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Steve Martin (yes, that Steve Martin) got baptized  
Posted: 24 May 2012 04:33 PM   [ Ignore ]   

   
 
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Elder Wand
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On my mission, a fellow elder swore up and down that a friend, or a friend of a friend (don't remember the level of acquaintance), who was serving a mission in California, had taught the discussions to Steve Martin and had baptized him. 
 
I'm proud to say I didn't buy it.  (Wish I could say the same about the Mormon fairy tale.)
 
I ended up hearing this story from more than one source.  It seemed to be spreading like wildfire.  But no matter how far it spread, the truth was that it wasn't true.  No number of believers changed that.
 
Another missionary on my mission said that while in the MTC, he lived in the same dorm floor as Peter Billingsley, more well-known as Ralphie Parker from "A Christmas Story."  To me, the dates didn't seem to add up.  But that elder swore by it.
 
Folks seem to be more interested in having something in common with a famous person than verifying facts.  At the risk of generalizing, may I say that Mormons love to name-drop. 
 
I lived in Las Vegas when Gladys Knight joined the church.  My mom, who worked at the Las Vegas temple, talked about when Ms. Knight came to receive her endowment.  So cool!  Everyone seemed abuzz about Gladys Knight.  Though I don't recall ever hearing these same people mention her when she was simply just a companion to the Pips.  And you never hear any of them mention the apparent exemption that Ms. Knight has received from wearing garments during public appearances, because no way could she be tucking and folding her garments under some of those outfits.  Just saying.
 
Mormons love to point out that Steve Young is Mormon.  Mormons in Utah idolized Shawn Bradley. (Mormons here in DFW tried not to bring him up too much due to his mostly dismal performance with the Mavs.)
 
For some reason, there's the feeling that having famous brothers- and sisters-in-arms makes the church more true, or more mainstream, or both. But all it really does is show that those famous people are just like us: dim-witted, bone-headed suckers.
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Posted: 24 May 2012 06:51 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]   

   
 
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Dogzilla Joy
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My BFF is a gay man. We've been friends for going on 25 years. As a consequence, I've been in a lot of gay bars and have hung around with a LOT of GLBT folks. A lot. To the point where I didn't actually have very many hetero friends at all for a while there. 
 
One day, I was laying on the beach with three gay guys and they were talking about different celebrities, Tom Cruise, as one example, who they think are gay. Is George Clooney gay? Then they'd discuss that to death, analyzing this and that. Is Bill Maher gay? More analysis and discussion. On and on they went, bringing up every single person of questionable sexual orientation they could think of, as if it matters*. They sounded like name-dropping mormons. I, being the only "outsider" (hetero person in the group), saw it immediately.
 
Finally, I got really sick of this discussion when they got to Johnny Depp. They can have George Clooney, but I'll be damned if they're going to claim my boyfriend Johnny Depp as one of their own.  I finally just suggested that, perhaps, it's really difficult to be GLBT in a mostly hetero world, so you guys must be assigning "teh gay" to anyone and everyone, even those who are demonstrably not GLBT, so you feel like you fit in somewhere. If someone as rich and famous and popular as George Clooney is gay, then hey, maybe that helps you not feel so bad about being gay yourself. You can even begin to accept yourself now that you can affiliate yourself with someone who's cool and hip and popular, 'cause now you're just like George. I went on and on, explaining how obviously they were projecting their own self-image on to these celebrities so they could feel like they were part of some accepted class of people instead of social pariahs (gay men in the Deep South -- the only thing that would make them more outsiders is if they were black as well). 
 
I never saw a group of gay men shut the #### up so fast in my life.  After digesting my words for a minute, they all laughed and admitted I'd totally nailed it and they wanted a lot of rich famous and sexy people to be gay so it would be okay for them to be gay too. 
 
I think that's what's going on with the mormon name-dropping, like the Mick Jagger on an airplane story and Steve Martin is a mormon story. Projection, once you get really good at spotting it, is really kind of pitiful. 
 
 
 
 
* DISCLAIMER: No beach discussion ever involves anything that truly matters. We're stoned, drunk, sunburned, and completely incapable of dealing with anything of import. 
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Posted: 24 May 2012 07:12 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]   

   
 
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I like Dogzilla Joy's explanation.
 
Have you ever gone to one of those sites that list all the famous mormons? It's actually a little sad. People who clearly don't believe and/or practice (Katherine Heigl, Eliza Dushku, etc.) are listed merely because at least one parent was mormon and perhaps they were brought up in the church. A lot of it certainly seems like grasping at straws.
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Posted: 24 May 2012 08:18 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]   

   
 
Jonathan Bentz (formerly AspieXLDS)
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RobinM:
I like Dogzilla Joy's explanation.
 
Have you ever gone to one of those sites that list all the famous mormons? It's actually a little sad. People who clearly don't believe and/or practice (Katherine Heigl, Eliza Dushku, etc.) are listed merely because at least one parent was mormon and perhaps they were brought up in the church. A lot of it certainly seems like grasping at straws.
 
 Most certainly. Funny thing is, if you go to Eliza Dushku's Wikipedia page, it says she's Mormon, but doesn't practice. Considering she has tattoos and her roles tend to be risque at best, in the view of the Mormons, I'd say that's a fair bet. I love the whole "grasping at straws" people do. The only Mormon I know of in Hollywood that's practicing is A.J. Cook, who plays JJ on Criminal Minds. The rest have either "fallen away" or been otherwise seduced by the tantalizing aspects of the world. 
 
I still remember when someone first told me Eliza Dushku was MOrmon. I said, "Bullshit. I could believe Sarah Michelle Gellar, but not Eliza Dushku." But lo and behold...
 
