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Falling Back In.
Started by  nightflight , Yesterday, 01:34 PM
 

Please log in to reply
 7 replies to this topic  .



 

 #1     nightflight 


Sage

Senior Member

2,714 posts
Location:Alpha Quadrant
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :aggie


Posted Yesterday, 01:34 PM

I've been in and out of Xianity so many times.  I guess I get lonely without God.  But there is so much a person has to block out in order to be a Christian.  Things like science, biblical contradictions, the second coming, miracles, moral atrocities, and a whole lot more.  Yet even with all that I do find myself repeatedly falling back into the faith.  Recently though it was the silence of God that drove me back out.  My life has unravelled due to illness and God failed to either heal me, help me find better therapy or at least make me see that life is worth living with it.  I'm angry about this.  Where is God?  Nowhere.  At some point, if I get the balls, I plan on taking my own life due to my illness; but fear of afterlife punishment is keeping me stuck here.  That's the worse thing about Xianity; it traps people in this sad world through fear.


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 #2     rjn 


Apostate

Regular Member

697 posts
Gender:Male
Location:Hyperborea
Interests:Nature, philosophy, history, linguistics, mythology, science, music, literature.
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :Nah. A spiritual world view at best.


Posted Yesterday, 02:05 PM
Hang in there. I don't know what kind of illness you're struggling with, and I know this will hardly console you, but regardless, don't give up, there are still reasons to stay alive, even without the threat or promise of an afterlife.


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 #3     dangitbobby83 


Thinker

Regular Member

175 posts
Gender:Male
Location:Montana Mountains
Interests:Philosophy, physics, (ex)theology, music, programming, camping, fishing and video games.
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :NO thank "God" :D


Posted Yesterday, 02:57 PM

Once you accept that there is no god, the world makes a lot more sense.
 
But don't take that as something to fear, that's something to embolden. It means we have FAR more power in our lives than the imaginary god ever has! The reason he hasn't helped you --- he doesn't exist. Instead, this means, you can focus on you! You CAN make it through. You CAN find people who care about you.
 
Look at where you are? Here at ex-c, you have a place to receive more and better support than any church could possibly supply.
 
Don't give up hope. I know what it's like to be depressed and suicidal. Removing god, finally and forever, was part of the equation for me. It allowed me to let go. It allowed me to assign value to myself and not rely on outside sources. I could see the bad in the world for what it truly was: not the work of sin, or satan. Human nature which we are overcoming, slowly but surely! Crime and violence is down across the world. No major war has been fought since WW2. Gays, lesbians, etc. are finally experiencing freedom to be with who they love all over the world. The income gap is closing. Women now have actual say. Slavery is all but abolished, at least legally, across the world. Technology is slowly but surely eliminating hunger worldwide, and there are tons of advances that will happen over the next few years that will do even more to help us.
 These are the broad strokes that show that things are getting better. That's not to say things don't need to be done - a lot of work needs to be done. But we do have the power to do it. God isn't coming "back". It's up to us and you are part of the solution, NOT the problem!
 
Please, don't consider suicide. You have value and worth. Talents and strengths. And you are NOT alone, even if you feel like it.
 
I hope this helps.


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 #4     sdelsolray 


I'm Not That Important

Regular Member

2,258 posts
Gender:Male
Interests:Music, science, critical thinking, history, gardening, film noir movies.
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :None of the above


Posted Yesterday, 07:48 PM

Religion has nothing to do with any chemical imbalances in your brain.  Some or all of your religious thoughts are quite possibly the result of chemical imbalances in your brain.
 
Please consult your mental health professional promptly.


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 #5     nightflight 


Sage

Senior Member

2,714 posts
Location:Alpha Quadrant
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :aggie


Posted Yesterday, 08:39 PM

sdelsolray, on 27 Feb 2016 - 7:48 PM, said:


Religion has nothing to do with any chemical imbalances in your brain.  Some or all of your religious thoughts are quite possibly the result of chemical imbalances in your brain.
 
Please consult your mental health professional promptly.
 
There is no imbalance in my brain.  I have chronic fatigue due to sleep apnea that is resistant to treatment.  I wake up wiped out.  I must deconvert so I can escape.


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 #6     TrueScotsman 


Thinker

Regular Member

132 posts
Gender:Male
Interests:Music, singing, hiking, reading, Wife
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :Nope


Posted Today, 04:15 AM

nightflight, on 27 Feb 2016 - 1:34 PM, said:

I've been in and out of Xianity so many times. I guess I get lonely without God. But there is so much a person has to block out in order to be a Christian. Things like science, biblical contradictions, the second coming, miracles, moral atrocities, and a whole lot more. Yet even with all that I do find myself repeatedly falling back into the faith. Recently though it was the silence of God that drove me back out. My life has unravelled due to illness and God failed to either heal me, help me find better therapy or at least make me see that life is worth living with it. I'm angry about this. Where is God? Nowhere. At some point, if I get the balls, I plan on taking my own life due to my illness; but fear of afterlife punishment is keeping me stuck here. That's the worse thing about Xianity; it traps people in this sad world through fear.
In all seriousness, seek professional help as soon as you can, we aren't psychologists here and we aren't going to make you more comfortable with ending your own life.

 Life can be tragic, but it can also be beautiful, but you need to get healthy first. Don't just give up because it has been resistant to treatment, life gets so much better after Christianity.
 Please seek professional psychological help.

 .


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 #7     Margee 


'Madame Eve'

Moderator

6,815 posts
Gender:Female
Location:Canada
Interests:Learning how to be an ex-Christian and be comfortable with it!
 This is my 'Please Forgive Me' letter - It is my testimony and I hope it helps someone....You'll have to copy and paste.
 
http://www.ex-christian.net/topic/44259-please-forgive-me/
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :Non-Believer


Posted Today, 09:07 AM

nightflight, on 27 Feb 2016 - 1:34 PM, said:


I've been in and out of Xianity so many times.  I guess I get lonely without God.  But there is so much a person has to block out in order to be a Christian.  Things like science, biblical contradictions, the second coming, miracles, moral atrocities, and a whole lot more.  Yet even with all that I do find myself repeatedly falling back into the faith.  Recently though it was the silence of God that drove me back out.  My life has unravelled due to illness and God failed to either heal me, help me find better therapy or at least make me see that life is worth living with it.  I'm angry about this.  Where is God?  Nowhere.  At some point, if I get the balls, I plan on taking my own life due to my illness; but fear of afterlife punishment is keeping me stuck here.  That's the worse thing about Xianity; it traps people in this sad world through fear.
 
Nightflight, I am so very sorry you are suffering right now. I certainly cannot tell you how to fix this dilemma you are in but I can relate to you some of my own life's experiences. There have been times when I have completely lost the will to live. You have to be very strong emotionally to fight for your life and I have had to do this...gain back a strength to fight back against the forces on earth that make you want to quit and give up. Examples would be, loss of loved ones, heartbreak and failed relationships, chronic illness, depression that comes naturally from these things, loss of job and financial stability, etc..... To be able to survive life's hardships we need to fight back. I believe it is 'survival of the fittest, strongest, healthiest and luckiest.
 
