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Elder Archuleta  
Posted: 20 December 2011 09:50 PM   [ Ignore ]   

   
 
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When I was (much) younger, I was told that the Osmonds did not serve missions because they were too recognizable and that they were doing plenty of good "missionary work" through their music. I was therefore somewhat surprised to see Jimmy Osmond in the MTC when i was there.
 
Now it has been announced that David Archuleta is going on a mission. I suppose he does not do as much "good" as the Osmonds. 
 
For the record, I recognize his name, I know that he was on American Idol (which I never watch), but I couldn't pick him out of a line-up if my life depended on it.
 
So just how does "preferential" treatment get doled out by the church? Who decides? What are the criteria?
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Posted: 20 December 2011 10:18 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]   

   
 
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All decisions of that nature, for that matter ALL decisions regarding LD$ Inc. requires a great deal of long thoughtful, prayerful fasts by the upper management...
 
On the outside....
 
 
On the inside----
 
Whatever fattens the bottom line of the ledger book.
 
 
 
 
 
In the case of the Osmonds, there were 6 of them all throwing coin at the church coffers, plus the parents, who got a piece of the performance pie.
 
Archuleta, meh, shopping malls don't pay 3rd rate singers all that much, so it's a mission for that one, it is... 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
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Posted: 20 December 2011 10:52 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]   

   
 
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They'll send him to Paris, because that's where the mormon elite and suddenly popular go, like Elizabeth Smart. Didn't Romney go to France? France is like a refinement school for mormons in the media. 

   


Posted: 21 December 2011 12:53 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]   

   
 
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They send them to France because they think with their "known" faces...they will bring in more converts then the average Joe/Josie....
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”I’ve begun worshiping the sun for a number of reasons. First of all, unlike some other gods I could mention, I can see the sun. It’s there for me every day. And the things it brings me are quite apparent all the time: heat, light, food, a lovely day. There’s no mystery, no one asks for money, I don’t have to dress up, and there’s no boring pageantry. And interestingly enough, I have found that the prayers I offer to the sun and the prayers I formerly offered to God are all answered at about the same 50-percent rate.” George Carlin


   


Posted: 21 December 2011 12:53 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]   

   
 
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Read the first comment to the article...
 
"I was there in that crowd and it was amazing to see how fast people jumped to their feet! And what faith and courage he had to announce that. It's hard in today's world where everyone is telling you who to be or how to live your life. But David Archuleta took the time to ask God what was best for his life. I'm so proud of him for doing what he believe in! He's an incredible person!"
 
 
 
WTF is so courageous and faith promoting about announcing in downtown SLC that you'll serve an LDS mission??  OF COURSE, the crowd will go nuts. 
 
I wonder if he'll enjoy being told who to be and how to live his life 
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Posted: 21 December 2011 01:16 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]   

   
 
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I think TBMs generally confuse "excitement" (or any strong emotion, for that matter) with "faith-promoting experiences." My last RS president announced that she was going to have triplets (already had 4 kids under 7) and women were calling that "a faith-promoting experience." I am generally suspicious of TBMs using that phrase. grin I am sure he will have a good mission, probably in a first world country with a loyal fan-base and the ability to publicize his righteousness. I guess there are worse things a b-list celebrity can do with their time though. 

   


Posted: 21 December 2011 03:52 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]   

   
 
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Highly doubt he'll do much on-the-ground tracting.
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”I’ve begun worshiping the sun for a number of reasons. First of all, unlike some other gods I could mention, I can see the sun. It’s there for me every day. And the things it brings me are quite apparent all the time: heat, light, food, a lovely day. There’s no mystery, no one asks for money, I don’t have to dress up, and there’s no boring pageantry. And interestingly enough, I have found that the prayers I offer to the sun and the prayers I formerly offered to God are all answered at about the same 50-percent rate.” George Carlin


   


Posted: 21 December 2011 05:20 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]   

   
 
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I saw that clip on FB all day!  My TBM friends are going nuts over him.
 
 
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OCTOBER CONFERENCE
"Past, Present, and Possibilities"
Oct. 18-20, 2013










 


Financial Report for 2011 to Date

Financial Report for 2010 to Date

Financial Report for 2009

Twin Falls Newspaper Article

Twin Falls Billboard

Financial Report for 2009 to Date




The Enemies of Reason - Richard Dawkins
[Sound Thinking]

Glad You Asked! The Garden of Eden
[Peep Stone!]

Native American DNA
[Post-Mormon Mag.]



Salt Lake Events the week before christmas
[Salt Lake City Po...] 
SF Bay Area Monthly Gathering SUNDAY (12/1)
[San Francisco Bay...] 
December 1st- Southern Utah PostMormon Lecture Series
[Southern Utah Pos...] 
We’re still here...
[East Tennessee Po...] 
Utah County CALM meetup for November
[Calm of Utah Coun...] 
Joseph's Changing Myth with Grant Palmer -- Nov 6 -- 7pm -- SLC Library
[Salt Lake City Po...] 
November Meet Up
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SF Bay Area Monthly Gathering SUNDAY (11/3)
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November 3rd- Southern Utah PostMormon Lecture series
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October Meet-up
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Book of Mormon Tories
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Glad You Asked! The Garden of Eden
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Church Authorities, Postmormons Find Common Ground
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Church Authorities, Postmormons Find Common Ground
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Resignation Letter to My Family
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Resignation Letter to My Family
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Resignation Letter to My Family
In search of Truth

Carolina PostMo Night: “The Master
Swearing Elder

Washington D.C. Post-Mormon Lunch - August 28
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Resignation Letter to My Family
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Financial Report for 2011 to Date
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Resignation Letter to My Family
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Financial Report for 2011 to Date
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Financial Report for 2011 to Date
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Osmonds on Joy Behar.  I’m getting douche chills.  
Posted: 30 August 2011 02:20 AM   [ Ignore ]   

   
 
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Posted: 30 August 2011 02:27 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]   

   
 
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Joy: "So I've always wondered what's up with the magic under wear. Are you wearing it now?" Donny: "Yes I am." (A little to enthusiastically) Joy: "So what's up with them? Will you tell me about the magic underwear?" Donny: I'd rather not. It's. Juuuuuuuust sooooo soooooo so sacred. If you could just go through the temple you'd understand. That was just one of the many eye gouging inducing moments in the interview. 

   


Posted: 30 August 2011 04:01 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]   

   
 
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Donny: "Yes Joy it was so sacred. In fact I am old enough to remember going through the temple when things were the way they were supposed to be, and pretending to slit my throat or slash my bowels if I ever had a conversation like this with anyone." Joy: "OMG, so who came up with such horrendous actions if you were to talk about this stuff." Donny: "Well, for many years we thought it was our founding prophet Joseph Smith, but then many realized that he was too busy chasing skirt, marrying youngsters and screwing his brood of spiritual wives that he had to have found this whole ceremony elsewhere and then we had it. The Masons. We all still find the temple ceremony to be profoundly sacred even though it was stolen from another discriminatory and secret cult er a sect." Joy: "That is fascinating. Thank god I don't have to wear that underwear!"
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Posted: 30 August 2011 05:00 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]   

   
 
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I watched that interview.  I thought that Joy was very antagonistic.  The question about magical underwear was sensationalistic and self serving on her part because 1) she knew it would make them uncomfortable 2) she asked it anyway.  If she did her homework at all, she knew it was a disrespectful question to ask.  If she didn't do her homework, then she's not very good at her job.
The Osmonds were in turn antagonistic and defensive.  But I believe that as the host, she could have created a warmer and more friendly tone and she decided not to.  Maybe she got some good ratings with her approach, but my respect for her went down a bit.  
I'm not a Donny and Marie fan and I normally like Joy quite a bit.  But I thought that her approach lacked tact and I think she could have done more to take the high road. 
 
Obviously we know that garments are bullshit and we also know that Mormons think they're sacred.  I don't think the question was appropriate for the interview.
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Posted: 30 August 2011 02:39 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]   

   
 
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She might as well asked why some others would wear a burkha, or a yarmulka or sheitel, or a kitl.  She doesn't have to believe it but if you're a host, it's simply rude to make it the topic of discussion.  Religious garments are nothing new, but you're not interesting on your own so let's talk about your underwear.
 
Donny should have asked her about her girdle or ridiculous shoes that cause corns.
 
Of all the things that I could find offensive about the LDS faith, garments or calling garments sacred, ain't one of them.  Religious clothing is a non-issue to me.   Clothing as symbolism is as old as the human race.
 
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 My Missionary boyfriend and I need your advice!
by NOMOREMO
Why dress up for a 'day of rest'?
by Tessa
TBM Rantings on Facebook about Utah's ban on gay marriage being overturned
by Tessa
Mo Tab Pres. says, "We are not proselytizing through our music at all."
by Tessa
Great Read - How A Federal Judge In Utah Adeptly Dismantled All Of The Arguments Against Marriage Equality
by Schyzm
Post/Ex Mormons in Newsweek Magazine!!!
by Baroque Dust
5% tithing
by Mrs. Jello Salad
Tithing - the Twelve voted to exempt themselves in 1845
by Quartersawn
I am speechless…
by Quartersawn
Interesting blog on the late Gentile Utah writer John D. Fitzgerald, he depicted Mormon Utah for many
by ldshistorybuff
Further proof 'the brethren' are really inspired
by WanderingGeek
Noah's Ark Found....or not
by kinderhooker
Utah's Amendment 3 Struck down!!!!
by Tessa
Anyone care to comment?
by Tessa
19th Wife of The Prophet Rulon Jeffs Gets The Prophet
by josephs myth
Toying With Our Emotions - Newsweek
by josephs myth
–Off Topic– WARNING: Content Contains Sexual Innuendo
by WinstonSmith
As I search...
by Tessa
Lamanites and Jewish practices?
by Tessa
Man UP Tommy, Boyd and buddies...
by WanderingGeek 

  
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OCTOBER CONFERENCE
"Past, Present, and Possibilities"
Oct. 18-20, 2013










 


Financial Report for 2011 to Date

Financial Report for 2010 to Date

Financial Report for 2009

Twin Falls Newspaper Article

Twin Falls Billboard

Financial Report for 2009 to Date




The Enemies of Reason - Richard Dawkins
[Sound Thinking]

Glad You Asked! The Garden of Eden
[Peep Stone!]

Native American DNA
[Post-Mormon Mag.]



Salt Lake Events the week before christmas
[Salt Lake City Po...] 
SF Bay Area Monthly Gathering SUNDAY (12/1)
[San Francisco Bay...] 
December 1st- Southern Utah PostMormon Lecture Series
[Southern Utah Pos...] 
We’re still here...
[East Tennessee Po...] 
Utah County CALM meetup for November
[Calm of Utah Coun...] 
Joseph's Changing Myth with Grant Palmer -- Nov 6 -- 7pm -- SLC Library
[Salt Lake City Po...] 
November Meet Up
[Idaho Falls Post-...] 
SF Bay Area Monthly Gathering SUNDAY (11/3)
[San Francisco Bay...] 
November 3rd- Southern Utah PostMormon Lecture series
[Southern Utah Pos...] 
October Meet-up
[Denver Post-Mormo...] 
October Meeting
[Idaho Falls Post-...] 
San Diego lunch this Sunday @ 1:30
[San Diego Post-Mo...] 


Book of Mormon Tories
by Tom Donofrio 
Book of Mormon Tories
by Nogginus Skepticalus 
Native American DNA
by GTM 
Ongoing Monthly Gatherings!
Reuben

Ongoing Monthly Gatherings!
Virginia Steve

CALM meet up for June
4bagel

Revised NW Women's Retreat Announcement
lunaverse

Austin Fall Party
lightrider702

Glad You Asked! The Garden of Eden
by Timo 
Church Authorities, Postmormons Find Common Ground
by ExMoNemo 
Church Authorities, Postmormons Find Common Ground
by Mikki B 
Resignation Letter to My Family
Mikki B

Resignation Letter to My Family
Waveoftruth

Resignation Letter to My Family
In search of Truth

Carolina PostMo Night: “The Master
Swearing Elder

Washington D.C. Post-Mormon Lunch - August 28
freckles

Resignation Letter to My Family
INRETROSPECT

Financial Report for 2011 to Date
by Jeff Ricks 
Resignation Letter to My Family
pennw

Financial Report for 2011 to Date
by Poor Thumper 
Financial Report for 2011 to Date
by Poor Thumper 
Resignation Letter to My Family
Poor Thumper

SF Bay Area Monthly Gathering SUNDAY (6/3)
exmoinaz

SF Bay Area Monthly Gathering SUNDAY (6/3)
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Earth Day Concert Get Together!
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Marie went back too soon….  
Posted: 18 March 2010 03:47 PM   [ Ignore ]   

   
 
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Posted: 18 March 2010 05:27 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]   

   
 
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Were I ever to be in such rarefied air, I would truly love to buy Marie a drink and have a nice long talk...
 
It's been 45 years since we were in the same ward. 
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Posted: 18 March 2010 05:42 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]   

   
 
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Perhaps the tragic death of her son will be the catalyst that pushes her out of Mormonism for good, to become one of the biggest defectors in recent years and an spokesperson for postmos and LGBT equality alike. Hey, I can dream can't I? grin
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Posted: 18 March 2010 05:47 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]   

   
 
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Hey, that isn't a garment worthy outfit, is it? Not to detract from her pain and sadness, but just sayin'. . . . .
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Posted: 19 March 2010 06:01 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]   

   
 
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YesIAmAPyr:
Were I ever to be in such rarefied air, I would truly love to buy Marie a drink and have a nice long talk...
 
It's been 45 years since we were in the same ward. 
 
 Donny's family was in my home ward about 15ish years ago. Man those Osmonds get around, LOL. Nothing like getting your sacrament passed to you by the son of an Osmond.
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Posted: 19 March 2010 01:28 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]   

   
 
caedmon
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This brings up a larger question for me.....are Mormons allowed to grieve?
 
 


   


Posted: 19 March 2010 04:15 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]   

   
 
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Entertainment mormons are on a constant mission...and nope, they must "show go on" through everything. Remember, they're promised Celestial Kingdom reunions.....
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”I’ve begun worshiping the sun for a number of reasons. First of all, unlike some other gods I could mention, I can see the sun. It’s there for me every day. And the things it brings me are quite apparent all the time: heat, light, food, a lovely day. There’s no mystery, no one asks for money, I don’t have to dress up, and there’s no boring pageantry. And interestingly enough, I have found that the prayers I offer to the sun and the prayers I formerly offered to God are all answered at about the same 50-percent rate.” George Carlin


   


            
 
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Quite a catty commentary on Osmond funeral.  
Posted: 09 March 2010 01:01 AM   [ Ignore ]   

   
 
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Yeah, so my MSN homepage says that none other than President Monson presided over Michael Osmonds funeral today. 
 
I have many questions.  First question - why?  Second question - the deceased was formerly in rehab and took his own life.  I'm pretty quite sure that Mormon Theology does not allow this young, troubled man into the Celestial Kingdom under such circumstances.  Is this correct?  Third question - yeah, how in the hell did that happen, that the prophet ended up presiding over this young mans funeral? 
 
I admit this is catty.  I don't think this would have pleased the deceased in the least.  The church didn't seem to be helping him all that much.  Of course I did not know the deceased, nor any of his family.  Still - did they ask the prophet?  Did the prophet volunteer?  I've never heard of this happening before. 
 
 
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Posted: 09 March 2010 01:14 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]   

   
 
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MishMagnet:  Third question - yeah, how in the hell did that happen, that the prophet ended up presiding over this young mans funeral? 
 
I'm pretty sure it's all a bullshit PR move.  He was LDS, from a famous LDS family, and his death made national news.  Time for the church to swoop in and put a happy loving  spin on things to make the church look good.
 
If this kid didn't come from a famous LDS family, Tom wouldn't give a rat's ass.
 
What a dick.
 
 
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Posted: 09 March 2010 01:18 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]   

   
 
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I feel like this shouldn't bother me.  But yes, you are correct.  Has Pres Monson presided over any other young mans funeral when suicide and addiction were involved? 
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Posted: 09 March 2010 01:21 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]   

   
 
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No matter what we may think or who may have presided over this young man's funeral, Marie lost her son.
 
There is no greater loss than that of a troubled child.  Just because you're an Osmond doesn't mean you don't have problems just like everyone else.
 
I had a dear friend from Utah whose son tried to commit suicide on numerous occasions but his "friends" didn't think it was necessary to tell his mother.  He finally succeeded and much to her horror, she discovered his body - you just don't know what is going thru kids heads when they do these things. 
 
So let's not be too harsh on Pres. Monson or his part in the funeral.  If he didn't want to be there, he would have declined the invitation or would not have made an offer to be there.
 



   


Posted: 09 March 2010 01:23 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]   

   
 
paladin
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Every Exmo is looking at that and realizing it for what it is, a totally blatant PR move by the church. Every TBM is going to get all misty eyed and trembling lipped, so happy that TM is there for the Osmonds. On top of the fact that Roseanne Barr made her comment that the unfortunate boy was gay (not proven), it is like saying the church shows compassion for unfortunate young men of that persuasion. Disgusting. 

   


Posted: 09 March 2010 01:26 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]   

   
 
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Tessa
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And Marie will go back on "Entertainment Tonight" touting how wonderful the church was to her, in her time of need....
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Posted: 09 March 2010 01:27 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]   

   
 
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It would be a wonderful comfort to every Mormon parent to come have the prophet himself conduct the funerals of their beloved children.  I've just never heard of it happening before.
 
Certainly nobody is suggesting the Osmonds are not suffering greatly nor am I trying to minimize the pain this young man was in.  I was chronically, severely depressed while in the church.  I have looked into that abyss.  I have nothing but compassion for this young man. 
 
When I was at BYU a young man killed himself on the front steps of the temple.  I do not recall the prophet coming to speak at his funeral, although we were right there in Provo, just like this was. 
 
 
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Posted: 09 March 2010 01:39 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]   

   
 
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@CadillacCTS2009, I agree the Osmonds are suffering and nobody here is saying otherwise.
 
But Mishmagnet is correct, this seems weird. The prophet of the church cannot possibly go to every funeral of troubled, addicted suicides by mormon boys. 
 
Then why did he go to this one?
 
I don't think he personally knew the man. It was said in the news report that he's friends with the Osmonds, but still.
 
This is the time for the church to shine, when the cameras are rolling.
 
This just smacks of PR and posturing.  It's blatantly obvious from where we stand. There are so many other funerals of people who know GAs and former friends of Prophets and they attend some and not others. How do they choose?
 
Monson doesn't get in front of the TV at all. He's conspicously absent as a leader. He doesn't even have words of wisdom and comfort for the people of Haiti or Chile, but he's there in front of the camera for the Osmond funeral.
 
I guess they are more important than the saints in Haiti or Chile. They need a message of comfort in their time of death.
 
The Haitians and Chileans don't need any comfort in their time of death, they are on their own.
 
See it for what it really is. Posturing for the cameras
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Posted: 09 March 2010 02:24 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]   

   
 
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Several missionaries have died recently, mostly of asphyxiation in rundown housing. I know that GA's have then spoken at their funerals (not President Monson). I wonder one day, if a grieving parent will stand, and demand publicly to know why their sons or daughters were living in such places. Affirmations of love to the Osmonds. I can't imagine...
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Posted: 09 March 2010 02:47 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]   

   
 
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Hmmm...wouldn't it be something to have had a prophet conduct a sad suicide of our gay community. I feel bad for the Osmonds..have had suicide in my own family. I read a book by Merrill Osmond that was very "telling" of his depression. It was so obvious that most of his problems stemmed from the church and expectations. Yet, he bore his testimony that the Church set him free. That being said, this seems so tacky in light of what I have been taught about suicide in the church. Just my .02 cents worth. Years from now, I hope that Marie can see how the Church in her own life has affected "finding herself" to deal with the guilt a mother always feels. Hugs, Vickie
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Posted: 09 March 2010 03:15 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]   

   
 
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gullible's travels
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I agree, this is a devastating time for the Osmonds and how horrible and just plain tragic.  These are real people, and real events, real feelings and emotions felt by the people experiencing them.
 
However, isn't having Thomas S there a little showy anyway?  I don't think in this time of grief and pain that you'd need any further attention or scrutiny drawn to the matter, but I am not going to judge her or her family in their time of heartache. 
 
This issue is more about the church than Marie Osmond, or her son for that matter.
 
And I can't help but feel like having Tom be there while the cameras roll reminds a little too much type of involvement the Church of Scientology would have if this were Tom and Katie's kid or John Travola and Kelly Preston's child?  
 
In fact, since only coming out of my TBM status recently, and therefore being TBM when John and Kelly's son died -I can't help but see the unfortunate similarities to a church that we LAUGH at and mock as members of TSCC {Scientology}.  John Travolta was made to keep his son's autism a secret for fear of how that particular condition is looked at in their church.  I remember feeling so sad for him that he bought into a religion that taught him that about his son.  Amazing.  NEVER realizing I had bought into a religion that did at worse!  Anyhow, if I remember right, he too found solace in his faith during his time of need.
 
It's like there is a lot of back scratching going on the way these Churches stroke the celebrities' egos and in turn the celebrities are even more faithful, touting the religion any chance they get.  I must admit, however, that celebrities seemly do this somewhat blindly, the Churches seem in the know however, ever cognisant of their posturing efforts and how they acheive desired effects.


   


Posted: 09 March 2010 03:52 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]   

   
 
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Garyatrics
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If President Monson had presided over other similar funerals, it wouldn't be on the news.  We don't know that he hasn't done dozens of similar acts of support and compassion.
 
I know that when my younger sister suffered a very painful event, President Monson (then an apostle) spoke on the phone twice with my mother, offering welcome support and critical information, both of which made a positive difference in how my sister responded.  It never made the news.
 
I don't believe that Monson is an actual prophet, but I do believe that he's probably doing his best to help other people.  He's probably a lot like most of us that way.
 
I also think in this case there are PR overtones, which Mormons call "doing missionary work."  It's what they do.  Sometimes it is pretty annoying.
 