Not to mention, I'm pretty sure Steve Young apostacized years ago. I seem to remember my dad going on about that....
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Posted: 24 May 2012 09:02 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]   

   
 
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Ah yes, Shawn Bradley. The only NBA player to have a line of furniture named after him: La-Z-Boy!
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Posted: 24 May 2012 11:56 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]   

   
 
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AspieXLDS:

Most certainly. Funny thing is, if you go to Eliza Dushku's Wikipedia page, it says she's Mormon, but doesn't practice. Considering she has tattoos and her roles tend to be risque at best, in the view of the Mormons, I'd say that's a fair bet. I love the whole "grasping at straws" people do. The only Mormon I know of in Hollywood that's practicing is A.J. Cook, who plays JJ on Criminal Minds. The rest have either "fallen away" or been otherwise seduced by the tantalizing aspects of the world. 
 
I still remember when someone first told me Eliza Dushku was MOrmon. I said, "Bullshit. I could believe Sarah Michelle Gellar, but not Eliza Dushku." But lo and behold...
 
Not to mention, I'm pretty sure Steve Young apostacized years ago. I seem to remember my dad going on about that....
 
I don't know how any Mormon celebrity could really "practice" the faith in the sense of being a ward member with busywork callings and B.S. meetings to go to. But if we're just talking believing/self-identifying Mormons then you have to put Steve Young back in that camp. He has never disavowed Mormonism, although he and his wife did stand against Prop 8. Maybe that's what your dad was going on about? Also, Brandon Flowers, lead singer for The Killers, did an "and I'm a Mormon" ad.
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Posted: 25 May 2012 01:05 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]   

   
 
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Born Free
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Dogzilla Joy:
 
[snip] 
 
I never saw a group of gay men shut the #### up so fast in my life.  After digesting my words for a minute, they all laughed and admitted I'd totally nailed it and they wanted a lot of rich famous and sexy people to be gay so it would be okay for them to be gay too. 
 
I think that's what's going on with the mormon name-dropping, like the Mick Jagger on an airplane story and Steve Martin is a mormon story. Projection, once you get really good at spotting it, is really kind of pitiful. 
 
 
 
 
* DISCLAIMER: No beach discussion ever involves anything that truly matters. We're stoned, drunk, sunburned, and completely incapable of dealing with anything of import. 
 
I am of the belief that projection is one of the most important psychological concepts human beings need to get on board to function as vaguely healthy 'adults'. You have nailed it beautifully here.
 
It is accompanied by boundaries in my assessment, and the two concepts are often interconnected.
 
'Zilla, in this example, the Shadow, the shamed and and gay self, which is tired of always being different, unappreciated and unaccepted, is first inverted and then projected.
 
The (imagined gay) celebrity is then accorded the very opposite of the problematic aspects of experience of being a gay man: different - becomes perfectly OK, unappreciated - becomes not only appreciated, but desired and unaccepted, becomes adored and desired. 
 
I hold the belief that the more the party detaches from their pain, the more likely they are to project in some form. Mormonism and fundy cults generally are particularly good at denying or minimising their outsider status, and inverting it, to where they become 'God's Chosen' no less, who will take great pleasure when JC returns a whops everyone elses ass.
 
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Posted: 26 May 2012 02:52 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]   

   
 
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The Wondertwins from DC comics are/were Mormon. There is also a couple of kids from Marvel. There is a site that tells you which superheroes are what religion. Whenever someone wants to name-drop like that I find myself saying, "Maybe, but most famous people aren't." or "What about Tom Cruse? Does him being a Scientologist make Scientology true?" 

   


Posted: 26 May 2012 07:25 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]   

   
 
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Elder Wand:
I lived in Las Vegas when Gladys Knight joined the church.  My mom, who worked at the Las Vegas temple, talked about when Ms. Knight came to receive her endowment.  So cool!  Everyone seemed abuzz about Gladys Knight.  Though I don't recall ever hearing these same people mention her when she was simply just a companion to the Pips.  And you never hear any of them mention the apparent exemption that Ms. Knight has received from wearing garments during public appearances, because no way could she be tucking and folding her garments under some of those outfits.  Just saying.
 
 
Her son was in my ward.  That's a true story.  No urban legend.  My one claim to fame.
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OCTOBER CONFERENCE
"Past, Present, and Possibilities"
Oct. 18-20, 2013










 


Financial Report for 2011 to Date

Financial Report for 2010 to Date

Financial Report for 2009

Twin Falls Newspaper Article

Twin Falls Billboard

Financial Report for 2009 to Date




The Enemies of Reason - Richard Dawkins
[Sound Thinking]

Glad You Asked! The Garden of Eden
[Peep Stone!]

Native American DNA
[Post-Mormon Mag.]



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[Salt Lake City Po...] 
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Speaking of Famous Mormons, anyone remember this guy…....?  
Posted: 30 August 2011 04:06 PM   [ Ignore ]   

   
 
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teetering
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Back in the early 80's, a famous Polish concert pianist visited our area in Northwest Washington.  His name was Wladimir Jan Kochanski and he was apparently one of Poland's most famous concert pianists.  Besides that he was a Mormon convert.

He performed a number of piano concerts, selling copies of his CDs and his autobiography (my parents bought one of everything). He also gave several firesides, where he played a few songs and told us stories about his conversion and particularly his experience performing in front of the Pope (John Paul II, also from Poland). He told us that while meeting with the Pope privately, he found the courage to present him with a Book of Mormon. He told us the Pope told him that he had already read that book, and knew it was true, but that God wanted him to remain with the Catholics. It gave us all a warm and fuzzy feeling to know that even the Pope recognized the truth of the BOM!

After the firesides, he would sign his CDs and books and shake the hands of the various members who wanted to meet him. He seemed like a really nice guy and we thought it was pretty impressive that such an important, famous musician would come to our little neck of the woods and perform in our church building.

