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This is Hard  
Posted: 15 March 2014 10:50 AM   [ Ignore ]   

   
 
musicalkate
Newbie
Rank
Joined  2014-03-15
 
  
 
So, yeah, hi. This isn’t going to be real professional, because I’m too exhausted to get into that sort of writing mood (I’m a huge writer, no matter what style of it. I guess right now I’m going for that journal type). And in advance, I apologize; I’ve always had trouble organizing my thoughts.
 
I’m Katie, age 14, daughter of @Mayerbabe on here.   We live in Utah, and my family resigned from the church a month ago.  Anyways, things have been extremely hard these last few weeks, and my mom suggested I get on here; she says it might help me.
 
I guess I’ll start with the back-story, ‘cause I feel it’s necessary to be understood.
Two months ago, to the day, I came forward to my parents, just finally fed up with the church and finally building the courage to admit that. It took me years to build up that courage, but I finally couldn’t handle any of the (in lack of words to come up with) crap the church kept piling on my shoulders.
Everything about it just seemed wrong. Everything about it seemed hypocritical. Just all my gut instincts were going off; something here was not right.
I had never had many problems with the church until about the year after my baptism. Even then, I don’t know that I fully recognized it myself; just that slowly I became more uncomfortable at church. Each week I dreaded it, and I always stressed over going. Each time I was there, I felt awful. I thought I wasn’t good enough, because I didn’t have the desire to believe in something my instincts were telling me were false, because I didn’t pray, read my scriptures, or do my dumb personal progress. Everyone always seemed so much better than me, having practically memorized the scriptures forwards and backwards, while I could hardly recall two scriptures stories.
 
Anyways, after voicing my concerns with the church, my Dad did some research throughout the night after I went to bed, and the next morning said he now knew it wasn’t true. We then stopped going to church and at first I felt so happy. I felt so relieved. My mom and I even tried going to another religious organization, just to see if this was for us (we decided it wasn’t; we don’t know where we’ll go with churches, or when).
 
Finally, after a few weeks, this huge change in our lives has finally caught up with me. I feel so lost, as if I have no idea what to do. I’ve been Mormon my whole life, and I’ve been drowned inside that church. Now, as I’m trying to move on with my life, I’m feeling so scared. 95% of my friends are Mormon, so I already have to deal with their pressure. Half the time, I’m so glad I left the church, the other half, I feel so scared, lost, guilty, and alone.
 
Now that I’m freed from their endless list of rules, I have no idea who I am. I don’t know what my true self would act like. I feel like I have no personality of my own and I have no idea how to find my true self. Nothing for me is sure anymore, nothing at all, and I don’t feel sure that whatever it is I’m doing is okay or not. I’m so used to being told in black and white, “This is good and will get you into Heaven, and this is a sin and will put you in Hell.”
 
 
And no matter what I do, I can’t escape any of the Mormon Junk. Everywhere I look, someone is discussing it, carting around the little churchy trinkets (personal progress books, clothing advertising the church, scriptures, et cetera). It’s all just a constant reminder of the choices I’ve made, and I can’t escape the flood of guilt that sets on me everyday. I mean, I even feel guilty for the thoughts that enter my head—I can’t stop my thoughts, but all my life I was taught that I had to have “perfect, clean thoughts, and to even think anything remotely bad was a sin.”
 
It’s just so many emotions fighting day after day. The former Mormon me is fighting with the current me, whom is trying to pull away. It’s an endless war of conflict with myself. And I can clearly see it’s not good for me. I’ve been so much more tired, so much more stressed out, so much more depressed, angry, and more often than not I feel like breaking down for one church-related reason or another.
 
UUUUUUUUUUGGGGGGHHHHH  JUST SOME WORDS LOCKED IN CAPS TO DISPLAY THE FRUSTRATION I CAN’T PROPERLY GET FORMED INTO WORDS OH MY GOSH JUST EVERYTHING IS WRONG AND MY THOUGHTS ARE STARS I CAN’T FATHOM INTO CONSTELLATIONS HEEEEEEELLLLLLPPPPP.
 
Sorry for this mindless chatter; I’m lost in a maze of my mind.
 
I guess, just some support would be nice, instead of the pressure from my friends. Does anyone have any advice on anything ex-Mormon? How do I get rid of the Mormon thoughts that have been baked into my mind? How do I find out who I truly am? How do I stop feeling terrible guilt for every little thing I do, or don’t do? I can’t escape Mormonism completely, I mean, heck, a friend even brought A HYMN BOOK TO SCHOOL. A HYMN BOOK, PEOPLE. How do I deal with all this Mormonism without feeling uncomfortable? I can’t be around anything to remind me of my previous life in the church without feeling sick to my stomach. I know, time will heal wounds, but I just kind of need something to help me cope with the pain while I heal, like an emotional pain killer. Any advice for how to deal with the pressure from my friends would be greatly appreciated. Teens are very different from adults, and sadly, a whole lot more judgmental, rude, and plain annoying.  If there are any other teens on this site, Jr. High to High School, I'd really like to get some support from you guys, and/or some advice.
 
*sigh* I can’t deal with everything in my life AND this, especially not now.
 
And if you found this post very confusing, I don’t blame you, turns out my mom posted one pointing out extremely clearly what I TRIED to explain. So you could read hers, if mine didn’t make much sense.
 
--A very confused girl waiting for I don’t know what as long as it helps reduce all these negative, damaging, feelings.


   


Posted: 15 March 2014 11:35 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]   

   
 
Avatar
josephs myth
Long Timer
RankRankRankRankRank
Joined  2008-01-25
 
  
 
 
Hi Katie,
 
Welcome to PostMo, it does get better with time but I'm going to try and address you and your situation right where you stand, okay?
 
