself with water). There's religious elaboration like saying certain things - mostly for the deeply religious who prefer to be have a continuous sense of spirituality about their lives - but that's about it.
Your condescending descriptions about each element just make it seem onerous. I can fulfill 99% of the bathroom obligations (again, mostly cleanliness related) in a span of 5 minutes.
Sat Mar 03, 03:44:00 PM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Anubis,
90% of the bathroom etiquette mentioned by Islam is just common sense.
No, 90% of the bathroom "etiquette" is bat-shit crazy bullshit. Asking Allah to protect you from male and female devils; entering with your left foot and leaving with your right; making sure your face and butt don't point towards Mecca; using your left hand to do the dirty work; washing and wiping an odd number of times, using stones or dirt; worrying about going to hell over a drop of pee; and fearing that if you look at your own penis you'll lose your memory.
None of these are common sense. All of them are bat-shit crazy.
Sat Mar 03, 08:18:00 PM 2012 
 Anubis said...
"bat-shit crazy"
Hmmm, one man's "religion" is another man's crazy. People's endless pursuit of money is "bat-shit" crazy to many religious people. But to the religious practitioner, doing these simple elaborations (like not facing toward Mecca out of respect, and imitating the life of their prophet by preferring the right hand) is beneficial to their spiritual resolve because it reminds them of their duty and purpose in life. And they take no more than 5 minutes to do, if that at all. People spend hours on youtube and facebook essentially doing nothing nowadays so it's not like human society is "above" apparently mindless repetitive tasks.
Sat Mar 10, 12:03:00 PM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Anubis,
So you were overstating things a bit when you said "90% of the bathroom etiquette mentioned by Islam is just common sense" -- by about 100% or so. It has nothing to do with common sense, it has to do with imitating Muhammad. If he said to wipe your but an odd number of times with your left hand using an odd number of pebbles while reciting a prayer to protect you from male and female devils while making sure not to point your face or private parts toward Mecca -- you'd do it. What the heck, it only takes five minutes or so and it reminds you of your duty and purpose in life (to do whatever Mo said to do). Nothing crazy about that, now is there?
Sun Mar 18, 09:03:00 AM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Looking forward to the next set of explanations from New BS. I'm wondering if your butt or face has to not be facing Mecca in a straight line (through the earth), or as the crow flies. Did Mo know the earth is round?
Steve Weeks
Sun Mar 18, 07:41:00 PM 2012 
 nazani said...
Having been to places where toilet tissue is a rare commodity, I do understand why the left hand is reserved for wiping, and the right for eating. Squatting to pee helps prevent getting splashed. These desert folk lived without leafy vegetation or abundant water for cleaning. Surrounding these acts with prayers and ritual is silly, but my ancestors had prayers and charms for everything for making butter to getting favorable winds, so I'll bet they had rituals for preventing spirits from attacking them when they had their breeks down, too.
Mon Mar 26, 02:40:00 PM 2012 
 Yahya Abdul-Baseir said...
I dont even know where to start. Bathroom ettiquete??? Your first step towards learning about Islam was bathroom ettiquete??? Wow, lol. How about that the Qur'an revealed the Big Bang in the 7th century while scientists just developed the theory in the 70's. Or how about that it revealed that the sun not only is not the center of the universe but it rotates and revolves around its own axis. You could have chose any subject from geology to oceanography, from embryology to botany and then some. And all of these fields have been tested by modern science and none have gone againts their findings. But you chose bathroom ettiquete and opted to ridicule what you've found. People commend you on your research but i've read some of the things you have stated with your limited knowledge pertaining this subject matter which exposed your lack of understanding of what you have even posted. Now if you want to choose a subject to ridicule from the Qur'an how about you take a look at the origins of the universe along with quantum mechanics and tell me what faults you find.
Sun Jun 24, 12:37:00 AM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Thanks for that, Yahya. Now we know why the Islamic world is so advanced scientifically. It's all in the Quran!
But my post wasn't about the scientific merits of the the Quran. It was about Muhammad's obsessions about going to the bathroom.
Was there something I got wrong in my post?
Sun Jun 24, 07:17:00 AM 2012 
 Yahya Abdul-Baseir said...
al-Ikhlâs - The Purity
سُوۡرَةُ الإخلاص
بِسۡمِ ٱللهِ ٱلرَّحۡمَـٰنِ ٱلرَّحِيمِ
قُلۡ هُوَ ٱللَّهُ أَحَدٌ (١) ٱللَّهُ ٱلصَّمَدُ (٢) لَمۡ يَلِدۡ وَلَمۡ يُولَدۡ (٣) وَلَمۡ يَكُن لَّهُ ۥ ڪُفُوًا أَحَدٌ (٤)
In the name of God, Most Gracious, Most Merciful
Say: He is Allah, the One and Only!
Allah, the Eternal, Absolute;
He begetteth not nor is He begotten.
And there is none like unto Him.

Actually science as we know it today owes a huge debt to Islam. Research that. Also the Qur'an is not a book of science. It's a book of signs. The fact that no one even had the technology to try and confirm the scientific statements of the Qur'an until recently is a huge sign and should part you from your satire. For some reason however you seem to be stuck on this topic of bathroom etiquette. Well, I have conducted some research of my own. Something simple. I looked up the definition of obsession and it is as follows; the domination of one's thoughts or feelings by a persistent idea, image, desire, etc. Now the keyword here sir is DOMINATION. Look deeper into Prophet Muhammads (PBUH) life and you'll see that this subject matter you cant let go of is virtually nowhere on his list of accomplishments. And on to the other half of my research. I looked up the word etiquette which is as follows;conventional requirements as to social behavior; proprieties of conduct as established in any class or community or for any occasion. I'm not going to confine this to a debate about bathroom etiquette seeing that you seem to be unknowing or confused about its very definition by calling it obsession. If you have any real issues with Islam let us deal with them. Maybe I can help to clear them up or maybe I can't but I am willing to try sir. And that goes for anyone else who took the time out to comment on your post. If you feel it is the truth you are upon then share it with me. I feel Islam is the truth and I would love for you to continue to try and punch wholes in it but give me the opportunity for rebuttal. Thanks for reading.
Sun Jun 24, 10:13:00 AM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
So you don't dispute the content of my post then Yahya? All of the 27 items on my list are accurate descriptions of Muhammad's bathroom instructions?
Sun Jun 24, 10:23:00 AM 2012 
 Yahya Abdul-Baseir said...
Well brother, I'd love to feed you with answers to your questions but how about you tackle some of the issues I have raised first and then i'll answer that question. Thank you in advance for your response.
Sun Jun 24, 11:20:00 AM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
My post was about Muhammad's bathroom rules, Yahya. If you don't want to talk about that, I understand. I wouldn't either if I were you.
Sun Jun 24, 11:24:00 AM 2012 
 Yahya Abdul-Baseir said...
Sir, I did address your post exposing your inability to differentiate between obsession and etiquette. ;-) After further reviewing your post I have seen one repeat, a category that could have been coupled but you chose to seperate to drag out whatever it is your trying to do here as well as something that had nothing to do with bathroom instructions not to mention a false claim. If you want me to agree with your "27" points then try and list 27 references from either the Qur'an or the Sahih Hadith for validation. Now, looking at the valid information you have posted I'd like to know what person of sense would find any of it irrational. So basically the valid points you have listed in your reference to how muslims have been instructed to use the bathroom can be broken down into three categories: 1. Cleanliness 2. Respect and 3. Modesty. Bathroom floors are not known for being sanitary. Wash your private part after using the restroom. If anyone holds anything of value who's going to address it while on the toilet. And the aspects of modesty I hope you will perhaps mature into one day. Thank you for reading.
Sun Jun 24, 12:00:00 PM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Thanks, Yahya. So my list is accurate, so far as you know. That's great.
Sun Jun 24, 12:13:00 PM 2012 
 Yahya Abdul-Baseir said...
It is apparant that you didn't read past the first sentence in my last post my dear brother. I hope that your readers don't suffer from the same affliction (of speaking on a statement in which they did not take the time to read in its entirety). With all due respect I noticed that your readers followed up your ignorance with more ignorance. Inshaa Allah/God Willing, I hope that your lack of understanding has been exposed and this is why they are choosing to remain silent. If anyone would like to gain a further understanding of Islam and its practices please just ask someone with a clue. Refer to my blog with any of your questions. http://yahya1610.blogspot.com/ Good day to all.
Sun Jun 24, 12:42:00 PM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Yahya said: "Inshaa Allah/God Willing, I hope that your lack of understanding has been exposed."
But you didn't expose anything, Yahya. If anything, you validated my post by failing to point out a single mistake on my part. Thanks, and good luck in the bathroom. (But watch out for those male and female devils!)
Sun Jun 24, 12:55:00 PM 2012 
 prakash mv said...
hahaha...interesting article... and looks very funny... :D
Thu Jul 26, 02:28:00 AM 2012 
 Abdurrahman said...
Hi Steve. I just wanted to point out that the link in your references (link 1) appears to contain a lot of material that is not cited and is unfamiliar to me as a student of Islam. As you probably know, within Islamic scholarship there are some Prophetic Traditions (Hadith) that are considered weak or unreliable due to poor sourcing. There are many examples of in your post of practices that are based on such unreliable sources (ex. covering the head to use the bathroom) and some that are cultural practices or exaggeration of what is required (milking one's self after urinating). Of course, the overall premise of the post, that Muslims are crazy for being concerned with such things, is not changed by such details; I just want to ensure that your mockery of our religion is based on it's merits, not on things not fairly attributed to it. My perspective as a Muslim is that these details you cite are examples of how a Muslim is constantly conscious of God throughout the day, even in otherwise mundane actions. There are supplications that can be said when getting dressed, when entering/exiting the house, when it rains too much, when it does not rain enough, even before intimate relations with one's spouse! Again, for a Muslim the best thing that we can do in life is "dhikr" or remembrance/reflection of God. In that light, maybe you can understand how someone who has a life goal of remembering and connecting to God as much as possible, despite how silly you may consider that, would look for as many opportunities as possible to mention Him, even in the most mundane aspects of life. The Qur'an has a passage that states "And the remembrance of God is greater (than all things/is the highest aim)" (29:45).
Mon Aug 06, 02:34:00 AM 2012 
 komal mahmood said...
As Muslims we are not supposed to bad mouth anyone, hurt anyones feelings and are supposed to respect all religion, then i wonder how we can be bad....when you run around naked, your women dont cover their privates and are most certainly looked upon by most men as whores....where Islam protects its women from the wicked sight of any man....then how can we be savages....and i am truly amazed out of the entire Quran all you could come up with was this.....did you know that sun has its own orbit, something scientists are proving in the twenty first century but Allah revealed it more than 1400 years ago....truly i look at you and i realize that metaphor IGNORANCE IS A BLISS....besides you clean your shit with toilet paper....and recent research reveals that you unbelievers are mostly to die of bacteria and aids and whatnot.....where as muslims and jews and christians in short believers have longer ages....you truly do live in a world of your own, I suggest you wake up because Time is very near and may Allah grant you guidance and give you peace Ammen, however Allah has also said in the Quran Surah Baqarah "Then your hearts became hardened after that, being like stones or even harder. For indeed, there are stones from which rivers burst forth, and there are some of them that split open and water comes out, and there are some of them that fall down for fear of Allah . And Allah is not unaware of what you do." (Quran 2:74) which means if Allah has willed then you will never see the light.....and you are cursed to forever burn in the depths of Hell....
Fri Aug 24, 11:02:00 PM 2012 
 raif110 said...
I dont make fun of your religion - Dont make fun of mine.
Plus I think the stupidest thing to do it to fight over matters like religion or politics on the internet.


Wed Sep 19, 02:02:00 AM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
raif: "I dont make fun of your religion."
I have no religion, raif. That's what makes it so fun for me. I get to make fun of everyone's religion, but no one can make fun of mine.
Wed Sep 19, 07:36:00 AM 2012 
 Steed Martin said...
Kormal Mahmoud and others...I have read the Quran and could find no science there. If there was why haven't Islamic Scientists been able to invent anything for over 500 years..do they not understand or read the Quran? As a test, please can you tell me when the next Quranic invention is coming out? I read the bit that Mohammed predicted Quntum Physics but the line was so unspecific he could have been inventing r talking about anything.
Let's also talk about the. Big bang that Mohammed and Allah told the world about. If you know Toaism you would know that they say "first there was nothing and then there was everything" and this was thousands of years before the Quran. So is the non-God of Toaism the dad of Allah?
Tue Oct 09, 08:19:00 AM 2012 
 JelloSmooters said...
omg! These were hilarious! I can understand why people would be offended, but in all honesty, that's the beauty of the internet. People can voice their opinions much like the people who disagree with those opinions, can voice theirs. These were wonderfully written along with your responses, those were quite hilarious too!
Mon Dec 17, 10:24:00 PM 2012 
 lovemuslimah said...
Let's take this point by point, shall we?
1.) "Now it's true that Allah doesn't provide much bathroom guidance in the Quran, although there is this bit of helpful advice: Quran 5:6"
Well, this is the entire verse:
O you who believe! When you intend to offer As-Salāt (the prayer), wash your faces and your hands (forearms) up to the elbows, rub (by passing wet hands over) your heads, and (wash) your feet up to ankles. If you are in a state of Janāba (i.e. had a sexual discharge), purify yourself (bathe your whole body). But if you are ill or on a journey or any of you comes from answering the call of nature, or you have been in contact with women (i.e. sexual intercourse) and you find no water, then perform Tayammum with clean earth and rub therewith your faces and hands. Allāh does not want to place you in difficulty, but He wants to purify you, and to complete His Favour on you that you may be thankful. (Al-Ma'idah 5:6)
So this shows us what breaks the ablution that Muslims must have before prayer.
2.) "And so does Muhammad (PB&J be upon him). He was absolutely obsessed with it. Here is what he had to say...."
The Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) didn't actually say that. It was a polytheist saying that to Salman al-Farsi (a companion of the Prophet) mockingly. Here's the full hadeeth:
Salman said that (one among) the polytheists remarked: I see that your friend even teaches you about the excrement. He replied; Yes, he has in fact forbidden us that anyone amongst us should cleanse himself with his right hand, or face the Qibla. He has forbidden the use of dung or bone for it, and he has also instructed us not to use less than three pebbles (for this purpose).
3.) As for your list, 1, 2, 3, and 4 are all fine. 6 actually ties in with 4 (the purpose of that rule was for the sake of modesty).
As for 5, I'm not sure about that. I think it might be the opinion of some Muslims, but not all (or even most).
7 is correct - we are to avoid as much as possible facing the direction of our prayers or turning our back to it when urinating or defecating. It's a sign of respect.
Thu Jan 03, 02:57:00 PM 2013 
 lovemuslimah said...
8 and 9 are also correct. We use our left for removing impurities.
10 is true. We do most things in odd numbers.
11, 12, and 13 I've never heard of.
14 is referring to Muslims. Disbelievers have punishments for a lot worse than urine. For disbelievers, the punishment in the grave is only the beginning of eternity in Hell. For the sinful Muslims who died without repenting, the punishment in the grave only serves to decrease the sins so that they can go to Paradise once they're purified.
Never heard of 15-20. It seems you took it from a somewhat dubious site....or a site that only a certain segment of Muslims follow.
21, if you look at the source you provided from islam-qa (what you have in your footnotes as "2"), it shows that it's disliked to speak unnecessarily while answering the call of nature. And if you were being honest, the link shows that "one should not greet a person who is answering the call of nature, or return a greeting whilst one is answering the call of nature, out of respect to Allaah by not mentioning His name in a dirty place." [Translator’s note: the Islamic greeting is “al-salaam ‘alaykum (peace be upon you)”; one of the names of Allaah is al-Salaam (the Peace)].
22 is correct. We don't clean ourselves with bones or dung (gross?) and we are told to make sure we are clean (thus the command of using sufficient material).
23 is also taken from that dubious site.
You already mentioned 24 in point 1.
25 & 26 - yep. Both true. However, unlike other religions (and unlike mythologies), we do not have certain gods for certain things. Our Lord is our Lord in all things. And we have prayers for just about everything. Leaving the house, entering the house, greeting someone, leaving someone, ascending, descending, traveling, breaking a fast, settling a debt, for rain, for anxiety or sorrow, etc. Here's a link to show you the supplications we make that come from the Qur'aan/sunnah: http://makedua.com/
27 - a.) where does it say "any" of these rules? Because I don't see it.
b.) Devils can possess people any moment when a person's faith is weak (and they don't know the proper way to keep jinn away).



And maybe you work/learn slowly, but none of this takes up much time.
Also, I'm proud of my religion being so complete & perfect. God has told us everything we need to know.
Thu Jan 03, 02:57:00 PM 2013 
 Al Mas said...
Hmmm...almost all of what you quoted are from one or more of the collections of sayings attributed to the Prophet.
These were put together about a 100 odd years or more after the passing of the Prophet, so you can imagine just how reliable they are not only in the actual words used, but the context.
How do you convey context after 100 odd years? What if the Prophet was directing something at an illiterate desert dweller? What if he is being tonque-in-cheek?
What basically you have demonstrated is the unreliability of these hadiths though various Muslim scholars through the ages have tried their best to sieve the unreliable from the reliable.
I think if would be more fruitful if we just focus on the Quran itself for purposes of critiqueing Islam. The hadith is a distraction best left to practising Muslims, in my opinion.
As an aside, you are aware of the toilet habits of Europe as late as the Middle Ages aren't you?

Sun Feb 03, 03:44:00 PM 2013 
 Steve Wells said...
Al Mas:
Hmmm...almost all of what you quoted are from one or more of the collections of sayings attributed to the Prophet.
That's true. The quotes in the post are from the hadith -- sayings or acts of Muhammad that most Muslims consider essential to interpreting and applying the Quran in their daily lives.
These were put together about a 100 odd years or more after the passing of the Prophet, so you can imagine just how reliable they are not only in the actual words used, but the context.
Yes, of course, the hadith is complete bullshit, just ilike the Quran. But it is believed to be true by nearly all of the 1.3 billion or so Muslims that are living today.
I think if would be more fruitful if we just focus on the Quran itself for purposes of critiqueing Islam. The hadith is a distraction best left to practising Muslims, in my opinion.
Since the hadith is considered essential to Islam by modern Muslims, it should be considered essential to an evaluation of Islam.
As an aside, you are aware of the toilet habits of Europe as late as the Middle Ages aren't you?
No, not really. But whatever they might have been, they are irrelevant to modern Christians, while Muhammad's bizarre bathroom obsessions still plague the Muslim world.
Mon Feb 04, 12:54:00 PM 2013 
 mike said...
Steve,
I Know you will be a muslim one Day
if you r invistigating islam this deep then you r to be muslim soon.. congratulations!!
Islam is a thoroughly detailed way of life, it is the complete Manual( directory) from God on how to operate this God created Machine ( which is human)..
the amazing details about how to go bathroom, how to sleep and when, how /much to eat and what and what not to eat..etc all completely acomply with science and health.
which can never happen unless this a divinly inspired to mohammed by the only God, the Creator of All
Mon Feb 11, 06:40:00 AM 2013 
 terriclark said...
I laughed so hard I peed on myself!
Fri Feb 15, 11:02:00 AM 2013 
 dreas seef said...
I wonder whatv would happen if i pee 'd completely naked on the black cube of saturn at mecca. Also people said their god is so great cause he tells tgyou everything. Well not wiping your bum with poo is um. Idk common sense? I mean why would you wipe poo with poo? Gods people must be dumb. Or as my sweet grandma used to say dumb dumb.
Fri May 03, 06:28:00 AM 2013 
 Fred Howard said...
Steve
in your earlier comments you try and make it sound like you heavily researched the topic When writing the article...
loveMuslima gave a detailed response to your article pointing out Where you made errors and Where possibly you just made things up, most likely because you probably thought the rules actually make Sense and felt you had to add things to mock it. Im Curious to why you have not responded to loveMuslima's Comments?
You Seem to have responded to all other Muslim Comments which in all fairness did not make their points very clear.
Have you not responded to Lovemuslima's comments because What he / she wrote is the actual truth and the version you wrote in your article was just you being a bit of an idiot?
Sun Jun 09, 08:34:00 PM 2013 
 A Spade's a spade said...
Fred:
Seriously? Are you a dhimmi or what? Steve's article brilliantly points out the many inanities that the religion of piss puts forth regarding going to the toilet. Ms. lovemuslimah tries to refute the article by saying some of those inanities are correct and others come from “dubious” sites. Who cares as to which one is "authentic" or "reliable" or not? Muslim always like to point at certain hadith as not authentic, while claiming that others are. Some Muslims don't believe in following the traditions of the hadith (probably because they're more shocking in nature than the Quran is!). Who cares? The point is, as the article title clearly states, that Islam is obsessed with bodily functions... like going to the bathroom. But its even more obsessed with sex.
BTW, poor Ms. lovemuslimah is deluded, brainwashed Muslim. She’s “proud of her religion being so complete and perfect.” Yeah, well then she’s a perfect example of why ol’ Mohammed said that women were deficient in religion and intelligence. (Bukhari 1:6:301). Or maybe Ms. lovemuslimah thinks that hadith is “dubious”?
And maybe little Ms. lovemuslimah is also proud of the fact that her husband can beat her—and edict from Allah himself. (This is NOT a hadith, read Quran 4:34 and 38:44.) There are many hadith that certainly prove that the Prophet and his companions took these verses to heart.
I’m sure Ms. lovemuslimah can hardly conceal her pride in the fact that Mohammed was a pedophile, consummating (i.e., raping) a nine-year-old girl, Aisha, whom he had married when she was six. He was 52. Nice!
And yes, Ms. lovemuslimah is also SO proud that men can take up to four wives, and have all the sex slaves they want. They’re also allowed to rape captive women, and take them as slaves. After all, Mohammed, the most perfect example of humankind, did it himself. (Hey, jihad anyone?)
Oh, yeah, thank Allah that Mohammed only advocated for FGM to be done “not too deep”... but only because it’s better for the husband (or if your a slave, your master).
I guess ol’ Mohammed was right, but only partially: women ARE deficient in religion and intelligence... but just the Muslim women.
Ms. lovemuslimah, if you read this, I’ll be happy to quote all the sources here. Or you can educate yourself. You must be lucky enough to live in Europe or in the North America. But you’re an idiot if you can still be proud of your religion if you’re okay with everything I’ve talked about above. Your prophet and religion has relegated your worth as a human to your vagina. Prove me wrong.
Anyway Fred, not to put too much of a fine point on it, but STFU unless you know what you’re talking about. No offense, of course.
Tue Jun 25, 11:09:00 AM 2013 
 ستایش said...
Hello!
I am s Muslim and I am proud that we have such regulations and a lot more than that.

Sun Jul 14, 02:49:00 PM 2013 
 rija adnan said...
I am sorry but I can't see a problem with Islam teaching you hygeinic and practical toilet etiquettes
Wed Jul 17, 10:24:00 AM 2013 
 rija adnan said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Thu Jul 18, 08:01:00 AM 2013 
 rija adnan said...
When somebody researches about Islamic teachings regarding one aspect of life he may think that Islam is mostly about that only but he fails to realise that Islam provides guidance in many many aspects of life and that is why Muslims call it a complete way of life and any person Muslim or not who has a sound knowledge about Islam would know that Islam is not at all mostly about toilet rules if the ratio of these etiquettes is taken to the rest of Islam hence the writers claim that Islam is mostly about toilet etiquettes is false and absurd
These ettiquettes are an important but small part of Islam
For those who don't know islam is mainly about submitting your will to Allah by doing what He commands e.g. by doing things that are good for you and the Society and forbidding evil and enjoining good all in hope of receiving reward from Allah and not for material gains
Thu Jul 18, 08:18:00 AM 2013 
 rija adnan said...
Steed martin quran is a book of signs not science however the scientific accuracy in it is a. Sign read this: http://www.everymuslim.co.za/index.php/articles-menu/islamic-medicine-menu/1198-quran-and-modern-science--dr-zakir-naik
Thu Jul 18, 08:36:00 AM 2013 
 A Spade's a spade said...
As usual, Muslims make excuses for the inanities of their regulations. I see that the people who have commented lately are happy for the rules and regulations... I guess they're convinced that they need these to live a good life: Who cares if you use your right hand or your left hand, as long as you clean them afterwards? How can not facing Mecca when you take a shit be good for society? And really, the "prophet" had to tell his followers to use three stones to clean your behinds instead of say, two? One? Why not five? Obviously they're so brainwashed they can't see the ridiculousness of this "hygienic" regulations.
Islam is not a religion, it's a fascist political belief with Allah (the pagan moon god of the area) thrown in to make it enforceable. It was started by a narcissist, delusional, pedophile warlord who needed people to worship him. Yes: worship. How many times does it say in the Koran that if you don't obey Allah AND the prophet you are doomed? Funny how Allah always gave Mohammed what he wanted: plenty of booty and women.
To stay on point: the only way for narcissist to function is to get people do even the most mundane things a certain way, hence all the regulations. Other major religions are more concerned with the spiritual aspects of life, and while certain rules are put forth to ensure the health and good of society in general, these religions wisely don't go into the minutia of living—because they're not fascist ideologies that must control every aspect of living (which is what Mohammed wanted: complete control... and he got it).
And WHATEVER on the "scientific accuracy" of the Koran... more apologist BS... There is NO science in the Koran.
Thu Jul 18, 08:52:00 AM 2013 
 Sasha Kimi said...
I guess these verses are a smokescreen. By having these outrageous fetishes, God is trying to test how good a blind believer you will be . I am a Hindu so I'm just guessing!!
Thu Aug 22, 07:53:00 AM 2013 
 A Spade's a spade said...
Sasha, my thoughts are that The Eternal wants us to be wise, to know the truth. That means being skeptical and to question—so that you can find the truth. In Islam, you aren't allowed to question. You must follow blindly. It demands you be a robot to ritual. It in fact, demands that you be a slave. Why would God need slaves?
Quite the antithesis to other religions. Oh... that's because Islam is not really a religion... it's a cult.
Thu Aug 22, 09:36:00 AM 2013 
 faisy wish said...
The Prophet Muhammad (saas), whom Allah tells us in the Holy Qur’an He sent as a “Mercy to the Worlds,” abided by Islamic moral values with the utmost joy and enthusiasm right up to the end of his life, a life which constituted a role model for others.
Islamic matrimonial
Sun Aug 25, 09:41:00 PM 2013 
 A Spade's a spade said...
At the end of Mohammed's life—on his death bed!—he was exhorting his followers to kill Christians and Jews. Yes, he was following the moon god Allah. Moral values? Yes, raping and pillaging are morally okay in Islam, and old Mo did it with gusto. Yes, faisy wish, what a role model!!
Mon Aug 26, 08:57:00 AM 2013 
 Mohammad Tariq said...
this is very bias and you should consider something unbias AND not full of hatespeech like
http://islamicsystem.blogspot.co.uk/2005/12/why-are-you-muslim.html
Sat Sep 14, 10:33:00 AM 2013 
 A Spade's a spade said...
M. Tariq: Hate speech? You mean facts are hate speech? I guess it's only hate speech when it's non-Muslims criticizing Mohammed, but it's not hate speech when Muslims talk about killing all Jews. Like Mohammed wanted told Muslims to do. Or subject Christians and Jews to jizyah. Whatever. Cry me a river.
And ha! You want us to consider something unbiased so you posted an Islamic site...You realize how biased that is, right?
Sat Sep 14, 12:02:00 PM 2013 
 Zarathustra said...
This is a lot of 'SHIT' to remember!!!!
Sun Sep 15, 09:27:00 AM 2013 
 srizals said...
Washing your hands makes you HAPPIER: Cleaning boosts our confidence and washes away feelings of failure
Study found that the ritual of cleaning makes us more optimistic after failure
People were also more confident they could complete the task the next time
Previous research found hand washing made people feel more comfortable about decisions they had made

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-2476507/How-washing-hands-makes-HAPPIER-Cleaning-boosts-confidence-washes-away-feelings-failure.html#ixzz2iukySDlp
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook
Sun Oct 27, 02:50:00 AM 2013 
 A Spade's a spade said...
srizals: What does washing your hands have to do with this conversation?
Sun Oct 27, 10:00:00 AM 2013 
 Andrea Trunzo said...
I'd love to see you approach a Muslim and ask them about bathroom etiquette face to face..... lol but I doubt you will ever do that, because you're just like rest who hide behind their computer and say nonsense!!!!
May Allah guide you ;-)
Thu Jan 02, 04:27:00 PM 2014 
 Steve Wells said...
Andrea said: "I'd love to see you approach a Muslim and ask them about bathroom etiquette face to face."
How would they react? Like I'd drawn a cartoon of Muhammad?
"You're just like rest who hide behind their computer and say nonsense!!!!"
Did I say something incorrect about Muslim bathroom behavior? If so, please correct me. If not, why do you call it "nonsense"?
Thu Jan 02, 10:00:00 PM 2014 
 backoffice ij said...
Religion is like a school. No one can force you to join a certain school but once you join, you have to follow certain rules. There are many things which outsiders can't understand. Same is the case with Islam, if you don't study it completely, you would misunderstand many things because every rule or way in islam is interlinked with others.
Some rules are for physical health (eg hygiene rules etc), Some are for a healthy soul (saying prayers,supplications etc).
Never following rules, making fun of what is honorable to others; you call it 'freedom' but I call it ' death of soul',
Sun Feb 02, 03:00:00 PM 2014 
 islam said...
i ask allah to give you understanding may he give you so much love for islam that you would be in the forefront amen may allah turn you and your families to islam may allah bless you all
Tue Apr 15, 10:39:00 AM 2014 
 shubbee shamsudin said...
May Allah, in whose hand is our heart is, guide you and show up the beauty of islam! amin. If you go out in the world wanting to believe/see only negative things then that is all you see. I hope your world is not filled with negativity but rather with love and mercy and genuine desire to learn about whatever you research. May God's peace be with you!
Mon Apr 21, 03:55:00 PM 2014 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 15 January 2012Tebow 136: God's message from last night's game
In last week's overtime win against the Steelers, Tim Tebow threw for 316 yards. And, of course, believers everywhere immediately knew that God was trying to tell us all something.
You see, God carefully arranged (fixed) the game so that Tebow's passing yards would match the numbers of his favorite verse -- the only verse that he and his followers seem to know or care much about -- John 3:16.
God, it seems, likes to communicate using Tim Tebow's stats.
So what was God saying in last night's game against the Patriots?
Well, God is really into passing yardage, and last night Tebow passed for 136 yards.
Which could only mean one thing: God wants us all to read and obey a particular Bible verse involving the digits in the number 136.
After a careful check of the Bible, I think I know what verse God had in mind: Deuteronomy 13:6 (and following verses).
Here's what God says in the passage beginning with that verse:
13:6 If thy brother, the son of thy mother, or thy son, or thy daughter, or the wife of thy bosom, or thy friend, which is as thine own soul, entice thee secretly, saying, Let us go and serve other gods, which thou hast not known, thou, nor thy fathers;
13:8 Thou shalt not consent unto him, nor hearken unto him; neither shall thine eye pity him, neither shalt thou spare, neither shalt thou conceal him:
13:9 But thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people.
13:10 And thou shalt stone him with stones, that he die.
God wants us to stone to death our family and friends, without pity (God hates pity), if they encourage us to worship the wrong god. (Which, of course, would include any Mormons, Catholics, Jews, Muslims, etc.)
I can't wait to see Tebow's eye-black for next season's opening game!

Posted by Steve Wells at 1/15/2012 02:54:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
15 comments:
 Erp said...
Matthew 13:6 13:6 And when the sun was up, they were scorched; and because they had no root, they withered away.
Sun Jan 15, 03:36:00 PM 2012 
 skanksta said...
He is soooo nauseating.
Sun Jan 15, 04:46:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
And doesn't Leviticus have implications for football? For example:
5:2 Or if a soul touch any unclean thing, whether it be a carcase of an unclean beast, or a carcase of unclean cattle, or the carcase of unclean creeping things, and if it be hidden from him; he also shall be unclean, and guilty.
In case there's confusion about what is unclean, Levie says this:
11:7 And the swine, though he divide the hoof, and be clovenfooted, yet he cheweth not the cud; he is unclean to you.
11:8 Of their flesh shall ye not eat, and their carcase shall ye not touch; they are unclean to you.
Even though footballs are made of cow leather, not actual pig carcase (http://ask.yahoo.com/20070417.html), you'd think Tebow would consider it his mission to get people to stop referring to the football as a "pigskin".
Mon Jan 16, 07:48:00 AM 2012 
 curious cuber said...
Well, at one point the broncos had 13 plays for negative yardage and the patriots had 6 touchdowns. If you jumble that up you get 316 also. Spooky!
Mon Jan 16, 03:20:00 PM 2012 
 Tom Sheepandgoats said...
entice thee secretly, saying, Let us go and serve other gods...
well, he has served the football god, though I guess not secretly. He doesn't do the bible god any favors, I don't think, to present that one as someone indifferent to injustice,mayhem, depravity & so forth, but who never misses a game, tweaking each team for winners and losers.
Mon Jan 16, 07:00:00 PM 2012 
 MARIOLANDblog said...
Maybe he meant Genesis 3:16 "Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee."
I think so, because another 3:16, 2 Timothy 3:16 "All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness"
Tue Jan 17, 01:48:00 PM 2012 
 LG said...
Not only did he throw 316 yards, the TV ratings peaked at 31.6. (http://www.webcitation.org/64e9Qo3sk)
Coincidence? I think not.
Wed Jan 18, 07:44:00 AM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
You're right, LG. God fiddled with the game to make Tebow's stats match his favorite Bible verse.
Is there anything too stupid for believers to believe?
Wed Jan 18, 08:35:00 AM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Good point, MARIOLANDblog!
Why do believers automatically assume God is referring to John 3:16?
Why not Genesis 3:16, as you suggest? Or Leviticus 3:16, which says "All the fat is the Lord's"? Lord knows he likes his fat, and he's just not getting enough anymore.
Or maybe it was Isaiah 3:16 that God had in mind when rigging the game. "The LORD saith, Because the daughters of Zion are haughty, and walk with stretched forth necks and wanton eyes, walking and mincing as they go, and making a tinkling with their feet." God can't stand to see haughty women, with their necks all stretched out and little tinkling thingies on their feet. It just creeps him out.
Or it could be Numbers 3:16, which shows who really counts in God's eyes: males over one month old. He doesn't give a damn about females of any age, males less one month old, and all fetuses, male or female.
Or maybe it was Job 3:16 or Lamentations 3:16. Or maybe God, like most of his followers, only knows one verse: John 3:16 .
Thu Jan 19, 10:55:00 AM 2012 
 Ian said...
Tebow completed 9 of his 26 passing attempts in that game, and I found Surah 9:26 in the Quran:
Then Allah sent His peace of reassurance down upon His messenger and upon the believers, and sent down hosts ye could not see, and punished those who disbelieved. Such is the reward of disbelievers.
Obviously, Tebow was telling me to become a Muslim with his performance in the loss to the Patriots.
Mon Jan 23, 06:10:00 PM 2012 
 Cujo600 said...
The reason one would assume the 316 refers to John 3:16 is something neither the author nor any of his publications have: common sense.
Whether this was a triple coincidence by God (316 yards, 31.6 average, 31.6 tv ratings) or not, who knows, but you certainly haven't proven anything by implying it's ridiculous to think so, dear friend
Fri Jan 27, 02:15:00 PM 2012 
 Cujo600 said...
To Ian: Tebow never had Quran references on him, sorry to disappoint you. Nice try though!
Fri Jan 27, 02:16:00 PM 2012 
 Anders said...
There idea of dividing the text into chapters and verses is very modern, it wasn't in the original scrolls, but I guess god keeps up with the times
But if everything is 31.6, why make it 3.16? Is there a divine ordinance that ye shalt divide all that is football by 10, that ye might know the truth? Why not Proverbs 31.6:
Give strong drink unto him that is ready to perish, and wine unto those that be of heavy hearts.
In other words, god is telling the losing team's fans to go out and get hammered
Sat Jan 28, 12:19:00 PM 2012 
 JustJoeP said...
I look forward to Tebow performing as mercurially as another erratic quarterback before him, Rex Grossman. Both could exhibit excellent technique when luck (or Gawd) was smiling upon them, but in the long run, it didn't really matter. On average, they are mediocre talents. Look at how awesomely Grossman did this year, for example. At least Rex didn't have the stupid sense to credit gawd for his wins and losses.
Sat Jan 28, 01:13:00 PM 2012 
 Armchair Preacher said...
Could've meant Genesis 3:16.
Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.
God curses womankind with the labor of childbirth and eternal subjugation by men. A real crowdpleaser for the guys.
Sat Feb 04, 05:44:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 25 February 2012Who had the most powerful spit: Jesus or Muhammad?
This is an important question.
Luckily, the gospels and Ash-Shifa can answer it for us. (Ash-Shifa is a 12th century biography of Muhammad that is considered authoritative throughout the Muslim world.)
Let's take Jesus' spit first.
In Mark's gospel, Jesus cured a deaf man by putting some of his holy spit on the deaf man's tongue.
And they bring unto him one that was deaf, and had an impediment in his speech ... And he ... put his fingers into his ears, and he spit, and touched his tongue ... And straightway his ears were opened, and the string of his tongue was loosed, and he spake plain. Mark 7:32-35
And he cured a blind man by spitting on (or in) his eyes.
And they bring a blind man unto him ... And ... he ... spit on his eyes [and] asked him if he saw ought. And he looked up, and said, I see men as trees, walking. After that he put his hands again upon his eyes, and made him look up: and he was restored, and saw every man clearly. Mark 8:22-25
The only other gospel that mentions Jesus' spit is John, which says that another blind man (or was it the same one?) was cured with mud made with Jesus spit followed by a holy water bath.
And as Jesus passed by, he saw a man which was blind from his birth. And his disciples asked him, saying, Master, who did sin, this man, or his parents, that he was born blind? Jesus answered, Neither hath this man sinned, nor his parents: but that the works of God should be made manifest in him .... When he had thus spoken, he spat on the ground, and made clay of the spittle, and he anointed the eyes of the blind man with the clay, And said unto him, Go, wash in the pool of Siloam ... He ... washed, and came seeing. John 9:1-7
Now let's consider the spit of the Prophet Muhammad (PB&J be upon him).
(All quotes are taken from Ash-Shifa.)
Just like Jesus, Muhammad cured blind and deaf people by spitting in their eyes or ears.
Habib, either the son of Fudayk or Furayk's said that his father's eyes became so white that he had no vision at all. The Messenger of Allah, praise and peace be upon him, blew some of his saliva in to his eyes whereupon his vision was immediately restored. He was even seen threading a needle at the age of eighty! (p. 188)
At the Battle of Khybar, Ali's eyes became very painful. The Prophet, praise and peace be upon him, blew some of his saliva on them and they were immediately healed. (p. 188)
A lady from Khuth'am had a child who was mute. The Prophet, praise and peace be upon him, asked for some water to be brought with which he rinsed his mouth and washed hands. Then he gave it to the mother and told her to wash the child and wipe him with it. The mother did as the Prophet, praise and peace be upon him, had said and the child was no longer mute and had an intellect superior to most people. (p. 189)
And like Moses, he could make water miraculously appear. But he didn't have to strike a rock with his rod or even speak to the rock. He did it all with his spit.
At Hudaybiyah, we are told by Al Bara', there were approximately 14,000 men, and the water well they found was insufficient to provide for even fifty sheep. The Companions crowded around the well until not one single drop remained. Then, the Messenger of Allah, praise and peace be upon him, came and sat beside it and a pail was brought to him in which he blew some of his saliva and supplicated. Salama reported that he either supplicated or blew some of his salvia in it whereupon water gushed forth and there was sufficient water for themselves and enough to fill their containers. (p. 170)
Like Jesus, Muhammad cured people with mud made with his own spit. But Muhammad's muddy spit treatment was administered orally rather than topically.
Mula'ib's son suffered from an edema of water fluid, and sent a messenger to the Prophet, praise and peace be upon him, to tell him of his condition. The Prophet, praise and peace be upon him, took some dust from the ground, blew some of his salvia upon it and gave to the Mula'ib's messenger who was amazed and took it fearing that he would be laughed at. He returned to Mulai'b's son who was now on the verge of death and gave it to him. He consumed it and Allah cured him.
And Muhammad's spit, unlike Jesus', cured more than just blind and deaf people. It also worked on burn and hernia patients.
There was a lady who brought her possessed son to the Prophet, praise and peace be upon, and Abbas' son tells us that the Prophet, praise and peace be upon him, stroked his chest whereupon the child vomited something that resembled a black puppy and was immediately cured. We are also told of the time Muhammad, Hatim's son was a child and a boiling pot overturned on his arm, the Prophet, praise and peace be upon him, stroked it, supplicated, then blew some of his salvia on it and it was immediately healed. (p. 189)
A man came to him suffering from a hernia. He instructed that it be sprinkled with water from a spring into which he had blown some saliva. After this had been carried out the man was cured. (p. 196)
Bad mannered girls behave much better after eating food from Muhammad's mouth. (There's nothing like this in the gospels.)
A girl who was in the service of the Prophet, praise and peace be upon him, asked him for some food when he was eating and as he never refused anyone anything he gave her what was in front of him. The girl was persistent and said, "I want the food in your mouth." So he gave her what was in his mouth. After she had swallowed it, she became well mannered and the change was apparent for all to see, and she became among the most well mannered girls of Medina. (p. 189)
Many soldiers were completely healed by rubbing Muhammad spit on their wounds. (Something similar occurred during Jesus' arrest, when a man with a severed ear was restored by Jesus' touch. But since no spit was involved, it doesn't count in the holy spit competition.)
Abu Sa'id Al Khudri said that the Prophet, praise and peace, be upon him, put some of his saliva on the mark made by the arrow on the Day of Dhu Qarad and Abu Katada told him that it neither throbbed nor yet became infected. (p. 187)
During the Battle of Uhud, Kulthum Hussain's son was shot in his throat. The Messenger of Allah, praise and peace be upon him, blew some of his saliva upon it and it healed immediately. Abdullah, Anies' son was also among those injured during the encounter and sustained a wound to his head, once again the Prophet, praise and peace be upon him, blew some of his saliva upon it and it did not turn septic. (p. 188)
Salama, Al Akwa's son sustained a wound to his thigh during the battle and a similar miracle occurred whereby he too was immediately healed. (p. 188)
And finally, and most impressively, Muhammad cured amputees with his spit. (Not even God can do that!)
It was during the Battle of Badr that Abu Jahl severed the hand of Mu'awwidh, Afra's son. Mu'awwidh went to the Prophet, praise and peace be upon him carrying his severed hand, whereupon the Prophet, praise and peace be upon him, blew some of his saliva on it, replaced it was immediately miraculously rejoined to his arm. It was during the same battle Wahb's son tells us that Khubaby, Yasaf's son was severely struck on the neck and half of it was severed. The Messenger of Allah, praise and peace be upon him, blew his salvia upon it and it was immediately healed. (p. 188-9)
So Muhammad wins the holy spit contest. I guess we should all convert to Islam. (What more evidence could anyone ever ask for?)
Posted by Steve Wells at 2/25/2012 10:10:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
10 comments:
 Nathan said...
But could either of them spit like Gaston?
Sat Feb 25, 05:04:00 PM 2012 
 The Wise Fool said...
Holy spit! That's hilarious!
Thanks for taking on this challenging question. :-)
Sat Feb 25, 06:09:00 PM 2012 
 Mormon411 said...
Are you a former Mormon?
"Dwindling in Unbelief" is a quote right out of the Book of Mormon.
Sun Feb 26, 06:14:00 AM 2012 
 Stephen said...
For those who did not appreciate Nathan's question, the relevant holy text is below. Although Gaston seems to lack the healing abilities of Jesus and Mo, he certainly has more power and range; that is probably equally impressive to the right type of mind. ;-)
As to the question, "nobody spits like Gaston". Settled.
Steve Weeks

No one fights like Gaston
Douses lights like Gaston
In a wrestling match nobody bites like Gaston
For there's no one as burly and brawny
"As you see I've got biceps to spare"
Not a bit of him's scraggly or scrawny
"(That's right!)And ev'ry last inch of me's covered with hair"
No one hits like Gaston
Matches wits like Gaston
In a spitting match nobody spits like Gaston
"I'm espcially good at expectorating" (Ptooey!)
Ten points for Gaston!
Sun Feb 26, 08:37:00 AM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Mormon411,
No I'm not a Mormon or ex-Mormon, but I did steal the phrase from the Book of Mormon. It caught my eye when I was creating the SABOM and thought it'd make a swell name for a blog.
Sun Feb 26, 09:58:00 AM 2012 
 Drake Shelton said...
Will you answer my ten questions?
1. What is your answer to the Pre-Socratic era of Greek Philosophy, and Zeno’s Paradox? Zeno of Elea (490-430 B.C.) brought the Pre Socratic era to a close with his devastating arguments against sensation, space and motion. First, was his famous Paradox. To be brief, Zeno’s argument, in essence, is that in order for Achilles to move from point A to point B he must come at least half the space. If so then he has to come at least a tenth; a hundredth; a millionth, etc. He must pass through an infinite number of points in a finite segment. Motion is therefore impossible and space is indefinable. (The essence of his argument is not a relation of motion to time but the impossibility of exhausting an infinite series. Neither is his argument that Achilles has to exhaust the series to the last point for there is no last point. Also, one cannot divide an infinite series. To do so one must assumethat the object in motion stops in mid-motion to create a mid-point. The mid-point then is only potential and not actual. I admit that it is possible to exhaust an infinite series of potential points, but not actual points. Also, you cannot appeal to imaginary, indemonstrable units of measurement like Plank Units to answer this paradox.) In a further complaint against the concept of space, Zeno argued that if atoms and motion required space there must also be super-space for space to exist in and another super-space for that, ad infinitum. Zeno also refuted the idea of sensation in the Atomistic system which denied qualities to atoms. In an exposition of Zeno’s criticism of Democritus’ Atomism (Later to dominate the Scientific Revolution) Dr. Clark says,
“When an ocean wave ‘thunders’ against the rocks, no atom produces an audible sensation; but the wave is nothing but atoms; therefore, it produces no sound.” (Ancient Philosophy, 272)...
http://eternalpropositions.wordpress.com/2012/02/29/questions-for-a-secularist/
Tue Feb 28, 07:27:00 PM 2012 
 Ian said...
#10 is a hoot, Drake Shelton. You forgot to mention that space aliens and the illuminati are also working with the Catholic Church to overthrow the US government and replace it with the New World Order.
Santorum's candidacy must scare the crap out of you, given how his supporters are overwhelmingly evangelical. I'm scared by it too, but for different reasons.
Wed Feb 29, 01:22:00 PM 2012 
 skanksta said...
those ten questions are very interesting Drake..
Can you answer the ONE question in the post - who has more powerful spit - Jesus or Muhammed ?
You could grow this in to a kind of top trumps superpower face-off between jc and Mo !
- maybe even some statistics on their magic powers...?
Wed Feb 29, 03:34:00 PM 2012 
 Fed Up With Faith said...
Hello, Love the Blog. Been reading a few lately! I started my own If you get time have a look
http://fedupwithfaith.blog.com/
Thanks
Thu Mar 01, 09:40:00 AM 2012 
 the eradicator said...
Holla,
You guys are really morons, aren't you? Can you even begin to realise how great a sin it is to make fun of prophets? You could do worse than heed this advise of a wise man (paraphrase): "I'd rather believe in an unseen God and die to find it's untrue than unbelive and die to find it's true and that He exists to punish or reward me for my actions.". Ergo, take heed and cease and desist from such mischief and you may receive His guidance. Aameen.
Sun Dec 08, 02:55:00 AM 2013 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 23 February 2012David Barton: Life begins at last call (Jeremiah 1:5)
David Barton (the psuedo-historian that Mike Huckabee wants every American to be 'forced at gun point' to listen to) says that "life begins before conception." (Jeremiah 1:5)
Or as Seth Meyers put it, "Life begins at last call."


Posted by Steve Wells at 2/23/2012 09:45:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
2 comments:
 Ian said...
So sperm and egg cells, which only contain half the chromosomes needed to produce a human being, are life?
In that case, I think I'm guilty of genocide, as I just cut my finger, thus massacring millions of skin and blood cells, all of which are more of a "person" than a gamete
Sun Feb 26, 03:34:00 PM 2012 
 sam said...
JER 1:5 “Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart…”
This suggests yhwh's formation of everlasting souls prior to physical conception, something the early church father Origen would have agreed with.
Add to that MK 15:20 - “But woe to that man who betrays the Son of Man! It would be better for him if he had not been born.”
yhwh permits the birth of people who he knows will betray the Son of Man, given his omniscience. If it would be better for the person if he had not been born, failing to prevent him from being born would be the less moral act, like failing to prevent a baby from drowning.
Certainly, yhwh is asserted to have the capacity to prevent pregancy, like in Gen 20:17-18. So, why does yhwh fail in his moral obligation to prevent birth & risk the everlasting damnation of these souls?
Eccles 4:2-3 – “And I thought the dead, who have already died, more fortunate than the living, who are still alive; but better than both is the one who has not yet been, & has not seen the evil deeds that are done under the sun.”
Tue Mar 13, 02:10:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.



Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 23 February 2012Bryan Fischer: We need a president who will make a bronze serpent to protect us from God's fiery serpents
God, I love it when fundamentalists quote Numbers 21.
You remember Numbers 21, don't you? It's the one where the Israelites complain about the lack of food and water, so God sends snakes to bite them, and many of them die.
So the people ask Moses to ask God to call off the snakes. And that's when God came up with a wonderful plan. He told Moses to make a bronze (brass in the KJV) serpent and stick it on a pole. Then, when the snake-bite victims look at it, they won't die.
So that's what Moses did.
And that, according to Bryan Fischer, is what we need our next president to do. Make a bronze serpent to protect us from God's fiery serpents.