I am a total 100% believer in mind-body connections. I have had to go back and heal (all by myself  mostly through doing a lot of research and with the help of a therapist every now and again) all my past trauma's, including childhood. I've had to look at everything that caused me pain. I believe completely that there is an emotional connection to our dilemma's as human animals and that might be what you need to look into. I am not by any means an experienced therapist but I was desperate enough to look at some things with a very open mind. I am only an on-line friend reaching out to another human who is suffering. I just wanted to pass this along to you today because I know what it feels like to feel desperate.
 
But...you must want to fight this with every fiber of strength that is within you. Only you can make your mind up to that.
 
Dr. Michael J. Lincoln’s book called '' Messages from the Body'' states this (below) about sleep apnea. He addresses the emotional component for people with sleep apnea, stating:
 
''They are intensely sensitive, fearful and longing for mother love or love from someone else. They have a lot of disappointment, bitterness, forgiveness and resentment of being overworked. But at the same time, they dare not express or even acknowledge these feelings out of fear of total rejection and abandonment. They are hostility repressing, compulsively over giving, hypersensitive and lonely. They are full of family taboos, social restrictions and moral inhibitions, all learned in an intensely repressive family which forced a “model child” adjustment on them. There is a great deal of deep-seated guilt, shame and grief arising out of this and they are joy avoidant, happiness squashing and love deflecting all in the misguided  hope that they will thereby finally “earn” the  “God Housekeeping Seal of Approval.” In effect they are so self suppressing, they are suffocating themselves.''
 
 
Does this not sound to you someone who strives to be 100% perfectionist?  Especially when we were christians....wanting to please god more than anything in the world? It was for me. I always wanted to rescue the whole world from pain because of the pains in my own childhood. If you have any fight left in you, you might want to look at some of this. I wish I could wave a magic wand and rescue you but I can't. You will have to  gather up the strength and fight for your life.
 
If you are at all interested, here is his website. You can order his book and their are various prices because he also offers it in an e-book style.
 
I don't know what else to say except my heart goes out to you and I hope you do decide to fight back. There are things in this world worth living for. I can't read the news or watch anything violent. I need to observe as much happiness as possible so I only watch funny movies and do things that make me laugh. I try very hard to get out in nature because it brings me peace. Unfortunately, anything that triggers me, including too much religious debate, I have to get away from to stay healthy in my own mind.
 
 
This is his website and to order his book if you are interested: http://www.talkinghe...l-j-lincoln-phd
 
For emotional support due to illness, this is a wonderful website to belong to pertaining to mind-body illnesses:
 
http://www.tmswiki.org/forum/
 
I am also an advocate for natural remedies as much as people might laugh at this, I have been successful in many areas of my own life through the use of supplements. You may want to do some research on this also. What have you got to lose?
 
 http://articles.merc...leep-apnea.aspx
 
Best of luck to you my friend. I hope you gain hope today.
 
((hug))
 

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 #8     rjn 


Apostate

Regular Member

697 posts
Gender:Male
Location:Hyperborea
Interests:Nature, philosophy, history, linguistics, mythology, science, music, literature.
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :Nah. A spiritual world view at best.


Posted Today, 09:33 AM
Too bad I can't like your comments Margee. You're a very wise and sensible person :)


 . 


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Christianity Saved My Soul
Started by  SerenelyBlue , Nov 17 2015 11:14 AM
 

This topic is locked This topic is locked
 5 replies to this topic  .



 

 #1     SerenelyBlue 


Thinker

Regular Member

129 posts
Gender:Male
Interests:I like reading, kayaking, photography and more...
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :no


Posted 17 November 2015 - 11:14 AM
My soul was in rebellion, but Christianity saved it. I was a wretched sinner, but Jesus took me in.
 My testimonial is that I was saved and given a second chance by the holy Jesus, the Son of God.



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 #2     florduh 


Not Right in the Head

Super Moderator

17,198 posts
Gender:Male
Location:St. Pete, Florduh
Interests:Food.
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :my doG


Posted 17 November 2015 - 11:44 AM

Take your meds and please don't start any more topics, okay?
 
We're still here for you.
 

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 #3     midniterider 


Fully Human

Regular Member

6,093 posts
Gender:Male
Location:Omnipresent
Interests:Chaos Magick, Meditation, Lucid Dreaming. I try not to take my philosophy of life too seriously.
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :Monistic Idealist


Posted 17 November 2015 - 01:12 PM

SerenelyBlue, on 17 Nov 2015 - 11:14 AM, said:


My soul was in rebellion, but Christianity saved it. I was a wretched sinner, but Jesus took me in.
 My testimonial is that I was saved and given a second chance by the holy Jesus, the Son of God.

 
Saved your soul from what? Your fearful imaginings?


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 #4     mymistake 


The Pope wants to punch me in the nose!

Regular Member

16,205 posts
Gender:Male
Interests:family, support, humanism, meditation, peace of mind, moving on as forgiveness, deprograming, laughing at the Bible, Fourth Wave Feminism, Game of Thrones
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :"I enjoy mythology but I'm not religious about it"


Posted 17 November 2015 - 01:33 PM

Manic phase then?  That is cool SerenityBlue.  We have several members with religious swings.  Please do not feel embarrassed when you come back down.  We understand.


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 #5     Geezer 


Born Again Non-Believer

Regular Member

1,507 posts
Gender:Male
Location:Deep South in the buckle of the bible belt
Interests:Religious History, Cosmology, & Theoretical Physics for dummies.
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :No


Posted 17 November 2015 - 04:15 PM

You know you shouldn't be smoking that stuff, right? Smoking that stuff makes Jesus cry. Don't do it!


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 #6     Overcame Faith 


Just Me

Senior Member

4,612 posts
Gender:Male
Location:USA
Interests:none right now.
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :No


Posted 17 November 2015 - 05:45 PM
Locked. Not appropriate for the testimonial forum. Note the title, "Testimonies of Former Christians". You are not a former Christian, but by your very words a current Christian. One more such incursion into the Testimonies forum and you will be given a warning point!!!


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A Brief Summary Of My Story
Started by  martynq , Sep 29 2015 07:52 AM
 

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 7 replies to this topic  .