I feel so sorry for the family and for the young man who probably went through hell before he finally decided that he couldn't take it anymore.  In my mind, these are more victims of addiction, a disorder that doesn't spare any group of people.
 
 
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Posted: 09 March 2010 04:05 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]   

   
 
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Since I've posted this I've been trying to talk myself down, but I keep getting agitated.  I think - well who cares as long as it was a comfort to his family.  And yet, is that how I, myself or you want to go out?  All Mormoned up to make our families feel better?  Having some Bishop say how we were led astray and certainly not happy but it's all going to be better now?
 
And then I think about the suggestion that he might have been gay.  I know the difference between speculation and fact, I am not stating his sexuality as fact.  However, there has been speculation and a certain theme to his suffering that does suggest he might have been gay.
 
In that case - the prophet is culpable in his death!  The church has been awful to the gay community in the past few years.  I can't imagine the insult of somebody doing something to greatly hurt me, perhaps to the point of suicide, and then having that someone preside at my funeral!
 
 
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Posted: 09 March 2010 04:15 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]   

   
 
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The Holy Ghost® is bearing witness to me as my boosm is a burning that it has something to do with this picture and teaser appearing on countless Yahoo, AOL, etc. etc. home pages across the world today.  You can't buy this kind of publicity (stunt) at Marie's ultimate expense though.  Maybe he was/is just a fan of Dancing With the Stars since he looks pretty happy.  Maybe he is telling her that her son is in a much better place right now. 
 
 
 
Marie & Monson 
Utah funeral service held for Marie Osmond's son
President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints Thomas Monson, left, comforts singer Marie Osmond before a graveside service after the funeral of her son Michael Bryan in Provo, Utah on Monday, March 8, 2010. (AP Photo/George Frey)
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Posted: 09 March 2010 04:21 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]   

   
 
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MishMagnet:
Since I've posted this I've been trying to talk myself down, but I keep getting agitated.  I think - well who cares as long as it was a comfort to his family.  And yet, is that how I, myself or you want to go out?  All Mormoned up to make our families feel better?  Having some Bishop say how we were led astray and certainly not happy but it's all going to be better now?
 
And then I think about the suggestion that he might have been gay.  I know the difference between speculation and fact, I am not stating his sexuality as fact.  However, there has been speculation and a certain theme to his suffering that does suggest he might have been gay.
 
In that case - the prophet is culpable in his death!  The church has been awful to the gay community in the past few years.  I can't imagine the insult of somebody doing something to greatly hurt me, perhaps to the point of suicide, and then having that someone preside at my funeral!
 
 
 
 MishMagnet,
 
I really get where you are coming from.  Monsoon's role in the funeral is suspect to me given the church's stance on suicide alone.
 
Deb 

   


Posted: 09 March 2010 04:37 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 15 ]   

   
 
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MishMagnet, I think I understand your point better now.  I was missing the element of possible church culpability in the factors leading to his suicide.  I apologize if I misunderstood you earlier.
 
It's such a painful thing to witness from this perspective outside the church: seeing how people turn to same beliefs and social patterns that might have contributed to the young man's death.
 
 
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Posted: 09 March 2010 05:42 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 16 ]   

   
 
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Monson's laughing in that photo.
 
 
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Posted: 09 March 2010 05:55 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 17 ]   

   
 
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geogdeb:
MishMagnet:
Since I've posted this I've been trying to talk myself down, but I keep getting agitated.  I think - well who cares as long as it was a comfort to his family.  And yet, is that how I, myself or you want to go out?  All Mormoned up to make our families feel better?  Having some Bishop say how we were led astray and certainly not happy but it's all going to be better now?
 
And then I think about the suggestion that he might have been gay.  I know the difference between speculation and fact, I am not stating his sexuality as fact.  However, there has been speculation and a certain theme to his suffering that does suggest he might have been gay.
 
In that case - the prophet is culpable in his death!  The church has been awful to the gay community in the past few years.  I can't imagine the insult of somebody doing something to greatly hurt me, perhaps to the point of suicide, and then having that someone preside at my funeral!
 
 
 
 MishMagnet,
 
I really get where you are coming from.  Monsoon's role in the funeral is suspect to me given the church's stance on suicide alone.
 
Deb
 
 I just realized that I misspelled Monson- or did I????  Freudian slip?


   


Posted: 09 March 2010 07:06 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 18 ]   

   
 
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I agree Mish. The church is her community and any support they give her is probably a good thing. But the Prophet/GA involvement in the funeral does feel like PR. Maybe he was a close personal friend. That would make his attendance more meaningful. 

   


Posted: 09 March 2010 07:14 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 19 ]   

   
 
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rod holland:
I agree Mish. The church is her community and any support they give her is probably a good thing. But the Prophet/GA involvement in the funeral does feel like PR. Maybe he was a close personal friend. That would make his attendance more meaningful.
 
KSL said he is a personal friend. If that is true, I have no problem. If the church used it as a PR moment, that is another matter although the family must have consented.
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Posted: 09 March 2010 04:52 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 20 ]   

   
 
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This is just my opinion so don't pay too much attention. Of course he would go to this funeral, its the Osmond's. They have a lot of money and are probably large contributors to the TSCC besides being famous mormons. I also find him being at this particular funeral suspect because of the TSCC's stance on suicide. This comment he made doesn't add up to me either, "He told them everything they loved about Michael will continue, only his spirit has returned home. " I was always taught that in the TSCC suicide is unforgivable so have they changed that? Feel free to correct me if I am wrong on any of this. 

   


Posted: 09 March 2010 05:12 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 21 ]   

   
 
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happymom:
This is just my opinion so don't pay too much attention. Of course he would go to this funeral, its the Osmond's. They have a lot of money and are probably large contributors to the TSCC besides being famous mormons. I also find him being at this particular funeral suspect because of the TSCC's stance on suicide. This comment he made doesn't add up to me either, "He told them everything they loved about Michael will continue, only his spirit has returned home. " I was always taught that in the TSCC suicide is unforgivable so have they changed that? Feel free to correct me if I am wrong on any of this.
 
Suicide was never "unforgivable" in LDS theology, as far as I know, although it has gone through an evolution.  The only unforgivable sin is becoming a son of perdition, of which there is officially only one in all of human history, Cain.
 
Suicide, in their doctrine, is murder of self.  As an act of murder, it falls under the LDS history of murder doctrine, i.e. blood atonement, etc.  As of now though, it kind of falls like this. 
 
If you commit suicide, you are shedding innocent blood, your own.  Therefore, like any murder, you go to spirit prison after you are dead and you suffer for your sin in a temporary condition called hell.  When that is complete, you go to the kingdom of glory where all murderers go -- the telestial kingdom.
 
In very modern times, although not official doctrine, it is "communicated" that if someone is mentally ill and therefore "not accountable for for actions" then there is a possibility of the "normal" mortal redemption.  His history of severe depression certainly qualifies as "mental illness."  But, by the cut and dry of Mormon doctrine, he is condemned.  (Unless an Osmond has had their calling and election made sure, but that another speculative area).
 
So what Monson said in his quote was true from his POV.  Everything about Michael does continue, good and bad, and he will return home in some way.


   


Posted: 09 March 2010 05:37 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 22 ]   

   
 
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Again, we have to remember LDS or not, people commit suicide.  Suicide, addiction, sexual orientation know no bounds.  And know one thing, no matter how you feel about this from a religious standpoint, we are all saved in the blood of Jesus Christ.  There is a place in Heaven for Marie's son.  I don't think one should be judged by how he/she leaves this world and enters into Eternity.  The Lord has loved him forever and will continue to do so.  Some of us have great coping skills and life is good; others don't have ANY coping skills and turn to whatever makes them happy that day.  Just remember one thing, I live with someone who has no coping skills, who is very depressed, has severe anxiety, and has no desire to do much of anything - you all don't know what I have to live with (maybe you do) but I think there's a saying out there that goes "people who live in glass temples shouldn't throw stones".
 
Again, being that Pres. Monson is a personal friend of the family, it would be his right to be there in whatever capacity he chose, friend or prophet.  This is not for any of us to choose -
Marie lost her child - leave it alone.


   


Posted: 09 March 2010 05:43 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 23 ]   

   
 
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I think many of us on the Post-mo side of life automatically assume these guys have ulterior motives.  Sometimes we're right, but sometimes we really ARE wrong.  Wiki says Monson was called as an apostle in 1963, right about the time the Osmonds were starting to receive national attention (Andy Williams show, 1962).  Being a leader in a small church that suddenly had this national novelty act on its hands probably DOES mean that Monson has known Marie since she was in diapers.  If that is the case, then Monson's being there is entirely appropriate, and as the highest-ranking priesthood holder in attendance, he automatically presides.  In fact, given Marie's opposition to Prop 8 and open support of her gay daughter, I think it probably does signify a strong family friendship.  Was it a PR opportunity?  If it was, I think it was probably incidental.
re: suicide, I don't remember being taught that it was unforgivable or anything like that.  Serious, yes, obviously, but I specifically remember being taught by an otherwise insanely strident seminary teacher that suicide was a course of action that no 'sane' person would follow, and that God would account for that mental state in his judgement.
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Posted: 09 March 2010 05:43 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 24 ]   

   
 
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Osmonds probably helped build the City Center...as large "investors in tithing." As such, Monson needed to be there...keeping the "money rolling in" by telling Marie whatever she wanted to hear.
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Posted: 09 March 2010 06:02 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 25 ]   

   
 
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My FIL, who is an exmo (though I did't actually know he was an exmo at all until I had known him for several years) knew Monson back in the day.  From how FIL describes him, he's a pretty decent guy.  They met when FIL would visit people from his church (Lutheran) and Monson would visit people in the hospital or something like that.
I have a letter that Monson wrote to my husband's grandparents thanking them for their participation in a scandinavian festival.  He even mentions my husband in the letter.  (DH's grandparents were always bragging him up to whomever would listen.)
 
I'm guessing this has more to do with PR than anything.  If he did kill himself because he was gay (and I don't know if there's any truth to that), then the church definitely has dirty hands in the matter.  If it had been my son, I wouldn't want anybody in the church near his corpse.  But what has happened to the Osmand family is sad and I don't have the heart to be snarky about it.  It's bad enough to have to grieve something like this.  Grieving it in the public eye only makes it worse.
 
I knew a girl a few years back whose father was a bishop at the time he committed suicide.  My mom said the funeral was nice and nobody talked down about it.
 
I think that people are coming around- even Mormons- and realizing that mental illness is a disease like many others.  You have to be pretty far gone to kill yourself.  Suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem.  Personally speaking, I've had a bad few days.  I've had a lot of things piling up.  I've had my moments recently where I've really just wished for death.  But I know that I'm going to come out of it eventually.  And I wouldn't leave my kids. 
 
I don't know why some people aren't able to see the light at the end of the tunnel.  But I think when you have no perspective, that's an illness.  And I think members of the church are becoming more enlightened about it.  Too slowly, of course, as is with everything.  But still making progress. 
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Posted: 09 March 2010 07:07 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 26 ]   

   
 
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CadillacCTS:
Again, we have to remember LDS or not, people commit suicide.  Suicide, addiction, sexual orientation know no bounds.  And know one thing, no matter how you feel about this from a religious standpoint, we are all saved in the blood of Jesus Christ.  There is a place in Heaven for Marie's son.  I don't think one should be judged by how he/she leaves this world and enters into Eternity.  The Lord has loved him forever and will continue to do so.  Some of us have great coping skills and life is good; others don't have ANY coping skills and turn to whatever makes them happy that day.  Just remember one thing, I live with someone who has no coping skills, who is very depressed, has severe anxiety, and has no desire to do much of anything - you all don't know what I have to live with (maybe you do) but I think there's a saying out there that goes "people who live in glass temples shouldn't throw stones".
 
Again, being that Pres. Monson is a personal friend of the family, it would be his right to be there in whatever capacity he chose, friend or prophet.  This is not for any of us to choose -
Marie lost her child - leave it alone. 
 
I'm sorry to hear about whatever it is you may be going through personally. I'm sure it must be very difficult. And I'm sending you good thoughts and prayers.
 
I don't think anyone here is judging Marie's son. On the contrary, I think folks here would have more sympathy for his plight than most. And also for Marie on the loss of her son and the questions that must be going on in her head right now and the intense sorrow she's feeling.
 
However, we can and do judge mormonism, including it's leaders. We discuss it in great detail because we can and should. And because we've earned the right to do that for all the years we wasted in it, and all the mind-screwing it did with our lives. That's why we're here.
 
So perhaps you could have some patience with us too.
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Posted: 09 March 2010 07:50 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 27 ]   

   
 
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MishMagnet:
I have many questions.  First question - why? 
 
 
I had the same exact reaction when it was announced on the evening news that Monson presided at the funeral.
 
I turned to my TBM wife and asked.."why would he do that"?  But in my heart I knew WHY.  The Osmonds are the only non-GA Mormon royalty. All Mormon's are equal...but some are more equal than others. 
 
By rubbing shoulders with the Osmond family, Monson can not only get his own ego stroked, but can bolster his own image among Mormon faithful at the same time.
 
Personally I think that it is a crock of shit that Monson would attend this funeral...I found it very offensive...and very self serving.  I personally like and have respect for the Osmond family and have sympathy for them at this time, but Monson's participation in this tragedy is just him wanting to share in the media spot light of the Osmond's tragedy...there is no other reason for him to attend other than self serving reasons.
 
NOTE:  He doesn't attend the funerals of other Mormon suicide victims.  Point Made 
 
 
I should add that I met Marie once in my TBM life.  My family and I were eating at the same restaraunt that Marie and her then husband were dining at.  One of my dinner guests insisted on getting her autograph and a picture.  I pleaded not to bother her but they were from out of town and insisted.  So I embarrassingly approuched her, she was nothing but gracious, extremely friendly and giving to both my family and my guests.  She was the one who suggested they have their pictures taken with her.  She was a very classy lady.  I am so very sorry for her terrible loss.
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Posted: 09 March 2010 07:55 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 28 ]   

   
 
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I have a couple of thoughts about this.
 
I am not sure that this was a PR move - I tend to believe it was not.
 
If Monson knew the family and attended the services he would have automatically presided there if it was being conducted by the LDS church.
 
As the executive priesthood office holder in the LDS church, Monson automatically presides at any and all LDS meetings he attends.  And according to LDS policy, the presiding authority sits on the stand and has ultimate authority to direct the meeting.
 
So I think this may be more of a case of Monson wanting to show respect to the Osmond family and automatically presiding because of his LDS position.
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Posted: 09 March 2010 07:55 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 29 ]   

   
 
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From the Provo Daily Herald: 
 
"...About 450 mourners attended Monday's services at a chapel near the Provo temple of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, including church President Thomas S. Monson, who offered words of comfort to the family..."

I don't know the capacity in which Monson served at the funeral, but my vote is to give him and the Osmond Family a pass on this one.  The family especially. 
 
It's been a tough run for Marie.  I feel bad for her, she's had to walk some fine lines to remain in good stead with the church and her family...
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Posted: 09 March 2010 10:01 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 30 ]   

   
 
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i just HAVE to chime in here.
 
i know TWO of the younger osmonds PERSONALLY-- enough to have their numbers in my phone, and on facebook, etc.
 
we get together every saturday and hang out and have LOADS of fun!  they are GREAT guys!
 
i was talking with them about the funeral.  i own a flower shop here in provo, and of course, had people calling about it.
 
i called around and the funeral home handling it said they could give me "no information" which, of COURSE, means they HAD the funeral.  but, i couldn't deliver anything because i had "no information"
 
as people called, i also told them, we have NO INFORMATION.
 
well, on saturday, when one of my osmond friends came to chill with us, i asked him about the funeral, sent my condolences, etc.
 
he said, they didn't know this "cousin" very well.  they had only met him two or three times. every time they'd go to maries house, he wasn't there, or was busy.
 
anyway, he mentioned that monson was coming to the funeral. i asked, "oh? why?" because i generally was curious as to why the PROPHET would come to a funeral for someone famous.
 
his response:  because he has known the osmond's for YEARS and monson was a good family friend to them.  
 
so, i'm taking it at his word.  so, in defense of the MORmONS, i'm sticking with this, that i HEARD WITH MY OWN EARS FROM AN OSMOND.
 
nice people!  good friends of mine, and i wish them solice in their time of sorrow.
 
as much as i dislike the mormon church, i think monson came to be genuinely interested in condolencing with the family.
 
yeah, they probably give a TON of their money to the morg...fine.  but i dont think that was the motivator in this appearance.


   


Posted: 10 March 2010 04:10 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 31 ]   

   
 
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YesIAmAPyr:
 
From the Provo Daily Herald: 
 
"...About 450 mourners attended Monday's services at a chapel near the Provo temple of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, including church President Thomas S. Monson, who offered words of comfort to the family..."

I don't know the capacity in which Monson served at the funeral, but my vote is to give him and the Osmond Family a pass on this one.  The family especially. 
 
It's been a tough run for Marie.  I feel bad for her, she's had to walk some fine lines to remain in good stead with the church and her family...
 
 
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Posted: 10 March 2010 04:38 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 32 ]   

   
 
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poodledoodledude:
his response:  because he has known the osmond's for YEARS and monson was a good family friend to them.  
 
I think that is all fine and good that a family friend would attend the funeral.  I have no problem with that regardless of anyone's celebrity status.  The head scratcher for me was why was Monson’s attendance the big news headline and photo making the AP news wire rather than say Donny or some other close friend, surviving children, or other family member’s picture splashed across my home page well outside of Zion’s warm fuzzy testimony building local news media area.  For example, it’s similar to the most important news worthy attendee at  John Travolta’s son Jett’s funeral being David Miscavige and most people thinking – who is President David Miscavige and why is he in the AP news headline and photo rather than family.  Most likely to show Scientology is the core of their strength in difficult times and in case anyone is interested in Scientology and would like to know more. 
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Posted: 10 March 2010 04:57 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 33 ]   

   
 
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I spoke with a friend in Palm Springs this evening. He brought up the sad demise of Marie Osmond's son. I mentioned the president of the LDS church attended the service. There was sudden silence and then he said, "But don't Mormons believe that homosexuals are going to Hell? Why would their president be there? It opened a great dialogue... on several issues.
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Posted: 10 March 2010 05:01 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 34 ]   

   
 
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Entertainment Tonight did a bunch of clips of the funeral, balloons and Mary Hart starting to tear up about Donny trying to sing, and not being able to finish. No Monson shown....
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Posted: 10 March 2010 09:16 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 35 ]   

   
 
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I feel like a mushroom - I live in a cage and get fed bullshit.... I didn't even know of the death until now Red
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Posted: 10 March 2010 03:11 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 36 ]   

   
 
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  http://feeds.people.com/~r/people/headlines/~3/9owiN_xQUt0/0,,20350026,00.html Back to work.
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”I’ve begun worshiping the sun for a number of reasons. First of all, unlike some other gods I could mention, I can see the sun. It’s there for me every day. And the things it brings me are quite apparent all the time: heat, light, food, a lovely day. There’s no mystery, no one asks for money, I don’t have to dress up, and there’s no boring pageantry. And interestingly enough, I have found that the prayers I offer to the sun and the prayers I formerly offered to God are all answered at about the same 50-percent rate.” George Carlin


   


            
 
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Roseanne slams Mormon church, says Marie’s son was gay  
Posted: 06 March 2010 03:48 AM   [ Ignore ]   

   
 
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  http://roseanneworld.com/blog/
 
Here are some excerpts... 
 
"marie osmonds poor gay son killed himself
because he had been told how wrong and how sick he was every day of his life by his church and the people in it. Calling that "depression" is a lie!
 
 
How sickening. I know so many mormon kids who were gay and committed suicide, and I just cannot and will not stay quiet in order to not offend bigots anymore. It is all so terribly depressing.
Marie please don't talk about how your faith in your church has helped you get through this one!
 
 
G-d is trying to use you for something good and this is your opportunity! Your church is wrong and on the wrong wrong wrong side of things! Get as vocal about that as you are about your diet. G-d bless you too, Marie. "
 
 
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Posted: 06 March 2010 03:50 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]   

   
 
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Ugh. Sorry I repeated a story!
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Posted: 06 March 2010 09:36 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]   

   
 
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Doesn't she have a daughter who's lesbian and "out"?  Roseanne could be shoveling BS; Marie seemed okay with her daughter's sexual orientation.  Then again, maybe her son's sexuality was swept under the rug because having two gay children begins to reflect on your parenting skills?
 
Dunno.  Just throwing it out there and naming possibilities.
 
Maybe Roseanne hasn't had a headline in awhile.
 
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Posted: 06 March 2010 10:42 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]   

   
 
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Marie does have a gay daughter and in the Prop H8 campaign she was vocal in defending her daughter's right to be herself and in opposing the church's involvement.
 
I don't know all the circumstances and I doubt Roseanne does either. 
 
Marie had children from 2 fathers and she had adopted children.  I don't that it's clear that her son was gay -- perhaps he was and perhaps he wasn't.  Maybe it was his father who created the problem -- he and his father were estranged.  Maybe the fact that a male child is supposed to hold the priesthood is what made Michael's being gay more offensive in some way or weighed more heavily on him.  I almost never hear lesbianism acknowledged when Mormons discuss the issues of being gay as though it's an exclusively male behavior.  Maybe that makes the impact of being gay and female less burdensome.  Or maybe the daughter had freed herself of the censure of the church in a way the son couldn't.  We'll probably never know.
 
Not defending Roseanne.  Those were offensive comments she should have kept to herself whatever her personal history growing up Jewish in SLC.   Just affirming that Marie Osmond was fearless in defending her gay daughter. 


   


Posted: 07 March 2010 02:52 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]   

   
 
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I did try and see if he was gay.  I'm not sure what to trust and what not to.  I know that as a teenager it was difficult for me.  There were times that I was pretty low... like the time I prayed to god to kill me if I ever masturbated again.  However, I never came close to suicide because I thought that killing myself would only cause me to go to the telestial kingdom, which is where I would be going because I was gay :S
 
I did just find out that a kid in my town growing up who killed himself about five years ago was gay.  I thought that would be the case, but now I know for sure.
 