It will probably be Rick Stantorum's first act as president.
Posted by Steve Wells at 2/23/2012 08:52:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
1 comment:
 sam said...
Good stuff.
MT 7:9-11 yhwh gives bread, not snakes, to those asking for bread.
Oops. NU 21:4-6, 1 Cor 10:9 yhwh gives snakes, not bread, to those asking for bread.
I also very much enjoyed this douchebag slipping into common mafia euphemisms, in which yhwh isn't directly ordering the serpents to kill the offending children of israel, but merely withdrawing his "protection".
It's too bad there isn't a mental gymnastics category in the Olympics. This guy is a shoe-in for the gold. He's far too brainwashed to see the aetiological story of Nehushtan (2Kings 18:1-7) for what it is. The author of John is responding to jewish criticisms of idolotry to his jesus divinity worship by pointing out in 3:15, "Hey, we've have god-sanctioned idolotry in judaism before, why not now?" It's almost as funny as that photo of the fundamentalists praying at the golden calf on Wall Street, shortly after the financial melt-down.
Finally, he caps everything off with a reference to King Sihon of Heshbon (DT 2:30), but conveniently fails to mention that it is yhwh who "hardens his heart", stripping him of free will in order to precipitate the herem genocide of women and children (DT 2:34).
Morally bankrupt people like this Bryan Fischer really do raise the question of what should be considered the boundaries of constitutionally-protected hate speech.
Tue Mar 13, 02:46:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.






Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 12 February 2012Happy Darwin Day!
To celebrate Charles Darwin's 203rd birthday, I attended Darwin on the Palouse on Thursday at Washington State University and at the University of Idaho on Friday. It was sponsored by the Palouse Coalition of Reason, and featured presentations by Daniel Dennett, PZ Myers, Fred Edwords, and Jen McCreight. It was as close to heaven as I'll ever come.
I don't have time to report on the presentations, but since they were videotaped, I'll post a link to them when they become available.
Still, I feel like I ought to say a few words in honor of Darwin on his birthday. Or better yet, I'll let him speak for himself.
Here's a quote from the introduction to The Descent of Man.
It has often and confidently been asserted, that man's origin can never be known: but ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge: it is those who know little, and not those who know much, who so positively assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science.
14 March 2012 Update: Here's the Daniel Dennett talk.

Posted by Steve Wells at 2/12/2012 12:10:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
18 comments:
 Anders said...
203 years, and the arguments of the opponents haven't evolved at all in that time. Does that count as evidence against evolution?
Sounds like it must have been a great bash, wish I could have been there
Sun Feb 12, 12:36:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Over at RichardDawkins.net (http://richarddawkins.net/articles/644929-happy-darwin-day) there are some links to free books on evolution, apparently good for today (2/12) only.
Looking forward to the video links, Steve. I also wish I could have been there.
Steve Weeks
Sun Feb 12, 02:25:00 PM 2012 
 naturefarmer said...
This sounds like a religion, Darwin worship, complete with a mention of "heaven".
Darwin was certainly a very smart man and he made important contributions to biology. And, Darwinism does explain a few things. For examples, there are sickle cell disease and bacterial resistance to antibiotics.
The really important adaptations are beyond Darwinism, however. Bird wings and flight feathers, as examples, require foresight and design. To get from a dinosaur foreleg to a wing requires real engineering. A process of random mutations and natural selection just won't get there. I challenge anyone to explain how that could happen.
Yes, there has been evolution (in the broad sense). But, it had to be guided. It seems so obvious. Why don't more biologists see it? Are they so blinded by materialistic naturalism that they don't?
Tue Feb 14, 08:43:00 AM 2012 
 Tony said...
Ahhh, naturefarmer, the old "isn't it obvious" argument. Brilliant! I suppose it then follows that Jesus died on the cross for our sins etc.
Tue Feb 14, 06:18:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Sun Feb 12, 02:25:00 PM 2012
Blogger naturefarmer said...
"...Darwinism does explain a few things... (but) ...A process of random mutations and natural selection just won't get there. I challenge anyone to explain how that could happen."
Evolutionary theory (that's "theory" in the *scientific* sense, like the theory of gravity or atomic theory) has come a long, long way since Darwin. Darwin knew nothing about genes, and DNA wasn't even on the radar screen until the middle of the Twentieth Century; the fossil record was poor in Darwin's time. It has been said that "nothing in biology makes any sense except in light of evolution."
I challenge *you* to read a good book on evolution. "Why Evolution is True", by Jerry Coyne is such a book. (See http://jerrycoyne.uchicago.edu/ ). You can't seriously think you can come on a blog like this and say "It seems so obvious. Why don't more biologists see it?" and expect to convince anyone that they should agree. Ignorance of the facts is not a crime, and can be remedied; willful ignorance is nothing but stupidity.
Your move.
Steve Weeks
Tue Feb 14, 07:01:00 PM 2012 
 naturefarmer said...
Thank you for the responses.
Three years ago I purchased a copy of Dr. Coyne's book "Why Evolution is True". I have read it more than one time since then. It is well-written and interesting to read. When he sticks to the science, it is a valuable resource. He does tend to stray into "culture wars", however. The science interests me. I don't care about the politics and culture wars. I want to know what really happened. I can handle that.
Dr. Coyne makes a good case for common descent. His discussion of endogenous retoviruses (p. 69) is especially enlightening. Common descent is an important aspect of "evolution" but it is not an explanation of the cause. That is left to neo-Darwinism. There is where the real weakness lies.
Pages 46-47 attempt to explain the evolution of bird flight. Here is a quote. "[F]eathers evolved before birds could fly...what on earth were they for?...we don't know...And what feathers evolved from is even more mysterious." Then Dr. Coyne goes through a couple of scenarios where flightless feathered dinosaurs are running around with long feathers on their forelimbs catching insects or leaping from trees. It is very unconvincing. How could small (tiny) steps in this process be advantagous?
In the non-living world, things that appear to be designed ARE designed. It took very smart humans to make computers, automobiles, etc. When it comes to the much more complex living things, are we to believe that they just happened?
I have doubts about my position in this debate. I certainly want to know the TRUTH. Do you ever question your position?
Wed Feb 15, 05:47:00 AM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
It may sound like religion, naturefarmer, but it isn't. In fact, it's just the opposite.
Charles Darwin was neither prophet nor messiah, and his writings are not sacred texts. No one will go to heaven for their understanding of science or be tortured forever in hell for failing a math exam.
Your certainty about the the origin of bat wings and bird feathers is an example of the ignorant confidence that comes from religious belief.
Wed Feb 15, 07:59:00 AM 2012 
 naturefarmer said...
Thank you for your response, Steve Wells.
A few years ago I read "The Blind Watchmaker" by Richard Dawkins. He is a good writer who knows a lot about the subject of biology and evolution. He like, Jerry Coyne, tends to get political, however.
I don't have the book in front of me, but I remember that he starts with bats and echolocation. While reading the book, I thought "great, he is going to explain how bats evolved and how they acquired echolocation". He didn't, though. He just made a statement that it happened by a blind undirected process. It was as if we were supposed to take his word for it. He is a smart and well educated man, but I can't just take what he says by faith. He needs to show the evidence. That is what science does.
As for my showing "ignorant confidence" I just said in the previous post that I have doubts. Do you?
I think the main reason people have trouble with Darwinism (by that I mean random mutations acted upon by natural selection explaining the diversity of life) is that it is so counterintuitive. In the non-living world we see things breaking down and becoming simpler. Farm equipment does that all the time. It takes an intelligent agent (a mechanic) just to keep it running. Entropy increases. So, how can living things become MORE complex with time? Outside input is needed to turn something like a bacteria cell (already quite complex) into a eukaryotic cell and then into a multicellar plant or animal.
I'm not appealing to religion here. I am a Christian believer but that doesn't preclude me from being a scientist.
As for Darwinism not being a religion. It isn't, but it has some of the trappings. It is kind of a religion substitute. Darwin seems to be held in great awe by Dawkins and many others.
Wed Feb 15, 09:22:00 AM 2012 
 estnihil said...
One thing can't be explained by a scientific theory. It is completely wrong. So many contradictions in the Bible. But it's copying errors/mistranslation/because you don't understand that 70 and 700 are the same number in God's eyes.
If, and I don't think it is true that it's wrong, that modern evolutionary theory can't explain echolocation, then that doesn't disprove evolution. That says, "evolution works up to this point, but breaks, so we need a better theory that fits all the data". When Newtonian physics was shown to have errors when one moves close to the speed of light, scientists didn't immediately throw up their hands in the air screaming "It's God all along! How could we have been so stupid! He causes gravity! Duh". Your God is a God of the Gaps. Keep on pointing out gaps in the scientific theory, but the more we fill, the smaller your God becomes. And as history as shown, Natural Wonders caused by God: 0, Natural Wonders caused by Science: countless. Your move, lol. Sorry if I was a bit harsh.
Wed Feb 15, 03:27:00 PM 2012 
 Ian said...
A few years ago I read "The Blind Watchmaker" by Richard Dawkins. He is a good writer who knows a lot about the subject of biology and evolution. He like, Jerry Coyne, tends to get political, however.
Perhaps the reason they sound "political" to you is that the right wing in the US has made the disinterested pursuit of science into a "culture wars" issue?
Where else can we go with the abject insanity that is the religious right's attack on biology? How about meteorology? Hurricanes are too complex to happen by chance. They must be intelligently designed. Anyone who suggests that hurricanes evolve from tropical waves that begin as thunderstorms off the coast of west Africa is a godlesss liberal.
Wed Feb 15, 05:56:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
I can tell you that anyone who could come up with a plausible theory that could replace evolution as a way of explaining the natural world as we see it would instantly win the Nobel Prize. That's "theory" understood to mean "an explanation of the interrelationships between observed and verifiable facts", not "my best hunch".
Do I question my "position"? Sure, I do. That is the nature of the scientific method. And, yes, there are things that cannot yet be explained, as mentioned by estnihil. The "gaps" are the things that make things interesting. ;-)
As for "design", what about *bad* design? You might look up the recurrent laryngeal nerve, or why the eyes of raptor birds of prey have much better visual acuity than those of humans. A good book on this subject is "Your Inner Fish", by Neil Shubin. Other examples of bad design are all around. Why would a designer arrange things so the majority (>90%, IIRC) of species that have ever existed have become extinct? I find it much easier to assume that an observation that has no explanation is simply one whose explanation is "pending" than that there has to be a supernatural explanation for it. You must see that "goddidit" isn't much of a motivation to try to figure out the natural world. Where would we be in the areas of medicine, physics, biology, geology, astronomy - to list a few that occur to me - if no one had ever bothered to go for those gaps?
A couple more afterthoughts. About those feathers. They weren't necessarily "for" anything. What we know is that they improved the chances for their owners to survive and reproduce. "Why" this was the case may not be understood, but it may be possible to generate a testable hypothesis that could lead to understanding.
Your mention of 1) farm equipment and how it requires maintenance to keep operating, 2) entropy, 3) increasing complexity make me think you've been hearing the argument about the Second Law of Thermodynamics. Remember that this law applies to a *closed system*. The Earth is not a closed system. It gets a rather large amount of energy from a nearby mass of fusing hydrogen.
You can be a "Christian Believer" and a "Scientist", but when it comes to evidence you will have to decide where you stand. Probably there will be areas of inquiry that you will prefer not to enter; I think that most modern-day scientists who claim to be religious are somehow good at compartmentalizing the two areas so they seem not to conflict.
Steve Weeks
Wed Feb 15, 08:17:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Darn. Now we have to wait while Nature Farmer reads "Why Evolution is True" yet another time in an attempt to understand it. >sigh<
;-)
Steve Weeks
Sun Feb 19, 06:26:00 PM 2012 
 naturefarmer said...
I have been gone for a while. I appreciate the comments here. Yes, I've read books by Jerry Coyne and Richard Dawkins as well as Charles Darwin. Several of the arguments in those books are quite persuasive. For example, the evidence for "common descent" is strong. On the contrary, the evidence for ALL this just happening due to random variations and natural selection is quite weak (small changes certainly can happen that way).
Here is a request. I would ask that you, Steve Weeks, and others read these three books and give your honest assessment of each: Signature in the Cell by Stephen C. Meyer, Darwin's Black Box and The Edge of Evolution by Michael Behe. I would really like to know what you think concerning the strengths and weaknesses of these authors' arguments.
Maybe you have already read those books. You may have preconceived ideas on the books. I'm not much interested in those, just your evaluation AFTER reading them.
Thanks!
Mon Feb 27, 11:52:00 AM 2012 
 Stephen said...
@ Nature farmer:
That's a heavy homework assignment. Unfortunately, I don't have time to read Discovery Institute/Intelligent Design stuff. Not all points of view are equally worthy of attention.
Here is Richard Dawkins's review of "The Edge of Evolution":
http://richarddawkins.net/articles/1360
... and that gives me an adequate assessment of it.
You have read some material, written by authors *widely accepted* as experts in their fields (Coyne, Dawkins... as opposed to Behe and Meyer), and you find some of the evidence convincing, yet you say that "evidence for ALL this just happening due to random variations and natural selection is quite weak." I think you may not be reckoning with the **vast** stretches of time involved in the evolutionary process. It is almost impossible to adequately comprehend what small changes over millions of years can amount to... but that is the hang-up, I think.
Steve Weeks
Mon Feb 27, 07:57:00 PM 2012 
 naturefarmer said...
OK, there may not be much more for us to discuss. I have enjoyed the honest exchange of ideas, though. I'm certainly not afraid of the truth. The Meyer book is long, but the Behe books are not. It would be worth your time to at least read one of them.
As for vast time periods, yes, the evidence is overwhelming that the earth is more than 4 1/2 billion years old. That doesn't solve all the problems, however. There had to be a FIRST TIME, a distinct event when, for example, the first bird flew. Prior to that first time, what kind of natural selection was causing flight feathers and wings to develop? If a proto-bird was climbing around in trees with awkward forelimbs, how would natural selection favor such a thing? And, natural selection would have to favor it STRONGLY and in a just the right way to end up with usable wings. Hand waving arguments are all I have ever seen from Darwinists. They just don't make the case.
Also, there is something else that puzzles me. Why are Darwinists (most, not all) so defensive and dismissive of other ideas? Do they have hidden doubts? After all, the Darwinists practically own the university biology departments. What do they have to fear?
I have a good friend from my high school days here in Oklahoma. He has a Ph.D. in entomology and has taught and done research at a major university for many years. He has sincere doubts about Darwinism, but mostly keeps them to himself. Why? On the few occasions when he has expressed doubts about Darwinism, he has faced strong personal attacks. That is a shame. A university is supposed to be a place where ideas can be openly expressed.
OK, this probably doesn't relate to you at all. You have been very civil. I thank you for that. It just seems that too much of the discourse between the various factions in the "origins debate" is prone to name calling and personal attacks. A little more humilty is in order. After all, none of us were there to witness what actually happened.
Best wishes!
Tue Feb 28, 07:55:00 AM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Nature Farmer,
Part of my brain says you've almost got it; the other half says you're at square one. "After all, none of us were there to witness what actually happened." Do you really think this argument carries any weight? No one has ever seen an electron; no one has actually seen a continental plate move (except earthquakes!). Yet testable hypotheses lead to theories that allow accurate predictions. This is what science is all about.
It would be useful to stop calling evolutionary theory "Darwinism". Darwin had a great idea, but it has been improved, refined and strengthened tremendously in the time since he proposed it. Darwin knew nothing about genes, much less DNA. The word "Darwinism" is used as a virtual epithet by creationist/intelligent design types.
You ask "Why are Darwinists (most, not all) so defensive and dismissive of other ideas?"
It's because the "other ideas" are not supported by **evidence**. See "Why Evolution is True" yet again. Your friend with the PhD in entomology and "doubts" about evolution keeps quiet probably because he is aware that he might as well express doubts that the earth is round or that microorganisms cause disease. "Strong personal attacks" are not appropriate in an academic or scientific context, but if his professional position is jeopardized by espousing explanations of nature that are not supported by evidence that is a different thing.
Finally, I'm going to tackle the "first flight" issue. You should have picked up from Coyne's book, if not others, that there is no time when a bird just "appears". At any given point in time, a survey of the creatures in a given are will find that they are almost all very similar; adjacent generations are virtually indistinguishable from each other. Flight almost certainly started out as "gliding". Perhaps a reptile had feather-like structures that were just enough larger (the "random mutation") than its parents to prevent its being killed from falling out of a tree avoiding a predator (the "natural selection"). That reptile might pass on those larger feathers to some of its offspring. With this improved ability to avoid being eaten, this creature would tend to out-reproduce its peers. The transition from gliding flight to powered flight would take thousands or millions of generations. So the "first bird to fly" would differ very little from its immediate predecessors.
I hope this helps. But, please, don't use the "no one was there to witness it" argument. You are obviously more intelligent than that. Cheers!
Steve Weeks
Tue Feb 28, 07:42:00 PM 2012 
 naturefarmer said...
Steve Weeks,
This will be my final post. You (or some one else) may have the last word. I've really enjoyed this discussion. You have given me ideas to consider and I am certainly going to do so.
My reason for using the term "Darwinism" is that it brings out the concept of natural selection acting upon random variations. That is the foremost original idea that is associated with Charles Darwin. And, as I understand it, this idea is still today at the very heart of evolutionary theory. "Evolution" or "evolutionary theory" is much broader. Coyne (p. 3) does a good job of explaining that in his book. I don't know about others, but I don't use the term "Darwinism" in a negative sense, rather in a more of a descriptive sense.
After all, I believe in "evolution" (change over time). Any thinking person does. Things change. Species change. I believe much more than that. The earth is billions of years old (for sure). Life has changed dramatically during that time period. Common descent is quite likely to have occurred (maybe even the the big "tree of life" but at least "bushes" here and there). For some one from a fundamentalist Christian background, those are really big things to accept. But I do so on the basis of EVIDENCE (as you have mentioned several times in your posts).
I'll go a little farther. Natural selection most certainly occurs. Random mutations occur (I hope they are random, the bad ones at least, and most are bad). But, where I absolutely DON'T see evidence is the extrapolation of this process to the origins of novel new features such as wings, flight feathers, etc.
Continues in next post
Thu Mar 01, 02:17:00 PM 2012 
 naturefarmer said...
continued...
The genetic material contains INFORMATION. This information came from somewhere. In our human experience, the only source of "specified and complex" information, like this, is intelligence.
Here is an experiment that could be done. I wish it would be done. You, no doubt, know about SETI (Search for Extra-terrestrial Intelligence). I wish that someone would take the genome of any organism (say, a simple bacterium) and code the As, Gs, Cs and Ts in a form that could be fed into the SETI program. What would it show? My guess (just a guess) is that it would show a strong signal for an intelligent source.
I'll close my arguments with an analogy for the genome of an organism. The genome is somwhat like a big city library. There are many volumes in the library. Some are duplicates. Some have been misshelved. Many are never or seldom read. Some have pages missing. Other libraries have similar collections. Many of the same books occur in those libraries. NEW BOOKS are added from time to time. Things have happened in libraries that are not due to any "smarts" or intelligence. Yet, no one will ever deny that the basics (the books) came from intelligent sources (human writers).
No analogy is perfect, but it sure appears that the genetic information in a living organism is, at the basic level, much like what you find in a bricks and mortar library.
There is overwhelming evidence for a spherical earth and for the germ theory of disease. To compare those with my friend's doubts concerning a few aspects of evolutionary theory is not fair. Where the evidence is strong, I know he accepts it. Where the evidence is notably weak, he (and I) would like to have an open and honest discussion, not personal attacks.


I love science. I am a scientist at heart and I hope that the search for evidence continues in a very robust fashion. I am willing to change my ideas as new evidence requires. Right now, the evidence does not require life to have developed through a non-intelligent process. In fact, just the opposite is the case. The only reasonable way that the vast information needed to code for even a simple organism could arise is from an intelligent source.
I knew when I posted on "Dwindling in Unbelief" that I would represent a very minority view. That's OK. It's good that we talk to each other.
Finally, I'll say this. Life, HOWEVER IT GOT HERE, is a wonder beyond wonders. I can easily image a barren planet. Even with oceans and an atmosphere, it would be a dull place. This planet is fabulous almost beyond comprehension.
This is too long. I'll stop. Best wishes to all!
Thu Mar 01, 02:18:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 03 February 2012What the Book of Mormon says about the poor (and why Mitt Romney should be concerned about them)
The morning after winning the Florida primary, Mitt Romney said "he wasn't concerned about the very poor" in an interview with Soledad O'Brien of CNN.
The next day at the National Prayer Breakfast, President Obama expressed just the opposite point of view. Here are some excepts, along with the corresponding bible verses.
... the biblical call [is] to care for the least of these –- for the poor; for those at the margins of our society. To answer the responsibility we’re given in Proverbs to “Speak up for those who cannot speak for themselves, for the rights of all who are destitute.” (Proverbs 31:8-10)
...
John tells us that, “If anyone has material possessions and sees his brother in need but has no pity on him, how can the love of God be in him? Dear children, let us not love with words or tongue but with actions and in truth.” (1 John 3:17)
There were, of course, some misapplied biblical references to "Am I my brother's keeper" (Genesis 4:9) and "For unto whom much is given, much shall be required." (Luke 12:48). But Obama made his point: he's a better Christian than Romney.
Still if I were writing Obama's speech, I'd have thrown in Proverbs 29:17, just for Mitt "I'm not concerned about the poor" Romney.
The righteous considereth the cause of the poor: but the wicked regardeth not to know it.
So we've pretty well established that Mitt isn't much of a Christian. But we already knew that. He's a Mormon.
And what the does Book of Mormon say about poor people?
Plenty, as it turns out. Here are some excerpts.
Ye will administer of your substance unto him that standeth in need; and ye will not suffer that the beggar putteth up his petition to you in vain, and turn him out to perish. (Mosiah 4:16)
Ye ought to impart of the substance that ye have one to another. (Mosiah 4:21)
Impart of your substance to the poor, every man according to that which he hath. (Mosiah 4:26)
They did impart of their substance, every man according to that which he had, to the poor, and the needy, and the sick, and the afflicted; and ... they were liberal to all. (Alma 1:27-30)
Yea, he saw great inequality among the people ... turning their backs upon the needy and the naked and those who were hungry, and those who were athirst, and those who were sick and afflicted. (Alma 4:12)
Will you persist in turning your backs upon the poor, and the needy, and in withholding your substance from them? (Alma 5:55)
So I guess Mitt Romney isn't a very good Mormon either.
Posted by Steve Wells at 2/03/2012 10:21:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
6 comments:
 Brett Cottrell said...
Mark Twain called the Book of Mormon "chloroform in print." Maybe Romney fell asleep while reading it.
http://brettcottrell.blogspot.com/2012/02/mark-twain-on-book-of-mormon-chloroform.html
Fri Feb 03, 11:47:00 AM 2012 
 The Wise Fool said...
Yeah, it's going to be interesting when Romney takes the nomination. The Republicans will have to vote between a multi-millionaire who embodies all of their financial ideals, or Obama, who has better values and seems to have a lot of other "Republican" stances, such as with national security, drone warfare, etc.
Fri Feb 03, 11:59:00 AM 2012 
 Ian said...
I'm generally pleased with Obama as president (he's not perfect, but such is politics) but I roll my eyes every time he feels the need to quote the Bible to justify himself. Why do the Democrats, who are obviously not the party of religious fundamentalists, continue to condescend to us this way?
I really hope someday soon we can have a competitive candidate for President who is an open atheist.
Fri Feb 03, 12:06:00 PM 2012 
 Nicholas said...
Romney donated millions of dollars to the poor last year. What did you do?
Sat Apr 28, 09:47:00 AM 2012 
 drpjmaddox said...
"I really hope someday soon we can have a competitive candidate for President who is an open atheist."
Not a chance "in hell" Ian. She would not be able to take the Oath of Office, (sworn on the bible).
Wed May 23, 02:27:00 PM 2012 
 NickandJen Costello said...
Is that before or after he outsourced their jobs? Also what do you wanna bet it was a for the tax break he won't tell us about. He is still a politician, no not an American hero the opposite!
Thu Sep 20, 12:45:00 AM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 29 March 2012Richard Dawkins and Michael Aus discuss the Clergy Project
The morning after the Reason Rally, Michael Aus was on the Chris Hayes Show, where he first came out as a non-believing Christian minister. Here is another interview, this time with Richard Dawkins.
Here's an excerpt.
Dawkins: What first led to those doubts?
Aus: What really first started it was actually paying attention to the Bible.
Dawkins: I'm not surprised.
Aus: Yeah, it seems silly that you work with the Lectionary week in and week out, teach Bible studies, and you start to see the inconsistencies, the fabrications, and the fascinating thing about this to me is that you don't have to be a Bible scholar to see this stuff.
Dawkins: It's not just the fabrications, it's the sheer unpleasantness.
Aus: Unpleasantness. It's brutal. The genocides, the slaughters, the oppression of women, the support for slavery, it goes on and on. There are a few gems of wisdom in the Bible, but you have to dig to find them.
Dawkins: Of course, we can always say that that was then and we've moved on.  But, of course, we have moved on, and that's the point, istn't it?
Aus: Yes, exactly!
Posted by Steve Wells at 3/29/2012 08:24:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
No comments:
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 27 March 2012John Hagee explains how and why the world will end in 2012
John Hagee explains it all in less that 20 minutes. (See video below.)
The sermon begins with the rhetorical question:
Could 2012 be the end of the world as we know it?
The rest of the sermon provides Hagee's answer.
But before getting in to that, Pastor Hagee tells us what "God's point of view" is with respect to homosexuals. (God wants us to kill them.)
The word homosexual does not appear in the Bible, but the concept is clearly expressed by Moses in Leviticus 20:13, it says, "If a man lies with another man as he lies with a woman, both of them have committed abomination. They shall surely be put to death." That's God's point of view.
And that he's "thrilled out of his ever-loving mind" that he'll soon be raptured before the Antichrist shows up.
I gladly tell you that I am a born again, Bible-believing Christian and I am not ashamed of the Gospel of Jesus Christ. And I am thrilled out of my ever-loving mind that when the trumpet of God sounds, I'm out of here before the Antichrist shows up with hell incorporated.
With that out of the way, he begins to fly through the book of Revelation, telling us about the monstrous ecological things that God will do to our planet in the coming months.
I'm going to fly through the chapters of the book of Revelation like a speeding bullet. In the Book of Revelation there are seven seals, seven trumpets, and seven vials. Twenty-one monstrous ecological things that happen to literally devastate the planet Earth.
God will start things off by burning up 1/3 of the Earth's vegetation. (Hagee believes in global warming, but it's not human-caused, it's God-caused.)
One-third of the vegetation of the Earth is burned up (Revelation 8:7).
Then hordes of horse-sized locusts will sting people, torturing them for five months, and making them wish they were dead. (But the God of love won't let them die.)
The gates of hell are opened and hordes of locusts, the Bible says, the size of a horse will come up out of the bottomless pit and sting men like a scorpion. (Rev 9:2-6) The pain will last for five months. And men will beg God to let them die. But they cannot find death, the Bible says that.
After that, there'll be a bloody war, where, according to my calculation, about 24 trillion people will be killed.
A world war so bloody that the blood of those killed in battle will flow for 200 miles to the bridles of a horse. (Rev 14:20)
God will cover any survivors with boils from head to toe.
Every person on earth who has taken the mark of the beast in his right hand or forehead will be covered from head to feet with running boils. (Rev 16:2)
Then he'll turn the sea into blood.
The seven seas of the earth will turn to blood. (Rev 16:3-4)
And send an world-wide earthquake that will level mountains and sink islands.
Now you have the Bible describe a world-wide earthquake so monstrous that the mountains of the world are leveled, and that the islands of the sea disappear. (Rev 16:18-20)
Next God will burn the earth with fire, causing us all to run to the mountains, where we'll chew on our tongues while asking the mountains to fall on us.
The sun will scorch the Earth with fire, and mighty men, the Bible says, and kings and men of war will gnaw their tongues in pain and they will crawl into the mountains, and the book of Revelation says they will cry to the mountains, "Fall on us and kill us, to hide us from the wrath of the lamb that's on the throne." (Rev 16:8-11)
Then God will release four angels to kill 1/3 of the human population in a one day. The exact hour for this holy massacre is specified somewhere in Genesis 1, but only God and John Hagee know it.
I ask you, read Revelation 9:15, it's the sixth trumpet. There are four angels released by God himself to destroy one-third of mankind in one day. The Bible says there is a year, a month, a day, and an hour that God picked out from Genesis 1. One-third of mankind on that day, by the will and hand of God, will be destroyed.
That's right. God is going to kill 2.3 billion people in a single day later this year. And if you have a hard time believing that, read Genesis 7:4-23.
You say, I have a hard time believing that. May I refer you to Noah's Flood? Believe it.
Among the dead will be 100 million Americans, one for each aborted fetus, by God and John Hagee's calculation.
In America we have something over 300 million people. That means 100 million people in 24 hours, gone. I believe that God will require a life for every child killed in abortion clinics in America. I believe that's where the tally is going to be set.
So that's ho the world will end. Here's why it will be in 2012.
There are three independent pieces of evidence that when taken together are absolutely convincing.
1. Satellite TV
So why is it coming now? ... I listened to my father and grandfather sit and discuss the fact that the whole world would see the two witnesses killed on the streets of Jerusalem in one hour. (Revelation 11:3-12) They thought there was something in the text that was absolutely false because it was not believable. There was no television at that point in time. Television was born, but we still didn't get it. Then satellite television came in and ding, ding, ding, ding, ding -- we got it. This is how Elijah and Enoch are going to be seen in the city of Jerusalem, when the Antichrist is going to be permitted to kill them. They're going to line in the streets of Jerusalem and the world is going to see them at one time over internet television. The world is going to be so happy that there dead. Remember there's nothing on earth at this time but devil-worshiping, Antichrist-following people. They hate these two men of God. The world is going to be so thrilled their dead, thy're going to give gifts to each other like it's Christmas when they die. But three and a half days later they're going to stand to their feet ... and be lifted from the ground, back into the presence of God. And the whole world will watch them --- woooooweee! ... That couldn't happen before satellite television.
2. Nuclear warfare
And there was another section of verses that my parents couldn't understand, where God said that this is a plague that I will send to those that fight against Israel. That I will cause the flesh to fall from their bones before their body can hit the ground, and their eyes shall  melt in their sockets and their tongue in their mouth. (Zechariah 14:12) There was no way we could understand that. And then came atomic warfare and nuclear warfare.
3. Israel
And then there's the birth of Israel. ... Every major prophecy in the Old Testament said there would be a day that God would bring Israel back home. ... That happened May the 15, 1948.
There are about twelve other reasons that Pastor Hagee didn't have time to tell us about. But these three are the most convincing and they are sufficient.
It's not rocket science, people. It's all in the Bible.
There are about twelve of those prophetic signs I don't have time to give you, but you don't have to be a rocket scientist or a theologian to understand what I've just said. That's all in the Bible.


Posted by Steve Wells at 3/27/2012 07:45:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
13 comments:
 Incongruous Circumspection said...
Whoa there! How can humanity crawl to the mountains to escape the fire when all the mountains have already been leveled?
Tue Mar 27, 07:56:00 AM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Good point, IC. But I think Hagee just got his events a bit out of order. First we gnaw our tongues and ask mountains to fall on us (Rev 6:16 and 16:10, not sure about the 10 chapter gap) and then the mountains are destroyed in an earthquake (Rev 16:20). Or something like that.
There are a few places in Revelation that don't make too much sense to me
Tue Mar 27, 08:31:00 AM 2012 
 GMpilot said...
So it doesn't really matter who gets elected President then, right?
Hagee has to choose between a (fake) Muslim and a real Mormon; no wonder he hopes to see the world end this year!
Tue Mar 27, 09:06:00 AM 2012 
 Holytape said...
Well, I'm sure that in 2013, he will give us a detailed explanation why the world will end in 2013. Which of course will be different that the 2014 explanation about why the world will end in 2014. Personally, I think the world ended in 1985 with the introduction of new coke. The world just hasn't realized that it has already ended.
The first rider of the apocalypse
Tue Mar 27, 10:06:00 AM 2012 
 Stephen said...
What a pompous a$$hole.
But I liked the use of the tune to Aloha Oe: Pua `âhihi lehua o uka. Hui: Aloha `oe, aloha `oe. E ke onaona noho i ka lipo. One fond embrace, A ho`i a`e au. Until we meet again `O ka hali`a aloha i hiki mai ...
Isn't that pagan or something?
Steve Weeks
Tue Mar 27, 04:33:00 PM 2012 
 The Wise Fool said...
Brace yourselves. I think we are in for a couple decades of apocalyptic dates. Camping and Hagee are just the beginning. It's been 2000 years of any-day-now. The natives are getting restless.
Tue Mar 27, 04:46:00 PM 2012 
 Ian said...
Remind me why I should take this guy any more seriously than the people who are gathering around that mountain in France, expecting aliens to rescue them from the end of the world this year?
Tue Mar 27, 05:55:00 PM 2012 
 nazani said...
I've been to the little desert of Patmos where the mysterious John was sent. If he wasn't nuts beforehand, wandering around that emptiness probably fostered his visions. Still, his exile was pretty merciful, considering the other things the Romans could have done to him. If only they'd know someday people would take his ranting seriously.
Thu Mar 29, 06:04:00 PM 2012 
 John said...
Hagee is almost 2000 years late. Jesus and the NT actually predicted that the end of the world would happen in the 1st century: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CbBYLQxC7z0
Thu Mar 29, 07:10:00 PM 2012 
 Patricia said...
When I just watched the video it says Could it be the End of the World as we know it! That is not saying the world is going to end in 2012. It's just not going to be the same a drastic change is coming. He is not saying it is going to be this year, he is saying could it possibly be this year????? Then he goes on to say what the bible says what is going to happen when the Antichrist comes. The Muslims believe this to be true as well. They have a different name they call him the 12 Imam. But they believe he is there savior. They believe there must be world wide chaos before he comes on the scene. He is going to bring peace and destroy the Israelis. They believe all the events are taking place right now. Muslims and Christian believe in the same out come in the end except one believes he is the messiah while the other one sees him as the Antichrist. The Reason for God's judgement is because the people reject him and serve the Antichrist (Devil) instead.
Tue Nov 13, 06:42:00 PM 2012 
 prince charming said...
thumbs up Patricia you tried to explain to them and i hope and believe they got what you were trying to say the other thing i want to say is this; it does not matter what you believe or what you try to convince people to believe the fact remains Jesus is God and is coming back watch and be ready for if you will not be hell is the place for you. John Hagee is talking facts. Dont be deceived Guys Jesus is lord and only in Him is salvation. not islam not any other religion as a matter of fact Christianity is not a religion.
coz religion is man trying to do things to please God( man trying to Get to God) and be accepted by Him. We Christians dont have do do that he already accepts us Just the way we are (Jesus death on the cross restored us back to God). all we Have to do is believe in Him.
he is the one who makes us clean not our actions and deeds.
open your eyes an let God be your light stop living in darkness Coz God loves you
Sat Nov 24, 03:01:00 AM 2012 
 -About Tyron- said...
Well folks it's 2013! Almost 2014! I guess Hagee's an 'A' class false prophet. Poor guy...
Sat Sep 14, 04:43:00 AM 2013 
 My Family said...
Funny how "it could happen" turns into "it will happen". Not a false prophet, you just don't listen to his words.
Tue Apr 15, 09:53:00 AM 2014 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 25 March 2012Up with Chris Hayes: The Morning After the Reason Rally
In this morning's show, Chris Hayes interviewed Pastor Mike Aus, who is one of the growing number of of active clergy who no longer believe in God. There were other interesting segments on the show, and I recommend that you watch it all, but I found the interview with Mike Aus especially interesting.
Here's the part that I liked best. (Begins around 7:10)
One of the dirty little secrets of Christianity is hardly anyone ever reads the Bible, and I think if they did, the whole thing would be in big trouble.
Amen to that, Pastor Mike.

Visit msnbc.com for breaking news, world news, and news about the economy
Posted by Steve Wells at 3/25/2012 06:34:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
2 comments:
 Stephen said...
Thanks for posting this fascinating interview. There are other bits on the Richard Dawkins web site, but the Reason Rally seems to have been largely ignored by the mainstream media. Suppression? <_<
Steve Weeks
Mon Mar 26, 07:52:00 AM 2012 
 Ian said...
One of the dirty little secrets of Christianity is hardly anyone ever reads the Bible, and I think if they did, the whole thing would be in big trouble.
This is what drove Matt Dillahunty to atheism. He was studying to be an evangelical minister, and yet he couldn't get past the absurdities and cruelties and outright falsehoods in the Bible, and now he's a vocal atheist.
Tue Mar 27, 05:36:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 23 March 2012New SAB Category: Politics
Since it's an election year, I thought I'd start a new SAB category: Politics.
Here's the first verse, used by Senator James Inhofe to prove that human-caused climate change does not exist.
While the earth remaineth, seedtime and harvest, and cold and heat, and summer and winter, and day and night shall not cease. Genesis 8:22
I'll be adding more verses as I come across them, so you'll start to see them now and then in the SAB. Just look for this icon.


And if you notice any that you think should be included, you tell me about it in the comments.
Posted by Steve Wells at 3/23/2012 03:16:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
10 comments:
 The Wise Fool said...
Awesome idea! Just to clarify, are you looking for what should be political, or what is political? For example, turning the other cheek versus attacking "enemy" nations.
Fri Mar 23, 05:51:00 PM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Wise Fool,
I'm not sure yet, really. But I definitely want to include verses that the Religious Right uses to justify their politics. And I think it could also include verses that religious liberals use (or should use) as well.
Fri Mar 23, 06:18:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Don't forget the buffoon who said global climate change can't raise the sea levels because of Genesis 9:15. This was John Shimkus, and I'm mortified to say he's from my state (Illinois)... though he *is* a republican. See this link for the story and a nice picture of this intellectual giant:
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1110/44958.html
Steve Weeks
Fri Mar 23, 08:01:00 PM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Thanks, Stephen, I hadn't heard about John Shimkus' use of Genesis 9:15. (Although I see he also uses Gen 8:22, along with Mt 24:31. I don't see how the latter applies, however.)
I didn't see a reference to Gen 9.15, though, in the article. Did I miss it?
Fri Mar 23, 08:27:00 PM 2012 
 Jay said...
And your just preaching another religion that actually thinks we humans are causing global warming, oh I mean climate change. Yep, when I was a kid it was that humans are causing a new ice age.... I guess you sound as fanatical as the fundies you mock. lol
Fri Mar 23, 09:41:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Jay, I see what you're doing there. ;-)
However, you can't come on a skeptic site and call acceptance of anthropogenic global warming ("climate change") a religion and expect to be taken seriously. In the first place, you need to look up the definition of "religion". Secondly, no one here is going to consider such a label an argument for your point of view.
As a matter of fact, there is a broad consensus among *climate* scientists (the ones who have specific training and expertise in this area) that the climate changes we see are significantly influenced by human activity.
Even if the changes were independent of burning of fossil fuels, what is the problem with practicing conservation? These are finite resources. I like to think that my children's children and their descendants will be able to continue responsibly using them.
Let me guess: you own a Hummer, don't you? ;-)
Steve Weeks
Sat Mar 24, 03:47:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Here is what Shimkus said:
"I do believe in the Bible as the final word of God," Shimkus said. "And I do believe that God said the Earth would not be destroyed by a flood.
AFAIK, he did not quote Gen 9:15 by specific chapter and verse, but it seems pretty clear that he could have had that in what passes for his mind. Also, Gen 9:11 is perhaps more consistent with what Shimkus said:
"And I will establish my covenant with you, neither shall all flesh be cut off any more by the waters of a flood; neither shall there any more be a flood to destroy the earth."
I think requiring the politician to actually refer to the bible (or other holy book!) by chapter and verse, rather than merely allude to it may be setting the bar a bit high for inclusion in the new category. On the other hand, including verses that are only alluded to would require more interpretation, as well as locating the actual verse... that's a job for a scholar like you! :-)
What I hope we see, in addition to the bible thumpers using scripture quotes to support their policies, is rational (maybe even skeptical) politicians using quotes to refute them. Let the games begin!
Steve Weeks
Sun Mar 25, 07:50:00 AM 2012 
 Ian said...
Ever notice how people like Jay (or Rick Santorum), when they want to denigrate the work of scientists, they refer to science as a "religion". It's rather hilarious that they implicitly acknowledge the superiority of scientific knowledge to religious superstition, so they try to drag scientific knowledge back down to the level of belief in talking snakes and guys who rise from the dead (or fly to heaven on a winged horse).
Sun Mar 25, 10:49:00 AM 2012 
 Ian said...
On another note, Steve, can you find me the verses in the Bible that are the basis for the founding of this country? I hear the right wing constantly blather about how the US was founded on Christian principles, and yet I can't seem to find "all men are created equal" or "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" anywhere.
;-)
Sun Mar 25, 10:51:00 AM 2012 
 skanksta said...
I've no bible knowledge to help :(
Looking forward to this as it grows though :)
Tue Mar 27, 04:21:00 AM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 21 March 2012Help begin the collapse of Catholic morality
Have you ever asked yourself, "What can I do to help begin the collapse of Catholic morality?"
Well, if so, now you have your answer.


Do it now. Do it often. The world depends upon it.
(Via Pharyngula)
Posted by Steve Wells at 3/21/2012 10:25:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
3 comments:
 Sean M. said...
I'm the dutiful sort.
Fri Mar 23, 06:51:00 AM 2012 
 Gary Amaryllis said...
This video is sounds like a propaganda video from a cult. Very spooky. I'm glad I'm not catholic anymore.
Thu Jul 05, 07:35:00 PM 2012 
 Gary Amaryllis said...
This video is sounds like a propaganda video from a cult. Very spooky. I'm glad I'm not catholic anymore.
Thu Jul 05, 07:36:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 21 March 2012Richard Dawkins on absolute morality
Here is a video of Richard Dawkins' response to a question about absolute morality.


I liked his answer so much that I decided to quote it in full below, along with some relevant quotes from the Bible, Quran, and Hadith.
But first, here was the question from Hamsa Koreshi.
Question: My question is for professor Dawkins. Considering that Atheism cannot possibly have any sense of absolute morality,  would it not then be an irrational leap of faith, which atheists themselves so harshly condemn, for an atheist to decide between right and wrong?
And here is Dawkins' answer:
The absolute morality that a religious person might profess would include what, stoning people for adultery,
And the man that committeth adultery with another man's wife, even he that committeth adultery with his neighbour's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death. Leviticus 20.10
The Jew brought to the Prophet a man and a woman from amongst them who have committed (adultery) illegal sexual intercourse. He ordered both of them to be stoned (to death), near the place of offering the funeral prayers beside the mosque. Hadith Sahih Muslim
death for apostasy,
If thy brother ... or thy son, or thy daughter, or the wife of thy bosom, or thy friend, which is as thine own soul, entice thee secretly, saying, Let us go and serve other gods ... Thou shalt not consent unto him ... neither shall thine eye pity him ... But thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people. Deuteronomy 13.6-10
"Whoever changed his Islamic religion, then kill him." -- Muhammad Sahih al-Bukhari
punishment for breaking the Sabbath?
Whosoever doeth any work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death. Exodus 31.14
Six days shall work be done, but on the seventh day there shall be to you an holy day, a sabbath of rest to the LORD: whosoever doeth work therein shall be put to death. Exodus 35.2
They found a man that gathered sticks upon the sabbath day ... and the LORD said unto Moses, The man shall be surely put to death: all the congregation shall stone him with stones. Numbers 15.32-36 
Ye know of those of you who broke the Sabbath, how We said unto them: Be ye apes, despised and hated! And We made it an example to their own and to succeeding generations. Quran 2.65-66
These are all things which are religiously-based absolute moralities. I don't think I want an absolute morality. I think I want a morality that is thought out, reasoned, argued, discussed, and based upon what you could almost call an intelligent design.


Can we not design our society in such a way to have the sort of morality that we want to live in? If you actually look at the moralities that are accepted among modern people, among 21st century people: we don't believe in slavery anymore, we believe in the equality of women, we believe in being gentle, we believe in being kind to animals. Theses are all things which  are entirely recent. They have very little basis in Biblical or Quranic scripture. They are things that have developed over historical time through a consensus of reasoning, sober discussion, argument, legal theory, political and moral philosophy. They do not come from religion.

To the extent that you can find the good bits in religious scriptures you have to cherry pick. You search your way through the Bible or the Quran and find the occasional verse that is an acceptable profession of morality and we say, "Look at that! That's religion." You leave out all the horrible bits and you say, "Oh, we don't believe that anymore. We've grown out of it."
(In the SAB there are 1312 cruel passages vs. 503 good ones; the corresponding values for the Quran are  531 and 75.)
Well, of course we've grown out of it! We've grown out of it because of secular, moral philosophy  and rational discussion.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Check out Dawkins' most recent book, The Magic of Reality, a graphic science book written for children 12 and up.




Posted by Steve Wells at 3/21/2012 09:40:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
1 comment:
 Faisal said...
No we have not grown out of it. We have just chosen things which are preferable to us. We might do away with those too in a few centuries. Murder might be made "good" in the future when populations have risen. Morals always seem subjective to people. Morals are where we find a balance. You are subscribing to them for that reason alone, killing isn't inherently good or bad, it is just a human interpretation, love is just sex of two members of species working underneath, there are no actual morals. You have proven your yourself. You came from dust and will go to dust
Tue Mar 11, 03:00:00 PM 2014 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 20 March 20122 Nephi 11-24: Padding Isaiah
I know, I've neglected the Book of Mormon lately. Sorry about that.
But now that it looks like Mitt Romney will be the Republican nominee, I'm inspired to return to my efforts to slog through Mitt's favorite book. (Here's a list of my previous Blogging the BoM posts so you catch up on the details.)
So here goes.
In the last episode, we learned that Jews are the most wicked people on earth and that God gave America (his favorite country) to the Mormons.
In chapter 11, Nephi's little brother, Jacob, continues his preaching, saying "many more things," but, lucky for us, Nephi only wrote down those things that sufficed him.
And now, Jacob spake many more things to my people at that time; nevertheless only these things have I caused to be written, for the things which I have written sufficeth me. 2 Nephi 11:1
After sufficing himself with Jacob's words, Nephi decided to throw in another 13 or so chapters from the Book of Isaiah   (He's already included four chapters. See 1 Nephi 20-21; 2 Nephi 6-8), because he likes Isaiah so darned much (and he needs to make his little book a little bigger).
And now I, Nephi, write more of the words of Isaiah, for my soul delighteth in his words. 2 Nephi 11:2
Before doing that, though, Nephi tells us a bit more about Jesus.
If there's no Jesus, there's no God, and if there's no God, there's no creation. But there is a God and his name is Jesus and he'll be coming in his own time (about 570 years after Nephi's words.)
Behold, my soul delighteth in proving unto my people the truth of the coming of Christ ... And also my soul delighteth in the covenants of the Lord ... yea, my soul delighteth in his grace ... And my soul delighteth in proving unto my people that save Christ should come all men must perish. For if there be no Christ there be no God; and if there be no God we are not, for there could have been no creation. But there is a God, and he is Christ, and he cometh in the fulness of his own time. 2 Nephi 11:4-7
And with that, Nephi writes some words of Isaiah. (13 chapters: 2 Nephi 12-24)
And now I write some of the words of Isaiah. 2 Nephi 11:8
Which I'm going to skip, since it has nothing to do with Nephi's story. I recommend that you do too.
See you in Chapter 25.


Posted by Steve Wells at 3/20/2012 11:52:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
2 comments:
 Stephen said...
Jeezus Kee-ryst, that is poor writing. Mark Twain was right on the button when he called the BoM "chloroform in print".
How anyone could believe it was divinely inspired puzzleth me exceedingly. Nevertheless, it came to pass.
;-)
Steve Weeks
Wed Mar 21, 07:45:00 AM 2012 
 Stephen said...
And it came to pass that I, Steve, copied the following example of exceedingly poor writing from another of your "Blogging the Book of Mormon" posts:
"And now I would that ye might know, that after my father, Lehi, had made an end of prophesying concerning his seed, it came to pass that the Lord spake unto him again, saying that it was not meet for him, Lehi, that he should take his family into the wilderness alone; but that his sons should take daughters to wife, that they might raise up seed unto the Lord in the land of promise." 1 Nephi 7:1
For extra credit: diagram that sentence! Lots of luck! (LOL)
Steve Weeks
Mon Mar 26, 12:55:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 19 March 2012Luke 17:34 and Pray to be Gay Day
I don't know how I missed this before, but I did.
Luke 17:34, that is.
I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left.
 And since Jesus clearly said that only a small minority would be saved,
Then said one unto him, Lord, are there few that be saved? And he said unto them, Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. Luke 13:23-24
Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it. Matthew 7:13-14
the best way to improve your chances of being saved, if you are a man, is to go to bed with another man. (50% is better than a virtually zero chance.)
Or to spend you time grinding with other women, if you're a woman, as Jesus said in Luke 17:35.
Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
But what if you're not blessed enough to be gay? It's not too late: Pray to be gay!
There's even a special day and place for it: Pray to be Gay Day at the Reason Rally on March 24th.
Watch Thunderf00t's video for all the details.



