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← Jehovah’s Witness culture creates a ‘perfect storm’ for abuse
Royal Commission’s Angus Stewart accuses Watchtower representative of deliberate deception →
 
Reflecting on the Australian Royal Commission (Day 3, Part 1)
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Posted on August 5, 2015

Abuse survivor Karen Morgan gives her take on evidence given by Dino Ali (above) at the Royal Commission
Abuse survivor Karen Morgan gives her take on evidence given by Dino Ali (above) at the Royal Commission

As you can appreciate there is so much information coming out of this investigation, it’s difficult to know where to start with reviewing it. I would like to begin by focusing on day 3, part 1, which sees Mr Dino Ali on the stand. He is one of the elders who dealt with the case of BCG.
I would love to know what advice/direction the elders have been given prior to this investigation. To me, the elders seem extremely unprepared and very out of their depth.
They are a far cry from the elders who sit in judgement on Judicial Committees and speak eloquently with authority and confidence from the platform.
The other thing that strikes me is the Commission seems to have a lot of the original paperwork, including notes taken by elders at Judicial Meetings. During my own case, the Society and the elders were asked to provide all paperwork related to the case, but they claimed paperwork was destroyed. Maybe in Australia the elders are more organized.
Back to Mr Ali who struggles to interpret his own notes that he took at the time (although I do wonder whether his struggles are related to the fact his own notes are about to drop him right in it).
Ali’s own notes clearly show that more than one child had been abused by their father, and that the elders were told about the abuse at the time of their investigation. However, the fact there were at least two witnesses as required by JW rules was not enough for the elders. It beggars belief, and I find myself saying out loud, “what the hell were you thinking?” I just cannot figure out what goes through these elders’ minds.
After countless judicial meetings, no action was taken against BCH (the father) until it transpired he had been involved in immorality with an adult female. This called for another judicial meeting where his immorality was the focus of the discussion.
At this meeting, the abuse of his daughter was again discussed. His notes state that BCH admitted to everything, and he stated that whatever his daughter BCG had said about him was true. It was only at this point that he was disfellowshipped. So at this point the elders had an admission at last, so there should have been no reason why BCH could not have been disfellowshipped for the abuse.
But no! Mr Ali claims that as this meeting was concerning immorality, then that’s all they could deal with. Also, and this is the killer, Mr Ali suggests that they couldn’t accept that admission as the elders felt it might not be true! Absolutely ludicrous.
So BCH gets disfellowshipped for immorality, but still no action is taken by elders on the child abuse claims. Let’s not forget that, at this stage, all four daughters and even the wife of BCH had all told the elders of the abuse that had taken place.
We then come to the letters sent by the elders to the Branch. The letters contain lots of information about the immorality, but no mention is made of the abuse. Mr Ali claims that at that time the guidelines did not require reporting of child abuse. He refers to the older version of Shepherd the Flock of God. What screams out at me here is: did they really need to have it in black and white in order to report it to the Branch?
Mr Ali is asked if he recalls BCH actually admitting to the abuse. His response: “Well I was only there as a bystander, I wasn’t directly involved.” He goes on to say that he “can’t remember,” which seems to be a common claim among these elders when asked any awkward questions.
Now here’s the clincher: Ali is asked the question I’ve been waiting for. Did he consider reporting these matters to the police? His answer: “No.” Even after the confession, they still did not feel any need to report to the police. Why? “Well, we were still trying to find all the facts on pornea which he was guilty of and we didn’t have the direction in order to do that.”
So in other words, because someone on the end of a phone didn’t say it’s a crime and needs to be reported, the elders didn’t report it. But it’s OK, because the elders tell the accused he/she is never to be on their own with children anymore, and they are not to have children staying overnight. They feel that is enough.
The next part of the questioning turns to the fact the elders had a full confession from BCH, and yet they still did nothing. Mr Ali goes back to his terrible explanation that they had to be sure BCH was being truthful in his confession. He claims that BCH may have only confessed to molesting his daughter to get out of the situation. Now, I don’t know what situation BCH found himself in at the time, but I’m struggling to think of ANY circumstances that would mean a father would falsely say he had been molesting his daughter?
So BCG claims to have been molested by her father, her father admits to molesting her, but the elders still weren’t sure. They were also worried that he may deny it later and they would find themselves stranded. We are supposed to share their concern about what would happen if they had gone to the police and then he had changed his mind. How would they live with themselves? Absolutely farcical!
The questioning moves to the suggestion that no one wants to accept that elders and ministerial servants would carry out child abuse because they are appointed by the Holy Spirit. Mr Ali denies this is the case, and he then describes being an elder or servant as the same as being a ‘Slave’ – claiming it is not a dignified position at all. You have to just laugh at that statement. He will not admit that it may have been a mistake to appoint BCH as a ministerial servant.
Mr Ali spent sleepless nights after hearing what BCG went through with her father. However, this did not prompt him or any of the elders to actually do anything. In fact, the four girls remained at home with their father until he later moved out. So these men appointed by Holy Spirit allowed four young girls to remain in the same home as their father who had abused them physically and sexually.
Let’s not forget that their mother was also aware of what was going on, and she too did nothing. So wouldn’t it have made sense to go to the police and allow them to properly investigate the crime? Mr Ali doesn’t seem to think so, as in 1988 they were following the old guidelines and it’s completely up to the victim to report.
The Judicial Committees are clearly designed to assist the wrongdoer and not the victim. The hope is that the wrongdoer will see their mistakes and repent and come back to Jehovah. Mr Ali feels they are well equipped to deal with the victims of child abuse. His reasons? Publications, circuit overseers, and the ability to ring the Bethel.
Elders also follow up by reading scriptures with the victim, but only within the committee meetings. The elders never told BCG that they believed her, or that it was not her fault. Mr Ali also claims that he was unaware of the gossip in the congregation that BCG was telling lies. He also doesn’t recall BCG had attempted suicide after these events.
The similarities between this case and my own experiences are scarily similar. I was subjected to countless meetings with elders, some on my own, some with my dad, and some with my abuser. I received NO support whatsoever outside of those meetings. My abuser was never disfellowshipped for what he did to me, he was disfellowshipped for admitting to being drunk and belligerent.
I too was called a liar by my congregation at the time, and also a trouble maker. Listening to this case takes me back to my own experience, and when I hear the victims describe how they felt, I know exactly what they are talking about.
Surely Jehovah’s Witnesses must realize how ridiculous their policies are when they watch this Commission? It’s sad, but I suspect your average Witness has no idea of these developments. Even if they do, they will view it as persecution and not see it for what it is – sorely needed exposure of a damaging organization that is failing children.
 
new-karen-signature2
 
 
 
 
 
 
Karen is herself a victim of child sex abuse as a Jehovah’s Witness. You can read more about her story here and here.
Further reading…
◾Jehovah’s Witness culture creates a ‘perfect storm’ for abuse
◾Elders shamed under questioning by the Royal Commission
◾Australian Royal Commission hears that 1,006 alleged child sex abusers were covered up by Watchtower
◾Media reports on the Royal Commission
◾JWsurvey articles on child abuse
Watch an updated playlist of Royal Commission footage…






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← Jehovah’s Witness culture creates a ‘perfect storm’ for abuse
Royal Commission’s Angus Stewart accuses Watchtower representative of deliberate deception →
 
105 Responses to Reflecting on the Australian Royal Commission (Day 3, Part 1)



Newer Comments →
 
 alanv says:

 August 5, 2015 at 6:22 am
 
I think you are right Karen when you say the elders are out of their depth. They are so used to being judge and jury, but now it is them that have to explain their actions, and they are finding that very hard.
 I would not say the Australian elders are more organised because they still had their notes, they just didnt destroy them as the gov body wanted them to.
Reply
 
 roid says:

 August 5, 2015 at 6:40 pm
 
Yep, their destroying of notes was one of the major early revelations of the Royal Commission.
Here’s Max Horley (an active elder) spilling the beans https://youtu.be/03fcjN_Dglw
Reply
 
 
 
 Searcher says:

 August 5, 2015 at 7:27 am
 
“It beggars belief, and I find myself saying out loud, “what the hell were you thinking?” I just cannot figure out what goes through these elders’ minds.”
Basically, they don’t think. They are mind-controlled, conscience-numb robots. If whatever situation isn’t explicitly explained in the their publications and mother Bethel cannot answer them, then they are lost little automatons. PATHETIC at best and SICKENING at worst.
Reply
 
 
 StrongHaiku says:

 August 5, 2015 at 7:28 am
 
Great article and recap. Nicely done.
As I listen to all of the hearings, I am constantly stunned by the level of bureaucratic dehumanizing non-sense passed off as “loving arrangement/direction”. At times I felt like I was watching the Terry Gilliam movie “Brazil”.
If it wasn’t so tragic, it would be comical.
Reply
 
 
 Idontknowhatodo says:

 August 5, 2015 at 7:56 am
 
It seems to me that under the reasoning and logical questioning from the Attornies and Judge the elders were exposed for what they are….incompetent and brainwashed to follow whatever direction given by that mystical place ‘The Branch’…it made a mockery of the Two Witness rule…and the classic and straightforeward reasoning from the Judge….’Paul said women cannot teach…he also said women must be silent…do you carry that through also?’… and if I hear one more time from those elders..’I dont remember’…’I dont recall’…’I dont know’…I will go mad!… They are ultimately stooges and they dont even realise it… it is sickening.
Reply
 
 MrFair says:

 August 5, 2015 at 9:45 am
 
I completely agree on the elder’s memory lapses. If you only have dealt with one or maybe two child abuse cases in your life, and especially ones that are as shocking as those presented in this case, it would be hard to forget the matter even if 25 years in the past. You’d have to be emotionally or mentally numb to forget such horrific stories, details. I think they used their supposedly faulty memory to try and slink out of it. Thankfully (and sadly) they kept written records of this stuff and were hit over the head with it.
Reply
 
 Searcher says:

 August 5, 2015 at 1:05 pm
 
Selective amnesia?
Reply
 
 StrongHaiku says:

 August 6, 2015 at 6:03 am
 
“Theocratic Warfare”?
Reply
 
 
 
 
 
 David says:

 August 5, 2015 at 8:26 am
 
It is tragic that worldly people have to teach them how to deal with sexual abuse cases. For the GB is hard to understand that a young gild would find easier to talk to a woman instead of three men. It is difficult to convince religious bigots that shield themselves with their personal flawed Bible interpretations.
 It is also comic how they always compare themselves with other religions. If they really protect children why do not put in place the best practices instead of practices that are a bit better then anybody else? Convincing them that they are deluded is a lost cause but hopefully people will do some research instead of losing their freedom for myths.
Reply
 
 holy Connoli says:

 August 8, 2015 at 1:39 am
 
I remember when I was an Elder. At first I wanted to help all the Brothers and Sisters be happy people and be a good leader to the congregation.
 As time went on I began to see that these problems as Elders we were told to deal with were outrageous! We were not qualified to be counselors of sexual abuse victims! We were not qualified to be
 practice family law and child psychologists and all the other things that come with dealing with heavy human and societal problems. As time went by it seemed that all we were told to do was to “protect” the Society and the WT against Lawsuits. There wasn’t over concern for the victim ever! It seemed like I was doing volunteer work for a law firm not shepherding a flock. I finally realized to myself what am I doing with my life and I never signed up for this. I am not a lawyer, I am not a Psychologist,
 I am not a sociologist and neither were any of the people on the committees I was on. In fact many of them had the same problems we were dealing with. It was no longer a Religion but had become a legal law firm trying to protect itself above all others and we were all doing pro bono work for them!
Reply
 
 
 
 Rowland Nelken says:

 August 5, 2015 at 8:28 am
 
One of the most impressive features of this whole show is the professionalism of the lawyers. They are so calm, measured and courteous, even when the replies and lack of them would inspire rage and head banging in many of us.
It is certainly great to see the self important elders, and later, the branch and legal wallahs up before the inquisitor. If all goes to plan it now seems that Geoffrey Jackson’s attempt to hide behind the humble role of GB translation gaffer has misfired, and he may have to face the music next week.
Reply
 
 
 James Broughton says:

 August 5, 2015 at 9:01 am
 
Some very good comments. Karen is right. “Surely Jehovah’s Witnesses must realize how ridiculous their policies are when they watch this Commission? It’s sad, but I suspect your average Witness has no idea of these developments. Even if they do, they will view it as persecution and not see it for what it is – sorely needed exposure of a damaging organization that is failing children.” With ongoing investigations in the UK into former British Prime Minister Edward Heath people will soon put it down to the prevailing culture. No child deserves to be abused.
Reply
 
 
 Hakizimana Jean de Dieu says:

 August 5, 2015 at 9:15 am
 
Mandatory reporting of child sexual abuse will surely make “Jehovahdom” fall. I wonder how criminals will confess to Elders knowing they will be reported to the Police. A wise or crook criminal will now choose to eliminate its victim… What about Africa?
*** w86 7/15 p. 6 Do You Respect God’s Gift of Procreation? ***
 Is the same thing happening today? Yes, for after reading past issues of this magazine, thousands have been helped to bring their lives into harmony with the Bible. Consider the example of a teenager in Africa who was sexually molested as a child. In time, she got involved in all sorts of immoral conduct, including lesbianism. “The world may give pleasure for a short while,” she said, “but it becomes like a drug resulting in a lost, worthless feeling.” In desperation, she tried to commit suicide, but during this crucial period something happened that changed her life. She began attending meetings of Jehovah’s Witnesses and accepted the advice to read the Bible daily. This gave her strength to overcome immoral practices. “I feel so much better now,” she says. “It’s amazing what Jehovah can do for a person.”
Reply
 
 
 ScotWm says:

 August 5, 2015 at 9:15 am
 
Watchtower Governing Body member Stephen Lett has dismissed all criticism of Watchtower child abuse policies as being “apostate-driven lies and dishonesties that Jehovah’s organization is permissive toward pedophiles.” Jehovah’s Witnesses are trained to believe that all utterances of Governing Body members, no matter how asinine, are inspired by holy spirit. So brainwashed Jehovah’s Witnesses will continue to go along with the Watchtower’s paedophile protection policies.
Fortunately, the members of the Australian Royal Commission aren’t so easily fooled. However, the only concession by the Australian elders that I have been able to find is that they have agreed to obey the law from now on and report all sex crimes to the police.
So, will obtaining this modest concession from Watchtower elders be all that this Royal Commission can accomplish? Will there also be some sort of punishment for those involved in this massive child abuse cover up? Could the Watchtower lose its tax exempt status and be forced to pay huge financial penalties? Will the congregation’s confessed paedophiles and the elders who pimped for them face any punishment?
Reply
 
 
 JWIntellect says:

 August 5, 2015 at 10:33 am
 
“. . . I suspect your average Witness has no idea of these developments. Even if they do, they will view it as persecution and not see it for what it is – sorely needed exposure of a damaging organization that is failing children.”
You could not have said it any better. Excellent article!
Reply
 
 ForestDaughter says:

 August 5, 2015 at 11:39 am
 
I should imagine that they’ve been instructed not to watch the proceedings. Unless the witness elders assume that the org will come out looking wonderful for their scripturally-based way of dealing with paedophiles. They got that wrong didn’t they! 😉
Reply
 
 Chiafade says:

 August 5, 2015 at 7:50 pm
 
I actually would like to know what instructions the congregations in Australia are receiving.
It would be very hard to respect anything coming from an elder after watching them get torn to pieces by the royal commission.
Reply
 
 Stirring Awake says:

 August 5, 2015 at 11:29 pm
 
@Chiafade
 No instructions, announcements or mention of it thus far. There’s only been one mid-week meeting thus far AND this week had a local needs partin the KM, so it was a prime opportunity to do so IMO.
I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s completely slipped past the majority of witnesses. Glossing over one or two news reports versus watching the RC hearings and reading the statements/evidence etc. are vastly different. One could easily assume that without critical thinking abilities and relying on blind faith alone, there’s bound to be thousands of heads still buried in the sand.
Reply
 
 
 Queen Elsa says:

 August 6, 2015 at 11:15 am
 
I have a friend there, I’m tempted to ask .. I was wondering the same thing.
Reply
 
 
 
 
 
 Ted says:

 August 5, 2015 at 12:14 pm
 
Vincent ( Oh! ) Toole, Top Aussie JW, has conceded they will
 now cooperate with mandatory reporting of child abuse, and
 claimed. “Coming to this commission has been a wake up call
 for me I can assure you”.
Sounds like an act of contrition, but were he to come before
 a committee of elders it would not meet the requirement of true
 remorse.- Elders would be guided by, Shepherd the Flock of God.
 manual p92 para,10,–under the section, indications of repentance.
Which asks, “Was his confession voluntary or did he have to be
 accused by others ?” Well bro Toole didn’t volunteer to appear
 before the Royal Commission, he was subpoenaed.
Were that not the case he would have continued to keep quiet about
 all the fresh cases of abuse, 4 every Month, knowing full well that it
 was binding on all citizens to report them.
It’s just cynical manoeuvring, the victims according to JW.org are
 just “Proud, greedy and litigious ” and where the law allows it
 the victims will be thrown under the bus, And Toole and his bosses
 will keep schtum.
Reply
 
 Wild Olive says:

 August 5, 2015 at 7:24 pm
 
I know Vin Toole quite well and once upon a time would have believed anything he said,he can speak with a lot authority.
 However time and the royal commission has shown the true colours of all these “spiritual men” and their deluded leaders.
 If ever there was a time to distance oneself from the org it’s now !
Reply
 
 
 Chiafade says:

 August 5, 2015 at 8:01 pm
 
Wow I haven’t watched that yet I’m still catching up. You are absolutely correct on that statement about contrition. In a judicial committee of his peers it wouldn’t be enough. “This was a real wake up call for me brothers” Eders :”well his repentance has to be commensurate with the sin committed and in his case we have multiple counts of covering over someone’s sin for YEARS! Wake up call is not enough. I move to dissfellowship”
Reply
 
 
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 5, 2015 at 4:54 pm
 
Wouldn’t you have thought that if the Watchtower had nothing to hide that they would be positive about this Commission? Surely, they should have been urged to pay it close scrutiny so that the GB would come out looking sparklingly white and clean. And if this was the coming of Armageddon then also surely they should be interested in the proceedings. No, they are not because they are full of it. Their brainwashed babble has come to entangle them. Let’s hope it is the beginning of their end.
Reply
 
 
 Ken says:

 August 5, 2015 at 7:18 pm
 
The “elders” obviously did not know what to do because their rule book is full of flaws. The GB at headquarters has only till recently issued new procedures in handling sex molestation cases which their legal department has to handle because all the lawsuits are totaling in the millions of dollars . It’s again obvious . I don’t want so much to say by enraging readers but I don’t think the Watchtower should be held responsible for the criminal actions of its members , they should have expelled the molestors from the Kingdom Halls when news of improper conduct was “reported” to them . Logically the victims had the right to go to the law (hello parent JWs) so this vicious circle repeats it’s self over and over……..
Reply
 
 Ken says:

 August 5, 2015 at 7:52 pm
 
See thishttp://enrichmentjournal.ag.org/200401/200401_78_legalrisks.cfm
What “churches” are supposed to do under the law.
Reply
 
 Chiafade says:

 August 5, 2015 at 8:25 pm
 
While it’s true that the parents should have called as well one thing to remember is the amount of loyalty to the organization present in these cases. Both on the parents part and the elders. The parents(parent in this case) trusted in an arrangement that they feel comes from God so do the elders. So this comes into play when dealing with such a serious matter because all JWs are encouraged/told to come to the elders with serious problems.
Since they feel that they are trusting in Jehovah they ignore ALL common sense which includes calling the police when this kind of crime is committed.
I understand why you feel the organization should not be held responsible but keep in mind they make the policies that are followed. Now the leaders of the organization deny all of these reports calling them lies and the witnesses blindly accept these statements “you see those stories aren’t true, bro Lett said so”. This is a systemic cultural issue within the witness organization. Plenty of blame to go around.
Reply
 
 
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 5, 2015 at 8:16 pm
 
The truth is Ken, that this is not new. This has been going on for years. You may not have been aware of this but this mistreatment of vulnerable young persons has been made an issue many times in the media but has not made it to mainstream press like this has. It is an old issue that keeps getting tucked away conveniently by the Governng Body. Many victims have been treated extremely badly. Some have suicided over the years. Many have been cut off from family and left to figure all this out on their own which has left them damaged. When a victim takes on the Watchtower Society they are faced with a whole contingent of lawyers looked after by the Watchtower. They have as much expert help at their disposal which is available, while the victim has limited funds and limited emotional stability to carry it through. It is like the situation of David and Goliath. It got to a point some years ago that it was alleged that they paid off a number of victims in the US making them sign a statutory declaration that they would not take it to the media. But there are so many victims, it is incomprehensible. I think you possibly need to look into this further as I am sure you will find it comes from the top. These elders are just brainwashed puppets who do as they are told and not allowed to question anything and that is why this has all happened. It’s the wrong scriptural counsel in this instance as it is dealing primarily with the rape of children who have no voice or wisdom to know what is going on.
Reply
 
 
 Pickled brain says:

 August 5, 2015 at 11:35 pm
 
@Ken . You are right on the point the GB change the advice on child abuse in the book for Elders(KS) recently because of the compensation claims are damaging but the GB have done this for years. When the GB or then Knorr back in the 1940s a complete reversal on the ban on VACCINES because the Society knew the U.S government would either imprison or financially sting them because of the Advice how to avoid the Smallpox Vaccine in the 1930s primarily coming from Clayton Woodworth who wrote most of the Golden Age & the early Awake Mags . Remember Clayton Woodworth was one of the 7 men with Rutherford imprisoned in 1918 by the U.S Government & then in the year 2000 BLOOD FRACTIONS were allowed whereas before they were banned by the GB in older Watchtower Mags & advice to Elders prior to this was to Disfellowship for taking Hemoglobin & other Fractions in the 1960s & 1970s, but again the GB knew to avoid Financial compensation & Law suits against the GB the Advice changed so more damage limitation could be avoids against the GB!
 This organisation changes its interpretation of scripture when it is to their financial benefit! That is why it is Just a BOOK PUBLISHING ORGANISATION & PROPERTY EMPIRE!!’ Nothing Inspired by Holy Spirit!! GOD DOESNT CHANGE but the 7 GREEDY MEN who Use INNOCENT CHILDREN does Change to Grab More Money & Property. That is why they don’t publish Worldwide Annual Accounts to see how much of the Donations are paid to CHILD ABUSE VICTIMS & How much is paid to 7 GB Members & Families & their new Lovely Lakeside HQ Buildings at Warwick,Walkill &Patterson & the New 88 acre site in England at Chelmsford which is 4 times size of Mill Hill the current Bethel in England.
Reply
 
 
 Searcher says:

 August 6, 2015 at 11:10 am
 
I can remember the ‘disfellowshipping’ talk at one of the recent conventions. The brainwashed many in this organizations are ‘instructed’ to throw away their own children if it is a choice between the children and the organization. The GB, leaders, and elders that support them and support this despicable organization would rather lie, dismiss from memory, cheat, or other devices to preserve the organization. It is a religion to them and goes to their very core of belief. Very sad. Children and parent’s grown children have to carry the brunt of this rotten organization and it’s depraved leaders.
Reply
 
 
 
 GEM says:

 August 6, 2015 at 12:21 am
 
I have never understood why the Governing Body, if claiming to be guided by the Holy Spirit finds itself incapable of using the words of Acts 15:28
“It seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us not to burden you with anything beyond the following requirements: ….” (NIV)
Times had changed, the Gentiles had entered into the congregations… issues like dietary requirements and ethics had prompted a review.
The Elders of Jerusalem back them took on the responsibility of reviewing principles, laws and commandments and putting them into a new time and context.
Today, the only thing the current body of men seem capable of doing is Cherry picking outdated instructions given to a vulnerable Nomadic tribe for its protection against the elements and influences of the time.
Take the principle… and, rewrite the Christian Statute book to reflect the needs of our Times. The JWs have grown from a Nomadic tribe into a substantial Nation.
It is time for reform…under their own appointment .. only they can do it .. the onus and the judgment is on them, Squarely!
Reply
 
 
 Average Joe says:

 August 6, 2015 at 1:55 am
 
Couldn’t help but chuckle to myself when I read the transcript of Day 152 between the Chair and Mr. Tokley when trying to get one of the GB to turn up (page 42 of the PDF document, lines 26-34):

Could anybody that has seen the video tell me the expression on the Chair’s face please? I can imagine him rolling his eyes when he said “and you realise where HER evidence ended up!”
In all, I am very impressed by the quality of questioning & reasoning on the part of this commission. They are truly professional & impartial. Maybe the GB should think about employing THEIR services if they are really concerned about the welfare of the organisation.
Reply
 
 
 Average Joe says:

 August 6, 2015 at 1:57 am
 
Oops, this is what happens when I try to be clever and use HTML in my comments!
 Here’s the quote:
“THE CHAIR: … We had Dr Applewhite, last Friday, and you realise where her evidence ended up —
MR TOKLEY: Yes, I do, your Honour.
 THE CHAIR: — in terms of the church’s process. Although she came to say that they were good, the ultimate position, as we understand what she said, they are flawed. Those flaws are the things that I’m talking to you about now.”
Reply
 
 
 Anonymous Speaker says:

 August 6, 2015 at 2:30 am
 
Hello
 I’m just commenting trying to see if anyone has an email address to the Jehovah’s Witness headquarters. I have searched online for a week and found nothing. I called their headquarters and the woman said she is a switchboard operator who has no emails to give out. I was sexually abused by a brother in a Kingdom Hall as a child and that act has lead to several other sexually abusive acts. It’s literally ruined my life. I feel the least they can do is hear what happen to me and acknowledge it. If anyone has an email to their headquarters please let me know. Please! I would be very grateful. Thank you.
Reply
 
 Grace says:

 August 6, 2015 at 3:43 pm
 
Anonymous Speaker,
I hate that you have to go through this. I hope that you can get through to them to get things on record.
Have you been to the Police about it? Please report this person to the Police if you haven’t already done so.
Please take care of yourself & stay strong.
Love & Peace.
Reply
 
 
 holy Connoli says:

 August 8, 2015 at 1:53 am
 
anonymous speaker: So sorry to hear what happened to you. Here is my suggestion if you cannot get a direct email to the WT to hear what happened to you and report this person. Contact the former congregation elders you were with in writing and tell them the name of the “brother” who did this to you. They will be forced to look into it and they will have to contact the legal department from NYC. That is why you need to put it in writing and
 ask them to report it to Brooklyn headquarters.
 Also it is not to late to go to the local police and report the crime to them and identify the criminal who did this to you. Also you can go to the JWORG web site and I believe thee is an email on their to
 request books, literature, bible study etc and send your information through that email address. I hope that helps but don’t just forget about it.
Reply
 
 
 
 Average Joe says:

 August 6, 2015 at 3:19 am
 
@Anonymous Speaker
 I haven’t found one for the HQ, but here is one for the Australian Branch if that helps:inboxLGL.AU@jw.org
 My source:
 Watchtower Australia Submission in response to the Royal Commission’s Summons to Produce Documents No S-NSW-391http://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/downloadfile.ashx?guid=fa4e009e-4eef-4573-8d0f-aa8334d6069b&type=exhibit&filename=WAT.0001.001.0001&fileextension=pdf
Here’s the email of the “professional” Dr Applewhite, who may be more disposed to helping you get in touch with NY HQ after her recent fiasco:monicaapplewhite@yahoo.com
 My source:
 Annexure 1 to the Statement of Dr Monica Applewhite – Letter from Watchtower Australia to Dr Applewhitehttp://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/downloadfile.ashx?guid=75531773-267b-4d0f-8a29-b7dacc21e03b&type=exhibit&filename=STAT.0606.001.0012&fileextension=pdf
Links have been included to prove that this info is in the Public Domain and I’m not disclosing any private info. I hope you manage to get some closure on your case, truly.
By the way, as a side issue and this is coming from my experience in the computer industry, does anyone else not find it strange that a “professional” like Dr Applewhite uses a free email address like Yahoo? Maybe it’s just me being a teccy snob but if I see any business that has a freebie email address instead of one from their own domain, I immediately question how professional they are. Just thinking out loud…
Reply
 