I really hate the church for how it hurts the marginalized!


   


Posted: 07 March 2010 03:03 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]   

   
 
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I really doubt that Roseanne Barr has any inside in formation on why Michael Blosil killed himself or what his sexual orientation was. Even if she did, this is not the time to make statements like that. She could have made her statement about the Morg's treatment of gays without bringing a dead boy into the mix. Vey poor taste and just about what I would expect of Roseanne.If he was gay and chose not to make it public, it is not her place to out him. I  he wasn't, then she is no better than a common gossip.
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Posted: 07 March 2010 03:09 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]   

   
 
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Rosanne can be brash and suffers from various mental disorders...but she knows the church and she knows things they try and keep secret in Hollywood and environs. She speaks up...when she knows she's going to catch it. Sometimes, the truth will out.
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Posted: 07 March 2010 03:21 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]   

   
 
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And sometimes she is just obnoxious like when she sang the national anthem off key at a ball game while scrathing her privates. At any rate, I doubt she travels in the same circles as the Osmonds a nd I think anything she may have heard is just gossip. Even if she was sure, it isn't her place to out someone else.I'm not arguing with her speaking out about the church and gays, but I object to her making Michael Blosil her poster boy. I think it is wrong even if he was gay which hasn't been confirmed.
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Posted: 07 March 2010 03:31 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]   

   
 
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And who will stand up for him, if it is true? Perhaps Rosanne may have thought he was being buried and forgotten. Marie climbing back on the boards in Vegas...very quickly. She may have been reacting to that. Not sure. Rosanne reminds me of many autistic/asbergers folks who blurt out things they know, without considering what they are saying...
 
http://www.hollywoodlife.com/2010/03/04/marie-osmond-son-suicide/
 
 
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Posted: 07 March 2010 03:35 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]   

   
 
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Tessa:
And who will stand up for him, if it is true? Perhaps Rosanne may have thought he was being buried and forgotten. Marie climbing back on the boards in Vegas...very quickly. She may have been reacting to that. Not sure. Rosanne reminds me of many autistic/asbergers folks who blurt out things they know, without considering what they are saying...
I doubt she "knows" anything. The Osmonds were open about Jessica. If Michael was gay, and I haven't heard it anywhere else, he chose to keep it secret and it is none of Roseanne's business. She could have made her point very well without bringing him into it.
 
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Posted: 07 March 2010 03:39 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]   

   
 
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I doubt she "knows" anything.
She's closer to the L.A. scene then many of us. She may or may not "know" but she's stuck her neck out there....with the Prop 8 stuff....she's reacting like many here to it's cruelty.
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Marie Osmond’s son commits suicide  
Posted: 27 February 2010 11:03 PM   [ Ignore ]   

   
 
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I haven't seen this posted yet.   Horribly sad & tragic...
 
http://www.usmagazine.com/celebritynews/news/marie-osmonds-son-commits-suicide-report-2010272
 
 


   


Posted: 27 February 2010 11:10 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]   

   
 
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This is very sad. 
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Posted: 27 February 2010 11:11 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]   

   
 
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That's very sad.
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Posted: 27 February 2010 11:12 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]   

   
 
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I don't want to seem cliche, but is there any information available that would indicate he was gay? It seems like if he suffered depression his whole life and was mormon and killed himself in the beginning of adulthood, that sexual orientation may have played a role. By no means am I saying that being gay and suicidal are related, but being Mormon, Gay and Suicidal do seem to run together sometimes. Whatever his motives, poor kid, poor family. I feel for them.
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“The proselytizing fanatic strengthens his own faith by converting others. The creed whose legitimacy is most easily challenged is likely to develop the strongest proselytizing impulse. It is also plausible that those movements with the greatest inner contradiction between profession and practice—that is to say with a strong feeling of guilt—are likely to be the most fervent in imposing their faith on others.”
—Eric Hoffer


   


Posted: 27 February 2010 11:17 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]   

   
 
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I saw this also, but didn't know how to link it.  I knew someone smart, and talented would come along and do it
 
When I saw this report on line this morning I immediately said, "Here is another example of the 'Church' grinding down a kid, and making them feel like they will never be good enough!"
 
My son (who has not been an active member of the church for twelve years) said, "Mom...you can't say that.  You have no idea why this kid jumped to his death.  Maybe the Church had nothing to do with it."
 
Again, wisdom out of the mouths of my babes.
 
He is right.  I have no right to make any kind of a judgement about Marie Osmond's son.
 
As a mother I can imagine the emotional, and physical, pain that Ms. Osmond must be in today.
 
 As a community of loving, caring, compassionate people who post here, I know that many you guys join me in sending the Osmond family our sympathy for their loss.
 
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Posted: 27 February 2010 11:18 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]   

   
 
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She has openly supported her lesbian daughter.  He might have been gay, but there are so many other pressures put on kids today as well, especially kids of celebrities and especially kids raised in the church.
 
So sad.  It seem like she's always being hit with something.
 
 
 
 
 
 
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Posted: 27 February 2010 11:19 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]   

   
 
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new.expositor:
I don't want to seem cliche, but is there any information available that would indicate he was gay? It seems like if he suffered depression his whole life and was mormon and killed himself in the beginning of adulthood, that sexual orientation may have played a role. By no means am I saying that being gay and suicidal are related, but being Mormon, Gay and Suicidal do seem to run together sometimes. Whatever his motives, poor kid, poor family. I feel for them.
 
 I wondered the same thing until I found this other article link over on the NOM forum. This article talked about some kind of rehab. 
 
http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20347551,00.html
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Posted: 27 February 2010 11:32 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]   

   
 
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sulki:
new.expositor:
I don't want to seem cliche, but is there any information available that would indicate he was gay? It seems like if he suffered depression his whole life and was mormon and killed himself in the beginning of adulthood, that sexual orientation may have played a role. By no means am I saying that being gay and suicidal are related, but being Mormon, Gay and Suicidal do seem to run together sometimes. Whatever his motives, poor kid, poor family. I feel for them.
 
 I wondered the same thing until I found this other article link over on the NOM forum. This article talked about some kind of rehab.  
 
http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20347551,00.html 
 
 Thanks, it looks like whatever it was, it was going on for some time now.  I wish I had a 3.9 GPA in high school, sucks, looks like he had lots of potential.
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—Eric Hoffer


   


Posted: 27 February 2010 11:56 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]   

   
 
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New Expositor, I totally agree with your theory. I have a gay cousin who just came out to us and I'm the only one in my entire extended family that still treats him like a human (my husband and children are 100% supportive of his lifestyle). In any event, he told me that he contemplated suicide MANY times because death seemed like a huge improvement over being a gay man in the LDS church. My sister's stake president's son was gay and killed himself in high school (about 8 years ago). His father, the SP, said (AT THE FUNERAL no less) that he received "a witness" that his son was better off dead than living a life of sin. My sister heard him say it. I think this sort of thing is much more prevalent in the LDS church than the leaders would ever let on. So very Christlike.
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Posted: 28 February 2010 12:33 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]   

   
 
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My heart really goes out to Marie and their whole family.  I was very sad to hear this news.  I've always liked Marie Osmond so much.  Her book on post-partum depression helped me out a great deal when I was a new mother. 
 
I lost a few High School classmates to suicide.  I think of them several times per year still.  Obviously they were in a tremendous amount of pain, but you can't help but realize that things would have worked out within a few years.  16 is way too young to give up on life.  Although I also remember being 16 and how it felt like adulthood was so far away it would never be real. 
 
 
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Posted: 28 February 2010 12:36 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]   

   
 
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MishMagnet:
My heart really goes out to Marie and their whole family.  I was very sad to hear this news.  I've always liked Marie Osmond so much.  Her book on post-partum depression helped me out a great deal when I was a new mother. 
 
I lost a few High School classmates to suicide.  I think of them several times per year still.  Obviously they were in a tremendous amount of pain, but you can't help but realize that things would have worked out within a few years.  16 is way too young to give up on life.  Although I also remember being 16 and how it felt like adulthood was so far away it would never be real. 
 
 
I had a 14 year old student who killed himself. Kids that age just don't have the perspective to realize that things work out and problems can be solved. I read that he had suffered depression all of his life. He had also been in rehap. A lot of victims of depression use drugs and alcohol to self medicate. It also seems depression runs in the family. Very sad.
 
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Posted: 28 February 2010 12:40 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]   

   
 
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I&#;m Free!:
... My sister's stake president's son was gay and killed himself in high school (about 8 years ago). His father, the SP, said (AT THE FUNERAL no less) that he received "a witness" that his son was better off dead than living a life of sin. My sister heard him say it. I think this sort of thing is much more prevalent in the LDS church than the leaders would ever let on. So very Christlike.
 
 Jebezus. You can feel the conditional love there. I could not imagine being in that family and having to listen to someone say something like that about a family member. I would have thrown something at him.
 
If a church higher up had been there, they would have made him a GA on the spot.
 


   


Posted: 28 February 2010 01:08 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]   

   
 
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Oh, the "If only...."s.
I don't know that the church played any roles in his depression, suicide, or if his sexual orientation may played a part either. But, I can pretty much assume that the church surely did not help his situation.
Walter Koenig had it right, and I hope that more people hear/read his message.
 
Depressed people, you are NOT alone. There are people who care. REALLY. To the families that go through the after math of suicide, there are people who mourn with you. HONESTLY.
 
The Osmond's seem to be "all together" but there have been many struggles that they've gone through over the years. Depression is something that tends to run in families, and I know that Marie was on that cliff's edge at one point in life (PPD), so for her this may be a double edged sword, I'm pretty sure.
 
I just wish that the church wouldn't "hush up" suicide. I really wish there were more opportunities provided by all religions to help people learn the warning signs of depression, to help the people dealing with depression have connections to the proper avenues to get proper help for their depression. But, I find that religions as a whole want people to believe that it is sin that is causing their depression, and if they would "just turn their life over to God", the depression would go away. I HATE that about religion.
 
 
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Posted: 28 February 2010 01:18 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]   

   
 
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AZEvilSingleGuy:
I&#;m Free!:
... My sister's stake president's son was gay and killed himself in high school (about 8 years ago). His father, the SP, said (AT THE FUNERAL no less) that he received "a witness" that his son was better off dead than living a life of sin. My sister heard him say it. I think this sort of thing is much more prevalent in the LDS church than the leaders would ever let on. So very Christlike.
 
 Jebezus. You can feel the conditional love there. I could not imagine being in that family and having to listen to someone say something like that about a family member. I would have thrown something at him.
 
If a church higher up had been there, they would have made him a GA on the spot.
 
 
As angry as that would make me, the problem is that his father is a "religious" man, and is toeing the corporate line. And, the other problem is, that because he openly made that statement, outsiders can come to a better understanding of WHY his son felt he had no other choice, but to end his own life.
 
I came from a family that thought nothing of saying stuff like that. It supposedly was said to help keep us strong and not falter. When you are raised in a religion whose dogma is so clear, and your parents believe it with all their heart, mind and soul, you do start to feel like they may be right about it all.
 
But, in learning how the Osmond's have handled other near death attempts, Marie's own included, I am pretty sure that the Osmonds would not allow such sentiment to be espoused. They have done a lot of study and research into depression. They also show support for their lesbian member. I applaud many things the Osmonds do to help educate the rest of us. (But, I admit to being a little green with envy that they seem to "have it all")
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Posted: 28 February 2010 01:34 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]   

   
 
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sulki:
new.expositor:
I don't want to seem cliche, but is there any information available that would indicate he was gay? It seems like if he suffered depression his whole life and was mormon and killed himself in the beginning of adulthood, that sexual orientation may have played a role. By no means am I saying that being gay and suicidal are related, but being Mormon, Gay and Suicidal do seem to run together sometimes. Whatever his motives, poor kid, poor family. I feel for them.
 I wondered the same thing until I found this other article link over on the NOM forum. This article talked about some kind of rehab.  
http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20347551,00.html 
 
When I saw the title of this thread, my immediate [knee-jerk... emphasis on "jerk"] thought was, "Oh, Gawd!!  TSCC got another one!"
 
I know that's shabby; I've never walked around in Michael Blosil's head to know what kind of pressure(s) he might have been under.
 
BUT: From what you folks've told me about the conformity and perfection forced upon the members of the morg, it's an understanable position.  It's also understandable that the "some kind of rehab" in the People Magazine article could have been "ex-gay" therapy.  Yes, Marie has been supportive of her lesbian daughter... but let's face it, it's different with sons.  Maybe his dad pushed him to get "fixed."
 
This is from one of my favorite "slash fiction" stories I've read on the 'net:
"Merc let loose with a full throated laugh and gave Bobby a pitying look. He said, 'You’re an only child… Mum says parents with their first child are like hens with one chick, they fuss and scratch, but they just make the chick nervous. Tyr was only subjected to her full attention 'til she dropped the twins. By the time you have three or four kids… its like, "just let them eat the dirt, okay? They're not bothering anyone and it won't hurt them." In other words… parents with lots of kids, focus on the big picture, murder, stealing, lying – the little stuff like what you wear or calling your brother a fag, she figures we'll work our on our own.'"
I reiterate:  "Just let them eat the dirt, okay?..."  Until parents of any stripe decide their children DON'T need "fixing," crap like this suicide will continue.
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Posted: 28 February 2010 01:44 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 15 ]   

   
 
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I&#;m Free!:
New Expositor, I totally agree with your theory. I have a gay cousin who just came out to us and I'm the only one in my entire extended family that still treats him like a human (my husband and children are 100% supportive of his lifestyle). In any event, he told me that he contemplated suicide MANY times because death seemed like a huge improvement over being a gay man in the LDS church. My sister's stake president's son was gay and killed himself in high school (about 8 years ago). His father, the SP, said (AT THE FUNERAL no less) that he received "a witness" that his son was better off dead than living a life of sin. My sister heard him say it. I think this sort of thing is much more prevalent in the LDS church than the leaders would ever let on. So very Christlike.
 
What a tragedy.
 
I know, should that have been the case, what it feels like, AND how close you can come to doing what this young man did.  I know what it means for a family to say something at least similar to what this SP said.  I would wish that feeling in no one, not even the bastards in the LDS church who say it.   If they only understood it the way LGBT Mormons do, it might be enough to change them.


   


Posted: 28 February 2010 07:18 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 16 ]   

   
 
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They've put their Las Vegas show on hiatus.....
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Posted: 28 February 2010 04:31 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 17 ]   

   
 
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aislin22
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My brother was the same age when he shot himself in our house, in the middle of the night, on mother's day, because he had the delusional idea that my mom waking up and finding him dead would be the best gift he could give her. My brother had just broken up with his girlfriend at the time, and my parents found out he was having sex with her. They were mortified. I will never forget that night for as long as I live. I don't know what the reason behind her son committing suicide, but I know the stronghold TSCC has on young adults. what a tragedy. I feel for her. I don't know how my brother survived, but he did. I wish Marie was so lucky to still have her son. Peace be with her. 

   


Posted: 28 February 2010 04:40 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 18 ]   

   
 
ll
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bradspencer:
I&#;m Free!:
New Expositor, I totally agree with your theory. I have a gay cousin who just came out to us and I'm the only one in my entire extended family that still treats him like a human (my husband and children are 100% supportive of his lifestyle). In any event, he told me that he contemplated suicide MANY times because death seemed like a huge improvement over being a gay man in the LDS church. My sister's stake president's son was gay and killed himself in high school (about 8 years ago). His father, the SP, said (AT THE FUNERAL no less) that he received "a witness" that his son was better off dead than living a life of sin. My sister heard him say it. I think this sort of thing is much more prevalent in the LDS church than the leaders would ever let on. So very Christlike.
 
What a tragedy. 
 
I know, should that have been the case, what it feels like, AND how close you can come to doing what this young man did.  I know what it means for a family to say something at least similar to what this SP said.  I would wish that feeling in no one, not even the bastards in the LDS church who say it.   If they only understood it the way LGBT Mormons do, it might be enough to change them.
 
Brad, I am so sorry that your family treated you with such coldness. This is such a tragedy and a shockingly callous thing to say. Instead of just taking a moment to be sad, the attitude drove the SP's son to such shame and then to suicide, then his own father can't even just feel sad at the loss.
 
I've been thinking of this since the thread started, and all I can feel is sad. This should be classified as abuse worse than beating or neglecting children. It is so unfortunate that social services don't get involved in situations like that.
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Marie Osmond and the Mormon Celebrity  
Posted: 11 December 2009 05:02 AM   [ Ignore ]   

   
 
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Did anyone else catch Marie Osmond on the Ellen show Wednesday? (Yes, I'm a straight male who TiVos Ellen and Oprah. Get off my back about it, will ya.)
 
I didn't know Marie had spoken out against Prop 8, or that she had a gay daughter.
 
It got me thinking. How difficult it must be to be a Mormon and a celebrity. Because if my aunt Susan speaks out against Prop 8, no big deal. But if Marie Osmond does it, or Steve Young's wife, that's a big deal, given their celebrity status.
 
And why does David Archuleta get out of going on a mission? Just because he's a talented singer? I was a talented auto mechanic in my late teens, but I still "had" to go.
 
Seems like being a Mormon celebrity would be more scrutinized than, say, a Jewish celebrity. Could you imagine what would happen if Chelsie Hightower was seen by TMZ partying with Lindsay Lohan? And to be a Mormon celebrity publicly going against the church like Marie? I wonder if she gets a phone call from Headquarters, or did she leave the church long ago? She is divorced, which is another strike against her.


   


Posted: 11 December 2009 06:32 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]   

   
 
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howzer:
Did anyone else catch Marie Osmond on the Ellen show Wednesday? (Yes, I'm a straight male who TiVos Ellen and Oprah. Get off my back about it, will ya.)
 
I didn't know Marie had spoken out against Prop 8, or that she had a gay daughter.
 
It got me thinking. How difficult it must be to be a Mormon and a celebrity. Because if my aunt Susan speaks out against Prop 8, no big deal. But if Marie Osmond does it, or Steve Young's wife, that's a big deal, given their celebrity status.
 
And why does David Archuleta get out of going on a mission? Just because he's a talented singer? I was a talented auto mechanic in my late teens, but I still "had" to go.
 
Seems like being a Mormon celebrity would be more scrutinized than, say, a Jewish celebrity. Could you imagine what would happen if Chelsie Hightower was seen by TMZ partying with Lindsay Lohan? And to be a Mormon celebrity publicly going against the church like Marie? I wonder if she gets a phone call from Headquarters, or did she leave the church long ago? She is divorced, which is another strike against her.
 
Hey howzer!  Welcome to PostMo.  I've always wondered a bit about Marie.  It would be nice to sit down and have a cup of coffee with her.
 
Way back in the early 80s when the sister missionaries were in the process of converting me, Marie Osmond was on the cover of some magazine, and if I remember correctly, she had on a pair of shorts which were not the prescribed legal length to accomodate garments.  The sister missionaries got all hot and bothered because they said that there was NO WAY she could be wearing garments.  They were really upset with Marie.  I remember thinking, WTF? 
 
I should have seen it as a sign.
 
 
ETA:  I suspect if she, and other celebs are paying large chunks of money in the form of tithing, much is overlooked.   
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Posted: 11 December 2009 03:23 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]   

   
 
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If memory serves, Marie spoke out -- but after-the-fact. Too little, too late. 

   


Posted: 11 December 2009 03:48 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]   

   
 
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Marie has a gay child....probably the reason she spoke out. She chose to accept and support that child...not shove her under the bus...like many "mormon christian" parents do. She's to be commended. Her divorces aren't exactly Mormon kosher either.
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Posted: 11 December 2009 06:23 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]   

   
 
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Correct me if I am wrong, but I also believe that Donny countered Marie and in supporting Prop 8.  So perhaps the two Osmonds cross each other out for LDS Media?
 
Once you have your own child, some will do what is best for your their child. I would hazard a guess that Marie has had plenty of exposure to healthy, functional, gay people. So the perception of what "being gay" is different for Marie than some TBM family in a small Mormon town.  Sadly there are too many families that completly reject their child. I am still waiting for a our first Gay Mormon Celebrity!
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Donny Osmond Howard Stern  
Posted: 28 May 2009 12:58 AM   [ Ignore ]   

   
 
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Anyone hear the Donny Osmond interview on Howard Stern today?   It was a repeat from ten years ago or more.  I have to give it to Donny he had balls for doing the interview.  He admitted to masturbating, lusting after other women, doing everything but sinking the battleship before marriage, seeing Marie naked, looking at Playboy, and having to constantly pray for help to not cheat on his wife.
It was a great interview.  I thought he was a douche bag when he came to the MTC to talk to us about how great the Osmonds were.  But after hearing this interview I have a little more respect for his honesty.


   


Posted: 28 May 2009 05:22 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]   

   
 
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Is it available online somewhere? I'd love to give it a listen. 

   


Posted: 30 May 2009 03:28 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]   

   
 
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I couldn't find it. It was great. I just read your band aid post. I tried to type something but our situation is so similiar that I just don't have an answer either. Good luck. 

   


            
 
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Marie Osmond talks about her daughter….on E.T.  
Posted: 21 May 2009 01:10 AM   [ Ignore ]   

   
 
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Tessa
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"So what if my daughter is a Lesbian....I love her.  Why does society have to separate.....???
 
http://www.etonline.com/news/2009/05/74453/index.html
 
Look out church....Marie will defend her daughter...the line in the sand is drawn.
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”I’ve begun worshiping the sun for a number of reasons. First of all, unlike some other gods I could mention, I can see the sun. It’s there for me every day. And the things it brings me are quite apparent all the time: heat, light, food, a lovely day. There’s no mystery, no one asks for money, I don’t have to dress up, and there’s no boring pageantry. And interestingly enough, I have found that the prayers I offer to the sun and the prayers I formerly offered to God are all answered at about the same 50-percent rate.” George Carlin


   


Posted: 21 May 2009 03:43 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]   

   
 
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LessMon
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Kudos to her. As she said, Christ loved everyone ... why can't we just do that?
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“A close examination of the text of the Book of Mormon makes it clear that if the Nephite people had tried to hide from modern archaeologists, they could not have done a better job.”
  — Orson Scott Card (link)


   


Posted: 21 May 2009 03:54 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]   

   
 
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TruthR
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 Yahoo Marie!!!
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Honor The Past, Live The Present, Create The Future

J9 When you need me I am here for you.