Posted by Steve Wells at 3/19/2012 09:02:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
28 comments:
 Stephen said...
Steve, I'm sending you the bill for a new keyboard. You really *must* remember to put a warning header on your posts so folks don't have their mouths full when they read. ;-)
Steve Weeks
Mon Mar 19, 06:24:00 PM 2012 
 davelinne said...
This is wrong interpretation of the Bible. You interpreted this verses based on what you want and not what God want.
Two men in bed does not mean they are having sex. Those days, when they refer to two men in this circumstances, this means two brothers or relatives or friends living in the same room or house or place.
This is an example of how it would be like on that day. Meaning the fact that not everybody would be raptured because we might be in the same place at the same time and finds the other raptured.
Strait: Narrow
The meaning of strait in those days did not refer to gay"sm". It's nowadays that strait is translated to be gay or something related to that. This was not so in the olden days. Check all dictioneries you could find and read the meaning strait. The original meaning of Strait is "narrow", Sometime Strict, rigid, or righteous. The content of the verse mean; you can not change the word of God, you must abide God's instruction. Unlike wide road, where anything goes, and does not lead to heaven.
Do not interprete Holy Word of God according to what you want to hear or to please some people.
Wed Mar 21, 03:16:00 AM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
You're (more or less) right, davelinne. Jesus didn't mean it that way, if he said it at all, that is. But you've got to admit it sounds funny. And I love funny-sounding Bible verses. Don't you?
Wed Mar 21, 07:05:00 AM 2012 
 Stephen said...
@davelinne:
"This is wrong interpretation of the Bible. You interpreted this verses based on what you want and not what God want."
You seem to think you know what god wants. Here's a quote from Susan B. Anthony:
"I distrust those people who know so well what God wants them to do, because I notice it always coincides with their own desires."
I agree with her.
You also seem to have a lot of excuses for why two men would be in bed together... are you a catholic priest? And I suppose "two women shall be grinding together" means they are preparing food, eh? Open your eyes, my friend. There is sin all around you!
BTW, "strait" refers to the jacket you wear. "Straight" means "not homosexual". Hope this helps!
Steve Weeks
Sat Mar 24, 08:28:00 PM 2012 
 Ian said...
This is wrong interpretation of the Bible. You interpreted this verses based on what you want and not what God want.
This is hilarious. All anyone ever does in any religion is pretend that their narrow, selfish interests are what "God" wants. Look at Rick Santorum. He rants and raves about homosexuality and contraception because his church is against that, while completely ignoring all the Catholic teachings about social justice and against war. He's even a creationist despite the Catholic Church accepting evolution as fact.
Sun Mar 25, 10:41:00 AM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Sadly, most of these commenters like our friend davelinne are just "drive-by" posters. What are we supposed to do for laughs?
Steve Weeks
Wed Mar 28, 06:51:00 AM 2012 
 Raz said...
Homosexuals and the pro-homosexual lobby are so funny, got to love them, lol. The arguments they come up with, lol.
Sun Apr 08, 07:10:00 AM 2012 
 jacob said...
just gonna say, this is a completely false interpertation of the bible, and its not even that well hid. The book of luke was written within the century after Jesus' death. at this point in time, there was no "grinding" in our context of the word, plus he omitted a simple word, grain, which goes immediately after grinding in the verse he spouted. along with this, in the hebrew tradition, the entire family lived in basically one large room, ere, they were both in bed. Also in ine NIV translation, which i was using to check the verses. it replaces men with people, probably due to the fact that in hebrew, whenever more that one person is referenced, the male tense is used to describe them. In Romans 1:26-27 "For this reason God gave them up to vile passions. For even their women exchanged the natural use for what is against nature. 27 Likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust for one another, men with men committing what is shameful, and receiving in themselves the penalty of their error which was due." and this is all without even looking at the old testament books for their insight on the correct judgement of the act of homosexuality
Mon Apr 09, 11:37:00 AM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Calm down, Jacob. It's a joke.
Mon Apr 09, 11:55:00 AM 2012 
 Davina said...
this is called blasphemy. id be careful if i were you. Jacob is very wise in correcting you with scripture.
Mon Apr 23, 09:04:00 AM 2012 
 Davina said...
this is called blasphemy, Steve. i suggest you not do it and make jokes out of Gods holy word, or twist what scripture says. the bible states that what you have done is very wrong. Jacob is very wise in correcting you, and using scripture to do so.
Mon Apr 23, 09:07:00 AM 2012 
 Wes said...
Great post OP man, it seems as though you have a fresh perspective on words written, oh 2000 years ago? ha-ha
Props to you for not banning the drive by commentators. I would not have had nearly as much restraint. You decided not to hush them up as they attempt to hush your free thinking up.
Wed May 09, 03:16:00 PM 2012 
 Kinsey6 said...
Who cares what an outdated bronze-age book says. It has no relevance to today's society anyway. We have separation of church and state in the US. Our law is the Constitution, not the Bible, which some often mistakenly believe.
Sun Jun 24, 04:08:00 PM 2012 
 asherf said...
Davina: To really take the words of such an awful book and actually want to follow them makes Jacob by no means wise. What IS wise is observing the world. Homosexuality - in other species of animals as well as humans. Christianity? It is in one species only.
The fact you get strung up on this joke and feel that it somehow needs to be 'corrected' but do not have a problem with what some of the Bible says is reflecting badly on you right now.
Raz: This is a joke. In my country, the UK, no one has to come up with anything because we don't follow unreliable texts which lack validity we follow science (which includes observing). You don't have to observe much to realise homosexuality exists in Nature.
Mon Sep 24, 01:56:00 PM 2012 
 travis walton said...
To all those Christians who've responded on this post - I salute you.
And now, let us leave these homosexuals to their own acts and sinful thoughts - I really don't see why we should bother saving them.
Let them delude themselves in their misinterpretations and evil attempts at getting their kicks and having a laugh by mistranslating the Word of God.
Personally, I'm quite happy with the extra space in heaven that they choose to give up.
Thanks very much!
Mon Oct 01, 04:47:00 PM 2012 
 BLCashflow7 said...
Who ever wrote this a a complete idiot or undercover Devil worshiper on a mission to turn the hearts of the simple. I pray you get what GOD wants you to have for wasting your time being funny when people are looking for help and answers. Get'em LORD
Thu Jan 10, 12:16:00 AM 2013 
 Raz said...
asherf, you do not even provide any kind of argument in response to my post. A dogmatic statement on the reliability of the text, without any evidence. The statement that there is homosexuality in nature,so what ? There are many kinds of perverted things in nature. Animals have sex within their own family, eat them sometimes, have sex with other species, etc. Entertaining stuff, lol.
Mon Apr 01, 02:43:00 PM 2013 
 Hizzlebomb said...
Wow... It's amazing to see how angry people can become over something like this.
I'm a God fearing Christian and I found this interpretation of the verses funnny! Of COURSE that's not the way they're supposed to be interpreted, but I thought it was entertaining to read. OP(Steve) obviously has a sense of humor, and I for one, believe that God isn't austere 100% of the time. I think He has a sense of humor and I think He would chuckle to see this interpretation of His book :)
To those Christians who post here condemning everyone, you should be ashamed of yourselves... If I weren't feeling lazy, I would quote you a scripture about beams and motes... Just because someone believes differently than you doesn't mean you should condemn them. I happen to believe that homosexuality is a sin also, but that doesn't mean I go around telling gays that they are damned... What good does that do anyone? Jesus said, "Love one another". Are you saying those things because you love these people? Or because you love yourself? Consider it.
To asherf, Raz is right, there are plenty of ugly things done in nature that aren't ok, like incest, animals being eaten alive, etc. If I'm not mistaken, Black Widow females often eat their male counterparts after mating, which is why they are called black widows. So by your argument, it's ok for all females to be cannibals of their children's fathers? Hmmmm... Also, what would happen if our entire species turned homosexual? If you truly believe in science and evolution, you must also believe that a species would never knowingly engage in a behavior that would be detrimental to itself? And yet, if our entire species became homosexual, we would become extinct in a single generation. Just something to think about.
Personally I don't condemn gays, or anyone for that matter. I think everyone should be loved for who they are. That doesn't mean that people can't or shouldn't change, but I don't think hate is something God would condone among His children.
TLDR; everyone stop hating on each other ;)
Fri Jun 07, 08:11:00 AM 2013 
 Roger said...
Wow, how foolish to intentionally misinterpret God's Holy word like this.
I am very supportive of all the Christian responses to this subject. Especially Davelinne's comment (2nd from top) she explains things well.
Except:
Hizzlebomb.. you say you are a Christian but i really don't think you understand how much God hates homosexuality- i really don't think He would find this funny.
Yes God has an amazing sense of humour like you wouldn't believe; but what God says about homosexuality is this:
Leviticus 20:13
"If a man practices homosexuality, having sex with another man as with a woman, both men have committed a detestable act. They must both be put to death, for they are guilty of a capital offense."
God considers homosexuality worthy of death. So it's a very serious subject and no laughing matter.
The most important and relevant thing here is that God makes it very clear in the Bible that He loves EVERYONE and EVERYONE is a sinner (especially me).
At the end of today, irrelevant of our past and wrong doings, it's up to us to decide the next place we want to be when our time's up on this earth. And it's a choice we all have to make ourselves. The Bible says we all have two options.
Option A: Believe and love God and accept His gift of forgiveness and you will receive everlasting life in heaven (far more perfect and amazing then imaginable- earthly words cannot describe how good heaven is)
Option B: Don't love God and He will hand you over to Satan. In case you don't know, Satan lives in Hell. Hell is a long lasting place of suffering, pain, torment, lot's of fire and is a terrible place that earthly words cannot describe.
The only up-side to Hell is that it will be destroyed by Jesus Christ.. one day.
And yet some people seem to think that there is an 'in-between' option: and that option is 6ft under, full stop. But the fact is that God has not included that option in the Bible as an eternal option-
6ft under is only where our dead earthly body's go. Our spirit and soul goes to Option A or Option B. Once you are there, you can't change your decision.
Personally I like the sound of Option A the best.
I pray God would Bless ya whether you agree with God or not.
Mon Jun 17, 07:22:00 PM 2013 
 Jason L. said...
I always found it kind of odd that so many Christians (especially Catholics) insist on making homophobic remarks towards homosexuals. Doesn't this constitute "throwing stones"? We all know what Jesus had to say about "throwing stones." But Catholics follow the teachings of the Catechisms, right? Now pay attention to the part in bold:
2357 Homosexuality refers to relations between men or between women who experience an exclusive or predominant sexual attraction toward persons of the same sex. It has taken a great variety of forms through the centuries and in different cultures. Its psychological genesis remains largely unexplained. Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity,141 tradition has always declared that "homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered."142 They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved.
2358 The number of men and women who have deep-seated homosexual tendencies is not negligible. This inclination, which is objectively disordered, constitutes for most of them a trial. They must be accepted with respect, compassion, and sensitivity. Every sign of unjust discrimination in their regard should be avoided. These persons are called to fulfill God's will in their lives and, if they are Christians, to unite to the sacrifice of the Lord's Cross the difficulties they may encounter from their condition.
2359 Homosexual persons are called to chastity. By the virtues of self-mastery that teach them inner freedom, at times by the support of disinterested friendship, by prayer and sacramental grace, they can and should gradually and resolutely approach Christian perfection.
Fri Jun 21, 05:27:00 PM 2013 
 Wolfe Tundra said...
Roger, don't forget that God also said do not wear clothing woven from two different kinds of thread (Leviticus 19:19), do not shave your sideburns or trim your beard (Leviticus 19:27), any person who curses their parent shall be put to death (Leviticus 20:9), if a man cheats on his wife, or vise versa, both the man and the woman must die (Leviticus 20:10), psychics, wizards, and so on are to be stoned to death (Leviticus 20:27) and people who have flat noses, or is blind or lame, cannot go to an altar of God (Leviticus 21:17-18). Oh, and for kickers, God also said all non-believers are to be killed (Deuteronomy 13:5/6/12 and 172). Get your rifle folks! It's [non-believer] hunting season!
If you're going to follow part of a Bible (God says all gays should be killed) then follow all of it and kill yourself for cutting your hair.
Sat Jun 29, 03:10:00 PM 2013 
 Roger said...
Wolfe, yes I have not forgotten what God says in Leviticus. (although some of what you said is not entirely accurate and you and I don't completely understand some of what God is referring to. And you and I don't entirely understand the culture of the Israelite's who God is talking to at the time this book was written)
By no means at all is Leviticus or Deuteronomy asking anyone to kill anyone in today's society- The laws in Leviticus and Deuteronomy is old covenant. We live in the new covenant. What’s the difference? Well the laws are still the same. The punishment is still the same. They are everlasting laws, as is written in both the new and old testament. The difference between the old and new covenant is way God carries out the punishment. He did the dirty work for us when Jesus took the punishment of everyone’s sin on the cross, so we don’t have to take matters into our own hands and kill someone ourselves because God says to. That’s not the way God wants our society to work.
God sent his son Jesus to die on the cross for everyone, but God also offers everyone a deal: Believe in His Son Jesus, be thankful for what He did for you on the cross and ask Jesus to be the Saviour of your life, and He will take away the punishment you deserve.
Jesus took our place so that if we have Jesus in our heart when we are judged, God sees only Jesus' perfection in our heart, and not our own wicked ways; thus accepts us into heaven…
This can be all challenging for us to understand.
And I certainly know I don't have the ability to understand most of God's ways.
But.. It would be beyond crazy to choose this world over perfect eternity!
Message to all non-Christians:
I promise with all my heart- God is real!
And if your time on earth comes to an end and I am wrong- We both gain nothing.
BUT if your time on earth comes to an end and God is real- You loose everything.
Sat Jul 13, 08:09:00 PM 2013 
 USMCPatriot said...
Roger,
If you "don't completely understand some of what God is referring to" then "he" didn't do a very good job of writing a clear set of "instructions" - since that's what you obviously think the Bible is. That makes god an incompetent author.
You point out that "Leviticus or Deuteronomy (aren't) asking anyone to kill anyone in today's society" because they are the "old covenant." Okay, ask yourself this - would you have thought it proper to obey the direction to kill others for mixing threads or crops - or for homosexuality - if you had lived in the time of Moses? Was it EVER good or moral to do these things? (and please don't rationalize that whatever god says is moral)
As usual, I'm confused by the idea that "god sent his son Jesus to die on the cross for everyone" for two reasons. One, do you believe Jesus IS dead? Because he would have to be to fulfill your statement. Temporary death doesn't count, because "he" didn't give up anything, did he, if Jesus isn't DEAD with a capital "D"? (unlike Wesley in the Princess Bride, who was only "mostly dead") And that whole "only begotten son" thing is another issue - you believe "he" can and did create the entire UNIVERSE... but can't manage to have another kid? Really? Second, why the need to "send someone to die in our place"? Would you need to watch your own child sacrificed in order for YOU to forgive the transgression of a friend... or would you simply forgive him? Apply a little logic, and try not to use canned non-answers such as "we can't know the mind of god."
You closed with a weak rendition of Pascal's Wager, but you have obviously never thought it through. One, you would have to believe in every god and religion to make it work (after all, what if YOU are wrong, and the Muslims, Hindus, etc are right?), and if you feign belief (which is the essence of the Wager) would not an omniscient god know you were faking?
Then you state, "It would be beyond crazy to choose this world over perfect eternity!" Really? Think about how long eternity is(hint: it never ends). Now explain to us what happens in a "perfect eternity." Do you have a body as some believe, or do you float around, disembodied, forever? Are there endless first run movies? (who would make them?) Is there golf? (in a perfect eternity, would every shot be a hole in one?) Is there sex? (with whom?) Do you think you would be BORED? As Susan Ertz once wrote, "Million yearn for eternity, who can't decide what to do on a rainy afternoon." The reality, Roger, is your desire for "perfect eternity" is simply a way to mitigate your natural fear of death... just as the Egyptians did when they placed mummies in pyramids enroute (or so they believed) to the "afterlife." Do you think they ever got there? How about the Greeks? They put coins on the eyes of their dead to pay the ferryman when they crossed into the netherworld. Were they wasting their time? Of course. So what makes you think YOUR fairy tale is any different? It's not.
Message to all Christians:
I promise with all my BRAIN (we don't think with our hearts, now do we?) - God is NOT real! Now stop wasting time on pie-in-the-sky superstition, and get busy living the only life you will ever have.
Wed Jul 24, 12:19:00 PM 2013 
 Jamin Sim said...
"Ha ha, the bible sounds so funny in modern context."
1 Corinthians 3:19 NIV
For the wisdom of this world is foolishness in God’s sight. As it is written: “He catches the wise in their craftiness"...
You guys are all pretending to be smart saying that we can't know what "God" really wants, or that he doesn't exist. If you think this is all a joke, you're all fools. If you want to prove us Christians wrong, first you have to understand what the bible says, not just see what it says.
The bible does say that all acts of homosexuality should not go unpunished, but everybody sins. That's why Jesus came to die for us. He died as a replacement for us so that we don't have to go to hell, unless we just completely ignore his sacrifice. Jesus forgave and forgives all sins. Accept his forgiveness by turning from your evil ways. He will give you a second chance. If you don't, there will be punishment. No doubt about it.
We will pray for you.
Mon Jul 29, 08:51:00 AM 2013 
 USMCPatriot said...
Jamim,
When will Christians learn that the silliest thing you can do is make an argument which relies upon a Bible verse? Who cares what it says in Corinthians? (for perspective, how would you respond to someone quoting the Quran?)
Saying, "If you want to prove us Christians wrong, first you have to understand what the bible says, not just see what it says." As usual, YOU have "interpreted" it correctly... right?
Then you use another tired theist tactic with your Appeal to Fear when you say, "If you don't, there will be punishment." That rings hollow when you are threatening people who don't believe in hell!
Then you add, "No doubt about it." Really? If that was true, this conversation would not be taking place, would it? Just because you believe something doesn't make it true. Just ask any Muslim... Hindu... victim of alien abduction... or Elvis-sighter.
Mon Jul 29, 03:23:00 PM 2013 
 Roger said...
Good on ya Jamim Sim, bless ya bro.. keep it up!
Wow USMCPatriat, you are so blind to see what God is doing in your life. All your arguments have a self centered reference point.
Haha, you said ‘I promise with all my brain’.. that’s original! You can’t believe in something you can’t see with your brain**! You need something deeper, like a gut feeling, which is where the term ‘with all my heart’ comes from. Like Jamim said, this is no joke.
(**unless someone else you know well sees it and they are so sure it is real, which I believe is why many people believe in God, even though they may not ever see God in real while living on earth. John 20:19 says ‘Then Jesus told his disciple, “Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.”’)
If you are depending on your earthly brain to live this life on earth, then that is all you will live (and you would live in hell too of course). If you are happy with that- then good on ya. But no way am I settling for second best when God says He has so much more in-store for me.
I'm not going to waste any more time picking apart all the reasons for why you don't think God is real.
I’m not here to argue. I’m here to proclaim God’s good news- Jesus is Alive! Hallelujah!
I can't express this enough- God loves you! You can't imagine what God has in-store for you if you don’t allow yourself to move towards God.
It’s only by God’s actions that you exsist.
It’s only be Jesus’ actions that you can be saved.
It’s only by your actions that you can believe, accept his forgiveness and strive to live according to God’s plan.
God is calling you, now and always, to take up His challenge, and follow Him.
At times you may let yourself down. But God won’t let you down.

Sat Aug 10, 10:22:00 PM 2013 
 Charlotte P said...
I feel like many of you are missing the point here. This is not serious. This is not about whether it is right or wrong to be homosexual. This is not even about how homosexuality is portrayed in the bible. Rather, this appears to be a commentary on how the bible can be used to support any opinion, depending on your interpretation. Of course this isn't how the bible was meant to be interpreted, but what it seems to be trying to say is that everyone will interpret things differently, and using bible verses to back up your arguments is extremely flimsy. Although that's just my interpretation of something that clearly can also be interpreted many different ways.
Sun Nov 10, 12:26:00 PM 2013 
 El_salluz said...
...aaaaaaaaand Charlotte P brought closure to this blog.
Tue Jan 21, 10:00:00 PM 2014 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 17 March 2012What did Muhammad look like? A detailed description from the Ash-Shifa
Here is a list of interesting facts about the Prophet Muhammad (PB&J be upon him) from Ash-Shifa: "The best biography of the Prophet Muhammad in 800 years." Ash-Shifa is highly regarded throughout the Muslim world, where it is said, "If Ash-Shifa is found in a house, this house will not suffer any harm." So it's a good book to have around. (I keep my copy in the bathroom on top of the Quran.)
Intelligence
The illiterate prophet of Islam was more intelligent than all other humans combined. Galileo, Newton, Einstein, and Darwin had nothing on Mo.
If all the intelligence of humanity, from the first to the last, were to be gathered as one, it would be in comparison to the intelligence of the Prophet... as a single grain of sand." p.49
His knowledge encompassed all sciences in full. p.211
General qualities
He was the best, the greatest, the most perfect human being. Allah liked him more than anyone else.
Allah … made him the most perfect human being. p.12
 The Messenger of Allah … is the best of the People p.18
 Prophet Muhammad … is by far the most worthy and the greatest of all mankind. p.44
 Lady Ayesha, Mother of Believers … tells us that the Prophet … said, "Gabriel came to me and said, 'I searched the East and the West of the earth and saw no man better than Muhammad.” p.96
Allah preferred Muhammad to the angels of the heavens and all the other prophets. p.99 
Allah honored Muhammad above the inhabitants of the heavens of the earth. p.108
As for the normal shadows that are cast by either the light of the sun or moon, he had none because he himself was radiant with his own light. p.218 
Humility
Mo said that he was the most  generous, courageous, and powerful person to ever exist. He had more sex than Wilt Chamberlain  and more followers than Lady Gaga. Allah likes him more than you and Allah likes his wives more than yours. He was the most eloquent Arab; the most honored and noblest of the children of Adam; and he'll have 1000 adoring youths surrounding him in paradise. And this is no boast.
The Prophet ... said, "I have been preferred over my nation in four things – generosity, courage, abundance of sexual intercourse and great power." p.57
The Prophet … addressed the people, saying, "O gathering of believers! Allah … has preferred me greatly over you, and He has preferred my wives greatly over yours." pp.102-3
The Prophet … told his Companions, "I am the most eloquent of Arabs.” p.52
The Prophet … spoke of his honored position saying, "I am the most honored of the children of Adam with my Lord, and this is no boast."  p.96
The Prophet … said, “I am the noblest of the children of Adam before my Lord, and this is no boast." p.121
"I am the noblest of all the children of Adam with my Lord, and this is no boast. A thousand youths of Paradise will go about me as if they were hidden pearls." p.121
The Prophet  … spoke … saying, "On the Day of Resurrection I will be the master of the Children of Adam and the Banner of Praise will be in my hand, and this is not a boast. p.121
All the prophets from the time of Adam will come under my banner, and I will be the first for whom the earth splits open, and this is no boast." p.121
I will be the one with the most followers. p.121
Modesty
Mo was a modest person, especially when it came to exposing his private parts. No one, not even his favorite wife, Ayesha, ever saw him naked. Good thing, too, because if they did, they'd go blind.
 The Prophet ...  was a modest person. 57
When Prophet Muhammad ... took part in the rebuilding of Ka'ba, he was about raise his robe ... but he was prevent by the heaven ... When his uncle asked what ... stopped him, he replied, "I have been prevented from exposing my privates." p.217
Lady Ayesha … said, "I never saw the private parts of the Messenger of Allah." … The Prophet ... asked Imam Ali to ensure that no one other than himself should wash him (his covered body after his death). He told him, "No one has ever seen me naked, and if it were to happen he would become blind." p.48
Appearance
Mo was the most handsome man that ever existed. His eyes were black, with natural mascara with a slight tinge of pink, accentuated by long eyelashes. His complexion was fair, his beard reached his chest, and his fingers were long. The hair on his chest formed a fine line, but the rest of his body was completely hairless.  His feet were so smooth that water ran off them. (Good info for Draw Muhammad Day.)
He was the most handsome man ever created, surpassing the beauty of Prophet Joseph for whom the women of the city cut their hands. p.44
The complexion of Prophet Muhammad … was radiant. His eyes were black, deep, widely set, and naturally mascaraed with a slight tinge of pink, accentuated by long eyelashes. p.45
His beard was thick and reached his chest. ... His fingers were long and … the hair between his chest and navel was fine. He was of medium stature, however, when a tall person walked by his side the Prophet … appeared to be the taller. As for his hair it was neither curly nor straight and when he laughed his teeth were visible like a flash of lightning, or, they have been described as white as hailstones. p.45
Allah did not send a prophet without making his face and voice beautiful, and that Prophet Muhammad … had the most handsome face of all of them and also the best voice. p.86
The Prophet … His complexion was fair … his nose was long and had a line of light over it that someone might, unthinkingly, suppose to be his nose. His beard was thick, and his eyes were black and naturally mascared. His cheeks were firm and his mouth wide with evenly spaced teeth. The hair on his chest formed a fine line. His neck was as if it were fashioned from pure silver. p.91
The Prophet's physique was finely balanced, and his body firm and muscular. His belly was equal in size to his chest. His chest was broad and the space between his shoulders wide. His calves were full. He was luminous! p.91
Between the neck and navel of the Prophet ... there was a fine line of hair, however the rest of his torso was free from hair … His feet were so smooth that water ran off them. p.92
Ancestry and pre-existence
Mo came from a long line of non-fornicators. There was not a single female fornicator in 500 generations. Allah created Mo's spirit 2000 years before Adam, putting him into the loins of Adam, Noah, and Abraham. He moved Mo from their noble loins into one pure womb after another, until finally Allah put Mo's spirit into the loins and womb of his parents.
From the time of Prophet Adam … there was neither an adulterer nor fornicator in the lineage of the Prophet, all were officially married. p.13
A line of no less than five hundred female ancestors of the Prophet ... He too verified that none had fornicated. p.13
The spirit of the Prophet ...  was a light in the hands of Allah two thousand years before He created Adam … and when Allah created Adam, He cast that light into his loins.” p.53
The Prophet ...  said, "Allah brought me down to earth in the loins of Adam, then He placed me in the loins of Noah and thereafter cast me into the loins of Abraham. Allah proceeded to move me from one noble loin and pure womb to another until He brought me out of my parents. None of them were ever joined together in fornication." pp.53, 96
You came through … as a drop that …was transferred from loin to womb. … When you were born, the earth shone And the horizon was illuminated by your light. p.97
Birth
Mo was born clean and already circumcised, with a pre-cut umbilical cord. Allah sent meteors to scare away any satans and jinns that were hanging around at the time of his birth.
When the Prophet … was born he was already circumcised and his umbilical cord cut.  … He was clean when he was born. p.46
Upon the Prophet's birth ...  the heavens became guarded by meteors that chase would-be eavesdroppers away and thereby prevent the mischief of the satans and jinn. p.217
Name
Allah assigns angels to visit each house with an Ahmad or Muhammad in it. Consequently, houses with one to three Muhammads are always prosperous, along with everyone else in the neighborhood. And whoever is named Muhammad has a sure-fire ticket to heaven, based on the name alone.
Allah has angels, who as an element of their worship, visit each house that has a person called Ahmad or Muhammad in it on account of the honor in which they hold Muhammad." p.101
Prophet Muhammad ...  said, "No harm will come if he has, one, two or three Muhammad's in the house." p.102
There isn't an unprosperous house in which there is the name Muhammad. All the people of that house are provided for and likewise their neighbors. p.102
On the Day of Resurrection a call will be given, 'Let whosoever is named Muhammad stand up and enter the Garden by the meritorious honor of his name.' p.102 
Sexual prowess
Mo was endowed with the power of 30 to 40 men. He'd visit each of his wives in the same hour, taking a purification bath between each visit. Solomon had as much semen as 100 men, so just imagine the load that Mo could deliver!
There is, however, an extra virtue the satisfaction of satisfying a wife's need. The Prophet … was given an abundance of this ability and would visit all of his wives in the same hour. Anas and his companions concluded that he had been given the power of thirty men. p.56
In the matter of sexual intercourse, the Prophet was endowed with the power of forty men. After having visited each wife he would take a purification bath before going to the next and said, "This is better and purer." p.56
Prophet Solomon and Prophet David were endowed with the same ability. Prophet Solomon said, "During the night I visited a hundred or ninety-nine women. Abbas' son said, "In the loins of Solomon there was the semen of a hundred men, and he had three hundred wives and three hundred whom the right hand possesses." It has also been reported that he had seven hundred wives. As for Prophet David, he had ninety-nine wives. p.56
Eyesight
Mo could see stuff behind him just like it was in front of him, and could see as well in the dark as in the light. He could even see eleven of the 1000 or so stars in the Pleiades. Since Moses could spot an ant from 30 miles away, just imagine what Mo was able to see!
The Prophet... told his Companions, "I see the one behind my neck just as I see the one before me." … When the Messenger of Allah ... arose from prayer he could see everyone behind him, just as if they were in front of him." p.49
The Prophet could see just as well in the dark as he could see in the light. p.49
His clear-sightedness permitted him to see the eleven stars in the Pleaides. p.49
Prophet Moses, Moses was able to see an ant on a stone a distance of thirty miles away." So imagine what Prophet Muhammad … was able to see. 49 
Sweat
Mo's sweat smelled sweet.
 The Prophet … was adorned with the sweetest of fragrances, as was his perspiration. p.46
 The Prophet … visited the house of Anas and fell asleep on a rug and perspired. When Anas's mother noticed the perspiration she fetched a long necked bottle into which she collected the drops of perspiration. Later, the Messenger of Allah … inquired about it, whereupon she replied, "We mixed it with our perfume and it is the most fragrant of scents." pp.46-47
Urine
Mo's urine smelled even better than his sweat. It smelled so good, in fact, that the earth split open to swallow the prophet's pee, leaving a fragrant aroma behind. Apparently this happened with prophet pooped, as well, since the earth swallowed whatever he discharged. Many people drank Mo's urine, with his permission and consent, and they all swore it tasted sweet.
Even when the Prophet … relieved himself, it is reported that the earth would split open and swallow his discharge and there remained a fragrant aroma. p.47
Lady Ayesha … said to the Prophet … "When you return after relieving yourself, there is nothing offensive about you." He replied, "O Ayesha, don't you know that the earth swallows up what is discharged from the prophets so that nothing is seen?" p.47
The Prophet... kept a wooden bowl under his bed in which, if he felt the need, he could urinate during the night. One night a lady by the name of Baraka,, … felt thirsty and upon seeing the cup drank the urine without knowing. There were also similar occurrences in which his urine was drunk, when the Prophet... learned of it he did not order the washing of their mouth nor did he forbid them to do it again. … The output from his body was sweeter and the drinker did not taste any urine as they would do so with anyone else. p.48
Mo's teaching about wives
It is good for a man to have more than one wife; the best man is the one with the most wives.
It is praiseworthy for a man to have more than one wife, referring to the Prophet … Abbas' son said, "The best of this community is the one with the most wives." p.55
About celibacy
Whoever can get married should get married. It protects the private parts.
The Prophet … forbade celibacy … and said, "Whosoever is able to marry should marry, it lowers the eyes and protects the private parts." p.55 
About religion
All true religion is based on cleanliness.
The Prophet … said, ”The religion is based on cleanliness." p.46
About Adam
Adam was 90 feet tall.
Prophet Muhammad ...  said, "The first group to enter the Garden of Paradise will be like the full moon … every man will be in the height of their father Adam who was sixty cubits (90 feet) tall." p.86
About Moses and Jesus
Moses wall tall with red hair. He was like the best man you've ever seen with a dark complexion. Mo looks more like him than anyone else does. But nobody ever saw any part of Moses' body on account of his modesty.
Jesus had a red face, just like he'd come out of a hot bath.
Prophet Muhammad … tells us, "I saw Moses, he was tall with curly hair.” … I saw Jesus, he was of medium height with a reddish face just as if he had come out after having taken a hot bath." p.86
The Prophet … gave additional information about Moses saying, "He is like the best men you have ever seen with a dark complexion." ….  Of himself the Prophet ...  said, "Among the descendants of Abraham, I am the one who most resembles him." p.86
Prophet Muhammad … tells us that Prophet Moses was a modest man who covered himself. No part of his body was seen on account of his modesty. p.87
About sickness
The root of all illness is indigestion.
Of illness, the Prophet ...  informs us of his knowledge saying, "The root of every illness is indigestion." p.211
About progress and innovation
 Follow Mo and beware of new things. New things are innovations and all innovations are misguided.
The Prophet ...  warned, ”You must follow my prophetic way and the way of the rightly guided Caliphs. Cling to it voraciously and beware of new things. New things are innovations and each innovation (that is not in the Spirit of Islam) is misguidance." p.226
About knowledge
There are only three type of knowledge: verse, prophetic way, and inheritance. All other knowledge is superfluous.
The Prophet ...  spoke of knowledge saying, "There are three types of knowledge; a precise verse, an established prophetic way, and a just share of inheritance. All other knowledge is superfluous." p.226
Miracles
One of Mo's favorite miracles was to make water come out of his fingers. Another was to talk trees into forming a screen so he could pee without anyone seeing. Rocks, trees, mountains, and lizards talked and bowed to Mo as he walked by.
There are many reports by the Companions that relate to numerous occasions when water was witnessed flowing from the fingers of the Prophet. p.168
Messenger of Allah ...  felt the need to relieve himself however there was nothing to screen him. So the Messenger of Allah ...  went to one of the trees and took hold of a branch and said, "Let me lead you by the permission of Allah" and gently proceeded to lead it like a haltered camel. He did the same with the other tree until the trees stood side by side, then he said to them "By the permission of Allah, join together for me" and this they did. p.175
The trees parted from each other … The Prophet ...  felt the need to relieve himself and asked if there was anywhere. Osama told him that the dried up water bed had no place of concealment, so the Prophet ...  asked if any palm trees or stones had been seen. Osama told him that he had seen some scattered palm-trees and some stones, so the Prophet ...  said, "Go and tell them that the Messenger of Allah commands them to come to his assistance … I saw the palm-trees draw near to each other until they joined and the stones came together until they formed a mound behind the Prophet. After he had relieved himself he told Osama to tell them to part, and Osama swore again saying, "By He who sent him with the truth, I saw the palm-trees and stones part and return to their places." pp.175-6
When the Prophet ...  was visiting a certain district in Mecca and as he passed each and every tree and mountain it greeted him saying 'Peace be upon you, O Messenger of Allah." p.179
Lady Ayesha that when Gabriel came to him with a message, every stone or tree he passed would greet him saying, "Peace be upon you, O Messenger of Allah." p.179
When the Prophet, praise and peace be upon happened to pass by a tree or rock it would bow to him. p.179
The Prophet ...  called the lizard and it answered in clear human speech so that everyone could hear, "Obedient to you, O adornment of the One who will bring the Resurrection!" The Prophet ...  asked the lizard, "Who do you worship? And it replied, "The One whose throne is in the heaven and whose power is in the earth, whose path is in the sea, whose mercy is in the Garden, and whose punishment is in the Fire." Then the Prophet ...  asked, "Who am I?" and it replied, "The Messenger of the Lord of the Worlds and the Seal of the Prophets. Whosoever bears witness that this is so is successful and whosoever belies you is lost!" p.181
The Prophet ...  who thereafter gave him a branch of a palm-tree saying, "Take it with you, it will shed light for you an arms length before you and an arms length behind you. When you enter your house you will see something dark. Beat it until it leaves because it is satan." p.195
Cures
Mo made a 70 year old man look like he was 15, and a 120 year old man to die without any broken teeth. He cured insane people by stroking their chests. And he stopped a couple young boys from crying by letting them suck on his tongue.
The Prophet ...  supplicated for Abu Katada saying, "May your face prosper! O Allah, bless him in his hair and skin." Abu Katada died at the age of seventy but looked no older than fifteen. p.190
An-Nabigha lived till the age of one hundred and twenty, the Prophet ...  supplicated for him saying, "May Allah not break your teeth" and none of his teeth fell out. p.190 
Whenever an insane person was brought to the Prophet ...  he would stroke their chest and the insanity would leave them. p.196 
The grandsons of the Prophet, Al Hasan and Al Hussain ... were young and crying on account of thirst. The Prophet ...  gave him his tongue to suck and thereafter they stopped crying. p.194 
Curses
Mo could curse as well as cure. He made a man lame for praying against him, and sent a lion to eat another for the same crime. He paralyzed a guy for eating with his left hand, and caused placenta-wielding unbelievers to be killed in battle. He sent a fatal disease on a man's knee for trying to break his staff. And he made a horse lame to punish its owner for lying.
One day a young man stopped praying, and the Prophet ... supplicated against him and he became lame. p.192
Utba, Abi Lahab's son was one of the enemies of the Prophet, praise and peace be upon him, and he supplicate against him saying, "O Allah, give one of your carnivores power over him", later he was devoured by a lion. p.192 
Muhallim, Jaththama's son was another of the vehement enemies of the Prophet ...  and was subjected to his curse. Muhallim was killed by a wild beast and every time an attempt to bury him was made, the earth rejected him and threw his body to its surface. Finally they threw his corpse between a gully and covered him with stones. p.192 
The Prophet ...  saw a man eating with his left hand and advised him, "Eat with your right hand." The man arrogantly replied, "I am not able to do so." The Prophet ...  said, "You will not be able to do so," and thereafter the man was never able to raise his right hand to his mouth. p.192
Masood's son tells us of the time when the unbelievers among the Koraysh put a placenta full of fluid and blood around the Prophet's neck whilst he was prostrate in prayer to Allah. The Prophet ...  cursed each of the participants, name by name, and during the Battle of Badr each one met their death. p.192
Jihjah Al Ghifari snatched hold of the Prophet's staff from Othman's hand and proceeded to try and break it across his knee. Upon seeing this the people shouted at him. Thereafter he was stricken by an itching disease in his knee and despite its amputation he died within the year. p.255
A certain man denied that he had sold his horse and only gave up his claim to ownership after the Prophet ...  supplicated, "O Allah, if he is lying, do not give him any blessing in it" whereupon the legs of the horse became rigid. p.192
Miscellaneous facts
Talking meat, groovy gestures, rapt audiences, and Mo's special fly repellent.
A Jewess poisoned the meat she had prepared for the Prophet. … The meat spoke to him telling him that it had been poisoned. p.65
If he happened to point to something, he pointed with his entire hand. When something surprised him he would turn the palm of his hand upside down. When talking, he held his right thumb in his left palm.  p.92
When he spoke, those sitting with him sat still, as if they had birds perched on their heads. p.94
Flies did not alight on either his clothes or body. p.218
BustedTees - The Best Thing To Happen To T-Shirts Since Sleeves
Posted by Steve Wells at 3/17/2012 03:18:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
8 comments:
 Andy said...
It sounds like Mo could have taken on the Legion of Doom all by himself.
Sat Mar 17, 03:53:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Well, that is just such a load of bullshit I am speechless.
Steve weeks
Sat Mar 17, 07:21:00 PM 2012 
 The Wise Fool said...
That is epically hilarious! Anyone who believes Ash-Shifa proves themselves of being devoid of critical thinking.
Sun Mar 18, 07:18:00 AM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Wisefool,
Yeah, I'm hoping Anubis will explain it to us. I'm sure that somehow or other 90% of it is just common sense.
Sun Mar 18, 09:12:00 AM 2012 
 nazani said...
A teensy point- I believe the translator meant eyeliner, not mascara. I wonder if the original word referred to kohl, a common cosmetic in the Middle East.
Wish I'd been there to see somebody plop a placenta (camel?) on Mo's head. That would have been hilarious.
Mon Mar 19, 06:30:00 AM 2012 
 skanksta said...
That was enough insanity for about 3 posts.
I need to lie down.
Mon Mar 19, 10:57:00 AM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Yeah, skanksta, I thought about doing a series of Ash-Shifa posts, but I didn't want you to think I was obsessed with Mo's insanity (PB&J be upon him, of course).
Mon Mar 19, 11:36:00 AM 2012 
 lovemuslimah said...
You should really be more intellectually honest with your readers.


Question: What is your opinion about the book al-Shifâ’ by al-Qâdî `Iyâd?
Answered by Sheikh Khâlid Husayn

This book is a valuable book on the subject of the Prophet’s virtues, though had it some weak and false hadîth in it.
This is the statement of Imam Shams al-Dîn al-Dhahabî in his immense biographical encyclopedia entitled Siyar A`lâm al-Nubalâ’. In his biographical entry on al-Qâdî `Iyâd (20/212-216), he writes: “His writings are valuable and one of his best works would have been his book al-Shifâ’ had it not been filled with fabricated hadîth.”
This Imam has no experience or knowledge in the science of hadîth. May Allah reward him for his good intention and let people benefit from his book al-Shifâ’. It has proven useful for many people.
It includes some far-fetched interpretations. Our Prophet (peace be upon him) is sufficiently praised by the Qur’ân and the authentic hadîth. We have no need for false hadîth.
It is better to read Dalâ’il al-Nubuwwah by al-Bayhaqî instead. Though it also contains weak hadîth, Imam al-Bayhaqî has done good job by providing the chains of transmission for them so that the student of knowledge may refer to hadîth books and determine the strength and weakness of the hadîth for himself. This is not the case with al-Shifâ’.
And Allah knows best.


As for the physical description of the Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him), this should be sufficient:
Al-Baraa' ibn 'Aazib said: "The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) was broad shouldered and had thick hair coming down to his shoulders and earlobes. He was wearing red garments. I have never seen anything more beautiful than him." (Reported by Muslim, Kitaab al-Fadaa'il, Baab Sifat Sha'r al-Nabi (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him), no. 2338).
'Ali said: "He was neither tall nor short, and had large hands and feet. He had a large head and was big-boned, and the thin line of hair (starting from his chest and extending to the navel) was long. When he walked, he would lean forward, as if he was walking downhill. I have never seen anyone like him, before or since." (Reported by al-Tirmidhi, 3570, who said this is a saheeh hasan hadeeth).
Jaabir ibn Samurah said: "The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) was dalee' al-fam, ashkal al-'ayn and manhoos al-'aqib." Shu'bah said: "I asked Maalik, 'What is dalee' al-fam?' He said: 'Wide-mouthed.' I asked, 'What is ashkal al-'ayn?' He said, 'Big-eyed.' I asked, 'What is manhoos al-'aqib?' He said, 'His heels were not fleshy.'" (Saheeh Muslim, Kitaab al-Fadaa'il, 2339).
Anas Ibn Maalik, may Allaah be pleased with him, narrated: "Allaah's Messenger had a rosy colour and he was neither completely white nor dark brown." [Al-Bukhaari]
"The Prophet had a white handsome face." [Muslim]
"Allaah's Messenger had reddish-black eyes." [Muslim]

I cannot wait to see him in Paradise, God-willing. <3
Thu Jan 03, 02:55:00 PM 2013 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 08 March 2012Netanyahu's Purim gift to President Obama: The Book of Esther (and a war with Iran)
Well, it's Purim time again, when Jews celebrate the day their ancestors supposedly killed 75,000 Persians in a preemptive strike because the Persians supposedly planned to kill the Jews. (DIU: The Esther Killings.)
The story is found in the Book of Esther, which Israel's Prime Minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, recently gave to President Obama as a Purim gift. Since ancient Persia is modern Iran, the message behind the gift is clear enough: let's do it again.
I hope that President Obama takes the time to read the Book of Esther, if he hasn't already. It's a silly, disgusting story that every Jew (and Christian) should be ashamed of, rather than celebrate -- or, worse yet, imitate.
There is no hope for peace in the world as long its leaders are inspired by the Bible and the Quran.

Posted by Steve Wells at 3/08/2012 04:18:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
4 comments:
 The Theist said...
Purim is celebrated on the 14th and 15th of Adar, which is the last month of the Jewish calendar; it corresponds to our late February and early March. Also called the festival of Lots.
It was named for Haman in casting the pur (or lot) to determine the day in which the Jews would be exterminated.
In the apocryphal book, Maccabees it is called "Mordecai's Day." (2 Maccabees 15:36)
A day of banquets, rejoicing and sending gifts to poor people. (Esther 9:20-22)
Steve, what do you find disgusting about the Jews celebration of the prevention of their extermination?
The Theist
Fri Mar 09, 09:37:00 AM 2012 
 krissthesexyatheist said...
True that Stev-o. As long as we have 'philosophies' that are by nature divisive, we can never have world peace. on another note...
I thought that purim was also the Jewish Halloween. Awesome buddy,
Kriss
Fri Mar 09, 10:26:00 AM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Have you read the Book of Esther, Theist?
Well, I have. Here is my reaction to it.
The Jews supposedly killed more than 75,000 people on a single day -- those who supposedly had intended to kill the Jews on Kill-The-Jews-Day -- along with their wives and children. How did the Jews decided who had intended to kill them? Some type of anti-Jewish thought detector, perhaps?
I find the story both cruel and idiotic. It couldn't have happened the way it was written, and if it did, then is was an act of preemptive, religiously motivated genocide. Maybe it's just me, but I find that sort of thing disgusting.
Fri Mar 09, 10:36:00 AM 2012 
 Ian said...
Netanyahu and the settler movement, the Iranian government, and the Republican Party: three peas in a delusional, paranoid, violent pod. All because of what some ancient books say.
I wish there was a way to get every liberal, secularist, and pluralist from Iran, Israel, and the US to work together to stop this madness. I know there are a lot of us, but we're not good with the hysterics and bullying like the others are.
Fri Mar 09, 02:40:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 06 March 2012Forget Jesus. Follow Miley Cyrus
Beautiful. twitter.com/MileyCyrus/sta…
— Miley Ray Cyrus (@MileyCyrus) March 1, 2012
I don't know anything about Miley Cyrus, but she makes a lot more sense than Jesus.
Here is the lecture by Lawrence Krauss from which the quote was taken.
(I posted a link to this a while back, but I can't resist doing it again. It is well worth watching twice.)

Posted by Steve Wells at 3/06/2012 05:01:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
2 comments:
 Ian said...
Well, she's a pop starlet marketed towards "Red State" America, but she's gone off the reservation before. I'm pretty sure she's been vocal about her support for gay marriage and now there's this.
I'm thinking there's a thoughtful young mind behind the bubblegum pop star facade.
Wed Mar 07, 03:57:00 PM 2012 
 nazani said...
Hey Miley, join us at the Reason Rally next weekend!
Mon Mar 19, 06:32:00 AM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 06 March 2012Behold, it came to pass exceedingly: The biblely bits of the Book of Mormon
I've previously posted on "it came to pass" in the Book of Mormon and I've highlighted the occurrences of that phrase, along with "exceedingly" in the SABoM. But there's another that should be added to the list. And that is "Behold."
These three phrases are also, of course, found in the King James Version of the Bible, which is no doubt why Joseph Smith used them so often in the BoM; it just sounded so darned biblical. The trouble is that he got carried away with it.
Here's a summary of the occurrences of "Behold," "It came to pass," and "Exceedingly" in the BoM and the King James Version of the Bible. (I haven't highlighted the "beholds" yet in the SABOM, but I'll get to them eventually.)  BoM  King James Version 
Behold  1669  1275 
It came to pass  1424 452
Exceedingly  287  39 

Each of these phrases occurs more often in the BoM than in the Bible, with "exceedingly" occurring over seven times as often. And that's without taking the their sizes into account. The Bible is nearly five times as big as the BoM.
Here's how the comparison looks when size is taken into account.
(Occurrences per 100 verses; 6553 verses in the BoM, 31102 in the Bible)  BoM  King James Version 
Behold  25.47 4.10
It came to pass  21.7 1.45
Exceedingly  4.38 0.13

Now let's repeat the analysis using all three of Joseph Smith's favorite phrases.
(Occurrences per 100 verses)  BoM  King James Version 
Behold,
it came to pass
exceedingly  51.6 5.68

So these phrases occur nearly ten times more often in the Book of Mormon as they do in the Bible. (And they occur rarely anywhere else.)
Here's how Richard Dawkins put it on Real Time with Bill Maher.
Joseph Smith made it [The Book of Mormon] up in the 19th century ... in 17th century English.... It's got charlatan written absolutely all over it. How it could have possibly caught on and still be going strong today ... and even having candidates for president is beyond me.
It's beyond me too, but it looks like it is not beyond the GOP.
Posted by Steve Wells at 3/06/2012 02:25:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
3 comments:
 adult onset atheist said...
Verily Verily
Tue Mar 06, 03:42:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Mark Twain had this to say about the BOM:
"All men have heard of the Mormon Bible, but few except the ‘elect’ have seen it, or, at least, taken the trouble to read it. I brought away a copy from Salt Lake. The book is a curiosity to me, it is such a pretentious affair, and yet so ‘slow,’ so sleepy; such an insipid mess of inspiration. It is chloroform in print. If Joseph Smith composed this book, the act was a miracle — keeping awake while he did it was, at any rate. If he, according to tradition, merely translated it from certain ancient and mysteriously-engraved plates of copper, which he declares he found under a stone, in an out-of-the-way locality, the work of translating was equally a miracle, for the same reason.
"The book seems to be merely a prosy detail of imaginary history, with the Old Testament for a model; followed by a tedious plagiarism of the New Testament. The author labored to give his words and phrases the quaint, old-fashioned sound and structure of our King James’s translation of the Scriptures; and the result is a mongrel — half modern glibness, and half ancient simplicity and gravity. The latter is awkward and constrained; the former natural, but grotesque by the contrast. Whenever he found his speech growing too modern — which was about every sentence or two — he ladled in a few such Scriptural phrases as ‘exceeding sore,’ ‘and it came to pass,’ etc., and made things satisfactory again. ‘And it came to pass’ was his pet. If he had left that out, his Bible would have been only a pamphlet."
Steve Weeks
Tue Mar 06, 07:15:00 PM 2012 
 Ian said...
The late, great Christopher Hitchens had some wonderful things to say about Joseph Smith in "God is Not Great". Here is his own narration of his text:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L9UzbucqHCc
Wed Mar 07, 04:27:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 28 April 2012A Perfect Case for Biblical Justice: Thou shalt cut off her hand, thine eye shall not pity her
When reading God's commandment in Deuteronomy 25:11-12, have you ever wondered if such a punishment is really necessary?
Here's the passage.
When men strive together one with another, and the wife of the one draweth near for to deliver her husband out of the hand of him that smiteth him, and putteth forth her hand, and taketh him by the secrets: Then thou shalt cut off her hand, thine eye shall not pity her.
Well, wonder no more.
China News 24 reports that a woman came to the assistance of her husband in a fight by grabbing the other man's testicles. She squeezed them so hard, in fact, that the man died.
Now, thanks to the Bible, we know what to do with her.