You're a pioneer, a fourteen year old pioneer and a leader whether you like it or not.  Breathe deep and eat healthy foods this next year, you're probably going to need it.  Exercise a lot, get involved in stress reducing activities and try and stay very busy.  Journal and write a lot, think about starting your own blog and lean on the wise and most helpful humans that you can find.  I was at where you are without the Internet at about fourteen years of age and all of my family stayed in the LDS church. 
 
There are others that can help you learn more of the secrets of inspiration that you need. 
Joni Eareckson Tada Speaks at the 2013 NRB Convention
 
And oh yeah, wear ear plugs (snort) they can help!
 
 
 Signature
-Nothing beats a failure like a try 
_______________________________________________________________________
When you believe in things that you don’t understand, Then you suffer…
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ekkkD8HU944
          Stevie Wonder - Superstition Live


   


Posted: 15 March 2014 11:54 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]   

   
 
SuziQ
Sr. Member
RankRankRankRank
Joined  2010-02-26
 
  
 
<<<<  Katie  >>>>>     Hugs to you and I applaud you for  the wonderful courage you have shown.    I so wish I could have done that.  When I was your age I ignored the little voice in my head telling me that something wasn't right with the church.  I wouldn't have had the courage to do what you are doing. 
 
And so now I have terrible regrets that I raised my family in what I now see is a cult.
I have grandchildren who are being raised in it as well.  I so hope they will stand up  some day as you have and say NO MORE!
 
I've been following your mom's story and I'm so happy for your  family.  It is very difficult at first, but it truly does get better.  Best wishes to all of you!


   


Posted: 15 March 2014 12:20 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]   

   
 
Avatar
josephs myth
Long Timer
RankRankRankRankRank
Joined  2008-01-25
 
  
 
 
Not exactly like this video, I had som non-Mormons stand up for me when I needed it.
 
http://abcnews.go.com/WhatWouldYouDo/story?id=7093224
 
Girl forced into poligamy marriage - YouTube
 
 Signature
-Nothing beats a failure like a try 
_______________________________________________________________________
When you believe in things that you don’t understand, Then you suffer…
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ekkkD8HU944
          Stevie Wonder - Superstition Live


   


Posted: 15 March 2014 12:39 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]   

   
 
Sossy
Sr. Member
RankRankRankRank
Joined  2009-01-10
 
  
 
I'm so sorry your going through this Katie. I think most teens are trying to figure out who they are and how to navigate through their life, so that isn't just because you changed your belief system, but it could certainly intensify your anxiety level.
Even though the church isn't true, there are still some good things in it. I like to think of morality as being how we treat other people. "Do unto others", you know? Of course you have to include yourself as one of the people you need to treat kindly. Trying to find a balance between caring for myself and others is how I try to navigate my life. You might try using that as a starting point and then see where it takes you. You don't have to figure everything out today. Most of us spend our entire lives trying to discover ourselves.
Best wishes to you!


   


Posted: 15 March 2014 12:55 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]   

   
 
Avatar
DrW
Long Timer
RankRankRankRankRank
Joined  2009-01-12
 
  
 
Hello Katie,
 
Welcome to post mo.
 
You will no doubt be surprised to learn that I am in the process of writing a story based largely on what your mother posted about you (along with experiences of a few other teenage females I know who have had the courage to do what is right in spite of peer group pressure at an age when peer group acceptance is a very important aspect of life).
 
Let me explain. A story in the Friend entitled "Katie finds a way" is the subject of another thread on this board. When I read that story, I was a bit upset at the manipulation and not so subtle indoctrination it represented, especially when I thought about it being read to my young grandchildren.
 
So I decided to write and post a story entitled "Katie finds a better way". That story is completely drafted (1200 words) and just needs to be polished up a bit.
 
In this version of the story, Katie is a courageous 15 year old who essentially did what you did.  However, instead of ending with main character reading her scriptures as in the Friend version, the story I am writing ends with Katie and her family taking a long vacation together down here in Florida and visiting the Kennedy Space Flight Center, Disney World,  Universal Studios, and taking a cruise to the Caribbean with the money that they had formerly given to the corporation which is the LDS Church.
 
In my version of the story, Katie is a young musician (piano).  Because of her courage and her actions, the Katie in my story freed her whole family from the LDS Church and is now set to follow her dreams of attending college, and pursuing a career in music, without the pressure to find a husband and be a mother by age 21 or 22.  In my story, because of her actions, Katie's brothers are released from the cultural expectation of serving the two years of pointless drudgery known as an LDS mission.
 
So, Kate, imagine my amazement when I learned that the given name of the girl on whom I was largely basing my story turned out to be the same as that of the main character in the Friend story.
 
Anyway, I should have this opus finished this weekend. However, now that you have posted here, and your name just happens to Kate (Katie), I want to make sure that it is okay with you and your parents to post a story with the title "Katie finds a better way", since there really is such a Katie.  
 
This title (including the name Katie) links my story with the insensitive and even offensive Friend version, and it is a story that I could only hope my grown (TBM) children would have the courage to read to my (soon to be TBM) young grandchildren. 
 
If you or your parents would rather not have a slightly fictionalized version of your real story posted, I will certainly respect your wishes. 
 
 
And by the way, best wishes with your current situation. Things will get better. Possibly better than you ever imagined.
 


   


Posted: 15 March 2014 01:28 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]   

   
 
Avatar
DrW
Long Timer
RankRankRankRankRank
Joined  2009-01-12
 
  
 
 Katie,
 
To continue on a bit from the last post, when me and my family were thrown into a new and unfamiliar cultural situation, as when we went to live in Abu Dhabi, for example, we found that the best approach for coping wth the new situation (new country, new home, new language, new schools, new culture and new laws) was to relay on and help one another as a family. Our family motto, even today, as we number some 33 souls, is:
 
Family First - no matter what.
 