It turns out things aren't always what they seem. Imagine my surprise to read the following paragraphs from an Amazon review of his autobiography:

The most disturbing aspect of Wladimir Jan Kochanski's autobiography is his description of himself as the son of a Polish-American family. A quick Google-search indicates that he was actually born to a Texan couple, Mr. and Mrs. Harvey, of English decent. His actual birth name is Robert Harvey. Nowhere in his memoir does Kochanski allude to his actual origins, and one wonders how much credibility can be granted to his various tales when the most basic fact of his identity and birth are hidden and distorted.
"The People's Pianist" as Kochanski labels himself, is peppered with references to his "Polish" family and the various Polish friends in his life. He makes a brief, sentimental reference of his death-bed marriage to a young lady named "Krystyna". Like various other tales in this book, it somehow does not ring true. The tone of his recounting bears a striking resemblance to Paderewski's autobiography and reference to his early widowhood in the same wistful manner. One begins to wonder if Mr. Harvey, a.k.a. Kochanski, is creating a fictional narrative and projecting an almost entirely imaginary persona onto a vast and unknowing readership.

It seems that "Wladimir" aka Robert, was some sort of fraud or con-man, similar to his contemporary Mark Hoffman. I'm not sure how much money he made going from Stake to Stake, pretending to be a Polish Pianist, but he definitely tapped into the LDS desire for acceptance/affirmation when tales are told about famous people joining the church (like the frequent DesNews stories about bowlers, TV actors, etc...)

Does anyone else remember going to one of this guys concerts or firesides? It seems that he is now living in isolation in California, no longer involved in music.


   


Posted: 30 August 2011 04:23 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]   

   
 
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I have no knowledge of him, but what your posting made me think of was the myriad Paul H. Dunn "faith building" stories in which he lied.
 
This guy should fit right in with at least one GA's history. 


   


Posted: 30 August 2011 07:11 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]   

   
 
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teetering:
Back in the early 80's, a famous Polish concert pianist visited our area in Northwest Washington.  His name was Wladimir Jan Kochanski and he was apparently one of Poland's most famous concert pianists.  Besides that he was a Mormon convert.

He performed a number of piano concerts, selling copies of his CDs and his autobiography (my parents bought one of everything). He also gave several firesides, where he played a few songs and told us stories about his conversion and particularly his experience performing in front of the Pope (John Paul II, also from Poland). He told us that while meeting with the Pope privately, he found the courage to present him with a Book of Mormon. He told us the Pope told him that he had already read that book, and knew it was true, but that God wanted him to remain with the Catholics. It gave us all a warm and fuzzy feeling to know that even the Pope recognized the truth of the BOM!
 
 
***I REMEMBER HIM WELL TEETERING.. HE CAME TO HAWAII AND MADE THE ROUNDS OVER THERE IN THE STAKES.. WE SENT CARE PACKAGES TO MEMBERS IN POLAND THOUGH THIS GUY.  WE FUNDED THESE CARE PACKAGES OUT OF OUR OWN POCKET AFTER TITHING THROUGH A COMPANY HE TOLD US TO USE.... WE HAD SEVERAL SMALL CHILDREN WE WERE PROVIDING FOR AT THE TIME, BUT THIS GUY TOLD US THAT POLISH MEMBERS NEEDED OUR HELP....BADLY.  
 
SO WE HELPED.
 
WHY IS IT NOT SURPRISING TO FIND OUT THAT EVEN THIS GUY WAS A FAKE.
 

 
LITH 

 
 
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Posted: 30 August 2011 07:21 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]   

   
 
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Lloyd Dobler
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That guy sounds awsome!
 
On my mission, in Tallahassee, FL, we had a Jewish convert (i think) named Marvin Goldstein.  Marvin could play the piano like a motherfckr.  He would also do firesides etc as well as sell CDs.  
 
What is it with convert musicians doing firesides?  Marvin was very well regarded in Tally.  He also was the real deal as far as I know.  He would play some stuff and then talk and then play and then talk etc.  Good grief.
 
I also remember one time non other than the one and only Janice Kapp Perry came to Tallahassee and did a fireside.  WOW!!!!!  was that good (totally kidding).  Even at the time I thought the whole thing was lame. 
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Posted: 30 August 2011 07:26 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]   

   
 
The Colonel
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OMFFAKEMORMONSKYDADDY!!!!!!!!!!!
 
I remember this guy so well because I've felt guilty all these years for having to stop giving to that poor Polish family because we could no longer afford to send money for food packages!  Now I'm wondering if the company he told us to send the money to was as fake as he is.
 
Holy F'ing fake prophet!!!  It seems like every day there's some new "revelation" about TSCC tied to some fakery.  Jo's legend continues. 


   


Posted: 30 August 2011 08:09 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]   

   
 
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Tessa
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One wonders how many "packages" ended up in Robert's cupboards.
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”I’ve begun worshiping the sun for a number of reasons. First of all, unlike some other gods I could mention, I can see the sun. It’s there for me every day. And the things it brings me are quite apparent all the time: heat, light, food, a lovely day. There’s no mystery, no one asks for money, I don’t have to dress up, and there’s no boring pageantry. And interestingly enough, I have found that the prayers I offer to the sun and the prayers I formerly offered to God are all answered at about the same 50-percent rate.” George Carlin


   


Posted: 30 August 2011 08:14 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]   

   
 
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Tessa
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His piano teachers were Van Cliburn's as well, and the "mystic" of getting into Russia, or having a foreign-sounding name (during the McCarthy era)...got him gigs. He just began to believe his hype.
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”I’ve begun worshiping the sun for a number of reasons. First of all, unlike some other gods I could mention, I can see the sun. It’s there for me every day. And the things it brings me are quite apparent all the time: heat, light, food, a lovely day. There’s no mystery, no one asks for money, I don’t have to dress up, and there’s no boring pageantry. And interestingly enough, I have found that the prayers I offer to the sun and the prayers I formerly offered to God are all answered at about the same 50-percent rate.” George Carlin


   


Posted: 30 August 2011 08:56 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]   

   
 
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"He told us that while meeting with the Pope privately, he found the courage to present him with a Book of Mormon. He told us the Pope told him that he had already read that book, and knew it was true, but that God wanted him to remain with the Catholics" My ex-wife has told the story many times that during her mission in Italy, a Catholic Priest told her, "I know the Book of Mormon is true, but I made a pact with Satan to deceive the people". Sort of sounds like the "PianoMan's" story.
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Marie Osmond remarries 1st husband in Temple?  
Posted: 05 May 2011 01:00 AM   [ Ignore ]   