 
 Stirring Awake says:

 August 6, 2015 at 3:34 am
 
So everyone should have their copies of the ‘Flocking the Sheep’ manual by now (including the 2015 Digital Edition with markup), but ICYMI.. here’s the Branch Organization manual!
https://jhonlemos.files.wordpress.com/2011/07/branch-organization-watchtower.pdf
Reply
 
 
 Average Joe says:

 August 6, 2015 at 4:17 am
 
@Anonymous Speaker
 I’ve responded to your comment/request with the email addresses I’ve found and the links to back them up but my comment is still awaiting moderation. When LLoyd or one of his team have had chance to review it you should then be able to see it.
 @Stirring Awake
 I posted a link to that manual on here but from the official Royal Commission site. That way, the WTS can’t accuse anybody from getting hold of it via “apostate” sources!
Reply
 
 
 Stirring Awake says:

 August 6, 2015 at 5:05 am
 
@Average Joe,
 Are you able to provide the Document ID please? I may have missed your earlier comment and can’t seem to locate the file in the list of Exhibits.
Thanks.
Reply
 
 Average Joe says:

 August 6, 2015 at 7:02 am
 
Of course, no problem:http://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/downloadfile.ashx?guid=75759c53-1248-4710-a6a8-7beda7ae5411&type=exhibit&filename=WAT.0003.001.0001&fileextension=pdf
 Document ID: WAT.0003.001.0001
“Marked Up” means it comes with all the additional notes & changes included as available from the Elders log-in section of jw.org.
Reply
 
 Stirring Awake says:

 August 6, 2015 at 8:34 am
 
@Average Joe,
 That’s the link to the Shepherd the Flock book. I’m fairly sure everyone has that one now in one form or another.
The link I posted was for the complete rundown on Branch Operations, outlining everything from policies and processes pertaining to the Branch… i.e. the Governing Body and Branch Committees, Bethel Home Organization, Files and Filing, Legal Matters, Annual Reports, Donations and Purchasing etc. It’s the 1997 document (2003 revised version). I haven’t seen this manual posted anywhere on the recent threads.
Reply
 
 Average Joe says:

 August 6, 2015 at 8:51 am
 
Oops my mistake, sorry.
 I didn’t know about such a manual so thanks for sharing. I will download it and have a butcher’s later.
 Cheers!
Reply
 
 
 
 
 
 anonymous says:

 August 6, 2015 at 5:31 am
 
The Society’s lawyer, Mr. Tool, seems to think that pleading ignorance of the moral law to report that a child is being abused is going to get them off the hook but I think most thinking persons can see that these men are lying to protect the precious name of the Organization. In the U.S. ignorance of the law is no excuse. Also, the fact that they get three to four calls per month shows that the Society is still not protecting the children.
This commission into the child abuse within the Organization is even an eye opener to me the way they brought out that when a person knows of a wrong doing that they are under obligation to report the abuse but unless they have another witness that they will not be believed. I know what a terrible position that puts a person in because the same thing happened to me and at one point we were having the circuit overseer’s visit and it was a Friday night and they were having a closed meeting with the elders at the Kingdom Hall and I drove to the Kingdom Hall and the doors were locked but if the doors hadn’t been locked, I would have went into that Kingdom Hall, I would have gone into the Kingdom Hall and screamed my bloody head off at them because of what I was going through because I got absolutely no support from the elders and they know what I was going through with my husband so I fully know of the frustration at abuse victims go through. One good thing that came out of it was, was even though I was almost at the point of suicide, I went to the internet to find some support (since I could get none from the elders) and I found JWsurvey and JWfacts. If it hadn’t been for that point in my life, I’d still be in the bubble.
Reply
 
 
 Erik says:

 August 6, 2015 at 9:52 am
 
Karen, I’m so glad you found the personal strength to survive the elder’s negligence and worse!
Reply
 
 
 Grace says:

 August 6, 2015 at 3:32 pm
 
I think that the RC should make all congregations of Australia submit their personal files to the RC.
There will be some creeps around Australia these last few months shitting bricks at this point wondering who has dobbed them in. Wondering when they will be called up to answer to the Authorities.
Sisters & brothers, if you are shy about going forward, do it now while you have a voice. You will be protected. It’s the only way to heal.
The sisters that are still in that shared their stories with me, they have hard copy files on their matters. Sisters, I hope that if you are reading any of these comments & listen to your conscience, go forward so that justice maybe served.
The many times that you repeated your story wasn’t because you were murmurers, it’s because you weren’t being heard.
To those that I listened to over the years, I loved you & it hurt me to see your pain & not be able to do anything about it.
Reply
 
 
 Bad Penny says:

 August 6, 2015 at 3:37 pm
 
Anonymous speaker –
After watching this hearing I would say the best thing for you to do would be to report the matter to the police. Historic cases of sexual abuse are becoming more and more common. If the perpetrator is still alive, he can be questioned by police and the correct procedure will follow. I would not rely on JW headquarters for any assistance in the matter. It seems that they are currently in denial of these abuses happening in their ‘clean’ organisation.
 I hope you will succeed in getting the needed help and ultimate closure to your ordeal.
Reply
 
 
 anonymous says:

 August 6, 2015 at 4:10 pm
 
Does anyone know if the Society can be held criminally negligent if they refuse to comply with the commission’s suggestions as to changing their policies to protect the children?
Reply
 
 
 Grace says:

 August 6, 2015 at 5:07 pm
 
Sorry if this post comes up twice.
I think that the RC should make all congregations of Australia submit their personal files to the RC.
There will be some creeps around Australia these last few months sh’ing bricks at this point wondering who has dobbed them in. Wondering when they will be called up to answer to the Authorities.
Sisters & brothers, if you are shy about going forward, do it now while you have a voice. You will be protected. It’s the only way to heal.
The sisters that are still in that shared their stories with me, they have hard copy files on their matters. Sisters, I hope that if you are reading any of these comments & listen to your conscience, go forward so that justice maybe served.
The many times that you repeated your story wasn’t because you were murmurers, it’s because you weren’t being heard.
To those that I listened to over the years, I loved you & it hurt me to see your pain & not be able to do anything about it.
 Reply
Reply
 
 
 Warren says:

 August 6, 2015 at 5:54 pm
 
I had a dealing with Vince, when serving as an elder, certain elders hid a letter outlining evidence showing a brother being guilty of child abuse, i never knew of the letter, nor was i aware of the case & the letter being hidden, Vince said to me that we were to keep silent before the police, & that we were on our own legally, i was not prepared to do that, in the end nothing happened, the brother confessed to the police & the matter was dealt with. I have long been vocal in the congregation that this practice is wrong, & now we are seeing the truth, except as someone has said this will be hidden from the average JW, as they are to scared to have a good open look at whats going on in real life, another comment has been made as the financial situation, we have already seen the payouts in America & very soon it will happen here, its no wonder they have just drained all the local accounts of cash for the world wide work, how convenient!!! we have saved $50,000 for our refurb, mmmm i wonder if that will ever happen now, at least as i say to many disgruntled members, they didnt get a cent of me or my family, i am also waiting for a new financial venture from them, another con to get our money, too pay for this mess..
Reply
 
 
 Enuffsenuff says:

 August 7, 2015 at 1:14 am
 
Some have asked if the WTS is liable for criminal prosecution this is the Act of NSW Criminal Code. I believe Vin Toole is sweating bullets, and so many elders have been put in a precarious position of being guilty of serious charges under the Code. Have to wait and see on this one
New South Wales Consolidated Acts
 [Index] [Table] [Search] [Search this Act] [Notes] [Noteup] [Previous] [Next] [Download] [Help]
 CRIMES ACT 1900 – SECT 316
 Concealing serious indictable offence
 316 Concealing serious indictable offence
(1) If a person has committed a serious indictable offence and another person who knows or believes that the offence has been committed and that he or she has information which might be of material assistance in securing the apprehension of the offender or the prosecution or conviction of the offender for it fails without reasonable excuse to bring that information to the attention of a member of the Police Force or other appropriate authority, that other person is liable to imprisonment for 2 years.
(2) A person who solicits, accepts or agrees to accept any benefit for himself or herself or any other person in consideration for doing anything that would be an offence under subsection (1) is liable to imprisonment for 5 years.
(3) It is not an offence against subsection (2) merely to solicit, accept or agree to accept the making good of loss or injury caused by an offence or the making of reasonable compensation for that loss or injury.
(4) A prosecution for an offence against subsection (1) is not to be commenced against a person without the approval of the Attorney General if the knowledge or belief that an offence has been committed was formed or the information referred to in the subsection was obtained by the person in the course of practising or following a profession, calling or vocation prescribed by the regulations for the purposes of this subsection.
(5) The regulations may prescribe a profession, calling or vocation as referred to in subsection (4).
Reply
 
 
 jake says:

 August 7, 2015 at 2:40 am
 
I have only one comment to say, how does it feel?
 Bob Dylan, like a rolling stone.x
Reply
 
 
 Cherie says:

 August 7, 2015 at 6:45 am
 
Karen, I am so sorry you had to go through such a terrible experience. Here in the U.S., it looks like the only media to pick up on this story is National Public Radio (NPR.)
Reply
 
 
 Ted says:

 August 7, 2015 at 7:12 am
 
The commission realises that any change to WT, policy on
 child abuse will have to come from N,York, not Australia.
 But the supremo’s are keeping their distance, even though
 one of them ( Geoffrey Jackson ) is already in Australia.
The commissions request to summon Jackson to the inquiry
 was rejected, with the statement , that it would be “Unconscionable”
( How did they not choke on that word ) as he’s in Australia for
 compassionate reasons,
So Stephen Lett’s claim, that we take “Action” against anyone
 who would threaten our young ones, is just wind from a horses ar-e
Those appearing for the Aussie branch have repeatedly avoided
 admitting they are controlled by N,Y, and have skirted round the
 Issue by obfuscation and verbiage.
Why is their conscience not seared? It’s probably because they’re
 so used to defending the indefensible, that it’s normal for them.
The commission is doing a great job, exposing a truly awful
 religious cult, but the gloves need to come off. Tough action
 from the law is needed to protect the children, inside the JW org,
 and those on the out side.
Reply
 
 
 Enuffsenuff says:

 August 7, 2015 at 7:40 am
 
Hi, I am not sure if it is known that Jackson has been summoned to appear at the RC on Tues or Wed of this coming week. Keeping in mind that Aust is anywhere from 10-15 hours ahead of the US keep that in mind if your are trying to watch it.
 On the last day of the public hearing of JW’s there was quite an exchange between Senior Counsel (SC) Angus Stewart and The Aust Branch Co-ordinator Terry O’Brien. Stewart put it to O’Brien 3 times that his statements regarding Geoff Jacksons reasons for not appearing were false, (a polite way of saying he was a liar), O’Brien denied it unconvincingly.
 SC Stewart called for proof that there was something wrong with Jackson’s father. That caused a scramble of offers of affidavits, doctors statements and other feeble offers.
 At that point the Head of the RC Peter Maclellan said he was issuing a summons for Jacksons appearance and that everyone has to cope with ill parents at some time or other, and Jacksons circumstances were no different than anyone else’s and there was no reason for him not to appear. God help if he doesn’t front. I love Maclellan.
Reply
 
 Idontknowhatodo says:

 August 7, 2015 at 11:20 am
 
I love Mclellan too…he really cuts away the camouflage and gets to the facts…I loved it when he said..’.these (family sickness etc) are things we all have to deal with,but as a commission we are investigating many matters that affect many people including members of his own church….exactly…how much does Geoffrey Jackson care about the thousands of victims worldwide that he is supposed to love…ones also that he and the others have instructed thier families to shun…lets see shall we?….and I loved that shunning was on the table as a cruel and agonising punishment…and the Branch Co-ordinator was not quite truthful again!
Reply
 
 
 
 Enuffsenuff says:

 August 7, 2015 at 8:04 am
 
And a little further on the reasons for O’briens’s probity being questioned. I and others thought that Jackson was in Australia for treatment for his health. Then we find out that it was not him but his father. The impression that Rod Spinks and Vin Toole seemed to convey was that the father was on death’s doorstep and Jackson was so stricken and mortified that no words would come out of his mouth because of grief (that may be a little hyperbole but not much). Then we find out that Jackson has been in Australia for 3 weeks and hiding out of sight.There was a deliberate plan to deceive the Commission. O’Briens role in all this was to say that Jackson just worked in the translation Dept at Brooklyn and he would be of little use in helping the commission determine where policy came from in Brooklyn. Can you believe that? They really thought in their arrogance that the Commission was as stupid as they were.
 SC Stewart primed O’Brien with a series of questions about the writing Dept and O’Brien “keen” to help informed him that Jackson was the head of that Dept. That was when the fit hit the shan.
 He was called a liar. I think everyone at the branch shivered at that point. I did hear later that branch staff were complaining that the RC was nit picking and this was all evidence that Satan was after them. Good grief, they haven’t needed any help from Satan to show them up for what they are and have been. They have proudly done this to themselves. They really are the Evil Slave.
Reply
 
 
 Koos says:

 August 7, 2015 at 10:37 am
 
No better chance, as being part of God’s mouth piece and spiritually guided, to show the truth!
Geoffrey Jackson where are you? They count on you!
Reply
 
 
 Exhausted says:

 August 7, 2015 at 12:31 pm
 
While watching day 7 part 3 , I was thinking it would be
 Highly appropriate to bring into evidence the Herd talk
 On women not having the brain power of a man. He is
 Testifying as to how respected women are in the org.
 And so forth, but they should dig up that talk. It would
 Totally discredit the logic he puts forth.
Reply
 
 Pickled brain says:

 August 7, 2015 at 2:24 pm
 
THREE CHEERS for the ROYAL COMMISSION of AUSTRALIA!!! Oops shouldn’t have said 3 cheers!! It’s PAGAN ?? Oh well 3 Cheers to the Satanic Worldly Royal Commission!! I have just made up some VOODOO DOLLS of Stephen Letts, Geoffrey Jackson & Anthony Morris & Sticking SPEARS through their Brains( Actually Genitalia, but what’s the Dilfference).!!!!!
 Australia might have soon lost the ASHES to England by tomorrow in the 4th Test ( the YANKS won’t understand what I’m talking about)BUT the Australia Royal Commission is ABSOLUTELY BRILLIANT!!’
HIP HIP HOORAY to Angus Stewart!’ I normally detest the Scots( can’t understand a word what they say) .the man is brilliant!!
Reply
 
 Jake says:

 August 7, 2015 at 10:51 pm
 
We deserved to winx
Reply
 
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 8, 2015 at 4:06 am
 
Couldn’t have said it better myself.
Reply
 
 
 
 
 Bad Penny says:

 August 7, 2015 at 5:00 pm
 
The Royal Commission are really making monkeys out of the elders.
 Max Horley, when asked about the death of Bill the abuser, said yes, he had died and then he unhesitatingly stated that he had gone to his funeral!
 Anyone who goes to a witness funeral, which Bill O’Neill probably had, will know that witnesses go to praise the life of their dear departed. It appears then that he was forgiven by Max for his misdemeanours. I bet they never mentioned Bill’s record of child abuse. But, of course, he has the resurrection hope! What hypocrisy!
 The poor victim of his advances had no support. Her evidence showed that she took the blame on herself.
‘Woe to the shepherds who are destroying and scattering the sheep of my pasturage!’ ….. ‘you have not turned your attention to them’ …… ‘Here I am turning my attention upon you, for the badness of your dealings,’ (Jer:23:1-2)
Reply
 
 
 Bad Penny says:

 August 7, 2015 at 5:23 pm
 
It appears that Geoffrey Jackson has weedled his way out of appearing at the Commission.
 What a shame he forsook the chance of supporting his dear brothers who are undergoing such a trial.
 Of course, as a substitute for Christ, he is following His example?? Jesus always left his followers in the lurch didn’t he?? I don’t think so.
 Jackson, I believe that Revelation 21:8 applies to YOU! Appointed by holy spirit, my ass!
Reply
 
 Jake says:

 August 7, 2015 at 10:40 pm
 
Please no, he has to appear!
Reply
 
 
 
 Garrett says:

 August 7, 2015 at 5:26 pm
 
Geoffrey Jackson absolutely CANNOT be allowed to get on that plane and fly away to the protection of the United States. The pedophile protecting policies that exist and the incalculable suffering by children and families lies right at the doorstep of this sick human being and his fellow cult leaders and policy makers the Governing Body of Jehova’s Witnesses.
 Everyone. PLEASE write the Royal commission immediately and tell them they must absolutely not let him leave the country without arrest/ full testimony and trial. Here is the email address everyone.contact@childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au
Reply
 
 Jake says:

 August 7, 2015 at 10:38 pm
 
Done it and begged, and thanks for the link.x
Reply
 
 
 
 Enuffsenuff says:

 August 8, 2015 at 12:32 am
 
An interesting exchange of dishonesty and being caught. Counsel for JW’s tells a porky and has to retract. All comments in brackets have been added and are not part of the RC transcript
.05/08/2015 (153)
 Transcript produced by DTI
 15871
THE CHAIR: Before I come to that, Mr Tokley, at the
 moment I am troubled by what I now understand as to the
 role of Mr Jackson in the organisation. It does seem that,
 having regard to the issues we have canvassed, he would be
 able to help. Do you want to respond to that?
MR TOKLEY: Your Honour, I can respond. I can certainly
 try to take further instructions. For reasons which are
 obvious, I think, your Honour is entitled to whatever
 assistance should be provided to your Honour. My
 understanding remains as I was instructed, that in relation to these legal matters, Mr Jackson would be of no assistance.
[The WT Lawyer was instructed to say Mr. Jackson would be of no assistance.]
THE CHAIR: It’s not legal matters. The discussion has
 moved a little from the history to the future.
 MR TOKLEY: Yes.
 THE CHAIR: At the moment, I can presently understand the injunction that is felt in relation to elders, but
 a process, a deliberative process for the church – it’s
 possible to imagine it being one which was not entirely
 conducted by elders. But, secondly, a process which the
 church engages in because of its adherence to the Bible,
 which allows a person who those who are deciding the matter have no doubt has committed the abuse, to, nevertheless, remain in the community, raises other issues as well.
 MR TOKLEY: Yes, your Honour, I understand.
 THE CHAIR: They won’t have eluded you or Mr Coyne, as
 they were raised.
 MR TOKLEY: No, your Honour.
 THE CHAIR: I mean, if you put yourself in a position to
 care for other people and you fail, then consequences flow.
[The GB will be held responsible.]
Now, these are issues which clearly have emerged from
 our discussion, and we would like as much help as we can.
 As he is in the country, it would seem logical that we ask
 him to come and help us.
 MR TOKLEY: I understand your Honour’s point and I am not seeking to not address your Honour’s point.
 THE CHAIR: No, I understand that. Having said that,
 I appreciate the circumstances of his father, but we all
 have to face those difficulties from time to time in our lives.
MR TOKLEY: Yes, your Honour.
 THE CHAIR: What I’m going to say is I would like you to
 take up the matter with Mr Stewart and we will make
 arrangements some time next week to hear evidence from Mr Jackson, unless Mr Stewart comes to me and says that that can’t be done.
[He has directed that Geoff Jackson appear]
MR TOKLEY: I understand, your Honour.
MR TOKLEY: Yes, thank you, your Honour. Just before my
 learned friend rises, I can assure your Honour that there
 was no intention, obviously, on my part to mislead
 your Honour in any way.
 THE CHAIR: We accept that.
 MR TOKLEY: Thank you, your Honour. The other aspect of
 it is that, if I may, it may be necessary for my learned
 friend Mr Stewart and I to perhaps approach your Honour in relation to Mr Jackson’s medical condition, simply because of the privacy of the matter, and to inform your Honour –
[Deliberate attempt to mislead the court into thinking it was Geoff Jackson’s
 medical condition.]
THE CHAIR: It is the medical condition of his father.
MR TOKLEY: Yes, your Honour, I beg your pardon.
[Caught out and applogized.]
THE CHAIR: That is as I understand it.
 MR TOKLEY: Yes, it is.
 THE CHAIR: At the moment that’s all I know, and that’s
 not enough for me, now, given what I know about his role in the organisation –
[Reason’s for not attending not accepted by the RC]
MR TOKLEY: Understood, your Honour.
 THE CHAIR: — to say that we shouldn’t have the benefit of his understanding.
 MR TOKLEY: No. I think I will endeavour to obtain
 a consultant specialist report on the matter.
[Attempt to redirect and continue to hide Geoff Jackson]
THE CHAIR: That won’t actually necessarily solve the
 problem.
[Redirection failed]
MR TOKLEY: I understand, your Honour.
 THE CHAIR: It is regrettable and I appreciate his
 position, but we all have to face these issues as well as
 our other responsibilities, and this Royal Commission, of
 course, carries great responsibilities for many, many
 people, some of whom are members of his church.
 MR TOKLEY: Yes, it is understood, your Honour.
 Thank you, your Honour.
 MR STEWART: If I might hand up the direction with regard to submissions, it is self-explanatory, I believe.
 If there is to be any appreciable delay on the matters
 your Honour has been discussing with my learned friend,
 then he might approach your Honour with regard to an
 amendment of the direction.
 THE CHAIR: Yes. Well, we will face that when we come to
 it, if we need to. Otherwise, I have made the directions
 in those terms. Mr Tokley, feel free to approach Mr Stewart, if that’s
 necessary.
 MR TOKLEY: Thank you, your Honour.
 THE CHAIR: The expectation we have is that at an
 appropriate time next week there will be maybe one or two hours set aside.
 MR TOKLEY: Understood, your Honour.
[Geoff Jackson has been directed to appear]
Reply
 
 Jake says:

 August 8, 2015 at 12:43 am
 
Cool :-)! And thank you:-)
Reply
 
 
 

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← Jehovah’s Witness culture creates a ‘perfect storm’ for abuse
Royal Commission’s Angus Stewart accuses Watchtower representative of deliberate deception →
 
Reflecting on the Australian Royal Commission (Day 3, Part 1)
avatar
Posted on August 5, 2015

Abuse survivor Karen Morgan gives her take on evidence given by Dino Ali (above) at the Royal Commission
Abuse survivor Karen Morgan gives her take on evidence given by Dino Ali (above) at the Royal Commission

As you can appreciate there is so much information coming out of this investigation, it’s difficult to know where to start with reviewing it. I would like to begin by focusing on day 3, part 1, which sees Mr Dino Ali on the stand. He is one of the elders who dealt with the case of BCG.
I would love to know what advice/direction the elders have been given prior to this investigation. To me, the elders seem extremely unprepared and very out of their depth.
They are a far cry from the elders who sit in judgement on Judicial Committees and speak eloquently with authority and confidence from the platform.
The other thing that strikes me is the Commission seems to have a lot of the original paperwork, including notes taken by elders at Judicial Meetings. During my own case, the Society and the elders were asked to provide all paperwork related to the case, but they claimed paperwork was destroyed. Maybe in Australia the elders are more organized.
Back to Mr Ali who struggles to interpret his own notes that he took at the time (although I do wonder whether his struggles are related to the fact his own notes are about to drop him right in it).
Ali’s own notes clearly show that more than one child had been abused by their father, and that the elders were told about the abuse at the time of their investigation. However, the fact there were at least two witnesses as required by JW rules was not enough for the elders. It beggars belief, and I find myself saying out loud, “what the hell were you thinking?” I just cannot figure out what goes through these elders’ minds.
After countless judicial meetings, no action was taken against BCH (the father) until it transpired he had been involved in immorality with an adult female. This called for another judicial meeting where his immorality was the focus of the discussion.
At this meeting, the abuse of his daughter was again discussed. His notes state that BCH admitted to everything, and he stated that whatever his daughter BCG had said about him was true. It was only at this point that he was disfellowshipped. So at this point the elders had an admission at last, so there should have been no reason why BCH could not have been disfellowshipped for the abuse.
But no! Mr Ali claims that as this meeting was concerning immorality, then that’s all they could deal with. Also, and this is the killer, Mr Ali suggests that they couldn’t accept that admission as the elders felt it might not be true! Absolutely ludicrous.
So BCH gets disfellowshipped for immorality, but still no action is taken by elders on the child abuse claims. Let’s not forget that, at this stage, all four daughters and even the wife of BCH had all told the elders of the abuse that had taken place.
We then come to the letters sent by the elders to the Branch. The letters contain lots of information about the immorality, but no mention is made of the abuse. Mr Ali claims that at that time the guidelines did not require reporting of child abuse. He refers to the older version of Shepherd the Flock of God. What screams out at me here is: did they really need to have it in black and white in order to report it to the Branch?
Mr Ali is asked if he recalls BCH actually admitting to the abuse. His response: “Well I was only there as a bystander, I wasn’t directly involved.” He goes on to say that he “can’t remember,” which seems to be a common claim among these elders when asked any awkward questions.
Now here’s the clincher: Ali is asked the question I’ve been waiting for. Did he consider reporting these matters to the police? His answer: “No.” Even after the confession, they still did not feel any need to report to the police. Why? “Well, we were still trying to find all the facts on pornea which he was guilty of and we didn’t have the direction in order to do that.”
So in other words, because someone on the end of a phone didn’t say it’s a crime and needs to be reported, the elders didn’t report it. But it’s OK, because the elders tell the accused he/she is never to be on their own with children anymore, and they are not to have children staying overnight. They feel that is enough.
The next part of the questioning turns to the fact the elders had a full confession from BCH, and yet they still did nothing. Mr Ali goes back to his terrible explanation that they had to be sure BCH was being truthful in his confession. He claims that BCH may have only confessed to molesting his daughter to get out of the situation. Now, I don’t know what situation BCH found himself in at the time, but I’m struggling to think of ANY circumstances that would mean a father would falsely say he had been molesting his daughter?
So BCG claims to have been molested by her father, her father admits to molesting her, but the elders still weren’t sure. They were also worried that he may deny it later and they would find themselves stranded. We are supposed to share their concern about what would happen if they had gone to the police and then he had changed his mind. How would they live with themselves? Absolutely farcical!
The questioning moves to the suggestion that no one wants to accept that elders and ministerial servants would carry out child abuse because they are appointed by the Holy Spirit. Mr Ali denies this is the case, and he then describes being an elder or servant as the same as being a ‘Slave’ – claiming it is not a dignified position at all. You have to just laugh at that statement. He will not admit that it may have been a mistake to appoint BCH as a ministerial servant.
Mr Ali spent sleepless nights after hearing what BCG went through with her father. However, this did not prompt him or any of the elders to actually do anything. In fact, the four girls remained at home with their father until he later moved out. So these men appointed by Holy Spirit allowed four young girls to remain in the same home as their father who had abused them physically and sexually.
Let’s not forget that their mother was also aware of what was going on, and she too did nothing. So wouldn’t it have made sense to go to the police and allow them to properly investigate the crime? Mr Ali doesn’t seem to think so, as in 1988 they were following the old guidelines and it’s completely up to the victim to report.
The Judicial Committees are clearly designed to assist the wrongdoer and not the victim. The hope is that the wrongdoer will see their mistakes and repent and come back to Jehovah. Mr Ali feels they are well equipped to deal with the victims of child abuse. His reasons? Publications, circuit overseers, and the ability to ring the Bethel.
Elders also follow up by reading scriptures with the victim, but only within the committee meetings. The elders never told BCG that they believed her, or that it was not her fault. Mr Ali also claims that he was unaware of the gossip in the congregation that BCG was telling lies. He also doesn’t recall BCG had attempted suicide after these events.
The similarities between this case and my own experiences are scarily similar. I was subjected to countless meetings with elders, some on my own, some with my dad, and some with my abuser. I received NO support whatsoever outside of those meetings. My abuser was never disfellowshipped for what he did to me, he was disfellowshipped for admitting to being drunk and belligerent.
I too was called a liar by my congregation at the time, and also a trouble maker. Listening to this case takes me back to my own experience, and when I hear the victims describe how they felt, I know exactly what they are talking about.
Surely Jehovah’s Witnesses must realize how ridiculous their policies are when they watch this Commission? It’s sad, but I suspect your average Witness has no idea of these developments. Even if they do, they will view it as persecution and not see it for what it is – sorely needed exposure of a damaging organization that is failing children.
 