You are probably not the only one in your family right now who is having  feelings of dislocation and being suddenly set adrift. At th esame time however, your family is probably the best resource you have. They know what you are going through and you parents have "been there" where you are today, whether you realize it or not.
 
Your mother clearly had your best interests in mind, for example, when she suggested that you post here. My guess is that there are many more ways in which she can help you. Same with your father.
 
Take time to talk things over with them. Sit down to family meals together whenever possible. Go have adventures as a family on the weekends.
 
And most importantly, know this.  You now have the opportunity to build a worldview that is based on objective physical evidence, on science and on demonstrable fact - and not the tall tales, lies and lame excuses of a 19th century religious fraud, and his followers.
 
Read, study, work, and learn how nature and the world really function. With this knowledge, and the exerience you gain in acquiring it, you will be in the best position possible to make good decisions, do good things for the right reasons, and not be obliged to engage in massive self-deception in order to be happy.
 
 
 
 
 
 
  


   


Posted: 15 March 2014 01:34 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]   

   
 
musicalkate
Newbie
Rank
Joined  2014-03-15
 
  
 
DrW:
Hello Katie,
 
Welcome to post mo.
 
You will no doubt be surprised to learn that I am in the process of writing a story based largely on what your mother posted about you (along with experiences of a few other teenage females I know who have had the courage to do what is right in spite of peer group pressure at an age when peer group acceptance is a very important aspect of life).
 
Let me explain. A story in the Friend entitled "Katie finds a way" is the subject of another thread on this board. When I read that story, I was a bit upset at the manipulation and not so subtle indoctrination it represented, especially when I thought about it being read to my young grandchildren.
 
So I decided to write and post a story entitled "Katie finds a better way". That story is completely drafted (1200 words) and just needs to be polished up a bit.
 
In this version of the story, Katie is a courageous 15 year old who essentially did what you did.  However, instead of ending with main character reading her scriptures as in the Friend version, the story I am writing ends with Katie and her family taking a long vacation together down here in Florida and visiting the Kennedy Space Flight Center, Disney World,  Universal Studios, and taking a cruise to the Caribbean with the money that they had formerly given to the corporation which is the LDS Church.
 
In my version of the story, Katie is a young musician (piano).  Because of her courage and her actions, the Katie in my story freed her whole family from the LDS Church and is now set to follow her dreams of attending college, and pursuing a career in music, without the pressure to find a husband and be a mother by age 21 or 22.  In my story, because of her actions, Katie's brothers are released from the cultural expectation of serving the two years of pointless drudgery known as an LDS mission.
 
So, Kate, imagine my amazement when I learned that the given name of the girl on whom I was largely basing my story turned out to be the same as that of the main character in the Friend story.
 
Anyway, I should have this opus finished this weekend. However, now that you have posted here, and your name just happens to Kate (Katie), I want to make sure that it is okay with you and your parents to post a story with the title "Katie finds a better way", since there really is such a Katie.  
 
This title (including the name Katie) links my story with the insensitive and even offensive Friend version, and it is a story that I could only hope my grown (TBM) children would have the courage to read to my (soon to be TBM) young grandchildren. 
 
If you or your parents would rather not have a slightly fictionalized version of your real story posted, I will certainly respect your wishes. 
 
 
And by the way, best wishes with your current situation. Things will get better. Possibly better than you ever imagined.
 
 
 Well, I can assure you I was certainly surprised and pleased. "A Writer!" my mind screams. I enjoy writing myself, so seeing you are a writer was quite nice. 
 
And then the suprise doesn't stop there. I actually really do go by Katie, musicalkate is just a screen name. To make it even better, I actually am a pianist, I've been playing since I was six, and the goals and dreams by your character are almost exact to my own. 
 
 It's surprisingly accurate!
 
I would not mind at all if I were to be fictionalized (its a dream come true!), and my parents don't mind either. 
 
Thank you for your support and positivity, as well.  It makes me feel a whole lot better. 
 
Can't wait to read that story!
 
--Katie


   


Posted: 15 March 2014 01:38 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]   

   
 
Senses Fail
Newbie
Rank
Joined  2014-02-27
 
  
 
Hi katie! I am 14 years older than you, but I am going through the exact same feelings that you are. My wife is as well. I am very excited for you because you have discovered the truth and a path to a better life in your teenage years.
 
I ignored the problems I had with the church until I was 26. Would you like to know what that means? It means I judged people in highschool who weren't mormon. I made people feel bad, including people I looked at as my friends. After high school, I gave 2 years of my life to TSCC and told people in Japan that they would be happier if they did what I told them. When I came home I married a wonderful girl in the temple. This marriage was wonderful and I am so happy I found my wife, but there were a lot of members of my family and hers who couldn't come to the wedding. I just smiled at them and thought "too bad for them, they should be better mormons if they want to come to my wedding."
 
I could give you many other examples, but the point I am trying to get at is that I have a lot of guilt as well. I think we all do when we leave the church. How could we not when it has been pounded into our skulls week in and week out how we are supposed to act?
 
I live in SLC and everywhere I look I have mormons in my life. My neighbors, my coworkers, and my family. Not an hour goes by in my life where the church isn't shoved in my face in one way or another. It bothers me sometimes, but I have had to train myself to be ok with it. I have made my decision, and they have made theirs. They are still good people, and as long as they don't hassle me, I will live and let live. 
 
You have a wonderful opportunity as you go through high school. You get to be friends with everyone (if you want to) not just the mormons. You get to choose what kind of person you want to be - not because of what other people tell you how to act; not because you will feel guilty if you don't do what other people or "god" say; but because YOU want to be that person. You have yourself to live up to, and that is the best way to be. 
 