   
 
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Tessa
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http://www.tmz.com/2011/05/04/marie-osmond-re-marrying-her-ex-steve-craig-wedding-marriage-las-vegas-love-mormon-temple-son-michael-death-anniversarylas-vegas/
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”I’ve begun worshiping the sun for a number of reasons. First of all, unlike some other gods I could mention, I can see the sun. It’s there for me every day. And the things it brings me are quite apparent all the time: heat, light, food, a lovely day. There’s no mystery, no one asks for money, I don’t have to dress up, and there’s no boring pageantry. And interestingly enough, I have found that the prayers I offer to the sun and the prayers I formerly offered to God are all answered at about the same 50-percent rate.” George Carlin


   


Posted: 05 May 2011 01:03 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]   

   
 
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GraciesDaddy
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She must've paid through the nose for that temple recommend.
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Posted: 05 May 2011 02:53 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]   

   
 
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GraciesDaddy:
She must've paid through the nose for that temple recommend.

 Or lied her ass off.
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Posted: 05 May 2011 01:02 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]   

   
 
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howdimissthat
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Ok, lets get this straight. 
 
(1) Marie Osmond married her first husband for the second time in a temple ceremony.  If she didn't marry her second husband in the temple the sealing to her first husband would not have been revoked because the church will not revoke a sealing for a woman until another sealing is going to take place to another husband (eta. which usually requires a fairly lengthy waiting period and a lot of explaining), so she would have already been sealed to the first husband  and why the need to re-seal?  
 
(2) If her first sealing was revoked and she married her second husband in the temple that sealing would have to be reovked in order for her to be sealed to her first husband again in the temple, and this usually doesnt happen until after a civil ceremony and a year long wait. 
 
(3) They did not do a time only ceremony.  Time only ceremonies are discouraged, if they even do them any more. Also, Donny said they had been sealed together for time and all eternity. 
 
(4) So it sounds like several rules were overlooked that the majority of un-famous couples have to observe.  The video of her coming out of the temple with her 16ft. train on her wedding dress made it appear as if that is what she wore for the ceremony, PR indeed, but then again maybe that rule was broken too, who knows. 
 
(5) This is all as clear as mud but the church makes it look like a normal, everyday occourance.  So many rules were overlooked or changed for this to take place and only TBM temple married mormons would know that, but they won't think past "isn't it wonderful, an eternal marriage for Marie." 
 
I really do hope it all works out for her, but the misrepresentation of what other couples have to go through to have sealings revoked and all the hoops they have to jump through will never be known because Marie simply went to the temple and was sealed to her first husband.  PR appears to make things look much easier in the church than what really happens for the rest of the membership if they aren't an asset to the church propoganda machine.  


   


Posted: 05 May 2011 01:54 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]   

   
 
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Tessa
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But if your 10% tithing is in Vegas millions, it can be done instantaneously....magically. Just like taking off her magic undies for her show.
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”I’ve begun worshiping the sun for a number of reasons. First of all, unlike some other gods I could mention, I can see the sun. It’s there for me every day. And the things it brings me are quite apparent all the time: heat, light, food, a lovely day. There’s no mystery, no one asks for money, I don’t have to dress up, and there’s no boring pageantry. And interestingly enough, I have found that the prayers I offer to the sun and the prayers I formerly offered to God are all answered at about the same 50-percent rate.” George Carlin


   


Posted: 05 May 2011 01:59 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]   

   
 
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Who does she think she is, Elizabeth Taylor? 
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Posted: 05 May 2011 06:19 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]   

   
 
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Doesn't the church know it is an abomination to God for her to remarry her first husband?

Bible says so
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Posted: 05 May 2011 09:03 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]   

   
 
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What Is Wanted:
Doesn't the church know it is an abomination to God for her to remarry her first husband?
 
Bible says so 
 
That must have been one of the incorrect translations JS was talking about.


   


Posted: 05 May 2011 10:06 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]   

   
 
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Tessa
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The abomination was she claims it was the same dress...pffft.
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”I’ve begun worshiping the sun for a number of reasons. First of all, unlike some other gods I could mention, I can see the sun. It’s there for me every day. And the things it brings me are quite apparent all the time: heat, light, food, a lovely day. There’s no mystery, no one asks for money, I don’t have to dress up, and there’s no boring pageantry. And interestingly enough, I have found that the prayers I offer to the sun and the prayers I formerly offered to God are all answered at about the same 50-percent rate.” George Carlin


   


Posted: 05 May 2011 10:41 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]   

   
 
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howdimissthat
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Tessa:
The abomination was she claims it was the same dress...pffft.
 
A good seamstres can make that happen with a panel here and a panel there. 


   


Posted: 05 May 2011 11:09 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]   

   
 
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Suzyq
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howdimissthat:
Ok, lets get this straight. 
 
(1) Marie Osmond married her first husband for the second time in a temple ceremony.  If she didn't marry her second husband in the temple the sealing to her first husband would not have been revoked because the church will not revoke a sealing for a woman until another sealing is going to take place to another husband (eta. which usually requires a fairly lengthy waiting period and a lot of explaining), so she would have already been sealed to the first husband  and why the need to re-seal?  
 
(2) If her first sealing was revoked and she married her second husband in the temple that sealing would have to be reovked in order for her to be sealed to her first husband again in the temple, and this usually doesnt happen until after a civil ceremony and a year long wait. 
 
(3) They did not do a time only ceremony.  Time only ceremonies are discouraged, if they even do them any more. Also, Donny said they had been sealed together for time and all eternity. 
 
(4) So it sounds like several rules were overlooked that the majority of un-famous couples have to observe.  The video of her coming out of the temple with her 16ft. train on her wedding dress made it appear as if that is what she wore for the ceremony, PR indeed, but then again maybe that rule was broken too, who knows. 
 