 

 #1     martynq 


Questioner

New Member

11 posts
Gender:Male
Location:United Kingdom
Interests:Mathematics, music, guitar playing, exercise
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :Nope


Posted 29 September 2015 - 07:52 AM

I've been reading articles here for a while and lurking on the forum slightly more recently.  I think I really ought to have got round to posting my ex-timony by now, but here (finally) goes.
 I became a christian while at university.  I really can no longer work out why I changed my mind about the atheist beliefs I held back then, but with hindsight I do know that I was poorly informed about christianity and somehow I perceived the claims as reasonable.  I was also surrounded at the time by a significant number of christians and, however much I might like to think I'm an independent thinker, I wonder whether I was too easily affected by the want to conform.  There is also the fact that the woman I married was one of these and perhaps subconsciously I knew that my only chance with her was to convert.  I then stayed a christian for just about the next 23 years and came out to my wife as an ex-christian back in January.
 It took me at least two years to wrestle through my thinking before I gave up my beliefs, and that's only a guess.  I can see things some four years ago that was leading up to the deconversion point, but it is definitely the thinking I was going through during that period of time that contributed.  The things that caused me to question my faith were the following:
 1. Lack of answers to prayer.  The death of a close friend who we all prayed for was probably the most significant, but after that I realised that I could not think of a single example of a prayer that I had made for which I could genuinely say had been answered.
 2. The way that so many christians point to various examples of an answered prayer or miracle, but what actually shows up is a poor handling of probabilities.  They tend to underestimate the likelihood of the thing they are pointing to, over-specialise so as to make it look more rare, and then fail to sum over all possible instances.  (What I mean by the latter is that a particular event for an individual might have a very small probability, but when we calculate the probability that somebody we know actually experiences it, the probability goes massively up.)  As someone who has considerable mathematical training, I find this way of handling things both annoying and naive.
 3. The way that various christians use whatever their Bible verses say to achieve whatever they want.  The statements about women teaching is a classic example.  My deconversion happened while my wife was training as a Baptist minister (we live in the UK, so this is slightly more acceptable than other places), but I still saw that a lot of churches were bigoted about women.  As someone who loves my wife very much, I couldn't stand to see her being treated so poorly.  (She is now working as an assistant pastor at a local church - well, I say working: she is unpaid, because they need two pastors but can't afford to pay her.)
 4. I spent a lot of the time asking god to show himself to me.  I had been told that he is all-powerful and wants to speak to his children.  This never happened to me.  The final straw was at a particular event where we were all supposed to listen to what god was saying.  I heard nothing - I could recognise what my own thoughts were, but everything in my brain I knew was originating from me.  The people around me, however, were able to babble on about all the wonderful things god was saying to them.  At this point, my eyes saw clearly that these people were just deluding themselves and I couldn't partake of this delusion any longer.
 5. My final conclusion was that if this god actually existed then he had every opportunity to show himself.  If he has this supposed power to create the whole universe, then only a small fraction would be required to produce something substantial that I could be certain about.  The only possible conclusion is that he doesn't exist.
 I can no longer remember whether there were any other substantive reasons that got me to this point.  One of the things I did realise is that as an educator, I was trying to get my students to engage in critical thinking and ask all the "why" questions.  On the topic of my former faith, I was completely disregarding this and acting in an opposite way to my training and natural form of thinking.
 Since deconverting, I've done various bits of reading and watching of sceptic conference talks and I am shocked by what I see.  Have I really been lied to so badly for all this time?  Why did I never enquire more deeply?  Finally I am thinking more clearly and actually trying to have substantive reasons for what I think is true.
 It won't have escaped your notice of the serious complication in my giving up my faith.  My wife is a Baptist minister.  She was very upset when I told her, to be honest not surprising that one.  Right now we are getting on ok, but we've basically drawn a truce where the topic of faith is never discussed.  I obviously don't think faith is a good way to live one's life, but there is no way that I can see to help her down my route.  I've no idea where this will end: we seem to be getting on ok, but reading around I see plenty of examples out there of marriages that didn't survive this.


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 #2     amateur 


Rationalist

Regular Member

2,209 posts
Gender:Female
Location:Pennsylvania, United States
Interests:Spending time with my family, enjoying my little corner of the world.
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :No, not necessary


Posted 29 September 2015 - 02:40 PM

Welcome, martynq!  I lurked quite a while before joining in, too.  I don't regret joining this forum; it's the only forum I have joined on the internet and it's been a good place.
 
I'm in complete agreement with your points 1-5.  God never spoke to me either or influenced any decision in my life in a spiritual way.  Yet other people seem to chat quite frequently with god, and that's actually kind of disturbing, isn't it??!!??
 
I spent a long time (25 years?) being a church-going agnostic.  Pre-internet it was hard to find good answers to religious questions, and relying on ministers wasn't a good place to question my doubt.  But when I found solid answers to my questions, I was completely, 100% done with religion.  It's been nice.
 
Good luck with your wife.  There are people here that are much more helpful than me on here in that regard.  Just remember, you're the one that changed on her and that's always scary (regardless of who changes over what), so let her know in every way you can that, other than religion, you are still the same person you've always been, still enjoy her company, and still are in love with her.


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 #3     Margee 


'Madame Eve'

Moderator

6,815 posts
Gender:Female
Location:Canada
Interests:Learning how to be an ex-Christian and be comfortable with it!
 This is my 'Please Forgive Me' letter - It is my testimony and I hope it helps someone....You'll have to copy and paste.
 
http://www.ex-christian.net/topic/44259-please-forgive-me/
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :Non-Believer


Posted 29 September 2015 - 08:06 PM

Welcome to EX-c martynq. Thank you for sharing your story. Oh, how well we can all relate to so many points you have brought up. The same questions that brought us all to this board. Keep reading and posting all your concerns. Someone is always here to help you though this transition. Forming a new world beliefs can be hard on us when we depended on this invisible god to show us the way for so long......
 
We're here for you on this new journey.
 
Good to have you here with us!
 
 
((hug))
 

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 #4     CynicalGoat 


Thinker

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111 posts
Gender:Male
Location:Alberta
Interests:Science, Philosophy, Nature, Politics
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :I am the author of my own destiny


Posted 29 September 2015 - 09:26 PM

Welcome! I really sympathize with your story, mine is quite similar actually. So I really appreciate that you shared it!
 
I wish you the best on your journey and I hope that I and the other members here can be of some help/support/encouragement to you during this transition!
 
I especially feel for you in regards to your marriage. My wife is a christian as well and my recent deconversion has hit her pretty hard too.
 
I look forward to hearing from you some more!


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 #5     martynq 


Questioner

New Member

11 posts
Gender:Male
Location:United Kingdom
Interests:Mathematics, music, guitar playing, exercise
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :Nope


Posted 30 September 2015 - 03:20 AM

Thanks for the replies.  I probably won't post more for a few days.  I'm off to visit my parents (on my own as my wife is busy).  They aren't christians, so I'm quite looking forward to the bit of space.


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 #6     Mychainsaregone 


Questioner

New Member

20 posts
Gender:Female
Location:Rather not say
Interests:Music
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :No


Posted 30 September 2015 - 04:19 AM
Hi Marty,
 Thanks for sharing your story. My husband is a Christian and I came out to him a few months ago - it is certainly difficult but I hope not insurmountable if the love and friendship is strong enough.
 Enjoy your breathing space :)


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 #7     Ellinas 


Infidel

Regular Member

1,237 posts
Gender:Male
Location:U.K.
Interests:Greek language; archaeology; books; musing about life, the universe and everything.
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :Greek pantheon


Posted 04 October 2015 - 11:08 AM

Welcome.
 
I also remain married to a Christian wife - though we've reached a point a little less advanced than you.  She knows I am disillusioned with Christianity but seems determined to enquire no further.  I'm not inclined to answer the questions she doesn't want to ask.  It's an odd position, but seems to be stable enough.
 