Your mother has helped me as I go through my struggles with her posts and support, and I am excited that you get to go through this adventure with your entire family. Mine still thinks I am mormon. You are braver than I, and I think you will find life so much more fulfilling as you explore the world, literature, music, religion, art, and humanity as you discover who you are. This journey will last the rest of your life, and when you look back at your struggles as a brave pioneer helping to get your own family out of mormonism, my guess is that you will be so happy that you went through it.
 
Thank you for your post. It helped me and I look forward to hearing more from you on this wonderful online community we are a part of. 


   


Posted: 15 March 2014 02:07 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]   

   
 
Avatar
Hitchen's Razor
Long Timer
RankRankRankRankRank
Joined  2013-02-11
 
  
 
Katie,
 
Welcome to Postmo!  I'm a bit older than you (OK, a lot, I'm 43), but I have a daughter who is nearly 14.  While our departure from the church wasn't as "overnight" as your parent's move, one of the factors in making that move was our kids and especially our daughter.  We didn't want them, and especially her, to be taught that unless they stuck to a certain mold, they wouldnt' be good enough. In lots of ways we're pretty lucky with where we live.  We have always had lots of non-mormon friends and so have our kids and it's easy for us to find lots of great people of all beliefs (or none) who are good people without the Mormon church.  That helps us understand that our kids are going to be just fine, despite what the church wants everyone to think, being a postmo (even one who has an occassional drink), doesn't lead down a road to destruction and misery - quite the contrary in our case.
 
I'll echo what others have said -- you've got a lot going on right now - you're a teenager, and with or without religion, this is a time in your life where it's very natural to start trying to figure out what type of person you are/want to be.  Lots of people go through this stage of their life without someone telling them exactly what to do and end up just fine, but those in the church in some ways have it a little easier.  If they do what they're told they fit into a mold and have a "place" within the church.  
 
The rest of the world gets to mold themselves and then find where they fit.  That takes a little more introspection, asking yourself "who am I fundamentally," but you'll be much better for asking the question and molding yourself - you'll also probably be less likely to wake up at the age of 43, have an existential crisis and need tons of anti-depressants to combat the feelings that you've wasted too many years of your life living the life someone else wanted you to live.
 
Best of luck to you and your parents! 
 Signature
I am not that photo, on my father’s mantle.  I won’t let the dust fall on my life.
-Dala, Good as Gold


   


Posted: 15 March 2014 02:18 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]   

   
 
Avatar
DrW
Long Timer
RankRankRankRankRank
Joined  2009-01-12
 
  
 
musicalkate:
DrW:
Hello Katie,
 
Welcome to post mo.
 
You will no doubt be surprised to learn that I am in the process of writing a story based largely on what your mother posted about you (along with experiences of a few other teenage females I know who have had the courage to do what is right in spite of peer group pressure at an age when peer group acceptance is a very important aspect of life).
 
Let me explain. A story in the Friend entitled "Katie finds a way" is the subject of another thread on this board. When I read that story, I was a bit upset at the manipulation and not so subtle indoctrination it represented, especially when I thought about it being read to my young grandchildren.
 
So I decided to write and post a story entitled "Katie finds a better way". That story is completely drafted (1200 words) and just needs to be polished up a bit.
 
In this version of the story, Katie is a courageous 15 year old who essentially did what you did.  However, instead of ending with main character reading her scriptures as in the Friend version, the story I am writing ends with Katie and her family taking a long vacation together down here in Florida and visiting the Kennedy Space Flight Center, Disney World,  Universal Studios, and taking a cruise to the Caribbean with the money that they had formerly given to the corporation which is the LDS Church.
 
In my version of the story, Katie is a young musician (piano).  Because of her courage and her actions, the Katie in my story freed her whole family from the LDS Church and is now set to follow her dreams of attending college, and pursuing a career in music, without the pressure to find a husband and be a mother by age 21 or 22.  In my story, because of her actions, Katie's brothers are released from the cultural expectation of serving the two years of pointless drudgery known as an LDS mission.
 
So, Kate, imagine my amazement when I learned that the given name of the girl on whom I was largely basing my story turned out to be the same as that of the main character in the Friend story.
 
Anyway, I should have this opus finished this weekend. However, now that you have posted here, and your name just happens to Kate (Katie), I want to make sure that it is okay with you and your parents to post a story with the title "Katie finds a better way", since there really is such a Katie.  
 
This title (including the name Katie) links my story with the insensitive and even offensive Friend version, and it is a story that I could only hope my grown (TBM) children would have the courage to read to my (soon to be TBM) young grandchildren. 
 
If you or your parents would rather not have a slightly fictionalized version of your real story posted, I will certainly respect your wishes. 
 
 
And by the way, best wishes with your current situation. Things will get better. Possibly better than you ever imagined.
 
 
 Well, I can assure you I was certainly surprised and pleased. "A Writer!" my mind screams. I enjoy writing myself, so seeing you are a writer was quite nice. 
 
And then the suprise doesn't stop there. I actually really do go by Katie, musicalkate is just a screen name. To make it even better, I actually am a pianist, I've been playing since I was six, and the goals and dreams by your character are almost exact to my own. 
 
 It's surprisingly accurate!
 
I would not mind at all if I were to be fictionalized (its a dream come true!), and my parents don't mind either. 
 
Thank you for your support and positivity, as well.  It makes me feel a whole lot better. 
 
Can't wait to read that story!
 
--Katie
 
 Katie,
 
Thanks for permission to post the story. Great to learn that you really are a musician. (I'm not really a writer, by the way.)
 
 The piano playing part of the story is based on one of my daughters, who would literally climb up on the piano bench and play little melodies she would make up as she went along, starting when she was three years old (my wife just confirmed her age at the time).  
 