(5) This is all as clear as mud but the church makes it look like a normal, everyday occourance.  So many rules were overlooked or changed for this to take place and only TBM temple married mormons would know that, but they won't think past "isn't it wonderful, an eternal marriage for Marie." 
 
I really do hope it all works out for her, but the misrepresentation of what other couples have to go through to have sealings revoked and all the hoops they have to jump through will never be known because Marie simply went to the temple and was sealed to her first husband.  PR appears to make things look much easier in the church than what really happens for the rest of the membership if they aren't an asset to the church propoganda machine.  
I don't understand what you guys are talking about!  You have NO idea what church requirements were met to make this happen.  Just because we just found out about it today doesn't mean they weren't jumping through hoops to accomplish this.  And what do you mean, lie?  I've never heard anything about Marie that would indicate she's not worthy of a temple recommened.  Not that I care about that part of it, but she's had a lot of hurt in her life (and having millions of dollars does not make that go away).  I wish her only the best -- sometimes those first loves just always have a spot in your heart.  Obviously it was there for her and for him.
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Posted: 05 May 2011 11:52 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]   

   
 
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howdimissthat
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Suzyq:
howdimissthat:
Ok, lets get this straight. 
 
(1) Marie Osmond married her first husband for the second time in a temple ceremony.  If she didn't marry her second husband in the temple the sealing to her first husband would not have been revoked because the church will not revoke a sealing for a woman until another sealing is going to take place to another husband (eta. which usually requires a fairly lengthy waiting period and a lot of explaining), so she would have already been sealed to the first husband  and why the need to re-seal?  
 
(2) If her first sealing was revoked and she married her second husband in the temple that sealing would have to be reovked in order for her to be sealed to her first husband again in the temple, and this usually doesnt happen until after a civil ceremony and a year long wait. 
 
(3) They did not do a time only ceremony.  Time only ceremonies are discouraged, if they even do them any more. Also, Donny said they had been sealed together for time and all eternity. 
 
(4) So it sounds like several rules were overlooked that the majority of un-famous couples have to observe.  The video of her coming out of the temple with her 16ft. train on her wedding dress made it appear as if that is what she wore for the ceremony, PR indeed, but then again maybe that rule was broken too, who knows. 
 
(5) This is all as clear as mud but the church makes it look like a normal, everyday occourance.  So many rules were overlooked or changed for this to take place and only TBM temple married mormons would know that, but they won't think past "isn't it wonderful, an eternal marriage for Marie." 
 
I really do hope it all works out for her, but the misrepresentation of what other couples have to go through to have sealings revoked and all the hoops they have to jump through will never be known because Marie simply went to the temple and was sealed to her first husband.  PR appears to make things look much easier in the church than what really happens for the rest of the membership if they aren't an asset to the church propoganda machine.  
I don't understand what you guys are talking about!  You have NO idea what church requirements were met to make this happen.  Just because we just found out about it today doesn't mean they weren't jumping through hoops to accomplish this.  And what do you mean, lie?  I've never heard anything about Marie that would indicate she's not worthy of a temple recommened.  Not that I care about that part of it, but she's had a lot of hurt in her life (and having millions of dollars does not make that go away).  I wish her only the best -- sometimes those first loves just always have a spot in your heart.  Obviously it was there for her and for him.
 
No I don't know what happened in the long run, those questions just came to my mind.  I do know what has to be done for a woman to get sealing revocation and and it isn't an easy task.  It can take several months if the woman is asking to be sealed to another man, and it won't happen at all if she isn't.  I have a sister-in-law and a daughter-in-law who went through this.  They both had civil ceremonies, one in the temple, both of them would have preferred a temple sealing instead of a civil ceremony but there was a waiting period for a sealing revocation, married or not.  I didn't say she lied, that was another poster.  I think they may have been referring to "do you wear your garments at all times" which she obviously does not when she does her LosVegas show, which is her choice she could wear garment appropriate clothing.  The point is it appears that the rules for your run of the mill TBM are not  always quite the same as for celebrtiy TBM's, but no, I don't know what happened, I just had some questions about this particular situation and the sealing/revocation process.


   


Posted: 06 May 2011 01:49 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]   

   
 
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Deut. 24:1-4

Abomination saith the lord
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Famous people that should be mormons  
Posted: 17 September 2010 01:21 PM   [ Ignore ]   

   
 
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Mohanrad Moriancummer
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Here and there you hear famous people speaking and they sound a lot like mormons. Some even dress like them or share their main political ideals (of the majority of course). So who can you see that fills this profile. As far as I can see I would vote for Sarah Palin and Nicholas Sparks.  

   


Posted: 17 September 2010 05:10 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]   

   
 
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Ahman's neighbor Bill
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from a different angle, I despise when TBMs say "that person should be Mormon, they're so close...blahblah" I was riding with a professor at BYU-I on a trip and some Clapton song came on on the radio and He says, "there's someone who should be a member, he wrote this song after his child passed away, it's how he hopes heaven will be, its so close to the truth, if he only knew!!" I just nodded my head and kept quiet. But honestly the nerve of these people to assume that they have all the truth and that everyone needs their truth is disturbing!! Doesn't it occur to them that maybe other people should be free to decide whats true for them?? If Clapton's version of Heaven is as he portrayed it in that song then good for him, he doesn't need Mormon version of Heaven.
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—Eric Hoffer


   


Posted: 17 September 2010 05:58 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]   

   
 
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Well, one must not forget Christine O'Donnell, the Tea Party candidate for the Senate just elected in Delaware. She is known as a "Anti-Masturbation" activist, and is outspoken as to whether or not Christians would ever do such a thing. Maybe she is already LDS?
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Posted: 17 September 2010 06:18 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]   

   
 