new-karen-signature2
 
 
 
 
 
 
Karen is herself a victim of child sex abuse as a Jehovah’s Witness. You can read more about her story here and here.
Further reading…
◾Jehovah’s Witness culture creates a ‘perfect storm’ for abuse
◾Elders shamed under questioning by the Royal Commission
◾Australian Royal Commission hears that 1,006 alleged child sex abusers were covered up by Watchtower
◾Media reports on the Royal Commission
◾JWsurvey articles on child abuse
Watch an updated playlist of Royal Commission footage…






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← Jehovah’s Witness culture creates a ‘perfect storm’ for abuse
Royal Commission’s Angus Stewart accuses Watchtower representative of deliberate deception →
 
105 Responses to Reflecting on the Australian Royal Commission (Day 3, Part 1)

← Older Comments
 
 Jake says:

 August 8, 2015 at 2:59 am
 
It will be wonderful to see Mr Jackson at the commission.
 He may be feeling nervous, frightened, scared. He’ll be quizzed, cross examined and he may not be believed.
 He didn’t want to appear before the committee due to compassionate reasons but what about the compassionate reasons for the children who HAD to appear before a judicial committee, what about feeling humiliated and sitting amongst your abuser and not being believed? Children have had to do that Mr Jackson, where was your compassion then? You are a coward Mr Jackson and a hypocrite along with your counterparts. I hope you are all humiliated.
Reply
 
 
 sirius says:

 August 8, 2015 at 6:36 am
 
To have a GB member who has been appointed by God present should earth shattering. /extreme sarcasm on!
IMHO
dogstar
Reply
 
 
 Excelsior! says:

 August 8, 2015 at 6:50 am
 
Folks,
If Mr Jackson appears, he will have to explain the policies, and he will have to discuss changes that he can make to the policies.
If Mr Jackson does not appear, he will demonstrate to the people of Australia, and the world, that he is unwilling to discuss the policies that he, along with the other six members of the governing body, have approved and enforce!
In other words, he is damned if he appears or if he does not appear!
Either way, the survivors win, and we along with them.
There is no way out of this for the WTBTS.
The Royal Commission is inoculating the people of Australia and the world against the JW cult. It is helping cut off the feeding source of the WTBTS. Do you think that the Australian people will want to become JWs now? Anyone exposed to these facts will run a mile!
This is the first major salvo against the WTBTS, and they have reeled from it. They were totally unprepared for the detailed knowledge the Commission has of their policies, and they have never regained their composure.
Peace be with you, Excelsior!
Reply
 
 anonymous says:

 August 8, 2015 at 8:47 am
 
Excelsior, I agree with your assessment 100%. I was totally amazed that that one elder hadn’t even heard of “Theocratic warfare” but the questioners did and quoted it from a 1957 Watchtower. Either that elder had never heard of it or he was pretending he had never heard of it.
Those people on that commission know a lot more about the under workings of the Society than any of those people being questioned from the Society and it shows. Those people did their homework and they are showing the JW religion and it’s followers as ignorant.
I love the way the commission questioners are talking down to the Witnesses as if they are children because the Witnesses are pretending to not understand the questions. Those elders know exactly what the commission is trying to prove and all the elders can do is talk in circles but the commission is too smart to fall for it.
Those people on that commission are asking all the questions that all of out here, who the Society would like to pretend are “apostates” and not deserving of being good enough to talk to and they are not being able to get out of it. When it comes to us “apostates” they refuse to talk to us and run the other way if we would ask those same questions to them.
I am loving it!!!!
Reply
 
 
 
 RK says:

 August 8, 2015 at 9:11 am
 
The society will just blame the elders too. I served as an elder for a few years. The CO would send you into the battle without a bulletproof vest. Then turn around and blame you (elders) when it all went wrong. The upper management are masters at side stepping blame. They will just say the elders did not follow procedure. They (GB) always have a way out. I left years ago after seeing the circuit overseers stir up the congregation, only to leave the next week with the mess in your lap. You can tell these elders are in a pile of (sh-it). We had a case where a girl said her step father molested her. I felt we needed to tell the police. But the mother had a government job and did not want the publicity. So sometimes the people are to blame too. They don’t want they’re family secrets to get out. It’s ashame. But thus stuff needs reported to the authorities. The. They can decide what to do. The WTBTS really did a disservice to everyone with their rules. Then they leave the elders to look bad and blame them. I’ve seen elders left with the blame bag so many times. I think they do it purposely so they always have a way out. The society is always in protect itself mode, no matter who gets hurt. Then ultimately they say that people are not following Jehovah’s direction. There is the ultimate excuse for them, blame the people. Just like they blame the Israelites for everything. We don’t want to be like those bad Israelites. The leadership never takes responsibility for its actions. Not now, and certainly not in the last 100 years. They hurt dozens of families only to say, let Jehovah work it out in his time. If there is a God. The GB will have a tough time explaining how they used Jehovah as their scapegoat all these years.
Reply
 
 Chiafade says:

 August 10, 2015 at 4:14 pm
 
I absolutely agree with your statements. I have been among the elders left with the blame bag. It’s a habit that trickles down to the elders as well. When someone has doubts its “why do you have doubts brother weak?”
Bro weak: I just can’t seem to reconcile a truthful organization completely and habitually avoiding speaking truth. Especially in court.
 Elders: Well, have you been studying and reading your Bible daily?
 Bro weak: What does that have to do with anything?
 Elders: If you had been studying you would know that these are nothing but satanic attacks on God’s true people.
You get the point. No matter how valid the complaint the organization is NEVER to blame EVER.
Reply
 
 
 
 Exhausted says:

 August 8, 2015 at 11:37 am
 
I knew about theocratic warfare since I was a little girl.
 We had it drilled into our heads that we would be persecuted and subjected to who knows what before
 The final battle which was looming in the near future.
 Well, I just turned 63 this week. So my point is this,
 That lawyer is a liar to say he has never heard the term
 Theocratic Warfare. Pleeeeese make it stop. LORDY.
Reply
 
 
 Jake says:

 August 8, 2015 at 12:06 pm
 
Read a lovely quote on the internet today, and it reminded me of all the young woman and girls who have showed such bravery, and to those who have suffered in silence
‘Speak the truth, even if your voice shakes’
I have absolute admiration for you and Iam very proud of my own 4y daughter, what an example.X
Reply
 
 
 Exhausted says:

 August 8, 2015 at 2:02 pm
 
Uncle Freddy was expounding the theory of Theocratic
 warfare as far back as 1955. I found a talk he gave on
 The subject under the heading Theocratic War speech
 1955. It also refers to the Rahab technique. Just saying.
Reply
 
 
 ScotWm says:

 August 8, 2015 at 3:28 pm
 
Here’s a good example of theocratic warfare, also known as lying: “Jehovah’s people do not beg for money… It is our judgment that money raised by the various begging devices in the name of our Lord is offensive, unacceptable to him, and does not bring his blessing either upon the givers or the work accomplished.”
But paying those child abuse judgments and out of court settlements can get expensive, so new light has revealed that various begging devices are now totally appropriate.
“Show Appreciation for Jehovah’s Generosity” is the headline of an article appearing in the November 1, 2015 Watchtower Study Edition. After a lengthy scriptural flourish on how donating to the Watchtower will help us repay God for his “indescribable free gift”, we are presented with a wide variety of ways to add to the Watchtower treasury.
There is a chart which shows how CHARITABLE PLANNING can be used as a tax avoidance strategy when donating insurance, bank accounts, stocks, bonds, real estate, wills and trusts to the Watchtower. Creating a will designating the Watchtower as sole beneficiary is encouraged.
OUTRIGHT DONATIONS include donations via electronic bank transfer, debit card or credit card. In some branches, electronic transfers can be made using jw.org or another designated website. Donations of cash, jewelry or other valuable personal property will also be greatly appreciated.
I’m curious to see if Governing Body members will now drop their pinky rings and Rolex watches into contribution boxes.
Those with limited means, such as pioneering part time janitors and window washers, are urged to continue devoting all of their “time, energy, and resources” to the Watchtower Society.
http://www.jw.org/en/publications/magazines/w20151115/donations-worldwide-work/
To make donating quick and easy, the Watchtower accepts Visa, MasterCard, American Express and Discover:
https://www.jw.org/apps/E_QBrNGR
Dig deep! Give until it hurts! And then give some more!
Reply
 
 
 Joe Smith says:

 August 8, 2015 at 10:19 pm
 
The “Theocratic Warfare” concept exists because it has been attested to as a ‘weapon’ of spiritual warfare [see the Walsh Trial Transcripts]
 Question: Therefore if I was required – on pain of death – to purchase a 19 cent Political Party Card [ref Malawi] and I did so – even though in my mind and soul I profess no allegiance to the party – but it saves my neck – that should be OK then?
 I think more people should know about the “Theocratic Warfare” thing!
Reply
 
 sirius says:

 August 9, 2015 at 6:58 am
 
“Theocratic Warfare” seems to have a parallelism of the battle plan of the Koran against the non-believers.
Your example is pretty close to the Koranic Surah 3, Ayat 28 (Surat ‘Āli `Imrān – Family of Imran) the justification using deception when in fear, even for one’s (self) life or safety. This art of deception can be practiced by most sects of islam, in particular the shiite, but also the sunni. The Arabic word is taqiyya*(rooted in ayat 3:28). The key disguising feature is that the believer can lie in front of his allah but only with his tongue & not his heart. The heart is one’s true faith, not the tongue. It’s liken to self-defense in fighting a non-believer, even under threat of sever questioning. Soooo, the goal in the islamic world is …. allah above all else!
* taqiyya is a fascinating subject area but will not get into depth here.
IMHO
dogstar
Reply
 
 
 
 Average Joe says:

 August 9, 2015 at 9:22 am
 
I had an interesting conversation with a fellow elder the other day and I subtly mentioned the Australian Royal Commission case (as I didn’t want him to top the conversation dead) and I told him about the confidential Branch Guidelines letter that even congregation elders aren’t allowed to see. I told him that one of the first questions was “If a person had previously been a child abuser in the past would that mean that he couldn’t be an elder or MS?” to which the answer was “not necessarily”. At first he couldn’t believe it (like me) but then when I read the rest that gave examples such as “it was before he came into the truth” or “it was many years ago and he had repented” then he told me he agreed with those situations. This elder is in his late 50s and seems to be the typical opinion of elders in his age group. I tried to reason with him that a child molester has crossed a line that should never be crossed. He tried to say it was the same as a murderer or fornicator that repents. I stood my ground and said “no” as those are understandable circumstances to some extent and we don’t know the situations that led up to their sin. However there is NO possible excuse for child molestation and that such a person should NEVER be allowed a privilege in the cong and should even be “marked” by letting the brothers know he is a former abuser. It fell on deaf ears. I am apparently too harsh and need to work on being merciful!!! I think it highlights the current problem facing the WTS though. Hopefully younger elders like myself can help make the needed reforms on a congregation level especially if justice is done in courts as in the Australian case.
Reply
 
 Simon Kestral says:

 August 9, 2015 at 10:41 am
 
I agree that child molesters permanently disqualify themselves from leadership roles. At least until a new world where such mental aberrations could be cured.
But you want to change WT from within?
As an elder, you are required to participate in field service with the goal of starting Bible studies. When asked who the faithful and discreet slave is, will you support WT’s claim to that title? If you do, you share in the sin of that lie. And if you don’t, you can’t serve as an elder.
WT is not a game where you can play double agent. You are deceiving yourself.
Reply
 
 Average Joe says:

 August 9, 2015 at 2:18 pm
 
Thanks for your reply Simon.
 I believe that I belong to the organisation God is using today, hence why I’m a part of it. What I’m beginning to see is how corruption reaches up even to “management” level. As I’ve stated on here before, I know what my conscience allows and what is morally right & wrong. I don’t need the WTS to tell me that. I am part of a fantastic small congregation and as yet haven’t seen any corruption or any cases of abuse. If I do then I’d be the first to go to the authorities. Yes I am very regular in field service (thanks for checking up on me; wow didn’t expect THAT on here!) as I believe there is more to life than what we see. I like to believe in a paradise earth where EVERYONE who is a decent human being gets to live based on God’s criteria and his alone (not US judging if an individual is worthy or not). I have great friends within the organisation and the congregation and will defend my fellow “rank & file” brothers & sisters as described by some on here. However, I will NOT defend bad WTS policies or corrupt, perverted individuals to anyone. I’ve yet to come across it in my ministry but I would openly direct an individual who brought the abuse cases up to the News Articles and TRUTHFULLY answer them to the best of my limited knowledge.
 Hope that satisfactorily answers your questions.
 Cheers. AJ
 PS. I’m on here after all because I’m being diligent and looking for answers.
Reply
 
 Simon Kestral says:

 August 9, 2015 at 3:24 pm
 
So you do support WT’s claim to the title of faithful and discreet slave, without any self conflict. I see.
At one time, I didn’t question it either. But eventually I realized that WT’s claim to the title of faithful and discreet slave is false. Only Jesus can make that judgment. He has not done so yet, and any person or organization claiming it for themselves is presumptuously running ahead.
WT’s failures are not mere management incompetence. WT’s claim to the title of faithful and discreet slave was false all the way back in 1881 when C.T. Russell first wrote of it, and with many flip flopping changes in the 134 years since, it’s still false today.
You can’t build a house of truth on a foundation of lies.
By examining so called apostate material such as found on this web site, you are disobedient to the organization you claim to have confidence in.
But by all means, continue searching for truth. It took time for me to realize WT is NOT “the truth.”
Reply
 
 
 
 
 Chiafade says:

 August 12, 2015 at 5:56 pm
 
They should “never be allowed to have a privilege”. I completely agree. Have you seen the application for temporary work in Warwick? In particular question 3 (e) and (f) under spiritual condition and background ” “Have you ever engaged in child molestation?” If so “how long ago?”
You can’t make this stuff up. There should be no room for a question like that.
Reply
 
 
 
 Ted says:

 August 9, 2015 at 11:48 am
 
Lying to a cruel regime, to save your life and the lives of your family
 and those whom you regard as Christian brothers, is certainly no sin.
 And most would agree it’s the honourable thing to do.
But far from being an evil authority, the R, Commission was formed
 to protect children from sexual predators, and anyone claiming to be
 Christian and more than that, the “Only. true Christians under the sun,
 surely would want to cooperate fully with that aim.
Instead we have seen very senior JWs deliberately trying to mislead
 and to thwart the commissions goals. Chief counsel for the R,Comm,
 Angus Stewart, openly accused, top JW, Terrence O’Brien, of giving
 WTs lawyer false information to be presented to the inquiry.
It’s all very far from, “The truth the Whole Truth and nothing but the
 Truth” Who can trust anything they say, if they’re not above lying
 under Oath sworn on the book they claim to live by?
No way can they use the excuse of “Theocratic Warfare”. There’s
 no persecution here, no attack by Satan, The comm, is investigating
 all organisations where children could be at risk, including the very
 powerful Catholic Church.
The reason they’re being so obstructive, is the absolute control
 they’re under. Minds taken over , afraid to give an honest opinion
 I almost feel sorry for them, watching them squirm.
Reply
 
 
 Excelsior! says:

 August 9, 2015 at 3:22 pm
 
Average Joe,
Sir, you are far better placed where you are than outside the organisation. You can offer better care to your fellow congregants as an appointed part of the organisation than outside of it.
I applaud your stance, and it is a comfort to know that you are by no means the only elder out there who has chosen to do what is right rather than what the organisation dictates is right.
I understand those who cannot accept a “double life” but I think that it depends on why someone is living a “double life”. In your case, Av. Joe, you are concerned for your congregants, and you want to be able to offer them Christian aid and advice. This is a noble aim. The fruitage will define if it is the correct choice.
You offer a fifth column that the WTBTS will find extremely difficult to counter. Cooperating with others in your position will be problematic, though. I’m sure you will find a way.
I shall leave you with a question. What is the right thing to do? Should you tell your congregants that the organisation you believe to be God’s channel has the worst reputation as regards the handling of child abuse?
I am an atheist. I am not going to judge you whatever you decide. I am genuinely interested in what the right thing to do IS in this situation. There are arguments for and against. This dilemma lies at the heart of how we help people wake up from the undue influence that the WTBTS uses.
For what it’s worth, Average Joe, I think that you are a sincere man, and I absolutely believe that if a child comes to you or your fellow elders with an accusation of paedophilia, you WILL contact the police and cooperate fully with their investigation. Good for you, sir.
I wish you well and I hope you find a way to live your faith in harmony with your own Christian conscience.
Peace be with you, Excelsior!
Reply
 
 Idontknowhatodo says:

 August 9, 2015 at 4:14 pm
 
Once again you are the voice of reason Excelsior…
We all have to find our own way…
We have to create our own exit strategy…
Thay may involve a lengthy ‘role play’…
I just hope average joe that you also realise that women are your equals and are treated with extreme prejudice in the organization you think is from ‘God’…..
I think even the fact that you are looking and commenting here means you are not as convinced as you like to think you are…
Keep your mind open…
I hope you are free before you are 57…
Reply
 
 
 
 Exhausted says:

 August 9, 2015 at 7:03 pm
 
Average Joe
You possess the ability to address one’s senses as to
 Conscience and the harsh reality that reigns supreme in
 The org. I read an article published in a newspaper in
 The land down under which used words that I have never
 Heard before, but the meaning was stupid, in a word.
 the word was gormless. Ever heard that one?
Reply
 
 
 Jake says:

 August 9, 2015 at 11:35 pm
 
To me it all makes perfect sense, the wheat and the weeds, the dragnet, the foolish virgins and who really is?
 Even the false parusisa of 1914 and the attitude of the man of lawlessness all within the organiaztion. The destruction of the holy place in my mind has to be this organisation to root out his presence. I see no conflict.
 Nevertheless whether true or false (above) I cannot agree with the Watchtowers policy’s and the way it has conducted itself and the way it has dealt with children, I see as an arrogant, self serving golden calf.
Reply
 
 
 Jake says:

 August 10, 2015 at 12:08 am
 
There is one thing we can all agree on. The Watchtower society is deluded, in its authority, it’s teaching and its attitude.
Reply
 
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 10, 2015 at 1:16 am
 
After realising that the Watchtower wasn’t going to do anything about the pedophile paradise claims that were going on in the early 2000’s, I lost faith in my religion that I had sacrificed so much for. I knew personally one of the victims who was featured in a tv show, so I knew that all the hype was true. The week that I was feeling like it was all going down the drain, I went witnessing and a lady with three small children took a tract and seemed genuinely interested in what I had to say. That day, I decided enough was enough. How could I attract this lady into a pedophile paradise with a good conscience. I felt like blabbing to her all I knew. I didn’t as I was pretty gutless then.I decided I’d had enough but I had to go through the painful process of leaving. I think we all get to that point.
Reply
 
 
 Mc fan says:

 August 10, 2015 at 1:44 am
 
Just came in about a half hour ago!!
Governing body member Geoffry Jackson, has been subpoenaed to appear before the royal commission on This coming Friday!!
Reply
 
 Criticus says:

 August 10, 2015 at 9:53 am
 
Yeeeeeeeah! Now, the butter comes to the fish, as say the Germans – or will this maybe prove to be just another barrel bust? Let’s see. In any case, Geoffrey might be “excited” – good for him. In this way, his otherwise drab homeward journey gets some sizzling little twist.
Reply
 
 
 Chiafade says:

 August 10, 2015 at 4:37 pm
 
Oh my! Will we be getting a Gerrit Losch repeat of “I don’t answer to anyone”? Or will Bro. Jackson actually appear and offer an unlikely apology? Wow I can’t wait for Friday.
Reply
 
 
 
 Ted says:

 August 10, 2015 at 3:57 am
 
Presiding judge, Mclelland challenged WT chief O’Brien, regarding
 the stupid ( My word ) 2 witness rule. Saying it was obligatory to
 report abuse to elders, but then it couldn’t be believed for lack of
 said witnesses, resulting in more suffering for the victim.
O’Brien was confounded, he could only answer its in the Bible, Jesus
 approved it (or words to that effect ). The judge then asked, has society
 not moved on ? he then cited slavery among early Christians. Paul’s
 words about slaves being obedient to masters were mentioned.
Oh! it wasn’t slavery in the way we understand it, said O’Brien, they
 were treated kindly. ( Whenever there’s something abhorrent in their
 revered book they always try to sanitise it, tone it down.)
Judge Mclelland was unmoved, “It’s still slavery” ! he replied./ Who
 could fail to agree with him? Even the words, Master and Slave
 are disgusting to any decent and sound “Thinking” person.
This is the big mistake JWs make, attempting to build a defence
 on Iron Age Writings that are clearly not due to the influence of
 a supreme intelligence. But are full of errors, and can be made
 to mean almost anything you want them to mean.
Further embarrassment is inevitable.
Reply
 
 
 Average Joe says:

 August 10, 2015 at 5:51 am
 
@Excelsior & Exhausted
 Thanks for your kind words. I do indeed find myself in a difficult situation, much like Cedars has passed through in the beginning, and it is not a pleasant one.
 I’m trying to do the best I can and it’s nice to know that you folks can see my predicament. My wife feels the same as me on the child abuse issues but won’t have a bad word said about the GB. I want to make sure that the steps I’m taking are well measured and with causing the less hurt possible to my brothers & sisters who deserve to know the truth about this whole can of worms.
 I have been pleasantly surprised up to now how well the ones I have spoken to on the whole have seen what a sad situation this is. Plus, credit where credit is due, they have also been looking at the info on the Royal Commission site, including the secret policy letters. The ball has started rolling (as it has I hope in congregations all over the world) and whilst it is moving slowly, I can imagine it picking up pace very soon now.
 Let’s hope that Geoff Jackson sees sense and appears before the board. In the eyes of those that almost “worship” the GB (yes I have family that fall into that category) that would be the best thing to happen to them to burst their bubble. He will then finally get to prove to the world what kind of man he is: will he side with the rest of the GB and try and cover all this up or will he admit their gross failings and try and make amends? It looks like it could be a very exciting week!
Reply
 
 
 Average Joe says:

 August 10, 2015 at 6:10 am
 
@Idontknowwhattodo
 Sorry, I forgot to include you in my comment above.
 I can wholeheartedly assure you that I KNOW women are my equal and are NOT second class citizens. Being brought up by my mum on her own taught me that! 😉
Reply
 
 Pickled brain says:

 August 11, 2015 at 2:05 am
 
@ Average Joe. I have enjoyed all your posts & am in the same situation with my wife worshipping the GB who can do no wrong. But I am determined to work on the inside by letting subtle comments slip into conversations with family JWs & friends. Most will stubbornly defend the GB but this is a natural defensive mechanism considering the AWFUL REALISATION the Wasted Years of being CONNED by 7 men in Brooklyn who CHOP & CHANGE interpretation of Scriptural doctrine (Generation;F&D Slave,Gog & Magog; Sheep& Goats, Organ transplants ,etc)3,4,5 times !! Then the GB can change interpretation 6,7,8 times!! I think many would end up having a MENTAL BREAKDOWN if they accepted that The GB are ALL FRAUDS!! But I believe the Truth MUST Come out to STOP FUTURE GENERATIONS not Wasting their Lives on the SACRIFICIAL ALTAR of the WATCHTOWER PUBLISHING & PROPERTY EMPIRE!!
Reply
 
 
 Idontknowhatodo says:

 August 11, 2015 at 2:53 am
 
I understand you do not consider women second class…but as a woman brought up as a jw from birth I sit in a kingdom Hall listening to men telling me what I can and cannot do…and realise that in the organisation you support women have no voice…that is why these vile abusers have gone unrevealed and unpunished for so long…Im like you to an extent…except I believe none of it anymore but would lose everything including my children if I left…so I have chosen as advised by many to play a role and slowly fade…it is hard beyond belief…but losing everything would be worse…I totally agree with what your doing…but asan elder how hard is it to carry on enforcing the dictates of these men who are perpetuating such misery…abuse…sexism…mysogyny…shunning…I am heartsick…it is quite agonising…I hope you stay clear of those who will most definitely come for you…I want you to prevail…I want that for my children…who are all young…in thier 20s and 30s.
Reply
 
 Pickled brain says:

 August 11, 2015 at 2:29 pm
 
@Idontknowwhattodo. YOUR COMMENTS are ABSOLUTELY BRILLIANT & Encapsulates Exactly what many sisters in the organisation must really feel but are too scared to speak out for FEAR of losing Family & friends which is understandable!! My heart goes out to you But we must all try to in our own way to try & save our future generations from being sucked into this high control group of 7 deluded men of the GB or are they Deluded or just power MAD???
Reply
 
 
 Chiafade says:

 August 12, 2015 at 6:32 am
 
Don’t lose hope. I am in my 30’s, serving in an appointmented capacity, and yet here I am. Your slow fade and gently introducing these developments in Australia may very wake your children up to the reality that all is NOT well in the spiritual paradise.
When I heard Tony Morris during the branch visit it sparked something in me that had been lingering for some time. Unreasonable rantings and rule making negating peoples ability to make a decision based on their conscience was very troubling. It still took a couple of months after that to start my investigation on what is really going on in the organization. It still shocks me but I’m still young enough to make a decent life for myself and my family even after spending 15 years broke as a pioneer with no savings. All the while, new properties are being built with mostly free labor and the senior citizen GB get to retire comfortably.
These things are plain to see. They are not hidden. Your children may come to see that.
Reply
 
 
 
 
 Wip it says:

 August 11, 2015 at 8:13 pm
 
is it any different from the other churches using hell fire to keep people in line, the only difference is they don’t dis-fellowship & destroy families, it is a trap, i still attend under false pretense & play the game, but no more door to door, as i have said i can’t sell the product anymore.
Reply
 
 Pickled brain says:

 August 11, 2015 at 9:15 pm
 
@Wip it . I agree with you ,what is the difference between Hellfire & a FIERY Destruction at Armageddon & NEVER seeing Family & Friends Again!! IT IS STILL the FEAR CARD the Watchtower is Playing just like the CatHOLICS !!!
Reply
 
 
 
 Wip it says:

 August 13, 2015 at 6:50 pm
 
Hi Average Joe, i am surprised an active elder is on this site, i am a former elders/ms, 20 years service & still go to meetings, if Elders in my congregation or anywhere else knew, i believe i would be treated as an apostate, i have a question for you, how do you reconcile 607 being the wrong year, history doesn’t stack up to it, & that throws all the rest out, sorry but its the main thing that has destroyed me, as well as the child abuse stuff
Reply
 
 
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← Reflecting on the Australian Royal Commission (Day 3, Part 1)
An apology, and update on what’s in store for JWsurvey →
 