She just had a natural talent including (we eventually learned) perfect pitch. She still teaches piano and has a long waiting list of students. 
 
 
When you think about it, the chances of a bright 14 or 15 year old Mormon female being able to play the piano are pretty good, and I was going for an aggregate character, so I definitely can't claim any clairvoyance. 
 
The story should be up by sometime on Monday (just found out I have to work this weekend). Hope you like it. 


   


Posted: 15 March 2014 03:08 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]   

   
 
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Elder OldDog
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We all have different perspectives...  Here's mine (also, you think YOU can go on and on and on?  Rookie!):

Your situation finds you cast adrift from what was formerly your life.  Well, almost completely.  See, you have confirmed to us that although you were "raised" mormon, you had, internally, opted out of following the entire party line.  Perhaps you weren't happy doing it, but you did, for a somewhat measurable period of time, lie to those around you regarding what was going on inside of you.  Meaning that you knew you didn't fit in, but you pretended to, in order to keep the peace.  This is a common dilemma in our dealings with family members, class members, co-workers, etc.; we sometimes have to pretend we're completely committed to what we think all the others of that particular group are supposed to be committed to.  I think you're going to find that this will be an oft repeated pattern in the lives of non-hermits.

What you've done is admit to the members of one group, Los Mormones, that all your prior involvement was faked, and that you no longer want to keep up the pretense.  (Imagine how hard your path would be if your parents had NOT come to agree with you!!!)  

So now besides being out of sorts with 95% of your friends and classmates, in that you reject what they espouse, you also have this looming deficit:  "Knowing what you don't believe in, but not having 'a plan' with which to replace it."

The Big Picture of what you will do with life will write itself, as in someday you will look back and it will all make some kind of sense.  But that doesn't help when it comes to the 'small picture'...  (As an aside, I see this as one of the things that keeps people pretending to be TBM.)  If all you know is how to be, or pretend to be, a mormon, what do you do when you decide NOT to pretend anymore?  

There are many ways to answer the above question, but it's my opinion that you have to come up with your own answers.  If you don't, if you decide to accept some other person's answer, then it's possible that you're exchanging one (for you) phoniness for another.  Mormonism works for a whole lot of people, and the mormon lifestyle apparently even works for a lot of people who don't have a testimony, again raising the issue of being able to tolerate 'comfortable' lies.  Also, I submit, and would vociferously defend, the proposition that there is nothing wrong with being raised mormon.  I have still have a soft spot in my heart for the MoTab Choir; "Come, Come Ye Saints" will forever elicit a certain heart tug; I feel a sort of affection for The Elders when I see them on the streets; I'm glad I never learned to smoke or drink hard liquor; I'm glad that I don't curse like a sailor; I'm happy to have been directed to seek out all that is good; and best of all, having learned to respect my fellow man, I can still fake that quality!

But at this juncture, I think you're very much looking at the 'little picture,' the one that deals with the life of a 14 female living in UT who, to 95% of her age group cohort, just sprouted horns and a tail.  How does that girl now live a calm, contented life?

Wouldn't it be grand if Walt Disney Pictures could write your future script?  But probably not much chance of that happening.  Nor, hopefully, will Stephen King write your high school script <shudder!>  How about Matt Groening or Seth MacFarlane?  How cool would that be?  (Turanga Leela!!)

At your stage of life, pretty much all you can do is react to what comes down the pike; in a word, you're stuck being "Reactive" because that's about all people without a steady, sufficient income can do.  But at least you've got a mother and father who are on your side.

Maybe there will be some in your immediate friendship circle who won't condemn you (despite, no doubt, their parents' desires that they do so, lest they be similarly tainted with "Kate-itis"!!  Oh, the horror!!)  If they all turn their backs on you, then it's going to be the shits, man!  I sincerely don't know what I would have done as a 14 year old if all my friends had turned their backs on me!  

There's a put down that has never gone out of popularity among the bullying crowd:  "It sucks to be you!"  And to be honest, I have on rare occasion looked in the mirror and uttered that phrase.  We all want a life of skittles and beer, but I'm certain that the other adults on this site, over a certain age, will tell you that even with downer episodes of their lives, it's been a good ride.

I sincerely believe that you have to do your own rewrite on the script of your life and that because of your parents it's not going to be as hard as it could have been.  What you're looking at is getting through high school within a population that looks down on non-members and apostates.  From what your mom has revealed, you're from an upper level income family, which is going to be a bit of a shield.  You're White & Delightsome, so another plus.  You come across as intelligent, well read, logical, hopeful and engaged.  There is nothing wrong with being scared at what you'll face over the next few years from your TBM classmates, but there are ways to survive.  I think one useful survival trait would be to emphasize how little you know about the world, rather than to emphasize how wrong you know mormonism to be.  Don't be an apostate missionary.

Very few people have life its ownself by the tail.  There are literally billions of people who would trade places with you.  Accentuate the positive, eliminate the negative.  You don't have to prove to anyone that your path is right for you; it's only necessary that you know it.  Decide what your "Prize" is and keep your focus on that Prize!  All you need is one friend, one good high school friend, and it'll be a breeze.  And now that I think about it, even just a good 'computer' friend might suffice! 

   


Posted: 15 March 2014 08:30 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]   

   
 
quietlydifferent
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Getting out at 14 is really impressive. I was a missionary before I really started my way out. The fact that you are examining things like this already bolds well for your future. It is a good reason why you shouldn't be too concerned with figuring out who you want to be. 
 