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ClearThoughts
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apostate (FKA) strangite:
Well, one must not forget Christine O'Donnell, the Tea Party candidate for the Senate just elected in Delaware. She is known as a "Anti-Masturbation" activist, and is outspoken as to whether or not Christians would ever do such a thing. Maybe she is already LDS?
Everything I've heard her say reminds me of TBMs.  It's like the shocked mainstream press has never talked to a TBM before... ;)
 
Here's my two favorite quotes by her (but there's lots more here):
 
O’Donnell believes women do not enjoy sex, using it only as a means to love. “Women play sex to get love. Men play love to get sex.” [Fox News, 8/2/03]
 
O’Donnell excused gay bashing as ‘kids being kids.’ Asked about disparaging comments children had made about a gay peer, O’Donnell dismissed it, saying, “It’s kids being kids, that’s it.” [Hannity & Colmes, 7/19/00]
 
 
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Posted: 18 September 2010 05:47 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]   

   
 
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apostate (FKA) strangite:
Well, one must not forget Christine O'Donnell, the Tea Party candidate for the Senate just elected in Delaware. She is known as a "Anti-Masturbation" activist, and is outspoken as to whether or not Christians would ever do such a thing. Maybe she is already LDS?


 Who would of thought masturbation was going to be a political issue in 2010.

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Posted: 18 September 2010 06:04 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]   

   
 
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eddie
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For their willingness to tell any lie to obtain money:
 
Bernie Madoff
Bernard Ebber
Lou Pearlman

...and the fine, upstanding citizens on this list:
 
http://www.dailyfinance.com/investing/famous-financial-felons/
 
The general authorities are of the same ilk as these people. Raking in a fortune and giving back...absolutely nothing. In fact these swindlers are so much like the general authorities they should make an exception and perform baptisms in absentia for the living in their cases. They should all also be given immediate callings to the Quorums of Seventy with Bernie Madoff next in line for an open seat among the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles. 
 
 
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Posted: 18 September 2010 06:59 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]   

   
 
apostate (FKA) strangite
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ClearThoughts:
apostate (FKA) strangite:
Well, one must not forget Christine O'Donnell, the Tea Party candidate for the Senate just elected in Delaware. She is known as a "Anti-Masturbation" activist, and is outspoken as to whether or not Christians would ever do such a thing. Maybe she is already LDS?
 

 Who would of thought masturbation was going to be a political issue in 2010.
 

  Joseph would want to personally thank her
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Posted: 19 September 2010 05:35 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]   

   
 
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ClearThoughts:
apostate (FKA) strangite:
Well, one must not forget Christine O'Donnell, the Tea Party candidate for the Senate just elected in Delaware. She is known as a "Anti-Masturbation" activist, and is outspoken as to whether or not Christians would ever do such a thing. Maybe she is already LDS?
Everything I've heard her say reminds me of TBMs.  It's like the shocked mainstream press has never talked to a TBM before... ;)
 
Here's my two favorite quotes by her (but there's lots more here):
 
O’Donnell believes women do not enjoy sex, using it only as a means to love. “Women play sex to get love. Men play love to get sex.” [Fox News, 8/2/03]

O’Donnell excused gay bashing as ‘kids being kids.’ Asked about disparaging comments children had made about a gay peer, O’Donnell dismissed it, saying, “It’s kids being kids, that’s it.” [Hannity & Colmes, 7/19/00]
 
 
 
 
 
 
What the????  Aparently she has never had good sex...
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Posted: 19 September 2010 06:21 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]   

   
 
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I really hate when Mormons talk about how Mother Theresa was so Christlike, but what a shame she wasn't a Mormon and didn't have the real truth. Or how she could have done so much more good if she'd been Mormon. It's a horribly arrogant thing to say. 
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Posted: 19 September 2010 12:20 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]   

   
 
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DrW
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apostate (FKA) strangite:
ClearThoughts:
apostate (FKA) strangite:
Well, one must not forget Christine O'Donnell, the Tea Party candidate for the Senate just elected in Delaware. She is known as a "Anti-Masturbation" activist, and is outspoken as to whether or not Christians would ever do such a thing. Maybe she is already LDS?
 

 Who would of thought masturbation was going to be a political issue in 2010.
 
 
  Joseph would want to personally thank her 
 
Hilarious (and exactly on point).
 
This one gets my vote for "Best Campaign Button of 2010".


   


Posted: 19 September 2010 01:41 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]   

   
 
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Eliza R. Snitch:
I really hate when Mormons talk about how Mother Theresa was so Christlike, but what a shame she wasn't a Mormon and didn't have the real truth. Or how she could have done so much more good if she'd been Mormon. It's a horribly arrogant thing to say. 
 
Several years ago I read how Mother Theresa, in her writings, actually doubted the existence of God.  I think she was on the right track. 
 
I sure those that are more computer savy than I am could find what she said.  I believe it was in a readers digest.
 
Maybe the US is turning into TBMs.  I watched a lot of football yesterday and for the first time I felt sorry, disappointed, pissed off and many other negative emotions as I saw both teams after a hard fought game all kneel to a mythical being.
 
I realized that leaving the 'true church' is all inclusive.


   


            
 
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Please indulge me another Brandon Flowers of The Killers thread…  
Posted: 15 September 2010 10:14 PM   [ Ignore ]   

   
 
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MishMagnet
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So we all know that I love Brandon Flowers and can't wait till he's a PostMo and am expecting him at any time - much like my parents expect me back at church any time.
 
Brandon Flowers solo album came out yesterday and I have listened to it.  Of course I read into his music what I want to read into it.  I'd heard that he called this album a testament to his faith or something along that line and I was worried it was going to be quite Jesus Wants me for a Sunbeam and all that.
 
In my opinion, from what I heard I would think he was closer than ever to leaving the church (and of course there is the question of how much he was ever in the church to begin with). 
 