Posted by Steve Wells at 4/28/2012 11:26:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
5 comments:
 Stephen said...
This was pretty funny,Steve, but then I noticed the "God hates figs" T-shirt on the side bar and nearly blew coffee all over my laptop.
Coincidentally, I think that bit about the fig tree preceeds what may be one of the essential lies of christianity:
"If ye have faith, and doubt not, ye shall not only do this which is done to the fig tree, but also if ye shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; it shall be done.
"21:22 And all things, whatsoever ye shall ask in prayer, believing, ye shall receive."
In the past I've used this in discussion with believers as an example of false statements in the new testament, because my prayers are never answered. Of course, the response is that my prayers aren't answered because I am not a believer. That makes sense. So now I ask them to pray for *me* to become a believer. It hasn't worked (for them) yet!
Steve Weeks
Sat Apr 28, 08:11:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Addendum: Sorry, I was thinking of Matthew 21:21-22. Jesus gets around to the false promise in Mark (11:23-24), but he's busy overturning tables first.
Also "precedes". :-)
Steve Weeks
Sun Apr 29, 09:10:00 AM 2012 
 The Theist said...
Nicely decorated new Dwindling in Unbelief, Mr. Wells. Reintroductions are perhaps in order.
To this post The Pathway Machine provided the following What The Bible Says About Amputations.
Well, I'm The Theist and I continue to add admonition to the improper Skeptical interpretation of the Bible. I have added many in the last month on the skeptic's annotated bible forum.
Here is the thing. The Chinese chick who grabbed the scrote of the man and killed him, she should be spared of her hands?
Stick out your scrote, idiot atheists, and sacrifice your brains to the god of injustice.
Atheism!
The Theist | Dispelling the Atheistic Propaganda of Steve Wells . . . while he works on his books.
Mon Apr 30, 09:13:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
OK, I'm convinced. I believe in god now.
Seriously, if you can't provide evidence to support your point of view, your name-calling won't help you much.
Steve Weeks
Tue May 01, 12:44:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Regarding "what the bible says about amputations", where is a credible account of an amputation being reversed by prayer? The one where Jesus touches the site of an ear amputation and restores the ear (Luke 22:50-51) does not meet reasonable criteria for authenticity.
Here is an interesting resource for you:
http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/
Steve Weeks
Tue May 01, 01:11:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 28 April 2012The Book of Job
Posted by Steve Wells at 4/28/2012 07:13:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
2 comments:
 TWF said...
That is awesome! Thanks for sharing it.
Sat Apr 28, 08:02:00 AM 2012 
 Fargofan1 said...
Finally! Someone else feels the same way I do about the "comforting" book of Job. This is classic!
Tue Jun 26, 06:18:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 27 April 2012Mitt Romney: The Ryan budget is a marvelous work and a wonder
A few weeks ago, President Obama made fun of Mitt Romney for describing Paul Ryan's budget as "marvelous" by saying,
Marvelous is a word you don't often hear when it comes to describing a budget. It's a word that you don't often hear generally.
Which is true, generally, unless you're a Mormon.
Mormons love the word "marvelous." It was one of Joseph Smith's favorite words. He used it 50 times in the book of Mormon, compared to the 24 times it is found in the King James Version of the Bible. And since the Bible is nearly five times as big as the Book of Mormon, the Book of Mormon is about ten times as "marvelous" as the Bible.
Here's a table to summarize the marvelousness of these two marvelous books.
 Bible Book of Mormon
Marvelous 24 50
number of verses 31,102 6553
Occurrences per 10,000 verses  7.7 76.3
But one of the phrases that Joseph Smith loved the most was "a marvelous work and a wonder." He used it to describe his own work, the Book of Mormon, and Mormons have used it as a code name for their sacred text ever since.
Here is how the phrase is used in Mitt Romney's third favorite book. (His favorite book is either Battlefield Earth or the Bible.)
And the Lord will set his hand again the second time to restore his people from their lost and fallen state. Wherefore, he will proceed to do a marvelous work and a wonder among the children of men. 2 Nephi 25:17
Therefore, I will proceed to do a marvelous work among this people, yea, a marvelous work and a wonder, for the wisdom of their wise and learned shall perish, and the understanding of their prudent shall be hid.2 Nephi 27:26
So when Romney called the Ryan budget "marvelous," he was using a word that is often heard in Mormondom. I suspect that if Romney was fully unzipped, he would say it is "a marvelous work and a wonder" just like the Book of Mormon.
Posted by Steve Wells at 4/27/2012 09:41:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
1 comment:
 Stephen said...
I am so stealing that for describing my students' work:
"Very nice. That is a marvelous work and a wonder."
;-)
Steve Weeks
Fri Apr 27, 01:36:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 23 April 2012The Book of Mormon: The whiter the skin, the closer to God
Tim Giago, the founder of the Native American Journalist Association, has an excellent article with this title at the Huffington Post. It inspired me to find the verses in the Book of Mormon that mention skin color.
Here's what I found. Let me know if I missed any.
Mary (Jesus's mother) was exceedingly fair and white.
And it came to pass that I looked and beheld the great city of Jerusalem, and also other cities. And I beheld the city of Nazareth; and in the city of Nazareth I beheld a virgin, and she was exceedingly fair and white. 1 Nephi 11:13
Jesus, of course, was as white as his mom, as were his disciples. Indeed, after they were blessed by Jesus, the disciples became whiter than anything else on earth -- as white as Jesus even!
It came to pass that Jesus blessed them as they did pray unto him; and his countenance did smile upon them, and the light of his countenance did shine upon them, and behold they were as white as the countenance and also the garments of Jesus; and behold the whiteness thereof did exceed all the whiteness, yea, even there could be nothing upon earth so white as the whiteness thereof. 3 Nephi 19:25
And when Jesus had spoken these words he came again unto his disciples; and behold they did pray steadfastly, without ceasing, unto him; and he did smile upon them again; and behold they were white, even as Jesus.  3 Nephi 19:30
The Nephites (God's favorite people) were also white and exceedingly delightsome.
It came to pass that the people of Nephi did wax strong, and did multiply exceedingly fast, and became an exceedingly fair and delightsome people. 4 Nephi 10
Even the Gentiles (white, non-Mormon Protestants in Mormon-speak) were exceedingly fair and beautiful.
 And I beheld the Spirit of the Lord, that it was upon the Gentiles, and they did prosper and obtain the land for their inheritance; and I beheld that they were white, and exceedingly fair and beautiful, like unto my people before they were slain. 1 Nephi 13:15
But the Lamanites (or Native Americans) were not. They were once "a delightsome people," but God made them a dark-skinned, "filthy and loathsome people, led about by Satan" because of their unbelief and idolatry.
This people ... shall become a dark, a filthy, and a loathsome people ... because of their unbelief and idolatry. ... They were once a delightsome people ... But now, behold, they are led about by Satan. Mormon 5:15-18
Still, there is some hope for Native Americans. If they convert to Mormonism, their skins will turn white, and they will become a "delightsome." (The original "white" in this verse was later changed to "pure" to soften the obvious racism of this prophecy.)
And then shall they rejoice; for they shall know that it is a blessing unto them from the hand of God; and their scales of darkness shall begin to fall from their eyes; and many generations shall not pass away among them, save they shall be a pure and delightsome people. 2 Nephi 30:6
It happened before. God removed his curse from the "good" Lamanites (the ones that "united with the Nephites"), and they "became exceedingly fair, with skins "white like unto the Nephites."
It came to pass that those Lamanites who had united with the Nephites were numbered among the Nephites; And their curse was taken from them, and their skin became white like unto the Nephites; And their young men and their daughters became exceedingly fair, and they were numbered among the Nephites. 3 Nephi 2:14
And it can happen to you, too. If you turn to God and become Mormon, God will make your skin spotless, pure, fair, and white.
O then ye unbelieving, turn ye unto the Lord; cry mightily unto the Father in the name of Jesus, that perhaps ye may be found spotless, pure, fair, and white. Mormon 9:6
So there you have it. According to the Book of Mormon, the whiter the skin, the closer to God.
Posted by Steve Wells at 4/23/2012 04:35:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
3 comments:
 Stephen said...
Excellent (read: "delightsome") compilation, Steve. Even as I read it, yea, it came to pass that I did see the not-so-well-concealed racism dictated, verily, from the hat, thanks be to Urim and Thummim. And I found the change in the text substituting "delightsome" for "white" most exceedingly telling. Assuredly, these scriptures were never meant to be studied so carefully. Sadly, you have revealed that your own skin is less delightsome and white than that of Jesus. In this I join you, though it puzzleth me mightily how one living in the Middle-East (or even New York) could have kept his skin so white: "whiteness thereof did exceed all the whiteness, yea, even there could be nothing upon earth so white as the whiteness thereof". He must have had some heavenly sun-screen; and it came to pass that the SPF value was like unto infinity, that the melanocytes of his delightsome skin did sit in total darkness and did not synthesize the loathsome pigment of those filthy Lamanites.
Steve Weeks
Mon Apr 23, 06:57:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Oops. I meant "pure" for "white", not "delightsome", even though my favorite Joe Smith word *is* delightsome. :-)
Steve Weeks
Thu Apr 26, 03:03:00 PM 2012 
 Glenn Ingersoll said...
Damn freckles!
Fri Apr 27, 04:12:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 21 April 2012A Green Bible Verse for Earth Day
Repost for Earth Day
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Here is a verse that is marked green in the world's most dishonest book -- The Green Bible. 
Therefore thus says the Lord God: My anger and my wrath shall be poured out on this place, on human beings and animals, on the trees of the field and the fruit of the ground; it will burn and not be quenched. Jeremiah 7:20, The Green Bible
I have no idea why it's marked green, except that the words "animals", "trees", and "fruit" are in it.
And yet when you read chapter 7 of Jeremiah, the meaning of this verse is clear enough: God's wrath will be poured out on the environment to punish humans for worshiping incorrectly.
There are no green Bible verses. There are only verses dishonestly marked green in the Green Bible.
Posted by Steve Wells at 4/21/2012 02:16:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
18 comments:
 The Pathway Machine said...
Trees are often used in the Bible to symbolize rulers and kingdoms, whereas grass is used for the common people.
Doesn't Jeremiah chapter 7 sound more like a pronouncement along those lines than against the great outdoors?
Wed Apr 27, 07:07:00 PM 2011 
 Steve Wells said...
My anger and my wrath shall be poured out on this place, on human beings and animals, on the trees of the field and the fruit of the ground; it will burn and not be quenched. Jeremiah 7:20
You say that when God said "trees" he really meant "kings" (or maybe kingdoms), and when he said "grass" he meant all the people.
What did he mean by "animals" and "fruit of the ground," PM? He's already told us that his wrath will burn forever toward kings, kingdoms, and all the people. What's with the "My anger and my wrath shall be poured out on ... animals" thing?
Why doesn't God just say what he means? Why does he talk the way you do? What is he trying to hide?
Do you think this verse shows God's love for his creation? Should it have been marked green in the Green Bible?
Wed Apr 27, 07:31:00 PM 2011 
 The Pathway Machine said...
Steve - You say that when God said "trees" he really meant "kings" (or maybe kingdoms), and when he said "grass" he meant all the people.
PM - I said that "trees are often symbolic of rulers and kingdoms." For the sake of discussion I proposed the possibility.
Steve - What did he mean by "animals" and "fruit of the ground," PM? He's already told us that his wrath will burn forever toward kings, kingdoms, and all the people. What's with the "My anger and my wrath shall be poured out on ... animals" thing?
PM - Depends upon the context. Sometimes animals symbolize good qualities, divine as well as human and sometimes they symbolize oppressive ruling powers. Fruit tends to represent the effort or the results of that effort of either godly or ungodly people. Cain, for example, offered an unacceptable sacrifice to Jehovah because he selected fruit off the ground, which was probably bad, rotten.
Steve - Why doesn't God just say what he means? Why does he talk the way you do? What is he trying to hide?
PM - I don't think he has anything to hide. When I tend to rant in a cryptic fashion it means that it is too late and my patience is wearing thin. Perhaps that's the case with God. I think he is saying what he means, but he is just saying it in a way that brings images of what is actually going on along with a more specific reference.
Steve - Do you think this verse shows God's love for his creation? Should it have been marked green in the Green Bible?
PM - Yes and I don't know.
There is no doubt in my mind regarding Jehovah God's love for his creation.
I didn't really address the Green Bible in my post because I have never heard of it before and have no idea what their spin is. My concern is for the meaning of the Bible itself rather than any bias the Green Bible may present.
As for Jeremiah Chapter 7, verse 2 addresses Judah. Verse 6 indicates they were having a problem foreigneressing the foriegner, fatherless, widow and they were shedding innocent blood. They were stealing, murdering, swearing falsely, commiworshipingery, and worshipping false gods.
The term Shiloh, in verse 12, literally means "He to whom it belongs." Beginning with David, the Judean King, the commander's staff and the regal sovereignty were the possessions of the trirebelliousah.
When the rebellous Israelites took the Ark, which represented Jehovah's presence, from Shiloh to the battlefield God allowed the Philistines to capture it, signifying he was no longer with them. (Psalm 78:60-61 / 1 Samuel 4:2-11)
Jeremiah 26:6,9 indicates Shiloh was destroyed. The Judean line of Kings was ended with Zedekiah . . . until Shiloh.
Until Jesus removes all other kingdoms. (Genesis 49:10 / Ezekiel 21:26-27 / Luke 1:31-33 / Revelation 5:5)
Wed Apr 27, 09:45:00 PM 2011 
 Steve Wells said...
Well, that was confusing. I still have no idea what you think God meant when he said this: "My anger and my wrath shall be poured out on this place, on human beings and animals, on the trees of the field and the fruit of the ground; it will burn and not be quenched." Jeremiah 7:20
He said his wrath would be poured out on the place, the people, the animals, and the plants. Did he mean to say that his wrath would be poured out on the people, the people, the people, and the people?
You say that you think Jeremiah 7:20 shows God's love for his creation (which I suppose would include the environment, including the plants and animals). How does it do that?
Wed Apr 27, 10:00:00 PM 2011 
 The Pathway Machine said...
For some reason this text editor wants to squish certain words together. I don't know what I did wrong, but for the sake of clarification, my last post above, corrected, reads:
Instead of "foreigneressing the foriegner" it should read "troubles with oppressing the foriegner"
Instead of "commiworshipingery, and worshipping false gods" it should read "committing adultry, and worshipping false gods."
Instead of "trirebelliousah" it should read "the tribe of Judah."
Wed Apr 27, 10:06:00 PM 2011 
 The Pathway Machine said...
Steve,
I think chapter 7 of Jeremiah is a pronouncement, not against the trees, animals, and fruit, but against Judah, the Judean line of kings, Jerusalem, its inhabitants.
The North and the South implies, what at that time would have been the divided Kingdom. The 10 tribe kingdom fell 133 years before the 21 tribe Kingdom.
Jeremiah 7 is talking about the destruction of Jerusalem which would come in 607 B.C.E. that would result in a million Jews being killed and 99,000 being taken captive to Babylon. The end of the Judean Kingdom, until Christ came.
Now, if it is any consellation I am sure that this resulted in the destruction of trees, animals, and fruit in a literal sense, but that isn't what the reference to those things are addressing in a literal sense.
As a skeptic, I think, our position is not to take the text literally but to try and estimate what it would have meant to the people to whom it was given.
Thu Apr 28, 08:34:00 AM 2011 
 Steve Wells said...
PM,
So, as a skeptic, you think that when God said, "My anger and my wrath shall be poured out on this place, on human beings and animals, on the trees of the field and the fruit of the ground," he meant that he planned to kill a lot of people and the plants and animals were just collateral damage?
Nice God you've got there, skeptic.
I'm also wondering why you accept the discredited JW date for the siege of Jerusalem of 607 BCE. Is that because you believe that Jesus returned 2,520 years after this date in 1914?
Skeptics believe the strangest things!
Thu Apr 28, 09:20:00 AM 2011 
 The Pathway Machine said...
Steve,
The humans are the inhabitants, the animals are the ravenous beast, the kingdom of Judah, the trees are its rulers, on the field implies the military, the fruit of the ground is the result or the produce of the faithless, possibly a reference in a religious sense.
I don't really have time to get deep into the 607 debate at present, but it wouldn't really matter, in that I don't think it matters to you or your readers what I, the JWs, or any other believers would conclude or why we would conclude what we do.
human beings and animals, on the trees of the field and the fruit of the ground
Thu Apr 28, 09:37:00 AM 2011 
 Steve Wells said...
Well, PM, you're the one who brought up your 607 belief. But if you don't want to talk about it, I understand. I think we all do.
Thu Apr 28, 09:52:00 AM 2011 
 The Pathway Machine said...
Steve,
The 607 dating is, I think, more accurate than others that are given. For example in the articles you linked to, but so what? If the other dates were accurate would it make that much difference?
I don't think so. The only good that could come from an intense and in depth analysis would be that you could say Wikipedia and I disagree so I must be wrong.
You and anyone reading this can do that on their own without me putting that much effort into it.
Just like the time I posted, with scripture and specific dates, the chronology from the creation to the Council of Nicea on the SAB forum.
Thu Apr 28, 08:56:00 PM 2011 
 twillight said...
The whle conversation between Steve and tPM is worthless, as it misses the point.
Let's assume - just for the conversation - that the quoted part is about some (nasty) humans. So, why is it MARKED GREEN?
The question wasn't if it is "good", or "misunderstood", but wether if it is about "greenpeace"-thingy or not.

If it is about humans, then it is not about "greenpeace-issue", so it shouldn't be marked as green.
If it IS about plants and stuff, then it is advocating harming them, so shouldn't be marked as green.
This settles the question for me :D
Fri Apr 29, 10:10:00 AM 2011 
 The Pathway Machine said...
twillight,
What about starting forest fires for the sake of preventing forest fires?
Burning smaller areas where there is a great deal of dead brush to prevent a more harmful forest fire?
Fri Apr 29, 01:45:00 PM 2011 
 twillight said...
PM, how about being a god, and making forestfire unnecessary, and with it unnecessary suffering unnecessary?
Face it: there is no god. There is just the indifferent Universe.
But just for the conversation, assume that kind of meaning is possible. What validates it? As far as I see: nothing.
Btw, please, stick to one opnion, or the other. You can either state the stentence means different people, OR you can go for greenpeace-apologism.
You ALREADY choose the above quote is NOT greenpeace-issue, therefor shuld not be marked as green according to your position.
Sat Apr 30, 03:22:00 AM 2011 
 The Pathway Machine said...
twillight,
It is silly for an atheist to speculate on the abilities or motivation of a god, regarding forest fires or anything else.
But, for even an atheist to say "there is no god" is even sillier because there are millions of them. The Bible mentions few that are known by science and history to have actually existed. The judges of Israel were called gods, Moses, Jesus.
My opinion regarding the Greenpeace is that the verses in question were making reference to trees, animals, the fruit and the field as symbolic references to other things which I explained in earlier posts.
Now whether or not they should have highlighted them in Green is up to them. Maybe they don’t care or maybe they know the references were symbolic.
Sat Apr 30, 01:07:00 PM 2011 
 twillight said...
@PM
You really think that a human speculating motives of dolphins, monkeys, orchids is "silly"?
Btw, it's not "an atheist saying there is no god". It is Bible-believers saying there is no God of the Bible (let them be jews, christians, or anyone considering the Bible book of their religion).
On the other hand give a definite definition of any god(ess), and we go out and test that. Until now no god(ess) ever su8cceeded on any of those tests.
Now as the ORIGINAL QUESTION was as the named paragraph should be highlighted as green or not, and you voted NO, that settles the question, every other topic here is OFFTOPIC.
But one thing still should be noted: You, after saying the verse should NOT be signed green, went apologism defending it to sign as green still. This marks you (and typical religious persons like you) a dishonest person.
Sun May 01, 03:54:00 AM 2011 
 Stephen said...
Blogger The Pathway Machine said...
"There is no doubt in my mind regarding Jehovah God's love for his creation."
Well, that is nice, but that is *your* mind. Perhaps you could provide some evidence for this "love" that is accessible- and acceptable- to others.
"My concern is for the meaning of the Bible itself rather than any bias the Green Bible may present."
Apparently, you have unlimited ability to interpret the bible according to your own way of thinking. What's the evidence that your idea of the "meaning" is correct? And why would an intelligent, all-powerful, all-knowing deity allow the scriptures to be written in such a vague maanner that so many radically different interpretations are possible?
Steve Weeks
Sun Apr 22, 08:19:00 AM 2012 
 scottfromscotland said...
I read this blog a lot and the comments always entertain but i've never felt compelled to write one myself until i read 'The Bible mentions few that are known by science and history to have actually existed' and nearly spat my coffee over the screen. I think you'll find that there is neither scientific nor historical evidence for any of the gods mentioned in the bible, or any other religious book ever written. Science and the study of history aim to find the truth by saying ' i dont know the answer to this, therefore i shall investigate'. Religion however says ' i dont know the answer to this, therefore god must have done it'.
Sun Apr 22, 11:16:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
@ scottfromscotland:
Welcome!
Science does a bit more than "investigate", as there's a specific way it's done. To tweak your comment a bit...
Science says "let's come up with a possible explanation ("hypothesis"), then see if we can shoot it down."
Religion says "let's see if we can interpret ("manipulate") the words of the scriptures to produce an explanation."
I hope we see more of your comments around here!
Steve Weeks
Tue Apr 24, 03:36:00 AM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 20 April 2012Martin Basher: Book of Mormon condemns Mitt Romney to hell
Mitt Romney is going to hell, if the Book of Mormon is true, that is.
Martin Basher pointed this out on his MSNBC show by exposing a few of Mitt's more recent lies and quoting from Mormon scripture.
The first quote is from the Doctrine and Covenants.
(Mislabeled in the video as "Book of Mormon" -- The Doctrine and Covenants is a part of LDS scripture but it is not in the Book of Mormon.)
All liars, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie, and the whoremonger and the sorcerer, shall have their part in that lake which burneth with fire and brimstone which is the second death. Doctrine and Covenants 63:17
The second is from 2 Nephi. (9:34, not 2:34 as said in the video)
Wo unto the liar for he shall be thrust down to hell. 2 Nephi 9:34
Here's the video.
Visit msnbc.com for breaking news, world news, and news about the economy
Posted by Steve Wells at 4/20/2012 08:32:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
1 comment:
 sam harlan said...
The facts are that there is no conspiracy put news media put spin on things along party lines Fox is republican and MSNBC and CNN are democrat. I'm an independent who is not all in favor of either. I do think Romney is better, however I watch both Fox and MSNBC to discern the truth. Frankly the things talked about in this video are grasping and superfluous. The author of "The Skeptics Annotated" seems greatly anti-religious and it left a bad taste in my mouth to read some of the things he wrote in all three of his works. Every religion has its assholes but I know many good Christians, Muslims, and Mormons. I thought this entire website would be less biased; pointing out flaws but not ripping into the faith like a wild animal. Also this seems completely un-american. Much of our country's strength was founded upon religion and the freedom to believe, and it has served us well for 250 years. If you don't want this posted so be it. I will be content knowing at least you read it.
Thu Oct 04, 04:54:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 16 April 2012Achieving a Celestial Marriage: What Mitt and Ann Romney believe about God, marriage, and working moms
What does Mitt Romney believe about working mothers?


Well, as with most things Mitt Romney says, it depends on when you ask. Lately he says  that "all moms are working moms"; a few months ago he said that "even if you have a child two years of age, you need to go to work." But the apparent inconsistency is easily resolved: the first statement referred to wealthy moms (like his wife, Ann) and the latter statement to everyone else.

So what does Mitt Romney really believe about working moms? To find out, we need to see what the Mormon church teaches about God, marriage, and working mothers.

Fortunately, it's all laid out in Achieving a Celestial Marriage, the LDS Church's official manual for instructing  young Mormons about marriage.

Here are some excerpts. (Emphasis in the original)
First, about God.

GOD WAS ONCE A MORTAL MAN
(1-2) He Lived on an Earth Like Our Own
"God himself was once as we are now, and is an exalted man, and sits enthroned in yonder heavens!" Joseph Smith, Teachings, p. 345
(1-3) He Experienced Conditions Similar to Our Own and Advanced Step by Step
GOD IS NOW AN EXALTED MAN WITH POWERS OF ETERNAL INCREASE
(1-4) Our Father in Heaven Lives in an Exalted Marriage Relationship
(1-5) We are Literal Children of God, Part of His Family Unit
(1-6) We Lived with Our Heavenly Parents Prior to Coming to Earth
WE ARE GODS IN EMBRYO
(1-7) We Have the Potential to Become like Our Heavenly Parents
About Marriage
 EXALTATION IS ATTAINABLE ONLY IN FAMILY UNITS
ONLY THROUGH CELESTIAL MARRIAGE CAN A PERSON BECOME LIKE GOD
(1-12) The Lord Commands Marriage
(1-13) Exaltation is Based on Celestial Marriage
 "No man shall receive the fulness of eternity, of exaltation, alone, no woman shall receive that blessing alone; but man and wife, when they receive the sealing power in the temple of the Lord, if they thereafter keep all the commandments, shall pass on to exaltation, and shall continue and become like the Lord." ( Joseph Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, 2:43-44)
(1-14) "Then Shall They Be Gods, Because They Have No End"
(1-15) Only Resurrected and Glorified Geings May Become Parents of Spirit Offspring
 (1-19) Celestial Marriage Makes it Possible for Us to Claim Our Mortal Children in Eternity As Well As to Propagate Ourselves Throughout Eternity
"We will become gods and have jurisdiction over worlds, and they worlds will be peopled by our own offspring." (Joseph Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, 2:43-44, 48)
About Contraception and Birth Control
BIRTH CONTROL -- THE CHURCH'S STAND
(16-6) Those Who Practice Birth Control Will Reap Disappointment
(16-8) The Root Reasons for Birth Control
"... in most cases the desire not to have children has its birth in vanity, passion, and selfishness."
(16-10) Unwillingness to Have Children -- an Onslaught Against the Home
GOSPEL ANSWERS TO THE POPULATION EXPLOSION PROBLEM
 "The precepts of men would have you believe that by limiting the population of the world, we can have peace and plenty. That is the doctrine of the devil." (Ezra Taft Benson in CR, Apr. 1969, p. 12
And, finally, about working moms
THE WOMAN: WIFE, HELPMEET, AND MOTHER
(14-8) Present-Day Allurements Versus the True Responsibilities and Influence of Women
"It is of great concern to all who understand this glorious concept that Satan and his cohorts are using scientific arguments and nefarious propaganda to lure women away from their primary responsibilities as wives, mothers, and homemakers. We hear so much about emancipatioon, independence, sexuual liberation, birth control, abortion, and other insidious propaganda belittling the role of motherhood, all of which is Satan's way of destroying woman, the hom, and the famliy -- the basic unit of society. . . ."
(14-14) It is Seldom Justifiable for Mothers to Work
"How can mothers justify their abandonmnet of home when they are needed so much by their offspring? Rationalization must take over as they justfy themselves in leaving home and children." Spencer W. Kimball, Faith Precedes the Miracle, pp. 116-17.)
So there you have it. That is what Mitt and Ann Romney believe about working moms. They believe that there shouldn't be any (Except for "working moms" like Ann Romney).

Posted by Steve Wells at 4/16/2012 09:21:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
2 comments:
 Stephen said...
"God himself was once as we are now, and is an exalted man, and sits enthroned in yonder heavens!" Joseph Smith, Teachings, p. 345
I lol'd exceedingly.
Steve Weeks
Mon Apr 16, 11:28:00 AM 2012 
 nazani said...
"We Lived with Our Heavenly Parents Prior to Coming to Earth"
Some of us clearly had a transporter accident.
Mon Apr 16, 01:00:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 12 April 2012Book of Mormon Action Figures: Before and After the Curse of Blackness
This is, without a doubt, one of my favorite items: Book of Mormon Action Figures. (They're even better than those from My Dinner with Andre.)


Here, for example, is Laman, before and after God darkened his skin.


But in order to really appreciate them, you need to know something about Laman and his descendants (the Native Americans), as told in the Book of Mormon.
"Laman and (his evil brother) Lemuel ... were like unto the Jews."  (Being like a Jew is about as bad as it gets in the Book of Mormon.) 1 Nephi 2:11-13
Laman  was "white, and exceedingly fair and delightsome" before the curse, but God caused "a skin of blackness" to come upon him for disobeying his older brother Nephi. 2 Nephi 5:21
God also cursed the Lamanites  (Laman's descendants) causing their skin to turn dark and making them "loathsome" to His people (the Nephites). 2 Nephi 5:22, Alma 3:8
God forbids intermarriage between the Nephites and Lamanites. Those who mix seed with the Lamanites will be cursed by God with "the same cursing". (Their skin will be blackened.) 2 Nephi 5:23, Alma 3:9
God's curse on the Lamanites caused them to become a sinful, polluted, filthy, idle, ferocious, bloodthirsty, and loathsome people, who delighted in murdereing, robbing, and plundering. God cursed them because of what their fathers did.  2 Nephi 5:24, Alma 17:14-15, 26:24, Jacob 3:5, Enos 1:20, Mosiah 10:12, 25:11
If you don't repent, God will make your skin even darker than that of the Lamanites. Jacob 3:8
The Lamanites "loved murder and would drink the blood of beasts." Jarom 1:6
The Lamanites shaved their heads and ran around naked. Mosiah 10:8, Alma 3:5-6, 43:37, 44:17
God loved the Nephites, but hated the Lamanites "because of the iniquity of the tradition of their fathers." Helaman 15:3-4
God removed his curse from the "good" Lamanites (the ones that "united with the Nephites"), and they "became exceedingly fair, with skins "white like unto the Nephites." 3 Nephi 2:14-16
"The Lamanites ... did teach their children that they should not believe." 4 Nephi 38
The Lamanites (or Native Americans) were once "a delightsome people", but God made them a dark-skinned, "filthy and loathsome people, led about by Satan" because of their unbelief and idolatry. Mormon 5:15-18
I wonder if Mitt Romney loves these action figures as much a I do.
Posted by Steve Wells at 4/12/2012 09:37:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
4 comments:
 nazani said...
Are these things commercially made? I'm curious why anyone would think built like a fridge would equal "delightsome." Is there another myth about how the Native Americans lost their facial hair?
Thu Apr 12, 03:16:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
@ nazani: just click on the image!
The figures are only $5.95 each, so I bet Mitt has a whole "civilization" of them. Ann probably carries them around in one of her Cadillacs.
Steve Weeks
Fri Apr 13, 05:59:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
How come the mormons comment on only *some* of the threads? I would they make a broader assault because it amuseth me exceedingly.
Steve Weeks
Sun Apr 15, 11:15:00 AM 2012 
 nazani said...
@Stephen Wow, these toys are a hoot. The costumes appear to be based on 19th century stage garb for 'spectacles' like Aida and Salome. They also have a brace of missionaries on bikes and a bust of Joseph Smith that looks nothing like his photos.
Thu Apr 19, 01:30:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 06 April 2012Bad Friday: Greater evil hath no man than this, that he is willing to kill his own son (for any fucking reason).

The three "great" Abrahamic faiths trace their origin to Abraham's willingness to sacrifice his son to God. Jews and Christians believe the story told in Genesis 22, in which God tells Abraham to kill his son, Isaac, for him.
God ... said, Take now thy son, thine only son Isaac, whom thou lovest, and .. and offer him there for a burnt offering. (Genesis 22:1)
(Actually God was wrong about the "only son" thing, because Abraham, at the time, had two sons, not one. Abraham had already abandoned his first son, Ishmael, and his mother, Hagar -- with God's consent and blessing. So I guess Isaac was Abraham's only son, at least as far as he and God were concerned.)
God didn't make Abraham do the evil deed, though, substituting a ram instead at the last minute. But it was Abraham's willingness to do it that impressed God so much. Abraham passed the test because he was was willing to kill his son for God.
For his willingness to do the greatest evil any father could ever do, God blessed Abraham and made him the father of all believers.
Because thou hast done this thing, and hast not withheld thy son, thine only son ... I will bless thee ... And in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed; because thou hast obeyed my voice. Genesis 22:16
Muslims also honor Abraham for his willingness to slaughter his son, but they believe it was a different son. They believe it was Ishmael, not Isaac, that God told Abraham to kill.



Here's the story from the Quran:
When (his son) was old enough to walk with him, (Abraham) said: O my dear son, I have seen in a dream that I must sacrifice thee. So look, what thinkest thou ? He said: O my father! Do that which thou art commanded. Allah willing, thou shalt find me of the steadfast. Quran 37:102
(Notice, though, that the Quran doesn't actually name the son, so maybe a Muslim could believe that Isaac was the intended victim.)
The important thing, though, is this: Abraham was willing to kill his own son for God, and God rewarded him for it.
And then, of course, there's Jesus.
God supposedly tested himself, just like he did Abraham, only this time he went through with it. He killed his own son for some god-awful reason. I guess it was to keep himself from torturing others for stuff they didn't  do or didn't believe. Or something like that.
Believers call it Good Friday.

Posted by Steve Wells at 4/06/2012 11:07:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
7 comments:
 Stephen said...
Disgusting.
Steve Weeks
Fri Apr 06, 07:59:00 PM 2012 
 Sean Seal said...
LOL! You miss the point so often. The point is that Abraham had so much faith that God would save his son that he was willing to sacrifice his son. Pretty sure you can't see past your nose buddy. Gain some perspective.
Sat Apr 07, 05:56:00 AM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
That's not what God said, Sam. God blessed Abraham because he was willing to kill his son.
"Because thou hast done this thing, and hast not withheld thy son, thine only son ... I will bless thee. Genesis 22:16
Only an evil God would ask a father to kill his son for him. And only a bad father would be willing to do it.
Sat Apr 07, 08:57:00 AM 2012 
 Me said...
Why would God need to test his faith? God is supposedly all knowing and wouldn't need to test Abraham because he would already know the answer before testing him. Does he expect a different outcome? It's ludicrous.
Sat Apr 07, 11:50:00 AM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Since god is nothing but a fig newton of some peoples' imagination, we don't need to waste time on "what an a$$h0le god is"... and concentrate on the people who made up the whole story. They were truly sick, and so are any who believe it.
Steve Weeks
Sat Apr 07, 12:09:00 PM 2012 
 srizals said...
Steve said, "Notice, though, that the Quran doesn't actually name the son, so maybe a Muslim could believe that Isaac was the intended victim."
Steve, you should read on, it's stated in this verse, a continuity of the verse quoted by you (37:102), his first born was not Isaac. It's as easy as ABC, as A comes before B.
"37:102 When (his son) was old enough to walk with him, (Abraham) said: O my dear son, I have seen in a dream that I must sacrifice thee. So look, what thinkest thou ? He said: O my father! Do that which thou art commanded. Allah willing, thou shalt find me of the steadfast."
The one speaking could not have been Isaac, since he was not born yet as it was told in this verse,
"37:112 And We gave him tidings of the birth of Isaac, a prophet of the righteous."
And you forgot to mention about what it's all about. It is a test, the test of faith in God that does not require a human sacrifice, ever. A benchmark set by Abraham that no man should need to sacrifice his son or any man for that matter in order to please God.
This is what is missing in your understanding of the story, Steve.
"But as soon as the two had surrendered themselves to [what they thought to be] the will of God, and [Abraham] had laid him down on his face, (103)
We called out to him: “O Abraham, (104)
thou hast already fulfilled [the purpose of] that dream- vision!” Thus, verily, do We reward the doers of good: (105)
for, behold, all this was indeed a trial, clear in itself. (106)
And We ransomed him with a tremendous sacrifice, (107)
and left him thus to be remembered among later generations: (108)
A Prophecy that has come to past. Abraham is remembered by three Abrahamic faith to this very day.
That is why a religious person would never abort his or her baby. Abraham didn't do it, why should he/she be doing it for the sake of pleasing him/herself?
Anyway, what happened to your post entitled, Muslims and toilet manners, I think. The question of eating with your right hand and dealing with fecal matter with your left hand if I recalled correctly. I seem can't find it anymore. I'm sure it's stuck in here somewhere.
Care to enlighten me, Steve? Thanks.
Sat Jun 02, 08:08:00 AM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Here's a link to the "Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom" post.
Sat Jun 02, 09:47:00 AM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 03 April 2012Mitt Romney: The Book of Mormon is an attack on all religions
OK, that's not a direct quote.
Here's what Mitt actually said: (see video below)
We are now all Catholics. Those of us who are people of faith recognize this is — an attack on one religion is an attack on all religion.
But if what he said is true, then the Book of Mormon is an attack on all religions.
Take the Catholic church for example.
The Book of Mormon says that the Catholic church is is an abominable church founded by the devil to lead souls to hell. It is more abominable that all other churches (and they are all abominable, too). It is the mother of all abominations, the whore of Babylon, and the mother of harlots. It has taken away the plain and precious parts of the gospel and perverted the ways of the Lord. The wrath of God is poured out upon it, and someday God will force Catholics to get drunk on their own blood. Only those who join the Mormon church in its fight against Catholics will be saved.
Now you probably think that I'm exaggerating a bit. But I'm not. Here are just some of the verses from the Book of Mormon that refer to the Catholic church.
I beheld this great and abominable church; and I saw the devil that he was the founder of it. 1 Nephi 13:6
A great and abominable church, which is most abominable above all other churches; for behold, they have taken away from the gospel of the Lamb many parts which are plain and most precious; and also many covenants of the Lord have they taken away. And all this have they done that they might pervert the right ways of the Lord, that they might blind the eyes and harden the hearts of the children of men. 1 Nephi 13:26-27
After the book hath gone forth through the hands of the great and abominable church, that there are many plain and precious things taken away from the book. 1 Nephi 13:28
The plain and most precious parts of the gospel of the Lamb which have been kept back by that abominable church. 1 Nephi 13:32
That great and abominable church, which was founded by the devil and his children, that he might lead away the souls of men down to hell. 1 Nephi 14:3
That great and abominable church, which is the mother of abominations, whose founder is the devil. 1 Nephi 14:9
The wrath of God was poured out upon that great and abominable church. 1 Nephi 14:15
The wrath of God is poured out upon the mother of harlots, which is the great and abominable church of all the earth, whose founder is the devil. 1 Nephi 14:17
And the blood of that great and abominable church, which is the whore of all the earth, shall turn upon their own heads; for they shall war among themselves, and the sword of their own hands shall fall upon their own heads, and they shall be drunken with their own blood. 1 Nephi 22:13
That great whore, who hath perverted the right ways of the Lord, yea, that great and abominable church, shall tumble to the dust and great shall be the fall of it. 1 Nephi 22:14
They shall repent and fight not against Zion, and do not unite themselves to that great and abominable church, they shall be saved. 2 Nephi 6:12
So if we are all Catholics now, then the Book of Mormon is an attack on us all.
(And don't even get the Book of Mormon started on Jews, non-Mormon Protestants, or unbelievers.)

Posted by Steve Wells at 4/03/2012 08:11:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
5 comments:
 Bukko Canukko said...
No attacks specifically on Mormons, Hindus and Buddhists? They have to settle for being lumped in with unbelievers in general?
I suppose that's what you get from a supposedly God-inspired, and thereby supposedly all-knowing, book that was actually written by an unsophisticated con man with only a rustic's 19th Century knowledge of the world. No stupider than all other religious books, of course. I weep for the trees that died as a sacrifice for their worthless pages.
Tue Apr 03, 03:03:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
"...A religion known as 'secularism' "
Pander, pander, pander.
Does he not realize that if secularism (he means "atheism") is a religion, then not collecting stamps is a hobby and bald is a hair color.
Steve Weeks
Tue Apr 03, 08:00:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Man, that first selction alone (1 Nephi 13:6) has a whole mess-load of "and it came to pass" in it!
Here's a dumb question, Steve: How do you know Ol' Joe is referring to the cat-o-holic church specifically? Thx!
Steve Weeks
Wed Apr 04, 06:44:00 AM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Well, Steve, I don't know for sure that Joseph Smith was talking about the Catholic church, but the code words that he used were the same ones Protestants have used since the time of Martin Luther. (Great and abominable church, whore of Babylon, mother or harlots, etc.) And all Mormons knew which church Joseph was talking about -- until it became politically incorrect to talk about other religions that way. Here's a link that goes into it in more detail than I can do here.
Wed Apr 04, 08:34:00 AM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Steve, thanks for that link. I will read it after I get next Friday's lecture finished!
Meanwhile, sounds like maybe the Mor(m)on church is due for a timely "revelation". ;-)
Steve Weeks
Wed Apr 04, 03:30:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 02 April 2012Sam Harris on Free Will

If you haven't had time to read the book (it's only 60 pages or so), then you probably won't have time to watch this lecture either.
But you should do one or the other. Your choice.

Posted by Steve Wells at 4/02/2012 08:31:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
3 comments:
 The Wise Fool said...
I'd agree with about 97% of what he suggests, which happens to coincide with much of how I have put together the world, too.
But I think that he may possibly be overreaching a little bit. I would wager that there is a level consciousness which exists under what can be instantaneously articulated. That is to say that there is a consciousness which makes decisions before they "bubble up" to where we could express them in even the most basic terms, because that act of expression requires additional processing.
For example, if you were playing basketball, you would hinder yourself greatly if you had to express all of your desired actions in words before you carried them out.
However, I feel that all that stuff about environment and physical influences effectively manipulating and limiting your "choice" is right on the money.
Mon Apr 02, 08:11:00 PM 2012 
 Mark Gesswein said...
I agree with The Wise Fool. Arguing that, because your brain has come to a conclusion before your CONSCIOUS mind is aware that you've come to that conclusion is just a matter of semantics. Are we just the sum total of all our experiences and imputed knowledge? To a degree, yes. But, as Wise Fool posted, the idea that we have NO control over what our brain does is patently ridiculous. Deciding, just for the heck of it, that I am going to raise my arm above my head, for NO good reason, is PURELY an act of free will. I'm doing it right now, as I type this. Random acts like this are quite common. In fact, if there were no such thing as free will, there would BE no such thing as random acts. Just my $0.02...
Thu Apr 05, 07:46:00 AM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
But, Mark, if raising your arm is a random act, then how is it an act of free will? Does a coin have a choice in whether it comes up heads or tails?
Thu Apr 05, 09:04:00 AM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 31 May 20122 Nephi 27: The Book of Mormon prophesies itself
After taking a short break from quoting Isaiah, Nephi got tired of his own tiresome words, so he went back to quoting Isaiah again.
But this time, it's not just filler.
Isaiah 29 was selected because it refers to a special book, sealed by God, that the wise and learned  cannot understand. Only one very special person will be able to read it.
As Nephi explains:
It shall come to pass that the Lord God shall bring forth unto you the words of a book ... And behold the book shall be sealed. 
But the book shall be delivered unto a man ... which are the words of those who have slumbered in the dust.
The book shall be hid from the eyes of the world, that the eyes of none shall behold it save it be that three witnesses shall behold it ... and they shall testify to the truth of the book and the things therein. 
And wo be unto him that rejecteth the word of God! 2 Nephi 27:6-14
The book, of course, is the Book of Mormon, "a marvelous work and a wonder," and the very special person is Joseph Smith.
 
It's all there in Isaiah 29, as quoted by Nephi (with a few extra "and it came to passes" and "beholds" thrown in to make it sound even more biblical than the Bible).
But behold, it shall come to pass that the Lord God shall say unto him to whom he shall deliver the book: Take these words which are not sealed and deliver them to another, that he may show them unto the learned, saying: Read this, I pray thee. And the learned shall say: Bring hither the book, and I will read them. 2 Nephi 27:15
And the man shall say: I cannot bring the book, for it is sealed. Then shall the learned say: I cannot read it. 2 Nephi 27:17-18
(And the vision of all is become unto you as the words of a book that is sealed, which men deliver to one that is learned, saying, Read this, I pray thee: and he saith, I cannot; for it is sealed: Isaiah 29:11) 
Wherefore it shall come to pass, that the Lord God will deliver again the book and the words thereof to him that is not learned; and the man that is not learned shall say: I am not learned. 2 Nephi 27:19
(And the book is delivered to him that is not learned, saying, Read this, I pray thee: and he saith, I am not learned. Isaiah 29:12)
Therefore, I will proceed to do a marvelous work among this people, yea, a marvelous work and a wonder, for the wisdom of their wise and learned shall perish, and the understanding of their prudent shall be hid. 2 Nephi 27:26
(Therefore, behold, I will proceed to do a marvellous work among this people, even a marvellous work and a wonder: for the wisdom of their wise men shall perish, and the understanding of their prudent men shall be hid. Isaiah 29:14)
The book of Mormon prophesies itself -- 2400 years before it was dug up and translated by Joseph Smith.
When it comes to prophesy, you just can't beat the Book of Mormon!
Posted by Steve Wells at 5/31/2012 01:49:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
4 comments:
 Zach Crouse said...
first off the books of nephi are Mormon which is a cult and not credible. Second read the book of Hebrews. There you will find that the reason for all of God's harshness in the old testament and how we are now not bound by that same law. God judged harshly in Old Testament because he was punishing those who committed sin of which the sentence is death. Not because God wants to kill them but because it was the sentence God told adam and eve in the garden. If God is to be fair and just he must abide by the law that was set. The law was set that way because God cannot be in the presence of sin because it goes against his nature which is perfection. Since people fall short of perfection he must punish them. (this death is a spiritual death in the new testament. sometimes God decided that sin was necessary to punish in a physical sense such as in the flood)
Tue Jun 05, 06:39:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Zach, don't you realize that the bible is just man-made fiction? We are not now, nor have we ever been, bound by any of that shit.
Start with the incontrovertible evidence that there was never a "first man" or "first woman", then think out the rest of it.
The book of mor(m)on is just more fiction that is of recent enough origin that we have less trouble seeing it for what it is.
Steve Weeks
Thu Jun 07, 07:26:00 AM 2012 
 mya said...
I believe the only one I want to see is The Book Of Mormon! I am waiting for his discount tickets from Ticketpolice.com for that one!I have been going to Broadway since I was 13. LOVE IT!
Fri Jun 15, 08:11:00 AM 2012 
 Leon Brooks said...
The incontrovertible evidence has been controverted many times.
When Mary Schweitzer discovered T.Rex remains in Hell Creek Formation which still had collagen etc intact after "65 million years," that one find, all by itself (there are scores of similar finds) completely derailed the standard dating mythology.
The work of fiction predicted the exact day on which a certain "mythical" gent rode a colt into a specific city, over 800 years before it happened.
It also predicted the gold melting & running down between the stones 70 years later, & what people would do to recover that gold.
It also predicted the year of (Bertheir) a general for Napoleon, executing Pius IV.
Joseph Smith's mother Lucy wrote to a friend (well before he started his organisation), describing him as a story-spinner, able to pad the most unlikely tale with his own invented details to make it seem believable... which is exactly what he did, assisted by his cousin Oliver Cowdery, Sydney Rigdon & a few other willing accomplices, on a big scale.
Tue Dec 11, 12:57:00 AM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 30 May 2012In my name they shall take up serpents
The last thing that Jesus supposedly said to his followers before beaming up to heaven after his resurrection was this:
And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues; They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover. Mark 16:17-18
Jesus said there are five signs of true believers, and one of them is handling snakes -- and walking on them.
Behold, I give unto you power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy: and nothing shall by any means hurt you. Luke 10:19
There just aren't many true believers anymore.
And now there is one less.