Royal Commission’s Angus Stewart accuses Watchtower representative of deliberate deception
Posted on August 10, 2015

Branch committee coordinator Terrence O'Brien was accused of intentionally trying to mislead the Commission
Branch committee coordinator Terrence O’Brien was accused of intentionally trying to mislead the Commission

This is the latest summary of the Royal Commission in Australia by non-disfellowshipped JWsurvey reader “CovertFade,” who is standing in for the JWsurvey writing team as we process the fast-paced events “down under”…
The closing moments of Day 7 of the Royal Commission’s investigation into Watchtower’s child abuse procedures saw some heavyweights from Watchtower’s Australia branch face up to some brutal questioning by the Commission’s Senior Council, Angus Stewart.
At one point the following remarkable exchange took place in which Terrence O’Brien, the coordinator of the Australia Branch, is accused of deliberately trying to deceive the commission in an apparent attempt to protect Governing Body member Geoffrey Jackson from being called to give evidence.
◾Mr Angus Stewart SC: Mr O’Brien, you have given evidence that you gave instructions to counsel on the point of Mr Jackson not being able to assist and his activities being in relation to translations. I, as a matter of fairness, must put to you that those instructions you gave were false, were they not?
◾Terrence O’Brien: No, I don’t believe so. Mr Jackson does oversee the translation work, but as part of the writing committee member, which he is one of the Governing Body members on that committee. So —
◾Stewart. And I suggest to you, or I put to you, that when you gave those instructions, you knew them to be false?
◾O’Brien. No. I disagree.
◾Stewart: And by giving those instructions, you sought to mislead the Royal Commission, to protect Mr Jackson from any potential summons to appear?
◾O’Brien: No, I disagree. I think the reason we asked consideration to be shown to Mr Jackson was the grave situation of his father – the very reason he is in Australia.
◾Stewart: Yes, and in relation to that, in view of what I have put to you, perhaps you can answer this: how are we to know if what you say about Mr Jackson’s compassionate circumstances is, in fact, true?
Attempting to mislead a Royal Commission is a criminal offense. If charged and convicted, Mr O’Brien could face a fine of up to $20,000 and up to five years in prison. So how on earth did the normally legally-savvy Watchtower manage to put itself in a situation where the head of its Australia branch was caught out in such a clumsy lie? Especially when the previous six days of testimonial curb-stomping clearly demonstrated that the Commission team was very smart, very aware of Watchtower’s inner workings, and quite prepared to examine matters with a fine tooth comb until it uncovered the truth.
Well, with hindsight, one can see the answer, and it revolves around the Cult Of Personality that the Watchtower has recently started to build around its Governing Body.
By Day 5, it was clear that a number of aspects of Watchtower’s handling of child abuse were seriously troubling the Commission. They included the two witness rule, the all-male nature of the judicial process, allowing a guilty-but-reproved offender to remain in the same environment as his victim with no real sanction, and more.
It was also clear that Watchtower considered these policies unchangeable due to their supposed scriptural basis, and that it was eagerly offering concessions in some lesser areas while carefully trying to sneak the weightier matters of concern out of the Commission’s spotlight unaltered.
The logical conclusion being drawn by the Commission was that they simply had to talk to the Governing Body. Ordinarily, this would be impossible; the seven members of the Governing Body reside in Brooklyn USA and as such are beyond the Australian Commission’s reach.
However, it transpired that Governing Body member Geoffrey Jackson had actually been in Australia since early July. The Commission made two separate approaches to Watchtower to organize testimony. Watchtower replied to the effect that Mr Jackson was in Australia for private, compassionate reasons and, also, that since the Governing Body was not involved in the implementation and administration of policies and procedures in relation to child sexual abuse, he would not be able to give relevant evidence.
The idea that a Governing Body member would not be able to give relevant evidence in this matter is absurd. Yet it should be noted that this fits a pattern of behavior. Gerrit Losch also refused to appear in defense of the organization’s child abuse policies in a US civil action the previous year. Nonetheless it appears the Commission was content at that point to let the matter go, and did not issue a summons. (It is important to note that refusing a summons to a Royal Commission is a criminal offense than can carry a sentence of up to six months imprisonment.)
However, by Day 6 it was clear that not only was the Commission realizing no meaningful change was possible without Governing Body sanction, but also that Watchtower was pulling out all the stops to firewall Jackson. My theory is that Watchtower Australia was given strict orders from Brooklyn that under no circumstances was Jackson to be summoned.
The damage to the cult of having one of the illustrious seven Faithful and Discreet Slave members, together comprising a revered mouthpiece of God, cut to dry-mouthed ribbons under examination as to his support for indefensible child abuse policies, was too awful a scenario for them to permit.
Nowhere was this more obvious than in the Day 6 testimony of Senior Service Desk Elder Rodney Spinks.
In the context of what we now know, it’s clear Spinks was tasked to mislead the Commission into believing Watchtower Australia had the authority to implement any changes the Commission might recommend, and thus shield Jackson from involvement. He does this in a manner that would make some of the most slippery political spin-masters green with envy. Let’s look at “Slippery Spinks” in action as he answers a simple, direct question. (By the way, the simple, direct answer to the question is: Yes we would need permission from the Governing Body.)
◾Mr Angus Stewart SC: But if you are to publish something new which sets out how child sexual abuse allegations are to be dealt with within congregations in Australia, would you need to get the clearance or the go-ahead from the Governing Body that what you have set out is fine, because it is not in conflict with the scriptures?
◾Spinks: I think the documents would show that we correspond openly with the Governing Body on matters of interpretation. I think my point is clear, that if recommendations from this Commission, and some things that we can obviously see ourselves – so, for example, if there is a legal requirement, whether it’s because of mandatory reporting or because of a criminal law that is less familiar to me than you, but if there are legal implications and we are working outside of those, you can be certain that an adjustment will be made here in Australia and a document produced relative to Australia, including collating those, as you see it – and correctly so – references from decades, that would be better into a single document tailored for the law, the culture, the expectation here in Australia. Absolutely.
◾Stewart: And you would only do that through engagement with the Governing Body?
◾Spinks: That’s – as many things could be done here in Australia, what I’m saying is we have such great respect for the Governing Body, we would have no issue at all with corresponding with them back and forward. I am confident there would be no issue, if we don’t stray from the scriptures, that they are happy for each branch committee – remembering that those members of the Governing Body are simply, as well, unpaid members of the organization that are selected from elders from different countries. So that’s not the issue. The issue is: is it in harmony with the scriptures and is it appropriate here in Australia. And the Australia branch committee would have that.
Notice how Spinks tries to dance around a simple and truthful “yes” every time, never quite telling an outright lie but still giving the false impression that the Australia branch can give the Commission everything it wants and thus there is no need to trouble Jackson.
During Day 6, the question of Jackson’s participation again comes up, and this extremely significant exchange takes place between Justice McClellan and the Watchtower Legal Council, Mr Tokley (bold is mine):
◾Justice McClellan: Now, these are very significant issues. They are not small issues, they are significant issues. At the moment, we are, as I say, facing the situation where we can see a problem, but we do need assistance from the church in what is the solution. We rather thought that Mr Jackson might be able to assist us in that respect. I understand the reason for compassion being extended to him. I have no difficulty with that. And for that reason, I have not issued a summons requiring him to attend. But at the moment we face a serious issue with which only the church can help us. Whether that needs a response now, I don’t know, but we would like you to reflect upon that situation.
◾Mr Tokley: Your Honour, may I respond on behalf of the persons I represent. Your Honour’s points are being taken on board, are being addressed, and are being given the most earnest consideration by the authorities. Mr Jackson would probably not have been of any assistance in any event, because his role and his responsibility is in relation to the translation of matters; it’s not in relation to these sorts of matters.
Remember that specific wording. That’s going to come back in a big way. Watchtower has just set something in motion that cannot be undone.
As Day 6 ends, it’s clear that Slippery Spinks has failed to protect Jackson. The Commission is clearly unconvinced. But it’s Day 7 when the wheels spectacularly come off the wagon for Watchtower Australia. During examination of the first witness of the day (Vince Toole, the elder in charge of the Legal Desk) the Commission submits a piece of previously unseen evidence.
◾Mr Angus Stewart SC: You say your understanding is that the branch committee members are equals. One of them is actually designated coordinator, is that not right?
◾Toole. Yes, I think he’s the coordinator of the – of the branch committee.
◾Stewart: And that designation or responsibility also is an appointment by the Governing Body?
◾Toole: I believe so, but I’m not absolutely certain – but I believe so. I’m sorry I don’t have a lot of information on that, but I just – I’ve never been involved.
◾Stewart: There are other copies coming shortly, but I’d just like to show you – there’s a copy for you – a document. You see it’s headed “Branch Organisation Effective December 15, 1977, Revised February 2003″. It says “This material in Branch Organisation –being the name of the publication –should not be copied or duplicated except with the permission of the Branch Committee.” It’s published in the USA, I understand, by the Governing Body. Have you seen this publication before?
Yes, for reasons that will come to light in a future JWsurvey article, the Royal Commission managed to obtain a copy of the Branch Handbook. If you thought the elders handbook was hard to obtain, that’s nothing compared to the Branch Handbook.
If the elders handbook is all about running a congregation, then the Branch Handbook is all about running a multi-million dollar worldwide corporation, and details, among other things, the full responsibilities of the Governing Body – the same Governing Body Watchtower Australia is desperately trying to insist has no say in the issue.
The day continues. Toole disgraces himself in his own special way during testimony, and also frantically tries to avoid giving straight answers as to the role of the Governing Body. Yet finally he is done, and Watchtower Australia’s big cheese, Terrance O’Brien, takes the stand.
Keep in mind what has happened up to now. Previous elders have been frantically spinning the narrative that Jackson is not needed, yet the Commission is clearly deeply suspicious, and most critically of all, Watchtower legal council has officially stated that Jackson’s role is limited “to the translations of matters.” To back away now would expose their deceit, and lead to possible criminal charges. But at the same time, it’s clear the Commission have all the evidence they need to see through the ruse. They have the Branch Handbook for crying out loud!
This is the no-win situation confronting O’Brien as he takes the stand, on an international live webcast, to face Mr Angus Stewart Senior Council, who has previously made mincemeat of every elder placed before him (even Slippery Spinks) and who now possesses the very publication that tells O’Brien how his own organization works.



The transcript records Stewart using the Handbook to establish Jackson’s role spanning multiple committees, including the writing committee and the teaching committee, both of which have direct involvement in the Commission’s area of interest. Then, the final nail in the coffin:
◾Stewart: I understand that you have not served as a member of the Governing Body, so I’m asking you from what your understanding is. But your understanding is that the seven members of the Governing Body, as a Governing Body, meet weekly, do they, every Wednesday?
◾O’Brien: Yes, so those who are present meet weekly.
◾Stewart. It will be that Governing Body as a whole, or those who are present, who would authorize the various publications and guides and guidelines, and so on; is that right?
◾O’Brien:. They would give the final approval for the publishing of them, yes.
◾Stewart: You will have heard yesterday that senior counsel representing the Jehovah’s Witnesses in Australia and the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society of Australia said that Mr Jackson would not be likely to be able to assist this Commission, because his role is in the translation of matters. Now, that, do you accept, is in clear variance to what you have explained in your evidence?
Think about it. What would you do? Admit the truth and your previous deception, or keep trying to deceive, even though it’s clear that the evidence to disprove your testimony is literally resting in the hands of your opponent? O’Brien makes his choice. Stick with the lie.
◾O’Brien No – sorry, it’s not. The translation, it comes under the writing committee, as I understand, which is what Mr Jackson is a member of.
 Stewart: But he’s also the coordinator of the teaching committee that has many other responsibilities, and not translation – not so?
◾O’Brien Yes, he – as a member of the Governing Body, he has a number —
◾Stewart. So can you explain, Mr O’Brien, how it came about that senior counsel representing the organization was given instructions that Mr Jackson’s role is confined to the translation of matters, when it clearly is not?
Finally! It took two solid days of testimony, of dancing around the issue by various senior elders, and dogged persistence by the Royal Commission to establish an answer to the simple question of: What does Geoffrey Jackson do? Two Days!
It’s not over yet. When Justice McClellan next speaks, the webcast audio records a softness to his tone that underscores that severity of the situation more than a raised voice ever could.
◾Justice McClellan: Mr O’Brian, did you give those instructions to senior counsel?
◾O’Brien: The instructions regarding Mr Jackson?
◾McClellan: Yes.
◾O’Brien: Yes.
◾McClellan: It led me to believe that there was little that Jackson could add to the discussion, and no doubt that is what you expected would happen; is that right?
◾O’Brien: That’s true, and I still concur with that.
◾McClellan: Well, I’m starting to form a totally different impression, I have to tell you.
The day ends on Watchtower’s worst case scenario: Justice McClellan issues a summons for Geoffrey Jackson. What will the fallout be?
At the time of writing, it is unknown if O’Brien will face charges. On the surface it would appear the case against him is compelling, and it’s clear both Mr Stewart and Justice McClellan viewed O’Brien’s misdirection seriously. Additionally, it’s clear this was part of a strategy of misdirection employed by every Branch-level elder who testified. Yet even if all involved escape legal sanction, the fact of their deception is preserved online for all the world to see.
Google doesn’t forget.
What of Jackson? He has three options.
1.Refuse to appear before the Commission, stay in the country to look after his reportedly dying father and go to prison.
2.Appear before the Commission and take part in the worst PR debacle the cult has even seen.
3.Refuse to appear, flee the country and make it clear to the world that he is so scared of the Commission he will even abandon his dying father to avoid testimony.
There is one final irony. As mentioned, the witness preceding O’Brien was Watchtower Australia’s top lawyer, Vince Toole. During his testimony, the concept of theocratic warfare was directly put to him:
◾Ms David: In the Watchtowers in 1957 and 1960, have you heard they say that: “As a soldier of Christ, you are in theocratic warfare and you must exercise added caution when dealing with God’s foes. Thus the scriptures show that for the purpose of protecting the interests of God’s cause it is proper to hide the truth from God’s enemies.” Have you heard of that?
◾Toole: No, and I’ve never read 1957 magazine articles, I’m sorry. I only became a Jehovah’s Witness in 1972.
◾Ms David: But, as a lawyer, you would be aware of such concepts, wouldn’t you – that you can lie to protect Jehovah’s name?
◾Toole: (Visibly angry) We are truthful. To be a Christian, you have to be truthful.
Maybe O’Brien didn’t get the memo?
 
CovertFade
 
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← Reflecting on the Australian Royal Commission (Day 3, Part 1)
An apology, and update on what’s in store for JWsurvey →
 
455 Responses to Royal Commission’s Angus Stewart accuses Watchtower representative of deliberate deception



Newer Comments →
 
 Keith says:

 August 10, 2015 at 2:52 am
 
Inciteful, well written, just beautiful!
 Thank you again.
 Keith and Gail
Reply
 
 
 William Niles says:

 August 10, 2015 at 3:23 am
 
I wonder what must be going through the minds of JWs, around the world, who are watching all of this?!? It has simply got to be “faith shattering” for at least some of them. Mr.Jackson of the Governing Body is all to aware of the fact that JWs around the world are watching this too…the heat is on. If the Royal Commission sense/see in any way, shape or form that Jackson tries to lie & deceive them, there’s no question that he will go to Prison along with the other Elders who have already committed these acts of perjury. It could possibly be that WTs worst nightmares are about to come true….
Reply
 
 Darlene says:

 August 10, 2015 at 4:42 am
 
I think the average JW brain just goes into lock-down. The Royal Commision is set up from Satan, is Gog of Magog, attacking true religion, thus the JW’s must have the truth because prophecy is fullfilled etc.
It’s sad, but I don’t think that this will serve as a wakeup call for most JW’s. They WANT to believe, they DON’T want to come to the realisation that they were mislead. Not even over such a serious matter as child abuse cover-up.
Reply
 
 Chiafade says:

 August 10, 2015 at 5:16 am
 
I agree Darlene. The majority of witnesses would just dismiss this issue and say that “Jehovah will clear this up his name is involved”. This they’ll say without giving thought to the fact that, and I’ll say this as a currently active witness, we are supposed to be defenders of said name. Yet the governing body has twice staunchly REFUSED to do just that. It’s unjustifiable, indefensible, and disgusting.
If as Mr. Toole pointed out “we are truthful” then what’s to be afraid of? The truth doesn’t need to hide does it? This whole case is just disturbing. It should give pause to ANY active witness giving money and time to this organization. Sadly as you said Darlene many will just shut their minds off and go into defense mode. This is what they have been indoctrinated to do. “You can’t trust the worldy news media you know who is in control of them” or “its a worldy court of law of course they are going to attack God’s people!” Never mind the fact that the royal commission is justifiably questioning and hopefully penalizing watchtower for its negligence and lack of cooperation.
I would like to see one of these elders try to get away with their line of reasoning on a judicial committee. Thank you covert fade for this well written and informative article.
Reply
 
 Dan says:

 August 10, 2015 at 10:53 am
 
Agree with both of you, but, not all will fall for this line of thinking, only the desperate ones will and though that may be many, its not all of them, i think many of JWs will see through these lies and start thinking for themselves, mark my words, doubt will be planted in many
Reply
 
 
 
 holy Connoli says:

 August 11, 2015 at 5:42 am
 
Darlewne. I agree the average JW will feel they are being persecuted. In fact my wife is a JW and she gets mad at me when I bring this stuff up and believe me I do bring it up quite often. I have others in my family who are JW’s as well and they all deny it is a problem. They say yes, we have child molestation but it is exaggerated and being publicized by APOSTATES that hate us. They are like Robots overall. There are some that will see what is going on but most will keep their blinders on. It is hard to admit something you gave your life to was misleading you and not truthful all the years you were giving your life to it.
 I wish it would be a Worldwide awakening but it appears at this time they just keep being sheeple.
Reply
 
 
 
 Jaak says:

 August 10, 2015 at 4:55 am
 
Most jw do not know about this or any lawsuit.
 I know many of them and none of them knows about it.
They refuse to read in to it, yes this is haw strong the indoctrination really is.
I’m living in Belgium, maybe this is different in other parts of the world?
Reply
 
 Chiafade says:

 August 10, 2015 at 5:24 am
 
No its not any different here in the U.S. I can tell you that. Most witnesses are abysmally ignorant of the many child abuse cases over here. As a matter of fact many don’t watch or read the news. They prefer the fluff in the watchtower or JW.org which is precisely what the gb wants. It’s been said from the platform on more than one occasion “stay away from the news” “don’t watch the news” and we all know how that becomes law in a witness mind. I remember bringing up many disturbing things and the response was “I don’t worry about that stuff half of it ain’t true anyway”. Makes you want to pull your hair out.
Reply
 
 Larry Long says:

 August 10, 2015 at 7:01 pm
 
Agree completely with your comments. Haven’t seen any coverage of the commission hearings in the US. When trying to show my wife the information she just quotes Letts and tight pants Tony about how wonderful the ORG is in handling child abuse. So sad!!!
Reply
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 11, 2015 at 1:43 am
 
I live in Australia and apart from the initial media coverage at the start, there is not much on the news about it. But that doesn’t mean that the average JW doesn’t know about it. The feedback I am getting from an in-law’s relative who is still in it is that some are saying it is disturbing and others are saying it is persecution. Still, they are talking about it and they must know it is currently going on. CNN did a very good coverage and I believe these reports went pretty much everywhere. I think the general mood around from people outside the Watchtower is that they have got major problems in their ranks. Really, I think they have lost their credibility and it is sure to get worse as time goes on.

 
 
 Chiafade says:

 August 11, 2015 at 9:32 am
 
What is mind boggling is that under legal matters in JW.org there is not even a blip of information regarding this case in Australia. All you’ll find are stories that Paint the witnesses as victims of religious persecution in other countries such as Azerbaijan or Russia banning the JW.org site.
I certainly think that this qualifies as a LEGAL matter and it is something all JWs should be aware of. This is especially the case because of the possible financial culpability the watchtower may receive. Culpability that the rank and file witness will be expected to pay through donations. Even more disgusting is the fact that they will not cease any of the building work to help pay for these legal penalties. The average witness will just be asked to pay for both. “It’s all for Jahs praise brothers”.

 
 
 
 Chris Benson says:

 August 11, 2015 at 4:51 am
 
Yep true Jaak
 Watchtower got a firm grip on their sheep due to keeping them very busy and telling them to only visit JW.ORG.
 I think every little helps as Tescos in the UK would say so where ever you are in the World if you can possibly bring it up to them at their carts or if you see them round your neighbourhood about what is presently going on it would help to wake them up and bring on a snowball effect
 You could mention its before the Royal Commission Jackson may have to appear and its been on CNN news and take your mobile phone with you to show them the relevant video clip as proof
Reply
 
 
 
 RC says:

 August 10, 2015 at 5:40 am
 
It is the same here in India as well. I had asked my cousin who is trapped inside the cult whether he knew of any significant developments in JW and he was ignorant. When i tried to inform him he said that they were unverified lies coming from Satan. Sigh wonder when he will wake up.
Reply
 
 questionall451 says:

 August 10, 2015 at 6:57 am
 
I’ve been pitching it to relatives like, “Hey, did you hear about all the “persecution” the brothers are under in Australia? They’re facing possible fines or jail time.” This naturally makes them want to at least look into what is going on over there.
Reply
 
 StrongHaiku says:

 August 10, 2015 at 7:15 am
 
Just wanted to say that your approach in couching it “persecution” to peak their interest is brilliant. Nicely done.

 
 
 RunFromTheTower says:

 August 10, 2015 at 9:19 am
 
Good angle to present it. Hopefully,they’ll be moved to watch the hearing.

 
 
 
 
 
 Bart says:

 August 10, 2015 at 8:58 am
 
My faith has been shattered for some time now.
Reply
 
 Cuthbert says:

 August 10, 2015 at 10:28 am
 
@ Bart,
That’s a good thing. Faith is silly and infantile anyways. Count yourself lucky.
Reply
 
 
 
 Chris Benson says:

 August 11, 2015 at 3:56 am
 
But how many current JWs are aware this is all going on? I think unfortunately that only a very limited few know about it
 I say this because over the last week Ive spoken to approx 7 different JWs at 2 different locations and none of them had a clue about it
Reply
 
 
 Chris Benson says:

 August 11, 2015 at 4:25 am
 
i wish that bloke who wrote crisis of conscience was still alive
Reply
 
 
 Criticus says:

 August 11, 2015 at 3:18 pm
 
(2nd attempt to post this)
Well, the GB has already tried to musically prepare the mind of “faithful marching Witnesses” to what is coming. Just note part of the first stanza of the new song 137:
“There are many who oppose us And who try to bring us shame.”
And the 2nd stanza has this:
“Give attention to the threats Of those who persecute and blame.”
To me, that fits perfectly what was going on in the ARC down under.
If GB didn’t know (and we all know they are not inspired, do we; they are VERY bad prophets) what was coming, they must have had some kind of a hunch. They must have felt for quite a while now that something is brewing.You may not yet be seeing the freight train that’s coming your way, as long as it is hidden behind the curve and the hills, but you feel the tracks trembling. And of course, nobody else is “trying to bring shame” to the JW – the shame they are in process of incurring (or which has already been heaped upon them) has been brought upon them by none other than themselves.
Looking forward to Friday; that’ll surely be fun.
Love y’all.
Criticus
Reply
 
 
 
 Mc fan says:

 August 10, 2015 at 4:36 am
 
THIS IS PRICELESS!!!
THE HOUSE OF CARDS HAS BEGUN TO FALL!!
Reply
 
 
 Average Joe says:

 August 10, 2015 at 5:40 am
 
One thing I HATE: double standards. How can you say that you have to be in obedience to the superior authorities (taken from the Bible and in this case refers to the Royal Commission) and actually use them to your advantage (defending the basic human right to meet for worship & preach your ideas etc) and yet at the same time call them objects of Satan and refuse to cooperate with them, especially as they are trying to root out “an evil of our time”?
This is what I as a JW can’t understand. As I’ve always been brought to believe from parents & teachers alike, ‘if you’re innocent then you’ve nothing to worry about’.
I have been using the Royal Commission site as a reference to all my close friends and encouraging them to read the transcripts for themselves.
 I still think that this should get more coverage from reputable sites like the BBC so that more JWs can see for themselves this unfortunate situation.
 It’s making it more complicated than it needs to be: “Have you as an organisation screwed up in regard to child abuse policies?
 Yes, we have and we are sorry.
 Will you allow us to enforce policies that work and suggest how you can compensate the former victims?
 Yes, we will.”
I can see that’s how it SHOULD work so why can’t the GB? If they truly believe in Jehovah and that he wants the best for his organisation then they should just tell the truth and leave things in his hands, including facing up to government imposed sanctions for terrible negligence.
 The more they leave things to carry on like this, the more God’s name is getting dragged through the mud: not due to apostates, not due to disgruntled ex-JWs, not even due to Satan, but rather all thanks to their pride and deception.
Reply
 
 Searcher says:

 August 10, 2015 at 11:18 am
 
I absolutely agree with you, Average Joe! Best as I can logically conclude: If these guys are orchestrating a purposed lie in front of a national government commission for an organization as directed by the organization, then THIS CANNOT BE GOD’S ONE AND ONLY ORGANIZATION HERE ON EARTH. It has proven again that the WTBTS is a fraud and now a purposed liar!!! The truth hurts in this case and the representatives of the JW/WTBTS cannot even come clean. I agree, if they had faith in God, and they truly believed it was God’s organization, then they would be doing everything to rightly and justly resolve these matters as God would set things strait. But no, they can only lie and talk in circles. God’s organization and the GB is the true mouthpiece of god? MY BIG BUTT ON FIRE!!!
Reply
 
 Hakizimana Jean de Dieu says:

 August 10, 2015 at 1:43 pm
 
@Searcher, search from the Bible you’ll find that JW/WTBTS is God’s Organization as you can see… (1 Samuel 15:3) 3 Now go, and strike down the A·malʹek·ites, and devote them to destruction along with all that they have. You must not spare them; you are to put them to death, man as well as woman, child as well as infant, bull as well as sheep, camel as well as donkey.’”
Reply
 
 
 Chiafade says:

 August 10, 2015 at 5:04 pm
 
After just eating a bowl of chili your statement “MY BIG BUTT ON FIRE” made lol hard. Never heard that before. I agree with your other statements as well.
Reply
 
 
 
 
 John Walsh says:

 August 10, 2015 at 5:44 am
 
In the distant past Terry O’Brien would frequently portray himself as having all of the answers to as he would taunt us with the line ‘any question, any subject’ and I must say he was good at covering himself pretty well on so many subjects that he clearly knew nothing about. I mention this because he really does back himself and was and is a sharp thinker.
 I always knew he would go to the top ranks of the JW’s, as at the ripe old age of 25 he was clearly rousing attention. He has been chosen by the upper level since way back, and for good reason, they know exactly what they require in a leader, and he has always fitted that bill to a T in number of ways.
Reply
 
 Chiafade says:

 August 10, 2015 at 5:12 pm
 
It just goes to show you that even the best and most prestigious among JWs fail on some of the most basic points of reasoning. If he is as bright as you say though it may also indicate the extant he is willing to go to protect the organization. Even to his own detriment.
 The reasonableness of the royal commission stands in stark contrast to the watchtower representatives.
Reply
 
 
 
 John Walsh says:

 August 10, 2015 at 6:01 am
 
And a personal message to Terry O’Brien in response to his manipulative approach in trying to protect a governing boy member from answering to the RC. Two words you know exactly what they refer back to in 1980, and your day out preaching. `NO PLEASE’, and your performance on day seven was a copy of your opponents performance on that day 1980.
 Unreasonable argument – persistent defence of same.
Reply
 