If there’s someone who makes your blood boil, thank him.
He’s showing you what you need to know to become a kinder person.
He’s doing the best he can and so are you.
Byron Katie 2008


   


Posted: 21 May 2009 04:00 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]   

   
 
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Tessa
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Marie has proved she follows her heart, not some bigoted religion.
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”I’ve begun worshiping the sun for a number of reasons. First of all, unlike some other gods I could mention, I can see the sun. It’s there for me every day. And the things it brings me are quite apparent all the time: heat, light, food, a lovely day. There’s no mystery, no one asks for money, I don’t have to dress up, and there’s no boring pageantry. And interestingly enough, I have found that the prayers I offer to the sun and the prayers I formerly offered to God are all answered at about the same 50-percent rate.” George Carlin


   


Posted: 21 May 2009 04:53 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]   

   
 
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jackfitzzzzz
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TruthR:
 Yahoo Marie!!!
 
TruthR, did you know that Marie Osmond was once heavy-set like Oprah?
 

(Oh boy, why did I even open my mouth...here comes another beating!)
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“I must remind you that I am a civilized man.  With occasional lapses.”
—King Arthur (Camelot)

“I am not a radical but I think radicals are necessary to society.”

“Women fall for me all the time ... because I trip them.” —Jack

“Well, that’s my .02 cents and believe me, it’s worth every penny.”
 


   


Posted: 21 May 2009 05:14 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]   

   
 
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TruthR
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jackfitzzzzz:
TruthR:
 Yahoo Marie!!!
 
TruthR, did you know that Marie Osmond was once heavy-set like Oprah?
 

(Oh boy, why did I even open my mouth...here comes another beating!)
  (and not the kissy, kissy version)
 
You are a gluten for punishment Mr. Jack.
 
And yes, if you watch the video provided on this thread, Marie says she has lost 50 pounds.
 
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Honor The Past, Live The Present, Create The Future

J9 When you need me I am here for you.

If there’s someone who makes your blood boil, thank him.
He’s showing you what you need to know to become a kinder person.
He’s doing the best he can and so are you.
Byron Katie 2008


   


Posted: 21 May 2009 08:05 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]   

   
 
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NotGaryStu
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Bravo to her!  It warms the heart to hear parents sticking up for their homosexual/genderqueer/transgender children, especially when they're part of a religious organization.
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“Believe me I am not part of the mind control cult.  Whatever that is supposed to be.”
-Nathan Young
NotGaryStu: Exploring diverse warm fuzzies since 2009.


   


Posted: 21 May 2009 11:46 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]   

   
 
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JustThinkin
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That's awesome! Maybe my mom will see this and remember that she once felt the same way about me.
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She went through the wet wild woods, waving her wild tail, and walking by her wild lone. But she never told anybody. (With apologies to R. Kipling for the gender change)


   


Posted: 21 May 2009 12:52 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]   

   
 
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ClearThoughts
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JustThinkin:
That's awesome! Maybe my mom will see this and remember that she once felt the same way about me.
Oh JustThinkin , That completely and totally sucks.  I hope one day she will see the light.  You know, Marie does like to adopt.....you're never too old to be adopted......it's worth a try.    
 
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One must live, not just exist. - French proverb


   


Posted: 21 May 2009 12:57 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]   

   
 
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gingerbreadapron
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I lived in Marie's ward for a few years and she was my visiting teacher for a while.  I am SO proud of her.  I have been so pleased with the way she has handled herself.  So many mormon women have admiration and respect for Marie, I hope this might make at least some of them stop and think about their own views on the subject. 

   


Posted: 21 May 2009 03:36 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]   

   
 
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MsGabbie
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I have always liked Marie Osmond.  I think she's classy, funny as hell and tough as nails.   I hope other LDS mothers of gay children follow her example!
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http://takingonmothernature.wordpress.com
I didn’t leave because I wanted to sin.  I left because I wanted a life!  The “sinning” was merely a bonus.

Ignorance is NOT bliss….it’s just ignorance!

To wonder is to begin to understand.

All animals dream.  Only dogs dream of us.


   


Posted: 21 May 2009 03:53 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]   

   
 
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Tessa
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Another famous person's mother is Ellen DeGeneres' mother...who has always loved her daughter unconditionally. She isn't Morg, but has set the example for all parents of gay children....a great person.
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”I’ve begun worshiping the sun for a number of reasons. First of all, unlike some other gods I could mention, I can see the sun. It’s there for me every day. And the things it brings me are quite apparent all the time: heat, light, food, a lovely day. There’s no mystery, no one asks for money, I don’t have to dress up, and there’s no boring pageantry. And interestingly enough, I have found that the prayers I offer to the sun and the prayers I formerly offered to God are all answered at about the same 50-percent rate.” George Carlin


   


Posted: 21 May 2009 04:07 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]   

   
 
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JustThinkin
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ClearThoughts:
JustThinkin:
That's awesome! Maybe my mom will see this and remember that she once felt the same way about me.
Oh JustThinkin , That completely and totally sucks.  I hope one day she will see the light.  You know, Marie does like to adopt.....you're never too old to be adopted......it's worth a try.    
 
 
 I suspect Marie has a lot more money to pass on than my parents do. Wait, though --- too many children have to split it. Besides, she's my age -- that'd just be weird. Now if she'd like to become my sugar mama. . .  nah - not my type.  
 
As for Mom -- I suspect she's displaying some incipient mental aging issues and that what I'm seeing now are real feelings that she's been considerately hiding. She gets props for years of good intentions and forgiveness for age getting the better of her.
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She went through the wet wild woods, waving her wild tail, and walking by her wild lone. But she never told anybody. (With apologies to R. Kipling for the gender change)


   


Posted: 21 May 2009 05:53 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]   

   
 
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jackfitzzzzz
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MsGabbieu:
I have always liked Marie Osmond.  I think she's classy, funny as hell and tough as nails.   I hope other LDS mothers of gay children follow her example!
 
I like Marie Osmond too and it is admirable that she is supporting her gay daughter.  But as I mentioned in another thread several months ago, there is still the $64 Million Dollar Question:
 

Would Marie Osmond be as dogmatic and outspoken and supportive of gay rights if she did not have any children who were gay?
 

Perhaps I am being cynical, but I think the answer is no.  Why mix it up with the Church if you don't have to.  She has a vested interest in doing so now, because of her daughter.  It is difficult for the Church to criticize her for supporting her child. 
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“I must remind you that I am a civilized man.  With occasional lapses.”
—King Arthur (Camelot)

“I am not a radical but I think radicals are necessary to society.”

“Women fall for me all the time ... because I trip them.” —Jack

“Well, that’s my .02 cents and believe me, it’s worth every penny.”
 


   


Posted: 21 May 2009 05:55 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]   

   
 
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Tessa
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Except she's in the "biz" and is surrounded by gay people, and knows how kind and wonderful they are....probably more so than the "lay" membership of the church. So the answer could also be "yes"....
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”I’ve begun worshiping the sun for a number of reasons. First of all, unlike some other gods I could mention, I can see the sun. It’s there for me every day. And the things it brings me are quite apparent all the time: heat, light, food, a lovely day. There’s no mystery, no one asks for money, I don’t have to dress up, and there’s no boring pageantry. And interestingly enough, I have found that the prayers I offer to the sun and the prayers I formerly offered to God are all answered at about the same 50-percent rate.” George Carlin


   


Posted: 21 May 2009 06:01 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 15 ]   

   
 
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jackfitzzzzz
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Tessa:
Except she's in the "biz" and is surrounded by gay people, and knows how kind and wonderful they are....probably more so than the "lay" membership of the church. So the answer could also be "yes"....
 
The answer could definitely be "yes."  However, she has been in show business for over 40 years and up until now has been silent on gay rights.  Everyone knows who the Hollywood celebrities are who champion gay rights and Marie Osmond has not been one of them.  Until now.
 

Just saying...
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“I must remind you that I am a civilized man.  With occasional lapses.”
—King Arthur (Camelot)

“I am not a radical but I think radicals are necessary to society.”

“Women fall for me all the time ... because I trip them.” —Jack

“Well, that’s my .02 cents and believe me, it’s worth every penny.”
 


   


Posted: 21 May 2009 06:16 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 16 ]   

   
 
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Tessa
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She could have also "banned" her daughter from the home and been a "stiff-necked" mormon....she didn't. Wonder how many non-mormon show-biz folks stand up for gay rights?
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”I’ve begun worshiping the sun for a number of reasons. First of all, unlike some other gods I could mention, I can see the sun. It’s there for me every day. And the things it brings me are quite apparent all the time: heat, light, food, a lovely day. There’s no mystery, no one asks for money, I don’t have to dress up, and there’s no boring pageantry. And interestingly enough, I have found that the prayers I offer to the sun and the prayers I formerly offered to God are all answered at about the same 50-percent rate.” George Carlin


   


Posted: 21 May 2009 07:03 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 17 ]   

   
 
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MsGabbie
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jackfitzzzzz:
MsGabbieu:
I have always liked Marie Osmond.  I think she's classy, funny as hell and tough as nails.   I hope other LDS mothers of gay children follow her example!
 
I like Marie Osmond too and it is admirable that she is supporting her gay daughter.  But as I mentioned in another thread several months ago, there is still the $64 Million Dollar Question:
 

Would Marie Osmond be as dogmatic and outspoken and supportive of gay rights if she did not have any children who were gay?
 

Perhaps I am being cynical, but I think the answer is no.  Why mix it up with the Church if you don't have to.  She has a vested interest in doing so now, because of her daughter.  It is difficult for the Church to criticize her for supporting her child. 
 
I think it is a little unfair to blame her for not speaking out for gay rights until she has a vested interest.  I think this is something that happens to us all on a variety of subjects.  Until we have walked in anothers' shoes and seen the other side of the issue, we often keep our opinions to ourselves.
 
For example - until I became an ExMo....it never occurred to me what an ExMo endured, especially an ExMo living in the land of Zion where LDS, Inc. influenced laws for all to live under.   I was not able to see the other side.  No doubt this has given Marie a chance to see the other side firsthand, and that always provides a new perspective. 
 
It is a heartbreaking reality that many LDS parents reject their gay children, and their rejection is supported by the church and it's members.  I applaud Marie Osmond for publicly supporting her gay daughter instead doing what so many others have done and rejected her completely. 
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~MsGabbie smile
http://takingonmothernature.wordpress.com
I didn’t leave because I wanted to sin.  I left because I wanted a life!  The “sinning” was merely a bonus.

Ignorance is NOT bliss….it’s just ignorance!

To wonder is to begin to understand.

All animals dream.  Only dogs dream of us.


   


Posted: 21 May 2009 07:07 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 18 ]   

   
 
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Tessa
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I think it is a little unfair to blame her for not speaking out for gay rights until she has a vested interest.
There are many people who are never "put-to-the-test" on how they feel about gay rights, until they have children who are, have friends who are, have husbands/wives who are...(Carol Lynn Pearson comes to mind.) It's how they react and accept/reject that's truly important. Most people don't sit around and discuss sexuality all day....contrary to rumor.
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”I’ve begun worshiping the sun for a number of reasons. First of all, unlike some other gods I could mention, I can see the sun. It’s there for me every day. And the things it brings me are quite apparent all the time: heat, light, food, a lovely day. There’s no mystery, no one asks for money, I don’t have to dress up, and there’s no boring pageantry. And interestingly enough, I have found that the prayers I offer to the sun and the prayers I formerly offered to God are all answered at about the same 50-percent rate.” George Carlin


   


Posted: 21 May 2009 07:16 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 19 ]   

   
 
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Hiker Daddy
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Tessa:
 
 
I think it is a little unfair to blame her for not speaking out for gay rights until she has a vested interest.
 
 
There are many people who are never "put-to-the-test" on how they feel about gay rights, until they have children who are, have friends who are, have husbands/wives who are...(Carol Lynn Pearson comes to mind.) It's how they react and accept/reject that's truly important. Most people don't sit around and discuss sexuality all day....contrary to rumor.
 Why not?
 
Actually I agree with you.  Marie didn't publicly stand up for gay rights until recently but I don't fault her for that.   I admire people that don't need a vested interest to stand up for another person's human rights but that is actually quite rare.  
 
There are dozens of important causes in the world that I am doing next to nothing about partly because I don't have a personal connection.  For example, I think what is happening in Darfur is horrible but I haven't done much about it.  If I knew someone affected personally, I might become more motivated.  Most people need a vested interest to act.
 
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Posted: 21 May 2009 07:29 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 20 ]   

   
 
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Tessa
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Most people need a vested interest to act.
 
 
Thinking of all the actors/rich-and-famous who suddenly are working for "Autism Research" because they have children with the syndrome.
 
Even Jesus reacted to the human conditions he observed...the woman had to "touch" him before she was healed.
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”I’ve begun worshiping the sun for a number of reasons. First of all, unlike some other gods I could mention, I can see the sun. It’s there for me every day. And the things it brings me are quite apparent all the time: heat, light, food, a lovely day. There’s no mystery, no one asks for money, I don’t have to dress up, and there’s no boring pageantry. And interestingly enough, I have found that the prayers I offer to the sun and the prayers I formerly offered to God are all answered at about the same 50-percent rate.” George Carlin


   


Posted: 21 May 2009 08:00 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 21 ]   

   
 
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jackfitzzzzz
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MsGabbieu:
jackfitzzzzz:
MsGabbieu:
I have always liked Marie Osmond.  I think she's classy, funny as hell and tough as nails.   I hope other LDS mothers of gay children follow her example!
 
I like Marie Osmond too and it is admirable that she is supporting her gay daughter.  But as I mentioned in another thread several months ago, there is still the $64 Million Dollar Question:
 

Would Marie Osmond be as dogmatic and outspoken and supportive of gay rights if she did not have any children who were gay?
 

Perhaps I am being cynical, but I think the answer is no.  Why mix it up with the Church if you don't have to.  She has a vested interest in doing so now, because of her daughter.  It is difficult for the Church to criticize her for supporting her child. 
 
I think it is a little unfair to blame her for not speaking out for gay rights until she has a vested interest.  I think this is something that happens to us all on a variety of subjects.  Until we have walked in anothers' shoes and seen the other side of the issue, we often keep our opinions to ourselves.
 
 
I'm not "blaming" Marie Osmond for anything.  I'm simply pointing out that, with over 40 years in show business and having been exposed to more gay people than the average Mormon, Marie Osmond has not been a gay rights advocate.  If you disagree with that then simply respond and say, "I think you're wrong Jack, Marie Osmond has been a gay rights advocate for years and the fact that her daughter is gay has nothing to do with her support of gay rights...Marie has always strongly and vocally supported gay rights."
 

ORANGE ABOVE:  Is it your opinion that Marie has always held strong opinions for gay rights but choose to keep her opinions to herself until it hit home when her own daughter came out?  I trying to think what might have influenced Marie not to speak out for gay rights even though she may have held strong gay rights beliefs?
 

Could Marie simply have kept quiet knowing that her Church considers gay people to be sick demonic sinners (that can be "cured").  What does that say about her.
 

My opinion is that the only reason that Marie is vocal now is because of her daughter.  She had 40 years to speak out for the gay cause and not a word came out of her mouth.  Now she's all onboard with "they are people just like the rest of us."  
 
Again, I still think she should be commended for supporting her daughter.  Many parents, both inside the Church and out, would not and have not done the same. 


 
 Signature
“I must remind you that I am a civilized man.  With occasional lapses.”
—King Arthur (Camelot)

“I am not a radical but I think radicals are necessary to society.”

“Women fall for me all the time ... because I trip them.” —Jack

“Well, that’s my .02 cents and believe me, it’s worth every penny.”
 


   


Posted: 21 May 2009 08:29 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 22 ]   

   
 
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MsGabbie
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jackfitzzzzz:

I'm not "blaming" Marie Osmond for anything.  I'm simply pointing out that, with over 40 years in show business and having been exposed to more gay people than the average Mormon, Marie Osmond has not been a gay rights advocate.  If you disagree with that then simply respond and say, "I think you're wrong Jack, Marie Osmond has been a gay rights advocate for years and the fact that her daughter is gay has nothing to do with her support of gay rights...Marie has always strongly and vocally supported gay rights."
 

ORANGE ABOVE:  Is it your opinion that Marie has always held strong opinions for gay rights but choose to keep her opinions to herself until it hit home when her own daughter came out?  I trying to think what might have influenced Marie not to speak out for gay rights even though she may have held strong gay rights beliefs?
 

Could Marie simply have kept quiet knowing that her Church considers gay people to be sick demonic sinners (that can be "cured").  What does that say about her.
 

My opinion is that the only reason that Marie is vocal now is because of her daughter.  She had 40 years to speak out for the gay cause and not a word came out of her mouth.  Now she's all onboard with "they are people just like the rest of us."  
 
Again, I still think she should be commended for supporting her daughter.  Many parents, both inside the Church and out, would not and have not done the same. 


 
 
Jack.....I think you missed my point.  For many of us imperfect humans, until we have a vested interest in a social issue, we usually don't have an opinion that we express publicly if it is in contradiction to our religious beliefs.  Even harder to do if you are in the public eye and everyone knows your religious affiliation.  I share your opinion that the only reason she is speaking out now is because her daughter is gay....I'm just not holding it against her that she didn't feel so inclined to become a gay rights activist before now.  I'm assuming she has privately supported her daughter for years.  I am also assuming the reason why she chose now to speak publicly about gay rights is because the tabloids are involved and she probably didn't want them making up stories about her NOT supporting her daughter.
 
Maybe 30 years ago she believed homosexuality was a sin (given her religious upbringing it's possible) and maybe now she realizes sexual orientation shouldn't be a reason to limit civil rights.  As we go through life, we learn, we grow, and guess what...sometimes we change our opinions.  This very well could be the case for her. 
 
Why turn the good thing she has done - supporting her gay daughter publicly DESPITE her religious upbringing - into a negative?  What purpose does that serve?
 
 
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~MsGabbie :)
http://takingonmothernature.wordpress.com
I didn’t leave because I wanted to sin.  I left because I wanted a life!  The “sinning” was merely a bonus.

Ignorance is NOT bliss….it’s just ignorance!

To wonder is to begin to understand.

All animals dream.  Only dogs dream of us.


   


Posted: 21 May 2009 09:13 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 23 ]   

   
 
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wesmanlv
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activists in the GLBTQ community have a startegy regarding coming out -and that strategy states that more people will support GLBTQ causes when they actually know someone who is gay. When you find out someone you know is gay is not the horrible demon once portrayed by the religious right your attitude often is more open. we are seeing that more and more. Marie is another example of that. She will also be an example t many LDS parents though i'm sure many LDS parents are passing hideous judgement on her.
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Posted: 21 May 2009 09:15 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 24 ]   

   
 
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Maybe the question should be directed to Marie's parents, did they advocate for gay rights?? What did they teach her about being "accepting" of everyone?? (Don't think they would have survived long in the business if they'd been raising hugely bigoted children.)
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Posted: 21 May 2009 09:53 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 25 ]   

   
 
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Tessa:
Maybe the question should be directed to Marie's parents, did they advocate for gay rights?? What did they teach her about being "accepting" of everyone?? (Don't think they would have survived long in the business if they'd been raising hugely bigoted children.)
 
Do you think her parents were a little bit country or a little bit rock-and-roll?
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Posted: 22 May 2009 12:02 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 26 ]   

   
 
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Now that is the question!!!
 
Actually, they first were "barber-shop" (Andy Williams Show) then morphed.
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Posted: 22 May 2009 12:57 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 27 ]   

   
 
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wesmanlv:
activists in the GLBTQ community have a startegy regarding coming out -and that strategy states that more people will support GLBTQ causes when they actually know someone who is gay. When you find out someone you know is gay is not the horrible demon once portrayed by the religious right your attitude often is more open. we are seeing that more and more. Marie is another example of that. She will also be an example t many LDS parents though i'm sure many LDS parents are passing hideous judgement on her.
I've seen this first hand. 
An acquaintance of mine, who is somewhat religious (not mormon), told me he felt conflicted over Prop.8.  But he voted against it because he knows and likes me and my partner.  He told me his vote was for us.  He did it in spite of what his church said.  I thought that was one of the most generous gifts I'd ever been given. 
 
My hat's off to Marie.  She loves her daughter more than her dogma. 
 
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Posted: 22 May 2009 01:06 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 28 ]   

   
 
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We can't support everything and everyone isn't political. We all have causes we support. Due to the constraints of time and money, we can't support everything we'd like. I haven't been active in support of gay marriage although I do believe in it. I do support other causes that are closer to my heart. That doesn't make me anti gay or a bigot anymore than you not supporting the causes I believe in makes you anti whatever.
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Posted: 22 May 2009 02:57 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 29 ]   

   
 
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wesmanlv:
activists in the GLBTQ community have a startegy regarding coming out -and that strategy states that more people will support GLBTQ causes when they actually know someone who is gay. When you find out someone you know is gay is not the horrible demon once portrayed by the religious right your attitude often is more open. we are seeing that more and more. Marie is another example of that. She will also be an example t many LDS parents though i'm sure many LDS parents are passing hideous judgement on her.
 
 That's been my experience with some of the people around here.  Some like to just ignore it and make no comment, others agree with her, and still others scorn her for it.  I think it just makes what she's doing all the more admirable.
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Posted: 22 May 2009 05:56 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 30 ]   

   
 
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When I saw her on ET the other night I was a little mixed.
I've always been a Marie fan.  (Donnie not so much as he lacks any real depth of character when he sings... like a sweet  loveable smiley happy  clone)
 
I thought it was great to see her  support her daughter. 
She said she was Christian and Jesus would love, etc
 
Then my husband and I wondered how she could justify the above with her own Mormon religions doctrines on a  strong stand against gay relationships.   
How does her mind claim she's Christian and grasp an idea of Christs actions and yet come to terms with the very true fact that Mormonism doesn't embrace homosexuality in the same way she just stated.    
 