There is no necessary logic that requires this situation to end in a divorce.  Indeed, given the conservative Christian attitude to divorce, it amazes me that it appears to happen as much as it does.  Basically, issues needn't become insurmountable mountains unless you one of you chooses to make them such.
 
All the best.


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 #8     martynq 


Questioner

New Member

11 posts
Gender:Male
Location:United Kingdom
Interests:Mathematics, music, guitar playing, exercise
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :Nope


Posted 08 October 2015 - 05:56 AM

Just a further follow-up... I think my main concern is for my wife.  I'm concerned that her work for the church may result in exploitation.  She is at times extremely busy and there seems an awful lot that she is trying to do.  I understand where the motivation comes from for her, even if I think it is not founded on something substantial.
 
She did comment just the other day that she felt that we related well.  (This was in the context of her having recently spent time caring for one of her congregation who was going through a difficult time in their marriage.)  I seemed to me a good thing that she was able to comment positively on our marriage even though I know that having come out as an Ex-C was painful at the time.


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I Have A Degree In Bible And, Now I Don't Believe It Anymore. Need Advice
Started by  mriancredible91 , Sep 29 2015 04:05 AM
 


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 28 replies to this topic  .



 

 #1     mriancredible91 


Curious

New Member

3 posts
Gender:Male
Interests:Theology, Running, Lifting weights
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :NO


Posted 29 September 2015 - 04:05 AM

So here I am typing something that I never thought would be a possibility. It’s still somewhat shocking to me as I’m writing this. I mean, if someone told me a year ago that I would be in this position believing what I do now, I would have labeled them in my mind as insane. No one could ever convince me that God didn’t exist. He was real. I just knew it. The Bible was his inspired word. Jesus is his son. He died on the cross for my sins and rose on the third day for me and, he’s going to come back and take me home someday. I just knew he would. But, now I’m not so sure. You see over the past year I’ve changed my worldview. Right now, I don’t know exactly where I stand on the existence of a god. But, what I do know is that my view of Christianity has changed completely. In the span of a couple years, I’ve gone from an extremely conservative Christian, to a moderately conservative Christian, to a liberal Christian, to someone who wishes they had never heard their first Bible story. Due to my changed worldview, I’ve found myself in an extremely difficult predicament.
 
Not only did I grow up in an extremely religious home, I graduated from a conservative Christian college with a degree in Bible. I planned on entering the ministry to do youth ministry. I was an intern for my church’s youth program for over three years and I’m still someone those young people look up to. I baptized my little sister a year ago and she always tells me how positive a Christian role model I am in her life. My father abandoned his faith when I was two years old and this led to his and my mother’s divorce. My dad and my best friend (non-religious) are the only people I’ve told about this. So, you can see the position I’m in. So much of my life at this point has been involved in the church. I loved being an intern. And, even though I don’t believe in Christianity anymore, my love for those young people is still very real. The majority of my close friendships and relationships are anchored in the church. My sister looks up to me as do the young people. And most of all, my mother has lived a difficult life but, finds comfort in knowing at the end of the day she raised her son in the lord. Is this familiar to anybody? I don’t want my decision to affect those young people or my sister. I don’t want my mother to feel she failed and to worry about my soul. I don’t want to lose those friendships that mean so much to me. But, at the same time I know I don’t want to be a hypocrite either. I want to have a family someday and I don’t want my children to go through the difficult time I’m going through now. Does anyone have any advice? Thank you so much. Glad to be here.   


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 #2     ficino 


Atheist

☆ Silver Patron ☆

3,907 posts
Gender:Male
Location:New York, NY
Interests:literature, philosophy
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :atheist


Posted 29 September 2015 - 07:20 AM
Hey, mrian, I feel for you, and I'm glad you're here. A lot of us have been through situations like yours. It is not easy when your whole life has revolved around what I'll call "the cult".
My first thought is, you are fairly young, no? I think you need a new career path. Do you have other education in your background that you can use as a starting point? If you are not economically dependent on being a minister or on the denomination and its allied groups, that gives you room to maneuver.
You may need to go to another city to school. That would provide new friends and a new environment.
There are ways you can "justify" such a career change to your family. Or, you may just want to come out now to your mother and siblings and get it over with. Do you need family financial support? It's good that you and your father can be open about this.
I am guessing that many of your present friendships must dwindle away, but a few may remain. That happens in life even without ideological differences, though. But you'll make new ones that aren't based on ideology.
A whole life is a long time to be unhappy. It is a long time to be divided against yourself. You are doing the right thing now.
I hope to hear more from you.
Best, ficino


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 #3     Overcame Faith 


Just Me

Senior Member

4,612 posts
Gender:Male
Location:USA
Interests:none right now.
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :No


Posted 29 September 2015 - 07:25 AM
Welcome to ExC, you've come to the right place to discuss your issues.
 Most people on ExC will know where you're coming from. Like you, there was a time that I could not imagine myself not believing all the same things you did. Leaving the faith is especially difficult when your family, friends and other loved ones are so strongly a part of Christianity as you have described. I will be brutally honest with you and tell you that there is a good chance that if/when you tell them, there will be a strong emotional response that will be very difficult on you and on them. That's not always the case, but the more conservative Christian they are and the more they find their identities largely in Christianity and the church, the more likely that the response will be emotionally intense.
 I am not saying not to tell them because that is your call. You know them, I don't. Rather prepare yourself the best you can if/when you do tell them. One thing I will say, though, is that you should wait until you are emotionally ready before you tell them. Leaving the faith takes its own healing and that healing can sometimes take quite sometime. Get your own emotional house in order before telling your family something that just might add further chaos in your life.
 In the meantime, congratulations for having the courage to question the faith, to look into those questions, and then accepting the truth about Christianity.
 I hope you stick around here for a good long time.


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 #4     Llwellyn 


Infidel

Regular Member

1,377 posts
Gender:Not Telling
Location:Neither Athenian, nor Greek, but citizen of the world. ~Socrates
Interests:Pathei Mathos
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :None


Posted 29 September 2015 - 09:22 AM

I grew up as a "missionary kid" and went to a Christian university.  Deconverting and telling my family about it was difficult, and I definitely don't have the intimacy with them that I used to have.  I have new relationships with new honesty that never would have been possible before.  I have no regrets, but there are tremendous costs and tremendous rewards.  I have no habit of saying something that I don't believe or holding back what I do believe, so continuing in Christianity was simply not an option.  I'm happy that I deconverted at age 25, as it was a perfect inflection point for new growth, pruning, and inevitable withering.  This will be especially hard for your mother, as no doubt your deconversion will remind her of the divorce and her feelings of loss, etc.  Whatever you tell her, say it in love.  This is one thing that the best kind of Christians genuinely do, is refer to the ethos of every transmission of information.  Every new peice of information demands a price from the person who hears it -- honor that price., e.g.:  "Mother, I say this to you in love, there is no God."


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 #5     Burny 


Strong Minded

Regular Member

316 posts
Gender:Male
Location:Canada
Interests:Climbing, Photography, Running, Hiking, Philosophy, Science
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :Never Again


Posted 29 September 2015 - 10:22 AM
Welcome to ex-c. It's a pretty crazy ride when your eyes are opened isn't it? You're in for a bit of a rough patch as everything you've thought and believed is now up for questioning. The wild ride will end eventually but it's not always easy or pleasant. Continue to post here and ask questions. All of us here have gone through the same things and many of us are still in some stage of dealing with the fallout of deconverting.