 
 GratefulThinker says:

 August 10, 2015 at 6:16 am
 
At the risk of possibly upsetting some people, I’m still going to say this: It’s like listening to the perverse testimony at the Nuremberg Trials all over again…”Just following orders”…”Our superiors know best”. But what is MOST disturbing is that these Elders are completely oblivious to the complete mind control and hive mentality that they’ve been imprisoned by!!
 Any Star Trek fans here?? The Borg!!
 Oh, and not to mention the arrogance and pride of those testifying. They’re not doing themselves or the Borganisation any favours by their haughty responses.
 Exposure of this dangerous, evil, malevolent cult has been a long time coming!!
Reply
 
 
 Everyday Explorer says:

 August 10, 2015 at 6:30 am
 
Brilliant reporting and analysis, CovertFade.
I am so glad that GB member Geoffrey Jackson has received a summons to the Commission. Well done to the Commission for seeing through the jaw-dropping duplicity (‘theocratic warfare’, my *&!&*!), of the WT.
The WT’s heinous lack of safeguarding of children and vulnerable people in its organisation has to change. The momentum is unstoppable now — and about time.
Reply
 
 
 Carlos says:

 August 10, 2015 at 7:40 am
 
It has been confirmed, that governing body member Geoffrey Jackson will appear this Friday 8-14-15 at the Royal Commission.
http://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/2015/08/10/jehovahs-boss-appear-abuse-inquiry
Reply
 
 Jill Hileman says:

 August 10, 2015 at 8:12 am
 
Thanks Carlos for the update! I also enjoy the article’s title…
Reply
 
 
 RunFromTheTower says:

 August 10, 2015 at 9:09 am
 
HUGE! IF he indeed does show up. More of the curtain will be pulled back on this cult.
Look forward with anticipation to hearing his testimony. A. Stewart, and the entire ARC, have been nails during this entire process.
Theocratic Warfare from the WT will be seen once again.
Reply
 
 
 Chiafade says:

 August 10, 2015 at 5:16 pm
 
Unprecedented if he actually does show up! I’ll believe it when I see it. I can’t wait until Friday! I may skip work.
Reply
 
 
 
 Rae says:

 August 10, 2015 at 8:16 am
 
The point about hiding the truth, or even lying to protect God (the Society) was revisited upon the elders ( if not also the publishers, which I believe it was) by the Society in the 80’s and even into the 90’s. For a lawyer to say he has no recollection concerning such statements… well… I’m really at a loss how to comment.
From my personal experience when I was an elder, we were trained to protect the Society (including the governing body) from any kind of inflammatory attack, even if it should cost us prison time or fines. Any faithful elder believed that Satan was wielding his evil power against God’s agents, and it was our duty to protect Mother.
As for child abuse cases. Sad to say the two witness rule was strictly applied in most cases… even with repeat offenders. Fortunately for me, I never sat a committee dealing with child sexual abuse, but was on one where parent neglect drove a young teen female into the arms of a predator. True, it was in the early 80’s, a different time back then, enlightenment and understanding concerning such issues having grown in the medical and social communities since then.
Still, there was no guidance from the Society other than to treat a young teen like an adult… protecting others in the flock by keeping to congregation ‘clean’… and not to look into underlying matters for a child’s actions. Let the chips fall where they may, so to speak. Love and mercy often meted out by the whip.
From my experiences with judicial cases, the Society kept a ‘hands clean’ approach, making the untrained elders cast the stones in judgment so that if anything later hit the fan the Society could be absolved by accusing the elders for mishandling the problem. “Circle the wagons about Mother”.
Sadly, I couldn’t see those things at the time, and it’s only been through reflection that I’ve come to understand the unloving cruelty I helped dispense at times feeling it was God’s will.
Reply
 
 Bart says:

 August 10, 2015 at 11:04 am
 
I wish my dad, who’s been an elder for all of my 30+ years, could see things the way so many of us do now. On the other hand, if he ever did, it would crush him, so part of me just wants him to be happy doing what he’s doing for the rest of his life, even if it has indirectly torn our family apart.
Reply
 
 Bart says:

 August 10, 2015 at 11:07 am
 
The longer you serve as a Witness, the more you have at stake. That’s why you see so much blindness, because people do not want to admit the possibility that they have devoted their whole life and sacrificed so much for a religion that is inherently flawed just like all the rest.
Reply
 
 
 
 trv says:

 August 10, 2015 at 12:31 pm
 
Thank you Rae. Your open and revealing observations serve others trying to escape this awful organization. I left in 2013 after further changes to the NWT (the removal of verses that had been present for more than 2000 years,…that harmed no person ever). These taught a lesson of love and mercy exercised by no other than God’s own son! I have been struggling ever since trying to deprogram, wow it has been work! This organization has damaged countless thousands if not a millions, most of them even oblivious to it. Your reporting really helps me and I know it helps all others who have become disillusioned for various reasons. Thank you.
Reply
 
 
 Excelsior! says:

 August 11, 2015 at 8:04 am
 
Rae,
The good news is that you can see what you did was wrong now. We all have regrets and things we did as JWs that we are ashamed of.
The fact that you are here contributing to this discussion speaks volumes of your moral compass. Good for you, Rae!
Peace be with you, Excelsior!
Reply
 
 
 
 Joe says:

 August 10, 2015 at 8:18 am
 
This whole case is proving to be dynamite. I am a current JW and am ashamed of the blatant evasiveness, unreasonableness and outright lies of these men who blindly follow and defend the governing body no matter what. If they thought they could pull the wool over the eyes of the RC, they have made an enormous mistake that will come back to haunt them.
I have been glued to the videos over the past few days whilst attending the regional assembly in Glasgow. As I watched Mark Sanderson give his talks, my mind would drift in and out of what was happening in Australia. This has got to be one of the biggest events happening since the crisis/witch hunt at Bethel in 1981.
Reply
 
 RunFromTheTower says:

 August 10, 2015 at 9:32 am
 
Joe I believe you’re right on with your assumption of this matter related to the 81′ “apostasy” purge. If not much worse. Unlike the star chamber tribunals which occurred in 81′, this is being televised and saved on YouTube for generations to come.
The outcome of this hearing could prove financially fatal. The ARC has already stated they expect to receive redress funds from each of the institutions based on the number of claims each institution has against them. No doubt, future child abuse cases will refer to this hearing as a basis to establish redress.
Reply
 
 
 Excelsior! says:

 August 11, 2015 at 8:08 am
 
Joe,
Thanks for your comment. It gives me hope when I read comments from good hearted current JWs like your good self.
We have had to endure many, many comments from JW apologists in the past, and it’s great that current Witnesses are agreeing with out demand for justice and compensation for the many victims of paedophilia in the WTBTS. Thank you for strengthening my faith in human kindness, Joe!
Peace be with you, Excelsior!
Reply
 
 
 
 lejusticiermasque says:

 August 10, 2015 at 8:32 am
 
It’s confirmed ! Can’t wait until Friday..
The Royal Commission’s public hearing into the Jehovah’s Witnesses will recommence in Sydney on Friday 14 August 2015 at 11:00am.
It is anticipated that the hearing will hear from one witness, Mr Geoffrey Jackson, a member of the Governing Body of Jehovah’s Witnesses.
http://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/media-centre/media-releases/2015-08/public-hearing-into-the-jehovah%E2%80%99s-witnesses-to-rec
Reply
 
 ScotWm says:

 August 10, 2015 at 5:41 pm
 
RE: “It’s confirmed ! Can’t wait until Friday..”
Governing Body member Gerrit “I Do Not Answer To Watchtower” Lösch blew off a summons to testify in a child abuse trial, which resulted in a default judgment against the Watchtower. I am concerned that Geoffrey “He Has No Authority Over Us” Jackson will do the same.
The use of theocratic warfare would allow Jackson to lie and promise to appear even though he really planned to sneak out of the country before Friday. I hope I am wrong, because it would be interesting to hear Jackson lie to the Royal Commission.
http://jwsurvey.org/cedars-blog/i-do-not-answer-to-watchtower-stunning-gerrit-losch-declaration-revealed
Reply
 
 
 
 Lyne says:

 August 10, 2015 at 8:53 am
 
Thank you Cedars for bringing the Australia commission to my inbox! Excellent piece CovertFade, very well written. A pure delight.
Making this available online to anyone daring to listen to their inner gut feeling, to infringe this embedded principle of turning away from any source of information other than that of the authoritarian WT and to read about this Commission’s proceedings is vital.
WT is fearing more than ever reaching the final financial knockout. There are leaks everywhere. They will use this like scoundrels again, when they can’t hide it anymore, to turn it to their advantage to scare JWs into believing the WT’s predictions were right all along, and that the end is very near! So be generous and get your credit cards out. These court matters are very expensive and may land financially fatal penalties.
They have conditioned all JW to protect the GB at the risk of facing justice themselves for lying to protect their abusers. Some may lie in fear of losing their all-expenses-paid honourable and highly-respected position in the org.
The saddest part is the consequences in terms of post-traumatic stress disorder victims of this cult, and especially victims of sexual abuse, will have to live with for the rest of their lives. I think it’s the least of the GB members’ worries right now. It’s way past time to put a definite end to this.
Part of the healing process for the victims is seeing the truth come out. It’s about time fattened enriched WT leaders know a bit about what being stressed and tormented is all about.
Can’t wait to see the next proceedings. What conclusions will the Commission reach and what recommendations will be made. What will change with regards to the law and how will it be possible for authorities to interfere, control and audit what goes on in this and other cults? How to see what is going on behind closed doors? This is very delicate.
As long as people are scared, it is very difficult to get the children out of dangerous situations. Trying to get people aware of the evil of these cults is one huge step towards prevention. Control is a whole other ball game.
Reply
 
 
 Bart says:

 August 10, 2015 at 10:55 am
 
Excellent coverage and writing, @CovertFade
Reply
 
 
 Searcher says:

 August 10, 2015 at 11:31 am
 
This is excellent coverage of the proceeding and I thank CoverFade and Cedars for bringing it to the forum for discussion.
For anyone that is still in the JW cult and not quite sure, then this has to be the final straw to show that the “Truth” isn’t really the truth, that this organization isn’t “God’s only organization here on earth”, and the GB is not “God’s Faithful and Discrete Slave” representative and mouthpiece. I agree with Average Joe that these guys (in Australia and the GB too) would be doing everything they could to expose the truth and not hide or try to deceive. If these leader had true faith and understood that they are God’s chosen ones, would they need to lie and deceive? Wouldn’t they have no fear in setting things right and just? Of course not! They are frauds, and here is proof that they (WTBTS leaders and the GB) know it too.
Unfortunately, people will believe what they want to believe. Those that are heavily invested over the years in this cult will rationalize away these lies and ‘guidance’. They will say, “this is Satan attacking the God’s organization, so the end must be near!” It’s pathetic and pitiful for those in the rank and file. I really feel for those people and how hard it is to accept the fact that their faith was misplaced in these disgusting SNAKES on leaders.
Reply
 
 Searcher says:

 August 10, 2015 at 11:34 am
 
correction: “…SNAKES AS leaders.”
Reply
 
 
 
 Simon Kestral says:

 August 10, 2015 at 11:34 am
 
At least one GB member has said they devote much time to reading WT material, presumably to approve it. So the GB is not doing much writing; WT staff produces the “script” that determines WT policy.
WT staff is a big machine; not even the GB can control it. So I don’t expect much revelation from Jackson’s testimony.
Reply
 
 Excelsior! says:

 August 11, 2015 at 8:10 am
 
Simon,
 I think it was Samuel Herd, but I could be wrong!
Peace be with you, Excelsior!
Reply
 
 
 
 ADRIAN says:

 August 10, 2015 at 11:45 am
 
I agree with most of this report except:
What you failed to mention in regards to O’Brian’s response when asked about how he can prove that what he is saying about Jackson’s dad being sick is in fact true….O’Brian went on to say that they can provide a doctors note and medical records.
 I am anti-watchtower. But, let’s be honest on how we report.
 thx
Reply
 
 anonymous says:

 August 10, 2015 at 1:53 pm
 
Adrian, I read the article again and so should you before you imply that the writer wasn’t being honest. No where in any of these articles was anybody saying that Jackson’s father isn’t ill.
Reply
 
 
 CoverFade says:

 August 10, 2015 at 2:34 pm
 
I think my reply might have gotten eaten by the internet, apologies if it shows up later and this is a shorter repeat.
I understand that point you make Adrian. My use of the quote was intended to show how the commission had come to view O’Brien in terms of his ability to give honest testimony. Whilst it true that he does give the response you cite, it doesn’t really change the overall thrust of the what I intended to show: that they don’t trust him, have ample proof of one deception, and thus don’t feel that they can trust anything else he’s said.
Since Cedars and the team have ensured the full video footage is linked on this website, and other articles on the site also link to the transcripts, I think people can quickly view and put the whole exchange in full context if they wish. I personally don’t feel the context alters the point I was making, but I respect that others might feel differently.
The comments section on an article like this is always a valuable tool, for readers to challenge articles and add extra perspective and depth to coverage if they feel something was lacking. Discussion always illuminates things, and I always welcome it about anything I write. :)
Reply
 
 Dblaron42 says:

 August 10, 2015 at 10:32 pm
 
A prime example of the difference between “mentally diseased” apostates. And the borg… You welcome critical thinking about your articles instead of expecting the reader to just ignore what he/she considers to be inconsistencies.
Great work CF
Reply
 
 
 
 
 rob says:

 August 10, 2015 at 12:00 pm
 
You can bet that Jackson is sitting with the watchtower lawyers as we speak, being “prepped” for Friday.
The lawyers will make sure to think of every question and contingency that may come up in the hearings.
In my opinion, Jackson will be evasive and will tip toe through the difficult questions.
Reply
 
 CoverFade says:

 August 10, 2015 at 2:12 pm
 
True, but remember the commission have a week to prepare as well, and they know now full well what kind of organisation they are dealing with. Jackson can tip-toe all he like, it’ll only make it worse for himself when they catch him out doing it.
Reply
 
 rob says:

 August 10, 2015 at 2:38 pm
 
I agree that the commission already know who and what they are dealing with and hopefully they will be ready for the probable evasiveness and manouvering by Jackson.
Reply
 
 
 
 ScotWm says:

 August 10, 2015 at 11:39 pm
 
RE: “You can bet that Jackson is sitting with the watchtower lawyers as we speak, being “prepped” for Friday.”
Just how far does the theocratic warfare umbrella extend? Does lying to protect the Watchtower have any limits?
Jackson might be able to get out of appearing by faking a medical emergency. It won’t surprise me if Jackson somehow manages to avoid his Friday date with destiny.
Reply
 
 Chiafade says:

 August 11, 2015 at 9:34 pm
 
I’m afraid of that happening as well. That would be all to convenient. But it would most certainly earn them a penalty.
Reply
 
 
 
 Excelsior! says:

 August 11, 2015 at 8:18 am
 
Rob,
Yes, he’ll be in a huddle with his rubbish legal team, desperately trying to come up with some way not to be slaughtered by the commission on Friday!
If he was a real man, he would be by his father’s side and if he were a true Christian, he would be expecting his “Big brother” Jesus to guide his tongue!
However, since the revolting cult he helps to run has no relation to Christianity, I guess he’s better off with his rubbish legal team after all!
I am looking forward to his testimony.
Folks, if you want a good laugh, check out the YouTube channel, My Plastic Microphone. He has a short snippet of a video where Geoffrey Jackson is ogling a young woman on a dance floor, and she runs away as fast as she can! Very, very cringe worthy!
However you slice it or dice it, the WTBTS is up the proverbial creek without a paddle.
Peace be with you, Excelsior!
Reply
 
 
 
 Hakizimana Jean de Dieu says:

 August 10, 2015 at 1:37 pm
 
“What of Jackson? He has three options.”! I like this! David, GRANDFATHER of Jesus, had to face such a painful situation of making a choice among three painful choices! What will do Geoffrey Jackson, the BROTHER of Jesus? Let him read this Bible story for guidance:
(2 Samuel 24:12-17) . . .Go, and you must say to David, ‘This is what Jehovah has said: “Three things I am laying upon you. Choose for yourself one of them that I may do it to you.”’” 13 Accordingly Gad came in to David and told him and said to him: “Should there come to you seven years of famine in your land, or three months of your fleeing before your adversaries, with them pursuing you, or the occurring of three days of pestilence in your land? Now know and see what I shall reply to the One sending me.” 14 So David said to Gad: “It is very distressing to me. Let us fall, please, into the hand of Jehovah, for many are his mercies; but into the hand of man do not let me fall.” 15 Then Jehovah gave a pestilence in Israel from the morning until the time appointed, so that out of the people from Dan to Beʹer-sheʹba seventy thousand persons died. 16 And the angel kept his hand thrust out toward Jerusalem to bring it to ruin; and Jehovah began to feel regret over the calamity, and so he said to the angel that was bringing ruin among the people: “It is enough! Now let your hand drop.” And Jehovah’s angel himself happened to be close by the threshing floor of A·rauʹnah the Jebʹu·site. 17 And David proceeded to say to Jehovah, when he saw the angel that was striking the people down, yes, he proceeded to say: “Here it is I that have sinned and it is I that have done wrong; but these sheep—what have they done? Let your hand, please, come upon me and upon the house of my father.”
Reply
 
 
 The reader says:

 August 10, 2015 at 3:01 pm
 
Might I defend Scripture.
 The two witness rule, is not as the Mosaic Law functioned.
 Check out: David & Amalekite [over Saul’s death] incident.
 Similar application is shown in Jesus’ trial.
 They would not have had problems with the present issues.
 Child abuse would be rape I suggest.
Reply
 
 Simon Kestral says:

 August 10, 2015 at 3:31 pm
 
David is not the best example for arguing a case of one witness testimony; he was impulsive and did not always follow the law.
But you have the right idea about rape and one witness testimony.
Deuteronomy 22:25-27 show that a man guilty of rape can be put to death on the testimony of one witness. As those verses say, no one was nearby to hear the woman scream, the only witness was the victim herself.
Does the two witness rule nullify her claim? No. The two witness rule is meant for expediting cases where the facts are not in dispute.
Deuteronomy 17:8,9 in the New World Translation, 2013 edition says:
“If a case arises in one of your cities that is too difficult for you to judge, whether it is a case involving bloodshed, or a legal claim that has been raised, or a violent deed that has been committed OR OTHER MATTERS OF DISPUTE, you should rise up and go to the place that Jehovah your God chooses. Go to the Levitical priests AND TO THE JUDGE SERVING IN THOSE DAYS, and make your inquiry, and they will hand down the decision to you.”
So when there is a DISPUTE, such as the case of a single witness, a JUDGE can decide the case. Having two or more witnesses simply means there is no dispute, and the local older men can handle the case quickly, without consulting a judge.
Again for emphasis, the two witness rule is meant for expediting cases where the facts are NOT in dispute, but it’s not the final word on a matter. That’s what judges are for, and that’s where Jehovah’s Witnesses fail in their application of the Bible. They stop short of the full procedure given in their very own Bible!
And they claim to be teachers of it!
Reply
 
 
 Paul says:

 August 10, 2015 at 6:05 pm
 
Yes, agreed, the law covenant had a clear rule that if a female was raped and screamed but nobody was around to hear it, then then offender was to be put to death, so there would have only been the victims testimony as a witness, and that system was fine at that time. It is only the rule makers in Brooklyn who have made life difficult by their insistence on a rule that is nonsensical.
Reply
 
 
 
 Ted says:

 August 10, 2015 at 3:11 pm
 
If Jackson does appear, it will be more of the same, “We cannot
 go beyond the things written” “We must obey God as ruler rather
 than men”. Thereby setting themselves up as the persecuted ones,
 and champions of “Gods holy word”.
How can they compromise on the 2 witness rule, or that only male
 elders can make decisions in child abuse cases or rape, or joining
 in with Babylon the Great organisations in a joint fund to make
 reparation to victims ?
They’re already deep in it and it will really hit the fan if they back
 down on any of those issues, considering how they’ve encouraged
 brothers in various countries to die before before giving a inch on
 Bible principles. What ammunition that will provide for us apostates !
 All this they are acutely aware of. So they will dig their heels in. IMHO.
Reply
 
 Chiafade says:

 August 10, 2015 at 6:09 pm
 
I wonder if the names Leo Greenless and Theodore Jaracs will come up. Two ex governing body members with a very scathing sexual past. No doubt the files in Brooklyn would have info on them and there’s enough notoriety about them online that the royal commission could easily capitalise on. The ARC has been very thorough in their research so I wouldn’t be surprised if it came up. I’m sure bro. Jackson would just say he wasn’t present as gb in those days and therefore has no input but still IT WOULD BE EVEN MORE RIVETING THAN IT ALREADY IS!
Reply
 
 
 
 Wild Olive says:

 August 10, 2015 at 3:21 pm
 
I know both Terry Obrian and Vin Toole and once upon a time would have believed anything they said.
 This commission has really exposed the leaders for what they are,worshippers of an organization,how ridiculous to think that they needed to obfuscate and lie on Jehovah’s behalf!
 I wonder if any of them are going to be doing jail time, it’s a lot like the time when Jo Rutherford was put in jail for illegally manipulating the brothers back in 1914,now these guys could face jail for illegally protecting peadophiles,lieing about it,and calling it Jehovah’s will!
 Those who ignore history are bound to repeat it, I believe Jehovah himself is showing its time to dispose of the hierarchy and all it represents if we are to carry his name.
Reply
 
 
 Jake says:

 August 10, 2015 at 3:42 pm
 
Human nature is human nature, the more you’ve got to hide the more cautious you will be. I once said to a legal mind, if you can smell bullsh-t there’s usually a pile not far away.
Reply
 
 
 rikos says:

 August 10, 2015 at 5:49 pm
 
Is so upsetting when you think these losers one time have controlled our life’s and we believed all the bullshit they have told us. I am wondering after so many lies have told the committee, these people will ask their God (given fake name Jehovah) please forgive our sins, and the reproach will bring to your fake name in to the world. shame on you JEHOVAH WITNESSES
Reply
 
 
 Paul says:

 August 10, 2015 at 5:50 pm
 
Another interesting point from Tooles testimony…
His legal studies at University were paid for in full by Watchtower. He let this slip in cross examination. So it is OK for WT to tell the rank & file that higher education is a big No-No, but if they want some legal guns on their side they are more than happy to break the rules and use the contributions of those lowly paid rank & file members to pay for it – Hypocrites!
Reply
 
 
 Ream says:

 August 10, 2015 at 6:22 pm
 
i’m also an active witness with privileges in the congregation and it’s been awhile since i had to open my eyes and come to the realization of how human our organization is and how far from the truth we are. It’s all about idiolizing the organization and protecting this naive and utopique idea that we call spiritual paradise.
 I agree with all of you it does not matter how shocking the outcome will be, we have been well conditioned to interpret these events as sign of satan’s world attack. But with time and patience a new generation won’t have any choice but to realize how wrong we were. The WT is running out of time considering its interpretation of the word “generation”. You can’t bring a more sophisticated explanation of that word than the one we have now.
 But we need to stay and raise these “positive” questions and avoid any questions that could come out as an attack on the organization. That would just trigger a defense mechanism that will shut down their critical thinking ability. Innocent question and “positive” concerns that will raise question would guide them to the right reflection. It will take time but it will happen in their mind once they are alone with their thoughts. A lot of our fellow friends will need people like us the day the truth comes out in an unexpect it way. A lot of them will be lost in life. A lot of have them have made sacrifices that have no meaning.
 I don’t think that the royal commission will change anything yet BUT the beauty of this event is that none of the commission witnesses are “apostates” are speaking (except for one) and this does not come from the press. It’s all facts established by a judicial process nothing has been exaggerated. All the interrogated witnesses are respected brothers with ranks in the organization and nobody can reproach us or anybody for watching this. So I will send some of my friend to the website and I will tell them that I got the news from a Google alert on witnesses (since I like to hear our legal victories around the world brought by the world press 😉 )
Reply
 
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 10, 2015 at 10:09 pm
 
This was a really good article. I had listened to much of the real life Royal commission drama but to have it explained underscored the rubbish that the Watchtower were coming out with. Thanks for making it clearer. Jackson is definitely in the hot seat. He can’t get out of this one. If he turns up, then this must be the first time a governing body member has taken the stand, what since 1918 or so? Very historic and yet it will not even rate a mention amongst faithful Witnesses. You would think they would be interested in all this as matter of personal interest and gaining more faith in their beloved Watchtower. They are all brainwashed beyond belief.
Reply
 
 
 Richard says:

 August 10, 2015 at 10:09 pm
 
It’s sad that this is getting absolutely no coverage in the U.S. I’ve written to several news outlets asking them to cover this story, but haven’t heard a peep.
Everyone needs to hear about this. This dangerous cult needs to be exposed to the entire world.
Reply
 
 Simon Kestral says:

 August 10, 2015 at 10:40 pm
 
To a tiny minority of ex JWs it’s important, but to the population at large, the whole JW organization is insignificant. News outlets need ratings, and this won’t do it for them.
Reply
 
 
 Garrett says:

 August 11, 2015 at 5:08 am
 
Richard
 I too have contact dozens of news outlets and have yet to see anything on the news in the U.S. Maybe they had their fill with all the Catholic sex abuse cases .
Reply
 
 
 
 Roxanne Temple says:

 August 10, 2015 at 10:59 pm
 
It is the beginning of “the end”. Of the WTBTS, not the world.
Reply
 
 
 ScotWm says:

 August 10, 2015 at 11:19 pm
 
Geoffrey Jackson is one of the seven self-appointed members of the Watchtower’s Governing Body. The members of this exclusive fraternity have made some very spectacular claims about themselves, which are summarized below:
“The faithful and discreet slave: A small group of anointed brothers who are directly involved in preparing and dispensing spiritual food during Christ’s presence. Today, these anointed brothers make up the Governing Body. That faithful slave is the channel through which Jesus is feeding his true followers in this time of the end. It is vital that we recognize the faithful slave. Our spiritual health and our relationship with God depend on this channel.”
If Jackson actually shows up to testify before the Royal Commission, he will have a hard time convincing the investigators that he has no authority over Watchtower underlings and no involvement in Watchtower policy making decisions. He will have an even more difficult time claiming that he has no knowledge of Watchtower doctrine and procedure as it pertains to handling child abuse cases.
http://www.jw.org/en/publications/magazines/w20130715/who-is-faithful-discreet-slave/
Reply
 
 
 Jake says:

 August 10, 2015 at 11:23 pm
 
The Jehovah’s witnesses/GB/organisation claim to be a bible based religion, so in my mind if you can reason form that prospective, despite the law, it will or should have a greater impact.
 The two witness rule is effectively their defence.
 I would ask a Jehovah witness their view on deu 22 with regards to the sexual crime of rape (23-27). My point would be this. . . . Even if a person heard the woman scream he/she would not necessarily be an eye witness to the rape, the scream would be the circumstantial evidence which would be enough to convict him, nevertheless, in the place where no scream could be heard (out in the field) the prepitriator could still be convicted even if there was no one to corroborate her story. . Is that correct?
 Matt 18 follows a similar formula, take a witness as to his attitude because he’s not listening, then two, three, the entire congregation, were they all eye witnesses to the sin?, no but to the circumstantial evidence. . . Is that correct? In other words you do not need two eye witnesses to an actual event to establish guilt.
 Once that issue is proven to a JW there can be no argument as to the wickedness of the stance taken by the organisation in this regard.
 The reality is the organisation adopts this stance to avoid litigation and is self serving (peddlers of Gods word comes to mind).
 I would be interested to hear the teachings committee response to this.
Reply
 
 william niles says:

 August 11, 2015 at 12:19 am
 
Very well said Jake, as I have said before that WT is misapplying the 2-witness rule and I have quoted even the same scripture in Deut. chapter 22. and I believe the 2 witness rule would apply AFTER Mathew chapter 18 was applied. Take a witness with you for the first attempt to confront/establish the wrongdoing…if he doesn’t listen then take 2 and after 3. THEN and only then could you go to the Elders, so they’re misapplying the 2 witness rule by not looking at those Scriptures as a whole v.s. reading them individually and taking them completely out of context. Anyone with 1/2 a brain knows there’s rarely/never anyone present as a second witness to a crime of rape. Those that usually are present have been known to be part of those networks of child trafficing.
Reply
 
 
 
 Enuffsenuff says:

 August 11, 2015 at 12:16 am
 
Just a point on the Royal Commission. It is not a Court of Law. It has different powers and greater ones at that than a Court of Law. If you are are summoned by The RC then you cannot do a Gerrit Losch and think you can get away. They will if necessary put out an international arrest warrant and extradite him back to Australia. Rest assured he will appear.
 As many contributors on this page have noted or realised, Jackson will have been coached, his memory will not recall incriminating events but will recall in great detail all other events. He will not have read things older than the year 2000 just gone, everything prior to that was old school and it has all been changed and he didn’t want to read that rubbish anyway, like Vin Toole, who said he had never heard of theocratic warfare. I have heard of some whoppers in my time but never a lie on that scale before.
 Finally, that don’t even believe the book they claim to support. Because events of the Christs last days prophecy haven’t turned out like they expected and since the GB are all under 75, half under 65 years of age they invented the “overlap” theory to explain their “anointing. Why? Because they are not of the generation that would “see all these things occur’. Meaning that Christ’s prophecy already had a fault with it. So I did a little research on the net and lo and behold guess what? Around the world there are approx 1.5 million people who were born in 1914 or prior to it and still alive. Whether it is accepted that Christ’s prophecy is true or not they should believe it, and they don’t, but that “generation” is still alive and bearing witness against them. They really don’t have much going for them do they?
Reply
 
 
 Enuffsenuff says:

 August 11, 2015 at 12:24 am
 
Don’t you just hate it when you forget to do an edit? The following sentence should read
 Finally, that don’t even believe the book they claim to support. Because events of the Christs last days prophecy
Should read- Finally THEY don’t… and- events of CHRIST’s
Reply
 
 
 Mc fan says:

 August 11, 2015 at 2:25 am
 
Can’t wait to hear how the RC got a hold of the Branch Handbook!!
Is there a secret army of faders at Bethel,trying to bring the cult down from within??
Reply
 
 
 anonymous says:

 August 11, 2015 at 7:17 am
 
If Jackson tries to use the Bible as his authority when it comes to the two witness rule and he goes by the Hebrew Scriptures from the Law Covenant that God supposedly gave to the nation of Israel, I would hope that the Commission would have him look up a few scriptures in the New World Translation and ask for Jackson’s explanation of those scriptures. These are scriptures that I don’t believe Jackson would have an answer for when it comes to the old Law Covenant with Israel:
Jeremiah 7:22 “For I did not speak with your forefathers, nor did I command them in the day of my bringing them out from the land of Egypt concerning the matters of whole burnt offering and sacrifice.”
Jeremiah 8:8 “How can you men say “We are wise and the law of Jehovah is with us”? Surely now the false stylus of the scribes has worked in sheer falsehood.”
Colossians 2:23 (speaking of the law) “Those very things are, indeed, possessed of an appearance of wisdom in a self-imposed form of worship and mock humility, a severe treatment of the body, but they are of no value in combating the satisfying of the flesh.”
Ps. 51:10 “For you do not take delight in sacrifice-otherwise I would give it, In whole burnt offering you do not find pleasure.”
Acts:7:42,43 “So God turned and handed them over to render sacred service to the army of heaven, just as it is written in the book of the prophets, ‘It was not to me that you offered victims and sacrifices for forty years in the wilderness, was it, O house of Israel? But it was the tent of Moloch and the star of the god Rephan that you took up, the figures which you made to worship them. Consequently I will deport you beyond Babylon.”
If Witnesses read the Bible and think about what they are reading, it makes it pretty clear that when the angel appeared to Moses in the thorn bush and the voice of Jehovah is what Moses heard, it was an angel called Jehovah who Moses heard and not God. The Watchtower likes to explain those scriptures away by saying that it was God speaking through an angel but actually if you take the rest of the Bible, it is saying that the Law was the worship of angels. It says in that one scripture in Acts that it wasn’t just the worship of the golden calf that was to Molech but it was during the whole forty years and beyond that the Israelites were worshiping false gods. The Watchtower went ahead and put the name Jehovah in the Bible over 7,000 times but who is Jehovah? Is Jehovah the angel who gave the Israelites the law or was it the other God who said that he didn’t take delight in burnt offerings?????
Reply
 
 
 rob says:

 August 11, 2015 at 7:51 am
 
It appears that these proceedings have not been picked up by the media in the USA, but if it turns out that criminal charges are laid or there is some type of sanction placed upon the witness religion in Australia, one can hope that it will gain international attention.
Even though I rarely discuss religion with witnesses anymore, I decided to have a quick discussion with a witness relative and I said to him, – Perhaps the “new system” as envisioned by the watchtower may not come in your lifetime” – He looked at me as if I was crazy and and said that he knew that the end was very near. I then said – If in 1950 you spoke to a witness who was maybe 45 years old and told him that the “new system” may not come in his lifetime, what would have been his response? He did not reply – discussion ended.
Reply
 
 sirius says:

 August 11, 2015 at 8:22 am
 
“He looked at me as if I was crazy and and said that he knew that the end was very near.’
Sad, of course the analogy to is this the loser at a casino, always going back with a new scheme. Always near – always soon! BTW, I love the “you just wait” fist shaking approach!
IMHO
dogstar
Reply
 
 
 
 just asking says:

 August 11, 2015 at 8:21 am
 
why am I enjoying this whole drama as it unfolds?
Reply
 
 
 just asking says:

 August 11, 2015 at 8:45 am
 
I know what the JW.org are gonna do. To keep the followers in check, they’re going to make a broadcast about how the whole thing is “Satan is attacking once again just like it was for Rutherford so be vigilant oh soldiers of the most high” Then threaten who ever follows the proceedings with disfellowship.
“Isn’t it wise therefore brothers to leave such matters in Jehovah’s hands and concentrate on preaching”? clap clap clap.
Reply
 
 
 Exhausted says:

 August 11, 2015 at 9:49 am
 
As I recall, the reason Rutherford was imprisoned was due
 To the fact they were publishing seditious words in their
 Finished Mystery book. Anti-government stuff that riled
 The Justices in that WW1 era. Some called it a compromise that he agreed to rip those pages out of that
 Publication and they were released from jail. Some how
 That was some prophetic fulfillment as well. Now, bringing this up to speed, Rutherford brought his tortures
 Upon himself to prove he was of Christ. Persecuted followers of Christ. Cannot it be said that he taunted the
 Bull?
 So it goes here in civilized society, when you rattle, you
 Must roll.
Reply
 
 
 Vidiot says:

 August 11, 2015 at 9:58 am
 
Jackson actually has a FOURTH option, but it is arguably just as impossible as the first three.
I obviously can’t speak for a GB member, but f I were him, and I’d been watching the proceedings, and seeing how the RC was lining up all their ducks and systematically eviscerating every policy, excuse, and testimony, and I was now faced with running that gauntlet MYSELF…
…I’d seriously consider eating a bullet between now and Friday.
Reply
 
 

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← Reflecting on the Australian Royal Commission (Day 3, Part 1)
An apology, and update on what’s in store for JWsurvey →
 
Royal Commission’s Angus Stewart accuses Watchtower representative of deliberate deception
Posted on August 10, 2015

Branch committee coordinator Terrence O'Brien was accused of intentionally trying to mislead the Commission
Branch committee coordinator Terrence O’Brien was accused of intentionally trying to mislead the Commission

This is the latest summary of the Royal Commission in Australia by non-disfellowshipped JWsurvey reader “CovertFade,” who is standing in for the JWsurvey writing team as we process the fast-paced events “down under”…
The closing moments of Day 7 of the Royal Commission’s investigation into Watchtower’s child abuse procedures saw some heavyweights from Watchtower’s Australia branch face up to some brutal questioning by the Commission’s Senior Council, Angus Stewart.
At one point the following remarkable exchange took place in which Terrence O’Brien, the coordinator of the Australia Branch, is accused of deliberately trying to deceive the commission in an apparent attempt to protect Governing Body member Geoffrey Jackson from being called to give evidence.
◾Mr Angus Stewart SC: Mr O’Brien, you have given evidence that you gave instructions to counsel on the point of Mr Jackson not being able to assist and his activities being in relation to translations. I, as a matter of fairness, must put to you that those instructions you gave were false, were they not?
◾Terrence O’Brien: No, I don’t believe so. Mr Jackson does oversee the translation work, but as part of the writing committee member, which he is one of the Governing Body members on that committee. So —
◾Stewart. And I suggest to you, or I put to you, that when you gave those instructions, you knew them to be false?
◾O’Brien. No. I disagree.
◾Stewart: And by giving those instructions, you sought to mislead the Royal Commission, to protect Mr Jackson from any potential summons to appear?
◾O’Brien: No, I disagree. I think the reason we asked consideration to be shown to Mr Jackson was the grave situation of his father – the very reason he is in Australia.
◾Stewart: Yes, and in relation to that, in view of what I have put to you, perhaps you can answer this: how are we to know if what you say about Mr Jackson’s compassionate circumstances is, in fact, true?
Attempting to mislead a Royal Commission is a criminal offense. If charged and convicted, Mr O’Brien could face a fine of up to $20,000 and up to five years in prison. So how on earth did the normally legally-savvy Watchtower manage to put itself in a situation where the head of its Australia branch was caught out in such a clumsy lie? Especially when the previous six days of testimonial curb-stomping clearly demonstrated that the Commission team was very smart, very aware of Watchtower’s inner workings, and quite prepared to examine matters with a fine tooth comb until it uncovered the truth.
Well, with hindsight, one can see the answer, and it revolves around the Cult Of Personality that the Watchtower has recently started to build around its Governing Body.
By Day 5, it was clear that a number of aspects of Watchtower’s handling of child abuse were seriously troubling the Commission. They included the two witness rule, the all-male nature of the judicial process, allowing a guilty-but-reproved offender to remain in the same environment as his victim with no real sanction, and more.
It was also clear that Watchtower considered these policies unchangeable due to their supposed scriptural basis, and that it was eagerly offering concessions in some lesser areas while carefully trying to sneak the weightier matters of concern out of the Commission’s spotlight unaltered.
The logical conclusion being drawn by the Commission was that they simply had to talk to the Governing Body. Ordinarily, this would be impossible; the seven members of the Governing Body reside in Brooklyn USA and as such are beyond the Australian Commission’s reach.
However, it transpired that Governing Body member Geoffrey Jackson had actually been in Australia since early July. The Commission made two separate approaches to Watchtower to organize testimony. Watchtower replied to the effect that Mr Jackson was in Australia for private, compassionate reasons and, also, that since the Governing Body was not involved in the implementation and administration of policies and procedures in relation to child sexual abuse, he would not be able to give relevant evidence.
The idea that a Governing Body member would not be able to give relevant evidence in this matter is absurd. Yet it should be noted that this fits a pattern of behavior. Gerrit Losch also refused to appear in defense of the organization’s child abuse policies in a US civil action the previous year. Nonetheless it appears the Commission was content at that point to let the matter go, and did not issue a summons. (It is important to note that refusing a summons to a Royal Commission is a criminal offense than can carry a sentence of up to six months imprisonment.)
However, by Day 6 it was clear that not only was the Commission realizing no meaningful change was possible without Governing Body sanction, but also that Watchtower was pulling out all the stops to firewall Jackson. My theory is that Watchtower Australia was given strict orders from Brooklyn that under no circumstances was Jackson to be summoned.
The damage to the cult of having one of the illustrious seven Faithful and Discreet Slave members, together comprising a revered mouthpiece of God, cut to dry-mouthed ribbons under examination as to his support for indefensible child abuse policies, was too awful a scenario for them to permit.
Nowhere was this more obvious than in the Day 6 testimony of Senior Service Desk Elder Rodney Spinks.
In the context of what we now know, it’s clear Spinks was tasked to mislead the Commission into believing Watchtower Australia had the authority to implement any changes the Commission might recommend, and thus shield Jackson from involvement. He does this in a manner that would make some of the most slippery political spin-masters green with envy. Let’s look at “Slippery Spinks” in action as he answers a simple, direct question. (By the way, the simple, direct answer to the question is: Yes we would need permission from the Governing Body.)
◾Mr Angus Stewart SC: But if you are to publish something new which sets out how child sexual abuse allegations are to be dealt with within congregations in Australia, would you need to get the clearance or the go-ahead from the Governing Body that what you have set out is fine, because it is not in conflict with the scriptures?
◾Spinks: I think the documents would show that we correspond openly with the Governing Body on matters of interpretation. I think my point is clear, that if recommendations from this Commission, and some things that we can obviously see ourselves – so, for example, if there is a legal requirement, whether it’s because of mandatory reporting or because of a criminal law that is less familiar to me than you, but if there are legal implications and we are working outside of those, you can be certain that an adjustment will be made here in Australia and a document produced relative to Australia, including collating those, as you see it – and correctly so – references from decades, that would be better into a single document tailored for the law, the culture, the expectation here in Australia. Absolutely.
◾Stewart: And you would only do that through engagement with the Governing Body?
◾Spinks: That’s – as many things could be done here in Australia, what I’m saying is we have such great respect for the Governing Body, we would have no issue at all with corresponding with them back and forward. I am confident there would be no issue, if we don’t stray from the scriptures, that they are happy for each branch committee – remembering that those members of the Governing Body are simply, as well, unpaid members of the organization that are selected from elders from different countries. So that’s not the issue. The issue is: is it in harmony with the scriptures and is it appropriate here in Australia. And the Australia branch committee would have that.
Notice how Spinks tries to dance around a simple and truthful “yes” every time, never quite telling an outright lie but still giving the false impression that the Australia branch can give the Commission everything it wants and thus there is no need to trouble Jackson.
During Day 6, the question of Jackson’s participation again comes up, and this extremely significant exchange takes place between Justice McClellan and the Watchtower Legal Council, Mr Tokley (bold is mine):
◾Justice McClellan: Now, these are very significant issues. They are not small issues, they are significant issues. At the moment, we are, as I say, facing the situation where we can see a problem, but we do need assistance from the church in what is the solution. We rather thought that Mr Jackson might be able to assist us in that respect. I understand the reason for compassion being extended to him. I have no difficulty with that. And for that reason, I have not issued a summons requiring him to attend. But at the moment we face a serious issue with which only the church can help us. Whether that needs a response now, I don’t know, but we would like you to reflect upon that situation.
◾Mr Tokley: Your Honour, may I respond on behalf of the persons I represent. Your Honour’s points are being taken on board, are being addressed, and are being given the most earnest consideration by the authorities. Mr Jackson would probably not have been of any assistance in any event, because his role and his responsibility is in relation to the translation of matters; it’s not in relation to these sorts of matters.
Remember that specific wording. That’s going to come back in a big way. Watchtower has just set something in motion that cannot be undone.
As Day 6 ends, it’s clear that Slippery Spinks has failed to protect Jackson. The Commission is clearly unconvinced. But it’s Day 7 when the wheels spectacularly come off the wagon for Watchtower Australia. During examination of the first witness of the day (Vince Toole, the elder in charge of the Legal Desk) the Commission submits a piece of previously unseen evidence.
◾Mr Angus Stewart SC: You say your understanding is that the branch committee members are equals. One of them is actually designated coordinator, is that not right?
◾Toole. Yes, I think he’s the coordinator of the – of the branch committee.
◾Stewart: And that designation or responsibility also is an appointment by the Governing Body?
◾Toole: I believe so, but I’m not absolutely certain – but I believe so. I’m sorry I don’t have a lot of information on that, but I just – I’ve never been involved.
◾Stewart: There are other copies coming shortly, but I’d just like to show you – there’s a copy for you – a document. You see it’s headed “Branch Organisation Effective December 15, 1977, Revised February 2003″. It says “This material in Branch Organisation –being the name of the publication –should not be copied or duplicated except with the permission of the Branch Committee.” It’s published in the USA, I understand, by the Governing Body. Have you seen this publication before?
Yes, for reasons that will come to light in a future JWsurvey article, the Royal Commission managed to obtain a copy of the Branch Handbook. If you thought the elders handbook was hard to obtain, that’s nothing compared to the Branch Handbook.
If the elders handbook is all about running a congregation, then the Branch Handbook is all about running a multi-million dollar worldwide corporation, and details, among other things, the full responsibilities of the Governing Body – the same Governing Body Watchtower Australia is desperately trying to insist has no say in the issue.
The day continues. Toole disgraces himself in his own special way during testimony, and also frantically tries to avoid giving straight answers as to the role of the Governing Body. Yet finally he is done, and Watchtower Australia’s big cheese, Terrance O’Brien, takes the stand.
Keep in mind what has happened up to now. Previous elders have been frantically spinning the narrative that Jackson is not needed, yet the Commission is clearly deeply suspicious, and most critically of all, Watchtower legal council has officially stated that Jackson’s role is limited “to the translations of matters.” To back away now would expose their deceit, and lead to possible criminal charges. But at the same time, it’s clear the Commission have all the evidence they need to see through the ruse. They have the Branch Handbook for crying out loud!
This is the no-win situation confronting O’Brien as he takes the stand, on an international live webcast, to face Mr Angus Stewart Senior Council, who has previously made mincemeat of every elder placed before him (even Slippery Spinks) and who now possesses the very publication that tells O’Brien how his own organization works.



The transcript records Stewart using the Handbook to establish Jackson’s role spanning multiple committees, including the writing committee and the teaching committee, both of which have direct involvement in the Commission’s area of interest. Then, the final nail in the coffin:
◾Stewart: I understand that you have not served as a member of the Governing Body, so I’m asking you from what your understanding is. But your understanding is that the seven members of the Governing Body, as a Governing Body, meet weekly, do they, every Wednesday?
◾O’Brien: Yes, so those who are present meet weekly.
◾Stewart. It will be that Governing Body as a whole, or those who are present, who would authorize the various publications and guides and guidelines, and so on; is that right?
◾O’Brien:. They would give the final approval for the publishing of them, yes.
◾Stewart: You will have heard yesterday that senior counsel representing the Jehovah’s Witnesses in Australia and the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society of Australia said that Mr Jackson would not be likely to be able to assist this Commission, because his role is in the translation of matters. Now, that, do you accept, is in clear variance to what you have explained in your evidence?
Think about it. What would you do? Admit the truth and your previous deception, or keep trying to deceive, even though it’s clear that the evidence to disprove your testimony is literally resting in the hands of your opponent? O’Brien makes his choice. Stick with the lie.
◾O’Brien No – sorry, it’s not. The translation, it comes under the writing committee, as I understand, which is what Mr Jackson is a member of.
 Stewart: But he’s also the coordinator of the teaching committee that has many other responsibilities, and not translation – not so?
◾O’Brien Yes, he – as a member of the Governing Body, he has a number —
◾Stewart. So can you explain, Mr O’Brien, how it came about that senior counsel representing the organization was given instructions that Mr Jackson’s role is confined to the translation of matters, when it clearly is not?
Finally! It took two solid days of testimony, of dancing around the issue by various senior elders, and dogged persistence by the Royal Commission to establish an answer to the simple question of: What does Geoffrey Jackson do? Two Days!
It’s not over yet. When Justice McClellan next speaks, the webcast audio records a softness to his tone that underscores that severity of the situation more than a raised voice ever could.
◾Justice McClellan: Mr O’Brian, did you give those instructions to senior counsel?
◾O’Brien: The instructions regarding Mr Jackson?
◾McClellan: Yes.
◾O’Brien: Yes.
◾McClellan: It led me to believe that there was little that Jackson could add to the discussion, and no doubt that is what you expected would happen; is that right?
◾O’Brien: That’s true, and I still concur with that.
◾McClellan: Well, I’m starting to form a totally different impression, I have to tell you.
The day ends on Watchtower’s worst case scenario: Justice McClellan issues a summons for Geoffrey Jackson. What will the fallout be?
At the time of writing, it is unknown if O’Brien will face charges. On the surface it would appear the case against him is compelling, and it’s clear both Mr Stewart and Justice McClellan viewed O’Brien’s misdirection seriously. Additionally, it’s clear this was part of a strategy of misdirection employed by every Branch-level elder who testified. Yet even if all involved escape legal sanction, the fact of their deception is preserved online for all the world to see.
Google doesn’t forget.
What of Jackson? He has three options.
1.Refuse to appear before the Commission, stay in the country to look after his reportedly dying father and go to prison.
2.Appear before the Commission and take part in the worst PR debacle the cult has even seen.
3.Refuse to appear, flee the country and make it clear to the world that he is so scared of the Commission he will even abandon his dying father to avoid testimony.
There is one final irony. As mentioned, the witness preceding O’Brien was Watchtower Australia’s top lawyer, Vince Toole. During his testimony, the concept of theocratic warfare was directly put to him:
◾Ms David: In the Watchtowers in 1957 and 1960, have you heard they say that: “As a soldier of Christ, you are in theocratic warfare and you must exercise added caution when dealing with God’s foes. Thus the scriptures show that for the purpose of protecting the interests of God’s cause it is proper to hide the truth from God’s enemies.” Have you heard of that?
◾Toole: No, and I’ve never read 1957 magazine articles, I’m sorry. I only became a Jehovah’s Witness in 1972.
◾Ms David: But, as a lawyer, you would be aware of such concepts, wouldn’t you – that you can lie to protect Jehovah’s name?
◾Toole: (Visibly angry) We are truthful. To be a Christian, you have to be truthful.
Maybe O’Brien didn’t get the memo?
 
CovertFade
 
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← Reflecting on the Australian Royal Commission (Day 3, Part 1)
An apology, and update on what’s in store for JWsurvey →
 
455 Responses to Royal Commission’s Angus Stewart accuses Watchtower representative of deliberate deception

← Older Comments
Newer Comments →
 
 Catalina says:

 August 11, 2015 at 10:47 am
 
Average Joe and Ream I am very happy to meet you guys on this website. I am an active witness also. I attend meetings two to three times a month to keep my family happy. I became inactive when I became overly saturated with the org insulting my mind. They are insulting my mind. Recently I had a conversation with two ‘sisters’ who feel the society uses emotional black mail (disfellowshipping) to make people come back into the ‘truth’ when that should return because it’s from the heart. The point I’m making is many thinking witnesses are afraid to speak up. This website is an excellent place to come to because it is non judgemental. It gives active witnesses who are waking up from indoctrination a safe place to come to. Active witnesses who are waking up find they have to deal with hateful judgemental people inside and outside of the religion. Waking up takes time. It doesn’t happen overnight.
Reply
 
 Average Joe says:

 August 11, 2015 at 1:22 pm
 
@Catalina
 Pleased to meet you. Your observations are very perceptive. There is indeed a good spirit of fellowship here between the active and non-active JWs even though our opinions differ but we seem to be able to talk about things in a civilised manner: totally opposite to what the WTS teaches. As yet, I still haven’t met a horrid, diseased apostate on here!
Reply
 
 
 
 Simon Kestral says:

 August 11, 2015 at 11:02 am
 
@Jake
Mt 18 is not necessary in the case of serious crimes such as rape.
The two witness rule is meant for expediting cases where the facts are not in dispute, but it’s not the final word. Having two or more witnesses simply means there is no dispute, and the local older men can handle the case quickly, without consulting a judge.
De 22:25-27 show that a man guilty of rape can be put to death on the testimony of one witness. As those verses say, no one was nearby to hear the woman scream, the only witness was the victim herself.
The two witness rule does not stop the victim’s claim. As De 17:8,9 says:
“If a case arises in one of your cities that is too difficult for you to judge, whether it is a case involving bloodshed, or a legal claim that has been raised, or a violent deed that has been committed or other matters of dispute, you should rise up and go to the place that Jehovah your God chooses. Go to the Levitical priests and to the judge serving in those days, and make your inquiry, and they will hand down the decision to you.”
So when there is dispute, such as the case of a single witness, a judge can decide the case. WT fails to apply this provision, denying the very Bible they claim to teach.
Reply
 
 Jake says:

 August 11, 2015 at 2:10 pm
 
Excellent comment, hence the superior authorities, I agree.
 In fairness to Watchtower and other religious organisations, if they have a confession (as I understand it and hopefully I am wrong, but it’s well worth the discussion) they are legally bound by clergy, laity privilege?
Reply
 
 Keith says:

 August 11, 2015 at 3:01 pm
 
Not in Australia Jake. Aside from the legal perspective there is no confidentiality in the organisation for ordinary Witnesses only the organisation gets to keep secrets.
Reply
 
 Stirring Awake says:

 August 11, 2015 at 5:53 pm
 
Keith is correct. There’s no such thing as ‘ecclesiastical privilege’ (something that was brought up during the RC) as testimony, confessions etc. are provided to more than one person during a Judicial Committee.
Reply
 
 
 
 Jake says:

 August 12, 2015 at 10:01 am
 
Agreed and thanks for the reasoning
Reply
 
 
 
 
 goneforgood says:

 August 11, 2015 at 1:30 pm
 
my hope is that this commission will help many see the ‘truth’, but for those deeply entrenched, they will not watch this, and will wait for the governing body to give them the news as the governing body sees fit. My own father who left years ago and doesn’t plan on going back, has become an apologist, believing only good things about Watchtower. He is still terrified about being labeled an apostate. Once I woke up fully, it was impossible to look at this organization the same way ever again. A person has to be open to seeing the truth though, whatever the truth may be. Many stay loyal to the organization out of pride and arrogance. Thank you for the great concise articles, much appreciated.
Reply
 
 
 MrFair says:

 August 11, 2015 at 1:34 pm
 
Jackson can have all of the coaching he wants but it won’t help for a few of reasons. First, lawyers could be of service for someone who only has to consider legal matters but they don’t help much when you’re a delusional cult leader who thinks that your religious policy supersedes human courts. Second, since the arguments have to be in line with JW doctrine they’ve already been used by Spinx, Toole and OBrien. The ARC has already proved that the JW position is indefensible and ineffective. He can repeat the arguments if he would like but I don’t think it will help much. On that note, my thought is that Jackson’s best bet would be to go apostate as a rogue GB member by throwing their policies under the bus. On the other side he could consult with the GB (which I’m sure will be happening tomorrow) and come ready to comply with the ARC’s suggestions in Australia. Third, the ARC is not suckered by double talk which is absolutely essential to Jackson and his legal team for convincing people that the policies already in place are good.
Reply
 
 
 MrFair says:

 August 11, 2015 at 1:46 pm
 
Just a note on some of the comments about the lack of publicity here in the U.S. and the general apathy/ thought stopping of the witnesses confronted with it. My wife and others are completely oblivious of what’s happening. When I mentioned the Jose Lopez case in the past, she told me that we can’t trust the media and was even suspicious of me for a while. I see that there is another “don’t trust the media” article coming out. It’s so hard/ disheartening to fight against that crap. What can we do? How can we get this information into people’s hand in a way that may arouse curiosity? I was thinking of making a friendly anonymous letter with the actual news clippings, relevant sections of elder books/ policy letters, websites etc. and mailing it to everyone in my congregation. Is it worth it? Has anyone tried it. I know they’ll probably just throw it away but I wonder if it couldn’t wake somebody up. I appreciate Lloyd and other activist but I can’t personally have a website or YouTube channel right now.
Reply
 
 Simon Kestral says:

 August 11, 2015 at 1:59 pm
 
Anonymous letter to the whole congregation? I don’t know if it will do much good, but it might get the hornet’s nest stirred up!
Consider mailing yourself a copy too, for plausible deniability.
Reply
 
 MrFair says:

 August 11, 2015 at 2:21 pm
 
I have my doubts about the effectiveness of changing minds but at least they would have the information available to them if they were the least bit concerned about the recent mentions of the subject by GB members. What are accusations that they feel they have to defend themselves against? I would send myself a copy too but it might still get pinned on me. I tend to have that apostate look in my eye…
Reply
 
 Good for nothing slave says:

 August 11, 2015 at 5:38 pm
 
It is just an exercise in frustration; I printed out the branch manual that directly contradicts the watchtowers statement, that a man that is known to be a molester would never qualify as an elder or ministerial servant, and gave it to a family member who was also molested. Not only did this person continue to defend the Borg, she also reported me to the elders. It makes otherwise loving people defend something everyone else knows is repugnant and indefensible. It’s crushing to see the cult have such a powerful effect on good people.
Reply
 
 Excelsior! says:

 August 12, 2015 at 5:42 am
 
Good for nothing slave,
How awful for her and for you. I am sorry that this has happened to you both.
This experience highlights the terrible power of undue influence. That poor victim has suffered unnecessarily due to her being fooled into believing that Jesus came down to earth invisibly, and chose an offshoot of the Adventist movement as his sole channel! Therefore, they can deny her justice, recognition of her suffering and compensation.
What can we do? I think the only thing we can do is to be compassionate to them. I am no longer a believer, but there is no defence against kindness.
Don’t raise this again, and try to do something kind for her. Let her know that you love her.
It is for people like your family member that we are fighting the WTBTS. We are winning.
Peace be with you, Excelsior!