Maybe this is an opening for her to recognize the differences?
Maybe not.
Time will tell how strong the mormon program is and if it does battle with her definitions of Christ which on this point are very different in detail and application to life within mormonism.
 
I'm rooting for Marie to see the differences and represent strongly on the differences.
 
...it might happen....   
although I'm not holding my breath.
 
 
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Posted: 22 May 2009 06:13 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 31 ]   

   
 
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Joan:
...Then my husband and I wondered how she could justify the above with her own Mormon religions doctrines on a strong stand against gay relationships.  How does her mind claim she's Christian and grasp an idea of Christs actions and yet come to terms with the very true fact that Mormonism doesn't embrace homosexuality in the same way she just stated.   
...although I'm not holding my breath.
 
 
Simple, in a very mentally unhealthy way.  You know the ropes, once you become sort of familiar with some of the minor inconsistencies and then the greater lies, involving the continuously deceptive practices encountered on a nearly daily basis.  By using nearly celebrity super human powers to insulate the dodging reality from the rest of your personal, not only disastrously upsetting, but potentially lethal world of coming crisis, it soon seems simple and easy.
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Posted: 22 May 2009 06:19 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 32 ]   

   
 
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as i've stated before -hurray for Marie and my energy and love go to her for taking this stand.
 
 
I am wondering about the daughter. Is she/was she a mormon? if so, what will the church do to her? what effect will all that have?
 
 
any thoughts anyone?
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Posted: 22 May 2009 06:25 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 33 ]   

   
 
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wesmanlv:
as i've stated before -hurray for Marie and my energy and love go to her for taking this stand.
 
 
I am wondering about the daughter. Is she/was she a mormon? if so, what will the church do to her? what effect will all that have?
 
 
any thoughts anyone?
If this is reliable (add salt), then I don't think she's that active. 
 
"Marie always envisioned Jessica being active in the Mormon church, going on a mission somewhere, marrying a great guy and giving her lost of grandchildren, but it's doubtful that's ever going to happen. Jessica and her partner consider themselves married, even though the haven't had an official ceremony. They've been together for about three years now and seem to be pretty happy," said a family insider.
When Jessica was 21, she and her then 16-year-old sister Rachel posted sexual explicit statements on their Myspace pages. Jessica posted that she was bi-sexual and wants to have sex "as many times as possible"; Rachel described herself as a "slut" and a "whore" who fantasized about David Bowie. (Rachel has since curtailed her slutty ways.)
"Marie just doesn't understand Jessica's lifestyle and it upsets her. She tries not to be too critical and often has to bite her tongue when they're together. Still, they've gotten into a lot of heated arguments," the insider said.
 
That's from a couple of months ago.
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Posted: 22 May 2009 06:26 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 34 ]   

   
 
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Who knows...Marie could be "tweetering" here....(Waves to Marie.) Seriously...don't think Marie is going to be downing the church or it's policies any time soon...too many "religious" brothers, and honoring her father/mother and their thick mormon family. (Remember...she's had two divorces...not exactly the "prime" of LDS thinking at best....(woman are supposed to just sit and take it.)
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Posted: 22 May 2009 10:12 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 35 ]   

   
 
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josephs myth:
Joan:
...Then my husband and I wondered how she could justify the above with her own Mormon religions doctrines on a strong stand against gay relationships.  How does her mind claim she's Christian and grasp an idea of Christs actions and yet come to terms with the very true fact that Mormonism doesn't embrace homosexuality in the same way she just stated.   
...although I'm not holding my breath.
 
 
Simple, in a very mentally unhealthy way.  You know the ropes, once you become sort of familiar with some of the minor inconsistencies and then the greater lies, involving the continuously deceptive practices encountered on a nearly daily basis.  By using nearly celebrity super human powers to insulate the dodging reality from the rest of your personal, not only disastrously upsetting, but potentially lethal world of coming crisis, it soon seems simple and easy.
 
 How did I forget.   How could I?
 
I don't think I forgot so much as I occasionally am aware of putting quite a barrier between my new self and old self that sometimes it's difficult for me to cross back over to figure it out.  Sometimes I identify easily.  This time apparently I didn't.
 But you're right,  and I did the same thing  in my own life with a lot of ease and conviction.   I didn't look for it to make any sense if it was going to cast the church in a bad light.  I always looked for ways to bend everything back to justify Mormonism in any way I could.   
 
And of course the corporation isn't likely to slap the O's  down when Marie  is a big  tithe payer and the O's are celeb  missionary member image boosters on E.T. every other week.     ((as much as I;ve always enjoyed Marie I can't for the life of me fiure out why on earth they showcase the Osmonds so much.   Their a 70's has been group who are E, no F  listers at best and unless the corp or buena vista entertainment own E.Tonight and allow the O's to get mo  coverage it's all beyond me.    That's not the point of this thread but I've always been curious about it.
 
Anyway,  I wish them all the best b/c I know how hard it was when I had to rearrange my mind to understand love in a very different way than I'd ever been taught in mormonism.    It's not easy and good luck to them all. 
 
 
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Why Do LDS Folks Look for other Famous LDS Folks So Much??  
Posted: 07 February 2009 04:21 PM   [ Ignore ]   

   
 
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Posted: 07 February 2009 04:46 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]   

   
 
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I think they just want validation that "one of their own" can succeed.  Like last year's American Idol.  All the mormons I know were hoping for Archeleta (no clue on spelling) to win, even my DH.  I found that weird because my DH doesn't listen to the slow, sappy music that Archeleta does, however, Cook fit his style really well.  When I pointed out to my DH that he would never listen to a cd created by Archeleta, but would probably wear out a Cook cd he had nothing to say.  He didn't seem to care so much about whose music he liked better, just wanted to see a mormon win.
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Posted: 07 February 2009 04:47 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]   

   
 
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My TBM wife looks for famous Mormons because it makes her perceive the religion as having more status.  It comforts her.  It helps her believe that prophecies are coming true.  It reduces her nagging sense of being secondary or excluded.
 
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Posted: 07 February 2009 04:48 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]   

   
 
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It makes me laugh when they claim popular illuminaries who in fact are not LDS.
Steve Martin comes to mind.
 
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Posted: 07 February 2009 04:51 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]   

   
 
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I bet plenty of people are upset that the Osmond was sent home during group week.
 
I also agree.  It's validation that the church is true for them.  I don't have friends going "WOOOOO that one's a UU like me... WOOOO"
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Posted: 07 February 2009 05:39 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]   

   
 
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It's the "SEE, even famous people know we have the truth" kind of thing, I guess long face 

   


Posted: 07 February 2009 05:46 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]   

   
 
sciencezgood
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coffeenow:
I bet plenty of people are upset that the Osmond was sent home during group week.
 
I also agree.  It's validation that the church is true for them.  I don't have friends going "WOOOOO that one's a UU like me... WOOOO"
 
HILARIOUS!!


   


Posted: 07 February 2009 05:53 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]   

   
 
MoNoMan
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hypatia:
It makes me laugh when they claim popular illuminaries who in fact are not LDS.
Steve Martin comes to mind.
 
Never underestimate the power of a faith promoting rumor.
 


   


Posted: 07 February 2009 07:19 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]   

   
 
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I've been reading a book called "Influence: The Psychology of Persusasion" by Robert C. Cialdini that talks about this phenomenon. He says that people like associating themselves with celebrities (or other successful people) because not only does it make them look more impressive to others, but it also makes them more impressive to themselves. It gives people the feeling of having a higher status. For this reason, people try to associate themselves--even superficially--with things that make them look good, and they distance themselves from things that would make them look bad.
 
It reminds me of how TBMs credit TSCC with the high rate of physical health in Utah, but distance TSCC from having anything to do with the high rate of anti-depressant use and high suicide rate. Scientologists like to associate themselves with Tom Cruise and John Travolta because it makes them look good to be associated with successful people. Mormons do the same thing with the Osmonds, Gladys Knight, etc. It's an ego thing.
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Posted: 07 February 2009 07:32 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]   

   
 
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My dad called me one time and told me Gladys Knight was on KSL singing with the Tabernacle Choir..hmmm..I came so close to asking him why she was white and delightsome...??? I figured that would change my mind about the church as end all questions. How many of us have heard different stories about Elvis and he receiving the Book of Mormon..almost converting??? That went around on all different levels.
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Posted: 07 February 2009 09:20 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]   

   
 
hartlyn
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It validates them to have celebs in their church.  (head:  meet desk) Funny thing is, Amy Adams and Aaron Eckhardt (sp?) acknowledge being raised Mormon but both admit to being inactive.
 
Todd Herzog is gay and admitted to being inactive, so not many Mormons were hoping he'd win on Survivor.
 
Aside from Gladys Knight (LOL My Turn--why hasn't she turned white and delightsome yet?) they have newly-minted celeb Stephenie Meyer, who writes unbearably bad fanfiction romance.
 
I remember hearing Jimmy Buffett and Alice Cooper (Vincent  Fournier sp?) were Mormons.  Fournier is actually the son of a Presbyterian minister (yeah, I was a kid in the '70's, and my cousin was a huge AC fan who talked of little else for an entire year).  
 
I think the biggest fish, though, was John Paul I.  He'd read the B of M, believed it, and was assassinated for it.  Dude, even the Pope secretly wanted to be a Mormon, and, like Joseph Smith, was assassinated for his beliefs!  
 
/snark
 
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Posted: 08 February 2009 12:09 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]   

   
 
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They used to trot out Steve Young, now it's the Osmonds, just waiting for "Mormon" high media popularity conventions to be begun around the country....wait, they are in Branson and Vegas and L.A. and.....
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Posted: 08 February 2009 12:22 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]   

   
 
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sciencezgood:
I've noticed that Mormons, including my TBM DW, are always combing the internet for famous Mormons. Why is that? Why do they need a hero? Is this a cult thing? How does a famous person being Mormon validate anything?
 
 Everybody wants their narrative validated, you, me, your TBM DW.
 
Problem is, that for a religion that claims to have "THE TRUTH ®" and the exclussive claim on "The Holy Ghost ®" they should be far more sucessful in all areas of endeavor than they are.
 
There are just as many Jews in the world as there are Mormons, but famous Jews far outweigh famous Mormons in every endeavor, except maybe sports. 
 
 
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Posted: 08 February 2009 12:43 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]   

   
 
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This subject has just fascinated me for some time now.  You see, I have a son who is a "Famous Mormon".  He's on some Famous Mormon web page, and been written about in several church magazines, and other books, etc. 
 
His TBM mother of course, just eats it up.  She is a constant source of embarrassment to my son, who does not see himself as famous. 
 
The poor guy can't go anywhere with her but what she introduces our son as her famous Mormon son.   She talks endlessly to perfect strangers whom I am sure could care less, just like my kid. 
 
I just shake my head and walk off, and shortly my kid will excuse himself from the conversation and catch up with me, so he can be "Normal" again.  He hates the attention, but his mother just won't let it alone.  It's like it somehow validates her as a TBM mom.   She keeps shamelessly promoting this kid, when he would prefer that it all just went away. 
 
I'm not sure how much Mormonism he really believes, but I think he is mostly in it because his wife believes it makes their lives better. 
 
I am also fascinated that Mormons think that someone famous somehow makes a difference in their religion.     I dunno.
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Posted: 08 February 2009 03:12 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]   

   
 
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I love finding out a certain famous person is/was LDS. I think its cool that Stephenie Meyer was not only LDS, but a BYU grad. I guess it's for validation, that someone so well-known is/was in the Church. LDS people are a minority--at least outside of Utah--so it's nice when someone "peculiar" like you is famous. Almost all universities have a list of "notable alumni" for the same reason, people like when famous people are like them--whether it is race, religion, sexuality, political leanings, etc.
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Posted: 08 February 2009 03:21 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 15 ]   

   
 
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Posted: 08 February 2009 05:46 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 16 ]   

   
 
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sciencezgood:
hartlyn:
It validates them to have celebs in their church.  (head:  meet desk) Funny thing is, Amy Adams and Aaron Eckhardt (sp?) acknowledge being raised Mormon but both admit to being inactive.
 
Todd Herzog is gay and admitted to being inactive, so not many Mormons were hoping he'd win on Survivor.
 
Aside from Gladys Knight (LOL My Turn--why hasn't she turned white and delightsome yet?) they have newly-minted celeb Stephenie Meyer, who writes unbearably bad fanfiction romance.
 
I remember hearing Jimmy Buffett and Alice Cooper (Vincent  Fournier sp?) were Mormons.  Fournier is actually the son of a Presbyterian minister (yeah, I was a kid in the '70's, and my cousin was a huge AC fan who talked of little else for an entire year).  
 
I think the biggest fish, though, was John Paul I.  He'd read the B of M, believed it, and was assassinated for it.  Dude, even the Pope secretly wanted to be a Mormon, and, like Joseph Smith, was assassinated for his beliefs!  
 
/snark
 
hartlyn
 
Gladys Knight is Mormon?!
Wait a minute... is this like that Chappelle episode where the old, blind, black KKK guy doesn't know he's black?
 
I can't imagine that there are many blacks (or anyone less than 'delightsome') or gays in LDS. Do they not know LDS history prior to 1978? Frankly, I think it's surprising they get women in there. But then I remember that the Catholics were able to get women in the aisles as well.
 
Another Mormon question... if whites were the only ones to get the priesthood prior to 1978, how did Jesus get to go to heaven (certainly he wasn't as delightsome as JS)?
 
Also, from John the Apostle (of New Testament fame) until 1820, all the churches were wrong and the Mormons weren't baptizing any of those dead dudes and dudettes. Where are all those dead people? Are they in outer darkness still? Do the Mormons really think they've found the records of all those dead folks? 
Gladys Knight and Thurl Bailey...this is sad because the church (IMO) puts
them in a realm of "show and tell"....you would think that my Dad would
not believe these things while looking at my "lamanite" foster sister..gees!
 
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Posted: 08 February 2009 06:12 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 17 ]   

   
 
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Vickie, I'd forgotten about Thurl Bailey too.  He and Sister Gladys must be sincere about the Morg or they would be posting here by now   LOL at your "show and tell" remark.  See!  We aren't racist!  We have TWO famous black people here!  And we let them sing with the MoTabs! We let Thurl star in one of our movies! Now if we could just get some other famous people of color we'd look really cool.  
 
The snark is thick today; once again, community, my humble apologies.
 
hartlyn
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Posted: 08 February 2009 07:26 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 18 ]   

   
 
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Seriously, How do Mormons view the issue of Jesus' darker skin? I'm seriously curious. Seems like some serious CogDis would be happening. 

   


Posted: 08 February 2009 10:06 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 19 ]   

   
 
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sciencezgood:
Seriously, How do Mormons view the issue of Jesus' darker skin? I'm seriously curious. Seems like some serious CogDis would be happening.
 "Their" Jesus looks like a Teutonic warrior prince, that's why--and has ever since the Renaissance.
 
hartlyn
 
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Posted: 08 February 2009 11:21 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 20 ]   

   
 
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hartlyn:
sciencezgood:
Seriously, How do Mormons view the issue of Jesus' darker skin? I'm seriously curious. Seems like some serious CogDis would be happening.
 "Their" Jesus looks like a Teutonic warrior prince, that's why--and has ever since the Renaissance.
 
hartlyn
 
 
 You wouldn't be talking about the most recent "Irish" Jesus that most LDS have on their walls these days would you?
 
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Posted: 09 February 2009 12:23 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 21 ]   

   
 
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Max:
I dunno, members don't invite me to their houses   Are you referring, perhaps to Greg Olson's paintings?  Jesus is tanned, with darker hair but with blue eyes.
 
Is the "Irish Jesus" the one we jokingly called Jesus' Senior Photo--the one with the red cloak.  He's blond and blue-eyed.  
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An Osmond on Idol?  
Posted: 29 January 2009 04:50 PM   [ Ignore ]   

   
 
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YesIAmAPyr8
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What's up with that?
 
Is the Empire of Osmondia losing it's status in the world of entertainment?
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
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Posted: 29 January 2009 05:57 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]   

   
 
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YesIAmAPyr:
What's up with that?
 
Is the Empire of Osmondia losing it's status in the world of entertainment?
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Reference, please.  (We are not all in Utah.)
 


   


Posted: 29 January 2009 05:58 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]   

   
 
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YesIAmAPyr:
What's up with that?
 
Is the Empire of Osmondia losing it's status in the world of entertainment?
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Why has something happened?
 
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Posted: 29 January 2009 06:03 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]   

   
 
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YesIAmAPyr:
What's up with that?
 
Is the Empire of Osmondia losing it's status in the world of entertainment?
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 Well Marie WAS on Dancing With the Stars....
 
Is there anyone on that show who still has an A-list career?  Dancing With the Stars is where careers go after they have already died when the bodies don't qualify for the porn industry.
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Posted: 29 January 2009 06:07 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]   

   
 
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Alan Osmond has been trying to recreate the success of his youth via his own sons for years. In the late 80s, in the wake of The New Kids on the Block craze, he trotted out "The Osmond Boys" to perform. They were pretty bland and made the orginal Osmond Brothers sound like Judas Priest.
 
I knew Alan back then and he frankly told me he hoped his boys would become famous "so they won't have to go on missions."
 
The kid wasn't bad. He had a voice that works for a show like Idol, I thought. The sad part is that Alan has MS and this kid who audtioned last night has it as well. That's got to be quite a blow.

Personally, I liked the Amy Winehouse sounding chick.


   


Posted: 29 January 2009 06:31 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]   

   
 
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DrW:
YesIAmAPyr:
What's up with that?
 
Is the Empire of Osmondia losing it's status in the world of entertainment?
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Reference, please.  (We are not all in Utah.)
 
 
The Pirate was shocked, shocked!, to see an Osmond family member audition with the great unwashed herds for American Idol (a nationally broadcast television show featuring aspiring singers who compete for the ultimate title of 'American Idol' and the accompanying benefits thereto).
 
I would have thought that the Osmond's would not need to attempt a break into 'showbiz' via this portal, what with a sizeable contact list of people in entertainment they must have on their collective Blackberries.  Showbiz thrives on the 'networking' between agents, managers, promoters, A & R's, et al.  You'd think that if the Osmonds are still in the industry, they could call in a few markers and get the kid a decent contract to get things going.
 
I'm just sayin'....
 
 
ETA:  You DO know who the Osmonds are, yes?
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Posted: 29 January 2009 09:07 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]   

   
 
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link???


   


Posted: 29 January 2009 09:22 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]   

   
 
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cutlerite:
link???
Nope.  Pirate here. 
 
 
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Posted: 29 January 2009 09:52 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]   

   
 
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I thought it was interesting that they talked about how friendly Salt Lake is, and how polite the people are, but not a word about mormonism.  
 
I liked the Osmond kid.  Agree with Zim that he has the kind of sound that would work for this show. 
 
www.americanidol.com is the official web site, but I didn't see any clips of young Mr. Osmond there.
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Posted: 29 January 2009 09:54 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]   

   
 
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Ahhhhh yes, the Osmonds. I have just never seen so many teeth in one family in all my life.
 
I'll bet their dentist is in tooth-fairy heaven Celestial Kingdom.
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Posted: 29 January 2009 09:55 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]   

   
 
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hypatia:
Ahhhhh yes, the Osmonds. I have just never seen so many teeth in one family in all my life.
 
I'll bet their dentist is in tooth-fairy heaven Celestial Kingdom.
 
 
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Posted: 29 January 2009 10:02 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]   

   
 
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hypatia:
Ahhhhh yes, the Osmonds. I have just never seen so many teeth in one family in all my life.
 
I'll bet their dentist is in tooth-fairy heaven Celestial Kingdom.
I vaguely remember an old TV show where Donny and Marie pulled out a set of those wind-up fake teeth and said they were "Osmo-chops".
I was never a big fan, but that actually made me laugh.  
 
 
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Posted: 29 January 2009 10:55 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]   

   
 
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Osmonds just want the "legacy" to continue....Donnie and Marie just did a stint in Vegas....their faces were plastered a zillion feet high....
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Posted: 29 January 2009 11:06 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]   

   
 
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Tessa:
Osmonds just want the "legacy" to continue....Donnie and Marie just did a stint in Vegas....their faces were plastered a zillion feet high....
Still there.
 
I'm trying to book the room with the window that is Marie's left incisor...
 
 
seems like it would be one of the brightest rooms, right??
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Posted: 29 January 2009 11:59 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]   

   
 
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YesIAmAPyr:
cutlerite:
link???
Nope.  Pirate here. 
 
 
This is Linc.  We bear little resemblance.
Linc Hayes
 
 WTF? I thought this was Link
 
 
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Posted: 30 January 2009 12:46 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 15 ]   

   
 
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Ugh.  I live in Utah and I have a bad feeling that this is going to be another David Archuleta thing.  On the radio this morning that's all they could talk about -- and how upset they were at the judges for saying anything bad about him.
 
(Last year for Halloween the corn maze at Thanksgiving Point was carved out as David Archuleta's face.)
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Posted: 01 January 2009 04:15 PM   [ Ignore ]   

   
 
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Emilie
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So I googled Famous Mormons (wanting to check out Amy Adams of the movie Doubt--(she of the low-cut stylish gowns... oops veering off topic).
 
sure enough the site still exists  http://www.google.ca/search?hl=en&q=famous+mormons&btnG=Google+Search&meta=
 
As well there are several other Famous Mormons sites. Then I did a few spot checks of Catholics, Christians, Baptists and sites exist for those too.
 
So it made me wonder, if there are famous people who are the same religion as you, does that give credibility to your belief system?
 
Em
 
 
 
 
 


   


Posted: 01 January 2009 05:35 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]   

   
 
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BYU Alum
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If it's good enough for Mitt Romney, Amy Adams, Paul Walker and possibly Christina Aguleria, then its good enough for me!!
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Posted: 01 January 2009 06:06 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]   

   
 
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StormWalker
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Yep, for some people, the fact that a famous person believes or does or uses something is an actual endorsement.
 