Peruse the following lyrics from Only The Young:
 
Look back in silence
The cradle of your whole life
There in the distance
Losing its greatest pride
Nothing is easy, nothing is sacred, why?
Where did the bow break?
It happened before your time
 
And there were people there
Lovely as you’d ever care
Tonight, baby, you can start again
Laughing in the open air
Have yourself another dream
Tonight, baby, we can start again
 
Only the young can break away, break away
Lost when the wind blows, on your own
Only the young can break away, break away
Lost when the wind blows, on your own
 
Mother, it’s cold here
Father, thy will be done
Thunder and lightning are crashing down
They got me on the run
Direct me to the sun
Redemption, keep my covers clean tonight
Baby, we can start again
 
And the sun will shine again.
And the sun will shine again.
Are you looking for a sign?
Or are you caught up in the lie?
 
Only the young can break away, break away
Lost when the wind blows, on your own
Only the young can break away, break away
Lost when the wind blows, on your own
 
On my last Brandon Flowers of The Killers thread several people said that Brandon Flowers music really spoke to their own pain of disaffection.  I wouldn't expect any TBM to understand what it feels like.  Donny Osmond's music, for instance, has never caused me to feel understood (although Donny Osmond is so nice, can't help but like him anyway.)  Maybe it's our shared Mormon soul. 
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Posted: 16 September 2010 01:03 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]   

   
 
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He was on NPR Weekend Edition on Sunday.  Enjoy!
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Posted: 16 September 2010 03:01 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]   

   
 
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You could post a Brandon Flowers thread 10 times every day and I'd love you for it!!!  I heart him!!!
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Posted: 16 September 2010 04:03 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]   

   
 
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He's moving our direction if he isn't here already.  His first son's name was Ammon.  His second son's name is Gunner.  Gunner's going to totally destroy Ammon.  I still consider Brandon the first PostMo I knew before I discovered all you good people were in our concert.
 
I saw The Killers this summer in concert.  I felt The Spirit© testify to me during the following opening hymn. 
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AHaXv0Yu4AU&feature=related
 
He took the words right out of my mouth since the whole song is how I feel facing my disenchantment with The Church© to my parents by, as he says, "cutting the cord" and becoming a human rather than doing the dance steps and following along.  It's interesting in the concert version he adds the following that is not on the studio version of the song. 
 
Bring on your new messiah
wherever he may roam.
First I'm gonna make it
then i'm gonna break it till it falls apart.
Hate'n all the fake'n
shake'n while I'm break'n your brittle heart.
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Posted: 16 September 2010 04:15 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]   

   
 
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God, he sounds so MORMON in that NPR interview. I'm talking not about the things he says but actually the way he speaks, his Mormon accent. He sounds like me.
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Posted: 16 September 2010 04:19 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]   

   
 
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Iron Rod:It's interesting in the concert version he adds the following that is not on the studio version of the song. 
 
 
Bring on your new messiah
wherever he may roam.
First I'm gonna make it
then i'm gonna break it till it falls apart.
Hate'n all the fake'n
shake'n while I'm break'n your brittle heart.
 
Not to take away anything from this post, but it should be noted he didn't write those lyrics. They're from "Bring on the Dancing Horses" by Echo & the Bunnymen.
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Posted: 16 September 2010 07:29 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]   

   
 
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So did you get his new album?  What do you think?  DW isn't a fan (except for the iTunes bonus tracks), but I'm diggin' it.  Of course, as I said to my wife, "I'd probably like anything he does.  He's dreamy." 
 
DD, a brand new teen, overheard and asked me, "Is he good-looking?"  I didn't answer.  The funny thing is that she and I saw The Killers one year ago this month in SLC.  Then she reminded me that she didn't bring her glasses.
 
Somebody mentioned Arcade Fire on this thread too, a band I enjoy as well (and seemingly my teen son's current favorite).  On lists of famous "postmos," I've obviously seen Win Butler, the lead singer.  But I saw his brother, William Butler, the band's drummer, on a list of famous Mormons.  This seems odd considering the few other things I've read about him.  Does anyone know more about this?
 
ETA:  I guess the Arcade Fire mention was on MishMagnet's other Brandon Flowers thread.
 
http://www.postmormon.org/exp_e/index.php/discussions/viewthread/23520/
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Posted: 16 September 2010 04:18 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]   

   
 
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So, I'm confused.  I thought he already was post-mormon.
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Posted: 16 September 2010 04:22 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]   

   
 
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I like the new album, not sure if I love it yet.  It's much more soulful without the energetic Killers back-up, but something about the back-up from the other band members is what really speaks to me on the band albums.
 
Gypsy Girl, he hasn't left yet that anyone knows.  He got sober a few years ago, got married (not in the temple) had two kids and in any interview does profess belief for the church. 
 
I kind of imagine he's a JackMo but am really not sure.
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Posted: 16 September 2010 04:52 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]   

   
 
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gypsy girl
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Hmm...I thought that I had read an interview several years ago where he said that he had heard some really weird stuff about Joseph Smith and then decided to leave TSCC, and then he talked about how weird it was to drink beers for the first time...
 
But maybe I'm getting him confused with someone else?  I dunno.  
 
I'll try to look for that interview...
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Posted: 16 September 2010 04:58 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]   

   
 
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gypsy girl
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Okay, this is hilarious...
 
I didn't find the interview, but I did find this quote on a Famous Mormons webpage:
 
"Mormon listeners may find some hints of our beliefs in Brandon’s lyrics such as the line found in the song “Somebody Told Me“:
Heaven ain’t close in a place like this
One wonders if it’s a possible reference to the teaching to avoid places where the Holy Ghost can’t dwell, but that’s anyone’s guess."
 
 

Are you serious???!!!  Hints to Mormon beliefs in "Somebody Told Me"???  How about the line..."you had a boyfriend who looked like a girlfriend I had in February"?  I'd love to hear a Mormon apologist try to find a link to Mormonism in that line!
 
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Posted: 16 September 2010 06:41 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]   

   
 
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gypsy girl:
Okay, this is hilarious...
 