Posted by Steve Wells at 5/30/2012 02:30:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
4 comments:
 Incongruous Circumspection said...
Science beats faith. Whodathunk it!
Wed May 30, 02:36:00 PM 2012 
 No said...
Sad thing but I'm pretty sure stories like this happen each day around the globe because of religion.
I read the article, his father died the exact same way. How's that ?
A Darwin Award nominee ? Naa...
RIP
Wed May 30, 06:07:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Last night on "Nature" (PBS) the topic was the "Black Mamba", one of the most deadly snakes on earth. Immediately following was "Nova", which was devoted to the topic of "Venom"... snakes, spiders, jellyfish, etc.
Gotta stand in AWE of the Lard's loving design! :lol:
Steve
Thu May 31, 04:20:00 AM 2012 
 Gary said...
God must've been taking a nap when these gentlemen died.
Tue Jul 17, 06:48:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 23 May 2012So it was Jesus that sent the serpents to bite people for complaining!
One of the craziest stories in the Bible is found in Numbers 21. It all happens in just two verses:
The people spake against God, and against Moses, Wherefore have ye brought us up out of Egypt to die in the wilderness? for there is no bread, neither is there any water; and our soul loatheth this light bread.
And the LORD sent fiery serpents among the people, and they bit the people; and much people of Israel died. Numbers 21:5-6
Christians don't pay much attention to it, though. That was, after all, the Old Testament, and they ignore pretty much everything in it, except for the verses that condemn homosexuality.
Sure, they say, God sent fiery serpents to bite the people for complaining about the lack of food and water, but Jesus had nothing to do with it.
Unless you believe Paul, that is.
Neither let us tempt Christ, as some of them also tempted, and were destroyed of serpents. 1 Corinthians 10:9
The people tempted Christ (by complaining) and he sent snakes to bite them.
So don't tempt Jesus, or he'll send some of his snakes to bite you too.
Posted by Steve Wells at 5/23/2012 03:52:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
6 comments:
 No said...
Unfortunately God did it only once, too bad for the millions out there dying of hunger, at least they would have something to eat: snakes.
Apparently it tastes a lot like chicken but I've never tried it.
Wed May 23, 06:03:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
The Irish could have used those snakes for food during the potato famine... no thanks to St. Patrick.
;-)
Steve Weeks
Thu May 24, 04:10:00 AM 2012 
 No said...
Had Adam and Eve eaten the snake instead of the apple we would still be enjoying the garden party and the naked chicks... sigh.
Thu May 24, 03:57:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
No said...
"Had Adam and Eve eaten the snake instead of the apple we would still be enjoying the garden party and the naked chicks... sigh."
Yes, but we wouldn't appreciate the naked chicks as much. :-(
Steve Weeks
Thu May 24, 05:34:00 PM 2012 
 Tracy said...
Wait... God, Jesus, and the Spook all did it. They are all the same thing. God is Jesus, and Jesus is God, and they are both the Spirit thing.
So if they say it was the Old Testament, yes, they are correct. However, the same Diety did it in the old and new testament.
Thu May 24, 08:45:00 PM 2012 
 No said...
Thank you Lord for your interest in snakes, I truly appreciate it. Who else would fill our place if not you and your threats. Hallelujah !
- A reptile home owner
Thu May 24, 10:45:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 16 May 20122 Nephi 26: All those who have dwindled in unbelief shall not be forgotten.
Nephi tells us, once again, all about Jesus, 600 or so years before Jesus existed.
After Jesus dies he will rise from the dead and come visit the Nephites in North America. The Nephites will learn about his birth, death, and resurrection; then all hell will break loose. Proud and wicked Nephites will stone to death the Nephite saints and prophets, then God will cause the proud and the wicked to be swallowed by the earth, covered with mountains, carried away by whirlwinds, crushed by falling buildings, destroyed by thunder, lightening, earthquakes, and fire.
After Christ shall have risen from the dead he shall show himself unto you, my children.
Many generations shall pass away, and there shall be great wars and contentions among my people.
And after the Messiah shall come there shall be signs given unto my people of his birth, and also of his death and resurrection; and great and terrible shall that day be unto the wicked, for they shall perish; and they perish because they cast out the prophets, and the saints, and stone them, and slay them.
All those who are proud, and that do wickedly, the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the Lord of Hosts.
They that kill the prophets, and the saints, the depths of the earth shall swallow them up, saith the Lord of Hosts; and mountains shall cover them, and whirlwinds shall carry them away, and buildings shall fall upon them and crush them to pieces and grind them to powder.
And they shall be visited with thunderings, and lightnings, and earthquakes, and all manner of destructions, for the fire of the anger of the Lord shall be kindled against them, and they shall be as stubble, and the day that cometh shall consume them, saith the Lord of Hosts. 2 Nephi 26:1-6
After the wicked kill the righteous and God kills the wicked, Jesus will heal whatever survivors there may be and there will be peace for three or four generations. Then the Nephites will "yield to the devil," be destroyed again, and "go down to hell."
But the Son of righteousness shall appear unto them; and he shall heal them, and they shall have peace with him, until three generations shall have passed away, and many of the fourth generation shall have passed away in righteousness.
And when these things have passed away a speedy destruction cometh unto my people ... they shall reap destruction; for because they yield unto the devil ... therefore they must go down to hell. 2 Nephi 26:9-10
Sometime after the Nephites are destroyed, the Gentiles (Non-Mormon Protestants) will start believing that Jesus is the Christ.
It must needs be that the Gentiles be convinced also that Jesus is the Christ, the Eternal God. 2 Nephi 26:12
In the last days, after the Gentiles are converted, Nephi's seed will dwindle in unbelief and be smitten by the Gentiles. God will camp out against the dwindlers and "all those that dwindle in unbelief shall not be forgotten."
I prophesy unto you concerning the last days.
After my seed ... shall have dwindled in unbelief, and shall have been smitten by the Gentiles; yea, after the Lord God shall have camped against them round about ... all those who have dwindled in unbelief shall not be forgotten. 2 Nephi 26:14-15
Then, in the latter days of the last days, the truths in the Book of Mormon will be written, but those who dwindle in unbelief won't believe them because "they seek to destroy the things of God."
For thus saith the Lord God: They shall write the things which shall be done among them, and they shall be written and sealed up in a book, and those who have dwindled in unbelief shall not have them, for they seek to destroy the things of God. 2 Nephi 26:17
And it will come to pass that those who dwindle in unbelief will be smitten (again) by the Gentiles.
And it shall come to pass, that those who have dwindled in unbelief shall be smitten by the hand of the Gentiles. 2 Nephi 26:19
Then the Gentiles will stumble "because of the greatness of their stumbling block" by building evil churches according to the secret combinations of the devil (who founded all the non-LDS churches).
The Gentiles ... stumbled, because of the greatness of their stumbling block, that they have built up many churches ... which cause envyings, and strifes, and malice.
And there are also secret combinations ... according to the combinations of the devil, for he is the founder of all these things. 2 Nephi 26:20-22
Which leaves us with the only true church: the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. You know, the one that teaches love and tolerance toward all. (Its code name is "Zion" in the Book of Mormon.)
The Lord God hath given a commandment that all men should have charity, which charity is love, and except they should have charity they were nothing.
But the laborer in Zion shall labor for Zion; for if they labor for money they shall perish.
For ... the Lord ... denieth none that come unto him, black and white, bond and free, male and female; and he remembereth the heathen; and all are alike unto God, both Jew and Gentile. 2 Nephi 26:30-33

Posted by Steve Wells at 5/16/2012 01:33:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
3 comments:
 nazani said...
OK, a long overdue question: What exactly did the biblical author or Joseph Smith mean by "dwindling in unbelief?" I assume they did not mean actual physical shrinkage or atrophy. Reduction in numbers, since the phrase always seems to refer to a group of people? Some sort of mystical 'brownie points' denoting a healthy or unhealthy eternal soul? If the latter, don't bother to explain the metaphysics- I don't care about the taxonomy of woo.
Or, is this just archaic language? I would say that my belief has dwindled to extinction, while my unbelief is as robust as any abstract idea can be.
Thu May 17, 05:35:00 AM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Yeah, I've wondered about that too, nazani. What did Joseph Smith mean by the phrase "dwindling in unbelief?" He loved to (over)use words and phrases from the King James Version of the Bible, such as "And it came to pass", "behold", and "exceedingly". But "dwindling in unbelief" is not found in the Bible.
My guess is that he just thought it sounded really cool. Like something God would say if he could talk.
But if I had to guess what was in Joseph Smith's mind, I'd say he meant that those who "dwindle in unbelief" no longer have God's love and protection, so they're up shit creek, so to speak. God either kills them off or has the non-dwindlers do it for him. Or something like that.
I don't know why I chose that phrase as the title for my blog. I guess I just liked the way it sounded -- which is probably the same reason Joseph Smith liked it so much.
It is true that unbelief is hardly dwindling. Our numbers are rapidly increasing, and science, liberty, and human progress have always depended upon unbelief and unbelievers.
So unbelief is flourishing as belief dwindles. And Joseph Smith is full of shit.
Thu May 17, 10:07:00 AM 2012 
 Stephen said...
"Dwindling" is best done privately, in the dark. And why should those dwindlers be forgotten? Look what happened to Onan!
;-)
Steve Weeks
Thu May 17, 11:50:00 AM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 13 May 2012Some Bible verses for Mother's Day
It's not easy to find a good Bible verse for Mother's Day.
But here are the best I can find.
From the book of Hosea.
Plead with your mother, plead: ... let her ... put away her whoredoms ... and her adulteries from between her breasts;  Lest I strip her naked ... and slay her with thirst. 
And I will not have mercy upon her children; for they be the children of whoredoms. ...For their mother hath played the harlot.
Now will I discover her lewdness in the sight of her lovers, and none shall deliver her out of mine hand. Hosea 2:2-10
Give them, O LORD: what wilt thou give? give them a miscarrying womb and dry breasts. ... I will love them no more.  ... Yea, though they bring forth, yet will I slay even the beloved fruit of their womb. Hosea 9:14-16
 Their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their women with child shall be ripped up. Hosea 13:16
And Deuteronomy.
The tender and delicate woman among you ... her eye shall be evil ... toward her son, and toward her daughter, And toward her young one that cometh out from between her feet, and toward her children which she shall bear: for she shall eat them. Deuteronomy 28:56-57
Or how about the inspiring words of Jesus?
I am come to set ... the daughter against her mother. ... He that loveth ... mother more than me is not worthy of me.  Matthew 10:35-37
Blessed is the womb that bare thee, and the paps which thou hast sucked. But he said, Yea rather, blessed are they that hear the word of God, and keep it.  Luke 11:27-28
If any man come to me, and hate not his ... mother ... he cannot be my disciple. Luke 14:26
Behold, thy mother ... seek(s) for thee. And he answered them, saying, Who is my mother? Mark 3:32-33
Woman, what have I to do with thee? (Jesus talking to his mother)   John 2:4
Any of these would look nice on a Mother's Day card, don't you think?
Happy Mother's Day!
Posted by Steve Wells at 5/13/2012 06:23:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
8 comments:
 Buffy said...
Maybe that's why RW Christians do so much bleating about the "sanctity of motherhood" yet treat women/mothers like garbage.
Sun May 13, 06:30:00 PM 2012 
 krissthesexyatheist said...
Wow...Happy Mothers Day indeed.
Kriss
Sun May 13, 07:36:00 PM 2012 
 C Woods said...
Holy shit! I'm glad I'm not the mother of someone who takes this stuff literally.
Sun May 13, 10:27:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Hallmark is going to be acquiring the rights to those verses as our nation becomes more religious.
;-)
Steve Weeks
Mon May 14, 04:14:00 AM 2012 
 nazani said...
Is there a list somewhere of all the bible verses that indicate God and his henchmen are only too willing to kill infants, born or unborn? If so, it should be read aloud in Congress and entered into the Congressional record.
Mon May 14, 05:51:00 AM 2012 
 Stephen said...
nazani said...
"Is there a list somewhere of all the bible verses that indicate God and his henchmen are only too willing to kill infants, born or unborn?"
Probably you could justify the point of view that the Flood in Genesis and is the single (alleged) event where the most killing of infants took place. A couple good resources are Steve Wells' excellent web site, "The Skeptic's Annotated Bible" and his book, "Drunk with Blood- God's Killings in the Bible".
Steve
Tue May 29, 06:21:00 PM 2012 
 Dr. B said...
Great work.....you left the all important CONTEXT out of everyone of these versus.
Tue May 07, 04:42:00 PM 2013 
 Jonny Vincent said...
ROFL. Context? What context makes the dashing of infants and the ripping up of women with child okay?
Christian two-faced lying leeches. Only the Romans had the right idea. You'll pay for your tolerance, in this world of sleaze and insanity.
Sat May 11, 10:22:00 PM 2013 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 11 May 2012What the Bible says about Homosexuality
Homosexuality is an abomination to God (like shrimp).


Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination. Leviticus 18:22

Except that unlike eating shrimp, the punishment for homosexuality is death.


If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them. Leviticus 20:13

Or exile.

Asa did that which was right in the eyes of the LORD ... And he took away the sodomites out of the land. ... Asa's heart was perfect with the LORD all his days. 1 Kings 15:11-14

Jehoshaphat ... walked in all the ways of Asa his father ... doing that which was right in the eyes of the LORD ... The remnant of the sodomites, which remained in the days of his father Asa, he took out of the land. 1 Kings 22:42-46

And the New Testament is just as intolerant toward homosexuals.

For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature. And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet. (God will make you gay!) Romans 1:26-27

God gave them over to a reprobate mind ... without natural affection ... they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them. Romans 1:28-32

The unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom ... neither fornicators ... nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind ... shall inherit the kingdom of God. 1 Corinthians 6:9-10

Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for ... them that defile themselves with mankind ... and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine ... These filthy dreamers defile the flesh. 1 Timothy 1:9-10

Even as Sodom and Gomorrha ... giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh ... suffering the vengeance of eternal fire. Jude 7-8

Except for Jesus (who hung out with 12 guys and never said anything bad about homosexuality) who said that  you can increase your chances of being raptured by being gay. (So pray to be gay!)


I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. Luke 17:34-35

And finally, rejoice and be glad when you see homosexuals (lead about by silly, lusty, educated women), because then you'll know for sure that Jesus is coming soon.


In the last days ... men shall be ... without natural affection ... lovers of pleasures ... lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts, ... ever learning. 2 Timothy 3:1-7
Posted by Steve Wells at 5/11/2012 10:54:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
5 comments:
 Stephen said...
This wouldn't have anything to do with Obama's announcement, would it?
http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/on-faith/obamas-embrace-of-gay-marriage-makes-for-a-spiritual-mothers-day/2012/05/11/gIQAAKULIU_story.html
This is a shot across the bow to the christian right. Let the gaymes begin!
Steve Weeks
Fri May 11, 07:13:00 PM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Yeah, Obama's announcement inspired me to update the "What the Bible says about Homosexuality" page at the SAB. So I thought I'd do a post on it as well.
Sat May 12, 04:48:00 PM 2012 
 Doulos1066 said...
There are two different hebrew words translated as abomination in the shrimp and homosexual passages.
Sat May 12, 05:31:00 PM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
And your point is what, Doulos?
Does God hate shrimp more or less than homosexuals?
Sat May 12, 06:33:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Steve Wells said...
"Does God hate shrimp more or less than homosexuals?"
No. It's worse than that:
Homosexual Shrimp!
Now, THAT's abomination!
Steve Weeks
Sat May 12, 07:52:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 09 May 20122 Nephi 25: Nephi speaks (somewhat) plainly about Jews, Jesus, and Joseph Smith
Nephi finally gives us a break from quoting Isaiah (2 Nephi 11-24) and begins to speak (somewhat) about the the 13 chapters he copied from the King James Version of the Bible (about 2200 years before that translation existed).
Now I, Nephi, do speak somewhat concerning the words which I have written, which have been spoken by the mouth of Isaiah. 2 Nephi 25:1
First he tells us about Jews.
The Jews ... works were works of darkness, and their doings were doings of abominations. 2 Nephi 25:2
Then he explains why no one understands Isaiah.  To understand Isaiah properly, you need to delight in plainness and be filled with the spirit of prophecy. And Nephi is full of prophecy and plainness.
The words of Isaiah are not plain unto you, nevertheless they are plain unto all those that are filled with the spirit of prophecy ... My soul delighteth in plainness unto my people. 2 Nephi 25:4
But Nephi's soul delights in more than just plainness; it also delights in the words of Isaiah. (That's probably why he included 13 consecutive chapters from Isaiah. See 2 Nephi 11-24)
My soul delighteth in the words of Isaiah. 2 Nephi 25:5a
The only people that understand the prophets are people that are taught after the manner of the Jews (like early 19th century Americans.)
The Jews do understand the things of the prophets, and there is none other people that understand the things which were spoken unto the Jews like unto them, save it be that they are taught after the manner of the things of the Jews. 2 Nephi 25:5b
And lucky for us, Nephi is from Jerusalem and knows all about all things such as and suchlike.
 But behold, I, Nephi ... have dwelt at Jerusalem, wherefore I know concerning the regions round about. 2 Nephi 25:6
With his prophecy credentials intact, Nephi proceeds with his own prophecy according to his plainness.
Behold, I proceed with mine own prophecy, according to my plainness. 2 Nephi 25:7
He starts by telling us a bit more about Jews. God has destroyed them from one generation to the next because of their iniquities.
As one generation hath been destroyed among the Jews because of iniquity, even so have they been destroyed from generation to generation according to their iniquities. 2 Nephi 25:9
Nephi prophesies that in another 600 years or so, the evil Jews will reject and crucify Jesus because of their hard hearts and stiff necks.
The Father of heaven and of earth, shall manifest himself unto them in the flesh, behold, they will reject him, because of their iniquities, and the hardness of their hearts, and the stiffness of their necks ... They will crucify him. 2 Nephi 25:12-13
And woe unto whoever fights against God's church (the Mormons), which will show up in another 2400 years or so.
 Wo unto them that fight against God and the people of his church. 2 Nephi 25:14
And, of course, woe unto the the Jews. They'll be scattered among all nations and be scourged by God for many generations until, finally, they are persuaded to believe in Christ.
Wherefore, the Jews shall be scattered among all nations. ... After they have been scattered, and the Lord God hath scourged them by other nations for ... many generations ... they shall be persuaded to believe in Christ. 2 Nephi 25:15-16
Meanwhile, God will inspire Joseph Smith to write find and translate the Book of Mormon, which is, as I'm sure you've noticed by now, a marvelous work and a wonder. ("A Marvelous work and a wonder" is LDS-speak for the Book of Mormon.)
The Lord ... will proceed to do a marvelous work and a wonder. 2 Nephi 25:17
That the promise may be fulfilled unto Joseph [Smith], that his seed should never perish as long as the earth should stand." 2 Nephi 25:21
And now Nephi gets precise about his Christ prophecy: Jesus Christ, the Son of God, will be born 600 years after Nephi's dad (Lehi) left Jerusalem.
According to the words of the prophets, the Messiah cometh in six hundred years from the time that my father left Jerusalem ... his name shall be Jesus Christ, the Son of God. 2 Nephi 25:19
Nephi reminds us about some of the plain and wonderful things that are found in the Hebrew scriptures:  the fiery serpents (Num. 21:6-9) and the water-bearing rock (Ex.17:6, Num.20:11)..
I have spoken plainly that ... the Lord God ... gave unto Moses power that he should heal the nations after they had been bitten by the poisonous serpents, if they would cast their eyes unto the serpent which he did raise up before them, and also gave him power that he should smite the rock and the water should come forth. 2 Nephi 25:20
And the rest of his prophecy is all about Jesus H. Christ. There's no other name that can get you saved.
There is none other name given under heaven save it be this Jesus Christ, of which I have spoken, whereby man can be saved. 2 Nephi 25:20
So believe in Christ.
We labor diligently to write, to persuade our children, and also our brethren, to believe in Christ. 2 Nephi 25:23
We believe in Christ. 2 Nephi 25:24a
Look forward to Christ.
Look forward with steadfastness unto Christ. 2 Nephi 25:24b
Be alive in Christ.
We are made alive in Christ because of our faith. 2 Nephi 25:25a
Talk of Christ.
We talk of Christ.  2 Nephi 25:26b
Rejoice in Christ.
We rejoice in Christ.  2 Nephi 25:26c
Preach of Christ.
We preach of Christ.  2 Nephi 25:26d
Prophesy of Christ.
We prophesy of Christ. 2 Nephi 25:26e
The Nephites did all these Christian things six centuries before Christianity existed.
So don't let anyone tell you Mormons aren't Christians.

Posted by Steve Wells at 5/09/2012 03:39:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
3 comments:
 sinclair said...
Wait, so Jews are universally evil, but being taught "in the manner of the Jews" is somehow a virtue? LOL at BoM having conflicting statements on nature vs nurture within a single chapter.
Thu May 10, 01:17:00 AM 2012 
 HopeYouGuessMyName said...
How the hell can you stand to read the BOM? I have tried a few times, but it is just a horridly written thing.
Sun May 13, 12:37:00 AM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Blogger HopeYouGuessMyName said...
"How the hell can you stand to read the BOM? I have tried a few times, but it is just a horridly written thing."
Just keep at it, and it will come to pass that you will find that your appreciation for the book, a marvelous work and a wonder, will wax strong, and it will delight you exceedingly.
;-)
Steve Weeks
Sun May 13, 05:16:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 06 May 2012Bill Maher on Mormonism: I'm very sorry if I called your horseshit bullshit.

Posted by Steve Wells at 5/06/2012 10:28:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
2 comments:
 Stephen said...
Sometimes Bill Maher misses the point.
This is not one of those times.
Steve Weeks
Sun May 06, 04:01:00 PM 2012 
 nazani said...
Wow. Had no idea giving to religion stiffed the rest of us so badly.
Wed May 09, 11:21:00 AM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 03 May 2012Jon Stewart's only fear: Religion
Jon Stewart isn't afraid to criticize people for their nasty beliefs -- unless the source of those beliefs is religion. Then, whatever it is, it's OK with him.
Here's how he put it on last night's show:
You can't cherry pick the worst aspects of a religion and then hold every member of that religion solely responsible for it.
Yes, you can. That is exactly what we should do.
We should hold Mormons responsible for the racism that is found throughout the Book of Mormon; Jews, for the cruel and intolerant passages in the Hebrew Scriptures; Christians, for the nasty bullshit in both of their testaments; and Muslims, for the entire hodgepodge of hateful horseshit that is the Quran.
The individual members of a religion are not solely responsible for the worst aspects of their religion. But they are responsible for believing it.
And we should hold them responsible for every rotten cherry on their religion's tree. If they don't like the cherries, they should pick another tree.
Here's the Daily Show video.

The Daily Show with Jon Stewart
Get More: Daily Show Full Episodes,Political Humor & Satire Blog,The Daily Show on Facebook
Posted by Steve Wells at 5/03/2012 06:54:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
12 comments:
 idrumgood said...
I usually agree with you, but not here. You're advocating something dangerously close to racism (relgiousism?)
I'm a white American, am I held responsible for the slaughter of the indigenous back in the 1500's? Is the 12 year old German girl still responsible for the Holocaust?
Holding an entire group responsible for the doings of a few is just as hateful and bigoted as those you claim to be above.
Fri May 04, 07:06:00 AM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
I am a white American, too, idrumgod, but I do not approve of the way the Native Americans were treated. I didn't choose my race or place of birth. But a believer chooses what to believe.
A person who believes in the Bible, for example, approves of its contents, and, therefore, should be held accountable for those beliefs. Mitt Romney believes in the Book of Mormon and agrees with its contents. He is, therefore, a racist -- not by birth, but by choice. The same applies to all believers. They, and they alone, are responsible for their beliefs.
Fri May 04, 09:11:00 AM 2012 
 idrumgood said...
Is it true that every Mormon is a racist? That every Christian would condemn the gays to hell?
Sure, their religions may teach it, but they certainly may not believe it. My mother is a Christian, but is not bigoted.
Your examples are true, Mitt is a racist, and by choice at that. But all Mormons are not. So it is still unfair and unjust to call all Mormons racist, despite the teachings of their religion. If they chose to believe those tenants and are indeed racist, then by all means, hold them accountable.
Fri May 04, 09:20:00 AM 2012 
 Ian said...
I'm going to disagee, Steve, in that I think you're missing an obvious point: most religious believers ignore the majority of what their holy books say, and cherry-pick items.
This, of course, leads me to ask why they bother with the cherry-picking and don't just discard the entire nonsensical package. If you don't believe that non-virgin women should be stoned to death on their wedding night, even though it's in the Bible, I don't see a good reason to believe that Jesus rose from the dead.
So I think the real criticism to direct at most believers is that they lack the intellectual and moral fortitude to reject the whole thing, even though they've already rejected a good chunk of what their holy books mandate.
Sat May 05, 08:22:00 AM 2012 
 nazani said...
Perhaps, if Jews hadn't been isolated and persecuted for centuries in Europe, there wouldn't be such a close bond between their religion and their ethnic identity. My guess is the same thing is happening now with Muslims. The more they are socially isolated by Europeans and Americans, the less chance someone raised in a faithful family will feel comfortable in walking away from that faith or be able to gradually drift away from it.
Anyway, I've worked with both Jews and Mormons in the Army who were only Jewish or Mormon when they visited their parents on leave. While we celebrate courageous people who wash their hands of religion, let's not bash those who aren't willing to cut all ties.
Sat May 05, 01:58:00 PM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Sure, there are many believers that are unaware of the teachings of their faith. They are either too lazy to read the texts that they claim to believe in, or too dishonest to admit that the nasty aspects of their religion exist. And they'll continue in their lazy, dishonest beliefs as long as no one confronts them. That's why so many nasty beliefs still exist.
We need to make believers ashamed of every belief that they should be ashamed of. Rather than pretend (with them) that there's nothing for them to be ashamed of.
Sat May 05, 09:29:00 PM 2012 
 nazani said...
@Steve Wells- Were you replying to me? Where did I say that the non-observant people in my units were lazy or ignorant of their own religion? If people aren't acting according to their nominal religion, then I would just be a dick for heckling them. I don't need to see everybody renounce their faiths in an overt way; letting it fade out quietly achieves the same end.
You might also consider the ramifications of telling your chopper mechanic, parachute rigger, supply or mess sergeant, or CO what they should be ashamed of.
Sun May 06, 09:55:00 AM 2012 
 Anders said...
I do agree that if you believe in a religion, then you must be held accountable for those beliefs. Not necessarily for what people did in the name of those beliefs, but most definitely for the beliefs themselves.
Sidenote: his name is Jon Stewart, not John
Sun May 06, 10:01:00 AM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
No mazani, I didn't mean to imply that you were calling non-observant religious people lazy or ignorant.
That's what I am doing. And maybe I'm a dick for doing so. But I think when it comes to religion, the world needs a few good dicks.
Sun May 06, 10:15:00 AM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Thanks, Anders, for the correction on Jon Stewart's name.
Tue May 08, 11:19:00 AM 2012 
 Darren Delgado said...
Steve,
Please continue the dickery. It is needed for a good cause, and appreciated. I applaud you.
Wed May 16, 02:03:00 AM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Darren Delgado said...
"Steve, Please continue the dickery. It is needed for a good cause, and appreciated. I applaud you."
I second that! Keep it up.
(Ooooh... bad pun!)
Steve Weeks
Wed May 16, 02:35:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 01 May 2012Dan Savage is right about the Bible: It's Bullshit
A couple weeks ago, Dan Savage discussed the Bible with a group of journalism students.
Here is what he said (see video below) -- along with some of the bullshit from the Bible that believers ignore while pretending to believe it.
The Bible, we’ll just talk about the Bible for a second. People often point out that they can’t help it – they can’t help with the anti-gay bullying, because it says right there in Leviticus, it says right there in Timothy, it says right there in Romans, that being gay is wrong.
Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination. Leviticus 18:22
If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them. Leviticus 20:13
The law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind.... 1 Timothy 1:9-10
 In the last days ... men will be ... without natural affection. 2 Timothy 3:1-3
 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:  And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another ... God gave them over to a reprobate mind ... they which commit such things are worthy of death. Romans 1:26-32
We can learn to ignore the bullshit in the Bible about gay people. [applause] The same way, the same way we have learned to ignore the bullshit in the Bible about shellfish,
And all that have not fins and scales in the seas ... shall be an abomination unto you: ... Whatsoever hath no fins nor scales in the waters, that shall be an abomination unto you. Leviticus 11:10-11
 about slavery,
Of the children of the strangers that do sojourn among you, of them shall ye buy, and of their families that are with you ... they shall be your possession. And ye shall take them as an inheritance for your children after you, to inherit them for a possession; they shall be your bondmen for ever.  Leviticus 25:44-46
If a man smite his servant, or his maid, with a rod, and ... he continue a day or two, he shall not be punished: for he is his money. Exodus 21:20-21
Servants [slaves], be subject to your masters with all fear; not only to the good and gentle, but also to the froward. 1 Peter 2:18
(See here for more bullshit from the Bible on slavery.)
about dinner,
These shall ye not eat ... swine ... it is unclean unto you. Deuteronomy 14:7-8
It is good neither to eat flesh, nor to drink wine, nor any thing whereby thy brother stumbleth, or is offended, or is made weak. Romans 14:21
And thou shalt eat it as barley cakes, and thou shalt bake it with dung that cometh out of man. Ezekiel 4:12
about farming,
Thou shalt not plow with an ox and an ass together.  Deuteronomy 22:10
about menstruation,
If a woman have an issue, and her issue in her flesh be blood, she shall be put apart seven days: and whosoever toucheth her shall be unclean until the even. And every thing that she lieth upon in her separation shall be unclean: every thing also that she sitteth upon shall be unclean. And whosoever toucheth her bed shall wash his clothes, and bathe himself in water, and be unclean until the even. And whosoever toucheth any thing that she sat upon shall wash his clothes, and bathe himself in water, and be unclean until the even. And if it be on her bed, or on any thing whereon she sitteth, when he toucheth it, he shall be unclean until the even. And if any man lie with her at all, and her flowers be upon him, he shall be unclean seven days; and all the bed whereon he lieth shall be unclean. And if a woman have an issue of her blood many days out of the time of her separation, or if it run beyond the time of her separation; all the days of the issue of her uncleanness shall be as the days of her separation: she shall be unclean. Every bed whereon she lieth all the days of her issue shall be unto her as the bed of her separation: and whatsoever she sitteth upon shall be unclean, as the uncleanness of her separation. And whosoever toucheth those things shall be unclean, and shall wash his clothes, and bathe himself in water, and be unclean until the even. But if she be cleansed of her issue, then she shall number to herself seven days, and after that she shall be clean. And on the eighth day she shall take unto her two turtles, or two young pigeons, and bring them unto the priest, to the door of the tabernacle of the congregation. And the priest shall offer the one for a sin offering, and the other for a burnt offering; and the priest shall make an atonement for her before the LORD for the issue of her uncleanness. Leviticus 15:19-30
If a man be just, and do that which is lawful and right, and hath not ... come near to a menstruous woman..... Ezekiel 18:5-6
about virginity,
If a man find a damsel that is a virgin, which is not betrothed, and lay hold on her, and lie with her, and they be found; Then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel's father fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife. Deuteronomy 22:28-29
Then shall the kingdom of heaven be likened unto ten virgins, which took their lamps, and went forth to meet the bridegroom. Matthew 25:1
about masturbation.
And Onan knew that the seed should not be his; and it came to pass, when he went in unto his brother's wife, that he spilled it on the ground, lest that he should give seed to his brother. And the thing which he did displeased the LORD: wherefore he slew him also. Genesis 38:9-10
If any man's seed of copulation go out from him, then he shall ... be unclean. Leviticus 15:16
Whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart. And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell. And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell. Matthew 5:28-30
[applause]
We ignore bullshit in the Bible about all sorts of things. The Bible is a radically pro-slavery document. Slave owners waved Bibles over their heads during the Civil War and justified it. The shortest book in the New Testament is a letter from Paul to a Christian slave owner about owning his Christian slave.
Philemon: This short letter was written by Paul to his slave-owner friend and fellow believer, Philemon. Paul was writing about Onesimus, who he had recently converted, and who happened to also be a runaway slave belonging to Philemon. Since Paul was in a position of authority among believers, this would have been a great opportunity for him (and God) to condemn slavery -- if he (and God) had anything against it, that is. But apparently he didn't. Instead he returned the slave to his owner without so much as a word against the institution of slavery.
(Note: Philemon isn't quite "the shortest book in the New Testament" -- 2 and 3 John are a bit shorter.)
And Paul doesn’t say “Christians don’t own people.” Paul talks about how Christians own people.
We ignore what the Bible says about slavery, because the Bible got slavery wrong. Tim — ah, Sam Harris, in A Letter To A Christian Nation, points out that the Bible got the easiest moral question that humanity has ever faced wrong. Slavery! What’re the odds that the Bible got something as complicated as human sexuality wrong? 100% percent.
The Bible says that if your daughter’s not a virgin on her wedding night – if a woman isn’t a virgin on her wedding night, she shall be dragged to her father’s doorstep and stoned to death.
If any man take a wife, and go in unto her, and hate her ... And say, I took this woman, and when I came to her, I found her not a maid: Then shall the father of the damsel, and her mother, take and bring forth the tokens of the damsel's virginity unto the elders of the city in the gate: And ... say ... these are the tokens of my daughter's virginity. ... But if ... the tokens of virginity be not found for the damsel, then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die. Deuteronomy 22:13-17
Callista Gingrich lives. [applause] And there is no effort to amend state constitutions to make it legal to stone women to death on their wedding night if they’re not virgins. At least not yet. We don’t know where the GOP is going these days. [audience laughs]
People are dying because people can’t clear this one last hurdle. They can’t get past this one last thing in the Bible about homosexuality.
One other thing I wanna talk about is — [chuckles] — so, you can tell the Bible guys in the hall that they can come back now, because I’m done beating up the Bible. [applause]
It’s funny, as someone who’s on the receiving end of beatings that are justified by the Bible, how pansy-assed some people react when you push back. [applause]


And here's a great video on the subject by Zinnia Jones.
Posted by Steve Wells at 5/01/2012 11:11:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
11 comments:
 krissthesexyatheist said...
Wow, made of awesome.
Kriss
Tue May 01, 11:22:00 AM 2012 
 Stephen said...
A bunch of people walked out on him, I suppose because they were (exceedingly) offended by his remarks critical of selective bible interpretation. Check out the girl at 1:35 wearing the crucifix. Actually, I don't remember Dan saying anything critical about Jesus or christianity, just old-testament stuff. The comments on the original article (http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2018110513_savage01m.html ) show a diversity of responses, but it's clear that a lot of people thought he was out of line. Not me. :-)
Steve Weeks
Tue May 01, 12:37:00 PM 2012 
 Mormon411 said...
Dear Steve Wells,
I love this blog! How do I follow you? Can't find a link anywhere!
Tue May 01, 02:11:00 PM 2012 
 LanceThruster said...
Hear, hear!
Tue May 01, 04:05:00 PM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Thanks Mormon411. I'm glad you like it.
As for links and whatnot, you can follow me on twitter (@SteveWellsSAB) and there's an RSS feed on the sidebar.
Tue May 01, 05:13:00 PM 2012 
 Leonidus the Great. said...
interesting piece and nice blog as a whole.
Tue May 01, 08:55:00 PM 2012 
 nazani said...
I wonder how many of these so-called journalism students later watched him on YouTube. I wonder how many actually considered what he said.
"it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell." Is this metaphor, or yet another example of ideas about the afterlife, of flesh v. spirit, not being quite settled when various books of the bible were written?
Thu May 03, 11:13:00 AM 2012 
 nazani said...
"it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell." Is this metaphor? Or yet another example of confusion about the nature of the afterlife and the nature of the soul?
I wonder how many of the walk-outs watched themselves on YouTube. Wonder if they felt proud of themselves or if some of his remarks actually got through.
Thu May 03, 11:15:00 AM 2012 
 Ian said...
I used to think that Christian fundamentalists would demonize homosexuality because, unlike say, adultery, it was the one "sin" they'd never be guilty of.
And while that may still be true, I'm convinced that a large chunk of the demonization comes from self-loathing closet cases. See Haggard, Ted; Craig, Larry; Long, Eddie; Bachmann, Marcus; Ratzinger, Joseph.
(I realize neither Pope Benedict or Marcus Bachmann have been caught in the act, but come on...)
Sat May 05, 08:16:00 AM 2012 
 Labratus1 said...
He looks so sad trying to put a spin on homosexuality and trying to justify it. But little that he knows its still wrong freak. Flame, Flame, Flame that's what he's going to get. The devil is so stupid when he's trying to compete with God. Next. Flamers. How GROSSSSS!
Mon May 28, 09:08:00 PM 2012 
 LanceThruster said...
Labratus1 - Your god's arms are too short to box with me. Sorry.
Tue May 29, 11:23:00 AM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 27 June 20122 Nephi 28-29: A Bible! We have got a Bible, and we need no more Bible!
In the last chapter, Nephi revealed the Book of Mormon, 2400 years before Joseph Smith dug it up in his own backyard. Amazing stuff.
Now he tells us how it will be received by Christians everywhere.
But first he reminds us about how God views non-Mormon Christians.
Yea, and there shall be many which shall teach ... false and vain and foolish doctrines ... their works shall be in the dark. And the blood of the saints shall cry from the ground against them. ... Because of pride, and because of false teachers, and false doctrine, their churches have become corrupted ... They wear stiff necks and high heads; yea, and because of pride, and wickedness, and abominations, and whoredoms .... wo, wo, wo be unto them, saith the Lord God Almighty, for they shall be thrust down to hell! 2 Nephi 28:9-15
And that's the (more or less) good guys - the non-Mormon Protestants.
It's the Catholics that God really hates.
But behold, that great and abominable church, the whore of all the earth, must tumble to the earth, and great must be the fall thereof. ... the devil will grasp them with his everlasting chains, and they be stirred up to anger, and perish ... Yea, they are grasped with death, and hell; and death, and hell ... from whence they must go into the place prepared for them, even a lake of fire and brimstone, which is endless torment. 28:18-23
Which leaves the Mormons, Nephi's seed.

God will proceed to do a marvelous work and remember Nephi's seed, and the words of Nephi's seed will proceed out of God's mouth. They will hiss forth unto the ends of the earth, so to speak.
I shall proceed to do a marvelous work ... I would remember your seed; and that the words of your seed should proceed forth out of my mouth unto your seed; and my words shall hiss forth unto the ends of the earth. 29.1-2
And when God's words hiss forth in the Book of Mormon, many of the WASPs will say, "A Bible! We have a Bible; we don't need another Bible!"
And because my words shall hiss forth -- many of the Gentiles shall say: A Bible! A Bible! We have got a Bible, and there cannot be any more Bible. ... A Bible! We have got a Bible, and we need no more Bible. 29:3-6
But God says it's his goddamned Bible and he can have as many of them as he pleases.
I speak forth my words according to mine own pleasure. And because that I have spoken one word ye need not suppose that I cannot speak another ... Wherefore, because that ye have a Bible ye need not suppose that it contains all my words; neither need ye suppose that I have not caused more to be written. 29:9-10
God made the Jews write a Bible; he made the Nephites write a Bible; he'll make the Lost Tribes of Israel write a Bible; everyone on earth will write a Bible. God likes Bibles. The more the merrier, he always says.
Behold, I shall speak unto the Jews and they shall write it; and I shall also speak unto the Nephites and they shall write it; and I shall also speak unto the other tribes of the house of Israel, which I have led away, and they shall write it; and I shall also speak unto all nations of the earth and they shall write it. 29:12
Before you know it the Jews will have the Nephite's Bible, the Nephites will have the Jews' Bible, the Nephites and the Jews will have the lost tribes' Bible, and the lost tribes will have the Bibles of the Nephites and the Jews.
The Jews shall have the words of the Nephites, and the Nephites shall have the words of the Jews; and the Nephites and the Jews shall have the words of the lost tribes of Israel; and the lost tribes of Israel shall have the words of the Nephites and the Jews. 29:13
And God will show those that fight against the Book of Mormon that he is God and that he covenanted with Abraham and he'll remember his seed forever.
And I will show unto them that fight against my word and against my people, who are of the house of Israel, that I am God, and that I covenanted with Abraham that I would remember his seed forever. 29:14
Or something like that.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Next Episode: 2 Nephi 30: They shall be a white and delightsome people.
Posted by Steve Wells at 6/27/2012 07:58:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
2 comments:
 No said...
The abysal depth of human naivety is as breathtaking as it is inexhaustible... what else to say ?
Thu Jun 28, 10:44:00 AM 2012 
 Maddy Miller said...
@No
https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/ad-hominem
Thu Mar 27, 11:12:00 AM 2014 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 21 June 2012The Numbers 15:32-36 Challenge to Bible Believers


Here's what the Bible says in Numbers 15:32-36:
While the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man that gathered sticks upon the Sabbath day. And they … brought him unto Moses and Aaron ... because it was not declared what should be done to him. And the LORD said unto Moses, The man shall be surely put to death: all the congregation shall stone him with stones ... And all the congregation ... stoned him with stones, and he died; as the LORD commanded Moses.
And here is the NonStampCollector challenge:
Christian believers, you have a choice: either defend the story of this man's being killed by having an angry mob of barbarians pelt him with rocks as being the holy justice mandated by a fair and just god of perfect love,...
or join the rest of the world in rejecting any deity's involvement in the story as a piece of insane fiction dreamt up by savage people hoping to convince somebody that their barbaric cruelty was mandated by a holy and unquestionable moral authority. It wasn't: it was fucking sick, AND YOU KNOW IT.
The bible is bullshit. Look elsewhere for perfect love.
Is there a Bible Believer who is willing to take the Numbers 15:32-36 challenge?
If so, I'd like to hear about it. You can even do a guest post here if you like.
Posted by Steve Wells at 6/21/2012 09:15:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
53 comments:
 Incongruous Circumspection said...
Someone told me the other day to keep my heart soft and open because, after all, "God loves me." My counter to them is, "Not the God portrayed in the Bible." There isn't a remote chance in the world that a God that can do things like this (this is lame compared to many of his other Biblical atrocities) actually gives a crap for me, no matter how many pretzels one tries to twist their theology into.
Thu Jun 21, 09:40:00 AM 2012 
 joel said...
hello, my name is Joel, I'm a Christian and wanted to discuss this point, i just stumbled on this website from a youtube video, so i still need to look around here, but i can appreciate the very logical/reasonable approach to the Bible i'm seeing so far, so i think we can agree that has to be our common ground.
ok, i can start quoting a bunch of scriptures, but i'm just going to throw some "what if's" and try to get the mindset right, to try to explain this particular scripture
if the Bible claims are true, that we have a sinful nature that makes it natural to us, to reject God, then we would need some way for this True God to reveal Himself to us outside of ourselves because our heart/mind are defiled.
So through Gods finding some faithful men, Noah, Abraham, down to Moses, we find ourselves with this Scripture, where God needs to reveal what righteousness is... 10 Commandments along with civil, health, hygiene, ceremonial laws showing us how the savior would be revealed to us as Passover, Feast of First Fruits, Day of Atonement, through the sanctuary.. etc, ,defining principally of what right and wrong is, what makes life work etc... with the long time goal redeeming mankind through the cross, the only thing that could make God just and vindicating His Name and Character before all heavenly beings, and this world against the claims of the devil.
So if this is true, then the people coming out of Egypt needed to have a checklist of many things, to teach them and be held by the hand if you will, for the sake of God's name and again the goal all along redeeming mankind and giving us a way back from our fallen and lost state. God makes these laws, one being the sabbath, along with many others that, granted are harsh, along with others you well aware of, but was the only way the Plan of Salvation could be carried out with the time and the people, for the sake of preserving the truth and preserving the Plan of Redemption, (on a side note the Flood gives us another example of this, any longer God would have waited, with the wickedness that arose at the time, mankind would have collapsed on itself!)
in God's mercy these things had to be put in place and judged accordingly in that Theocracy where they could see the cloud by day, fire by night, they could see the mana miraculously in the morning everyday, along with other miracles they could see daily, and if someone still high handedly rebelled they would put themselves out of the mercy of God and condemn themselves!
i made many assumptions in the post, you seem very biblically knowledgeable, i tried to take a step back from looking so close at these scriptures, to see the bigger picture and then understand why they happened. I too was an atheist and have about 3 years as a Christian, in asking myself "What is Truth?" and deciding whatever that may be to follow it. if i'm wrong, then i want to find Truth if it's you, or hidden under a tree somewhere, then that's the ultimate goal and what i'm always striving for. Thx for this website and the time put in here to make us all question what we "think" we know.
gracias amigo
Thu Jun 21, 01:11:00 PM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Thanks for that, joel.
But what did any of it have to do with Numbers 15:32-36?
Did God tell the Israelites to stone to death the man who gathered sticks on the Sabbath day?
How about starting with a "Yes" or "No".
Thu Jun 21, 01:16:00 PM 2012 
 joel said...
ah, quick response, great....
Yes
along with many others things "if a child rebels against his father, he shall kill him" take you're pick right? we both know them well.
if God would have let anybody slide from not obeying even one of those commandments, i would liken it to slapping God in the face! imagine for a moment, to illustrate a point, you and i walking along a river, a lion is behind us, we hear a voice, the water parts and we're like Woa!! we're saved, we get hungry and miracle food appears every morning, we get thirsty water starts to gush from a rock, we get hot and a cloud covers us from the heat, in the night a fire leads us, then the voice says keep the sabbath holy, and you keep the day holy, you rest, worship, but i say, you know what, i'm going to watch a movie today, pick some sticks, and make some marshmallows!!!! nobody in their right mind would do that, and when it did happen, it was just and right for him to be judge as such.
In leading this people, God showed us the role of the Savior, the manner of His coming, and the fulfillment of the ceremonies, so people after the fact could not say it was an accident, if i may quote a scripture
Isaiah 46:9,10 "Remember the former things of old,
For I am God, and there is no other;
I am God, and there is none like Me,
10 Declaring the end from the beginning,
And from ancient times things that are not yet done,
Saying, ‘My counsel shall stand,
And I will do all My pleasure"
only this could differentiate a True God, declaring the end from the beginning, what exactly was the role of the lamb being sacrificed what was the purpose of the passover? what was the point of the feast of first fruits, any of the Messianic prophecies including the prophecy of Jesus Daniel 9:24 pointing to the exact year of Jesus baptism if not the very day.
Bigger picture and context of most of these scriptures is God revealing to man the way salvation would come, and things as stated that make life work, sabbath for example, i don't think anyone would say working 30 days straight, 8-10 hours a day would be healthy for anybody, not only physically but mentally and since we're on the topic, spiritually.
When we apply logic and reason to this scripture with the Biblical context, i don't think any Good God would or should have done anything different.
Thu Jun 21, 01:48:00 PM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
So you believe God commanded the Israelites to stone to death a man for gathering sticks on the Sabbath, eh joel? And the Israelites did as God commanded, and they were right for doing so.
Should we stone to death a someone who mows his lawn on Saturday (or Sunday)?
Thu Jun 21, 01:57:00 PM 2012 
 Incongruous Circumspection said...
God was the one who designed the whole video game in the first place. He could have created a world without sin. But he didn't. He created it WITH sin and then, because he was so holy, he couldn't handle humans, who he had created, and killed or maimed them at will, because he was holy and couldn't handle sin.
You see, you can go in circles, trying to prove that God is love, but the fact of the matter is, if a person knew full well what they were doing and still put their son or daughter in harm's way, just so they could kill them, you would call them a monster.
If, in the case of the bloke that gathered wood sticks on the Sabbath, God surely didn't want him to gather the twigs, he could have made them magically appear in his house, lit on fire, cooking some magical food - like he did with mannah...like he did with the Red Sea...like he did with a female for Adam...like he did with the sheep for ole' Abe.
But, nooooooooooo. God had to prove a point that he was the shite! And who better to do it to than an old poor sap that nobody gave a damn about.
That god does not care about you. He cares only for himself.
Thu Jun 21, 02:06:00 PM 2012 
 Incongruous Circumspection said...
joel, this isn't meant as a personal attack, but more of a curious inquiry.
When I left Christianity, I did so because the same arguments you are using, I used to use, and a little bit of thought caused them to lose all their rationality.
As an agnostic and an atheist in practice, I cannot see myself ever going back to allowing my thinking mind to believe in something that is akin to African tribal gods - an otherworldly being that we must placate with hundreds and thousands of rules, or he/she/them will smite us.
The smiting, of course, is circumstantial at best due to the natural processes our world goes through. It simply feeds the narrative of those that do not think and those that DO think but realize the power of the message to keep their followers in line.
Sure, you can toss in the idea that Christ took away our need to placate the bible god. But that just adds another host of other issues. Like, why did god wait so many years before he sent Jesus? How many people did God kill who were anticipating Christ's imminent birth and salvation? Among many other questions.
In short, what caused you to leave a rational worldview for something so clearly irrational? Or, have you neatly compartmentalized your thinking so you simply don't recognize it now?
Thu Jun 21, 02:38:00 PM 2012 
 joel said...
'"""""""""i had to break this up? typing limit :-)"""""""""""""""""
ok, i got it, there's more people responding here, i thought i was speaking to 1 person, is this website either of your's? and the date stamp on the post was today, looks like i got on, in the beginning.. good stuff... i really enjoy these discussions, so i hope we can continue them, ok, very well let me do 2 responses and if you don't mind i'll put number 1 then 2 to identify them
1-
Steve Wells on your question on stoning someone for mowing the lawn on sabbath (Sat or Sun) i would say no, we wouldn't do it today.
God is a God of principle first, not necessarily rules and regulations,even though our fallen nature demanded the rules, for us to understand, Galations 3:24 tells us the law was a tutor to bring us to Christ and see a need for a savior. the reason why we wouldn't stone someone today, is because of the different dispensation we entered when the Word become flesh in the person of Jesus we are told John 1:17 that the law came through Moses, but grace and truth came through Jesus. Colossians 2:11-17 tell us the ceremonies, festivals, handwriting of requirements were all pointing to Jesus, but when the grace arrived in the person of Jesus, they no longer were against us as evidence of our sin, so when the answers and promises to all the prophesies arrived, the very embodiment of what Truth is, there was no more need of keeping "man" in line because the answer came on the cross, the fulfillment of things spoken of.
an example of this is John 8:1-11 with the adulterous women and the people in the time asked Jesus this very question, and trying to have something against Jesus. His answer is clear, whoever is without sin, let him cast the first stone. Explaining that this religious people at the time thought they were righteous, thought they were obeying the whole law, searching the scriptures thinking they had eternal life, but knowing not God. obeying all the ceremonies perfectly but missing the Savior. let me expound on this point i think is crucial.
It all boils down to choice, on one occasion the people demanded a sign Luke 16:31 and Jesus tells them if they don't believe all the things that had been spoken of already, they won't believe even if one rises from the grave. the very thing that happened twice, Lazarus & Jesus, and they still wouldn't believe. Matthew chapters 5-7 in the Sermon on the Mount, Jesus tries to make this clear, he explains it's a matter of your heart. it's not about just murdering, it's about hating... it's not about committing adultery, it's lusting... etc and He goes on. All of these laws, were preparing a people for the coming of Jesus, keeping a certain people separate and set apart to be used as a conduit of preserving God's Word for the whole world, the grace dispensation came in to all who believe would not perish but have everlasting life.
Thu Jun 21, 05:31:00 PM 2012 
 joel said...
"""""""""""""second part""""""""""" sorry for the essay
Now back to the God of Principle, Exodus 16 speaks of God teaching them about the sabbath, 6 days the bread appears, and on the 7th day no bread. Miraculously this happen before the 10 Commandments were given teaching them the Principle to prepare for God's holy day. Genesis 2:3 God blessed the 7th day and sanctified it. Isaiah 58:13 tells us not to do our own pleasures because it's God's holy day, a Memorial of creation and God's claim to being the True God. so principally mowing should have already been done before sabbath if we love God, we would keep his Commandments John 14:15. Psalms chapter 119, 1 John 5:3, and Mark 2:28 tell us sabbath was made for man, we are not slaves to it, but it's a blessing to spend with God, it's not burdensome, but is a delight to spend with God and fellowship etc.
Any man or women understands this right? if the opposite sex, someone you were interested in told you to meet them 1 day a week, the same day, if you were interested in them in the least, forget in love with them, i don't care if your friends call you that day, i don't care if you had a football game to go to, if the simpsons were on, any plans you had for that day or if you grass was a foot high... you would do everything possible to get it all done before that day came for your date! and this is speaking of a mere human.. the sabbath is with the Creator of the cosmos. a great blessing
2.
Incongruous Circumspection, you made this comment
"God was the one who designed the whole video game in the first place"
i want to make sure we all understand that God didn't design this video game the way it is now, the way God designed it was the Garden of Eden, what we see today is a video game God designed perfect and satan implanted the sin virus if you will. God's video game was no death, no suffering, no sickness, no sin, but because we know that God is Love, love has to be given freely, love cannot be forced... another word for forced love would be "rape"
so initially God in heaven didn't make a defective angel,- lucifer, but God gave everyone the greatest gift, free will, which tells us if God took away our ability NOT to love, than that's not love at all! at that point we're mere automatons. nothing more than a robot saying "i love and worship God" which is meaningless to a perfect, good and just God. and was what we saw again in the Garden of Eden.
John 3:18 tells us the default state of fallen man is condemned, and what God is looking for is a few good men and women :-) people who have something inside telling us there is something more, there is something better, 70-80 years of even the "best" life here would still be a waste, if there wasn't a greater good, some hope, some divine revelation, and that's exactly what we have in the Bible and the Plan of Redemption. and because we are condemned already God is looking for people to see our deficiencies and shortcomings, rest in Him and allow Him to work through us perfecting our character, making us overcomers, so God needs co workers, co laborers to overcome and gain victory, which is why God won't do anything, that you and i can do, like gathering sticks on the sabbath, which in respect to God, in love toward God, we would have made preparations so that wouldn't have to be done on the sabbath, as explained with the dating analogy.
Thu Jun 21, 05:32:00 PM 2012 
 Incongruous Circumspection said...
Where you say "god is love" is where your rational mind moves into the irrational. Love is not proven by murderous acts for no other reason than someone doesn't like you. And if you call that love, I don't want your love, and I most definitely don't want your god.
Oh...and god created the whole video game, no matter how you twist Satan's or man's decisions into it.
Thu Jun 21, 06:27:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Blogger joel said...
"Steve Wells on your question on stoning someone for mowing the lawn on sabbath (Sat or Sun) i would say no, we wouldn't do it today."
You would say... meaning you are interpreting "scripture" by your own standards, not "god's".
"God is a God of principle first, not necessarily rules and regulations,even though our fallen nature demanded the rules, for us to understand, Galations 3:24 tells us the law was a tutor to bring us to Christ and see a need for a savior."
If, by "fallen nature", you mean the consequences of Adam eating the apple, you must square that with the abundant evidence that there was no "first" man or woman. If you are an evolution denier, then go stick your head back in whatever sand or orifice best prevents you from seeing the way the world works.
I see you're quoting the bible, chapter and verse, as if it's documentation for your opinions. The bible is no more the word of god, even if there *were* a god, than this blog... and if this blog were the word of a god I'd prefer that god to the god of the bible who is a thoroughly despicable (though imaginary) being.
Steve Weeks
Thu Jun 21, 08:30:00 PM 2012 
 Tony said...
So Joel must be fine with homosexuality, then. This is an old law and since Jesus died for our sins etc., gay people are cool with god. Just as god is now fine with gathering sticks.
Fri Jun 22, 04:50:00 AM 2012 
 No said...
Of all things that would suggest our ancestors were gullible and uneducated, the belief and trust they had in a book suppositely writen by the creator of this world, in my mind at least, has to be the most overwhelming evidence of all.
Mere cargo worshippers, just a tad more bloody, like this verse from Numbers shows.
"Homo homini lupus"
Fri Jun 22, 08:08:00 AM 2012 
 No said...
"Incongruous Circumspection said...
Where you say "god is love" is where your rational mind moves into the irrational. Love is not proven by murderous acts for no other reason than someone doesn't like you."
Well said Incongruous, your comments reminded me of the Stockholm syndrome. Christians are like hostages to their god who litteraly threat them with eternal hell and yet they are ready to find him convoluted excuses no matter what in order to secure their belief in him.
"In psychology, Stockholm syndrome is a psychological phenomenon in which hostages express empathy and have positive feelings towards their captors, sometimes to the point of defending them. These feelings are generally considered irrational in light of the danger or risk endured by the victims (...)"
- Wiki
Fri Jun 22, 08:20:00 AM 2012 
 Incongruous Circumspection said...
I still don't understand how someone goes from atheist to joel. joel said he used to be an atheist. Now he spouts Bible as if it's unfettered truth. I thought atheists were atheists because they think.
I'm seriously confused.
Then again, I'm not. Just as there are many kinds of Christians, there are also many kinds of atheists. (Don't confuse my "kinds" with Ken Ham's ubiquitous word for imaginary speciation).
joel. Become an atheist again. Seriously. And when you do, think through things, rather than re-entering Christianity based on the emotionalism spouted from a pulpit.
You'll look smarter. And no, the Apostle Paul or God or whomever you attribute the Bible's writing to, did NOT predict that I would say that the Bible is foolishness. They, as all religion creators do, knew that religion could not be proved and was completely asinine when brought up to the light of reason. Thus, they HAD to tell their followers that it was holy to be sneered at.
It's called duping.
Fri Jun 22, 08:22:00 AM 2012 
 joel said...
-------did it again :-( part 1-------
wow, many comments... ok first off, it's very difficult to answer everyone in one post, and be sufficient for everyone because we are discussing many different topics that need individual answers. i'm trying to juggle 4 balls with 1 hand!, so bear with me guys...plus anyone of us are not on trial here, as individuals, not personal stories, why he's this or he's that.,would be good if this discussion stayed on topic as the title states, Numbers 15:32-36, which i think would serve everyone better or start another thread for different points.. for example the first question
------Stephen says "I see you're quoting the bible, chapter and verse, as if it's documentation for your opinions."
ok stephen let's be fair, this was the question posed, i found this link on youtube, asking a Biblical question from the Bible of course, i took the challenge, being a Bible Believer giving the Biblical evidence, for support, and explanation, nothing more. The question was not "is the Bible the inspired Word of God" but even this i believe has ample evidence supporting, within and without the scriptures themselves. Without this there is no reason to have made the challenge in the first place. Just a friendly discussion on differing opinions.