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 #6     midniterider 


Fully Human

Regular Member

6,093 posts
Gender:Male
Location:Omnipresent
Interests:Chaos Magick, Meditation, Lucid Dreaming. I try not to take my philosophy of life too seriously.
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :Monistic Idealist


Posted 29 September 2015 - 11:10 AM

"I don’t want my decision to affect those young people or my sister. I don’t want my mother to feel she failed and to worry about my soul. I don’t want to lose those friendships that mean so much to me."
 
We have very little control over other people. Don't think you are responsible for causing these people pain. The BS known as Christianity is responsible.  Pain will fade with time. Be yourself. It's easier than pretending you're something else. If your friends wont be your friend without you being a Christian then they are just shallow people anyway and not true friends. Enjoy your new path as much as you can right now. New people will come into your life that aren't Christian and you will navigate the changes just fine. smile.png Life will smooth out and become great after this bump in the road. :)

Edited by midniterider, 29 September 2015 - 11:16 AM.

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 #7     amateur 


Rationalist

Regular Member

2,209 posts
Gender:Female
Location:Pennsylvania, United States
Interests:Spending time with my family, enjoying my little corner of the world.
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :No, not necessary


Posted 29 September 2015 - 02:18 PM

Welcome!  I have nothing to add to what's been said above, but I agree wholeheartedly.  Be true to yourself.  You have a long life ahead of you and it would be a horrible waste to be stuck doing something you no longer believe in.  You have no control over anybody else (your mom, your sister, etc) but you have control over your own life and it's always best to be honest, as quickly as you can.  The longer you wait, the harder it becomes.
 
Good luck, I do wish you all the best.  Feel free to post anything else on here about how things go with your decisions.  It's a good group of people here.


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 #8     mriancredible91 


Curious

New Member

3 posts
Gender:Male
Interests:Theology, Running, Lifting weights
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :NO


Posted 29 September 2015 - 10:25 PM

Thank you everyone. I'm not doing ministry I'm working in banking now and no I'm not financially dependent on them. I've decided I will tell my mother sooner rather than later over lunch somewhere. She's my main concern. I want to assure her that me leaving Christianity does not mean she failed me as a parent. That's really what's making this so hard for me. She was so heartbroken when my dad left the faith and it kills me that she's going to go through it again. I'm tearing up typing this now thinking about it it's that hard. What I feel will speak to her is the fact that I'm happier now than I ever was as a Christian and I believe she will listen to me when I tell her why. The church has not been good to her so, I feel some of the problems with Christianity I present to her will resonate. Speaking of which, I'm currently working on my actual testimonial as to why I changed my worldview. It's a little long because of so many aspects to it but, I'd love it if ya'll took the time to read it. I'll post it under another forum when it's done. Again, thank you so much for your comments and advice. I'll be sure to keep you updated as things progress. I love that this community is here. It's funny to me that atheists and skeptics are more warm and welcoming than any believer I've ever met.   


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 #9     Mychainsaregone 


Questioner

New Member

20 posts
Gender:Female
Location:Rather not say
Interests:Music
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :No


Posted 30 September 2015 - 04:14 AM
Hi Mrian,
 I'm at a similar stage to you (my story is under testimonials) and I can identify with what you are saying, particularly the impact of this change on loved ones. Your compassion and thoughtfulness for their feelings is admirable but it's good that you are going to be honest with your mother. I hope I can be as courageous someday!
 Welcome to your new life - it may be shaky at first but soon the relief and freedom will sink in and you will feel like a newborn again, discovering and seeing things for the first time with wonder and joy :)
 All the best with it, and well done.


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 #10     Blood 


Free Thinker

☆ Silver Patron ☆

1,773 posts
Gender:Male
Location:Houston, TX
Interests:Ancient history, religion
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :No


Posted 30 September 2015 - 06:18 AM

You didn't explain what the catalyst was, though it is sometimes the case that the deeper one studies the Bible, the more skeptical one becomes. I personally know someone who was studying for the ministry but instead became an atheist after learning that the entire edifice is built on quicksand.


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 #11     UnFundEd 


Thinker

Regular Member

109 posts
Gender:Male
Location:Nebraska
Interests:Golf, Technology, Human Sexuality, Music, Near Death Experiences
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :Fewer every day


Posted 30 September 2015 - 08:34 AM
Assuming that you are young, you can be grateful that you figured this out early in life. I didn't come to this realization until my life was half over, and I made a ton of bad decisions throughout my life, based on beliefs that Jesus' return was imminent and that it was more important to have treasure in heaven than saving for retirement. Your story has some parallels to mine, especially having a degree in Bible. Welcome, and I wish you well as you continue your journey.


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 #12     BendyLine 


Skeptic

Regular Member

396 posts
Gender:Male
Location:Austin, Texas
Interests:Gaming, reading, writing, traveling
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :...nah.


Posted 30 September 2015 - 01:28 PM

Welcome! I can relate to your story. If someone had told me a few years ago that I'd be an atheist, I would have either been scared out of my mind or laughed in their face.  The good news is that it all gets easier. While losing my faith was one of the most difficult things I've ever gone through, I feel so much better off on the other side.
 
I guess the best advice I can give you is to find some like-minded people to help you cope. For a lot of folks, leaving Christianity is heartbreaking, and it helps to have people to talk to who understand. There are plenty of private Facebook communities for ex-Christians around these days; you can PM me if you're interested. And of course this website is a great place to start too. I've met people here that have become wonderful IRL friends over the past few years.
 
Also, I'd like to plug the blog of a friend of mine: www.godlessindixie.com. Neil writes about being a nonbeliever in the Bible Belt, but even if you don't live there it's good stuff if you're surrounded by Christians. While it is an atheist blog, he's good about not treating Christians like idiots (something I find pretty distasteful, since I used to be one myself).


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 #13     sdelsolray 


I'm Not That Important

Regular Member

2,258 posts
Gender:Male
Interests:Music, science, critical thinking, history, gardening, film noir movies.
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :None of the above


Posted 30 September 2015 - 04:39 PM

Take a look at Bart Ehrman's career.  He was a believer, now he isn't and he still teaches Biblical history at a university.

Edited by sdelsolray, 01 October 2015 - 10:31 AM.

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 #14     Insightful 


Doubter

Regular Member

52 posts
Gender:Male
Location:orange county CA
Interests:Learning, Loving
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :Maybe


Posted 30 September 2015 - 05:51 PM

Welome Mrian,
 
I totally sense and feel your pain.  I've gone through (and am still going through) similar struggles.  I completely relate to thinking "no way EVER would I NOT believe".  My entire life was wrapped up in Christianity.  ALL of my friends - every single one.  Two of my best friends from 10-15 years ago that were NOT Christian - I ended up offending them by pushing them hard with the gospel message and I lost those friendships.  My wife is a VERY strong beliver.  Both parents.  All four of my groomsmen.  I was totally immersed in church life, leading bible studies, missions trips, I even started a Christian non-profit!
 