That is why it is very, very important for political parties to showcase the famous who support the cause. There are actually people - many people - who take that as meaningful. 
 
 
 
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Posted: 01 January 2009 06:16 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]   

   
 
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Suspicious Minds
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It simply cognitive role modeling.   


   


Posted: 01 January 2009 06:18 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]   

   
 
Carter
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I believe that Mormonism has an inferiority complex, and so over compensate by trying and believing that Mormons are the best at everything!
 
Famous people confirm the church is true.
Olympic athletes confirm the church is true.
The wealth of the church confirms that it is true.
We contributed more to Prop 8 than any other organization - the church is true!
etc. etc. etc.
 
And if they happen to find an area that they can't figure out a way to show they are the best at, they use this strategy:
 
We have suffered more, so the church is true.
We are persecuted more, so the church is true.
People hate Mormons, so the church is true.
 
Everything and anything confirm the church is true.  But they especially like the extremes.


   


Posted: 01 January 2009 06:22 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]   

   
 
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Rudy DC
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I remember when I was first getting into the church were allways tellling me so and so is a member and so is this person. I remember thinking..."so?" 

   


Posted: 01 January 2009 06:58 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]   

   
 
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Cooper
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Nothing like a bit of selective memory on the part of TBMs. They seem to overlook Mormons such as Ted Bundy, Arthur Gary Bishop, and Glenn Taylor Helzer. Quite the string of serial killers.
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“And most of the Israelites did not come from outside Canaan—they emerged from within it. There was no mass Exodus from Egypt. There was no violent conquest of Canaan. Most of the people who formed early Israel were local people—the same people whom we see in the highlands throughout the Bronze and Iron Ages. The early Israelites were—irony of ironies—themselves originally Canaanites!” - Finkelstein & Silberman


   


Posted: 01 January 2009 08:29 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]   

   
 
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WhiskeyTangoFoxtrot
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Cooper:
Nothing like a bit of selective memory on the part of TBMs. They seem to overlook Mormons such as Ted Bundy, Arthur Gary Bishop, and Glenn Taylor Helzer. Quite the string of serial killers.
 
 WHOA! I had no idea! 
 
As for famous members, when I was a TBM I felt like famous members made Mormons seem less weird.  "See, if Katherine Heigl is Mormon we can't be THAT weird!"  Although it bothered me a lot that most of the really famous ones clearly weren't active anymore.  I felt they weren't doing their part to represent the church well and had just been too sucked into the Hollywood lifestyle/deceived by Satan.  Now I really wonder if any of them have really done their research and left for the doctrinal/historical reasons.


   


Posted: 01 January 2009 09:05 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]   

   
 
hartlyn
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Carter:
I believe that Mormonism has an inferiority complex, and so over compensate by trying and believing that Mormons are the best at everything!
 
Famous people confirm the church is true.
Olympic athletes confirm the church is true.
The wealth of the church confirms that it is true.
We contributed more to Prop 8 than any other organization - the church is true!
etc. etc. etc.
 
And if they happen to find an area that they can't figure out a way to show they are the best at, they use this strategy:
 
We have suffered more, so the church is true.
We are persecuted more, so the church is true.
People hate Mormons, so the church is true.
 
Everything and anything confirm the church is true.  But they especially like the extremes.
 You're absolutely right about the inferiority complex.  In the '80's, when Michael Jackson was so popular, the JW's had a huge surge in membership.  As a missionary, we often got the question about were there any famous Mormons aside from the Osmonds.  That was before Sister Gladys Knight, Survivor, The Real World, and all those Dancing With the Stars and American Idol contestants.  Canadians only knew Junior Ah You, who played for the Concordes for awhile, and it was common knowledge Randy Bachman was LDS.  
 
Having famous people as members of your church legitimizes you.  Or something.  I never could figure that out.  
 
It also may be the Mormons' desire to prove "we're not really freaks!"
 
hartlyn
 
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Posted: 01 January 2009 09:10 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]   

   
 
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Don K
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 "I kind of fell out of Mormonism at a young age. My brothers and I were not completely rebellious, but I remember driving to church in the minivan on Sunday--church is three hours long if you're Mormon-- we would stop at a red light, throw open the slider [door] and run for the hills. My mother would be screaming!"
 
 Eliza Dushku
 
 
 I love this quote. We need a "Used to be Mormon, now a PostMo" site. 
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Posted: 04 January 2009 11:12 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]   

   
 
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Anaar
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Cooper:
Nothing like a bit of selective memory on the part of TBMs. They seem to overlook Mormons such as Ted Bundy, Arthur Gary Bishop, and Glenn Taylor Helzer. Quite the string of serial killers.
 
^The Famous Mormons site lists them all and then some.
 
And yes having famous people in your religion absolutely validates it.. Didn't you all KNOW that?? I mean you all should become Muslim immediately.. We have Cat Stevens.. how cool is that? Er.. um.....kindlly overlook Osama Bin Laden and all the pesky terrorists, and of course the most sinister of them all... Michael Jackson.
 
Seriously though, I'm always interested to learn if someone famous is a Mormon.


   


Posted: 04 January 2009 03:32 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]   

   
 
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TattooMe
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Anaar:
Cooper:
Nothing like a bit of selective memory on the part of TBMs. They seem to overlook Mormons such as Ted Bundy, Arthur Gary Bishop, and Glenn Taylor Helzer. Quite the string of serial killers.
 
^The Famous Mormons site lists them all and then some.
 
And yes having famous people in your religion absolutely validates it.. Didn't you all KNOW that?? I mean you all should become Muslim immediately.. We have Cat Stevens.. how cool is that? Er.. um.....kindlly overlook Osama Bin Laden and all the pesky terrorists, and of course the most sinister of them all... Michael Jackson.
 
Seriously though, I'm always interested to learn if someone famous is a Mormon.
 
Gary Gilmore came from a long line of Mormon heritage....in 1977, he was the first man executed in the US, after Capitol punishment was suspended by the Supreme Court in 1972.
 
I don't know if Gary was actually a Mormon or not. His mother was, but married outside of the church to a drunken, con man.
 
Gilmore's brother Mikyl wrote Shot in the Heart. It is a good book with a lot of info about blood attonement and the Danites.
 
On a side note.....
I was never really impressed by the fact that certain people were Mormon. I figured if I only concentrated on those people, think of all the really wonderful people outside of the Morg that I would miss out on. Including my current husband, who is one of the finest people I have ever met. He is a good man, with a good heart, a hard working honest man, who treats me with all the love, respect and equality that I never had in my Ultra Mo temple marriage.
 
Even while I was involved in the church, I had decided that if I met a man who was not a Mo I would give him a chance because I wasn't all the impressed with most of the Morg men that I knew.
 
 


   


Posted: 04 January 2009 10:03 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]   

   
 
StillShell
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I love how everyone is counted in the numbers even the ones that state that they are NOT mormon or don't practice anymore. 

   


Posted: 04 January 2009 10:51 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]   

   
 
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athena
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TattooMe:
Anaar:
Cooper:
Nothing like a bit of selective memory on the part of TBMs. They seem to overlook Mormons such as Ted Bundy, Arthur Gary Bishop, and Glenn Taylor Helzer. Quite the string of serial killers.
 
^The Famous Mormons site lists them all and then some.
 
And yes having famous people in your religion absolutely validates it.. Didn't you all KNOW that?? I mean you all should become Muslim immediately.. We have Cat Stevens.. how cool is that? Er.. um.....kindlly overlook Osama Bin Laden and all the pesky terrorists, and of course the most sinister of them all... Michael Jackson.
 
Seriously though, I'm always interested to learn if someone famous is a Mormon.
 
Gary Gilmore came from a long line of Mormon heritage....in 1977, he was the first man executed in the US, after Capitol punishment was suspended by the Supreme Court in 1972.
 
I don't know if Gary was actually a Mormon or not. His mother was, but married outside of the church to a drunken, con man.
 
Gilmore's brother Mikyl wrote Shot in the Heart. It is a good book with a lot of info about blood attonement and the Danites.
 
On a side note.....
I was never really impressed by the fact that certain people were Mormon. I figured if I only concentrated on those people, think of all the really wonderful people outside of the Morg that I would miss out on. Including my current husband, who is one of the finest people I have ever met. He is a good man, with a good heart, a hard working honest man, who treats me with all the love, respect and equality that I never had in my Ultra Mo temple marriage.
 
Even while I was involved in the church, I had decided that if I met a man who was not a Mo I would give him a chance because I wasn't all the impressed with most of the Morg men that I knew.
 
 
Gary Gilmore recieved Catholic last rites from the priest who accompanied him to his execution. I was taking an Italian class from the priest at the time and he mentioned it to the class, so I would assume that Gilmore wasn't active or that he wasn't a Mormon at all.
 
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Posted: 04 January 2009 11:04 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]   

   
 
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TattooMe
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athena:
TattooMe:
Anaar:
Cooper:
Nothing like a bit of selective memory on the part of TBMs. They seem to overlook Mormons such as Ted Bundy, Arthur Gary Bishop, and Glenn Taylor Helzer. Quite the string of serial killers.
 
^The Famous Mormons site lists them all and then some.
 
And yes having famous people in your religion absolutely validates it.. Didn't you all KNOW that?? I mean you all should become Muslim immediately.. We have Cat Stevens.. how cool is that? Er.. um.....kindlly overlook Osama Bin Laden and all the pesky terrorists, and of course the most sinister of them all... Michael Jackson.
 
Seriously though, I'm always interested to learn if someone famous is a Mormon.
 
Gary Gilmore came from a long line of Mormon heritage....in 1977, he was the first man executed in the US, after Capitol punishment was suspended by the Supreme Court in 1972.
 
I don't know if Gary was actually a Mormon or not. His mother was, but married outside of the church to a drunken, con man.
 
Gilmore's brother Mikyl wrote Shot in the Heart. It is a good book with a lot of info about blood attonement and the Danites.
 
On a side note.....
I was never really impressed by the fact that certain people were Mormon. I figured if I only concentrated on those people, think of all the really wonderful people outside of the Morg that I would miss out on. Including my current husband, who is one of the finest people I have ever met. He is a good man, with a good heart, a hard working honest man, who treats me with all the love, respect and equality that I never had in my Ultra Mo temple marriage.
 
Even while I was involved in the church, I had decided that if I met a man who was not a Mo I would give him a chance because I wasn't all the impressed with most of the Morg men that I knew.
 
 
Gary Gilmore recieved Catholic last rites from the priest who accompanied him to his execution. I was taking an Italian class from the priest at the time and he mentioned it to the class, so I would assume that Gilmore wasn't active or that he wasn't a Mormon at all.
 
I know that his mothers family was Mormon but I wasn't sure about Gary. It's hard to know what was true and what wasn't. His dad's mother told them that their dad was Houdini's illigitimate son and their mother told of witnessing a public hanging when she was a child. Pretty messed up family.
 


   


Posted: 05 January 2009 03:36 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 15 ]   

   
 
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athena
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TattooMe:
athena:
TattooMe:
Anaar:
Cooper:
Nothing like a bit of selective memory on the part of TBMs. They seem to overlook Mormons such as Ted Bundy, Arthur Gary Bishop, and Glenn Taylor Helzer. Quite the string of serial killers.
 
^The Famous Mormons site lists them all and then some.
 
And yes having famous people in your religion absolutely validates it.. Didn't you all KNOW that?? I mean you all should become Muslim immediately.. We have Cat Stevens.. how cool is that? Er.. um.....kindlly overlook Osama Bin Laden and all the pesky terrorists, and of course the most sinister of them all... Michael Jackson.
 
Seriously though, I'm always interested to learn if someone famous is a Mormon.
 
Gary Gilmore came from a long line of Mormon heritage....in 1977, he was the first man executed in the US, after Capitol punishment was suspended by the Supreme Court in 1972.
 
I don't know if Gary was actually a Mormon or not. His mother was, but married outside of the church to a drunken, con man.
 
Gilmore's brother Mikyl wrote Shot in the Heart. It is a good book with a lot of info about blood attonement and the Danites.
 
On a side note.....
I was never really impressed by the fact that certain people were Mormon. I figured if I only concentrated on those people, think of all the really wonderful people outside of the Morg that I would miss out on. Including my current husband, who is one of the finest people I have ever met. He is a good man, with a good heart, a hard working honest man, who treats me with all the love, respect and equality that I never had in my Ultra Mo temple marriage.
 
Even while I was involved in the church, I had decided that if I met a man who was not a Mo I would give him a chance because I wasn't all the impressed with most of the Morg men that I knew.
 
 
Gary Gilmore recieved Catholic last rites from the priest who accompanied him to his execution. I was taking an Italian class from the priest at the time and he mentioned it to the class, so I would assume that Gilmore wasn't active or that he wasn't a Mormon at all.
 
I know that his mothers family was Mormon but I wasn't sure about Gary. It's hard to know what was true and what wasn't. His dad's mother told them that their dad was Houdini's illigitimate son and their mother told of witnessing a public hanging when she was a child. Pretty messed up family.
 
I don't know anything about his religious beliefs other than he chose a priest to be with him when he died. I remember they made a movie about it and it priest played himself.I don't know if he had been baptized or had any Mormon training.
 
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Posted: 05 January 2009 06:00 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 16 ]   

   
 
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peter_mary
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This reminds me of a Peep Stone article in our archives:  LDS Church Seeks Celebrities.
 
 
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Posted: 05 January 2009 06:15 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 17 ]   

   
 
kreator
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Are there any famous Post- Mormons?    Hmmmm... 

   


Posted: 05 January 2009 06:29 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 18 ]   

   
 
kreator
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I just realized, my last comment may sound like something a troll would ask...but I was seriously wondering (not being sarcastic as it may appear)...I personally wish the former Mormon scientists who found the DNA evidence that shows where Native Americans descend from, ought to be famous...The fact that native DNA tests dont get more media attention makes me wonder...is the media afraid to disprove the BOM? Maybe they get a lot of money from the SCC to keep their collective mouths shut... 

   


Posted: 05 January 2009 08:06 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 19 ]   

   
 
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LessMon
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kreator:
I just realized, my last comment may sound like something a troll would ask...but I was seriously wondering (not being sarcastic as it may appear)...I personally wish the former Mormon scientists who found the DNA evidence that shows where Native Americans descend from, ought to be famous...The fact that native DNA tests dont get more media attention makes me wonder...is the media afraid to disprove the BOM? Maybe they get a lot of money from the SCC to keep their collective mouths shut...
 
Was it a Mo scientist who discovered that? I'm only familiar with Southerton who, as a scientist, found the evidence irrefutable and ended up leaving the church because of it. But I had thought the studies were by non-Mos. Certainly if that was done originally by a Mo, they deserve a medal for their integrity.
 
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“A close examination of the text of the Book of Mormon makes it clear that if the Nephite people had tried to hide from modern archaeologists, they could not have done a better job.”
  — Orson Scott Card (link)


   


Posted: 05 January 2009 08:41 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 20 ]   

   
 
kreator
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LessMon:
kreator:
I just realized, my last comment may sound like something a troll would ask...but I was seriously wondering (not being sarcastic as it may appear)...I personally wish the former Mormon scientists who found the DNA evidence that shows where Native Americans descend from, ought to be famous...The fact that native DNA tests dont get more media attention makes me wonder...is the media afraid to disprove the BOM? Maybe they get a lot of money from the SCC to keep their collective mouths shut...
 
Was it a Mo scientist who discovered that? I'm only familiar with Southerton who, as a scientist, found the evidence irrefutable and ended up leaving the church because of it. But I had thought the studies were by non-Mos. Certainly if that was done originally by a Mo, they deserve a medal for their integrity.
 
Maybe it was'nt a Mormon who was over the tests, but they were involved, and they looked so conflicted on the Youtube video where they discussed the results...They appeared to be on the verge of tears while talking about it...
 


   


Posted: 05 January 2009 02:21 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 21 ]   

   
 
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Dutch
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athena:
Gary Gilmore recieved Catholic last rites from the priest who accompanied him to his execution. I was taking an Italian class from the priest at the time and he mentioned it to the class, so I would assume that Gilmore wasn't active or that he wasn't a Mormon at all.
 
 
I'm sure he's been necro-dunked by now.  As for the original question, Jesus was a Jew, but the Jews don't seem to be thrilled about it.
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Posted: 05 January 2009 07:46 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 22 ]   

   
 
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Miss Diana
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The Scientologists do this same thing....Tom Cruise, anybody?


   


Posted: 05 January 2009 08:18 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 23 ]   

   
 
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peter_mary
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Miss Diana:
The Scientologists do this same thing....Tom Cruise, anybody?
 
Must.read.Peep stone!
 
LDS Church Seeks Celebrities.
 
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Doing stupid things faster and with more energy since 1962.


   


Posted: 05 January 2009 08:35 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 24 ]   

   
 
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Rmyth
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Carter:
I believe that Mormonism has an inferiority complex, and so over compensate by trying and believing that Mormons are the best at everything!
 
Famous people confirm the church is true.
Olympic athletes confirm the church is true.
The wealth of the church confirms that it is true.
We contributed more to Prop 8 than any other organization - the church is true!
etc. etc. etc.
 
And if they happen to find an area that they can't figure out a way to show they are the best at, they use this strategy:
 
We have suffered more, so the church is true.
We are persecuted more, so the church is true.
People hate Mormons, so the church is true.
 
Everything and anything confirm the church is true.  But they especially like the extremes.
 
 I think exactly the same thing.  Steve Young with a super bowl vicotory and in the NFL Hall of Fame concludes that the church is true.
 
Amen to all you said.
 


   


Posted: 05 January 2009 09:04 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 25 ]   

   
 
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josephs myth
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kreator:
Are there any famous Post- Mormons?    Hmmmm...
 
 
Maybe, Matt Stone? 
 
Mor(m)on Musical Planned
 

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Posted: 05 January 2009 10:03 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 26 ]   

   
 
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Emilie
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kreator:
Are there any famous Post- Mormons?    Hmmmm...
 
 Randy Bachman...


   


Posted: 05 January 2009 10:15 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 27 ]   

   
 
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Dogzilla Joy
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Cooper:
Nothing like a bit of selective memory on the part of TBMs. They seem to overlook Mormons such as Ted Bundy, Arthur Gary Bishop, and Glenn Taylor Helzer. Quite the string of serial killers.
 
 I dunno about the two other fellas, but I'm about 60% sure that Ted Bundy was not a mormon. According to the Wikipedia site, he was an active Methodist in his youth, but not other mention of a later conversion or anything suggests or supports the idea that he was a mormon. Just because someone lived in Utah does not mean they automatically drank the Kool Aid and just couldn't resist joining the church.
 
Same goes for Alice Cooper or Mick Jagger. Neither one sat on a jet with a GA and decided his rock and roll lifestyle was all wrong and he must simply join The Church.
 
It's all nonsense/appeal to authority type of logic, which is to say... it's not logical at all.
 
Let me know what evidence you find that Ted Bundy really was actually a mormon, even if only for five minutes. I don't buy it for one second.  
 
Oh, and Matt Stone and Trey Parker are not mormons either. Matt Stone just grew up around a lot of mormons so their knowlege is circumstantial. They are the only brilliant comedy writers who seem to be aware that mormonism is rife with comedy gold just waiting to be mined. Aside from our own Peter_Mary, of course, who has already plundered several really great mormon funnies. 
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Posted: 05 January 2009 10:16 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 28 ]   

   
 
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Emilie:
kreator:
Are there any famous Post- Mormons?    Hmmmm...
 
 Randy Bachman...
 
 Define "famous."
 
I mean, I know who Randy Bachman is, but I'm an audiophile and am very much into music. I bet I could throw a rock and hit someone who has never heard of him. 
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Posted: 05 January 2009 10:42 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 29 ]   

   
 
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dogzilla:
Cooper:
Nothing like a bit of selective memory on the part of TBMs. They seem to overlook Mormons such as Ted Bundy, Arthur Gary Bishop, and Glenn Taylor Helzer. Quite the string of serial killers.
 
 I dunno about the two other fellas, but I'm about 60% sure that Ted Bundy was not a mormon. According to the Wikipedia site, he was an active Methodist in his youth, but not other mention of a later conversion or anything suggests or supports the idea that he was a mormon. Just because someone lived in Utah does not mean they automatically drank the Kool Aid and just couldn't resist joining the church.
 
Same goes for Alice Cooper or Mick Jagger. Neither one sat on a jet with a GA and decided his rock and roll lifestyle was all wrong and he must simply join The Church.
 
It's all nonsense/appeal to authority type of logic, which is to say... it's not logical at all.
 
Let me know what evidence you find that Ted Bundy really was actually a mormon, even if only for five minutes. I don't buy it for one second.  
 
Oh, and Matt Stone and Trey Parker are not mormons either. Matt Stone just grew up around a lot of mormons so their knowlege is circumstantial. They are the only brilliant comedy writers who seem to be aware that mormonism is rife with comedy gold just waiting to be mined. Aside from our own Peter_Mary, of course, who has already plundered several really great mormon funnies. 
 
I read that Bundy was baptized while he lived in Utah. His girl friend in Washington was Mormon. He did it partly to please her and partly to fit in.In Utah being a Mormon is an advantage and Bundy was an opportunist.He never actually lived a Mormon life.As a predator, perhaps he thought that being a clean-cut Mormon law student would help deflect suspicion from him. It was part of his Utah image.
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Posted: 05 January 2009 11:08 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 30 ]   

   
 
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Maybe we should start a web site of infamous Mormons!
 
P.S. Alice Cooper is "sort of Mormon" in a loose sense:  His grandfather was an apostle in the Bickertonite Church (a splinter Mormon church based in Pittsburgh, PA). 


   


Posted: 05 January 2009 11:09 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 31 ]   

   
 
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athena:

 
I read that Bundy was baptized while he lived in Utah. His girl friend in Washington was Mormon. He did it partly to please her and partly to fit in.In Utah being a Mormon is an advantage and Bundy was an opportunist.He never actually lived a Mormon life.As a predator, perhaps he thought that being a clean-cut Mormon law student would help deflect suspicion from him. It was part of his Utah image.
 