-------Incongruous Circumspection said...
Where you say "god is love"
i think this is the least understood statement in the Bible and i think is at the root of every question and doubt of God or the Bible... on this point, i have to reemphasize my first statement on the robots, let's really think about this, if a true God of Love really exists who by definition would be completely righteous, He would have to give His creation free will, to have a choice to love, and also having a choice not to love. any less would be uncivilized (commercial anyone? :-) picture a God would leave no choice for all creation to hate, all the "can" do is love, i would again liken that to any of us having a spouse that is a robot? or a child that's a robot? that all they can, and are able to do is what they have been told & programmed to do ... that could never be love and God would receive no less
compared to eternity, the original video game that once was, will be restored in all it's perfection, this hiccup of the video game we live in now is little to nothing relative to eternity. We have to really understand, it's not just every soul Jesus came to save, but to clear satins charges against God before the then existing creation. 1/3 of angels fell, God could not just have flushed the toilet with the devil and the other angels. would be contrary to love and leave on obedience through fear and a lot of doubt, so , God let's sin play out, to it's climax of the devil, and mankind and the cross, the ultimate depiction of love and of what sins consequences are displayed to the whole world. Most are going to destruction, few will find the truth, my question, how shall we escape if we neglect such great of a salvation?
Ultimatley this will be everyone's individual choice, ultimately God has to do nothing when someone rejects light, only darkness is left. When someone rejects life, only option is death. Nobody is getting into heaven for no other reason than love for Jesus. not fear of death , hell and the grave, because once in heaven there would be no other reason to be there.
Fri Jun 22, 03:44:00 PM 2012 
 joel said...
--------Part 2--------
Tony said...
So Joel must be fine with homosexuality,
so here is another topic that needs a thread :-) a simple search on the different laws of the Bible will explain this (Ceremonial, Civil, Moral Laws) there are many instructions for health, and hygiene aswell, and another thread for old and new covenants Heb 8 and Jeremiah 31 for staters, to explain that further, but homosexuality is a sin, just like fornication, lying, lusting, pride, jealousy or eating to much.. so yes homosexuality is still a sin and we are all in the same boat together, no different, the same, needing help to rid ourselves of whatever our sins maybe, but i have another question to ask,
Why does God hate sin? He hates sin because it's contrary to righteousness, goodness, perfection, love and who God is! and mainly because sin separates each one of us from Him. He has a place for us, He paid the ultimate price on the cross for us, doesn't matter what we've done in the past, doesn't matter what we are seeing on our computer screens, nothing in our lives is separating us from Him if we are willing, unbiased, open minded, sincerely searching, without blinding ourselves, myself included, to seek and ultimately to find! Bible says it's natural to not believe in God, it's natural to love sin, it's natural, so each one of us in any walk of life, has to step outside of ourselves and make an intelligent decision in our own jury of 1, each of us will have to make.
you guys are good guys, i know you are good intelligent people, not sure who the ex christian was on the posts, but clearly there are still ties there, and a drawing, so whatever we discuss, let's not demean or insult, because we're not forced to post here. good discussion so far, looks like a healthy discussion, oh one more thing, a good book, that started my walk towards God from non believer was CS Lewis "mere Christianity" oldie but goodie, if you've read, let me know what you thought, if not, i definitely thinks it's worth everyone's time, not doctrinal, no scriptures, back to principles, logic, reason, just mere Christianity. i didn't proof read, gotta go, i'll get back on to finish some of the other questions.
Fri Jun 22, 03:45:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
joel said...
"...but homosexuality is a sin, just like fornication, lying, lusting, pride, jealousy or eating to (sic) much.. so yes homosexuality is still a sin..."
Yet we now know that homosexuality is not a choice, but a condition which is caused by developmental influences. So those who are gay are "created" this way. How do you rationalize a "loving" god who creates an individual is a state of "sin" then recommends punishment for what is *not* under that individual's control?
If C.S. Lewis started you on the road back to religion, I recommend you read Richard Dawkins's book "The God Delusion"; it might turn you around... there may still be time! :-)
Steve Weeks
Fri Jun 22, 08:07:00 PM 2012 
 No said...
Hi I'm God, Jesus and the Holy Sidekick, the Alpha Male and the Omega3man, the All in One Enchilada in the Sky, pre Steve Hawkins's big bang Ka-bang and pre post Walmart Fukushima's nuclear trash botox Chuck Norris and McDonald's Big Mac foam wraps from the '70's, life expectancy talking that is.
The Big Bang that was me scratching my balls... well... just one (said He looking at his Fingernails... creating black holes when switching Hands... engulfing civilisations we might never know...)
I can't remember how I was created myself though... but anyway I created the Universe the hundred billion galaxies and suns, the crawling swimming flying creatures with only one thing in mind: to have a SPECIAL kind of relationship with monkeys like you. Yes ! I got a soft spot for your kind ! Aren't you glad ?!!
I'm sure you've notice me when your singing at church. Oh you did ? Beloved when you sing for Me I'm there I'm listening ! What's that ? Amazing Grace is your favorite number ? Well it's mine too how's that ! Dear beloved do you like it best with bass and drum rythm section too ?
Now about my Best Seller, which is the purpose of this post, what is it that you don't catch in the wording of the law ? It's clear.
It is... isn't it ?
Fri Jun 22, 09:56:00 PM 2012 
 Likando Maboshe said...
to joel
i was a christian just like you.You have mentioned the 10 commandments well in the 10 commandments your god says thou shall not kill but goes on to order numerous killings e.g After capturing all the Midianite women and children, God commands Moses to kill the women and the male children and to "keep the virgin girls alive for yourselves." Moses then proceeds to offer 32 of the 32,000 virgin girls to God as a "tribute." We know from Leviticus 27:29 that these 32 girls would not be allowed to stay alive but were offered as a heave offering (burnt on the sacrificial altar) to the Lord. - Numbers 31:17-18,40-41. this is a paradox can you explain that looks to me that your god is blatantly breaking his own commandents
Fri Jun 22, 11:20:00 PM 2012 
 Shawn said...
Hey all,
Why does God hate sin? He hates sin because it's contrary to righteousness, goodness, perfection, love and who God is! and mainly because sin separates each one of us from Him.
But God is the alpha and omega, according to Christianity, right? If he created everything, then he created sin, he created the serpent and satan and he put them all together with fallible humans. If he is omnipotent, then he knew it was all going to play out the way it did. That's what omnipotent means - knowing everything. When that happens in the real world, they call it entrapment...
How about this - I can show you evidence of evolution, as demonstrated by the fossil record - where is your evidence of anything happening as described in the bible? You say that Eden was the way the world was meant to be - where is Eden located? How about evidence of a flood, or Noah's ark? Or if Moses parted the Red Sea and drowned the armies of Egypt, where is it mentioned in the history of that country? How can you continue to live in ignorance of how the world truly works?
Sat Jun 23, 10:59:00 AM 2012 
 Tracy said...
I agree with Shawn's post. If the god of the bible was Omnipotent, Omniscient, and Omnipresent like he is sold (in his own book, which is called the word of god) to be... then exactly how did he not know that the world would turn out this way before he created it? If he did not know all this would happen, then he is not god. Was he supprised that all this happened this way? If he was, he is not much of a god.
One more thing I would like to ask. If he "knew us before we were born", we probably were relatively free of sin... I mean, we had not hit the flesh yet, right? Just a soul. So, then he puts us into a body, we are born, sin, do not fall into his mold and are thrown into a lake of fire. Why would your god of love do that? He just murdered you before you became flesh. He KNEW you would burn before you were born, yet he sentances you to death anyway.
What a loving god he truly is. I have used all the analytical powers he gave to me (chuckle) and ran his numbers.... he does not add up. So, I made the logical decision to figure it out on my own and am very happy with how life has turned out.
Sat Jun 23, 08:49:00 PM 2012 
 Andy tyler said...
Good posts everyone. Joel, I like your analogy to automatons and real love. Your explanation is definitely very understandable in humanistic terms. If we accept that explanation (which I am), it seems we are taken into heaven as automatons after proving we can resist biology (biology understood as demonology to ancients, imho). Do you view this as a contradiction? Taken a bit further, as Tracy points out, we were taken from a happy automaton state in the first place, only this time, with a chance and a probability of being tortured forever. I would prefer remaining an automaton. :) Why does God prefer it otherwise?
Sat Jun 23, 11:07:00 PM 2012 
 Andy tyler said...
Joel
In regard to your "date" with God comment, I have a similar analogy. I recently found out that my oldest daughter listed her mother's boyfriend as her father on her Facebook page. My initial reaction was, "What is going on in her life that she denies her father?" No pun intended. :) My response was concern, and we talked about it. You seem to view God's jealousy as more justified because of his power compared to a human 'date". It seems obvious to you, which is understandable, because jealousy is observed all the time. However, I see it as more petty for the exact same reason. In other words, the idea that everyone would interpret ignoring the Sabbath the same way as God did, would be short-sighted for an Omni God. There are plenty of "God loves you no matter what" passages as well. So, if we have a choice between the two, why shouldn't we just figure it out for ourselves without the Bible?
Sat Jun 23, 11:33:00 PM 2012 
 Tom VonOxford said...
Joel;
Oh My God... are you serious?
Original Sin?
How were Adam and Eve supposed to know that a talking snake who appeared before them wasn't God - especially since God didn't want them to know anything?
Sun Jun 24, 03:58:00 PM 2012 
 Mercy rules said...
For just a minute think about who you are talking about.This is about belief in God.The 2 verses before 32 tells us that we are to chose whether we believe in god or not it's our choice. And it's still our choice to believe or not but the results are still the same.
Mon Jun 25, 05:23:00 PM 2012 
 Mercy rules said...
I would hope that you would consider my comment as one who has recieved mercy and I know that God wants that for us all
Mon Jun 25, 05:25:00 PM 2012 
 Likando Maboshe said...
to mercy and bible believers:
this is a part of the story of adam and eve this was after they had eaten the 'forbidden fruit':-
they[adam and eve] heard God's voice approaching (God was taking a stroll in the garden during the cool of the day...interesting behavior for something without a body) and they hid from God in the bushes. God looks around and can't find Adam so he calls out "Hey, Adam! Where are you?" Now Adam, comes out and tells God that he was afraid of God because NOW he knew that he was naked and had disobeyed God's instructions. God realized that the only way Adam could know that he had been naked and done wrong was if someone told him he was naked or if Adam had eaten of that fruit which gave man the knowledge of good and evil. Rather than take responsibility for his actions, the first man points the finger of blame at the woman saying, "That woman that you made for me gave me the fruit and I ate it." When God turns to the woman she says, "It wasn't my fault, the serpent tempted me." So does God in his infinite wisdom and perfect justice blame himself for putting the tree in the grasp of man? No. Does he blame himself for leaving man to the wiles of more intelligent creatures? No. Does he blame himself for expecting man to be able to choose the right and obey when he has kept that knowledge from him? No. God punishes the serpent, the woman, the man, and condemns all of man's future offspring to be "fallen" and "sinners."
i will leave you with a quote from Thomas Paine one which i totally agree with ''I do not believe in the creed professed by the Jewish church, by the Roman church, by the Greek church, by the Turkish church, by the Protestant church, nor by any church that I know of. My own mind is my own church.All national institutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian, or Turkish, appear to me no other than human inventions set up to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power and profit.''
Mon Jun 25, 08:04:00 PM 2012 
 No said...
"Mercy rules said...
I would hope that you would consider my comment as one who has recieved mercy and I know that God wants that for us all"
With more than one billion people not eating enough each day on Earth, with more than 10 million children dying of famine this year alone even though their parents are praying God constantly for their children to be spared... when the rubber meets the road of reality a loving and mercyfull God is something unlikely to be found not to mention that a God that would have the power to irradicate hunger in the world but doesn't bother is not worthy of devotion.
Tue Jun 26, 06:25:00 AM 2012 
 Joshua Perry said...
Honestly, I would just end this fight as it is. Anyone who does not believe in God will easily find a way to beat whatever Joel points out. Moments later, Joel (and maybe someone else) will easily defend his original statement, and debunk the statement that originally debunked his statement. Then someone will be a total prick and bash Joel, which he will ignore, and this discussion will continue; as it has for thousands of years.
Joel: Nothing you say will change how they see things, as a Christian, you feel compelled to defend your beliefs which is admirable in an overwhelming situation such as this. If I were you, I would make a simple final statement and wipe the dust from my feet. Also, you've done well to keep a positive tone, don't blow it now.
NOT Joel: Nothing you say would ever make Joel, or strong Christians sway. You feel you know the truth and are so annoyed by people not realizing it because you care enough to wish people not to waste time. It's a nice thought. I suggest you make any final statement you think should be said, please don't bash.
NO: Shut it unless you actually felt like bringing something useful to this. You should make a final statement too, I hope it is either pleasant or hilarious, the previous statements have been neither (and since there isn't anything funny about what you've been saying, you're making a crappy troll).
I'm a Christian. Many of my friends are Atheist. I ask both parties for help in one thing.
Let's get rid of the middle people, the people "neither hot nor cold."
You know them, the Atheist who says, "well God could exist, but why trouble trying to find out?" The Christian who believes in whatever piece of The Bible that suits him. My most disliked, The Christian with that bullshit smile and that attitude, "WOW GOLLY GEE, AIN'T TODAY JUST SPECIAL Y'KNOW?" yeah, they don't believe in jack, they just do what the "evangelist" tells them to.
Let's work on getting those people back into uncertainty, this way they choose one or the other, it's more people for both sides right?
Tue Jun 26, 08:13:00 AM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Thanks for the lecture, Joshua.
But the post was about Numbers 15:32-36. Have you read that passage? If so, how do you justify it?
Tue Jun 26, 08:31:00 AM 2012 
 Andre Vatke said...
I've enjoyed reading this debate yet one thing that Joel wrote hasn't been adequately addressed:
"...if a true God of Love really exists who by definition would be completely righteous, He would have to give His creation free will, to have a choice to love, and also having a choice not to love.
Now, I don't know about you, but I was not given free will to choose my parents, my economic or educational upbringing or many of the other things that directly shaped and continue to shape my psychology. The fact is that we are shaped by our society and we know that certain situation are better than others. We are also much different for being alive in 2012 in the USA than we would be in 1600 in Britain.
The very fact that we react to our surroundings - like gather firewood because we are cold and our kids are hungry - is evidence that free will is not quite what you think it is.
Tue Jun 26, 08:32:00 AM 2012 
 No said...
"Let's get rid of the middle people, the people "neither hot nor cold."
Interesting request here, are you on a mission from God Joshua ?
Tue Jun 26, 11:12:00 AM 2012 
 Incongruous Circumspection said...
So much jargon in Joshua's comment, I don't even know where to begin. It totally confuses anyone of the thinking persuasion when you don't use plain English and instead resort to speaking meaningless religious platitudes and nothingisms.
At least I understood joel.
Tue Jun 26, 11:19:00 AM 2012 
 No said...
" The Christian who believes in whatever piece of The Bible that suits him."
Joshua, your words suggests that you do not take parts of the Bible that suit you, which means you take the whole Bible not just parts of it.
Now if you are serious about your claim valiant knight, which I beleive you are not, you better start stacking rocks as your God requested in Number 15:32-36 because you literaly have the whole world to stone, not to mention that walking your talk will only land you in jail before you are able to accomplish your God's will.
Tue Jun 26, 12:11:00 PM 2012 
 Tracy said...
" The Christian who believes in whatever piece of The Bible that suits him."
I call that "Jigsaw Puzzle Christianity".
Tue Jun 26, 03:49:00 PM 2012 
 Tracy said...
@Joshua,
As an Atheist, I really don't care if anyone "sways" or not. We do not get a cash bonus, or a promotion to "Atheist First Class", or a sparkly star on our chart, and we don't win favor with a deity. We don't care if you believe or not as we do not prosthelytize for the sake of conversion.
Let's remember how we got here ("here" as in this conversation point, not "here" as in creation and whatnot), Joel decided to come to an Atheist Blog Site because he saw something on Youtube. Joel started to engage in a discussion. Joel, I assume, is a big boy and can probably figure out if he is beating a dead god... I mean horse.
You, however, seem awfully butthurt right out of the gate. Does someone need a hug?
Tue Jun 26, 05:35:00 PM 2012 
 Sir Ryan the Great said...
I will partake in the challenge and defend/explain the passage in your post.
Honestly, there are a lot of parts in the Old Testament that leave me scratching my head, wondering why God did or said what He did at that particular moment. Besides the Numbers passage above, another case in point is Leviticus 10 where God consumes Aaron's sons with holy fire seemingly because they burned the wrong kind of fire at the wrong time (the very passage that caused me to stumble onto your blog in the first place).
I defend a loving and completely just God because He is perfectly loving AND perfectly just. These things are not mutually exclusive.
I will try and paint a picture here... say you stole something and you were caught and arrested for it. Would you say stealing is wrong? Would you say that there are consequences that go along with your actions? Let's say you go to court for a hearing and the judge is presented with the facts of your case - you were caught red handed, it's an open and shut case. In the country and society we live in you have a penalty to pay - we'll say $5,000 in this case. Now the judge, being completely just, sentences you to pay $5,000 for your actions. It's what you deserve. You broke the law. After the sentencing though, the judge steps up off the bench and walks down the steps, shedding his robes and reaches into his back pocket. He brings out his wallet and hands you $5,000 - effectively paying your rightly deserved penalty. Why? Because the judge is completely loving.
Now change the judge to God and apply the story to your life. This is what God did for you with your actions (John 3:16-17). This is what the Bible is all about - it's a massive love letter to you and me. And that's why it is important to not just take out certain clips and bytes of the story and have that be your complete and permanent picture of God because it would be like you seeing a puddle and saying you now know everything about and completely understand the ocean. You're missing out on a lot. (Continued)
Tue Jun 26, 05:43:00 PM 2012 
 Sir Ryan the Great said...
(Continued)
So it is passages like the one here in Numbers and the aforementioned passage in Leviticus that we read by themselves and are like, "Huh?! This is what a loving and merciful God looks like?!" But we'd be wrong because we're not understanding the whole picture.
And this is some of the big picture - there was an old covenant (the old testament) and a new covenant (the new testament) between God and man. The old covenant declared that God was holy and that He chose the Israelites to be His special people. God is perfectly holy and so cannot stand to be anywhere near sin, thus requiring the Israelites to offer certain kinds of sacrifices to cleanse themselves in God's sight. God laid everything out for the Israelites (Exodus 20, practically all of Leviticus), giving them step by step instructions on how to live life. But a lot of times they were stubborn and chose to go their own ways and do things how they wanted to do things.
This is what happened here in Numbers and what also happened in the passage from Leviticus. We must remember that we "judge by outward appearance, but God looks at the heart" (1 Samuel 16:7) and so he knew what the motives were behind these people's actions. God is perfectly holy and there is punishment for sin. God said we must not work on the Sabbath and must keep it holy (Exodus 20:8, Leviticus 16) yet the guy in Numbers did the opposite. God also laid out explicitly what the priests were to do and how they were to do it (first 9 chapters of Leviticus and elsewhere in Exodus) and yet Aaron's sons chose to ignore it.
But insert the beauty of the new testament. Since God is holy and and we are sinful and our actions require payment - God sent His one and only son to die for us as the perfect sacrifice for you and for me so that we might be called children of God. Heirs to his Kingdom and heirs to Christ's glory (Romans 8:17). It did away with the old and brought in the new - yet God is the same throughout it all. When He looks at you, and you have accepted Jesus and what He has done for you, He sees not you and your actions, but Jesus and His sacrifice instead.
Tue Jun 26, 05:53:00 PM 2012 
 No said...
Yet how come God, the proclaimed Creator of the Universe, ask the congregation to stone someone to death for gathering a little wood and yet manage to keep his "loving" attribute in some people's mind ?
Tue Jun 26, 06:41:00 PM 2012 
 Tracy said...
@Ryan,
I am pretty sure that the judge, which you can 100% validate to be real, would lose his gavel over that action. It may not be on the books as being "illegal" to do, but it is improper and would be seen as wrong. People would question his integrity in other areas and might even be dis-barred. I am not a legal expert by any means, and it may be perfect right for him to do.
He appears to say that, it is ok for you to break the law because I will pay your fine. Which would lead people to wonder what else he "supports" people to do. Like murdering women and children by the thousands, but telling the audience that you shall not kill.
Using a tangible parable to authenticate something that has ZERO physical proof may not be the best idea. The judge, the laws, the crime... That is a situation that we can debate and analyze and even attend the even and discuss it with the judge... but god and his "perfect love"?
Pretty sure the first born sons, and their families who may or may not have had anything to do with the administration in Egypt, that he murdered would disagree that his love was perfect.
Tue Jun 26, 06:52:00 PM 2012 
 Incongruous Circumspection said...
Um...Ryan. No. Stretch the analogy to the whole era covered by the Bible. Sure, in the last few years of the Bible, god might do what you say. But in the majority of the former years, you got the eternal axe for doing stupid stuff like squatting on god's people's land that you rightfully owned.
There is so much more that is wrong with that analogy. Like, the judge didn't create you and know you would steal, like god does. Also, a five thousand dollar fine is not akin to eternal death.
Try again.
Tue Jun 26, 07:31:00 PM 2012 
 No said...
3:36 "He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him."
This verse from St-John makes the horror from Numbers look pale in comparaison when you look at it.
Take a moment to measure the impact of these words in the real world around you if St-John has any value to you.
On a lighter note I wonder why God desperately needs a bunch of apes to believe in him... isn't there more interesting things to do when you are All Powerfull ?
Tue Jun 26, 09:17:00 PM 2012 
 Likando Maboshe said...
to Sir Ryan the Great
what exactly is your point that your god is as you have put it ''perfectly loving and just'' in Numbers 15:32-36 if that is so then your sense of justice is as sick,horrible and twisted like the ''God'' you serve.Come on be reasonable.
Wed Jun 27, 03:29:00 AM 2012 
 Likando Maboshe said...
to Sir Ryan the Great
On top of thatI have to point out that the last book of the Old Testament says that God never changes (Malachi 3:6). If God did those things to humans once, he will do them again and again. But what about Jesus? Jesus is supposed to be loving and peaceful, the kind of god that wouldn't hurt a fly. Let's see what the Bible says about this.

The loving Jesus introduces a new form of cruelty to mankind: the concept of an eternal barbecue called, "HELL" where there will be weeping, wailing and gnashing of teeth. Now, God gets to enjoy the smell of burning humans for all eternity. Thank you JESUS! - Matthew 3:12, 8:12, 10:21, 13:30, 42, 22:13, 24:51, 25:30, Luke 13:28, John 5:24
Jesus tells a parable about himself and reveals his true nature by saying, "But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me. - Luke 19:27
While telling his disciples what they can expect in the near future, Jesus throws in that brothers will turn in each other to be killed, fathers will have their children put to death and children will cause their parents to be killed. - Matthew 10:21
Jesus also showed his love and kindness by predicting that pregnant women, infants and children would suffer greatly in the coming "days of vengeance." The fact that he wasn't appalled with the injustice of the idea shows that his heart was just as cruel as his evil Father/God. - Luke 21:22-23
Did Jesus come to bring peace on earth? Let's see what Jesus says about that: "Do not think that I have come to bring peace on earth: I did not come to bring peace, I came to bring a sword. I have come to turn a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law. And a man's enemies will be the members of his own family. He who loves his father or mother or son or daughter more than he loves me is not worthy of me." - Matthew 10:34-37
Jesus taught that to follow him you had to first hate your family. - Luke 14:26
Jesus commanded his followers to purchase swords. - Luke 22:36
Jesus didn't only use his magic powers to heal the sick. He also used them to curse a fig tree (Mark 11:12-14) and he cursed the inhabitants of three cities which didn't repent after he performed miracles for them. He condemned the people of these cities to hell and said that their punishment would be worse than the fiery destruction of Sodom. He finishes up by thanking God that the truth has been hidden from the wise men who could most benefit from its saving power. - Matthew 11:20-25
Jesus supposedly had the power to transform water into wine. At his last supper he turned the wine into his own blood and commanded his disciples to drink it (Mark 14:22-24) in violation of God's commandment to not drink blood (Genesis 9:4-5). This bloody, cannibalistic cocktail is recreated in churches across the world every week. Catholic believers are told that they must believe that the wine has actually transformed into the physical blood of Jesus. Jesus himself taught that the way to gain eternal life was to drink his blood. The vampiric traits of his father (God) must have been hereditary. - John 6:53-54
Wed Jun 27, 03:33:00 AM 2012 
 Incongruous Circumspection said...
Wait. Were we just having a logical discussion and ended up getting Jesus juked? Damn...
Sir Ryan...
Spare me the gospel message. God's little video game he set up for us to get it just right is appalling to say the least.
Let's contrast the Old and New Testament:
Old - you follow all of god's commandments and...you still die because David f*cked up and counted armies.
New - you do everything right on this earth, helping the poor (not railing on them to pull themselves up by their bootstraps like is popular in Christianity these days) and you burn in hell because you didn't say the magic prayer.
Seriously dude, if god is so powerful that he can kill himself and raise himself for yours and my sins, he's powerful enough to make this stupid game NOT a stupid game. He set the cards up (made the rules), forced man to break the rules, then made new rules, forced man to break those rules, then made new rules, forced man to accept those rules or die forever in burning hell, and then gets to celebrate his victories over those stupid robots in heaven for eternity with the members of Westboro Baptist Church et al because they know the right answer.
How do they know the right answers? Well, they translated the freaking riddle the most correct way. Everyone else be damned since they messed up on a jot or a tiddle or even added a few things. Forget the fact that they aren't reading from the original manuscripts, because, if they were, hell, we'd have all the riddles answered for us.
Oh yeah? Show me the bloody manuscripts and we'll have that discussion.
It's all a big joke and your parroting stupidisms that make no sense. Read through your crap, apply logic, and then take some melatonin. It might clear your muddled head out and see how asinine these beliefs are.
Wed Jun 27, 09:07:00 AM 2012 
 havocwing said...
The biblical god is a genocidal narcissistic lunatic.
Thu Jun 28, 11:01:00 AM 2012 
 No said...
I'm sure there's a special place for North Korea in Yahweh heart !
Fri Jun 29, 08:26:00 AM 2012 
 Carlos Bosque said...
Who ever created the Sabbath law, was serious about having the weekend off and if anyone gave the idea that maybe you can do some work, that person must be stone to death. How can anyone disrespect god by making fire that day, assuming that was guys intention, to keep warm or cook or what ever reasons. This is not part of the free will gods deal, obviously. In memory of must follow ridiculous laws by god, god gives a new fashion after the killing incident (numbers 15:37-40) This sound more like a gang from the hood to me then a divine message and what do we learn? Gods free will its just a mirage created by humans so anyone out there comes and joint the gang. Oh don't you dare get out of the gang because your loving god will burn you for eternity... Now isn't that ironic?
Sun Aug 12, 07:23:00 PM 2012 
 in.his.love. said...
the man's sin wasn't just that he broke the sabbath, he committed a "presumptuous sin" ( numbers 15:30) . his sin was a deliberate defiance of God, an outward expression of his contempt for The Word of God. In his choosing to publicly dishonor God he showed that he "despised the word" and "thought himself too great, too good, and too wise to be ruled by it" ( matthew henry's commentary). the presumptuous sin is an especially serious one, in fact, it is the only kind of sin God did not provide an atonement for in jewish law (the spurgeon archive- presumptuous sin sermon)
we are so blessed that now we live in a time of ultimate freedom. a time where Jesus Christ has already payed the price for our sins, no matter how serious they are! thank you God for having a plan to bring us back to You and for all the steps that had to be taken to achieve our salvation, even in the face of all of our sins <3
Tue Aug 14, 11:45:00 PM 2012 
 Carlos Bosque said...
Funny, I witness my daughter several times where she would do things just to show me that she can do what ever please her to do, sometimes even laugh at my face but never cross my mind to stone her to death. The powerful god its suppose to have more patience and love then any human on earth and he couldn't show it with this guy because he despised the word of god? don't know if god was giving an excellent example to the world on how to love and be patience or maybe god was showing off his powers
Wed Aug 15, 08:40:00 PM 2012 
 knight17prince said...
God is perfect in all his ways... "when he said everyone who disobey his laws must be put to death" he mean it! Actually killing or stoning people who disobey his sabbath is not a commandment. In fact one of his commandments is thou shall not kill. Just like what he said. Everyone who disobey his command shall be put to death. This is the reason why he killed the man. This is to prove that he is really true to all his words. In short. It was God who killed the man not the people...
Fri Aug 31, 01:21:00 PM 2012 
 knight17prince said...
God is perfect in all his ways... "when he said everyone who disobey his laws must be put to death" he mean it! Actually killing or stoning people who disobey his sabbath is not a commandment. In fact one of his commandments is thou shall not kill. Just like what he said. Everyone who disobey his command shall be put to death. This is the reason why he killed the man. This is to prove that he is really true to all his words. In short. It was God who killed the man not the people...
Fri Aug 31, 01:22:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 14 June 2012Hamor: the best father in the Bible (Greater love hath no father than this, that he cut off his own foreskin for his son.)
In a previous post, I listed 15 of the best fathers in the Bible. I wasn't entirely serious, of course, as each of the fathers on the list behaved about as badly as any father could possibly behave. None of them could serve as a good role model for fathers on Father's Day. And yet there is nothing in the Bible itself that shows the slightest disapproval of any of their bad behavior. They are, in fact, about as good as fathers get in the Bible.
But, surely, there must be some good fathers in the Bible. Maybe, but there's only one that I can honestly recommend for fathers on Father's Day.
His story is found in Genesis 34 and his name is Hamor.
The story begins when Dinah, the daughter of Jacob, goes out to meet her Hivite neighbors.
Dinah the daughter of Leah, which she bare unto Jacob, went out to see the daughters of the land.  Genesis 34:1
While she was visiting, a young Hivite man named Shechem saw her and immediately fell in love with her. (Well, maybe not immediately, but after he had sex with her, anyway. The Bible doesn't say whether it was consensual or not.)
And when Shechem the son of Hamor the Hivite, prince of the country, saw her, he took her, and lay with her, and defiled her. And his soul clave unto Dinah ... and he loved the damsel, and spake kindly unto the damsel. 34:2-3
Shechem told his father that he'd like to marry Dinah.
Shechem spake unto his father Hamor, saying, Get me this damsel to wife. 34.4
So Hamor went to talk to Jacob about it.
And Hamor the father of Shechem went out unto Jacob to commune with him ... saying, The soul of my son Shechem longeth for your daughter: I pray you give her him to wife. 34.6-8
Hamor suggested that the Hivites and the Israelites live together in peace, trading and intermarrying with one other. 
And make ye marriages with us, and give your daughters unto us, and take our daughters unto you.  And ye shall dwell with us: and the land shall be before you; dwell and trade ye therein, and get you possessions therein. 34:9-10
Jacob didn't seem to care much about it, one way or another. But his sons did. It was all about the Hivite's penises.
The sons of Jacob answered Shechem and Hamor his father deceitfully, and said, ... We cannot do this thing, to give our sister to one that is uncircumcised. 34:13-14
The problem was that little flap of skin at the tip of the Hivite's penises. If they'd just cut that off, then they could all happily live together in peace.
But in this will we consent unto you: If ye will be as we be, that every male of you be circumcised; Then will we give our daughters unto you, and we will take your daughters to us, and we will dwell with you, and we will become one people. 34:15-16
Hamor agrees to this. He, along with his son and all the male Hivites, will cut off that little flap of skin at the end of their penises as a sacrifice for peace. (Greater love hath no father than this, that he cut off his own foreskin for his son.)
And Hamor and Shechem his son ... communed with the men of their city, saying,  These men are peaceable with us; therefore let them dwell in the land, and trade therein; for the land, behold, it is large enough for them; let us take their daughters to us for wives, and let us give them our daughters.  Only herein will the men consent unto us for to dwell with us, to be one people, if every male among us be circumcised, as they are circumcised. ... Let us consent unto them, and they will dwell with us. 34:20-21
So Hamor, Shechem and every male Hivite cut off that little flap of skin that offends God so much.
And every male was circumcised. 34:24
And Dinah and Shechem were married and everyone lived happily ever after.
Just kidding.
Here's what actually happened.

And it came to pass on the third day, when they were sore, that two of the sons of Jacob ... took each man his sword, and came upon the city boldly, and slew all the males. And they slew Hamor and Shechem his son with the edge of the sword, and took Dinah out of Shechem's house, and went out. The sons of Jacob came upon the slain, and spoiled the city, because they had defiled their sister. ... And all their wealth, and all their little ones, and their wives took they captive, and spoiled even all that was in the house. 34:25-29
But at least Hamor died for something worthwhile -- the happiness of his son and peace in the world. And thereby set a great example for Father's Day.
Posted by Steve Wells at 6/14/2012 07:56:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
3 comments:
 skanksta said...
"They all lived happily ever after - just kidding!"
Lol, lol and literally rofl ! Steve Wells will you think of my poor sides ?
Well played Hamor :)
I hear a challenge to believers to find more good-fathering examples coming on...
Wed Jun 20, 01:42:00 AM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Well, here's a guy with a 100-pound scrotum:
http://www.khon2.com/mostpopular/story/Las-Vegas-man-with-100-pound-scrotum-turns-down/RB-IOHucykCYcTT6G7Dy9w.cspx
One of the comments says god will fix this. Meanwhile, he probably can't find his foreskin.
Steve Weeks
Wed Jun 20, 07:40:00 PM 2012 
 C. L. Hanson said...
Note that this post has been nominated for a Brodie Award for insightful discussion of religion and kids/parenting. You can vote for it here.
Wed Jan 23, 05:26:00 AM 2013 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 13 June 2012The Best Fathers in the Bible: Examples for Father's Day
Since it's getting close to Father's Day, I'm bumping this post up again. I've also added another father to the list -- Hosea.
I should also mention that believers, on the whole, seem to agree with my selections. For example, here is a post on the Ten Best Fathers in the Bible, five of which are also on my list.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Noah, the just preacher of righteousness
 For some reason, God really liked Noah. He hated everyone else, though. Hated them so much, in fact, that he drowned every last one of them, except for Noah (and his family), that is.
 What was it that God liked about Noah? Well, the bible doesn't say. It only says that he was a "just and perfect preacher of righteousness." (Genesis 6:9, 7:1; 2 Peter 2:5)
It isn't until after the flood, though, that we find out about his true character. Noah plants a vineyard, gets drunk, and lies around naked in his tent. His son, Ham, happens to see his father in this condition. When Noah sobers up and hears "what his young son had done unto him" (what did he do besides look at him?), he curses not Ham, who "saw the nakedness of his father," but Ham's son, Canaan.
And Noah ... planted a vineyard: And he drank of the wine, and was drunken; and he was uncovered within his tent. And Ham, the father of Canaan, saw the nakedness of his father, and told his two brethren without. And Shem and Japheth took a garment, and laid it upon both their shoulders, and went backward, and covered the nakedness of their father; and their faces were backward, and they saw not their father's nakedness. And Noah awoke from his wine, and knew what his younger son had done unto him. And he said, Cursed be Canaan; a servant of servants shall he be unto his brethren. Genesis 9:20-25
 So drink up on Father's Day all you dads out there. Pass out and lie around naked in front of God and everybody. If any of your kids happen to see you, curse them in the name of the Lord -- or better yet, curse your unborn grandkids and all of their descendants with slavery. Just follow the example of that just and perfect, godly preacher of righteousness, Noah!

Lot, the just and righteous
Lot was a family man and one of God's special heroes. Out of all of the inhabitants of Sodom and Gomorrah, God saved only Lot and his family, because Lot was, according to the bible, a just and righteous man (2 Peter 2:7-8). He was also, no doubt, an excellent father. Here is what the Bible says about him.
He offered his two virgin daughters to a crowd of angel rapers, saying:
"Behold now, I have two daughters which have not known man; let me, I pray you, bring them out unto you, and do ye to them as is good in your eyes." -- Genesis 19:8
Later he got drunk and impregnated them.
Lot ... dwelt in the mountain, and his two daughters with him.... And the firstborn said unto the younger, Our father is old, and there is not a man in the earth to come in unto us ... Come, let us make our father drink wine, and we will lie with him, that we may preserve seed of our father. And they made their father drink wine that night: and the firstborn went in, and lay with her father; and he perceived not when she lay down, nor when she arose. And it came to pass on the morrow, that the firstborn said unto the younger, Behold, I lay yesternight with my father: let us make him drink wine this night also; and go thou in, and lie with him, that we may preserve seed of our father. And they made their father drink wine that night also: and the younger arose, and lay with him; and he perceived not when she lay down, nor when she arose. Thus were both the daughters of Lot with child by their father. -- Genesis 19:30-36
So if you are attacked by a sex-crazed mob of angel rapers on Father's Day, follow the just and righteous Lot's example. Offer your virgin daughters to the mob to do whatever they want to do with them and then (if your daughters survive that) get drunk and impregnate them.

Abraham
Abraham abandoned his first son, Ishmael, sending him and his mother into the desert to die.
Wherefore she (Sarah) said unto Abraham, Cast out this bondwoman (Hagar) and her son (Ishmael) ... And God said unto Abraham ... hearken unto her voice. ... And Abraham ... took bread, and a bottle of water, and gave it unto Hagar, putting it on her shoulder, and the child and sent her away: and she departed, and wandered in the wilderness. -- Genesis 21:10-14
 He then agreed to sacrifice his second son (his "only" son) to God as a burnt offering.
And he said, Take now thy son, thine only son Isaac, whom thou lovest, and ... offer him there for a burnt offering.... And Abraham stretched forth his hand, and took the knife to slay his son. -- Genesis 22:2, 10
So if your wife can't stand one of your kids and tells you to throw him or her out of the house, follow Father Abraham's example and do what she says. Then later, if God asks you to kill one of your other children, do that too. Don't worry about it. God will probably send an angel to protect the abandoned child and provide a goat for you to kill instead of your kid at the last minute. Just be willing to abandon and kill your children for God if he asks you to. That's the important thing.

Isaac
Isaac had two sons, Esau and Jacob. Isaac loved Esau (because he liked to eat his venison), Rebekah loved Jacob (God knows why), and God hated Esau.
Isaac loved Esau, because he did eat of his venison: but Rebekah loved Jacob. -- Genesis 25:28
Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated. -- Romans 9:13
The Bible doesn't say anything more about Isaac's relationship with his two sons until he is about to die, when Rebekah, Jacob, and God all work together to steal Isaac's blessing of Esau and make it apply to Jacob instead. It's a bit too long to tell here, so I suggest you read the Brick Testament story instead. There is an important message for fathers here. Every father should understand that God will love some of his children and hate others. Don't worry about it. Just try to find out which of you children God hates and then go and do likewise.

Jacob
Jacob loved Joseph more than his other children, and he made it pretty obvious. So the other kids in the family hated Joseph. (God didn't seem to mind; he liked Joseph best, too.)
Now Israel [Jacob] loved Joseph more than all his children ... And when his brethren saw that their father loved him more than all his brethren, they hated him. -- Genesis 37:3-4
So don't fall for the modern secular lie that a father should love all of children as much and as equally as possible. Follow the example of Jacob and love one of your children more than all of the others.

Aaron
Aaron watched quietly as his sons were burned to death by God.
And Nadab and Abihu, the sons of Aaron ... offered strange fire before the LORD, which he commanded them not. And there went out fire from the LORD, and devoured them, and they died before the LORD. .... And Aaron held his peace. -- Leviticus 10:1-3
So if God decides to burn your children to death for burning incense or whatever, just watch quietly. And for God's sake, don't complain about it.

Caleb
Caleb was one of the twelve scouts that Moses sent out during the Exodus to check out the land of Canaan. Since Caleb told Moses what he wanted to hear (that it would be easy to conquer the Canaanites), he was rewarded, while the ten honest scouts (who filed more discouraging reports) were killed by God in a plague (God's 18th killing).
Forty years later, when the Israelites were busy killing Canaanites, Caleb offered a reward to whomever could smite (kill all the inhabitants of) the city of Kirjathsepher. The reward was his daughter, Achsah.
Caleb said, He that smiteth Kirjathsepher, and taketh it, to him will I give Achsah my daughter to wife. Joshua 15:16
The guy who won the reward happened to be one of Caleb's relatives.
And Othniel the son of Kenaz, the brother of Caleb, took it: and he gave him Achsah his daughter to wife. Joshua 15:17
It's hard to tell from that verse whether Othniel was Caleb's brother or nephew, but whichever it was God approved of the whole thing. Because Caleb was "God's servant."
And the LORD said ... my servant Caleb, because he had another spirit with him, and hath followed me fully, him will I bring into the land whereinto he went; and his seed shall possess it. Numbers 15:20-23
So to all you dads out there, God says it's OK to give your daughter to someone who commits genocide for you, even if the someone is a close relative, like a uncle or even a brother. What the heck.

Gideon
Gideon is a great example for all Christian men. He had many wives and seventy sons.
And Gideon had threescore and ten sons of his body begotten: for he had many wives. -- Judges 8:30
He taught taught his sons what it means to be a real man.
And he said unto Jether his firstborn, Up, and slay them. But the youth drew not his sword: for he feared, because he was yet a youth. ... And Gideon arose, and slew [them]. -- Judges 8:20-21
This one is pretty obvious. Try to have as many wives and sons as possible. And teach your sons what it means to be real men. (Real men are not afraid to kill people.)

Jephthah
When the spirit of the Lord came upon Jephthah, he promised to offer to God as a burnt offering whatever came to greet him when he returned from battle. When his daughter greeted him after a successful God-assisted slaughter, he honored his promise to God by killing and burning his daughter for God.
Then the Spirit of the LORD came upon Jephthah.... And Jephthah vowed a vow unto the LORD, and said, If thou shalt without fail deliver the children of Ammon into mine hands, Then it shall be, that whatsoever cometh forth of the doors of my house to meet me, when I return in peace from the children of Ammon, shall surely be the LORD's, and I will offer it up for a burnt offering. So Jephthah passed over unto the children of Ammon to fight against them; and the LORD delivered them into his hands. And he smote them ... with a very great slaughter. ... And Jephthah came to Mizpeh unto his house, and, behold, his daughter came out to meet him with timbrels and with dances.... And ... when he saw her... said, Alas, my daughter! ... I have opened my mouth unto the LORD, and I cannot go back. And she said unto him ... Let this thing be done for me: let me alone two months, that I may go up and down upon the mountains, and bewail my virginity, I and my fellows. ... And it came to pass at the end of two months, that she returned unto her father, who did with her according to his vow which he had vowed. -- Judges 11:29-39
So when the spirit of the Lord comes upon you and you promise God to kill whomever you happen to see first when you get home from your latest God-assisted genocide, remember Jephthah and fulfill your promise to God, even if it means you have to kill and burn your daughter as a sacrifice to God.

Saul
Saul offered to sell his daughter for 100 Philistine foreskins.
And Saul said, Thus shall ye say to David, The king desireth not any dowry, but an hundred foreskins of the Philistines. -- 1 Samuel 18:25
David bought her for twice the asking price (200 foreskins).
Wherefore David arose and went, he and his men, and slew of the Philistines two hundred men; and David brought their foreskins, and they gave them in full tale to the king, that he might be the king's son in law. And Saul gave him Michal his daughter to wife. -- 1 Samuel 18:27
And since "David did that which was right in the eyes of the LORD ... save only in the matter of Uriah the Hittite," we know that God approved of the transaction. So don't settle for just a few foreskins when selling your daughters.

David
You can tell a lot about a father by his last words to his children. Take David for example.
David asked his son Solomon to murder Joab for him.
Now the days of David drew nigh that he should die; and he charged Solomon his son, saying … thou knowest also what Joab the son of Zeruiah did to me … let not his hoar head go down to the grave in peace. 1 Kings 2.1-6
So Solomon sent Benaiah to murder Joab.
It was told king Solomon that Joab was fled unto the tabernacle of the LORD; and, behold, he is by the altar. Then Solomon sent Benaiah … saying, Go, fall upon him … So Benaiah … fell upon him, and slew him. 1 Kings 2:29-34
And another person that David asked his son to murder was Shimei.
Thou hast with thee Shimei … which cursed me with a grievous curse in the day when I went to Mahanaim: but he came down to meet me at Jordan, and I sware to him by the LORD, saying, I will not put thee to death with the sword. Now therefore hold him not guiltless: for thou art a wise man, and knowest what thou oughtest to do unto him; but his hoar head bring thou down to the grave with blood. 1 Kings 2:8-9
So Solomon sent Benaiah to “fall on” Shimei, too.
So the king commanded Benaiah ... which went out, and fell upon him, that he died. 1 Kings 2:44-46
The lesson here is this: have a list of people you'd like your children to kill for you after your die.