I feel torn between being 100% honest about who I am and what I believe and the damage that may come from being that honest.
 
It is difficult to share your non-belief with believers as they will:
1) React defensively because by doubting THEIR belief system, you force them to face the fact that THEY could be wrong and if they are, their security about surviving death and living forever is threatened.  It's crazy, but I think finding a "solution" to the fear/uncertainty of death keeps most people in.  Why give up their comfortable "solution" to the problem of death by opening up their worldview to scrutiny...
2)  Think forever differently about you.  that you are somehow misguided, blinded, confused, mired in a favorite sin, etc.  You can't be noble/honorabe to them as a non-believer.
 
I've shared with my mom, and she is "OK".  But it's hard for her - fearing that I'm going to hell.
 
The hardest part is my wife...  it's been tough.  We're surviving - 2 years past my deconversion now - but it's not the same.  She says it never will be...  But I completely feel that joy and freedom you feel.  It's worth it!


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 #15     Margee 


'Madame Eve'

Moderator

6,815 posts
Gender:Female
Location:Canada
Interests:Learning how to be an ex-Christian and be comfortable with it!
 This is my 'Please Forgive Me' letter - It is my testimony and I hope it helps someone....You'll have to copy and paste.
 
http://www.ex-christian.net/topic/44259-please-forgive-me/
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :Non-Believer


Posted 30 September 2015 - 07:44 PM

Welcome to Ex-c Mrian. Thank you so much for sharing some of your story with us. We can all relate to it. I couldn't believe the very first night I came on this board to post. I was terrified because I really thought I was the only one who had doubts about the god of the christian faith. I was positive that satan had me in his grips.The highly intelligent people on this board helped me to stay somewhat 'sane' as I found a new world view. Keep posting and reading. Best wishes as you 'come out' to your mom. I can tell by reading what you wrote that you will be very gentle with her. This kind of news is devastating to believers. I'm looking forward to hear the whole story of your journey. Hang tight. You're home with people who totally understand.
 
Hug
 

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 #16     Bluechipx 


Doubter

Regular Member

62 posts
Gender:Male
Location:W. Michigan USA
Interests:Outdoor nature
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :no


Posted 02 October 2015 - 06:39 AM
Mrian, I see it not going too well if you tell your mother about your eye opening over lunch. I visit my mom regularly at a retirement home and she always has a religious station on TV and Hagee is her favorite. At her age 99, I guess I'll just 'run out the clock', but I suspect you are in a much different situation with your likely younger age and will have to handle it more realistically. Take it slow and easy coming out to her and very best of luck!


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 #17     bunzooh 


Doubter

Regular Member

73 posts
Gender:Female
Location:Slick City, UT
Interests:Christianity, world religions, new age spirituality, reading, music, writing/journaling, TV, Movies, walking, yoga, zentangle. Quantum stuff is fascinating. Vegan/vegetarianism. Dancing (as in shaking my booty with or without a dance partner)
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :Not sure. Still seeking


Posted 02 October 2015 - 07:37 AM

mriancredible91, on 29 Sept 2015 - 10:25 PM, said:


. Speaking of which, I'm currently working on my actual testimonial as to why I changed my worldview. It's a little long because of so many aspects to it but, I'd love it if ya'll took the time to read it. I'll post it under another forum when it's done.
I would love to read your testimony, even if it is long. I'll be on the lookout for it.
 
No advice from me, as I'm still very much on the fence about Xtianity, though extremely disillusioned about the bible, so I'm every bit as interested in the comments you receive as i am in your story. smile.png this is a good place to hang out though. Friendly, frank people who understand.
 
But let this be a comfort...my 20 something daughter left Xtianity several years ago, at least two years before my eyes began to creak open, and I remember the sort of deep breath she took, and her face getting a little pale, when she told me she no longer believed in the god of the bible or Jesus, and was going to explore the roots of our heritage (we are Irish/English, with an emphasis on Irish) IOW, she was going to delve into the paganism of Ireland before Xtianity spread there.
 
It wasn't easy for me to hear, but I love my kids, and I trusted God. It's never been about *us*...it is about god knowing RIGHT WHERE my daughter was in her spiritual journey. Her turning away from the church was no surprise to him, and even as a conservative, bible-reliant Christian, I trusted that he loved her and would keep her safe. May your mom find the same peace in her heart when you do get a chance to "come out"...as a Christian she believes god is omniscient, so he already knows what's going on with you.
 
well anyway. keep us posted!

Edited by bunzooh, 02 October 2015 - 07:56 AM.

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 #18     BobCu 


Questioner

New Member

18 posts
Gender:Male
Location:Margate Florida USA
Interests:Science
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :Heck No.


Posted 02 October 2015 - 09:36 PM

You wrote: "Right now, I don’t know exactly where I stand on the existence of a god."
 
 
This is not rocket science. Nothing could be more simple. It goes like this: God is just another word for magic. Magic is not real therefore magical beings are impossible. Period. There is nothing more to say about it.
 
​Your other problems might seem difficult but you might be surprised how easy it is to fix everything. I suggest being honest with your friends and family is the way to go. Honesty is always the right thing to do. Just explain what happened to you and explain why there's nothing anyone can do about it. Once a person accepts reality and throws out superstitious nonsense there is no going back. Just tell them that. It's one way to find out who really is your friend and who isn't a real friend. Same thing for your relatives.
 
Don't worry about it. Instead have fun with it. You might even, without even trying, convince somebody else to break away from being a slave, with a magical being as their master who demands worship and obedience. It's so much better to be a free person. Some people might get it after you talk to them. Maybe not right away but they could eventually figure out they have been wrong about everything their entire lives.
 
​Religions are good for nothing but violence, stupidity, brainwashing, and slowing down human progress. Fortunately the childish cowardly fantasies are going extinct. Nonsense can't last forever especially with today's never ending scientific progress.
 
By the way congratulations on throwing out the Dark Ages. Welcome to the 21st century.


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 #19     CynicalGoat 


Thinker

Regular Member

111 posts
Gender:Male
Location:Alberta
Interests:Science, Philosophy, Nature, Politics
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :I am the author of my own destiny


Posted 03 October 2015 - 01:26 PM
Welcome, Mrian! As you can probably tell, we are all very glad that you found your way here! I imagine you are already beginning to realize that you are not at all alone!
 I can empathize with some of your story. I volunteered wity tge high school youth at my church even during my deconversion and have been extremely quiet about my change in beleif so as to not adversely affect those kids.
 Shortly after my deconversion, my mom found out about it. I had been trying to keep it from her, at least for a while. She took it pretty hard. I would definitely suggest easing into it with fam8py ifbat all possible.
 Just my 2 cents, but I hope you realize that you are not alone and we are all here to support you!


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 #20     Citsonga 


Fully Human

★ Gold Patron ★

5,012 posts
Gender:Male
Location:Pennsylvania
Interests:Music, biblical criticism, logic, freethinker dialogue
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :Fresh salsa. Mmmm, good!


Posted 03 October 2015 - 06:30 PM

Welcome, mriancredible91!
 