It's entirely possible, but my burning question is where did you read that? Ann Rule did extensive research on the guy and knew him, so if you read it in her book, then I will accept this as fact, stand corrected, and acknowledge that I don't actually know everything.  Otherwise, I'd be interested in knowing what your source is, if you remember. (I never remember where I read things...)
 
I've seen him noted as a mormon on the interwebs before, too, so I'm not too sure what info out there is credible and what is, well, wishful thinking, I guess.  I have a passing fascination with Bundy myself because I live in one of the cities where he did some killin'.
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Posted: 05 January 2009 11:18 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 32 ]   

   
 
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I think I read it in Ann Rule's book, but I could be wrong since I read it years ago. I've read other books about him and, since I live in Utah, there was plenty written locally about him at the time of his arrest, trials and execution. I'm not absolutely sure of my source, but I'm pretty sure he joined. I know he met with some bishop when he was investigating. The bishop invited him to dinner where Bundy complimented his teen-aged daughter on her beautiful long, dark hair. The man was totally freaked out when Bundy was charged with raping and killing all those girls who had long dark hair. If I have a chance, I'll  try to locate Rule's book and see if that was where I read it.
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Posted: 05 January 2009 11:30 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 33 ]   

   
 
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The mormon grapevine also get excited about any celebrity who just LIVES in Utah.  Choosing Utah is oh so close to being Mormon.  It's probably just a matter of time.
 
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Posted: 05 January 2009 11:31 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 34 ]   

   
 
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dogzilla:
Emilie:
kreator:
Are there any famous Post- Mormons?    Hmmmm...
 
 Randy Bachman...
 
 Define "famous."
 
I mean, I know who Randy Bachman is, but I'm an audiophile and am very much into music. I bet I could throw a rock and hit someone who has never heard of him. 
 
30 years ago maybe.  Tal would probably be more "famous" but still a bit past his "famous" prime.  My guess, though, is that we can claim about half of the people on the "famous mormons" site.  I mean, do you really think that Sister Heigl pays her 10%?
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Posted: 05 January 2009 11:32 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 35 ]   

   
 
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athena:
I think I read it in Ann Rule's book, but I could be wrong since I read it years ago. I've read other books about him and, since I live in Utah, there was plenty written locally about him at the time of his arrest, trials and execution. I'm not absolutely sure of my source, but I'm pretty sure he joined. I know he met with some bishop when he was investigating. The bishop invited him to dinner where Bundy complimented his teen-aged daughter on her beautiful long, dark hair. The man was totally freaked out when Bundy was charged with raping and killing all those girls who had long dark hair. If I have a chance, I'll  try to locate Rule's book and see if that was where I read it.
 
I forgot about the recanted Ted Bundy encounters circulating around the LDS functions after his final arrest was made.  Yes, I actually knew a girl whom almost left a dance with that creepy killer.  The nearly overt pressure excised on long dark haired young women, targeted by him, was sure to have happened in and around Provo, Utah.
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Posted: 05 January 2009 11:33 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 36 ]   

   
 
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dogzilla:
 
...I live in one of the cities where he did some killin'.
 
He dumped one of the bodies behind my Ward house, when I was a kid.  Pretty creepy.
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Posted: 05 January 2009 11:41 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 37 ]   

   
 
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D. B. Cooper.
 
There is a book written by the FBI guy who did extensive investigation into the D.B. Cooper case and claims emphatically that it is one Richard McCoy.  The name of the book "The Real McCoy".  
 
For any of those that are that old or recall, he is the guy who hijacked an airplane with a bunch of money and bailed out over Provo, Ut.  The FBI nabbed him after a few days along with the money.  I believe the headlines were:  "Mormon Sunday School Teacher HiJacks Airplain".  
 
Anyway, he was convicted and got killed some years later after escaping prison.  At the time he was a BYU student and Sunday School teacher.
 
Does that qualify for famous mormon?
 
 
He was pretty famous of a little while.  Of course, the legend of DB Cooper lives on.
 


   


Posted: 06 January 2009 12:00 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 38 ]   

   
 
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Rmyth:
D. B. Cooper.
 
There is a book written by the FBI guy who did extensive investigation into the D.B. Cooper case and claims emphatically that it is one Richard McCoy.  The name of the book "The Real McCoy".  
 
For any of those that are that old or recall, he is the guy who hijacked an airplane with a bunch of money and bailed out over Provo, Ut.  The FBI nabbed him after a few days along with the money.  I believe the headlines were:  "Mormon Sunday School Teacher HiJacks Airplain".  
 
Anyway, he was convicted and got killed some years later after escaping prison.  At the time he was a BYU student and Sunday School teacher.
 
Does that qualify for famous mormon?
 
 
He was pretty famous of a little while.  Of course, the legend of DB Cooper lives on.
 
 
Although the Cooper/McCoy connection is tantalizing, it has never been conclusively proven that they are one and the same person...
 
I'd like to think that D. B. is still around.  It makes for a good story...
 
To answer the question, hell yeah, Mc Coy is a famous mormon, let us not forget...
 
 
 
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I’m tired of Donny Osmund…  
Posted: 15 November 2007 04:42 AM   [ Ignore ]   

   
 
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For those of you who live in SLC and surrounding areas.  I just wanted to publicly say that I am tired of Donny Osmund.  I'm tired of seeing him on the news.  I'm tired of seeing him on ET. I am tired of seeing him anywhere.  I dont think that he is that great.  I just dont understand all the buzz. 
 
I am also tired of his sister Marie. 
 
I think that Donny and Marie are media whores.  They are even going to be on the show on CNN with the dead guy tonight where she talks about her 16 year old abdopted son ( oh, look at me, im so nice) that just went to re-hab.
 
Sorry. I just needed to say that and nobody is hear to listen to me.


   


Posted: 15 November 2007 04:46 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]   

   
 
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Now, why would you feel like the Osmonds are media whores? I just can't understand what you're talking about...
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T9wWtSarGzU
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Posted: 15 November 2007 04:48 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]   

   
 
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Sanctified:
For those of you who live in SLC and surrounding areas.  I just wanted to publicly say that I am tired of Donny Osmund.  I'm tired of seeing him on the news.  I'm tired of seeing him on ET. I am tired of seeing him anywhere.  I dont think that he is that great.  I just dont understand all the buzz. 
 
I am also tired of his sister Marie. 
 
I think that Donny and Marie are media whores.  They are even going to be on the show on CNN with the dead guy tonight where she talks about her 16 year old abdopted son ( oh, look at me, im so nice) that just went to re-hab.
 
Sorry. I just needed to say that and nobody is hear to listen to me.
 
In one ear and out the other!    Like you, I just wanna puke anytime I hear about the Osmond's. 


   


Posted: 15 November 2007 04:49 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]   

   
 
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Ugh, me too. sick Anytime I see one of them on TV, I change the channel. A bunch of Osmond kids went to my high school. My best friend had a crush on one of them for awhile. I got sick of even hearing that last name. Bleh. shut eye
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Posted: 15 November 2007 04:52 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]   

   
 
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They talk about being such good mormons.  They stand for evertthing that a good mormon would. 
 
Then marie talks about her being depression and all that crap.  She is a model mormon. So much that she probably doesn't even realize it.  She is messed up.  To top it all off, her son gets sent off to rehap for who knows what and she is still hanging out on that damn tv show. 
 
They are trying so hard to look good for the public.  It kills me.
 


   


Posted: 15 November 2007 04:58 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]   

   
 
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Sanctified:
For those of you who live in SLC and surrounding areas.  I just wanted to publicly say that I am tired of Donny Osmund.  I'm tired of seeing him on the news.  I'm tired of seeing him on ET. I am tired of seeing him anywhere.  I dont think that he is that great.  I just dont understand all the buzz. 
 
I am also tired of his sister Marie. 
 
I think that Donny and Marie are media whores.  They are even going to be on the show on CNN with the dead guy tonight where she talks about her 16 year old abdopted son ( oh, look at me, im so nice) that just went to re-hab.
 
Sorry. I just needed to say that and nobody is hear to listen to me.
 
I met Marie when I was 19 and new on my mission. She had just gotten married to the guy who was doing Phone SEX/ Porn- the BYU Basketball Hero!...as I recall. Actually Marie was pretty dang cute, but I was a horny 19 year old missionary too. At any rate I think you are correct. My last companion was from Provo and his mother worked at the Osmond Studio. He hated the Osmond's. Said they were totally PHONEY Mormons.  I would guess that they like Mitt Romney realise the  enormous base of support within the MO FO Church membership, and they ain't about to ruin that FREE GRAVY TRAIN.  Get ready, the cameras are rolling, Smile and act like everything is just fine!  AHHHH THATS SO SPECIAL!


   


Posted: 15 November 2007 05:05 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]   

   
 
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DoubleX:
Now, why would you feel like the Osmonds are media whores? I just can't understand what you're talking about...
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T9wWtSarGzU
 
Nice Leg shot! Sister OSMOND!!! where are your GARMENTS of the Holy Priesthood? did you not covenant to wear them both day and night!??? I bet if she would have been obedient in the wearing of her sacred garments she would not have "fainted"!! for they would have been a shield and protection unto her!


   


Posted: 15 November 2007 05:11 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]   

   
 
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Ironically enough....the Osmond studio was converted to a drug rehabilitation center.  The one lindsay lohan just checked out of.  A useless fact for your enjoyment..... 

   


Posted: 15 November 2007 05:43 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]   

   
 
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I'm so sick of the Osmonds, too.
 
When I was growing up in the church, I used to perform quite a bit with my own brothers and sisters. My whole family could sing, and quite a few of my nieces and nephews were singers and musicians, too. I still love making music, many years later.
 
At one point, my mother got it into her head that we should form a group like the Osmonds. Our family name was Marshall and she wanted to call us the "Marshmelodies."
 
"No way!" was my reply.   

 
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Posted: 15 November 2007 05:51 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]   

   
 
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OMG she is going to be on Leno tonight.  Will I never be able to get away from this torture.   I'm going to !!!
 
F*** it.  I'm going to bed.


   


Posted: 15 November 2007 06:46 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]   

   
 
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fhelsing:
At one point, my mother got it into her head that we should form a group like the Osmonds. Our family name was Marshall and she wanted to call us the "Marshmelodies."
 
    
                    (catching my breath)
 
Marshmelodies?!  That is hysterical!
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Posted: 15 November 2007 06:49 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]   

   
 
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Donny and Marie in bed.
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Posted: 15 November 2007 03:38 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]   

   
 
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O.K., this will probably make me a board pariah, but I don't care.
 
<EMBARRASSING CONFESSION>Growing up, I was a huge Osmonds fan. I thought they were so great. I was maybe 6 or 7 when they started getting really huge and I just loved their stuff. I loved the Jackson 5 too. I think it had to do with the fact that they had little kid singers and I was a little kid myself. Plus, they both had cartoons on Saturday mornings, always a plus for me. I didn't even know the Osmonds were Mormon until years later. I watched Donny & Marie every weekend. I loved their 'concept album' about the plan of salvation called, The Plan.
 
When I was in Utah, I was surprised at how many mormons absolutely hated the Osmonds. I suppose they threw their weight around a bit in Utah county and exhausted a lot of good will there or something, but I never found anyone who would admit to ever liking them. 
 
I worked at a radio station in Provo. During the week, we played oldies, but on Sundays we had 12 hours of religious music and programs called "The Sounds of Sunday." I was the host of that and often interviewed LDS celebrities. I had both Alan and Merrill on my show. Alan was on twice. The first time he was promoting his sons, The Osmond Boys. He was trying to ride the New Kids on Block coattails,  much as the original Osmonds rode the Jacksons. Another time, he was promoting his fireworks spectacular, but I had specifically invited him on to talk about the album, The Plan. Donny refused to do my show (it was during his brief comeback when he released, Soldier of Love) because he didn't want to be associated with an LDS-themed show. Ah, the memories.
 
My final humiliating admission is that I actually have the song, Crazy Horses, on my  iPod.   </EMBARRASSING CONFESSION>
  


   


Posted: 15 November 2007 03:42 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]   

   
 
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Zim:
O.K., this will probably make me a board pariah, but I don't care.
 
<EMBARRASSING CONFESSION>Growing up, I was a huge Osmonds fan. I thought they were so great. I was maybe 6 or 7 when they started getting really huge and I just loved their stuff. I loved the Jackson 5 too. I think it had to do with the fact that they had little kid singers and I was a little kid myself. Plus, they both had cartoons on Saturday mornings, always a plus for me. I didn't even know the Osmonds were Mormon until years later. I watched Donny & Marie every weekend. I loved their 'concept album' about the plan of salvation called, The Plan.
 
When I was in Utah, I was surprised at how many mormons absolutely hated the Osmonds. I suppose they threw their weight around a bit in Utah county and exhausted a lot of good will there or something, but I never found anyone who would admit to ever liking them. 
 
I worked at a radio station in Provo. During the week, we played oldies, but on Sundays we had 12 hours of religious music and programs called "The Sounds of Sunday." I was the host of that and often interviewed LDS celebrities. I had both Alan and Merrill on my show. Alan was on twice. The first time he was promoting his sons, The Osmond Boys. He was trying to ride the New Kids on Block coattails,  much as the original Osmonds rode the Jacksons. Another time, he was promoting his fireworks spectacular, but I had specifically invited him on to talk about the album, The Plan. Donny refused to do my show (it was during his brief comeback when he released, Soldier of Love) because he didn't want to be associated with an LDS-themed show. Ah, the memories.
 
My final humiliating admission is that I actually have the song, Crazy Horses, on my  iPod.   </EMBARRASSING CONFESSION>
  
You'll be ok.  Admitting the problem is the first step toward recovery.
 
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Posted: 15 November 2007 04:08 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]   

   
 
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The Pirate knew them when...I was in their ward in SoCal before fame and fortune smiled on them.
 
They got rich and famous, I dropped out of the church and now I'm a Pirate...
 
There may be a moral to this story...
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Posted: 15 November 2007 05:10 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 15 ]   

   
 
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My brother always said that Marie looks like the girl the Osmonds Bros are told NOT to date. tongue wink
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Posted: 15 November 2007 07:23 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 16 ]   

   
 
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I was just complaining about this last night to my roomie. If I turn on the television and hear an ET commercial that says, "You saw him on Oprah, now he speaks with us!" I will seriously throw up all over my new shoes.
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Posted: 15 November 2007 08:01 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 17 ]   

   
 
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Dingleburger
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Zim:
O.K., this will probably make me a board pariah, but I don't care.
 
<EMBARRASSING CONFESSION>Growing up, I was a huge Osmonds fan. I thought they were so great. I was maybe 6 or 7 when they started getting really huge and I just loved their stuff. I loved the Jackson 5 too. I think it had to do with the fact that they had little kid singers and I was a little kid myself. Plus, they both had cartoons on Saturday mornings, always a plus for me. I didn't even know the Osmonds were Mormon until years later. I watched Donny & Marie every weekend. I loved their 'concept album' about the plan of salvation called, The Plan.
 
When I was in Utah, I was surprised at how many mormons absolutely hated the Osmonds. I suppose they threw their weight around a bit in Utah county and exhausted a lot of good will there or something, but I never found anyone who would admit to ever liking them. 
 
I worked at a radio station in Provo. During the week, we played oldies, but on Sundays we had 12 hours of religious music and programs called "The Sounds of Sunday." I was the host of that and often interviewed LDS celebrities. I had both Alan and Merrill on my show. Alan was on twice. The first time he was promoting his sons, The Osmond Boys. He was trying to ride the New Kids on Block coattails,  much as the original Osmonds rode the Jacksons. Another time, he was promoting his fireworks spectacular, but I had specifically invited him on to talk about the album, The Plan. Donny refused to do my show (it was during his brief comeback when he released, Soldier of Love) because he didn't want to be associated with an LDS-themed show. Ah, the memories.
 
My final humiliating admission is that I actually have the song, Crazy Horses, on my  iPod.   </EMBARRASSING CONFESSION>
  
Maybe you need to find a new board to hang out on, Zim. 
 
When I was a kid, the only thing I knew about the Osmonds was that Marie was a famous Mormon and that my testimony was threatened when she appeared on some made-for-TV movie where she had a kissing scene and actually KISSED the guy on the LIPS. It was really hard on my little mind to comprehend that she could do such an ungodly thing -- (kissing on the lips was for after marriage), being MORMON and all, on NATIONAL TV....good Mormons didn't sacrifice their standards for anything, right?
 
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Posted: 15 November 2007 08:05 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 18 ]   

   
 
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Does anyone remember, several years ago, one of Marie's little Mo sons sang "All my Ex's Live in Texas" on TV, and the shitstorm that followed?  Hilarious!  I didn't find the song choice as disturbing as I did the little guy's complete lack of singing ability (you know, what with being an Osmond and all.)
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Posted: 15 November 2007 10:22 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 19 ]   

   
 
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I am sick of them too. Donny has confessed to getting overly depressed when the spotlight isn't on him. He lives for fame.
 
On a side note, he and his family went to the ward I grew up in while he did the dream coat play here in Michigan.
 
We've also had Shawn Bradley show up to ward once too.
 
We had a private pilot in our ward which is how we got many mormon celebs to our little po dunk ward, LOL
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Posted: 15 November 2007 10:30 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 20 ]   

   
 
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Qi
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We don't get much of them here. Only they showed Marie fainting over and over for one day--some dancing show she is on. I am just glad she fell down like a "lady." That could have been bad, if you know what I mean! 

   


Posted: 15 November 2007 10:45 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 21 ]   

   
 
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Zim:
O.K., this will probably make me a board pariah, but I don't care.
 
<EMBARRASSING CONFESSION>
.......
 
Aw, that's OK, Zim.  You're among friends. 
 
But guess who's not getting my vote to choose the music for the next Post-Mo party. 
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Posted: 15 November 2007 10:51 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 22 ]   

   
 
Zim
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elder_nomo:
Aw, that's OK, Zim.  You're among friends. 
 
But guess who's not getting my vote to choose the music for the next Post-Mo party. 
Oh man!
 
I swear that's not the extent of my taste! I file it under guilty pleasures or something like that. Don't we all have those? O.K., maybe not this bad, but still ...
 


   


Posted: 15 November 2007 10:58 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 23 ]   

   
 
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Zim:
elder_nomo:
Aw, that's OK, Zim.  You're among friends. 
 
But guess who's not getting my vote to choose the music for the next Post-Mo party. 
Oh man!
 
I swear that's not the extent of my taste! I file it under guilty pleasures or something like that. Don't we all have those? O.K., maybe not this bad, but still ...
 
When you're a mormon every pleasure is a guilty one!
 
OK, I'll admit, I do have some.
sometimes I'm a little bit country..... 
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Posted: 15 November 2007 10:59 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 24 ]   

   
 
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Zim, sh..sh..sh..I have a Donny Osmond Album tucked away at home. Santa gave it to me many moons ago.. tongue wink
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Posted: 16 November 2007 01:10 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 25 ]   

   
 
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Hahaha!  Y'all are slaying me.  As I heard on Oprah when 100 Osmonds were there, they are having an upcoming concert for the first time in so many years, which explains the publicity of late.  Who would have thought they were having such a hard time selling tickets to that?  *snicker*
 
Zim, don't feel badly--I used to have a Donny Osmond poster in my bedroom as a pre-pubescent girl and got The Plan album one Christmas from a Mormon friend.   Now I may watch them on Oprah (and I enjoyed that except for Marie's testimony, it brought back some good memories for me) but I am not following them around t.v.  One show is enough for me!  


   


Posted: 16 November 2007 06:03 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 26 ]   

   
 
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Don't feel bad, Zim! I used to like that song "YoYo" ... maybe we could team up and do a punk rock version.
 
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Dolly Parton to be Baptized (Faith Promoting Rumor Contest)  
Posted: 22 June 2007 05:04 PM   [ Ignore ]   

   
 
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KimberlyAnn
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The following is the very first parody I wrote for RfM.  I guess it was about a year ago.  I was a bit nervous to post my first attempt and thought it'd sink like a rock, but people liked it.  They've been lamenting that encouragement ever since, as they've been subjected to a steady stream of my silliness over the past year. :)
 
Through a series of miraculous events, the woman who once exclaimed, "It costs a lot of money to look this cheap!", has accepted the true Gospel of Jesus Christ and has committed to be baptized this Saturday at her Tennessee theme park, Dollywood.
In her generosity, Dolly has invited the entire Tennessee East Stake to attend her baptism and enjoy free admission to Dollywood. Per her request, she will be baptized in the water reservoir at the bottom of the Raging Rapids log ride.
Beehive Clothing is "abuzz" with anticipation of Dolly's baptism. Garment Design Manager, Chastity Bottoms, had this to say:
"Beehive Clothing has been granted special permission to design a new women's garment top especially for Sister Parton. The burning in her bosom is so great--it may set aflame the standard women's garment."
Sister Parton, inspired by the garment design of Beehive Clothing, is currently in collaboration with the makers of "gyno-panties" to design her own unique line of sacred undergarments. Dollygarms will be geared toward the "fully" endowed sisters, and those whose bosoms burn at a higher temperature than average. They are expected to be approved by the First Presidency in the next few weeks and will be available for online purchase by the end of the year.

 
 
My parody reminds me of all the far-fetched faith promoting rumors I've heard over the years.  Several years ago, the missionaries actually told me Steve Martin was a member, lol!  I told them I'd heard that rumor earlier and it wasn't true.
 
I think we should make up our own faith promoting rumors - I suppose they could be either faith promoting for the Mormon or ex-Mormon cause, whichever you prefer.  The faith promoting rumor I'm surprised I haven't heard yet is that Dr. Phil is taking the missionary lessons...
 
Tell your faith promoting rumor stories, and if you don't have any, make one up!
 