Job
Job was a perfect man (and perfect father) with ten children, seven sons and three daughters.
There was a man in the land of Uz, whose name was Job; and that man was perfect ... There were born unto him seven sons and three daughters. Job 1:1-2
As part of a bet, God and Satan killed Job's children. After the killing, Job "blessed God" and didn't "foolishly" blame God for his murderous Satanic bet. (See here for details. Or read all 8 of the Brick Testament stories about Job.)
In the end, God rewarded Job for not complaining by replacing the dead children with a completely a new set of ten kids. And the new daughters were even prettier than before!
So the LORD blessed the latter end of Job more than his beginning ... He had also seven sons and three daughters ... And in all the land were no women found so fair as the daughters of Job. Job 42:12-13
So remember dads, if you don't like your children all that much, or have some ugly daughters or whatnot, just ask God and Satan to kill them for you. That way you're sure to get a better set of kids.
  
Hosea
Hosea's family life was prearranged by God, and was, therefore, perfect by definition.
God told him to take ... a wife of whoredoms and children of whoredoms" because the land has "committed great whoredom." So Hosea did as God commanded and "took" a wife named Gomer.
The LORD said to Hosea, Go, take unto thee a wife of whoredoms and children of whoredoms: for the land hath committed great whoredom, departing from the LORD.  So he went and took Gomer. Hosea 1:2-3
Gomer had a daughter, which God told Hosea to name "unloved."
Gomer ... conceived ... and bare a daughter. And God said unto him, Call her name Loruhamah. Hosea 1:3-6
Hosea tells his unloved daughter that her mother is a whore who is not his wife. He asks her to tell her  mother to "put away her whoredoms" and "her adulteries from between her breasts" or he (Hosea or God?) will "strip her naked ... and slay her with thirst."
Plead with your mother, plead: for she is not my wife, neither am I her husband: let her therefore put away her whoredoms out of her sight, and her adulteries from between her breasts. Lest I strip her naked, and set her as in the day that she was born ... and slay her with thirst. Hosea 2:
God (or Hosea, it's hard to tell them apart) says he will not have mercy on Hosea's children, because their mother is a whore.
I will not have mercy upon her children; for they be the children of whoredoms.
For their mother hath played the harlot. Hosea 2:4-5
So there you have it: the perfect example for godly fathers.
Marry a whore, give your children nasty names like "unloved," tell them their mother is a whore, and have no mercy on them since they are "the children of whoredoms."

Simon Peter
We don't know from the gospels whether or not Peter was a father, but he was definitely a married man, since Jesus rebuked Peter's mother-in-law's fever.
He [Jesus] arose out of the synagogue, and entered into Simon's house. And Simon's wife's mother was taken with a great fever; and they besought him for her. And he stood over her, and rebuked the fever; and it left her: and immediately she arose and ministered unto them. Luke 4:38-39
Since Peter was married, it's reasonable to suppose that he had children, not that it matters much since Jesus encouraged his disciples to abandon their wives and children. (The first pope abandoned his family for Jesus in Luke 5:11.)
Jesus said ... Every one that hath forsaken ... wife, or children ... for my name's sake, shall receive an hundredfold, and shall inherit everlasting life. Matthew 19:28-29 Mark 10:29-30, Luke 18:29-30
So to hell with fatherhood. Forsake wife and children for Jesus. (He'll give you a big reward for it!)

God the Father
Somehow I forgot about him. But you can read all about his fathering skills here: here.


Posted by Steve Wells at 6/13/2012 09:36:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
51 comments:
 dwerf said...
Well ... how can we mere mortals know God's true intentions? God, of all creatures, surely must have his (very good and understandable) reasons, reasons we are just completely incapable of understanding, because He gave us brains too small to understand. You see, we simply aren't SUPPOSED to understand, because Our Super Mega Lord Almighty chose to create us in his image, but just of a tad less quality (being mortal and wrecking our habitat and such), because, how else can he remain Almighty! It was all part of his plan you see, a plan that is so cunning and clever, that we will never understand, and certainly not you!
You see, for this blog post you shall burn in Hell for all of Eternity. God doesn't like you taking the Bible so out of context.
Oh well, God will keep loving you anyways, also while you're burning in Hell. And there's absolutely nothin' you can do about it.
God Bless ;-)
Sun Jun 15, 11:12:00 AM 2008 
 Paul said...
Noah, clearly. He was just a terrible grandfather.
What do I win?
Sun Jun 15, 11:17:00 AM 2008 
 sconnor said...
My vote, for the worst father, is the imaginary, vindictive, vile, abusive, almighty, father in the Bible.
Mark Twain says it best.
The best minds will tell you that when a man has begotten a child he is morally bound to tenderly care for it, protect it from hurt, shield it from disease, clothe it, feed it, bear with its waywardness, lay no hand upon it save in kindness and for its own good, and never in any case inflict upon it a wanton cruelty. God's treatment of his earthly children, every day and every night, is the exact opposite of all that, yet those best minds warmly justify these crimes, condone them, excuse them, and indignantly refuse to regard them as crimes at all, when he commits them. Your country and mine is an interesting one, but there is nothing there that is half so interesting as the human mind. -- Mark Twain
--S.
Sun Jun 15, 01:00:00 PM 2008 
 Jeremy Gibson said...
There's not much I can say, really. The bible isn't too big on love and care.
Sorry if that comment added absolutely nothing to this topic, but I felt like contributing something.
Mon Jun 16, 01:05:00 AM 2008 
 Brucker said...
Yeah, it's not a well-hidden fact. My own pastor yesterday said, "I figured for Father's Day, I'd share a story of a really good father in the Bible. After thinking about this for a few minutes, I realized I needed a diffierent topic."
Mon Jun 16, 01:32:00 PM 2008 
 Cikgu Screwtape said...
Hi there,
Thanks for your entries on this blog. We have been having troubles with Christian fundamentalists lately (especially those from Singapore) who oppose us because we refuse to take a hard anti-gay stance. One in particular even threatened to have my son raped/sodomized on his birthday. The rest have been anathemizing us.
Our blog is Jeremiah Blues (http://jeremiahblues.blogspot.com). They have also been bragging about their higher authority because of their supposed learning (getting degrees and doctorates, learning Greek, etc.)
Do your part and add your voice to ours. We welcome all comments.
Thanks.
~ Edmund
Tue Jun 17, 03:30:00 AM 2008 
 Cikgu Screwtape said...
Thanks again for your work.
~ Edmund
Tue Jun 17, 03:48:00 AM 2008 
 McGuire said...
Perhaps this guy was following Jephthah's example;
http://www.cnn.com/2008/CRIME/06/16/toddler.killed.ap/index.html
TURLOCK, California (AP) -- Police killed a 27-year-old man as he kicked, punched and stomped a toddler to death despite other people's attempts to stop him on a dark, country road, authorities said.
Thoughts from the folks who are Ok with Jephthah killing his daughter?
Tue Jun 17, 11:40:00 AM 2008 
 v_quixotic said...
When I compare the Abraham story to the Jephthah story, the message I get is God doesn't care much for girls. This is odd, especially as Jephthah's (unnamed) daughter is an exemplar of dutiful obedience returning to be sacrificed and apparently not using the opportunity to relieve herself of that bemoan-worthy virginity when the opportunity was there to get 2 months head-start on the posse.
Wed Jun 18, 12:30:00 AM 2008 
 Hugo said...
Just thought about this, wasn't Jesus supposed to be God's son.
I know there are some other weird explanations 1+1+1=1??? but they're always saying that god sent his only son to be tortured, good father example!!!
Wed Jun 18, 04:34:00 AM 2008 
 Anon said...
brucker, is that a true story? If so, I don't know if it's funny or sad. Some preachers out there must have come to realize, if they didn't at the beginning, that the Bible really isn't all it's cracked up to be. So I guess they have a choice: continue to do their job, or quit, be shunned, and try to find another job. Not an easy choice.
Good point, hugo. That's maybe the worst father story of all. They say that God loved the world so much that he sent his Son to suffer and die, but they don't say what that means about what he thinks of his son (Jesus, I could just forgive humanity's sins, but I want to see blood: off you go!)
Thu Jun 19, 04:22:00 PM 2008 
 Erp said...
Of the lot given, I would say Aaron. He may well have kept silent because he still had two sons left alive and feared what God might do to them if he spoke up. I note he did refuse to eat some of the sacrifice that day.
Sat Jun 20, 02:41:00 PM 2009 
 Ian G. said...
Yeah, I have to agree with Hugo and Anon. God himself, rather than just forgiving mankind for its sins, decides to send his son to be tortured and killed to atone for mankind's sins. What a great father!
Sat Jun 20, 05:01:00 PM 2009 
 Steve Wells said...
Yeah, Erp, I think I agree with you on that. Still, I don't understand how Aaron could have continued to serve a god who burned his sons to death.
But then I don't see how Christians could serve a god that will torture their disbelieving friends and family forever in hell. Can some believer explain that to me?
Sat Jun 20, 05:06:00 PM 2009 
 Erp said...
Well we are speculating about pure legend but what would you do in Aaron's position knowing that to refuse to serve would probably get you and your entire family killed and some other poor fellow put in the same position? It is not as though there was any chance of escaping.
Sun Jun 21, 09:13:00 AM 2009 
 L. S. Allen said...
I give the worst Father's Day example to dwerp, who left the first post in the comment section.
dwerp, if you're such a righteous person and great Christian, what would Jesus say about the horrible things you said to the author of the blog? He will "burn in Hell for all of eternity"...nice! Are you judging? Didn't Jesus say "Judge not, lest ye be judged."?? I wonder what Jesus would say about your smart ass comment "there's nothin' you can do about it....wink, wink." Is that the kind of person Jesus wants you to be?
What sort of example are you setting for other Christians AND none believers by judging the article so harshly? Are none believers supposed to be convinced to convert by your arrogant, self-righteous tone? Of course your pompous view is backed by zero evidence or counterargument, aside from your own naive interpretation (and by the way, I've heard a lot of arguments, and yours is by far the worst). Even if you disagree with the content, is that the sort of thing that your God would encourage? To be hateful and pass judgment and damnation to another person simply because of conflicting opinion? Your post made me want to vomit.
Despite religious beliefs or affiliations, dwerp is the problem, and, without question, deserves the title of Worst Father Ever.
Fri Jun 26, 09:41:00 PM 2009 
 Cristiano SamZZ said...
Steve, you can't forget also that Saul tried to kill his own son with a spear when he found out that he was gay:

1 Samuel 20:32 And Jonathan answered Saul his father, and said unto him, Wherefore shall he be slain? what hath he done?
1 Samuel 20:33 And Saul cast a javelin at him to smite him

Pretty good example to christians who have gay childrren eh?
Thu Aug 06, 11:51:00 AM 2009 
 Steve Wells said...
Thanks Christiano.
I added a note about that in the post and in the SAB. Somehow I missed that before!
Thu Aug 06, 01:20:00 PM 2009 
 Cristiano SamZZ said...
Wow, cool Steve. It's very hard for you to miss something, really, so I'm glad I could help. Just another little correction, the link in "Homosexuality in the Bible" is not 1 Samuel 21:31-33, its 1 Samuel 20:31-33.
See ya. ;)
Fri Aug 07, 09:19:00 AM 2009 
 Steve Wells said...
Thanks again, Cristiano. I've corrected the 1 Samuel link.
Fri Aug 07, 09:45:00 AM 2009 
 skanksta said...
Steve,
I think I've read all of your wonderful blog and I don't remember you covering the 'Jonathan - gay or not?!' question.
Was he ? What do the beleivers say ?
Might be a good topic; apologies if you have already covered.
@dwerf - I thought this was nailing it satire ! Was it ?
Fri Jun 18, 05:47:00 PM 2010 
 Matthew Blanchette said...
I doubt it, skanksta; he never showed up again to explain the "joke".
Steve, very good link that you provided... but it misses out on how nice God was in forcing his "people" to once again be enslaved by the Bablyonian Empire after they wanted freedom of thought; what a great dad! :-P
Fri Jun 18, 06:59:00 PM 2010 
 Steve Wells said...
skanksta,
You know, I'm not really sure about Jonathan's sexual orientation. Saul was clearly upset about his relationship with David, and it might have been because it was a homosexual affair, but it might have been because of Jonathan's political support of, and friendship with, David (Saul's enemy). Their relationship sure does seem gay, but it might just be a language thing. I honestly don't know. That's why I haven't discussed it much.
Fri Jun 18, 07:15:00 PM 2010 
 Erp said...
Thinking over things, I suspect the best father in the Bible is Joseph. He takes care of a child that isn't even his. This includes fleeing to Egypt so the kid isn't murdered and then moving permanently to a new place (according to Matthew).
For less than good fathers, also see Hosea who called two of his children "not loved" and "not my people". His third child was named after the site of a massacre.
Fri Jun 18, 09:03:00 PM 2010 
 Steve Wells said...
Yeah, I can see why you'd choose Joseph, Erp. But the Bible doesn't really say much about what kind of father he was. (Though it does sound like he tried to protect the Jesus from Herod by moving to Egypt for a while. Kind of a crazy thing to do based only on a dream, though, don't you think?)
And as for Hosea, well, he gave his kids some lousy names, but the Bible doesn't say anything else about him as a father, does it?
Fri Jun 18, 09:28:00 PM 2010 
 Jim4901 said...
Steve Wells asked how Christians could worship at God who sends people and their family to hell where they will burn forever.
God does not send people to Hell. He send Jesus to pay the price of our sin, and through faith in Him, we can live in Heaven for all eternity.
God also gave people free will, and He honours our choices. Some people choose not to believe in God, or to live by faith in Jesus. That choice results in rejecting eternal life in Heaven. God honours that choice, even though it breaks His heart.
According to Revelation 20:12-15, unbelievers will be cast into the Lake of Fire, which will be their second death. They will not burn in hell forever; they will be dead forever.
Sat Jun 19, 04:30:00 AM 2010 
 Erp said...
It doesn't take a dream just some knowledge of Herod. Going by Matthew, the kid gets visited by a group of well to do magi and proclaimed king by them. These same magi have also talked to the real king, Herod, and told them what they were doing. Any halfway intelligent man up on current politics would know it might be wise to get out of town fast before Herod moved to get rid of another rival (Herod had killed his own children as potential rivals). The other option is to get rid of the kid. Admittedly the whole Bethlehem/magi story never happened but within the story Joseph does seem to have been a concerned foster father.
Sat Jun 19, 12:29:00 PM 2010 
 Gordon Napier said...
If you extend 'Bible' to include the apocrypha, one might nominate St Peter from the apocryphal Acts of Peter, who prays for his daughter to become paralysed! http://jewishchristianlit.com/Resources/Nag/bActPet.html
Sat Jun 19, 12:36:00 PM 2010 
 skanksta said...
ty Steve and Blanchette,
lol @ dwerf then, I DIDN'T occur to me he meant it !
@Jim902010,
run that by me again ?!
Sat Jun 19, 01:28:00 PM 2010 
 Matthew Blanchette said...
Exactly, skanksta; it doesn't make a heapin' lick o' sense. :-P
Steve, this site might interest you; it hasn't been updated in a while, and the fellow's a little long-winded, but his arguments make a hell of a lot of sense: http://jesuspuzzle.humanists.net/home.htm ;-)
Sun Jun 20, 06:08:00 PM 2010 
 A Heathen with a Bible said...
Even as a kid, it always baffled me that practically every story in Genesis has the moral, "Sometimes God doesn't like you, probably because you were born first, and that's all there is to it". I recently started reading the bible beginning-to-end(aheathenreadsthebible.blogspot.com); my children's comic book bible left out a lot of these charming tales, but not all of them!
Tue Jul 13, 10:21:00 PM 2010 
 parthianking1 said...
You have, unwittingly, fallen into the "trap" Scripture sets for the reader. The assumption woven into your redaction of the ancient texts is that those who first wrote, edited, and read them were unaware of the human frailties you point out--and that readers today are /still/ unaware of them. This is a vain assumption.
Romans 4 speaks of Abraham (="Exalted Father") trusting in God who justifies the ungodly. He wasn't trusting for someone other than himself. The message of Scripture is for soft-hearted sinners who are only sure that they don't have all the answers, not know-it-alls who feel they have the God question worked out because they can tap out a blog.
Mon Jun 13, 08:45:00 AM 2011 
 Turtle said...
Wow. That took a lot of work. I too am struggling to find a perfect father in the scriptures... Short God of course who loved his creation enough to sacrifice His Son... But I find that how true that is to life around me, every father seems to have such major issues. It's a wonder any of us make it out of home alive. Guess it's just the grace of God.
Mon Jun 13, 09:57:00 AM 2011 
 mtcci said...
Please read the scriptures for yourself, asking GOD to help you understand.If you are not willing to understand what GOD has to say to you in the scriptures by asking with sincere heart, then it will just be foolishness to you.
Mon Jun 13, 12:32:00 PM 2011 
 Richard said...
Out of fairness I decided to mention someone who really was an awesome and loving father in the Bible. But then I came up blank. Man, it's hard to think of anyone there who exemplifies loving fatherhood.
The only example I can think of is the Pharaoh during Exodus; he lost his firstborn son to Yahweh's plagues and then, in great sadness, permitted the Israelites to leave. Sure, the story claims that he was guilty of enslaving God's favored people and any halfway decent father would mourn his deceased son, but it does show that he loved his son more than anything else in Egypt.
It's funny and ironic that the only example that came to my mind is the story's villain!
Mon Jun 13, 09:50:00 PM 2011 
 Richard said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Mon Jun 13, 10:04:00 PM 2011 
 Matteo said...
I hope this solves your doubts about Caleb: in the Vulgata (Latin) version of the Bible, it is apparent that
Othniel is Caleb's younger brother "Othonihel filius Cenez frater Chaleb iunior" because of nominative case concord :-)
Wed Jun 15, 10:31:00 AM 2011 
 Matteo said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Wed Jun 15, 10:32:00 AM 2011 
 Stephen said...
Hey, Steve,
Thanks for that analysis. I'm not too concerned about the fathers in the bible because, good or bad, they do't have much to do with fatherhood today. I try to be the best father I can be; so far, so good.
And Happy Father's Day to you!
@ Blogger mtcci...
"If you are not willing to understand what GOD has to say to you in the scriptures by asking with sincere heart, then it will just be foolishness to you."
Er... no, it's just foolishness. :-)
Steve Weeks
Wed Jun 15, 08:42:00 PM 2011 
 Stephen said...
Blogger mtcci said...
"If you are not willing to understand what GOD has to say to you in the scriptures by asking with sincere heart, then it will just be foolishness to you."
Er... it *is* just foolishness!
Steve, Happy Father's Day!
Steve Weeks
Wed Jun 15, 08:44:00 PM 2011 
 rodrick rajive lal said...
This is a most enlightening post, just what we need today, in times when fewer and fewer of our youth go to church. I am preparing to speak on the occasion of Father's Day on the 24th. of June in my Church. I have gained a lot of inspiration from your post! Keep it up, God Bless
Wed Jun 13, 09:30:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
rodrick rajive lal said...
"This is a most enlightening post, just what we need today, in times when fewer and fewer of our youth go to church."
Wed Jun 13, 09:30:00 PM 2012
Your sarcasm is wasted here.
Mine; not so much. :-)
Happy Father's Day anyway!
Steve Weeks
Thu Jun 14, 07:53:00 AM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Heh... I looked at the detail of that Meister Bertram painting in #15. It resembles the "money shot" from some porn movie, and Adam appears to have an actual "woody".
:lol:
Steve Weeks
Thu Jun 14, 02:41:00 PM 2012 
 Godless Poutine said...
This is really awesome! I've started something similar on my blog. But it's all here! Well done! ... Hope you don't accuse me of copying!
Fri Jun 15, 06:17:00 AM 2012 
 Ashwedster Ministryvac said...
Your Blog:
"Then later, if God asks you to kill one of your other children, do that too. Don't worry about it. God will probably send an angel to protect the abandoned child and provide a goat for you to kill instead of your kid at the last minute. Just be willing to abandon and kill your children for God if he asks you to. That's the important thing""


I was reading your blog for some ideas for Father's Day and the below comment that you make under Abraham section caught me off guard because I truly believe that's now how it should be interpret.
You said that "if God ask you to kill your children then you should do it" is an inaccurate interpretation of the bible and his message. This violate the "Do not murder" commandment (Exodus 20). He will not ask you to do such a thing because He will never going to ask or put you in a situation where there's not an alternative to do the right thing and you HAVE to sin. That will violate everything about God and His characters. He is love and He cares for his children
Also, the bible also tells us to not test God (Luke 4:2) but trust that "All things work together for the God of those who love him (Romans 8:28).
I hope that you reconsider my comment here because my intention here is pure and I hope that may the word of God give you a clearer understand of His word and Himself.
Sat Jun 16, 09:39:00 AM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Ashwedster Ministryvac said...
"He is love and He cares for his children..."
"I hope that you reconsider my comment here because my intention here is pure and I hope that may the word of God give you a clearer understand of His word and Himself."
You can keep repeating "god is love", etc., but that doesn't make it true. You really should read Steve Wells's book "Drunk with Blood". But, luckily, all those killings aren't true because god doesn't exist. Your intention may be pure, but the bible is pure make-believe.
I'll see your bible quotes about not testing god, and raise you these: Matthew 7:7-8, Luke 11: 9-10, and, if you're mor(m)on, 3 Nephi 14:7-8. Why don't you take these to heart and ask god to change my mind? Is he not capable of this?
I thought not.
Steve Weeks
Sat Jun 16, 09:31:00 PM 2012 
 JKerber said...
I'm sure I'm not the first one to point this out, but Matthew 23:9 says that you shall call no man father.. So much for father's day. I hope that my Catholic father doesn't get offended that I always do something for him on that day. =/
I've gone on a few websites like catholic.com but they don't really answer this question of Matthew. They all seem to just point to other verses where "father" is used. It just seems to emphasize more that the Bible contradicts itself, rather than explain why this verse doesn't mean what it says.
Tue Jun 26, 10:46:00 AM 2012 
 Unknown said...
This post is so misleading! Yes, Noah, Lot and ALL of the other righteous men in the bible weren't PERFECT. They were pretty much terrible sinners. JUST like the rest of us. Praise be to God that even sinners can be seen as righteous and pure in His eyes when we believe in Him and give our lives to Him!
All this post does is illustrate God's love, grace and forgiveness for those of us who turn to Him. Thank goodness! Because I am just as much of a sinner as Noah and all the rest of them.
Tue Jun 26, 03:17:00 PM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Unknown said: "This post is so misleading! Yes, Noah, Lot and ALL of the other righteous men in the bible weren't PERFECT."
Really? Then why does the Bible say they were. Take Noah, for example.
"Noah was a just man and perfect." Gen 6:9
And Job.
"There was a man in the land of Uz, whose name was Job; and that man was perfect." Job 1:1
These two guys were perfect, according to God anyway.
There is nothing in the Bible that condemns the atrocious behavior of the fathers on the list. The Bible, in fact, praises them for it. And you should, too, if you believe in the Bible.
Tue Jun 26, 03:49:00 PM 2012 
 Antonio LeBron said...
One small note on the word "perfect". Referring to Noah, he was said to be "perfect in his generations" alluding to perfection as being relative. We must also consider that our translations of the original scriptures are just that, translations. Many of our translations were taken from the Greek where words take on different meanings based on inflection and context.
Fri Apr 26, 08:19:00 AM 2013 
 Pamela Moore said...
God is the best Father, just saying.
fathers day messages
Thu Jun 06, 03:30:00 AM 2013 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 07 June 2012Sending body parts in the mail: The Biblical way to send a message

OK, this is going to be another grisly post. Sorry about that.
But, hey, I am, after all,  blogging about the Bible. If you don't like disgusting stories, you're not going to like the Bible. Or my posts.
So here goes.
You've probably heard by now about the Canadian body part messages. If not, here's a summary:
Last week the leaders of the Canadian Liberal and Conservative parties received some body parts in the mail.
Now that's pretty disgusting, isn't it?
Well, not to the Biblical God it isn't. It's one of his favorite ways of sending a message. And if you believe in the Bible, you should consider sending messages yourself that way.
Take Saul, for example.
The spirit of the Lord came upon Saul and he chopped up a couple of oxen and send the pieces to all the leaders of Israel.
And the spirit of God came upon Saul ... and he took a yoke of oxen, and hewed them in pieces, and sent them throughout all the coast of Israel. 1 Samuel 11:6-7
Which makes you wonder. Did the spirit of the Lord come upon Luka Rocco Magnotta when he chopped up Jun Lin and sent his body parts to the Canadian leaders?

And then there's the story about the Levite and his concubine.


You know the one where the Levite and his concubine are staying at a guy's house when a mob comes and asks to have sex with the Levite, and the host says no you can't have sex with him but I'll give you my virgin daughter and his concubine instead, so the Levite gives them his concubine and they rape her all night and she crawls back to the house and dies the next morning, and then the Levite puts her body on his donkey and goes home and chops her body into 12 pieces and sends a piece to each tribe of Israel?

Yeah that one. (You can read all about it in Judges 19.)

Well, God didn't seem to have much to do with that, at least not directly. But he approved that message. Because in the next chapter God personally arranged a holy civil war between the Benjamites (the tribe that happened to include the town of Gibeah where the incident with the concubine occurred) and the other tribes of Israel, each of which received a concubine body part message in the mail.

So maybe Magnotta sent the body parts to the Canadian political leaders to call for a holy war between the province of Quebec (from where the body was sent, and probably hacked up) and all the other Canadian provinces. Maybe that's what God had in mind.

If so, then, the Canadian leaders should read the end of Judges and go and do likewise, by killing every man, woman, and child in Quebec, as the Israelites, under God's direction, did to the Benjamites.

Or something like that.

It's hard to know what God, the Great Communicator, had in mind when he inspired Judges 19-21.
Posted by Steve Wells at 6/07/2012 09:18:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
4 comments:
 Andy said...
I totally agree. I just read through Judges a year ago and that story of the concubine was very, very gross.
Fri Jun 08, 02:34:00 AM 2012 
 Abeille said...
Didn't someone argue that the concubine wasn't dead yet?
Fri Jun 08, 10:00:00 AM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Yes, Abeille, Brucker points out on his blog that the concubine might have been alive when she was dismembered. There's nothing in the text to indicate otherwise.
Fri Jun 08, 10:27:00 AM 2012 
 No said...
People in Montreal are lucky this guy didn't read the Old Testament for goodness sake.
Fri Jun 08, 07:00:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 06 June 2012Eugene's Bible: Did the Bible inspire the naked face-chewing cannibal?
Rudy Eugene is a firm believer in the Bible.


He attended a Bible study just two days before the face-chewing episode, he was called "the preacher" by his friends, and his mother said that he never left home without his Bible. And he had it with him at the time of the attack. It was, in fact, the only thing he had, as he was otherwise completely naked.

So it seems reasonable to ask: was there something in the Bible that inspired the attack?

Of course it's hard to say, but there is plenty in the Bible that might encourage similar behavior.

Take his nakedness, for example. God seems to like his prophets to run around naked. Here are God's instructions to Isaiah.
At the same time spake the LORD ... saying, Go and loose the sackcloth from off thy loins, and put off thy shoe from thy foot. And he did so, walking naked and barefoot.  And the LORD said, Like as my servant Isaiah hath walked naked and barefoot three years for a sign and wonder. Isaiah 20:2-3
God told Isaiah to walk around naked for three years as a sign and and wonder. Maybe Eugene was just trying to do likewise.

And here is what Saul did when the spirit of the Lord came upon him:
Saul ... went thither to Naioth in Ramah: and the Spirit of God was upon him also, and he went on, and prophesied ... And he stripped off his clothes also, and prophesied before Samuel in like manner, and lay down naked all that day and all that night. Wherefore they say, Is Saul also among the prophets? 1 Samuel 19:21-24
The spirit of the Lord came upon Saul and he "lay down naked" all day and night. Maybe the spirit of the Lord came upon Eugene, too.

And then there's this from Micah:
Therefore I will wail and howl, I will go stripped and naked: I will make a wailing like the dragons, and mourning as the owls ... roll thyself in the dust ... having thy shame naked. Micah 1:8-11
I don't know if Rudy Eugene wailed like a dragon, but I'm pretty sure he had his shame naked.

But what about the face-eating behavior? There's nothing in the Good Book that could inspire activity like that, is there?

Well, how about these passages?
And I will cause them to eat the flesh of their sons and the flesh of their daughters, and they shall eat every one the flesh of his friend. Jeremiah 19:9
Therefore the fathers shall eat the sons in the midst of thee, and the sons shall eat their fathers. Ezekiel 5:10
I will not feed you: that that dieth, let it die; and that that is to be cut off, let it be cut off; and let the rest eat every one the flesh of another. Zechariah 11:9
Who pluck off their skin from off them, and their flesh from off their bones; Who also eat the flesh of my people, and flay their skin from off them; and they break their bones, and chop them in pieces, as for the pot, and as flesh within the caldron. Micah 3:2-3
There's plenty there for a naked, face-eating, bible-believing cannibal to choose from.
Perhaps Eugene thought that Ronald Poppo was his long-lost father or friend  that God wanted him to eat, in accordance with Ezekiel 5:10 or Jeremiah 19:9 .  Or maybe that Poppo was just "another" whom God commanded him to eat in Zechariah 11:9. Or that Poppo was one of God's people and, therefore, it was Eugene's job to eat him, as prophesied in Micah 3:2-3.
It's hard to know what God had in mind when he inspired these verses. But I suspect that Rudy Eugene might have a good idea. He and God seem to think pretty much alike.
Posted by Steve Wells at 6/06/2012 12:15:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
13 comments:
 Abeille said...
Oh, wow, I hadn't heard of this.
Just... wow.
Wed Jun 06, 01:03:00 PM 2012 
 Incongruous Circumspection said...
It's obvious god had a thing for naked dudes. Maybe the Westboro Baptist Church should read their Bible again.
Wed Jun 06, 01:03:00 PM 2012 
 Har said...
I bet these passages are hardly ever mentioned in Sunday-school as it would scare the christian kiddies. Not really Sunday morning sermon-fare, either.
It's time believers start reading their Bible, instead of nit-pickingly bashing it.
Wed Jun 06, 01:53:00 PM 2012 
 Har said...
I bet these passages are hardly ever mentioned in Sunday-school as it would scare the christian kiddies. Not really Sunday morning sermon-fare, either.
It's time believers start reading their Bible, instead of nit-pickingly bashing it.
Wed Jun 06, 01:54:00 PM 2012 
 Nathan said...
I wonder what a wailing dragon sounds like.
Wed Jun 06, 04:09:00 PM 2012 
 Ockham's Razorboy said...
To be honest, I think the whole 'taking copious amounts of drugs' thing probably inspired his eating another man's face off, rather than the Bible. His carrying a copy around means he was pretentious, but it's a bit of a stretch to suggest it was integral in inspiring him to take up cannibalism.
Wed Jun 06, 06:26:00 PM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Yeah, I agree, ORB. It was probably the drugs, not the Bible. I doubt if Eugene even knows these verses are in the Bible; most Bible-believers don't. But an honest believer could chow down on someone's face while quoting verses to justify the act. Is there another book that could be used for such a purpose?
Wed Jun 06, 07:09:00 PM 2012 
 Ockham's Razorboy said...
I'm sure there's several books out there that someone could quote to justify something. After all, you can quote from any book to justify anything you like; that doesn't make it a credible justification. Just look at Mark David Chapman as an example; dude was using 'The Catcher In The Rye' as his justification for shooting John Lennon. That doesn't make J. D. Salinger partly responsible for Lennon's death; it just means that Chapman was mental (and really bad at coming up with excuses).
There's a lot of really horrible stuff in the Bible, don't get me wrong. One of the reasons I like your blog is because it's very good at pointing out this stuff. But on this sort of issue I don't think the book, however unpleasant, is at fault. It's the person. Chapman was crazy, and Eugene should have laid off the drugs.
Wed Jun 06, 07:48:00 PM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
ORB said, I'm sure there's several books out there that someone could quote to justify something.
I suppose. But it's hard to find a book where God brags about forcing people to eat their family, friends, and neighbors. Or to lie around naked for 3 years for a sign and a wonder. Stuff like that you can only find in the Bible.
Wed Jun 06, 08:05:00 PM 2012 
 No said...
I wonder if eating the holy cracker, which is the body of Christ in substance as per the transsubstantiation doctrine, makes catholics face-chewing cannibals as well.
Does each of these crackers contains the whole Jesus or just part of him,say part of his right patella for example ?
Thu Jun 07, 02:42:00 PM 2012 
 cloistered_cluttered_confused_orccc said...
Mr. Wells, I think that you hit the nail right on the temple (I mean spot). The bible, (a book that justifies war crimes that are justified upon earlier war crimes), and social morals do not mix well. Add to the mix a Bible Thumper who has dulled reason with the use of hallucinogens, (that includes sacramental wine); the obvious results are "Zombie Killers of God".
Rudy Eugene was most definitely one of them. Sure take the “bath salts” away and Rudy might have maintained some cloud of reason. But as a Bible Thumper he knew all the crimes and edicts of God and the Prophets. The drugs subdued his reason and all he had left was his ability to listen to the “Word of God” like a “Voice crying in the wilderness” telling him to “eat the flesh of another”…etc.
Thu Jun 07, 03:16:00 PM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
No said, "Does each of these crackers contains the whole Jesus or just part of him,say part of his right patella for example ?"
Yes, No, the "sacred host" contains the whole enchilada, the body, blood, soul, and divinity of Jesus.
So that would include his face, which means, I guess, since Jesus is both human and divine, that Catholics are face-eating cannibals.
Thu Jun 07, 04:12:00 PM 2012 
 Matteo Raggi said...
I suggest you to add a newslett n your blog, I love it, but I'm not yet using rss feed, as many italians.. and I don't remember to come back to your site weekly if you don't alert me at the new articles..
Sun Jun 10, 02:42:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 01 June 2012Finally, a Christian who is not ashamed of Leviticus 20:13
In his sermon last Sunday, Curtis Knapp of New Hope Baptist Church in Seneca, Kansas had this to say about homosexuals:
They should be put to death. That's what happened in Israel. That's why homosexuality wouldn't have grown in Israel. It tends to limit conversions. It tends to limit people coming out of the closets.
But he says it's not our job to kill them. It's the government's.
Oh, so you're saying we should go out and start killing them? No, I'm saying the government should.
Then he did what Bible believers are rarely willing to do: he quoted Leviticus 20:13.
If there is a man who lies with a male as those who lie with a woman, then they have committed a detestable act, and they shall surely be put to death.
 He then finished by saying something really puzzling.
I don't think homosexuals have anything to worry about. I don't think the government is going to do that. They don't have anything to worry about from me. I don't believe I should lay a finger against them.
Leviticus 20:13 says nothing about government. And neither does the context. Here, for example, is how Leviticus 20 starts out.
And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, Again, thou shalt say to the children of Israel, Whosoever he be of the children of Israel, or of the strangers that sojourn in Israel, that giveth any of his seed unto Molech; he shall surely be put to death: the people of the land shall stone him with stones. Leviticus 20:1-2
"He shall be put to death: the people of the land shall stone him with stones."
It was the people's job to throw the stones, not the government's.
God makes this point especially clear in the next few verses. Here's what happens to people like Curtis Knapp who refuse to cast the first stone.
And if the people of the land do any ways hide their eyes from the man, when he giveth of his seed unto Molech, and kill him not: Then I will set my face against that man, and against his family, and will cut him off.... Leviticus 20:4-5
God will "cut off" people who refuse to kill those that God says should be killed (like those who "give their seed to Molech", curse their parents, have sex with  animals, etc.).  Then when he's done with that he'll do the same to their families.
No, it's not the governments job to do the killing; it's ours.
The only question is how? In some cases (like the people who give their seed to Molech and wizards) it's clear enough: God wants us to stone them to death.
In other cases (like when a man has sex with his wife and her mother),  we must burn them to death.
But sometimes God just doesn't say how we should do it.
Let's look again at Leviticus 20:13.
If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.
All we can say for sure is this: God wants us to kill male homosexuals in a bloody way. "Their blood shall be upon them." Stoning would certainly be bloody enough, even for God. And it's one of God's favorite means of execution. So I think Pastor Knapp should go with that.
But if the good pastor "hides his eyes" from homosexuals by refusing to kill them as God commands, God will "set his face against him and his family" and "cut them off."
It's time for Pastor Knapp and other Bible believers to come out of the closet and do what God commands them to do in Leviticus 20:13.
It's their job, not the governments.

Posted by Steve Wells at 6/01/2012 02:29:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
7 comments:
 Incongruous Circumspection said...
This moron too.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a-qr6gxIHhQ&feature=related
Fri Jun 01, 03:23:00 PM 2012 
 v1car said...
I seem to recall that "their blood shall be upon them" actually means "it's their own fault". (That is, the blood is a metaphor for the guilt arising from their deaths.)
You might say it's a loophole in the Old Testament guilt and shame accounting tax code; everyone should feel bad about all sorts of things all the time, but for a few specific cases, you can (literally) get away with murder and you don't have to feel bad because, hey, god is totally down with killing certain people.
Fri Jun 01, 03:28:00 PM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Yeah, you might be right about that v1car. But I think "blood" here is likely to have two meanings, one metaphorical and one literal. "Blood" may mean "guilt" but it also means blood. God wants them killed in a messy, painful, and bloody way.
Fri Jun 01, 05:04:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
v1car said...
"I seem to recall that "their blood shall be upon them" actually means "it's their own fault". (That is, the blood is a metaphor for the guilt arising from their deaths.)"
Why would people who like to take the bible literally bother with something like a metaphor, which requires a bit of intelligence to understand? To paraphrase Sigmund Freud, "Sometimes blood is just blood."
Steve
Sat Jun 02, 07:38:00 AM 2012 
 Belexus said...
Definitely a librul as he is demanding an ever-expanding government do the job a private sector employer could do so much more efficiently.....
Mon Aug 06, 07:49:00 PM 2012 
 Carlos Bosque said...
I have an interesting question. Leviticus 20:13 shows that god its against men who sleeps with men, does that means that god has nothing against lesbians? Yeap! God is, with no question, a typical men, homophobic but has no problem with women sleeping with women. Leviticus 20:10-21 explains the sleeping sexual arrangements rules from god. When it comes to sleeping with animals, god mention both genders, making clear its not ok for females or males to have sex with animals but only mention one gender when it comes to homosexuality. I guess we have to come to the conclusion that god only approves lesbians, 'not like there is anything wrong with that.' Also god disapprove brothers and sisters sleeping with each other but god didn't mind when Abraham did it, (genesis 20:11,12) in fact he was married to her... maybe that's the reason he couldn't get her pregnant. When Lot slept with his daughter (genesis 19:30-36) that's also against gods sleeping arrangements but god didn't mind this one either. Some might said god let it happen because they need it to make more people but there was more people around, Abraham slept with his wife's slave (genesis 16:2-4) his wife gave him permission. Well I guess god is willing to bend his rules with some people, he works in a very mysterious way... too mysterious to take it seriously.
Sun Aug 12, 10:46:00 PM 2012 
 jjhrae said...
Carlos you need to READ the Bible! it is the same for Women BOTH are detestable - man with a man and woman with a woman. Guess you need me to find it for you. 1. ALL sex outside marriage is Sin!
Fornication is sin. 2. Woman was created for Man 1 Cor:11:9. 3. Homosexual practice (BOTH genders) - same gender sex - is SIN and unnatural lust - Rom1:24 "Therefore God gave them over 48 in the desires of their hearts to impurity, to dishonor 49 their bodies among themselves" and Rom 1:26-27 " 26 For this reason God gave them over to dishonorable passions. For their women exchanged the natural sexual relations for unnatural ones, 27 and likewise the men also abandoned natural relations with women 55 and were inflamed in their passions 56 for one another. Men 57 committed shameless acts with men and received in themselves the due penalty for their error.
So that is Very clear Carlos. Everything is IN the Bible!
OH MY Carlos You think Sarah was Abraham's sister? READ it again - Abraham LIED to the King - He was afraid that they would KILL Him and take Sarah for the King's Harem! So he LIED and said she is my sister.
Carlos YOU cant read the Bible UNLESS GOD gives you the Spirit to SEE. BUT it IS PLAIN as day. I couldn't understand or see it until I asked GOD to open my eyes. Ask HIM He will open your eyes IF you are sincere and really want to know the Truth!
LOT was Drunk and passed out. HE did NOT know what his daughters planned!
GOD Loves the sinner, But IF the sinner does NOT repent the Sinner is the one who sends himself to Hell. He can NOT let sinners into heaven. WE become saved by what Jesus did on the Cross. That is the ONLY way to be forgiven by God.
The penalty for sin is Immediate Death. But the fact is GOD does Love us and gives us Many opportunities to choose him and his way is why we are NOT struck dead like Nadab & Abihu - Arrons 2 sons in the old testament and Ananias & Sapphira in the New testament.
God's Grace is that we are Still alive and we -YOU- still have a chance to change. Hell is Eternal Torment where GOD wants NO ONE to go that is why Jesus Died in YOUR and my place so that we can be saved! THAT is the ultimate symbol of Love.
God would rather go thru Death on the cross to Save us than to Spend eternity without us! That is TRUE Love!
All you have to do is Choose His sacrifice and accept it. He - God Meets us where we are in our sin and changes OUR lives for the better!
Only YOU can let him in! It is MOST serious Carlos!
Where YOU spend eternity is YOUR choice Hey want to see some Real evidence of the story of the Exodus? Put in your search bar "the search for the Real Mt Sinai" and watch the video evidence - Amazing! Oh and Carlos there is Much more evidence I can show you!
Tue Mar 12, 09:58:00 AM 2013 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 31 July 2012Jeremy Paxman is right: The Bible is religious hogwash that stupid people teach to children
Jeremy Paxman has upset a few (stupid) people for calling the Bible "religious hogwash."
Here are some quotes from his interview with Richard Dawkins on BBC Newsnight.
Paxman (0:49): ...from our earliest years, we have learned to suspend disbelief. And that, apparently, is how we condition impressionable brains to absorb religious hogwash.
Dawkins (7:58): The problem is that 40% of the American people think it [the Genesis creation story] is literally true. And they probably think Lot's wife was turned into a pillar of salt as well, for that matter.
Paxman (8:07): Do you really care that there are a lot of stupid people around?
Dawkins (8:11): I do, actually, yes. I care that children are being mislead by those stupid people.


Posted by Steve Wells at 7/31/2012 11:55:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
4 comments:
 No said...
I agree with him on the children's education and I congratulate myself I didn't pass along the Good Book God Jesus Holy Trio Deal Meal from Above as I was fed at the youngest age.
For the unfortunate choice of words well we'll see how it unfolds for Richard.
I wonder if Mitt still reads british press... nah.
Tue Jul 31, 05:58:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
I thought it was a rather even-handed review. The objectionable word, "stupid", could have been omitted, but Paxman wasn't talking about *all* religious people... just the ones who take Genesis literally, or believe Lot's wife was really turned into a pillar of salt. Those people could fairly be described as "stupid", though maybe "feeble-minded" or "credulous" might have sounded better. Anyone who believes the story about Mrs. Lot also has to believe that Lot's two daughters committed pre-meditated drug-assisted incest with their father. Hmmm... inbreeding is a known contributing cause to intellectual deficit... maybe these people *are* descended from Lot. ^_^
Steve Weeks
Wed Aug 01, 02:18:00 PM 2012 
 Carlos Bosque said...
I wish I would have learn the truth of creation from a very early age. For 20 years I believe in genesis and now I look back and I think, 'how ridiculous I sound it.' I defended this stories and literally stop talking to people who believe differently. Now I feel stupid for my past but smart about the future after I learn a more accurate science studies. I would never let my children experience what I experience when I was religious, I can't blind them to the beauty of discovering the unknown by giving them myth as the answer to all of our questions
Sun Aug 12, 03:28:00 PM 2012 
 DC said...
I can't believe that at one time I was dumb enough to think like Dawkins and believe we are related to monkeys. But after studying the myth of evolution I came to turn against it. I have 3 of Dawkins books, and when I look back at them they seem so silly and childish now.
Tue Aug 14, 01:17:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 26 July 2012The Worst Person in the World (according to the Bible)
In my last post I nominated Jehu for the Worst Person in the Bible award. It wasn't an easy choice, of course, since there are so many bad people in the Bible.
But who is the worst person in the Bible according to the Bible?
There are really only three candidates: Jeroboam, Omri, and Ahab.
God made Jeroboam the king of Israel, but he wasn't happy with him. He just wasn't perfect like David.
Thou hast not been as my servant David, who kept my commandments, and who followed me with all his heart, to do that only which was right in mine eyes. 1 Kings 14:8
In fact, Jeroboam wasn't just not perfect like David, he was worst person who had ever lived up to that time.
Go, tell Jeroboam, Thus saith the LORD God ... thou ... hast done evil above all that were before thee. 1 Kings 14:7-9
The Bible doesn't say what Jeroboam did that was so evil, but whatever it was it was so evil that God had to kill Jeroboam, his son and entire family. Here's the way God put it:
Behold, I will bring evil upon the house of Jeroboam, and will cut off from Jeroboam him that pisseth against the wall ...  and will take away the remnant of the house of Jeroboam, as a man taketh away dung ... Him that dieth of Jeroboam in the city shall the dogs eat; and him that dieth in the field shall the fowls of the air eat: for the LORD hath spoken it. 1 Kings 14:10
There were others after Jeroboam that were evil, so evil, in fact, that God had to kill them too (like Baasha, whom God selected to slaughter Jeroboam's family; and Zimri, whom God selected to kill Baasha's family and who was later burned to death by God). But none of them qualified as the worst person in the world up to that time.
Until Omri, who replaced Jeroboam as the worst person in the world (and who led an attack on Zimri that resulted in Zimri burning to death).
Omri wrought evil in the eyes of the LORD, and did worse than all that were before him. 1 Kings 16:25
But Omni's reign as the worst person in the world didn't last long, since he was replaced by his son, Ahab.
Ahab the son of Omri did evil in the sight of the LORD above all that were before him ... Ahab did more to provoke the LORD God of Israel to anger than all the kings of Israel that were before him. 1 Kings 16:30-33
What was it that Ahab did that was so awful?
He didn't kill a captured king.
To God, that is the worst thing a person can do. It cost Saul his kingdom and it cost Ahab his life. To punish Ahab for the crime of showing mercy, God killed Ahab and selected Jehu to murder Ahab's 70 sons, his wife, family and friends.
Since Ahab is the last person in the Bible to be called the worst person in the world, I guess he wins the Bible's prize.
(Next question: Who is the worst person in Breaking Bad?)
Posted by Steve Wells at 7/26/2012 01:49:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
3 comments:
 Baker Street Boy said...
Hi Steve.
I'm Italian and - as I said time ago - I'm going to translate some of your post.
Have I your permission?
In the last part of your post..
30 Acab, figlio di Omri, fece ciò che è male agli occhi del Signore piú di tutti quelli che l'avevano preceduto. 31 Come se fosse stato per lui poca cosa abbandonarsi ai peccati di Geroboamo, figlio di Nebat, prese in moglie *Izebel, figlia di Etbaal, re dei *Sidoni, andò ad adorare *Baal, a prostrarsi davanti a lui, 32 e innalzò un altare a Baal, nel tempio di Baal, che costruí a Samaria. 33 Acab fece anche l'idolo d'*ASTARTE. Acab fece piú di quello che avevano fatto tutti i precedenti re d'Israele per provocare lo sdegno del Signore, Dio d'Israele.
ASTARTE was the wife of God.. Mary was just a "bunga bunga".. :)
The part about the Omri dinasty is well described in "The Bible Unearthed" by Israel Finkelstein.
They were the kings of Israel kingdom, that's why they're so loathed by Judah's kingdom.
Sorry for my bad English, I'm going to improve it by translating your post..
Bye
Sat Jul 28, 11:16:00 AM 2012 
 Baker Street Boy said...
I have to say something but you have to translate it.
La conclusione a cui sei giunto è sbagliata.
Dio non punisce Acab per aver salvato la vita ad un re catturato, ma nella storia biblica viene additato come un eretico per il fatto di aver ripristinato il culto di Astarte, la moglie di Dio.
Bye
Sat Jul 28, 02:55:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Steve, thanks for the link to the Barbara Griffiths site (http://www.barbaragriffiths.com/books-bible.php#bible-10). Pure comedy gold... and great art work!
Steve
Sun Jul 29, 08:01:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 24 July 2012The worst person in the Bible
As anyone who has actually read the Bible knows, there are a lot of bad people in the (not so very) Good Book. Noah, Abraham, Lot, Moses, Joshua, Jephthah, Gideon, Samson, David, Elijah, Elisha, Jesus -- there are many candidates for the worst person in the Bible award.
My choice for the award isn't on the above list. It is someone that many Bible believers have never even heard of.
His name is Jehu.
The story of Jehu is told in 2 Kings chapters 9 and 10, where God, through the prophet Elisha, anoints Jehu as king and commands him to perform a series of serial killings. First he is told to kill everyone in Ahab's family, especially all those who have ever "pissed against a wall."
Thus saith the LORD God ... thou shalt smite the house of Ahab ... For the whole house of Ahab shall perish: and I will cut off from Ahab him that pisseth against the wall. 2 Kings 9:7-9
So Jehu rides off in his chariot to kill Ahab's son, Jehoram -- a wall pisser if ever there was one.
After killing Jehoram, Jehu killed Ahab's wife, Jezebel, whom God wanted not just dead, but treated like shit and fed to the dogs.
And the dogs shall eat Jezebel in the portion of Jezreel, and there shall be none to bury her. 9:10
This is the word of the LORD ... dogs [shall] eat the flesh of Jezebel: And the carcase of Jezebel shall be as dung upon the face of the field. 9:36-37
So Jehu had Jezebel thrown off a wall to be trampled by horses and fed to the dogs.
Then it was time to take care of the rest of Ahab's family. So Jehu ordered the rulers of Jezreel to cut off the heads of 70 of Ahab's sons and deliver them to him in two baskets.
But there were still a few other wall-pissers on God's hit list. So Jehu searched the town of Jezreel for any and all of Ahab's remaining family and friends -- whoever was associated somehow with Ahab and might have pissed against a wall at one time or another.
Then he killed them all.
So Jehu slew all that remained of the house of Ahab in Jezreel, and all his great men, and his kinsfolks, and his priests, until he left him none remaining. 2 Kings 10:11
But there were still more of Ahab's family to kill. (Ahab had a very large family.) So Jehu drove off to Samaria to meet with the family of King Ahaziah of Judah (a relative of Ahab).