Don't worry too much about finding your true self. You get to, at least partially, choose who that is. Sure, you have genetic predispositions and enviornmental factors are a big part of what makes you you but choice is the part you should concern yourself with. What kind of a person do you want to be? What would your concept of an ideal person do? These are the kinds of questions that will help you figure out what to do. Stop asking WWJD and start asking WSID(what should I do). It is up to you to determine what qualities matter to you. Sure, heroes and role-models are great but only as far as they resonate with what you admire and think/feel is good. What kind of person do you enjoy being around? Why? What makes someone admirable? The answers are different for different people and that is okay. It is okay to be different. If the path you choose isn't walked by that many people it is fine and if it is a common one that is fine as well. Do what makes you happy and be what you want to be.
 
Examine everything. Explore. Be smart about it but have fun.


   


Posted: 15 March 2014 09:30 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]   

   
 
zenzombie
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First let me say that I admire your courage and honesty. Your story touched me and reminded me of my own period of identity deconstruction, not knowing who I was or what was real. It was terrifying but I wouldn't trade it because it shaped who I am today and made me a more empathic person. I know it can feel deeply dark and lonely at times but those times will pass and can even be your teacher. 

   


Posted: 17 March 2014 05:02 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]   

   
 
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DrW
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DrW:
musicalkate:
DrW:
Hello Katie,
 
Welcome to post mo.
 
You will no doubt be surprised to learn that I am in the process of writing a story based largely on what your mother posted about you (along with experiences of a few other teenage females I know who have had the courage to do what is right in spite of peer group pressure at an age when peer group acceptance is a very important aspect of life).
 
Let me explain. A story in the Friend entitled "Katie finds a way" is the subject of another thread on this board. When I read that story, I was a bit upset at the manipulation and not so subtle indoctrination it represented, especially when I thought about it being read to my young grandchildren.
 
So I decided to write and post a story entitled "Katie finds a better way". That story is completely drafted (1200 words) and just needs to be polished up a bit.
 
In this version of the story, Katie is a courageous 15 year old who essentially did what you did.  However, instead of ending with main character reading her scriptures as in the Friend version, the story I am writing ends with Katie and her family taking a long vacation together down here in Florida and visiting the Kennedy Space Flight Center, Disney World,  Universal Studios, and taking a cruise to the Caribbean with the money that they had formerly given to the corporation which is the LDS Church.
 
In my version of the story, Katie is a young musician (piano).  Because of her courage and her actions, the Katie in my story freed her whole family from the LDS Church and is now set to follow her dreams of attending college, and pursuing a career in music, without the pressure to find a husband and be a mother by age 21 or 22.  In my story, because of her actions, Katie's brothers are released from the cultural expectation of serving the two years of pointless drudgery known as an LDS mission.
 
So, Kate, imagine my amazement when I learned that the given name of the girl on whom I was largely basing my story turned out to be the same as that of the main character in the Friend story.
 
Anyway, I should have this opus finished this weekend. However, now that you have posted here, and your name just happens to Kate (Katie), I want to make sure that it is okay with you and your parents to post a story with the title "Katie finds a better way", since there really is such a Katie.  
 
This title (including the name Katie) links my story with the insensitive and even offensive Friend version, and it is a story that I could only hope my grown (TBM) children would have the courage to read to my (soon to be TBM) young grandchildren. 
 
If you or your parents would rather not have a slightly fictionalized version of your real story posted, I will certainly respect your wishes. 
 
 
And by the way, best wishes with your current situation. Things will get better. Possibly better than you ever imagined.
 
 
 Well, I can assure you I was certainly surprised and pleased. "A Writer!" my mind screams. I enjoy writing myself, so seeing you are a writer was quite nice. 
 
And then the suprise doesn't stop there. I actually really do go by Katie, musicalkate is just a screen name. To make it even better, I actually am a pianist, I've been playing since I was six, and the goals and dreams by your character are almost exact to my own. 
 
 It's surprisingly accurate!
 
I would not mind at all if I were to be fictionalized (its a dream come true!), and my parents don't mind either. 
 
Thank you for your support and positivity, as well.  It makes me feel a whole lot better. 
 
Can't wait to read that story!
 
--Katie
 
 Katie,
 
Thanks for permission to post the story. Great to learn that you really are a musician. (I'm not really a writer, by the way.)
 
 The piano playing part of the story is based on one of my daughters, who would literally climb up on the piano bench and play little melodies she would make up as she went along, starting when she was three years old (my wife just confirmed her age at the time).  
 
She just had a natural talent including (we eventually learned) perfect pitch. She still teaches piano and has a long waiting list of students. 
 
 
When you think about it, the chances of a bright 14 or 15 year old Mormon female being able to play the piano are pretty good, and I was going for an aggregate character, so I definitely can't claim any clairvoyance. 
 
The story should be up by sometime on Monday (just found out I have to work this weekend). Hope you like it. 
 
Katie,
 
Here is a link to the story: "Katie Finds a Better Way" . 


   


Posted: 17 March 2014 09:28 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 15 ]   

   
 
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Howdy, Katie!  
 
Welcome, welcome, WELCOME, Shugah!  You are among friends here; those who have or ARE going through the same things.  It's quite nice to have a young person among our ranks!  Well, perhaps I should say a minor person!  
 
...And you can say/type "crap" to your heart's content!!  The profanity filters catch the more "salty" [no pun intended] words.  But that one seems to be a favorite with PostMoes!
 
I just wanted to jump in here with my own [never-mo] welcome and suggest to you that you try to just breathe... Breathe in calm... Breathe out anxiety.  There are heartsongs here that will bring you to tears of joy!  Let them flow!  It's washing away all of the crap you've been fed up until now!  If you're around your "friends" from TSCC [the so-called church] and all they can do is talk about ward or stake activities or who got their mission call or whatever claptrap has their attention at the moment... Just smile at them and take a deep breath and let it out.  Knowing, all the while, that you don't fall into that mentality any longer and are happier for it!  
 