KA
 
 
 
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Posted: 22 June 2007 05:27 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]   

   
 
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In the days of my youth and rabid zealous faith in the "Only True Church" I was excited to find out that Tom Selleck was a member of the Church! Wow, if Tom Selleck was a member that must mean the church really was true. (I also believed Paul H. Dunn stories.) I was disappointed to find out the Osmonds were members, if had it not been for my stalwart faith in the Church I would have left when I found out Tom was not a member and the Osmonds were!
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Posted: 22 June 2007 05:33 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]   

   
 
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Crime Dog
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It's funny how those rumors get started. A few months back, my beloved MIL, a devout TBM, came over and asked if I knew that Barack Obama had been LDS, and only switched to his current religion when he decided to get into politics.
No, Mom. Thanks for telling me.
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Posted: 22 June 2007 06:17 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]   

   
 
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One of my favorites goes back to my college days.  My first college roommate was a recently returned RM who served in Georgia.  The story he'd heard was that Michael Stipe, lead singer of REM, had been taking the discussions, and fully believed it.  While he wasn't one of the missionaries involved, he claimed to have known the ones that were.
However, he ran into a problem when they tried to commit Mr. Stipe to the law of chastity.  Since he's gay, he was unable to make that commitment.  He was so broken up about it that he wrote the song, "Losing my religion."
Well, according to this Wikipedia article, the song has nothing whatsoever to do with religion.  But as a TBM at the time, I totally sucked it in and believed the story.


   


Posted: 22 June 2007 07:01 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]   

   
 
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I never heard about Michael Stipe or Obama, but I did hear that Alice Cooper was a Mormon.  I wonder if there's any truth to that one?  LOL!
 
KA
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Posted: 22 June 2007 07:07 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]   

   
 
jahedgpeth
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Some of the above stories reminded me of the site http://www.famousmormons.net
What a pathetic shrine built by  man-worshipping LDS faithful. I would be embarrassed about this site if I were a Mormon. I suppose that is some of the reason I am not a Mormon..hmmmmm
But, the most topical feature on this site is the page that displays and explains people's status who have been "rumored" to be LDS. Here is the link.
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Posted: 22 June 2007 07:38 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]   

   
 
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Crime Dog
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KimberlyAnn:
I never heard about Michael Stipe or Obama, but I did hear that Alice Cooper was a Mormon.  I wonder if there's any truth to that one?  LOL!

KA


Naaaah. Everybody knows he's really Billy Mumy from Lost In Space!!
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Posted: 22 June 2007 07:42 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]   

   
 
tibber
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There was the rumor that Marylin Manson's dad was a SP, and that one concert Marylin wore his dad's Gs on stage.  Or was that Alice Cooper?  One of those guys was LDS, or has LDS ties somewhere. 
Wikipedia just confirmed that Alice Cooper, born Vincent Furnier to a parents Ether Moroni (nothing mormon about that, is there?) and Ella Mae, had a grandfather who was an apostle of the church of jesus christ, the bickertonites, not the mainstream mormons. 
I'm pretty sure Marylin Manson has no affiliation with mormonism other than tearing a book of mormon up while opening a NIN concert in SLC. 
I tried to start a rumor that Micheal Jordan was taking discussions during my mission.  Everyone we told in my district believed it, but it never got any further than that. 
It was also a big deal that Mike Holmgren was LDS (currently head coach of the SeaHawks previously offensive coach for the Packers ) and all the missionaries and local wards in Green-bay were expecting Brett Favre to show up at church but it never happened.
And there was also the rumor that Steve Martin joined the church and that he showed Jay Leno his CTR ring on the Tonight Show.  I think it would be incredible tacky for steve Martin to wear a CTR ring, even if he had converted to mormonism, which he didn't.
TB


   


Posted: 22 June 2007 08:34 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]   

   
 
Zim
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tbiter:There was the rumor that Marylin Manson's dad was a SP, and that one concert Marylin wore his dad's Gs on stage.  Or was that Alice Cooper?  One of those guys was LDS, or has LDS ties somewhere. 
Wikipedia just confirmed that Alice Cooper, born Vincent Furnier to a parents Ether Moroni (nothing mormon about that, is there?) and Ella Mae, had a grandfather who was an apostle of the church of jesus christ, the bickertonites, not the mainstream mormons.

That's right, Alice's dad was part of a mormon splinter group, but left and became a Presbyterian minister. Alice is now a born again, but still likes to rock and roll. 

   


Posted: 22 June 2007 10:08 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]   

   
 
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Annie Lennox of the Eurythmics was a Mormon (j/k).  She wrote Missionary Man for all the mishies.  
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Posted: 23 June 2007 12:24 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]   

   
 
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I heard the whole Marilyn Mansen connection, too.  Oh, and Jewel.  Her dad was LDS, but she was raised by her mom.
I always heard that Tal Bachman was a mormon, but then the evil, sinful world of rock n' roll corrupted him and he fell away with such pretences as "The BOM is false" and "Joseph Smith lied" but of course, it was only so he could drink and party on his path to stardom.....
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Posted: 23 June 2007 12:25 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]   

   
 
snickersprincess
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Is there any truth to the rumors that Yoda was patterned after Pres. Benson or Kimball-- one of those old guys...?
I am probably dumb for even asking-- but, I have heard it soooo many times-- I have to put it out there.
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Posted: 23 June 2007 01:00 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]   

   
 
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Susan D.
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snickersprincess:Is there any truth to the rumors that Yoda was patterned after Pres. Benson or Kimball-- one of those old guys...?
I am probably dumb for even asking-- but, I have heard it soooo many times-- I have to put it out there.

Yeah, I heard it was SWK they tried to mimic with Yoda.  The story I heard is that they wanted to find a voice of someone seen as a "wise leader" and they liked SWK's voice. 
Do local FPR's count?  When the Dallas temple was being built I heard (from the then-husband who was in a so-called leadership position to know) that someone saw some man standing at the base of the concrete fencing around the grounds after hours.  They wondered what he was doing there and then they saw him leap up, facing forward, (several feet, I think about 9) and sit on that fence!  Wow, what an acrobat.  They were saying it was one of the 3 Nephites or an angel.  Whatever. 


   


Posted: 23 June 2007 01:20 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]   

   
 
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dave (e_nomo)
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I remembered hearing an interview with Alice Cooper not too long ago on NPR. 
Hear it here...http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=10231271
Somewhere near the beginning, he mentions that his dad was a christian pastor. 
About 3/4 of the way in, interviewer Terry Gross brings up that his grandfather was the head of his church.  Alice says yes, it was the Church of Jesus Christ, and Terry asks "mormon?" and he says no, there's no LDS at the end of the name of the church. 
But the fact that she asked that, and the tone of his voice in his answer, and Zim's comment (above) made me wonder.
Wikipedia says this...

Vincent Furnier was born in Detroit, Michigan to Ether Moroni Furnier and Ella Mae McCart. His grandfather, Thurman Sylvester Furnier, was an Apostle of The Church of Jesus Christ (Bickertonite). Vincent's father was an Elder
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alice_Cooper

Bickertonites are indeed a BoM believing "restoration" church. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Church_of_Jesus_Christ
IMO Alice was being a little disingenous with the way he replied, trying to make it seem that they were mainstream christians of some kind. 

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Posted: 23 June 2007 03:34 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]   

   
 
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KimberlyAnn
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elder_nomo:
I remembered hearing an interview with Alice Cooper not too long ago on NPR. 
Hear it here...http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=10231271
Somewhere near the beginning, he mentions that his dad was a christian pastor. 
About 3/4 of the way in, interviewer Terry Gross brings up that his grandfather was the head of his church.  Alice says yes, it was the Church of Jesus Christ, and Terry asks "mormon?" and he says no, there's no LDS at the end of the name of the church. 
But the fact that she asked that, and the tone of his voice in his answer, and Zim's comment (above) made me wonder.
Wikipedia says this...

Vincent Furnier was born in Detroit, Michigan to Ether Moroni Furnier and Ella Mae McCart. His grandfather, Thurman Sylvester Furnier, was an Apostle of The Church of Jesus Christ (Bickertonite). Vincent's father was an Elder
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alice_Cooper

Bickertonites are indeed a BoM believing "restoration" church. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Church_of_Jesus_Christ
IMO Alice was being a little disingenous with the way he replied, trying to make it seem that they were mainstream christians of some kind. 


 
Wow!  There was something to the Alice Cooper rumors!  Weird.  Who woulda thunk...
 
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Posted: 23 June 2007 12:15 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 15 ]   

   
 
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More on Alice: He is the President of the Board of Directors for the Solid Rock Foundation, a Christian outreach group for teens: http://www.srfrock.org/about.html
I saw Alice perform a few years ago in LA. It was a short set in the KLOS Radio parking lot, but holy smoke. The man's still got it.
Oh, and Rick Schroeder (Silver Spoons, NYPD Blue and recently 24) is a mormon convert of just a few years. He married a mormon girl. I heard him talk about it on the Howard Stern Show. 

   


            
 
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Should gay/Lesbians stand up and leave or remain mormon??  
Posted: 31 May 2013 08:44 PM   [ Ignore ]   

   
 
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carsonhill
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Now here at Post mo we have a different breed perhaps.  Likely those who are here and posting may be more at the stage of voicing their beliefs, many whom have left the church; those who don't by nature want to be completely silent etc.. same with ex mo sites..
 
but we've seen recent videos of mormons coming out as gay and remaining mormon.  Just coming out and encouraging others to stay active while gay etc...  
 
Now I'll admit this is a hot little topic but the reason I ask it is recently I've been doing some apartment shopping and that includes searching new houses and rooms.  Today I spoke to a gal I met in a department store and we got talking.  I mentioned I'd been room shopping and that its always interesting.  She said she lives with a guy and is paying rent on a room.  I was curious if she was married to him or dating and she said no because he is gay.  I said oh thats cool. 
 
Then we got talking about alcohol after that and she said she doesn't drink as much cause she doesn't feel comfortable around him and his boyfriend drinking.  When I asked why, she said it's because they are both mormon and practicing, other than the gay/dating thing of course.  I said oh so he is gay and still attending church.  She said yes and that his boyfriend is over all the time but they don't drink and won't accept any of those drinks so she just avoids it around them.  She said they are not rude but they just live the church standards other than being gay. Hugh, I thought..
 
Later I found an add for a room to rent that mentioned gay but mormon so they wanted someone gay friendly that abide by church standards.
 
Just kind of got me thinking.  I am in no position to judge because I am not gay but obviously quite vocal about gay rights because I feel strongly it reflects my rights, as i'm represented in the whole.  Also I am offended that the church fought so hard for something that went against what I'd consider equal rights for all.. that being funding of prop 8 etc..
 
So part of me wants to say that if you are gay and mormon, don't try and live by the church standards and attend church while being gay long term, instead embrace what your church has done and the falty altering of doctrine due to societal pressures it calls "revelations."
 
and leave and explain why you left to not stand for something that lies and covers up...
 
But another argument I hear is that it is good that gay church members are coming open while still being in church cause it encourages others to have the courage to at least do the same, instead of living the deep suppressive alternative, which is horrible.  I mean if it prevents suicide and that type of suppression Id be all for it. 
 
I just still don't like the idea that the church can just adapt (being a flip floper) like its done with blacks etc, and just later say being gay is ok because it would never own up to the bull shit its done.. 
 
But then again this is how the church functions, based on lies isn't it..? LOL..  On one hand I hate that members would support the gay adaption as it progresses because it wouldn't hold the church accountable; on the other hand I want gay members to not be in the dark suppression that hurts them and any outlet of that seems better than the alternative.
 
So is it good gays are coming out while remaining members.  Is that progress of a kind?  or by remaining active members and coming out gay are they feeding the fire that is a deceptive, adaptive organization with a tainted history and pattern of embodying lies and deceit?
 
Any Postmo Gay/Lesbian thoughts welcome as are others, no matter what stage you're in.  What are your thoughts on the matter if any ??


   


Posted: 31 May 2013 09:05 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]   

   
 
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I'm not gay but i attended a "same sex attraction" conference while at BYU with this guy.    http://www.joshweed.com/  The famous gay guy who married a woman and has a family.  Honestly i wanted to hate him...but he made a choice and in the nature of acceptance i respect his choice.  he loves his wife and it sounds like they have a good thing going.
 
 However there were other couples there where their marriage "worked".  In other-words these Mormon woman convinced themselves they were "happy" and saw lots of therapist.   Then men were also miserable but that is what marriage is all about right???
 
So I am tyring very very hard to respect the idea of people staying Mormon. I want to be open minded. I think if they choose to stay Mormon and it works for them do it.  i hope they are doing it because they like the lifestyle because we all know the sludge of the morg.  In being open-minded it is important to allow people accept people doing thing that make no since to you.   
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Posted: 31 May 2013 09:53 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]   

   
 
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Sorry, I just can't past the fact that the best sex demands the full participation of the available faculties.  Love and lust can and should go hand in hand.  Yeah, I know you can enjoy having just one (usually lust) without the other, but when you get to have both, there is no comparison, after the climax. Prior to, the endorphins are all cooking up a great storm, but after the endorphin fountain closes, and you open your eyes, that's when love makes such a huge difference.  At least that's been my experience.  Sex can be great fun, but loving your sexual partner, and being loved in return, is pretty darn good. 
 
So how does Josh Weed do it?  (And I ask this in the generic, not about him specifically.) I gather that there is the possibility that he is bi, so maybe it's that simple; he can lust after his wife, as well as love her.  But what about a straight gay, (that sounds funny, huh?)  a person with pure same sex attraction.  It makes no sense that a 'pure' gay person can lust after, get hot for, a member of the other sex.  So for the full effect of both the endorphin fountain and that after glow, resting in the arms of the loved one, you have to break a TSCC commandment and lose your ticket to the CK.
 
And that makes no sense, unless you're brain washed.  How can two Mormon gay men be boyfriends?  No sex, of course, but can they kiss?  Can they cuddle?  Can they go to a Gold & Green Ball together?  Can they sit in Sacrament meeting, snuggled together, touching, holding hands?  Logically, they would refuse to live together, just as any two unmarried TBMs in love would avoid such a situation.  But think back when you were dating and how you acted with your boy/girlfriend at church.
 
If I were a bishop (with all the discernment that accompanies the calling) I woud be telling the boys that ghawd has set them a challenge and that he wouldn't have done so unless he had made them strong enough to surmont it.  (Yeah, that really worked well for masturbation...)  Say the guys were in their 20s...  How in the hell could a bishop look them in the eyes and tell them to go their entire lives without the complete fulfillment that love + lust affords?
 
And when is the No Sex Outside of Marriage commandment broken by gays and lesbians?  Can they kiss?  Can they make out, pet, dry hump?  When do gays & lesbian cross the line?  Has TSCC published a standard?
 
That TSCC is getting away with keeping gays paying tithing is a testament to the motivation that is greed.  And if the boys/girls slip up, hey, they just have to repent, try again to keep on the straight and narrow, and keep paying their tithing.  It's all good, from TSCC's point of view.    
 


   


Posted: 01 June 2013 07:48 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]   

   
 
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It works for some.   Doesn't work for a whole lot of others.  That one group or the other insists that THIS is the way it should work is where we are off.
I couldn't imagine a marriage where I wasn't sexually attracted to the core of what my spouse is.  But then, the core of what he's made up of is more than male.  Then I don't want marriage without sex as one of the bonds that takes priority.  Others find their intimacy in other arenas of life.
 
What Josh and Lolly Weed have works for them.  Marriage is unique between two people. Sexuality is unique to the person. Religion begins and ends as a personal journey.  Anyone can share or not share these aspects of life and what they do doesn't have to work for me.  It's the discussion of these topics that is important.
I have a friend who is so damned conservative, and religious, and celibate, and so gay and out of the closet.  He's an enigma but right now, his path works for him.  It's not up to me to tell him different.  I don't tell him what to do and think, he doesn't tell me what to do or think.  At the very least who he is has given him that perspective...that he has no right to dictate the terms to a personal life anymore than anyone else does.  
 
 
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Posted: 01 June 2013 08:22 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]   

   
 
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I know a gay single Mormon who is not out of the closet, although I imagine many people suspect he is gay. He has told me of the pain that he suffers. Things would just be worse for him if he came out, so there is no point in him doing it. I asked him why he stays in the church and whether or not he has issues with church doctrine on this matter. He is very unhappy about the church's stance on homosexuality, and it tears him up inside, but he believes the church is true. So he must stay Mormon, and he must stay in the closet.
Stupid church. 

   


Posted: 01 June 2013 09:45 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]   

   
 
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The simplest but truest answer is they should decide for themselves.  Just like everyone here decided for themselves what they were getting out of it and if that was enough and when it was no longer helpful and if the cost of leaving was too high.  The eleventh article of faith applies to a whole lot of life whether you're LDS or not or gay or straight or whatever.   Don't you think?


   


Posted: 01 June 2013 10:01 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]   

   
 
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At some point...gay members will get mighty tired of "reproduction" stories of Celestialized humans....and not having their significant others as celestial partners in the after life. Their shunning will continue no matter how "sweet" their ward/stake is. They will feel the ostracizing keenly.
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Posted: 01 June 2013 10:29 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]   

   
 
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I've given a lot of thought to this in a way.  As a black man I considered the good it would do to stay in the church.  I thought it might do good for others to see a "good black mormon example".  
 
Although my experience and learning told me the church is not true, I considered "dying to self" and walking the higher road that benefited others.
 
I like what was said above earlier about can they kiss, hold hands, snuggle in sacrament, etc?  This gets to the heart of the problem.  The daily logistics of living in a culture which (at its core) rejects the very nature of who you are.  A unique aspect of yourself that you cannot change. 
 
If you live around cool, weird, loose, democratic Mormons, you might be able to have an awesome experience.  Conversely if you live with ridged, square, uppity Mormons that buy into the doctrine of you being spiritually inferior because of who you are, damn!  What an awful life.
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Posted: 01 June 2013 07:50 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]   

   
 
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Curious NeverMo:
The simplest but truest answer is they should decide for themselves.  Just like everyone here decided for themselves what they were getting out of it and if that was enough and when it was no longer helpful and if the cost of leaving was too high.  The eleventh article of faith applies to a whole lot of life whether you're LDS or not or gay or straight or whatever.   Don't you think?
 
 Yes. Surely the Mormon GLBT community has enough oppression to deal with without us chiming in to tell them how to settle their personal conflicts. I think there is something to said for for either choice -- but it is problem when it is weighed by outsiders.
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Posted: 01 June 2013 07:59 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]   

   
 
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I am not going to support a church who spends Millions to stop a right every person should have and that is to marry who they love and want to marry. I have friends who I know for a fact are gay, but they are married, have kids, and live a life and lie in absolute fear of what would happen if the came out. 

   


Posted: 01 June 2013 08:07 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]   

   
 
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I have a hard time seeing why a gay person would want to remain a Mormon, but that's because I'm an apostate because of doctrinal reasons.  If I still believed and were gay, I'd take some comfort in that it appears the church is fast approaching a "don't ask/don't tell" sort of position.  They are being forced by cultural changes to do that.  It's not ideal, but better than it has been,
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Posted: 01 June 2013 10:20 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]   

   
 
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Even though I am a gay man myself, every person's experience is different; every person's idea of happiness is different, and I wouldn't want to tell others what they *should* do. 
But I do want to share some thoughts on the topic.
As difficult as it's been for the church to continue its anti-gay stance due to public and internal pressure, I think they are going to have an even harder time with the more relaxed position, because of the questions raised by Elder Old Dog and others above.  The church is not good with grey areas and this is a step in the grey direction.  Will it be OK for two gay people to hold hands in church? Can they hug?  Certainly not kiss (or can they?)  I think it will be a LONG LONG time before the church sanctions gay sexual relationships or same-sex marriages.  So if you're gay and thinking of staying in the church, you may want to consider whether celibacy for the rest of your life sounds appealing. 
As for the other approach to being gay and staying mormon - the Josh Weed approach, where you DO get to have sex, but it's with the gender you're not naturally attracted to... well, I think that would be another difficult choice. 
To answer the question of how it's even possible...
Straight men in prison sometimes turn to other men for sex, even though they are not attracted to men.  Because the sexual drive is strong and that's all that's available.  They use what's available. 
I think it is the same for mormon married gay men.  Their wives are "all that's available". 
Just like men in prison immediately return to heterosexuality when released, I think mormon married gay men would follow their natural sexuality if they were released from the prison of mormon doctrine. 
On the question of staying in the church, again a very personal decision.  But I would be concerned about staying in an organization that teaches that you are "less than" because of who you are.  LGBT, women, free thinkers - all are both openly and subtly told they are less.  
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Posted: 02 June 2013 04:06 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]   

   
 
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Props to the many Mormons who showed up for SLC's Pride Parade including Mormons Building Bridges and the couple interviewed on the ABC4 news who admitted they skipped church to go but considered it the Christian thing to do -- plus good for their kids.
 
It doesn't answer the question, but it warms my heart.
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Posted: 02 June 2013 04:30 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]   

   
 
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I recently met another woman who was the cousin from one of my old friends from YW's. We met at my friend's birthday party, and at one point she and I started talking about LGBTQ movement vs. the LDS church. I told her that one of the major reasons I was leaving the church was because I'm a lesbian, and I learned that she herself was bisexual, but she had chosen to supress it and live a straight life. I've chosen to leave because I don't appreciate TSCC's severe anti-LGBTQ politics, but she told me that she believe's TSCC is changing and becoming more accepting. She's still a strong member, even about to serve a mission. 
 
I think that it's not my place to tell her what she should do with her life. Personally, I think it's only a matter of time before she leaves, because she's a very open-minded person, and pretty liberal, especially compared to the rest of her TBM family. However, if she chooses to live the rest of her life in a straight marrage within the church, then that's her choice and who am I to complain?
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Posted: 03 June 2013 08:33 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]   

   
 
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I think Dave (e_nomo) is right that the church is not good with grey areas and they have introduced a big grey area with relaxing their stance towards gays.
 
With the scouting program in particular, since they now claim to welcome gay scouts as long as they are chaste, what's going to happen over time when gay teens come out, stay chaste, stay believing, and want to serve missions when they are 18? Is the church going to deny gay members the opportunity of serving a mission even when they believe and have lived the standards of the church? I think a lot of members would be uncomfortable with that because they'd think it would be inappropriate for an openly gay missionary to be living with another person of the same sex. It'll be interesting to see how the church handles this, because it's going to happen soon.
  
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