It was a short, productive meeting. Jehu had only one action item: kill all 42 attendees.
Jehu met with the brethren of Ahaziah king of Judah ... And he [Jehu] said, Take them alive. And they took them alive, and slew them at the pit of the shearing house, even two and fortymen; neither left he any of them. 10:13-14
There were still a few more of Ahab's relatives to kill, however. So Jehu and a very close friend show off their "zeal for the Lord" by slaughtering the rest of Ahab's family.
When he was departed thence, he lighted on Jehonadab the son of Rechab coming to meet him: and he saluted him, and said to him, Is thine heart right, as my heart is with thy heart? And Jehonadab answered, It is. If it be, give me thine hand. And he gave him his hand; and he took him up to him into the chariot. And he said, Come with me, and see my zeal for the LORD ... And when he came to Samaria, he slew all that remained unto Ahab in Samaria, till he had destroyed him, according to the saying of the LORD. 10:15-17
And finally, after Jehu finished killing Ahab's family in Samaria, he called an assembly to worship Baal. Then when the worshipers arrived, he killed them all.
Jehu said, Proclaim a solemn assembly for Baal. And they proclaimed it. And Jehu sent through all Israel: and all the worshippers of Baal came, so that there was not a man left that came not. And they came into the house of Baal; and the house of Baal was full from one end to another. ... As soon as he had made an end of offering the burnt offering, that Jehu said to the guard and to the captains, Go in, and slay them; let none come forth. And they smote them with the edge of the sword. 2 Kings 10:20-25
And that's all the Bible says about Jehu. Still it seems enough to award him the title of the worst person in the Bible.
But what about God? Since he ordered the killings, isn't he even worse than Jehu?
And the LORD said unto Jehu, Because thou hast done well in executing that which is right in mine eyes, and hast done unto the house of Ahab according to all that was in mine heart, thy children of the fourth generation shall sit on the throne of Israel. 2 Kings 10:30
Well, yes he is.  Richard Dawkins was quite right when he said that "the God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction." But he's not human (or a corporation), so he doesn't qualify as a person.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
To be fair to God, I should mention that God seemed to change his mind about the Jehu mass murders.
And the LORD said unto him, Call his name Jezreel; for yet a little while, and I will avenge the blood of Jezreel upon the house of Jehu, and will cause to cease the kingdom of the house of Israel. Hosea 1:4
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Here are a few questions for believers:
Did Jehu "do well" when he performed this series of mass murders and was "it according to God's heart" as it says in 2 Kings 10:30? 
Why then did God say he would avenge Jehu's killings in Hosea 1:4? 
How are Jehu's killings different from those of James Holmes?
Posted by Steve Wells at 7/24/2012 11:56:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
5 comments:
 Stephen said...
It may yet turn out that James Holmes (thought he) was doing the lord's work. If so, he'll be in good company, but he's a rank amateur compared to Jehu.
Steve Weeks
Tue Jul 24, 01:32:00 PM 2012 
 Ngofo said...
I was introduced to your blog earlier this year by a youtube comment. obviously, I have read most of your post and the ensuing arguements and, like many, I find your blog quite intriquing, I must say.
Pioneering missionaries to Africa discredited the African interpretation of their god-experience as barbaric heathenistism but, on the other hand, all the killings done by the chosen children of God, the Israelites, and commanded by God, were all justified righteousness, because, according to them, the people on the receiving end had so many sins that God was now punishing them. We see this same rationalization today in the invasions of Iraq, Lybia,Syria,Lebanon,Vietnam,and countless others as if any mass killings can be justified if the aggressors can explain how bad, and therefore deserving, the victims are.
Tue Jul 24, 04:35:00 PM 2012 
 TWF said...
By Jove, I think you've got a winner! Way to play the underdog, and do it so well!
I am not sure I agree that Jehu was the worst, but you have certainly made a convincing case here. Good work. (Don't be surprised if I condemn your children for this work in the future.) ;-)
Tue Jul 24, 06:01:00 PM 2012 
 No said...
From the Bible's point of view any person in the book that would not believe Jesus is their personal saviour are equaly as bad and worthy of burning in hell for all Eternity as perscribe by Jesus and God.
From my point of view the worst person in the Bible is the christian God for promissing to ruthlessly murder more than half the human race, present and throughout history, for not believing in him.
Wed Jul 25, 07:53:00 AM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Here's a letter (edited for brevity) written by Colin (http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2012/07/28/my-take-this-is-where-god-was-in-aurora/comment-page-1/#comments)about the Colorado shootings:
Dear Christians:
God here. I thought I would take the time to personally explain my absence in the Aurora shootings. While I was at it, I thought I would also explain my absence during every murder, massacre and crime that has ever taken place in World history, and in every war, in every famine, drought and flood.
You see, I do not exist. I never have. Did it really make sense to you that I would create an entire Universe with billions of billions of planets and wait about 13,700,000,000 years just so I could focus on a few Jews from Palestine about 2,000 years ago while ignoring the rest of the 200,000,000 people on the planet at the time?
So, you really think my periodic miracles prove my existence hey? Then why not something inarguable and unambiguous, like a huge crucifix in the sky, or my face on the moon? Why is it always that believers have to construct my miracles out of perfectly explicable natural events?
This happens every time there is a tragedy or near tragedy of any kind, anywhere in the world and in all cultures. Of course, none of these incidents really are "miracles.” When the totality of facts are taken into account, "miracles" turn out to be nothing more than believers who are desperate for some sign of my existence ignoring the downside of a set of facts, focusing solely on the upside and calling the quarantined "good" a miracle from me or one of the other sky-fairies.
Another annoying habit my “miracles” seem to have is that they always seem to tag along, just behind medical science, like an annoying kid brother who won’t go away. Until the mid nineties, those with AIDS who prayed for a miracle were never granted one. Medical science finds a way to permanently suppress the disease, and all of a sudden I start to perform miracles with AIDS patients. No polio patient ever received a miracle until the Salk vaccine and I routinely ignored cancer patients until chemotherapy and radiation treatments were developed. Suddenly, prayers to me from cancer patients are regularly “answered.”
Why is it that I still seem deaf to the pleadings of amputees who would like their fingers, arms or legs back, to those who have physically lost eyes or ears, to the horribly burned and to all others who ail from patently visible and currently incurable maladies? Why is it that, at the very same time, I am very receptive to the prayers of those whose condition is uncertain, internal and vulnerable to miraculous claims?
Take five minutes to make two lists; one of those ailments I will miraculously cure and the other of those I will not. You will quickly find it coincides perfectly with those conditions medical science (or the human body itself) can defeat and those we cannot. Why do you think that is? It is almost as my miracles are created out of medical ambiguity isn’t it?
No, my human friends. I am afraid I do not exist. I do not read your minds (or “hear your prayers” as you like to call it) and you are not going to achieve immortality (or “eternal life” as you like to call it) no matter how many commandments from Iron Age Palestine you choose to “keep”. Move on and enjoy the few years you have. You were all dead for the last 13,700,000,000 years and it wasn’t that least bit uncomfortable now, was it?
God
Fri Aug 03, 02:43:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 24 July 2012The worst person in the Bible
As anyone who has actually read the Bible knows, there are a lot of bad people in the (not so very) Good Book. Noah, Abraham, Lot, Moses, Joshua, Jephthah, Gideon, Samson, David, Elijah, Elisha, Jesus -- there are many candidates for the worst person in the Bible award.
My choice for the award isn't on the above list. It is someone that many Bible believers have never even heard of.
His name is Jehu.
The story of Jehu is told in 2 Kings chapters 9 and 10, where God, through the prophet Elisha, anoints Jehu as king and commands him to perform a series of serial killings. First he is told to kill everyone in Ahab's family, especially all those who have ever "pissed against a wall."
Thus saith the LORD God ... thou shalt smite the house of Ahab ... For the whole house of Ahab shall perish: and I will cut off from Ahab him that pisseth against the wall. 2 Kings 9:7-9
So Jehu rides off in his chariot to kill Ahab's son, Jehoram -- a wall pisser if ever there was one.
After killing Jehoram, Jehu killed Ahab's wife, Jezebel, whom God wanted not just dead, but treated like shit and fed to the dogs.
And the dogs shall eat Jezebel in the portion of Jezreel, and there shall be none to bury her. 9:10
This is the word of the LORD ... dogs [shall] eat the flesh of Jezebel: And the carcase of Jezebel shall be as dung upon the face of the field. 9:36-37
So Jehu had Jezebel thrown off a wall to be trampled by horses and fed to the dogs.
Then it was time to take care of the rest of Ahab's family. So Jehu ordered the rulers of Jezreel to cut off the heads of 70 of Ahab's sons and deliver them to him in two baskets.
But there were still a few other wall-pissers on God's hit list. So Jehu searched the town of Jezreel for any and all of Ahab's remaining family and friends -- whoever was associated somehow with Ahab and might have pissed against a wall at one time or another.
Then he killed them all.
So Jehu slew all that remained of the house of Ahab in Jezreel, and all his great men, and his kinsfolks, and his priests, until he left him none remaining. 2 Kings 10:11
But there were still more of Ahab's family to kill. (Ahab had a very large family.) So Jehu drove off to Samaria to meet with the family of King Ahaziah of Judah (a relative of Ahab).


It was a short, productive meeting. Jehu had only one action item: kill all 42 attendees.
Jehu met with the brethren of Ahaziah king of Judah ... And he [Jehu] said, Take them alive. And they took them alive, and slew them at the pit of the shearing house, even two and fortymen; neither left he any of them. 10:13-14
There were still a few more of Ahab's relatives to kill, however. So Jehu and a very close friend show off their "zeal for the Lord" by slaughtering the rest of Ahab's family.
When he was departed thence, he lighted on Jehonadab the son of Rechab coming to meet him: and he saluted him, and said to him, Is thine heart right, as my heart is with thy heart? And Jehonadab answered, It is. If it be, give me thine hand. And he gave him his hand; and he took him up to him into the chariot. And he said, Come with me, and see my zeal for the LORD ... And when he came to Samaria, he slew all that remained unto Ahab in Samaria, till he had destroyed him, according to the saying of the LORD. 10:15-17
And finally, after Jehu finished killing Ahab's family in Samaria, he called an assembly to worship Baal. Then when the worshipers arrived, he killed them all.
Jehu said, Proclaim a solemn assembly for Baal. And they proclaimed it. And Jehu sent through all Israel: and all the worshippers of Baal came, so that there was not a man left that came not. And they came into the house of Baal; and the house of Baal was full from one end to another. ... As soon as he had made an end of offering the burnt offering, that Jehu said to the guard and to the captains, Go in, and slay them; let none come forth. And they smote them with the edge of the sword. 2 Kings 10:20-25
And that's all the Bible says about Jehu. Still it seems enough to award him the title of the worst person in the Bible.
But what about God? Since he ordered the killings, isn't he even worse than Jehu?
And the LORD said unto Jehu, Because thou hast done well in executing that which is right in mine eyes, and hast done unto the house of Ahab according to all that was in mine heart, thy children of the fourth generation shall sit on the throne of Israel. 2 Kings 10:30
Well, yes he is.  Richard Dawkins was quite right when he said that "the God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction." But he's not human (or a corporation), so he doesn't qualify as a person.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
To be fair to God, I should mention that God seemed to change his mind about the Jehu mass murders.
And the LORD said unto him, Call his name Jezreel; for yet a little while, and I will avenge the blood of Jezreel upon the house of Jehu, and will cause to cease the kingdom of the house of Israel. Hosea 1:4
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Here are a few questions for believers:
Did Jehu "do well" when he performed this series of mass murders and was "it according to God's heart" as it says in 2 Kings 10:30? 
Why then did God say he would avenge Jehu's killings in Hosea 1:4? 
How are Jehu's killings different from those of James Holmes?
Posted by Steve Wells at 7/24/2012 11:56:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
5 comments:
 Stephen said...
It may yet turn out that James Holmes (thought he) was doing the lord's work. If so, he'll be in good company, but he's a rank amateur compared to Jehu.
Steve Weeks
Tue Jul 24, 01:32:00 PM 2012 
 Ngofo said...
I was introduced to your blog earlier this year by a youtube comment. obviously, I have read most of your post and the ensuing arguements and, like many, I find your blog quite intriquing, I must say.
Pioneering missionaries to Africa discredited the African interpretation of their god-experience as barbaric heathenistism but, on the other hand, all the killings done by the chosen children of God, the Israelites, and commanded by God, were all justified righteousness, because, according to them, the people on the receiving end had so many sins that God was now punishing them. We see this same rationalization today in the invasions of Iraq, Lybia,Syria,Lebanon,Vietnam,and countless others as if any mass killings can be justified if the aggressors can explain how bad, and therefore deserving, the victims are.
Tue Jul 24, 04:35:00 PM 2012 
 TWF said...
By Jove, I think you've got a winner! Way to play the underdog, and do it so well!
I am not sure I agree that Jehu was the worst, but you have certainly made a convincing case here. Good work. (Don't be surprised if I condemn your children for this work in the future.) ;-)
Tue Jul 24, 06:01:00 PM 2012 
 No said...
From the Bible's point of view any person in the book that would not believe Jesus is their personal saviour are equaly as bad and worthy of burning in hell for all Eternity as perscribe by Jesus and God.
From my point of view the worst person in the Bible is the christian God for promissing to ruthlessly murder more than half the human race, present and throughout history, for not believing in him.
Wed Jul 25, 07:53:00 AM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Here's a letter (edited for brevity) written by Colin (http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2012/07/28/my-take-this-is-where-god-was-in-aurora/comment-page-1/#comments)about the Colorado shootings:
Dear Christians:
God here. I thought I would take the time to personally explain my absence in the Aurora shootings. While I was at it, I thought I would also explain my absence during every murder, massacre and crime that has ever taken place in World history, and in every war, in every famine, drought and flood.
You see, I do not exist. I never have. Did it really make sense to you that I would create an entire Universe with billions of billions of planets and wait about 13,700,000,000 years just so I could focus on a few Jews from Palestine about 2,000 years ago while ignoring the rest of the 200,000,000 people on the planet at the time?
So, you really think my periodic miracles prove my existence hey? Then why not something inarguable and unambiguous, like a huge crucifix in the sky, or my face on the moon? Why is it always that believers have to construct my miracles out of perfectly explicable natural events?
This happens every time there is a tragedy or near tragedy of any kind, anywhere in the world and in all cultures. Of course, none of these incidents really are "miracles.” When the totality of facts are taken into account, "miracles" turn out to be nothing more than believers who are desperate for some sign of my existence ignoring the downside of a set of facts, focusing solely on the upside and calling the quarantined "good" a miracle from me or one of the other sky-fairies.
Another annoying habit my “miracles” seem to have is that they always seem to tag along, just behind medical science, like an annoying kid brother who won’t go away. Until the mid nineties, those with AIDS who prayed for a miracle were never granted one. Medical science finds a way to permanently suppress the disease, and all of a sudden I start to perform miracles with AIDS patients. No polio patient ever received a miracle until the Salk vaccine and I routinely ignored cancer patients until chemotherapy and radiation treatments were developed. Suddenly, prayers to me from cancer patients are regularly “answered.”
Why is it that I still seem deaf to the pleadings of amputees who would like their fingers, arms or legs back, to those who have physically lost eyes or ears, to the horribly burned and to all others who ail from patently visible and currently incurable maladies? Why is it that, at the very same time, I am very receptive to the prayers of those whose condition is uncertain, internal and vulnerable to miraculous claims?
Take five minutes to make two lists; one of those ailments I will miraculously cure and the other of those I will not. You will quickly find it coincides perfectly with those conditions medical science (or the human body itself) can defeat and those we cannot. Why do you think that is? It is almost as my miracles are created out of medical ambiguity isn’t it?
No, my human friends. I am afraid I do not exist. I do not read your minds (or “hear your prayers” as you like to call it) and you are not going to achieve immortality (or “eternal life” as you like to call it) no matter how many commandments from Iron Age Palestine you choose to “keep”. Move on and enjoy the few years you have. You were all dead for the last 13,700,000,000 years and it wasn’t that least bit uncomfortable now, was it?
God
Fri Aug 03, 02:43:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 11 July 2012Woe is everyone!
My last post showed that God is woe. But he's got plenty of woe company.
Here's a list of woe people in the Bible.
Early rising, all-day drinkers
Woe unto them that rise up early in the morning, that they may follow strong drink; that continue until night, till wine inflame them!  Isaiah 5:11

Drinkers, drunkards, and bartenders
Woe unto them that are mighty to drink wine, and ... mingle strong drink. Isaiah 5:22
Woe to ... the drunkards ... that are overcome with wine! Isaiah 28:1
Woe unto him that giveth his neighbour drink, that puttest thy bottle to him, and makest him drunken. Habakkuk 2:15

People with unclean lips
Woe is me! ... because I am a man of unclean lips, and I dwell in the midst of a people of unclean lips. Isaiah 6:5

People that make a noise like the sea
Woe to the multitude ... which make a noise like the noise of the seas. Isaiah 17:12

Spoiled people
Woe unto us! for we are spoiled. Jeremiah 4:13

Foolish, free-spirited prophets
Woe unto the foolish prophets, that follow their own spirit, and have seen nothing! Ezekiel 13:3

Women that sew pillows
Thus saith the Lord GOD; Woe to the women that sew pillows ... Behold, I am against your pillows. Ezekiel 13:18-20

Bloody cities
Woe to the bloody city, to the pot whose scum is therein, and whose scum is not gone out of it!   Ezekiel 24:6
Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Woe to the bloody city I will even make the pile for fire great. Ezekiel 24:9
Woe to the bloody city! Nahum 3:1

People that desire the day of the Lord
Woe unto you that desire the day of the LORD! to what end is it for you? the day of the LORD is darkness, and not light. Amos 5:18

People that are at ease
Woe to them that are at ease. Amos 6:1

People who wake up wood or dumb stones
Woe unto him that saith to the wood, Awake; to the dumb stone, Arise. Habakkuk 2:19

The inhabitants of the sea coast
Woe unto the inhabitants of the sea coast ... I will even destroy thee, that there shall be no inhabitant. Zephaniah 2:5

Filthy and polluted women
Woe to her that is filthy and polluted. Zephaniah 3:1
Idle shepherds
Woe to the idle shepherd that leaveth the flock! the sword shall be upon his arm, and upon his right eye: his arm shall be clean dried up, and his right eye shall be utterly darkened.  Zechariah 11:17

Pregnant women and nursing mothers
Woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days! Matthew 24:19, Mark 13:17, Luke 21:23

Rich people
Woe unto you that are rich! Luke 6:24

The well-fed
Woe unto you that are full! Luke 6:25a
Those that laugh now
Woe to you that laugh now. Luke 6:25b

Those with good reputations
Woe unto you, when all men shall speak well of you! Luke 6:26

Lawyers
Woe unto you also, ye lawyers!  Luke 11:46

Everyone on earth
Woe unto the world because of offences! Matthew 18:7
Woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth!   Revelation 8:13
Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you.  Revelation 12:12
Posted by Steve Wells at 7/11/2012 01:43:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
4 comments:
 Lars Larson said...
Love your stuff...
...but listen...Isaiah 5:11 goes like this:
"Woe unto them that rise up early in the morning, that they may follow strong drink; that continue until night, till wine inflame them!"
Why not print the rest? It is all silly. You don't need to rip things out of context to show it. It just makes you as ingenuous as those trying to scam people into believing.
Wed Jul 11, 03:04:00 PM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Thanks Lars. And you're right, I should have quoted the whole verse. I usually try to include as much of the quote as is necessary to show the meaning of the verse or passage, but this time I couldn't resist truncating it for humorous effect.
I'll revise the post to include the whole verse as you suggest.
Wed Jul 11, 05:30:00 PM 2012 
 No said...
"Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you."
Revelation 12:12
But Lord you are the one that created the whole thing to begin with,remember ? During iron age Most Holy... does that ring a bell ?
Still hesitating ? Try Omega3 it's good it's fish oil.
Speaking of fish Your Most Hon'rable marine wildlife is evil too, is this so... they can't stop sinning like us bone bags uh I'd bet ? Why haven't I though about it before... woe to the inhabitant of the sea !
Where's my fishing rod ?!
Fri Jul 13, 08:02:00 PM 2012 
 havocwing said...
The epitome of sadism.
Fri Jul 13, 08:24:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 10 July 2012Woe is God.
Woe to them that devise iniquity, and work evil upon their beds! Micah 2:1
Thus saith the LORD; Behold, against this family do I devise an evil. Micah 2:3

Posted by Steve Wells at 7/10/2012 09:20:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
5 comments:
 No said...
Caught red-handed ! Surely the evil doer ought to be put to death ! Everybody must get stones !
Tue Jul 10, 09:39:00 AM 2012 
 Stephen said...
Surely you mean "Woden is God. ;-)
And... THERE ARE NO CONTRADICTIONS IN THE BIBLE ITS GODS WORD!!!!!
...
Thanks, I'm back to normal now!
Steve Weeks
Tue Jul 10, 01:36:00 PM 2012 
 No said...
If there were no evil in your world let me tell ya I'd be bored out of my skull.
It took me two verses, just two verses, to depart from my own divine decree... not sure if this is my personnal record though.
-Da Lard
Tue Jul 10, 04:01:00 PM 2012 
 C.D. said...
Steve, whoever you are, I was browsing the internet looking for something on free will, and i stumbled upon your blog... What a refreshing experience... my first contact with you was the 50 reasons why we should 'unfriend' Jesus... got a good laugh at that... I was born an raised in a Christian family, but I do question a lot, and I do value open and inquisitive minds like yours. You have done a marvelous job and research.
Fri Jul 13, 09:40:00 AM 2012 
 Stephen said...
C.D., welcome to the blog. Sam Harris has a new book on free will (http://www.samharris.org/free-will ), which I haven't read yet, but might be of interest to you. Steve Wells has a good book ("Drunk with Blood") and a great Bible resource ("Skeptic's Annotated Bible"), which might be off the free-will topic... though there are references to god "hardening" peoples' hearts (eg, Pharaoh in "exodus") which kind of takes away their free will.
Anyway, I hope you find interesting things to think about on Steve's blog.
Steve Weeks (not to be confused with Steve Wells!)
Fri Jul 13, 07:50:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 08 July 20122 Nephi 30: They shall be a white pure and delightsome people
In the last chapter, Nephi explained that God had written a new Bible, a Third Testament, "a marvelous work and a wonder," which we all know today as the Book of Mormon.
Here's how the Book of Mormon (the musical) explains it:
You all know the Bible is made of testaments old an new.
You've been told it's just those two parts,
or only one if you're a Jew.
But what if I were to tell you,
there's a fresh third part out there,
Which was found by a hip new prophet
who had a little Donny Osmond flair.


You've got to believe in the first two books or you will perish without covenanting with God.
Except ye shall keep the commandments of God ye shall all likewise perish. 2 Nephi 30:1
The Jews believe in the first but not the second, so god will cast them off.
As many of the Jews as will not repent shall be cast off; for the Lord covenanteth with none save it be with them that repent and believe in his Son. 2 Nephi 30:2
But believing in the first two is not enough; you also need to believe in the third book, as Nephi prophesied somewhat more about.
And now, I would prophesy somewhat more concerning the Jews and the Gentiles. For after the book of which I have spoken. 2 Nephi 30:3
Believing in these three books will not only get you saved, they will also turn your skin white (if God has cursed you with with dark skin) or make you delightsome (if you have become loathsome, filthy, idle, and abominable by dwindling in unbelief).
And the gospel of Jesus Christ shall be declared among them ... and their scales of darkness shall begin to fall from their eyes; and many generations shall not pass away among them, save they shall be a pure and delightsome people. 2 Nephi 30:5-6
(Note: The Mormon Church changed the word "white" to "pure" to soften the obvious racism of this prophecy.)
Belief in these three books will whiten the skin of the Lamanites (Native Americans) and make the Jews a delightsome people.
And it shall come to pass that the Jews which are scattered also shall begin to believe in Christ; and they shall begin to gather in upon the face of the land; and as many as shall believe in Christ shall also become a delightsome people. 2 Nephi 30:7
And it will work for you too, no matter how loathsome, filthy, idle, or abominable you are, or how dark your skin may be. You can become white and delightsome in God's eyes.
All you've got to do is believe.

Posted by Steve Wells at 7/08/2012 11:32:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
2 comments:
 Stephen said...
Joe Smith had a way with language. I had never heard "covenant" used as a verb:
"As many of the Jews as will not repent shall be cast off; for the Lord covenanteth with none save it be with them that repent and believe in his Son." 2 Nephi 30:2
According to Merriam-Webster, this use is rare. But Joe-boy really makes this and many other words come to life.
No, sorry... Mark Twain was right: the BoM is "chloroform in print". It is sooooooo badly written it's impossible for me to understand how so many people in the 21st century can take it seriously. And that's just considering how it's written; the content is risable to the extreme. I hasten to point out that it's no more ridiculous than any other religion.
Steve Weeks
Sun Jul 08, 12:15:00 PM 2012 
 No said...
I raise my hat to salute folks who were able to deprogrammed themselves from this obvious man made doctrine, especiallly if the family is deeply into it. Surely this accomplishment came with a price.
Mon Jul 09, 06:19:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 06 July 2012The Shechem and Dinah love story/massacre
The story begins when Dinah, the daughter of Jacob, goes out to meet her Hivite neighbors.

Dinah the daughter of Leah, which she bare unto Jacob, went out to see the daughters of the land.  Genesis 34:1
While she was visiting, a young Hivite man named Shechem saw her and immediately fell in love with her. (Well, maybe not immediately, but after he had sex with her, anyway. The Bible doesn't say whether it was consensual or not.)
And when Shechem the son of Hamor the Hivite, prince of the country, saw her, he took her, and lay with her, and defiled her. And his soul clave unto Dinah ... and he loved the damsel, and spake kindly unto the damsel. 34:2-3
Shechem told his father that he'd like to marry Dinah.
Shechem spake unto his father Hamor, saying, Get me this damsel to wife. 34.4
So Hamor went to talk to Jacob about it.
And Hamor the father of Shechem went out unto Jacob to commune with him ... saying, The soul of my son Shechem longeth for your daughter: I pray you give her him to wife. 34.6-8
Hamor suggested that the Hivites and the Israelites live together in peace, trading and intermarrying with one other. 
And make ye marriages with us, and give your daughters unto us, and take our daughters unto you.  And ye shall dwell with us: and the land shall be before you; dwell and trade ye therein, and get you possessions therein. 34:9-10
Jacob didn't seem to care much about it, one way or another. But his sons did. It was all about the Hivite's penises.
The sons of Jacob answered Shechem and Hamor his father deceitfully, and said, ... We cannot do this thing, to give our sister to one that is uncircumcised. 34:13-14
The problem was that little flap of skin at the tip of the Hivite's penises. If they'd just cut that off, then they could all happily live together in peace.
But in this will we consent unto you: If ye will be as we be, that every male of you be circumcised; Then will we give our daughters unto you, and we will take your daughters to us, and we will dwell with you, and we will become one people. 34:15-16
Hamor agrees to this. He, along with his son and all the male Hivites, will cut off that little flap of skin at the end of their penises as a sacrifice for peace. (Greater love hath no father than this, that he cut off his own foreskin for his son.)
And Hamor and Shechem his son ... communed with the men of their city, saying,  These men are peaceable with us; therefore let them dwell in the land, and trade therein; for the land, behold, it is large enough for them; let us take their daughters to us for wives, and let us give them our daughters.  Only herein will the men consent unto us for to dwell with us, to be one people, if every male among us be circumcised, as they are circumcised. ... Let us consent unto them, and they will dwell with us. 34:20-21
So Hamor, Shechem and every male Hivite cut off that little flap of skin that offends God so much.
And every male was circumcised. 34:24
And Dinah and Shechem were married and everyone lived happily ever after.
Just kidding.
Here's what actually happened.
And it came to pass on the third day, when they were sore, that two of the sons of Jacob ... took each man his sword, and came upon the city boldly, and slew all the males. And they slew Hamor and Shechem his son with the edge of the sword, and took Dinah out of Shechem's house, and went out. The sons of Jacob came upon the slain, and spoiled the city, because they had defiled their sister. ... And all their wealth, and all their little ones, and their wives took they captive, and spoiled even all that was in the house. 34:25-29
Jacob's sons slaughtered Shechem, Hamor, and all the Hivite males while they were recovering from their circumcisions, and then stole their possessions and enslaved their wives.
But at least Hamor died for something worthwhile -- the happiness of his son and peace in the world. And thereby set a great example for Father's Day.
It's a nasty story, of course, but it isn't entirely clear, from the story in Genesis 34 anyway, what God had to do with it. And for that reason, I originally left it off the list of God's killings. However the deuterocanonical book of Judith clears all that up very nicely.
Here's what it says.
O Lord God of my father Simeon, who gavest him a sword to execute vengeance against strangers, who had defiled by their uncleanness, and uncovered the virgin unto confusion: And who gavest their wives to be made a prey, and their daughters into captivity ... who were zealous with thy zeal. Judith 9:2-3
So God not only approved of the Shechem massacre, he gave Simeon the sword to do it with.


Thank God for the Catholic Bible.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Since the Bible doesn't say how many Hivites were killed in this massacre, I just gave it the usual 1000 for a standard biblical massacre. But two victims were known by name (Shechem and Hamor), so I added 2 to the "biblical number" for God's killings.
God's next killing: Er for being wicked in the sight of the Lord
Posted by Steve Wells at 7/06/2012 12:02:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
6 comments:
 Stephen said...
Man, there's enough slicing and dicing that I almost think the old testament was written by Ron Popeil. ;-)
Steve Weeks
Fri Jul 06, 12:14:00 PM 2012 
 No said...
Hey if your not happy with the way I set MY priorities in MY holy book and in MY universe how about starting your own imaginary universe on the side with your own holy book Bucko... uh ?
-Yahweh
Sat Jul 07, 09:35:00 AM 2012 
 No said...
Of course Yahweh was speaking to no one in particular here, just going on being his usual moronic Self without the ruby red pourred all over at his own request.
Honestly that be great if someone would come up with an OT2, with the same caracters that we like so much to laugh about, but this time it would clearly specify that this is just a collection of tales and by no mean a sacred book.
Wouldn't that be great to have Genesis rewritten sauce Monty Python let's say, and have a whole new set of stories as appalling and provocative as in OT1 ?
New genocides new devine revenges new contradictions but same bad taste ?
Sat Jul 07, 10:34:00 AM 2012 
 combo3 said...
Regarding the death toll...
According to the book of Jasher, the total body count was at least 963 men: 18 uncircumcised males, plus 645 circumcised males plus, 300 other undisclosed men. Apparently they also slew all the married women, because the text goes on to say they took 85 women 'who had not known men' captive. Assuming a 1:1 ratio of men to women, that raises the total number of dead to ~1,920 people. Of course the narrative then contradicts itself by saying they took 47 males captive as well.
www.ccel.org/a/anonymous/jasher/34.htm
But yeah, the moral of the story is that it's permissible to destroy an entire city for the transgressions of one inhabitant. (But definitely keep the young virgins for yourself.)
Sat Jul 07, 10:53:00 AM 2012 
 No said...
Interestingly enough the Bible shows some consistancy here in regard to the moral of Shechem's story when it comes to community hooliganism by Devine Decree.
And whosoever shall not receive you, nor hear your words, when ye depart out of that house or city, shake off the dust of your feet.
Verily I say unto you, It shall be more tolerable for the land of Sodom and Gomorrha in the day of judgment, than for that city.
Matthew 10:14-15
Here the Loving God of the NT empowers ordinary christians to have whole cities deleted from Google Map at some time in the future if they ever get their feathers ruffled a little preachin' the Good Book.
That's quite a claim from your local church Loving Lord Bible lovers. If you're a Christian I hope they make it clear to you on Sunday so you don't use this super power of your foolishly !
Sat Jul 07, 12:26:00 PM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Thanks, combo3, for the information about the book of Jasher. I should probably refer to that and use the numbers from that book for this killing, even though it didn't make it into either the Protestant or Catholic versions of the Bible.
Sat Jul 07, 12:42:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 05 July 2012Three more ways that Muhammad is better than Jesus
In a previous post, I discussed the important question: who had the most powerful spit, Jesus or Muhammad?
But what about the other characteristics of Jesus and Mo?
Well, here are three more ways that the founders of the two largest religions can be compared. (Information about Muhammad is from the Ash-Shifa.)

Mo had pure women ancestors all the way back to Eve.
From the time of Prophet Adam … there was neither an adulterer nor fornicator in the lineage of the Prophet, all were officially married. p.13
A line of no less than five hundred female ancestors of the Prophet ... He too verified that none had fornicated. p.13
Jesus didn't. (His 47th or so great grandfather was the son of a prostitute.)
It was told Tamar, saying, Behold thy father in law goeth up to Timnath to shear his sheep. ... When Judah saw her, he thought her to be an harlot; because she had covered her face. And he said ... let me come in unto thee ... And he gave it her, and came in unto her, and she conceived by him. ... And  twins were in her womb. ... Pharez and Zarah. Genesis 38.13-28
Jesus ... being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli ... [46 or so generations] ... which was the son of Phares. Luke 3.33

Judas and Tamar (the mother of Pharez)

Mo was born already circumcised.
When the Prophet … was born he was already circumcised and his umbilical cord cut. … He was clean when he was born. p.46
Jesus wasn't.
When eight days were accomplished for the circumcising of the child, his name was called JESUS.  Luke 2:21

The circumcision of Jesus

Mo was endowed with the sexual power of forty men and had sex with all of his wives every night.
There is, however, an extra virtue the satisfaction of satisfying a wife's need. The Prophet … was given an abundance of this ability and would visit all of his wives in the same hour. Anas and his companions concluded that he had been given the power of thirty men. p.56
In the matter of sexual intercourse, the Prophet was endowed with the power of forty men. After having visited each wife he would take a purification bath before going to the next and said, "This is better and purer." p.56
Jesus never married (although he plans to get married someday) and had sex with no one.
 The marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready. Revelation 19:7
And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife. Revelation 21:9

Jesus' bride making herself ready


Posted by Steve Wells at 7/05/2012 10:25:00 AM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
8 comments:
 fenm said...
Ya know, it's funny how in #1 you say Muhammad is better because none of his ancestors had sex outside marriage, but in #3 you say, "Jesus never married [...] had sex with no one."
Well, yes, obviously if he never married he never had sex. Because if he had sex without the benefit of marriage, that would have been a bad thing, right? You said so in #1.
Seriously; reading this whole post was weird. Are you really this conservative and... traditional about sex? Jesus was bad because one of his ancestors was a prostitute, Muhammad is better because he married and had sex... God forbid anyone stray outside the norm and decide they want to have sex the way they want to, or [gasp] NOT have sex at all. And honestly? I haven't even scratched the surface of what bothers me about this post.
Thu Jul 05, 01:47:00 PM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Well gosh, fenm, I'm sorry to have upset you. But maybe it'd help to know that I wasn't being entirely serious. I have no real interest in the contest between Jesus and Mo. I think they both are full of shit. (And so are their followers.)
Thu Jul 05, 01:53:00 PM 2012 
 Stephen said...
What Steve said.
Also, my goodness, that Jesus was a well-endowed little tyke, and quite a hunk for an 8-day-old. I'm surprised the mohel isn't using his mouth to draw out the blood... maybe he hasn't gotten to that part yet (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohel). Is that his "father" he's looking at with a sort of "Whiskey-Tango-Foxtrot" expression?
Steve Weeks
Thu Jul 05, 03:18:00 PM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
Yeah, Steve, I think Jesus had Mo beat in that department, at least if that picture is accurate. But we'll never know for sure because no one ever saw Mo naked, not even his favorite wife, Aisha. It's a damned shame too, since that could settle the matter once and for all.
Thu Jul 05, 03:49:00 PM 2012 
 fenm said...
Steve Wells said:
"But maybe it'd help to know that I wasn't being entirely serious."
Not really? I mean, I'm not sure why this "contest" was based on such old fashioned, sexist (against both genders) ideas. Are you trying to make fun of them? I guess I just don't get the point of all of this.
Oh, wow, I just read the bit about Muhammad and his wives...
"and would visit all of his wives in the same hour.
[...]
After having visited each wife he would take a purification bath Pg 56.
So, with 13 wives, he spent less than five minutes with each, and that includes the time for "purification bath". So, really, what this means is he didn't believe in foreplay, and orgasmed in about a minute. It's interesting that this is assumed to have "satisfied" his wives when really all it probably did was leave them frustrated and having to... er, "take care of business" on their own.
Thu Jul 05, 05:42:00 PM 2012 
 No said...
40 little ladies in one hour pfffff... that's bagatelle in comparison to what Good ol' Chuck can deliver with his tool.
But do people turn this fact into a religion per se ?
Well... maybe I guess.
Thu Jul 05, 10:10:00 PM 2012 
 Hugh said...
You seem to assume that having part of one's penis missing is a good thing....
Sat Jul 07, 05:06:00 PM 2012 
 Steve Wells said...
No, Hugh, I don't assume that having part of one's penis missing is a good thing. But God sure as hell does -- as do, I suppose, Muslims, Jews, and Christians, who tend to agree with him.
Sat Jul 07, 06:03:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.





Dwindling In Unbelief



This Blog Linked From Here

This Blog
     
Linked From Here
    
 04 July 2012What the Bible Says About Alcohol
Recently, a woman who was convicted of drunk driving was sentenced to do some jail time -- and some Bible study. So it got me thinking about what the Bible has to say about alcohol.
Here's what I found.
Noah was the first drunk (and naked), just and perfect, preacher of righteousness. (God approves of drunk and naked preachers. Just don't look get caught looking at them. -- See Genesis 9:24-25)
Noah ... drank of the wine, and was drunken; and he was uncovered within his tent. Genesis 9:20-21
Noah was a just man and perfect ... and Noah walked with God. Genesis 6:9
The LORD said unto Noah ... thee have I seen righteous. Genesis 7:1
God ... saved Noah ... a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly. 2 Peter 2:5
Lot, the just and righteous, got drunk and impregnated his daughters. (Just and righteous fathers occasionally do that sort of thing.)
Lot ... dwelt in the mountain, and his two daughters with him ... and he dwelt in a cave, he and his two daughters. And the firstborn said unto the younger, Our father is old, and there is not a man in the earth to come in unto us ... Come, let us make our father drink wine, and we will lie with him, that we may preserve seed of our father. And they made their father drink wine that night: and the firstborn went in, and lay with her father; and he perceived not when she lay down, nor when she arose. And it came to pass on the morrow, that the firstborn said unto the younger, Behold, I lay yesternight with my father: let us make him drink wine this night also; and go thou in, and lie with him, that we may preserve seed of our father. And they made their father drink wine that night also: and the younger arose, and lay with him; and he perceived not when she lay down, nor when she arose. Thus were both the daughters of Lot with child by their father. Genesis 19:30-36
God ... delivered just Lot ... that righteous man. 2 Peter 2:4-8
God drinks wine and it makes him happy. It'll work for you too.
Wine ... cheereth God and man. Judges 9:13
Wine ... maketh glad the heart of man. Psalms 104:15
God is great. He cheers the young men with corn and the maids with wine.
How great is his goodness, and how great is his beauty! corn shall make the young men cheerful, and new wine the maids. Zechariah 9:17
God gave us plenty of wine, so I guess we should drink it.
God gave thee ... plenty of ... wine. Genesis 27:28
Don't drink water. Drink wine instead. (For your stomach's sake)
Drink no longer water, but use a little wine for thy stomach's sake. 1 Timothy 5:23
But don't drink the wine of Sodom and Gomorrah; it is the poison of dragons.
For their vine is of the vine of Sodom, and of the fields of Gomorrah: their grapes are grapes of gall, their clusters are bitter: Their wine is the poison of dragons. Deuteronomy 32:32-33
And don't drink wine in bowls.
Woe to them ... that drink wine in bowls. Amos 6:1-6
Or let any holy flesh touch wine or it won't be holy any more. (The flesh, I think, not the wine)
Thus saith the LORD of hosts; Ask now the priests concerning the law, saying, If one bear holy flesh in the skirt of his garment, and with his skirt do touch ... wine ... shall it be holy? Haggai 2:11-12
In case you were wondering, there will be wine in heaven.
I [Jesus] will not drink henceforth of this fruit of the vine, until that day when I drink it new with you in my Father's kingdom. Matthew 26:29
Here's a nice verse to quote at parties.
Drink thou also and let thy foreskin be uncovered. Habakkuk 2:16
If you get drunk and run out of wine, weep and howl.
Awake, ye drunkards, and weep; and howl, all ye drinkers of wine, because of the new wine; for it is cut off from your mouth. Joel 1:5
And ask Jesus' mom to help you.
And when they wanted wine, the mother of Jesus saith unto him, They have no wine. ... His mother saith unto the servants, Whatsoever he saith unto you, do it. ... Jesus saith unto them, Fill the waterpots with water. And they filled them up to the brim. And he saith unto them, Draw out now, and bear unto the governor of the feast. And they bare it. When the ruler of the feast had tasted the water that was made wine ... the governor  of the feast called the bridegroom, And saith unto him,Every man at the beginning doth set forth good wine; and when men have well drunk, then that which is worse: but thou hast kept the good wine until now. John 2:2-10
There is one time, though, when you shouldn't drink -- when going to church.  (If you do, God will kill you.)
Do not drink wine nor strong drink ... when ye go into the tabernacle of the congregation, lest ye die: it shall be a statute for ever throughout your generations.
Leviticus 10:9
Be sure to give God a quarter (or a third or a half) hin of wine for a drink offering now and then. (A hin is about 4 liters.)
Now this is that which thou shalt offer upon the altar ... the fourth part of an hin of wine for a drink offering. Exodus 29:38-40
And ye shall offer ... unto the LORD ... wine, the fourth part of an hin.Leviticus 23:12-13
His offering unto the LORD ... the fourth part of an hin of wine for a drink offering. Numbers 15:4-5
For a drink offering thou shalt offer the third part of an hin of wine. Numbers 15:7
Thou shalt bring for a drink offering half an hin of wine, for ... a sweet savour unto the LORD. Numbers 15:10
Their drink offerings shall be half an hin of wine. Numbers 28:14
David once gave a large bottle of wine to every man and woman in Israel.  (And since David did right in the eyes of the Lord, it must have been OK to drink it.)
David ... dealt to every one of Israel, both man and woman, ... a flagon of wine. -- 1 Chronicles 16:2-3
If you give money to God, he'll give you lots of wine.
Honour the LORD with thy substance ... and thy presses shall burst out with new wine. -- Proverbs 3:9-10
Some lips are like wine that goes down sweetly and makes sleeping people talk.
And the roof of thy mouth like the best wine for my beloved, that goeth down sweetly, causing the lips of those that are asleep to speak. Song of Solomon 7:9
If you see God flying over you blowing a trumpet, drink some wine and make a wine-like noise.
And the LORD shall be seen over them ... and the LORD God shall blow the trumpet ... and they shall drink, and make a noise as through wine. Zechariah 9:14-15
Sometimes God sends a perverse spirit that makes people act drunk, "as a drunken man staggereth in his own vomit."
The LORD hath mingled a perverse spirit in the midst thereof: they have caused Egypt to err in every work thereof, as a drunken man staggereth in his vomit. Isaiah 19:14
God will make everyone drunk and then "dash the fathers and the sons together."
Thus saith the LORD God of Israel, Every bottle shall be filled with wine ... I will fill all the inhabitants of this land ... with drunkenness. And I will dash them one against another, even the fathers and the sons together, saith the LORD: I will not pity, nor spare, nor have mercy, but destroy them. Jeremiah 13:12-14
God will force all nations to drink from his wine cup of fury. It will make them drunk and crazy; then he'll kill them all with a sword.
For thus saith the LORD God of Israel unto me; Take the wine cup of this fury at my hand, and cause all the nations, to whom I send thee, to drink it.
And they shall drink, and be moved, and be mad, because of the sword that I will send among them. Jeremiah 25:15-16
Thus saith the LORD of hosts, the God of Israel; Drink ye, and be drunken, and spue, and fall, and rise no more, because of the sword which I will send among you.
And it shall be, if they refuse to take the cup at thine hand to drink, then shalt thou say unto them, Thus saith the LORD of hosts; Ye shall certainly drink. Jeremiah 25:27-28
Babylon hath been a golden cup in the LORD's hand, that made all the earth drunken: the nations have drunken of her wine; therefore the nations are mad. Jeremiah 51:7
I will make them drunken ... saith the LORD. I will bring them down like lambs to the slaughter, like rams with he goats. Jeremiah 51:39-40
God will force the Babylonians to get so drunk that they die from alcohol poisoning.
I will make drunk her princes, and her wise men, her captains, and her rulers, and her mighty men: and they shall sleep a perpetual sleep, and not wake, saith the King, whose name is the LORD of hosts. Jeremiah 51:57
On the day of the Lord, God's sword will become drunk with blood. (If God's sword can get drunk with blood, it's probably OK for you to have a beer now and then.)
For this is the day of the Lord GOD of hosts, a day of vengeance, that he may avenge him of his adversaries: and the sword shall devour, and it shall be satiate and made drunk with their blood. Jeremiah 46:10
God will feed the bodies of the people he has killed to the birds and beasts, who will become drunk on their blood.
Thus saith the Lord GOD; Speak unto every feathered fowl, and to every beast of the field ... come; gather yourselves on every side to my sacrifice that I do sacrifice for you
... that ye may ... drink blood till ye be drunken, of my sacrifice which I have sacrificed for you. Ezekiel 39:17-19
Someday we'll all get drunk on the wine of the whore of Babylon's fornication. (So there's that to look forward to.)
With whom the kings of the earth have committed fornication, and the inhabitants of the earth have been made drunk with the wine of her fornication. Revelation 17:2
So drink or don't drink. It's your choice.
In either case, now you know what the Bible says about it.


Posted by Steve Wells at 7/04/2012 03:00:00 PM   Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest
Reactions:  
1 comment:
 Stephen said...
OK, Steve,
You owe me a new keyboard. I spewed coffee (no alcohol, no siree) when I read #11 on your list. :lol:
I wonder, though, what does one do if one has had one's foreskin surgically removed as required by the Lard:
Genesis 17:10 This is my covenant, which ye shall keep, between me and you and thy seed after thee; Every man child among you shall be circumcised.
Genesis 17:11 And ye shall circumcise the flesh of your foreskin; and it shall be a token of the covenant betwixt me and you.
You can't uncover what you don't have!
Then I went from amusement to amazement as I discovered that the writers of the old testament were experts in the now-forgotten medical specialty of Genital Cardiology:
Deuteronomy 10:16 Circumcise therefore the foreskin of your heart, and be no more stiffnecked.
-and-
Jeremiah 4:4 Circumcise yourselves to the LORD, and take away the foreskins of your heart, ye men of Judah and inhabitants of Jerusalem: lest my fury come forth like fire, and burn that none can quench it, because of the evil of your doings.
That is probably a life-saving procedure that should be taught in medical schools. :lol:
Steve Weeks
Wed Jul 04, 08:24:00 PM 2012 
Post a Comment
Newer Post Older Post Home 
 New Audiobook
New Audiobook
 Subscribe to our mailing list
 

 
   International SAB order

 
 
  
Drunk With Blood Audiobook:
Introduction


  Subscribe To
  Posts


 Atom   Posts
 RSS Feed
 Search This Blog
 
 powered by 
 A biased sample
A Challenge to Christians
How many has God killed? (Complete list and estimated total)
Islam: It's mostly about going to the bathroom
Blogging the Book of Mormon
50 reasons to be ashamed (and not a fan) of Jesus
Who has killed more, Satan or God?
God's Top 50 Killings in the Bible
Where do evil spirits come from?
David, a man after God's own heart (WWDD?)
The worth of a woman: The Bible vs. the Quran
208 ways to get yourself saved
Real men pee standing up
Everybody must get stoned
Where do evil spirits come from?
What does Jesus have written on his testicles?
Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?
Why Christian "Marriage" is Wrong
Is it wrong to burn people to death?
The Top 50 Bible Stories for kids
Which bits of the Bible are we still to believe?
 Blog Archive
 Blog Archive April (8) March (5) February (12) January (13) December (7) November (11) October (6) September (6) August (12) July (11) June (4) May (11) April (4) March (6) February (6) January (10) December (9) November (13) October (14) September (10) August (5) July (9) June (7) May (10) April (12) March (12) February (5) January (3) December (2) November (6) October (5) September (13) August (6) July (4) June (6) May (7) April (13) March (10) February (4) January (8) December (8) November (8) October (11) September (6) August (12) July (8) June (21) May (8) April (13) March (28) February (36) January (17) December (11) November (11) October (29) September (14) August (9) July (17) June (9) May (6) April (7) March (9) February (5) January (11) December (2) November (3) October (5) September (8) August (6) July (4) June (8) May (8) April (11) March (8) February (3) January (3) December (4) November (3) October (5) September (1) August (1) July (2) June (2) May (1) April (2) March (2) February (4) January (6) December (6) November (11) October (9) September (8) August (12) July (15) June (16)
 Contributors
Steve Wells
Philip Wells
 Site Meter
 Follow by Email
   
 
  


 
Watermark template. Powered by Blogger.