 
 
 
 
 Searcher says:

 August 13, 2015 at 9:12 am
 
Wow! Could you image the “Local Needs” talk that would follow something like that?
Risky!
Reply
 
 
 
 Amy says:

 August 13, 2015 at 6:46 pm
 
I emailed to my JW father (an elder), in 25 or more separate emails, a link to every online news article concerning this whole thing, as well as copying and pasting each entire article to reach of those emails. I did not use any articles from apostate websites so he could see this stuff is in the news, in the world’s public eye. I didn’t expect to receive any type of reply, and I haven’t yet received one, but I’m hoping and praying that he doesn’t just delete everything I sent. Hoping and praying that maybe something gets through to him! Doubt it, but at least I tried, and will continue trying in this way, as the hearing goes on.
Reply
 
 
 
 Exhausted says:

 August 11, 2015 at 1:59 pm
 
Yes, I wonder and anticipate the upcoming testimony of
 Friday. How will he handle the interrogation?? Only he
 Knows, but I assume he will plead the “I don’t recall
 Scenario” that they have all resorted to. Just tell the
 Truth guys. The outcome will be better for you. The
 Truth is the truth right??? Either way, the world sees you
 As oddballs, …. take for example that Mormon creep who
 Was raping little girls Neffs? Was it? Now please brothers,
 Don’t act cowardly like he did. Also I am not implying
 That you are anywhere in that league, but, don’t cower
 From the stance you have allowed to prevail in this community. The Society has hidden pedos. now pay the
 Proverbial piper. Haven’t we?????
Reply
 
 
 Bad Penny says:

 August 11, 2015 at 4:33 pm
 
I am sending invites out to current JW’s to see their Own GB member fulfil prophecy (Matt 10:18-20).
 I’m hoping it will stir their interest enough to watch.
 This hearing will prove costly to Watchtower and I do fear that something may happen to Geoffrey on his way to the Commission. Remember how Russell was silenced! I do hope history does not repeat itself!
Reply
 
 Garrett says:

 August 11, 2015 at 6:37 pm
 
I give up… What did happen to Russel, Bad Penny? What do you fear could happen?
Reply
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 11, 2015 at 8:33 pm
 
I think Russell died in 1916 when he was on a train. Not sure what of. As my memory, which could probably stand corrected, seems to recall, there was a group of men who were taken to court for what I cannot remember. Watchtower claimed they were trumped up charges and the lot were sent to prison for a while, maybe a year or two. When they were released around 1919 they claimed they fulfilled prophecy and Judge Rutherford was pronouned their leader pronouncing that they had to “Advertise, advertise the King and the Kingdom to all the world.” I remember reading this in one of those old black Watchtower books from the 1920’s. I don’t recall it’s title. I was so eager back then to find out the history. What a sucker I was. Really, though, how could anyone have ever known whether those books ever told the truth?
Reply
 
 
 
 Excelsior! says:

 August 12, 2015 at 5:52 am
 
Bad Penny,
Charles Taze Russell was not murdered! He died of natural causes. If you have any evidence to the contrary then I would be very interested to see it.
The imprisonment of the directors of the WTBTS was not on a murder charge. They are not linked.
There is plenty of evidence that is verifiable fact to beat the WTBTS with. We don’t need hearsay and inaccuracies, we can leave them for the WTBTS to try to use.
Peace be with you, Excelsior!
Reply
 
 
 
 Wip it says:

 August 11, 2015 at 8:27 pm
 
I am getting comments from some, that this is going to lead to the banning of religion, so wait for it guys, prophecy fulfilled, whatever happened to the king of the north/south stuff, all gone quiet on that one.
Reply
 
 Chiafade says:

 August 11, 2015 at 9:16 pm
 
That very well may be the spin that they try to use. But the fact that it’s not even mentioned in the legal matters section on JW.org shows that the GB isn’t too concerned about that. More like they are planning a preemptive strike to keep this quiet and let it fly under the JW radar.
The GB also knows that there are serious financial penalties to be paid should this go south. ” How do we keep our Warwick retirement home construction going with stuff like this coming up?” “Lets make another donation broadcast!”
Reply
 
 will says:

 August 12, 2015 at 11:51 am
 
I think it’s not in the legal matters because I don’t think the Borg wants witnesses to look further into this. My wife had no idea this was going on in Australia until I told her and I suspect most witnesses are clueless. If the Borg posts it on their website, it will create a storm of inquiry.
Reply
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 12, 2015 at 4:55 pm
 
Will, you have me intrigued. Where did you get the Borg from. Everyone used to call it the Org but I don’t think it deserves that kind of recognition. Is it Bloody Organisation or Boring Organisation? Both of which seem fitting. I am intrigued.
Reply
 
 Simon Kestral says:

 August 12, 2015 at 5:15 pm
 
The “Borg” is from Star Trek Next Generation. It was an alien humanoid species. Via mental telepathy, they shared a collective mind, having no personal or individual will.
They were an enemy of the Federation, raiding populated planets and assimilating the victims into their collective hive.
Kind of like the WT …

 
 
 
 Average Joe says:

 August 14, 2015 at 6:07 am
 
@Will
 As an aviso Star Trek fan, i just take offence to your comparing the WTS to The Borg. They are a highly intelligent body, only looking out for improving other’s lives and striving towards perfection, although their methods leave a lot to be desired. I’m talking about the Borg by the way! :)
 The WTS are more akin to the Romulan High Council: paranoid of anything outside the organisation and quick to label everything non-JW as a threat. They too use fear tactics to keep the common Romulan in their place and obedient to the empire.
Reply
 
 
 
 
 Pickled brain says:

 August 12, 2015 at 12:36 am
 
@Wip it. Yes your right about the new King of the North should come first as it disappeared once the USSR was disbanded when Berlin Wall came down. In last years AGM Geoffrey Jackson Alluded to the GB might reveal who the new King of the North would be in this years AGM in October!! Maybe Geoffrey me old Jokey GB Matey will be in an Australian prison by then & the GB can say Australia is the new King of the North !! Might as well be as the Aussies were thrashed in Cricket recently by part of King of the South(Britain) . I Just received Holy Spirit as I was drinking my Gin& Tonic . ?? I AM ANOINTED by G&T. Well probably I have a better claim to being Anointed than the 7 Charlatans in Brooklyn who are Milking the Poor Publishers of all their money& time to build their LUXURIOUS LAKESIDE HOTEL on that TOXIC DUMP Warwick!!
Reply
 
 Grace says:

 August 12, 2015 at 2:45 pm
 
Keep rubbing it in Pickled Brain. haha. Yes what a humiliating defeat the Aussies had but wait until we come back with a vengeance.
Also, that’s interesting that they will wait until October to reveal who the K of the N will be. Why, I wonder. What do they have up their propaganda sleeve to keep everyone in anticipation for another few months.
Reply
 
 
 Keith says:

 August 12, 2015 at 3:09 pm
 
And the “King of the North” came storming out of the South to reclaim the beloved “Ashes”. Watch for the fulfilment in 2016.
Reply
 
 
 
 
 DJ says:

 August 11, 2015 at 9:44 pm
 
My mother told me today, after I had an argument with my dad, that they don’t expect the preaching work to reach the 30 lands and they are stubborn nd wont listen to me that its gonns be hard nd won’t happen anytime soon. She said thats why they have JW.org so that they can reach the other lands. Any thoughts on this
Reply
 
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 12, 2015 at 12:18 am
 
They kept the Silentlambs protest march a big secret too, when they locked the gates from those dangerous insidious victims of child sexual abuse back in 2003. Not a word was said. That is how they operate. This is part of their passive warfare. It is so pathetic. And the idea of the beginning of the end for religion, isn’t that a Watchtower prophecy back to front? Wouldn’t trust anything they had to say.
Reply
 
 
 Johan says:

 August 12, 2015 at 2:49 am
 
One question I would really like them to ask Jackson if he appears ! How do you explain the fact you went back and forth over 8 times whether its porneia if a girl was raped and she did not scream and should be disellowshipped ?
Reply
 
 Searcher says:

 August 13, 2015 at 9:30 am
 
I tell you, these WT theologians really get hung up on that word “porneia”. I assume it’s just another one of their versions of a witch hunt to stir the masses. Sexual behavior is an inherent part of the human condition and touches every one of us, so stretching the Greek word “porneia” to fit doctrine just touches everyone right down to our core. They are well aware of that fact. Only a TRUE greek language scholar could really define what the watchtower has defined 10 ways from Sunday just to make their twisted points.
Reply
 
 
 
 rob says:

 August 12, 2015 at 7:54 am
 
In my opinion, what should happen is that the watchtower changes its policies on child abuse, becomes a defender of abused victims and works in conjunction with the local authorities to see that the abuser is properly punished by the courts. They should also apologize to all the victims and their families for covering up the abuse.
What will probably happen is that the watchtower will continue to say that they have to keep God’s name from reproach ( I think that God doesn’t need man to keep His name from reproach) and they will continue to cover up the abuse to try and protect the organization and they will proclaim that the end is so near because now they are truly being persecuted as God’s only chosen people.
Unfortunately in an “us vs.them” scenario, the average witness will eat this all up and become even more entrenched in the bizarre cocoon that is the watchtower organization.
Jackson will probably try to whitewash and evade and skirt around all the questions and “not remember”.
I believe that the truth will in the end prevail and one day justice will be served for the poor victims who have suffered needlessly due to the pharasiacal rules within the watchtower organization.
Reply
 
 
 Excelsior! says:

 August 12, 2015 at 9:27 am
 
rob,
You may be right, sir, about the rank and file’s response. However, the ARC has done a great job of inoculating the public from joining the cult.
With two thirds of young witnesses leaving, and with less new victims to fleece, the WTBTS will inevitably shrink. It’s been happening for years.
I am hopeful that the ARC will be the first of many significant blows to the WTBTS.
Peace be with you, Excelsior!
Reply
 
 
 Jake says:

 August 12, 2015 at 9:59 am
 
:-) this is like waiting for a summer blockbuster:-)!
 I have Thursday and Friday off work:-).
 Can anyone post a link to the live webcam and what time do I need to begin to watch here in the UK?
 I have my popcorn and cocacola at the ready:-)
Reply
 
 Simon Kestral says:

 August 12, 2015 at 10:47 am
 
This gives local time in Sydney:
http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/australia/sydney
That page also shows Sydney vs. GMT. Just remember they are West of the International date line, so their Friday morning will be approximately your Midnight Thursday.
Reply
 
 
 Jake says:

 August 12, 2015 at 11:48 am
 
Thanks for that, starts at 11am according to the commissions website, if I’m right that should be around 2am Friday UK time
Reply
 
 
 
 Koos says:

 August 12, 2015 at 12:14 pm
 
@Rob, your comment is very well said!
John Cedars thank you for your hard work and great
 articles!
Reply
 
 
 Ted says:

 August 12, 2015 at 12:19 pm
 
15th cent, philosopher Niccolo Machiavelli stated,- ” If a ruler wants
 to maintain control. He as to be prepared to Lie, torture, steal, kill,
 and do whatever is necessary,”
At the same time he must, – “PRETEND to be merciful, faithful,
 humane. But above all RELIGIOUS.”
So far it’s been the lackeys, lying and doing what’s necessary,
 on Friday it’s the turn of one of the seven Autocrats.
Do they all really believe the baloney that this shell game religion
 dishes out? Can they all really be that dumb? Especially those at
 centre of the deceit and chicanery.
It smells of pretence, to maintain power and keep the plebs under
 control.
Reply
 
 
 rob says:

 August 12, 2015 at 1:32 pm
 
@Ted
 I ask myself the same question – “do they all really believe the baloney that this shell game religion dishes out?”
I think that deep inside many know that all is not right within this religion but most will not question because of fear, or because they dont want to lose friends/family or simply because they love the feeling of superiority that this religion instills in them.
When speaking to many witnesses I can feel the pretentiousness. I look at them and wonder how they can live in such a bubble.
Reply
 
 
 Grace says:

 August 12, 2015 at 3:00 pm
 
Just to let you all know. This will not be over on Friday.
I have held off from saying too much about it but I have told my story to a lovely lady at the RC. I have to wait though for 8-10 months before I get to meet with someone for an interview. She told me that there has been an influx of people reporting their story & that’s why I am in a waiting list that they have to go through.
I told her that I am really looking forward to what Mr Jackson has to say for himself as one of the leaders of 8 million plus people. Her comment was, “yes, it will be an interesting interview”.
So the onlookers outside of JW’s are fascinated with this as well. They have a sense of justice.
It’s stands out as obvious that Jehovahs’ shepherds that were supposed to be the “hiding place from the wind” didn’t do their job & that “satan & his hoards” have had to step up & be the hiding place for the victims. Shame, shame, shame.
Reply
 
 Everyday Explorer says:

 August 13, 2015 at 2:57 am
 
Well done, Grace. Thanks to your bravery, and now the bravery of many others contacting the ARC, the momentum against this arrogant organisation’s cruel lack of safeguarding policies continues ever more.
How I look forward to what transpires at the ARC on Friday 14 August 2015. Spotlights will be even more glaring on all this chicanery and duplicity and hypocrisy! Watchtower GB, you really can’t fool all of the people all of the time…
Reply
 
 
 
 al etheredge says:

 August 12, 2015 at 3:08 pm
 
That I should have lived to see the day a member of the governing body called to a witness stand to justify one of their misguided policies. This is going to be GREAT.
Reply
 
 
 Grace says:

 August 12, 2015 at 3:14 pm
 
I forgot to mention that they will be asking me what changes would I like to see made to the religion. I have pondered this for a while as to what I will say.
My first thought was that I don’t giving a sh%$ about this religion anymore but something inside still does. I would like to see their charitable status removed because they claim charitable status by their preaching but the counter claim to that is that they cause more damage than good with their doctrine.
My thoughts as to what changes could be made if this religion were to keep going is to take their right to hold JC’s as this is an obstruction of justice. That each member should be doing what the bible says & deal with their crisis as they see fit as they have a brain of their own. They don’t need to involve elders. Especially if it’s a criminal matter.
I also think that the GB should stop all disfellowshipping & shunning policies because it violates the UN’s human rights policies. I also believe that’s why they conveniently took out the scriptures in John 8…”those without sin cast the first stone” so that a person can’t argue or question why they are in JC in the first place.
That’s just my thoughts, I have a few more months to think about it.
Reply
 
 Garrett says:

 August 12, 2015 at 5:09 pm
 
Good points Grace.
 If you have the commissions ear, use it.
 I would love to see the commission lobby the UN to make the world aware of what is going on and have the same standards for them in every country.
 I.e.
 1- No tax exemption in any country anywhere. As a charity they do zilch and as a religion they protect pedophiles. They do not deserve tax exemption EVER.
2 All their records must be handed over in regards to the child molestation. That means all 20,000 names they have withheld.
3 Anyone abused should be allowed to now come forward retero activly no matter how many years ago and sue the Watchtower Society with no statute of limitations.
4 disfellowshipping should be banned. Let each person decide for himself if he wants to hang around with someone or not.
5 Governing Body should face a trubunal and be held criminally responsible for its pedophile protecting policies.
Grace…. Use that time wisely to push them to act on our behalf.
 G
Reply
 
 Grace says:

 August 12, 2015 at 5:36 pm
 
Thanks Garrett,
I’m going to write down your notes so that I can put it to the commission.
I may be just a little irritation in the throat of the WT but if everyone speaks we can become a lump in their throat & hopefully they will choke on it.
That’s why I also love this website it does give a voice to the silent majority. It’s helped me to build my own confidence in speaking up.
Reply
 
 Simon Kestral says:

 August 12, 2015 at 5:48 pm
 
Some of the demands above may sound desirable to ex JWs, but to the world at large and the superior authorities, will sound ridiculous.
Disfellowshipping, for instance. That’s a personal, elective social behavior that no government can regulate.
Limit your demands / advice / suggestions to things that are actually feasible for authorities to implement. Otherwise, they won’t take you seriously.
Reply
 
 Excelsior! says:

 August 13, 2015 at 9:38 am
 
Simon Kestral,
Disfellowshipping is “a personal, elective social behaviour” is it?
What role does the WTBTS have in this choice, Simon? Is there no causal connection at all? Do you think that “the superior authorities” won’t understand that undue influence is at work?
I’m going to give you the benefit of the doubt over the reason for this advise.
I do think that you could have been far more diplomatic in your wording, though, Simon.
Please remember who you are talking to. Grace has suffered terrible abuse and her suggestions are perfectly reasonable. I don’t think that “the world at large” would find Grace’s suggestions “ridiculous” at all.
Do you, Simon?
Grace,
Well done, madam. It is through the bravery and decency of survivors like you that the ARC has been able to hold the WTBTS to account so well. Thank you.
Peace be with you, Excelsior!

 
 
 
 
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 12, 2015 at 5:37 pm
 
Good on you Grace.
Reply
 
 
 
 Ted says:

 August 12, 2015 at 3:53 pm
 
Good point Rob, “Living in a bubble”, an ego trip, a feeling
 of superiority that would vanish if they confronted the TTATT.
Reply
 
 
 Enuffsenuff says:

 August 12, 2015 at 5:15 pm
 
Hi Grace, it is devastating to think how many more victims there are including your own experience. I think every one who reads your thoughts has a great measure of empathy.
 I saw the remarks that you may raise about the charitable status of the WTBTS to RC. I have always thought that they do not do any charitable works except with strings attached. Unlike the Good Samaritan principle. Therefore when they say they do charitable works such as going from door to door all they are doing is looking for converts, that is the motive, not charity. They have no business being excluded from taxes on the basis of their charitable works because they don’t do them. I wish you all the best with what amounts to a emotional journey.
Reply
 
 Grace says:

 August 12, 2015 at 5:55 pm
 
Thank you Enuffsenuff,
I didn’t realise how many others suffered with unfinished business like me until I started to go to ‘apostate’ sites & forums & read so many accounts of people suffering at the hands of this regime. I told the lady at the RC that I was naive as to how many others went through similar to me & were silenced in many ways. I thought that I was the only one & that it was just an isolated incident until I had friends confide in me about theirs. I told her that what drew my attention initially to looking & listening to others was a famous case in America that dealt with Candace Conti. I realised that there was something going on worldwide & that it wasn’t just me. She said that she was aware of the case & that it is a huge problem & reassured me that this wasn’t just me.
I wrote an email thanking the RC for helping to heal from my story as well.
From what I can gather they have had a huge response. The response from the members including maybe some outsiders caught up in the web of the WT like non JW family members & therapists to JW’s etc would be enough proof to see that this religion needs some serious looking into besides this one issue.
Reply
 
 
 
 Bad Penny says:

 August 12, 2015 at 5:31 pm
 
Garrett and Excelsior!
 Sorry about the delay in replying to your question, I’ve been very busy.
 My research over the past couple of years into the origins of Watchtower has led me on an extremely long, yet interesting journey.
 Charles Taze Russell, the founder of Watchtower Bible and Tract Society, as you are probably aware, had links to the Freemasons. There are reports that people had tried to poison him on a number of occasions and that he became so obsessed that he had a personal taster who tried the food before he did. His death on the train on Halloween, 31st October, has been viewed by some as suspicious. Some say he died from cystitis, some say he was actually poisoned. We will never really know as no Death Certificate has yet been found to verify his demise.
 You can do much research for yourself on this man if you want to, there is plenty of info on the web. Court documents on his divorce are available to read which show what sort of man he really was.
 Back to the present – I’m sure Geoffrey will have his day before the Commission. I just hope the outcome will benefit the victims of these terrible abuses.
Reply
 
 Garrett says:

 August 12, 2015 at 7:11 pm
 
At Bad Penny.
I just am amazed that just when you think you got to the bottom ,the rabbit hole goes even deeper. He was obviously a free mason.
 His grave stone and all the symbols easily prove that …. If anyone doubts that they need an education.
As to him possibly being poisoned?…. Well… This is a new one on me…… I’d have to have facts to believe it but everything I thought to
 be true with the Watchtower Society being the truth is false… Perhaps there is a basis there.
 Would love to hear more..
Reply
 
 
 
 Vivian says:

 August 12, 2015 at 7:52 pm
 
Will he really take the stand? If he flees, it will be just as damaging. Imagine the personal conversations between all these high up elders that have been embarrassed shamed humiliated on the stand , for carrying out policy with such exactness and obedience. And a policy maker just so happens to be in the country(jehovahs hand???? right….) to “set matters straight” and help them answer to this mess. More than likely the trial has shaken these men to their senses quite a bit. If he leaves without helping them I wouldn’t be surprised if the Australian branch is quite rattled.
Reply
 
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 12, 2015 at 8:55 pm
 
You know when I left 12 years ago, there was nowhere to go. There were a few sites on the net but speaking freely was very difficult. I had heard rumors that Watchtower was working hard at shutting down as many ‘apostate’ sites as possible.
Our daughter in law wanted me disfellowshipped because I had given her a video to watch. A kind elder got me off that one. We left damaged, shattered and in terrible shock. When family turn on you it breaks your heart. We soon discovered though the pleasure in freedom.
Thank you Cedars for creating this site and blog, and for the great team of writers that you have. We need it. The waiting has seemed like it was never going to come. We had to bury our feelings deeply in order to cope. We will still probably have to wait but at least now this is not secret anymore.
Reply
 
 
 Exhausted says:

 August 12, 2015 at 10:24 pm
 
Is it not funny that earlier today my in laws came over
 Now mind you my bro in law is getting up there, but
 So kind, so loving to me I was amazed. Now, I have told
 Them all about the hearings and the funny part is they
 Just listen, and I know my old bro in law gets it, but
 Remains quiet in front of his wife, who by the way I love.
 So we exchanged a few private looks here and there with
 An understanding of what the real issue was. It is funny,
 They all come to my home under the radar, cuz, I put out
 The goods. Luncheons are like buffets at my home. But
 In all fairness, I have eaten at their homes as well. It just
 Has not been in the last 20 years. Hee hee
Reply
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 13, 2015 at 12:03 am
 
Maybe, just maybe, the penny has dropped Exhausted. How strange that would be. Hang on. I’m running ahead here.
Reply
 
 
 
 ruthlee says:

 August 13, 2015 at 1:02 am
 
hello a thought to Grace you are in a unique position in that we have no voice and you have a little one that might start off as a tiny candle in a dark place so use your time and convictions in a way that you know is best and truthful i think you know we will support you with our love in my old cong one of the elders put his hands around my neck and shook me from behind and said ” Im going to kill you” it was because he a little man liked to be in control that to me was a rapacious nasty act but there is no redress no one cares not even my sledgehammer husband so i say to you dear grace if you have the honour of putting the tent peg into this org then what an honour you have and i will watch from the sidelines and know you will do the right thing respect and love RL
Reply
 
 
 Enuffsenuff says:

 August 13, 2015 at 3:06 am
 
The latest that I have on Jacksons appearance is that it will be by videolink. Jackson is in Brisbane (I think), the RC is in Sydney, therefore apart from the intense coaching he has had, I think that the V/link lets him off the hook a fair bit from the heated atmosphere of the lawyers. It would have been good to see him in person grilled as the star chamber J.Committees have done to so many people. If it is correct about where he will give evidence then I am thoroughly disappointed, What will be will be.
Reply
 
 Everyday Explorer says:

 August 13, 2015 at 3:36 am
 
I agree, Enuffsenuff, that it would be far preferable for Geoffrey Jackson to be physically present at the ARC, rather than via video link (as may turn out to be the case).
However, I don’t think we should under-estimate how taxing GJ will find any sort of incisive questioning over a prolonged period of time. Members of the WT GB must spend most of their daily lives pronouncing and announcing, exhorting and distorting — and being deferred to for their very presence. Hence, they may not have experienced a secular discussion for aeons!
So there will definitely be a substantial cognitive pressure on Jackson, as well as all the political/etc pressures, as he attempts actually to listen and respond logically to the questions that will be put to him.
Reply
 
 Enuffsenuff says:

 August 13, 2015 at 5:12 am
 
I also agree with you on this EE. I hope my info was wrong to tell the truth. I want him to be on the stand in Sydney. Notwithstanding, SC Angus Stewart and Peter MacClellan have done a fantastic job and I think everyone on these pages never saw coming, what has happened so far, especially and including GJ’s appearance. I don’t think so far there has been anything so devastating in the last 100 years to see WT men, lie, treat women (the lawyers at the ARC) so contemptuously, evasive to the point of deceiving and exposure of practises that clearly don’t fit the scriptures that they claim to hold so dear. Everything I have seen or read about for the past fifty years the men in charge tackled problems, horrendous ones (i.e. WW2) with gusto and vigour and the firm conviction that they were right and following the spirit of God’s word. Not so here. it has been cheap, shabby and tawdry, and for the abused disgusting. Worst of all for me I can’t think of a single justifiable reason for their behaviour and cruelty.
Reply
 
 
 CoverFade says:

 August 13, 2015 at 5:15 am
 
Agreed. Whilst it’s a shame that we won’t get the full live experience, don’t expect a video link to shield Jackson in any way. It might been he squirms a little less, but the questions asked of him will be exactly the same, the answers he will have no choice but to give will be equally damning, and the Commission will keep drilling until it’s satisfied.
I mean, you’ve seen Stewart and McClellan in action, right? 😉
Reply
 
 
 
 
 Enuffsenuff says:

 August 13, 2015 at 5:42 am
 
One other thing that my wife is worried about is will the v/link be shown so that we can see Jackson. One of the things that has become obvious about the cross examination has been that viewing has given us a far greater insight than just hearing by itself. The body language, the expressions on the face, the discomfort of facing the truth and so on. My wife has described Vin Toole as having “dead eyes” like a snake, and, while I have not met him others I know, and who have, describe him as having no empathy for others. Then again, they all seemed like that to me seeing them on the stand. Back to my wife she feels that if individuals email the Commission, and ask to see Jackson’s testimony, as he gives it, would be most revealing. Then you see the man and whether his face reflects what he says.
 And, yes I have seen Counsel and Commissioner at work, and they are good.;-)
Reply
 