You might find us oldsters a little boring... A LOT cranky... and sometimes ranting.  It is, from my experience, harmless.  But there are also a lot of cyberhugs here for you... And plenty of space to do a little ranting of your own!
 
Namaste. 
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Posted: 18 March 2014 06:07 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 16 ]   

   
 
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Welcome Kaite
 
I hope that you will find help on these boards like many of us have.
 
It's not always easy....but be happy that your family is with you on this journey. I hope that your friends will treat you with respect.  
 
Here are some of my thoughts on questions you asked.......
 
  How do I get rid of the Mormon thoughts that have been baked into my mind?
 This is a hard one for a lot of us. It's who we are... You have been mormon for 14 years. I was mormon for 36... It's not always easy to not "think mormon". I think it just takes time...  The hardest thing I think is what you also asked about....
 How do I stop feeling terrible guilt for every little thing I do, or don’t do?
 This is a good question. And one that for me has been hard. The guilt is the biggest thing that upsets me with the church. It's what I am worried about with my kids. I don't want them to grow up thinking less of them selves because of the guilt. I think as time goes on, you can learn to let things go. If I feel guilty about something, I stop myself right there and ask myself why? Is it something that is wrong as a human or something that is only wrong as a Mormon.  
  
How do I find out who I truly am?   
This is a deep and personal question. You find out who you are as you live and grow. For many years while I was a TBM, I did certain things and acted a certain way...because it was who I was. And though it made me feel bad cause I was not a perfect mormon. It was who I am.  
Here's an example.... I am a person of freedom.  I do not like having people tell me what to do or how to think. I have always been that way. So when I found out about the church...it helped me to leave because I never liked being told to shave, or cut my hair. Told that I can't watch an R rated movie, or go out on Sunday. I would try to follow those things....but I would still do them from time to time. So that is something that I have learned about myself now. That I enjoy being free to choose for myself. And not have someone else choose for me.
 
 How do I deal with all this Mormonism without feeling uncomfortable?
 This was a big issue for me. It took me a while to tell people about my unbelief. (well my wife told them all not me lol)  and I was worried about it. And I felt strange going to Sacrament Meeting with my family. In a blue dress shirt and no garments. But as I have thought more about it. I don't believe what they believe. And that's fine. In the church everyone has to think the same. And that's not right. Just hold on to what you believe. 
 
 
 
Wish I could say it will all be easy. But at your age, those who are older will think you are just following your parents, or that you don't know enough to not believe. Just ignore them. That's all you can do.
 
Keep smiling! Keep your chin up!
 
As I have seen on here before, things will get better. You just have to move past the phase you are in. A that could be a few days, or a few months.  Only time will tell. Lean on your family!
 
Best of Luck!
 
Wg 
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5. To lose clarity or coherence of thought or expression.


   


Posted: 18 March 2014 01:49 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 17 ]   

   
 
Tincan
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Elder Olddog's post is amazing, I recommend reading that and thinking it over a few times at least. 
 
Even if you have not been in mormonism for long, it has spun things on you that will affect you for years and years. Mormonism teaches you to constantly think you have what you need and want, when you do not. It tells you it will bring you happiness but you will get mostly lower self-esteem from the gospel. It tells you that you have the truth and to get familiar with it when the truth is a slippery and constantly new thing. It makes you convince yourself that God's words are comforting when they are vague and slip away, even when you catch inspiration you need to keep going and keep trying to catch it over and over again when you ignore that what you need is already on you. You've been taught to ignore what you already have and think you have what you not to deceive yourself. It is a radical change to step out of this. You have a greed, a constant hole inside you that needs to be filled. They put that hole there so you'd be dependent on them. Your mind tells you that these vague feelings are good. It makes you grasp illusion, not in just knowledge, but in feeling as well.
You will find your life will gain more clarity whatever path you take away from mormonism, that life will become more real and not just a shell for the afterlife. So here is my advice, live your life however you want, and accept the holes you've been told are not there, and find the holes that have been given the illusion of filling. You will find more of these the more you leave mormonism. Give yourself the care mormonism didn't, if you know the real feelings that mormons can insecurely pretend to have, you will be like a mountain- immovable by their pestering- neither reactionary, aggressive, self-hurtingly passive, or defensive.
 
- Mormonism taught you to love in some ways, but it also told you to guilt and shame yourself for thoughts and actions. Try to be easy and accepting of yourself, start out very small, just accept things that are little when you notice yourself doing it. You will find it easier over time. You will also find being kind to others is easier as well. This act of love will make the insecurities of those around you obvious and they will have less influence and control over you. You will also have given yourself enough care in going through the process that you will simultaneously be able to empathize with them even more caringly because you gave yourself that when you were like them.
 
- Mormonism gave you a big community and friends, which is a good thing. It also tends to give you shallow friends that will naturally not accept you for who you are when it comes to mormonism, as a mormon or an exmormon. If you make one real friend that understands you and grows with you, accepts you for your behavior and qualities even if you do not know what those are, then it will be much better than all of the big community mormon friends you could ever have. They are accepting something deeper, that which all those outside things stem from, pulling you up by the roots and holding you to their heart rather than touching a leaf.  
 
The list goes on. There's a reason organizations like mormonism try to recruit people when they are at their weakest and going through terrible things, they can't sell something to someone who is content with themselves.
Idk, these are all things I am learning and are individual to me, you will find what best works for you in time.  
 
Also have you talked to your family about ways to be away from all these mormons?  


   


Posted: 21 March 2014 12:19 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 18 ]   

   
 
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Hi Katie! Welcome to PostMo! You're definitely not alone in this struggle. I'm 17 and I'm still trying to work through some residual feelings of anger and frustration, and then on top of that getting tired of all the Mormon stuff all around me, like you said. (I stopped wanting to believe 9 months ago, but knew it wasn't true 3 months ago.)
 