I can understand your dilemma. I wish I'd realized the problems with Christianity when I was younger (as you seem to be), but regardless, dealing with seeing through the sham while having deeply religious family members can be quite difficult. I'm not going to tell you what to do, but as for myself, I didn't want to make an issue out of it, so I never mentioned it (which wasn't hard at that point, as I had moved 500 miles away from my family). Once my parents found out through my daughter that I hadn't been going to church anymore, my dad questioned me about it, so at that point I wrote my parents a very lengthy letter explaining where I was coming from. That's certainly not the route for every ex-christian, but it's the route I took.
 
Regardless, I'd like to echo the recommendation to check out Bart Ehrman's career. In fact, that's the first thing that popped into my mind as I read your original post, before even seeing sdelsolray's comment. The introduction to Bart's book Misquoting Jesus explains his path through seminary to where he is now, and he has quite a scholarly approach to the Bible as a textual critic. The book goes on to deal with problems in the Biblical text. Another good book of his is Lost Christianities, which explains how the Christian church did not come about the way Christians think it did. Whether or not you'd like to use your degree in a similar capacity, I'm sure you'd at least find his work to be interesting.
 
At any rate, good luck as you figure out what to do with your life and how to handle familial relationships. Above all, enjoy the journey ahead of you....


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I Have A Degree In Bible And, Now I Don't Believe It Anymore. Need Advice
Started by  mriancredible91 , Sep 29 2015 04:05 AM
 


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 #21     Ellinas 


Infidel

Regular Member

1,237 posts
Gender:Male
Location:U.K.
Interests:Greek language; archaeology; books; musing about life, the universe and everything.
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :Greek pantheon


Posted 04 October 2015 - 11:18 AM

Welcome.
 
The problem here is that every family and social dynamic is different.  To be honest, only you can judge how to act in relation to your situation.  But as guiding principles, I would say:
1.Play the long game and think strategically.  You don't need to reveal all to everyone this very minute,in all likelihood.
2.Make sure you have a fall-back position in terms of life's practicalities if this means you are in danger of being isolated.
3.Choose your time and place to reveal your position to give you the greatest security and to be the least confrontational (unless you reach a point where your strategy is to light the blue touchpaper and walk away).
4.Don't be afraid to walk away if you are left with no other choice.

Good luck.

Edited by Ellinas, 04 October 2015 - 11:19 AM.

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 #22     Stamps1962 


Skeptic

Regular Member

471 posts
Gender:Male
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :No


Posted 06 October 2015 - 10:21 AM

I was in almost the same position thirty years ago. Maybe some of my advice is outdated but for what it's worth:
 
You are almost certain to run into problems with prospective employers questioning why you got a religious degree and are now seeking employment in secular work. You may even- as I did- encounter interviewers who are Xrian and will grill you on your beliefs and try to 'bring you back', that sort of thing. I wound up fibbing about my degree- instead of a Bible major i said it was in something else. So far as I know nobody ever checked. You may also run into coworkers who feel they cannot act themselves around you- until they get to know you. It is best again- lie about your past. Sad advice but necessary.
 
Your friends and family already know about your degree. I'd simply tell them you are choosing a different career path and not go into your changed beliefs.


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 #23     Citsonga 


Fully Human

★ Gold Patron ★

5,012 posts
Gender:Male
Location:Pennsylvania
Interests:Music, biblical criticism, logic, freethinker dialogue
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :Fresh salsa. Mmmm, good!


Posted 06 October 2015 - 10:59 AM

Stamps1962, on 06 Oct 2015 - 10:21 AM, said:


You may even- as I did- encounter interviewers who are Xrian and will grill you on your beliefs and try to 'bring you back', that sort of thing.
 
In America, unliss it's a religious institution, it is illegal for employers to ask prospective employees about their religious views in an interview.


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 #24     Stamps1962 


Skeptic

Regular Member

471 posts
Gender:Male
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :No


Posted 06 October 2015 - 12:23 PM

Citsonga, on 06 Oct 2015 - 10:59 AM, said:


 
Stamps1962, on 06 Oct 2015 - 10:21 AM, said:


You may even- as I did- encounter interviewers who are Xrian and will grill you on your beliefs and try to 'bring you back', that sort of thing.
 
In America, unliss it's a religious institution, it is illegal for employers to ask prospective employees about their religious views in an interview.
 
 
It is and ought to be- yet it happened to me. This was some years back but I still remember being so angry I wanted to file a complaint but didn't- it would have hurt my employ-ability. This was a large insurance company with a claims manager who wound up asking me if I believed in God then when he didn't like my answer tried to suggest some book I should read. As politely as I could I got up and left. Rules don't always apply to these people.


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 #25     mriancredible91 


Curious

New Member

3 posts
Gender:Male
Interests:Theology, Running, Lifting weights
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :NO


Posted 08 October 2015 - 07:00 AM

Again, I'm floored by the kindness and support I've received on here. To some of those wondering, I never held a position in the church besides an intern. I interviewed at twelve different churches and they all turned me down. The last rejection was the final straw and I actually turned my back on desiring to be a youth minister BEFORE I turned my back on the religion. Still, working on the testimonial. Like I said, there's a lot to write and I feel this is an important thing for me and other doubters who may read it. I'll title it something similar to this topic so you'll know it's mine. Again, thank you so much for the overwhelming support, advice, and kindness. 


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 #26     TheDemonHunter 


Curious

New Member

3 posts
Gender:Male
Location:Slippery Rock, PA
Interests:Video Games, Pop Punk, Hiking, Reading
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :NO


Posted 08 October 2015 - 08:39 PM

I'm going through the same thing man. It's really tough trying to figure out what to do next, especially if the degree is unaccredited like mine is, which I assume yours is as well. I'm trying to get back to school eventually for a real degree in history, I would love to teach in a university some day.


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 #27     whitehot 


Questioner

New Member

18 posts
Gender:Female
Location:australia
Interests:education, philosophy, arts, kindness, presence, equality
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :still not sure


Posted 13 October 2015 - 12:33 PM
My way of approaching family was simply to discuss with them the questions that caused me to doubt the Bible and Christianity. I told them that I struggled with these questions and asked them what they thought the answers were. Part of me genuinely wanted them to say something convincing, part of me knew they couldn't. When their answers failed to satisfy me, I told them so and explained that I need to take the time to work out for myself what I believe outside of the context of what I was brought up with. Not just honesty, but heartfelt honesty backed up by good reasoning, and delivered with love. I'm not saying that it didn't put a lot of pressure on these relationships, but in time things began to settle and we all still love each other, there are just some things we don't discuss in the same way anymore. My mother was shocked that I was afraid she wouldn't love me as much anymore, and shocked at herself that she felt hurt and betrayed and less loving towards me - she has since confronted her demons so to speak and loves me as much as ever and accepts me unconditionally. You never know how these things can give others a chance to grow, even if it's painful. I learnt to stop tying my self worth to what she thought of me, and started being my true self. It's still complicated, but in a way we are now both free. The bible has a few nuggets of wisdom, and one is The truth shall set you free.
 Welcome, and much love from a fellow journeyer



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 #28     aria 


Curious

New Member

2 posts
Gender:Female
Interests:arts
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :bokonon


Posted 17 October 2015 - 05:31 PM

Hey Mrian :) From my experience I can tell you one thing: you might be very surprised who would calmly accept your choices and even listen to your reasons and who would accuse you of the worst things and call you names. It might be the people you fear telling the most will be the ones that will stand by your side no matter what you believe, and people who you'd expect to take it lightly will attack you.
 