I didn't find the interview, but I did find this quote on a Famous Mormons webpage:
 
"Mormon listeners may find some hints of our beliefs in Brandon’s lyrics such as the line found in the song “Somebody Told Me“:
Heaven ain’t close in a place like this
One wonders if it’s a possible reference to the teaching to avoid places where the Holy Ghost can’t dwell, but that’s anyone’s guess."
 
 

Are you serious???!!!  Hints to Mormon beliefs in "Somebody Told Me"???  How about the line..."you had a boyfriend who looked like a girlfriend I had in February"?  I'd love to hear a Mormon apologist try to find a link to Mormonism in that line!
 
 
That's what I love about art and artists.  You're influenced by your own experiences in your interpretation of them and their work.  My TBM BIL loves the Killers, I'm sure he only sees Flowers' words as pro-TSSC.  
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Posted: 16 September 2010 07:20 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]   

   
 
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Smokey
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Ok, I had never really listened to the Killers before, but because of this thread I have been listening to them all day on Grooveshark.

I have not heard a bad song YET!!!!!  These guys kick A.
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Posted: 16 September 2010 07:35 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]   

   
 
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  whoops. never mind.
 
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Posted: 16 September 2010 11:07 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]   

   
 
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FindingPeace
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ElGuapo:
Iron Rod:It's interesting in the concert version he adds the following that is not on the studio version of the song. 
 
 
Bring on your new messiah
wherever he may roam.
First I'm gonna make it
then i'm gonna break it till it falls apart.
Hate'n all the fake'n
shake'n while I'm break'n your brittle heart.
 
Not to take away anything from this post, but it should be noted he didn't write those lyrics. They're from "Bring on the Dancing Horses" by Echo & the Bunnymen.

 I love Echo & the Bunnymen. 
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Posted: 16 September 2010 11:41 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 15 ]   

   
 
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gypsy girl
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ClearThoughts:
gypsy girl:
Okay, this is hilarious...
 
I didn't find the interview, but I did find this quote on a Famous Mormons webpage:
 
"Mormon listeners may find some hints of our beliefs in Brandon’s lyrics such as the line found in the song “Somebody Told Me“:
Heaven ain’t close in a place like this
One wonders if it’s a possible reference to the teaching to avoid places where the Holy Ghost can’t dwell, but that’s anyone’s guess."
 
 

Are you serious???!!!  Hints to Mormon beliefs in "Somebody Told Me"???  How about the line..."you had a boyfriend who looked like a girlfriend I had in February"?  I'd love to hear a Mormon apologist try to find a link to Mormonism in that line!
 
 
That's what I love about art and artists.  You're influenced by your own experiences in your interpretation of them and their work.  My TBM BIL loves the Killers, I'm sure he only sees Flowers' words as pro-TSSC.  
 
 Well, yes.  Be that as it may, "Somebody Told Me," as a Mormon song is a huuuugggge stretch (far off heavens and departing Holy Ghosts notwithstanding). 
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Posted: 17 September 2010 02:59 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 16 ]   

   
 
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GodFree
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I love The Killers. Don't know if I'll get the solo album unless the singles really kick ass. I wouldn't hold my breath for Flowers to leave TSCC though. He was a lapsed mormon for a few years, but everything recently points to him being a TBM.
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Posted: 20 September 2010 08:41 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 17 ]   

   
 
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GodFree:
I love The Killers. Don't know if I'll get the solo album unless the singles really kick ass. I wouldn't hold my breath for Flowers to leave TSCC though. He was a lapsed mormon for a few years, but everything recently points to him being a TBM.
 
I also get the impression that he's moving closer to the church, not farther away from it.  It's been quite a while since he was photographed with a drink in his hand or a cigarette hanging out of his mouth.
 
Also, check this out from his Wiki page:
 
 
Brandon and his wife have two sons, Ammon (named after a Mormon prophet), born July 14, 2007 and Gunner, born July 28, 2009. The couple is expecting a third child.
 
 
So they're certainly following the TBM reproductive pattern!  
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Posted: 20 September 2010 08:53 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 18 ]   

   
 
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http://www.newsoftheworld.co.uk/entertainment/music/71603/Killers-singer-says-it-KILLS-him-when-people-mock-Mormons.html
 
This is from back at the end of 2008, so I don't know where in his history of being active and inactive this falls.  But as of that date, this makes it sounds like he was pretty much embracing his TBMism at that time.
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Posted: 20 September 2010 09:22 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 19 ]   

   
 
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Qi
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Zenock-Knock:
Brandon and his wife have two sons, Ammon (named after a Mormon prophet), born July 14, 2007 and Gunner, born July 28, 2009. The couple is expecting a third child.
 Hmmm........Brandon! No!!! Pleease don't slip into the Soul Eating Machine!

**************************************************************
 Has anyone ever listened to Interpol and thought perhaps that the style influenced Flowers?


   


Posted: 14 October 2010 11:31 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 20 ]   

   
 
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Just for you, MishMagnet:
 
Brandon Flowers interview in the London Telegraph (Oct. 12, 2010).
 
 
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Posted: 14 October 2010 02:25 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 21 ]   

   
 
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Ooh, thanks for the link!  I just wish it were'nt so depressing.  "My faith influences the songs I don't write" (regarding his darker, sexual nature.)
 

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Posted: 10 December 2010 01:37 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 22 ]   

   
 
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I have been ADDICTED, seriously, to the Killers for over 3 years now.  I love Brandon so much that I would probably rejoin the church for him and be wife # whatever..!!!  Now that's true love 
 
My two teenage kids were taken to their first rock concert by me, to see the Killers a few years ago.  They loved it.  They're hooked.
 
Then this year in August I flew to Vegas to watch his first solo performance of Flamingo in a small room of a hotel.  Anybody else go to that?  I don't like the music as much as the Killers, but I could not get enough of his face. 
 
As far as what kind of Mormon he is, I think he's a Jack.  He believes but he can't stick to the suffocating rules. 
 
He's just a brilliant artist.   If he ever studies up on the history of tscc I bet he'll jump ship, and have SOOOO much writing material from those emotions.  Should be great. 
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