It really is a process, and I know that when I was 14 I wouldn't be as ready to deal with this situation as I am now. Make sure you are kind to yourself, it takes a while to really find out who you are and what you believe.
 
Also, be extremely grateful that your parents were so open minded about it. When I went to my parents they didn't care about the problems I was having, and the historical facts I had found. I am the only one in my family who isn't a devoted Mormon, and on top of that I am one of the few atheists at my Utah school, leading to those of feelings of isolation.
 
I really relate to the things you said about all your friends being mostly Mormon and they never stop talking about those things. It takes up such a big part of their lives it seems that's all they can talk about sometimes. There's not really a solution to that unfortunately, but I've become much closer to my non-Mormon friends since this big change in belief. I don't know if that would be an option for you, but it's always nice to be surrounded by people with the same beliefs, which is hard in Utah...
 
Don't give up, over time you will continue to learn more about yourself and what you truly believe, rather than what the church tells you to believe. Everyone else has given some great advice, that's why I love the PostMormon forum. I hope everything starts getting better! Stay strong!!


   


            
 
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Response to essay on polygamy  
Posted: 21 March 2014 05:38 AM   [ Ignore ]   

   
 
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For your consideration, here's MormonThink's reponse to the church's essay on Plural Marriage which we just finished up.  I've used some insights gained from some of the posters here - thanks all.
http://www.mormonthink.com/essays-plural-marriage.htm


   


Posted: 21 March 2014 06:52 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]   

   
 
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WinstonSmith
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Joined  2011-09-26
 
  
 
MormonThink:
For your consideration, here's MormonThink's reponse to the church's essay on Plural Marriage which we just finished up.  I've used some insights gained from some of the posters here - thanks all.
http://www.mormonthink.com/essays-plural-marriage.htm
 
Great Response!!!
 
My great, great, great grandmother was married to BY in Nauvoo---they had no children---she left BY and married my great, great, great grandfather in Utah a few years later.  He wasn't a member at the time, but later joined the church and BY sent him on a mission.
 
It seems that no animosity existed between her and BY.
 
My Mom passed a few years ago, and Dad has remarried.  As far as we know they haven't been Sealed, but that being said they may have pulled a JS and not told us.  
 
My sister in nice to my Dad's new wife, but deep down I think she feels like my Dad has betrayed my Mom. My Dad knows of my disaffection with TSCC.  My Dad's wife has grown kids, most of which are non-card carrying members. There is no reason for them to include us in their Sealing.  They severed a Temple Mission a few years ago outside the country and I would not be suprised if my Dad took his Polygamist wife then and there.
 
I am very glad that My Dad found someone to share the rest of this life with (she is a great person for him) and I believe that even if he was sealed to his 2nd wife, it is irrelevant.  The thought of my Mom having a sister wife just makes me want to vomit.  I physically feel ill in the thought---maybe it is the Spirit testifying to me how evil and perverse polygamy really is.
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“Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones.”  -Marcus Aurelius


   


Posted: 21 March 2014 11:27 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]   

   
 
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Silver Girl
Long Timer
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Joined  2008-02-01
 
  
 
WinstonSmith:
MormonThink:
For your consideration, here's MormonThink's reponse to the church's essay on Plural Marriage which we just finished up.  I've used some insights gained from some of the posters here - thanks all.
http://www.mormonthink.com/essays-plural-marriage.htm
 
Great Response!!!
 
My great, great, great grandmother was married to BY in Nauvoo---they had no children---she left BY and married my great, great, great grandfather in Utah a few years later.  He wasn't a member at the time, but later joined the church and BY sent him on a mission.
 
It seems that no animosity existed between her and BY.
 
My Mom passed a few years ago, and Dad has remarried.  As far as we know they haven't been Sealed, but that being said they may have pulled a JS and not told us.  
 
My sister in nice to my Dad's new wife, but deep down I think she feels like my Dad has betrayed my Mom. My Dad knows of my disaffection with TSCC.  My Dad's wife has grown kids, most of which are non-card carrying members. There is no reason for them to include us in their Sealing.  They severed a Temple Mission a few years ago outside the country and I would not be suprised if my Dad took his Polygamist wife then and there.
 
I am very glad that My Dad found someone to share the rest of this life with (she is a great person for him) and I believe that even if he was sealed to his 2nd wife, it is irrelevant.  The thought of my Mom having a sister wife just makes me want to vomit.  I physically feel ill in the thought---maybe it is the Spirit testifying to me how evil and perverse polygamy really is.
 
Is mormonthink down right now?  I was not able to get through with either of the above links, nor when I tried typing it straight into my browser.
 
Anyone else here tried recently or know what is up?
 
Thanks
 
SG


   


Posted: 21 March 2014 11:55 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]   

   
 
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MormonThink
Sr. Member
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Joined  2012-11-28
 
  
 
 
 
Is mormonthink down right now?  I was not able to get through with either of the above links, nor when I tried typing it straight into my browser.
 
Anyone else here tried recently or know what is up?
 
Thanks
 
SG
 
Down for me too - happens sometimes.  Probably problem with provider.  We'll contact them if it remains that way.
 


   


Posted: 21 March 2014 12:15 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]   

   
 
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Silver Girl
Long Timer
RankRankRankRankRank
Joined  2008-02-01
 
  
 
MormonThink:
 
 
Is mormonthink down right now?  I was not able to get through with either of the above links, nor when I tried typing it straight into my browser.
 
Anyone else here tried recently or know what is up?
 
Thanks
 
SG
 
Down for me too - happens sometimes.  Probably problem with provider.  We'll contact them if it remains that way.
 
 
Thanks.


   


            
 
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