My deconverion started with questions that were very inconvenient to some people in the church (I'm actually also in the process of writing them down, but it takes me the longest time). Some of the people I saw once in my whole life started spreading rummors about me being a heretic, and that sitting by the same table with me should (seriously!) be considered a sin, they even had bible verses to support it. I laughted first time I heard it, but then some of my friends joined them, and started convincing others to cut all ties with me. From that point on my deconversion was very fast, I just had to get to the bottom of it all, to find the truth, find the answers to the questions those people were so offended by me even raising. And I did just that, and then I went even further. It was traumatic and confusing, at some point I was believing and not believing all at once, my mind was spinning out of control. But then I just knew.
 
I lost all of the friends that went to that church (but that was not a church my family and I attended). All of them. The person I considered my best friend started calling me names, telling me I'm just manipulative and trying to brainwash her, and that I must be really stupid (I didn't even try to pull her to my side, I just told her I was an atheist!)-and she never even 'walked her talk', she was a christian because her father was a pastor of that church, but me being an atheist was somehow too much for her to handle.
 
Then there was this other friend of mine, the only person I shared my questions with, who passed them to his parents who then started the crusade. He never even cared to listen to my reasons, he turned out to be an intellectual coward, which also hurt, as our friendship was very much of an intelectual nature. I felt betrayed.
 
After all of that I was a little bit more hesitant to tell anyone. My sister knew and was avoiding the subject at al cost, as if atheism was contagious. She did not want to hear anything about it, and she would openly oppose me in public discussions just in case anybody would figure out I was an atheist and so she was making sure nobody would think we shared our views.
 
I also shared my views with this christian couple. At first their reaction was extremely emotional, but now were on the same terms as we were before, it's all good.
 
Then there was this friend of mine, who works in a christian organisation. When I told her, she said that that made her sad because of everything that she believes but she listened to my reasons and even agreed with me on some of them. Our conversation was beautiful, and each could at least fathom where the other one was coming from.
 
My school friends also were very accepting and they admitted they also left religion a few years back (but for them christianity was always more of a cultural thing, so it wasn't that big of a deal for them)
 
but then there was the taughest part- telling my parents. From the very beginning I was very open with them about having doubts and questions, but I wasn't nearly as open about the conclusions i reached. Just like you, I didn't want to cause my parents unnecessery pain. I knew they wouldn't change my mind. I stopped going to church when I had my doubts. I had some very personal talks with my mom, and intellectual discussions on the bible with my dad. I let them know step by step the problems I had with some parts of the Bible.Then one day the subject of Jehova's witnesses surfaced, and I said that there are no biblical reasons to believe Jesus was God and mom asked if it meant I didn't believe Jesus was God and I confirmed. The conversation ended there, but some time later my mom said it broke her heart to hear that. So I never told her how much more there was of the things I did not believe, I never said I was an atheist. But now my mom figured it out anyways and she even jokes about it (and I don't deny). She's seen first hand that it didn't make me a bad person, so it seems like she doesn't mind, at least on the outside. I'm pretty sure her whole bible study group is praying for me, but I really don't mind.
 
You see, I would never in a million years have thought that my mom would ever be fine with me being an atheist. on the other hand it never even crossed my mind that those 'friends' of mine would reject me, espectally in such a nasty way, because of my deconversion. Maybe it would be best to reaveal the facts gradually, to share with the people you're closest with the whole process, not just the end results. but if you lose friends on the way- just let them go. they were never your friends to begin with.
 
I'm still quite lonely, to this day. Not only because of the friends that I lost, but also because there's nobody I can openly share this whole cluster of thoughts with. People that were never really deep into faith just do not get it and probably also do not care. people that are into the bible find my conclusions offensive. So it is a very solitary place to be an independent thinker, but it's still worth it. And this website is everything :)


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 #29     offtheromanroad 


Thinker

Regular Member

123 posts
Gender:Female
Location:Europe
Interests:*
Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :Probably not --> Freedom


Posted 04 November 2015 - 04:12 PM

Welcome, Mrian, and thank you so much for writing here. I have to disagree with those who say you should lie about your degree in Bible. I don't think it'd be good to do so, but then, I am from Europe, so things might be different over here. Not lying doesn't necessarily mean you have to tell everone about it, though... see my sidenote comment below.My one question would be: Since you already work in another field (banking as I understand), you have already started to leave your degree behind. You could maybe just keep working in that job for a while and find out what you really want to do and then either look for a job in that other field (if it isn't banking) or sign up for training in that other field (I am thinking part time studies, an evening class, a correspondence course, Open University) and then apply for a job. The nice thing is, it doesn't only have to be about getting a degree, you are now free to learn/study something that you are really interested in or passionate about (in a non-religous sense ;-)) and that you would like to do in the future. Your degree in Bible does not have to put limitations on you. You are now free to learn what you want to learn!
 
On a sidenote: I signed up for a one year Bible School when I was 20 and now sometimes think that it was a funny/strange decision. I also find it awkward. I also hesitate to tell people what I did that particular year since I live in a rather atheistic country, and "Bible School" makes people think you're a bit wacko. I have been trying to come to terms with that year and be honest about it - "I used to be religous" is what I usually say when I decide to tell people about it - and I don't tell everyone - it's none of their business if I don't want to tell them. I have to say that in a way, that year was good for my soul (for non-religous reasons, though). But I know one year is vey different from a degree. I just try to cut myself some slack and accept that this is what I did - and now, I am doing something different, and I don't have to be restricted by the expectations society puts on me. I am my own person, and you are, too, Mrian. We are free to be who we are, and to learn what we want to learn/study.

Edited by offtheromanroad, 04 November 2015 - 04:18 PM.

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Long-Time Lurker, First-Time Poster 

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Just A Piece Of My Rediculous History 

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A Brief Summary Of My Story 

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Leaving Christianity, Lost Count Of How Many Times I've Done This Already. 

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HEADS UP: Testimony Forum Guidelines 

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HEADS UP: Testimony Forum Guidelines - last post by Margee
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Falling Back In. 

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Question: Why Did You Leave 

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My Marriage Is Dying A Slow Death 

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Stuck: Prophecy, Witchcraft & Tongues 

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Unsacred Namer Here. 

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Finally Found A Place To Share My Story. 

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My Long Story. May Be You Can Help Me. 

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Chrisitanity Is Killing Me 

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From A Fellow Sojourner 

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The Truth Does Set You Free 

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All Aboard The Cuckoo Train... 

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The Story Of The 16 Year Old Gay Atheist 

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 12 Jan 2016 

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Struggles I Face As A Gay Ex-Mennonite 

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It's Been A Long Time... 

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