 Average Joe says:

 August 13, 2015 at 12:22 pm
 
That’s a good observation. I’ll drop them a line now. Thanks for the idea.
Reply
 
 
 
 Free Thinker says:

 August 13, 2015 at 5:45 am
 
Grace
 I think it is noteworthy that the person you spoke to about your ordeal was a woman (take note watchtower).
 CoverFade I wonder if Jackson because he is on video link will be reminded not to have any written notes other than those from the commission. Angus Stewart (superlawyer) reminded one of the previous witnesses of this. This hearing has proved pivotal in so many ways that as a still in (just) witness it is now a permanent part of the healing/awakening experience for many years to come. How many of us still have that nagging doubt that Jackson will somehow pull out at the last minute possibly family bereavement. We can only wait for the next 24 hours to pass by in anticipation of a potentially mouth watering experience.
Reply
 
 Average Joe says:

 August 13, 2015 at 12:20 pm
 
I would image that the video link-up will be in a place approved & monitored by the RC so as to make sure that Geoffrey behaves himself!
 It’s being broacast live at 2am Friday morning here in the UK and as much as I would like to see it live, I will have to wait for the retransmission via YouTube. I look forward to everyone’s comments.
 AJ
Reply
 
 
 Chiafade says:

 August 13, 2015 at 10:15 pm
 
That’s my nagging doubt. I hope it doesn’t happen and I hope for a nice stable video stream lest they say ” you see Jehovah intervened to protect his name”.
I remember a JW urban legend where during a court case in a particular u.s. state something happened. There was a high ranking bethelite present and during the lunch break he told members of the congregation that were present to “pray for confusion”. Low and behold the ” worldy attorney ” could not recall what his next piece of evidence was supposed to be and the witnesses won the case!
 You know that’s what any who are aware of this case are doing right now. Well, their prayers have been answered just not in the way they thought. Confusion describes the elders who were put on the stand. Without direction from “mother” on what to do under those circumstances they were lost and confused or just lying. “I can’t recall” ” I don’t know “.
Reply
 
 
 
 Mary says:

 August 13, 2015 at 6:55 am
 
Although it seems incredible, apparently these senior members of the Organization did not foresee this disaster and obviously thought they could pull the wool over the eyes of the Commission the same way they have to the Rank & File all these years.
It’s been almost 100 years since the leaders of this religion have been brought to trial for their contemptible views so perhaps it shouldn’t be all that surprising that they obviously feel that they’re untouchable. They’re so used to squashing any discontent or any serious questioning of their doctrines that they have been completely caught off-guard by the fact that what was “once hidden” is now “revealed” for all the world to see. And it doesn’t paint a very flattering picture of them.
Of course, this all could have been avoided had they simply changed their pathetic stance on reporting child abuse to the authorities, getting the victims some much needed help and kicking the molesters to the curb. Their arrogant attitude, even after the Dateline story in 2002, is that “no one is going to tell US what to do.”
Can’t wait to see what Geoffrey Jackson says on the stand. I hope the RC is prepared for a deluge of “I don’t know”, and “I’m not aware” answers along with a trail of outright lies.
Reply
 
 
 rob says:

 August 13, 2015 at 9:08 am
 
I think that the RC will be prepared and will ask the questions that Jackson must answer and they will ask questions that he cannot avoid answering.
However in the end, if Jackson does lie or does “not remember” he will have to live with himself, knowing that he is guilty of hiding information.
Reply
 
 
 Simon Kestral says:

 August 13, 2015 at 11:21 am
 
@Excelsior
The law recognizes a potential for “undue influence” in contract and probate law.
But in a social / religious context such as disfellowshipping, “undue influence” is not a matter of law. Individuals voluntarily follow the leaders teaching such practices, and it would be utterly impractical for the law to regulate their choice of friends. As far as the law is concerned, those are private matters for individuals to decide.
A request to “ban disfellowshipping” may seem like a good idea to ex JWs, but the authorities can’t take it seriously, because they know they don’t have that power.
Hence my advice to keep it real when making requests of the authorities.
Reply
 
 Excelsior! says:

 August 14, 2015 at 12:41 pm
 
Simon Kestral,
It has been legally established that the second baptism question, where they ask, “Do you understand that your baptism identifies you as one of Jehovah’s Witnesses, in association with God’s spirit directed organisation” is a verbal contract.
By your definition, the law could address this issue, could it not?
After all, disfellowshipping can only occur to a baptised JW, can it not?
Can a child be held to a verbal contract? If they can’t, then surely that would invalidate the verbal contract they entered when they declared “yes” to the second question?
I don’t know about you, Simon, but I’m not legally trained. But it seems to me that a case could be made that the verbal contract was not entered into legally. It would be great to get a professional opinion on this.
Thank you for your polite and informative reply.
Peace be with you, Excelsior!
Reply
 
 Simon Kestral says:

 August 15, 2015 at 4:50 pm
 
In a contract one party promises to do something in return for a promise from the other party to provide a benefit of value. So professing loyalty to WT is not a contract in the legal sense.
If you have enough money to spend on lawyers, you can sue almost anybody for almost anything.
But in the USA, lawsuits against religious disfellowshiping have little chance of success. Any appearance of attacking religion can be political suicide. Law and politics walk hand in hand, and most judges would not touch it.
This is not a professional opinion. Just common sense.
Reply
 
 
 
 
 Grace says:

 August 13, 2015 at 2:14 pm
 
Hi Simon,
“I also think that the GB should stop all disfellowshipping & shunning policies because it violates the UN’s human rights policies. I also believe that’s why they conveniently took out the scriptures in John 8…”those without sin cast the first stone” so that a person can’t argue or question why they are in JC in the first place.”
If you re-read what I first wrote above, it was to the GB not the secular authorities & it was just my thoughts on what should change with this religion.
The RC can make suggestions to the church as to what is the least damaging to it’s members, especially victims of crime.
I’m sure though that there would be something in disfellowshipping that falls under discrimination & prejudices. All of my family work in Government jobs & discrimination is a huge factor in the work place & taken very seriously.
Shunning someone because they have been disfellowshipped is forming a prejudice to that person especially if you don’t know what they have been disfellowshipped for. For all we know, they could have disagreed with the GB or the elders on matters & where deemed apostate. Members are therefore forming an opinion of someone & shunning someone out of ignorance & the recommendation from someone else without knowing the other persons story.
Reply
 
 Simon Kestral says:

 August 13, 2015 at 3:52 pm
 
I know, it was Garrett who said “disfellowshipping should be banned.” I was replying to that remark.
And I agree with you that “discrimination is a huge factor in the work place & taken very seriously.”
But WT is not discriminating in the workplace. Ex JWs may dislike their disfellowshipping policy, but it’s not illegal.
You can publicly denounce WT to anyone who will listen. But we should not expect the law to correct social injustice where they lack power over it. The power we have as individuals is to either support WT teachings, or reject them. If we reject them, we can also preach against them, in the hope of helping others avoid the WT snare.
I hope you don’t take this the wrong way. I support you. I hope you contribute meaningful input to the RC. All I’m saying is, when dealing with authorities, stick to the facts, and don’t expect more than they can deliver. That way, they are more likely to take you seriously.
Reply
 
 
 
 Bad Penny says:

 August 13, 2015 at 4:13 pm
 
Garrett –
 … would love to hear more … I could write a book –
There is so much info out there, how far down the rabbit hole do you want to go? If you want to start at the bottom go to ‘Jehovah’s witnesses EXPOSED – Compiled and edited by David J. Stewart, (Turn down the eerie music, it’s a bit off putting) or Russell bloodlines by Fritz Springmeier. Plenty of food for thought here.
 It’s amazing how smokescreens have been used in the distant past and how they are still being used with the current issue of child abuse.
 I’m so tempted to stay up till 2 a.m. British time to see the start of this episode with Geoffrey. I think I’ll just grab a few hours sleep beforehand … zzzz!
Reply
 
 Garrett says:

 August 13, 2015 at 7:19 pm
 
Bad Penny.
 70* degree dew point and 90 degree heat has me also done for the day from the construction site. It’s earlier here central time but I tried to watch live and the server is so overloaded that it’s like being Oliver Twist in a soup line. I’ll wait for the ” best of” series for the Commission.
 I’m sure there is a ton of information out there like you reference. Where was all of it when we were becoming witnesses? Would we have ever joined up if all those things about free masonry and other crazy crap www known?
 Not me.
Reply
 
 
 
 Jake says:

 August 13, 2015 at 5:10 pm
 
The witness for the prosecution is stronger than their defence. I wish you all well and hope you receive everything you are deserved.x
Reply
 
 
 Queen Elsa says:

 August 13, 2015 at 7:23 pm
 
Oh my, watching… Unbelievable!!
Reply
 
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 13, 2015 at 9:03 pm
 
Didn’t manage to catch it all but he sounded just like he was giving a talk. You know, like when you are at an assembly and some stuffed shirt Bethel brother gets up there like we are all supposed to started bowing and clapping. How typical. Some of the stuff he agreed with is never going to happen and has never happened. Distorting the truth seems to be in their nature.
Reply
 
 
 Bad Penny says:

 August 14, 2015 at 1:47 am
 
Garrett
 Thanks to the www we have everything at our fingertips now.
 I don’t believe anyone from outside would have got involved if they had known the real truth about the org.
 The only poor souls to stay with it would be the ‘born ins’.
Eye opening cases like this one should decimate the JW population in Australia. When the Royal Commission spreads their enquiries around the world it may lead to an end to the ‘preaching work’. The more exposure to this child abuse within JWs, the more damning it will become.
 The case of Jimmy Savile (radio & TV personality) in the UK has lead to a huge outcry. More and more cases are coming to light of paedophiles among the ‘elite’.
If JW’s hit the headlines in the UK, I believe they will be spat upon in the streets. It will be a case of ‘The End is Nigh’ turned on them! Can’t wait!
Reply
 
 
 Stirring Awake says:

 August 14, 2015 at 4:31 am
 
Angus Stewart is gooooooood! He’s REALLY gooooooood!
Jackson was lucky enough to be given some legal support in an attempt to not be caught off guard like every other elder before him, but wow… Stewart is brilliant at pinning people down, in a corner, of a locked room, on an island…. with just his words!
Day 8, Part 1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=erWV8YnTFto
 Day 8, Part 2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBE_oof1RzE
Reply
 
 CoverFade says:

 August 14, 2015 at 8:17 am
 
Agreed. The section where he nails Jackson to the wall over the cruelty and tyrannical nature of shunning was especially succulent.
Reply
 
 
 
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← Reflecting on the Australian Royal Commission (Day 3, Part 1)
An apology, and update on what’s in store for JWsurvey →
 
Royal Commission’s Angus Stewart accuses Watchtower representative of deliberate deception
Posted on August 10, 2015

Branch committee coordinator Terrence O'Brien was accused of intentionally trying to mislead the Commission
Branch committee coordinator Terrence O’Brien was accused of intentionally trying to mislead the Commission

This is the latest summary of the Royal Commission in Australia by non-disfellowshipped JWsurvey reader “CovertFade,” who is standing in for the JWsurvey writing team as we process the fast-paced events “down under”…
The closing moments of Day 7 of the Royal Commission’s investigation into Watchtower’s child abuse procedures saw some heavyweights from Watchtower’s Australia branch face up to some brutal questioning by the Commission’s Senior Council, Angus Stewart.
At one point the following remarkable exchange took place in which Terrence O’Brien, the coordinator of the Australia Branch, is accused of deliberately trying to deceive the commission in an apparent attempt to protect Governing Body member Geoffrey Jackson from being called to give evidence.
◾Mr Angus Stewart SC: Mr O’Brien, you have given evidence that you gave instructions to counsel on the point of Mr Jackson not being able to assist and his activities being in relation to translations. I, as a matter of fairness, must put to you that those instructions you gave were false, were they not?
◾Terrence O’Brien: No, I don’t believe so. Mr Jackson does oversee the translation work, but as part of the writing committee member, which he is one of the Governing Body members on that committee. So —
◾Stewart. And I suggest to you, or I put to you, that when you gave those instructions, you knew them to be false?
◾O’Brien. No. I disagree.
◾Stewart: And by giving those instructions, you sought to mislead the Royal Commission, to protect Mr Jackson from any potential summons to appear?
◾O’Brien: No, I disagree. I think the reason we asked consideration to be shown to Mr Jackson was the grave situation of his father – the very reason he is in Australia.
◾Stewart: Yes, and in relation to that, in view of what I have put to you, perhaps you can answer this: how are we to know if what you say about Mr Jackson’s compassionate circumstances is, in fact, true?
Attempting to mislead a Royal Commission is a criminal offense. If charged and convicted, Mr O’Brien could face a fine of up to $20,000 and up to five years in prison. So how on earth did the normally legally-savvy Watchtower manage to put itself in a situation where the head of its Australia branch was caught out in such a clumsy lie? Especially when the previous six days of testimonial curb-stomping clearly demonstrated that the Commission team was very smart, very aware of Watchtower’s inner workings, and quite prepared to examine matters with a fine tooth comb until it uncovered the truth.
Well, with hindsight, one can see the answer, and it revolves around the Cult Of Personality that the Watchtower has recently started to build around its Governing Body.
By Day 5, it was clear that a number of aspects of Watchtower’s handling of child abuse were seriously troubling the Commission. They included the two witness rule, the all-male nature of the judicial process, allowing a guilty-but-reproved offender to remain in the same environment as his victim with no real sanction, and more.
It was also clear that Watchtower considered these policies unchangeable due to their supposed scriptural basis, and that it was eagerly offering concessions in some lesser areas while carefully trying to sneak the weightier matters of concern out of the Commission’s spotlight unaltered.
The logical conclusion being drawn by the Commission was that they simply had to talk to the Governing Body. Ordinarily, this would be impossible; the seven members of the Governing Body reside in Brooklyn USA and as such are beyond the Australian Commission’s reach.
However, it transpired that Governing Body member Geoffrey Jackson had actually been in Australia since early July. The Commission made two separate approaches to Watchtower to organize testimony. Watchtower replied to the effect that Mr Jackson was in Australia for private, compassionate reasons and, also, that since the Governing Body was not involved in the implementation and administration of policies and procedures in relation to child sexual abuse, he would not be able to give relevant evidence.
The idea that a Governing Body member would not be able to give relevant evidence in this matter is absurd. Yet it should be noted that this fits a pattern of behavior. Gerrit Losch also refused to appear in defense of the organization’s child abuse policies in a US civil action the previous year. Nonetheless it appears the Commission was content at that point to let the matter go, and did not issue a summons. (It is important to note that refusing a summons to a Royal Commission is a criminal offense than can carry a sentence of up to six months imprisonment.)
However, by Day 6 it was clear that not only was the Commission realizing no meaningful change was possible without Governing Body sanction, but also that Watchtower was pulling out all the stops to firewall Jackson. My theory is that Watchtower Australia was given strict orders from Brooklyn that under no circumstances was Jackson to be summoned.
The damage to the cult of having one of the illustrious seven Faithful and Discreet Slave members, together comprising a revered mouthpiece of God, cut to dry-mouthed ribbons under examination as to his support for indefensible child abuse policies, was too awful a scenario for them to permit.
Nowhere was this more obvious than in the Day 6 testimony of Senior Service Desk Elder Rodney Spinks.
In the context of what we now know, it’s clear Spinks was tasked to mislead the Commission into believing Watchtower Australia had the authority to implement any changes the Commission might recommend, and thus shield Jackson from involvement. He does this in a manner that would make some of the most slippery political spin-masters green with envy. Let’s look at “Slippery Spinks” in action as he answers a simple, direct question. (By the way, the simple, direct answer to the question is: Yes we would need permission from the Governing Body.)
◾Mr Angus Stewart SC: But if you are to publish something new which sets out how child sexual abuse allegations are to be dealt with within congregations in Australia, would you need to get the clearance or the go-ahead from the Governing Body that what you have set out is fine, because it is not in conflict with the scriptures?
◾Spinks: I think the documents would show that we correspond openly with the Governing Body on matters of interpretation. I think my point is clear, that if recommendations from this Commission, and some things that we can obviously see ourselves – so, for example, if there is a legal requirement, whether it’s because of mandatory reporting or because of a criminal law that is less familiar to me than you, but if there are legal implications and we are working outside of those, you can be certain that an adjustment will be made here in Australia and a document produced relative to Australia, including collating those, as you see it – and correctly so – references from decades, that would be better into a single document tailored for the law, the culture, the expectation here in Australia. Absolutely.
◾Stewart: And you would only do that through engagement with the Governing Body?
◾Spinks: That’s – as many things could be done here in Australia, what I’m saying is we have such great respect for the Governing Body, we would have no issue at all with corresponding with them back and forward. I am confident there would be no issue, if we don’t stray from the scriptures, that they are happy for each branch committee – remembering that those members of the Governing Body are simply, as well, unpaid members of the organization that are selected from elders from different countries. So that’s not the issue. The issue is: is it in harmony with the scriptures and is it appropriate here in Australia. And the Australia branch committee would have that.
Notice how Spinks tries to dance around a simple and truthful “yes” every time, never quite telling an outright lie but still giving the false impression that the Australia branch can give the Commission everything it wants and thus there is no need to trouble Jackson.
During Day 6, the question of Jackson’s participation again comes up, and this extremely significant exchange takes place between Justice McClellan and the Watchtower Legal Council, Mr Tokley (bold is mine):
◾Justice McClellan: Now, these are very significant issues. They are not small issues, they are significant issues. At the moment, we are, as I say, facing the situation where we can see a problem, but we do need assistance from the church in what is the solution. We rather thought that Mr Jackson might be able to assist us in that respect. I understand the reason for compassion being extended to him. I have no difficulty with that. And for that reason, I have not issued a summons requiring him to attend. But at the moment we face a serious issue with which only the church can help us. Whether that needs a response now, I don’t know, but we would like you to reflect upon that situation.
◾Mr Tokley: Your Honour, may I respond on behalf of the persons I represent. Your Honour’s points are being taken on board, are being addressed, and are being given the most earnest consideration by the authorities. Mr Jackson would probably not have been of any assistance in any event, because his role and his responsibility is in relation to the translation of matters; it’s not in relation to these sorts of matters.
Remember that specific wording. That’s going to come back in a big way. Watchtower has just set something in motion that cannot be undone.
As Day 6 ends, it’s clear that Slippery Spinks has failed to protect Jackson. The Commission is clearly unconvinced. But it’s Day 7 when the wheels spectacularly come off the wagon for Watchtower Australia. During examination of the first witness of the day (Vince Toole, the elder in charge of the Legal Desk) the Commission submits a piece of previously unseen evidence.
◾Mr Angus Stewart SC: You say your understanding is that the branch committee members are equals. One of them is actually designated coordinator, is that not right?
◾Toole. Yes, I think he’s the coordinator of the – of the branch committee.
◾Stewart: And that designation or responsibility also is an appointment by the Governing Body?
◾Toole: I believe so, but I’m not absolutely certain – but I believe so. I’m sorry I don’t have a lot of information on that, but I just – I’ve never been involved.
◾Stewart: There are other copies coming shortly, but I’d just like to show you – there’s a copy for you – a document. You see it’s headed “Branch Organisation Effective December 15, 1977, Revised February 2003″. It says “This material in Branch Organisation –being the name of the publication –should not be copied or duplicated except with the permission of the Branch Committee.” It’s published in the USA, I understand, by the Governing Body. Have you seen this publication before?
Yes, for reasons that will come to light in a future JWsurvey article, the Royal Commission managed to obtain a copy of the Branch Handbook. If you thought the elders handbook was hard to obtain, that’s nothing compared to the Branch Handbook.
If the elders handbook is all about running a congregation, then the Branch Handbook is all about running a multi-million dollar worldwide corporation, and details, among other things, the full responsibilities of the Governing Body – the same Governing Body Watchtower Australia is desperately trying to insist has no say in the issue.
The day continues. Toole disgraces himself in his own special way during testimony, and also frantically tries to avoid giving straight answers as to the role of the Governing Body. Yet finally he is done, and Watchtower Australia’s big cheese, Terrance O’Brien, takes the stand.
Keep in mind what has happened up to now. Previous elders have been frantically spinning the narrative that Jackson is not needed, yet the Commission is clearly deeply suspicious, and most critically of all, Watchtower legal council has officially stated that Jackson’s role is limited “to the translations of matters.” To back away now would expose their deceit, and lead to possible criminal charges. But at the same time, it’s clear the Commission have all the evidence they need to see through the ruse. They have the Branch Handbook for crying out loud!
This is the no-win situation confronting O’Brien as he takes the stand, on an international live webcast, to face Mr Angus Stewart Senior Council, who has previously made mincemeat of every elder placed before him (even Slippery Spinks) and who now possesses the very publication that tells O’Brien how his own organization works.



The transcript records Stewart using the Handbook to establish Jackson’s role spanning multiple committees, including the writing committee and the teaching committee, both of which have direct involvement in the Commission’s area of interest. Then, the final nail in the coffin:
◾Stewart: I understand that you have not served as a member of the Governing Body, so I’m asking you from what your understanding is. But your understanding is that the seven members of the Governing Body, as a Governing Body, meet weekly, do they, every Wednesday?
◾O’Brien: Yes, so those who are present meet weekly.
◾Stewart. It will be that Governing Body as a whole, or those who are present, who would authorize the various publications and guides and guidelines, and so on; is that right?
◾O’Brien:. They would give the final approval for the publishing of them, yes.
◾Stewart: You will have heard yesterday that senior counsel representing the Jehovah’s Witnesses in Australia and the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society of Australia said that Mr Jackson would not be likely to be able to assist this Commission, because his role is in the translation of matters. Now, that, do you accept, is in clear variance to what you have explained in your evidence?
Think about it. What would you do? Admit the truth and your previous deception, or keep trying to deceive, even though it’s clear that the evidence to disprove your testimony is literally resting in the hands of your opponent? O’Brien makes his choice. Stick with the lie.
◾O’Brien No – sorry, it’s not. The translation, it comes under the writing committee, as I understand, which is what Mr Jackson is a member of.
 Stewart: But he’s also the coordinator of the teaching committee that has many other responsibilities, and not translation – not so?
◾O’Brien Yes, he – as a member of the Governing Body, he has a number —
◾Stewart. So can you explain, Mr O’Brien, how it came about that senior counsel representing the organization was given instructions that Mr Jackson’s role is confined to the translation of matters, when it clearly is not?
Finally! It took two solid days of testimony, of dancing around the issue by various senior elders, and dogged persistence by the Royal Commission to establish an answer to the simple question of: What does Geoffrey Jackson do? Two Days!
It’s not over yet. When Justice McClellan next speaks, the webcast audio records a softness to his tone that underscores that severity of the situation more than a raised voice ever could.
◾Justice McClellan: Mr O’Brian, did you give those instructions to senior counsel?
◾O’Brien: The instructions regarding Mr Jackson?
◾McClellan: Yes.
◾O’Brien: Yes.
◾McClellan: It led me to believe that there was little that Jackson could add to the discussion, and no doubt that is what you expected would happen; is that right?
◾O’Brien: That’s true, and I still concur with that.
◾McClellan: Well, I’m starting to form a totally different impression, I have to tell you.
The day ends on Watchtower’s worst case scenario: Justice McClellan issues a summons for Geoffrey Jackson. What will the fallout be?
At the time of writing, it is unknown if O’Brien will face charges. On the surface it would appear the case against him is compelling, and it’s clear both Mr Stewart and Justice McClellan viewed O’Brien’s misdirection seriously. Additionally, it’s clear this was part of a strategy of misdirection employed by every Branch-level elder who testified. Yet even if all involved escape legal sanction, the fact of their deception is preserved online for all the world to see.
Google doesn’t forget.
What of Jackson? He has three options.
1.Refuse to appear before the Commission, stay in the country to look after his reportedly dying father and go to prison.
2.Appear before the Commission and take part in the worst PR debacle the cult has even seen.
3.Refuse to appear, flee the country and make it clear to the world that he is so scared of the Commission he will even abandon his dying father to avoid testimony.
There is one final irony. As mentioned, the witness preceding O’Brien was Watchtower Australia’s top lawyer, Vince Toole. During his testimony, the concept of theocratic warfare was directly put to him:
◾Ms David: In the Watchtowers in 1957 and 1960, have you heard they say that: “As a soldier of Christ, you are in theocratic warfare and you must exercise added caution when dealing with God’s foes. Thus the scriptures show that for the purpose of protecting the interests of God’s cause it is proper to hide the truth from God’s enemies.” Have you heard of that?
◾Toole: No, and I’ve never read 1957 magazine articles, I’m sorry. I only became a Jehovah’s Witness in 1972.
◾Ms David: But, as a lawyer, you would be aware of such concepts, wouldn’t you – that you can lie to protect Jehovah’s name?
◾Toole: (Visibly angry) We are truthful. To be a Christian, you have to be truthful.
Maybe O’Brien didn’t get the memo?
 
CovertFade
 
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← Reflecting on the Australian Royal Commission (Day 3, Part 1)
An apology, and update on what’s in store for JWsurvey →
 
455 Responses to Royal Commission’s Angus Stewart accuses Watchtower representative of deliberate deception

← Older Comments
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 Idontknowhatodo says:

 August 14, 2015 at 7:30 am
 
Oooooh….women on the investigating body…….circumstances becoming a 2nd witness….no shunning of disassociated ones…etc…from the mouth of one of the GB….I wait with bated breath……not!
 Such wonderful and careful questioning…..
Because I had listened to every day of the RC I knew exactly where it was heading…GJ did not…
And the classic…..Thats a very good question…
Its called playing for time….
Reply
 
 
 Itfeelsgoodtobefree says:

 August 14, 2015 at 7:31 am
 
Hi All,
 Some articles are starting to surface about Geoffrey Jackson ‘s appearance in court, you won’t believe his arrogance!Ugh!
 1. http://www.9news.com.au/national/2015/08/14/03/37/inquiry-to-hear-from-top-jehovah-member
 2. http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/senior-jehovahs-witness-geoffrey-jackson-says-church-might-offer-redress-scheme-to-abuse-victims-20150813-giyxuu.html
 3. http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/sex-abuse-royal-commission-church-elder-reveals-seven-men-control-jehovahs-witness-teachings/story-e6frg6n6-1227483516098
Reply
 
 
 Simon Kestral says:

 August 14, 2015 at 8:44 am
 
Mr. Stewart discussed the one witness aspect of rape in De 22:25-27, and said Jesus was not talking about rape or child abuse in Mt 18.
Jackson replied he would like to ask Jesus about that, but Jesus was not available, or something to that effect.
They are such slaves to WT organization rules they can’t see what their own Bible plainly says: the two witness rule helps expedite simple cases, but it’s not the final word in matters of dispute. And because they are so insular, they ignore the clear provision given in De 17:8,9: take it to a judge (the secular authorities).
And of course WT ignores Jg 4:4, where Israel had a female judge.
Reply
 
 Mark says:

 August 15, 2015 at 11:02 am
 
Jackson replied he would like to ask Jesus about that, but Jesus was not available, or something to that effect.
What?! I thought that Jesus has been guiding this organisation since 1914 and has authorised the GB to make up the rules on his behalf.
And Jesus is not available?
The hotline doesn’t work?
Jesus isnt answering prayers at the moment?
You couldnt make this stuff up ….
Reply
 
 
 
 Pickled brain says:

 August 14, 2015 at 11:41 am
 
ABSOLUTELY BRILLIANT ANGUS STEWART in NAILING Geoffrey Jackson to the Wall or should I say STAKE!! If These Elders & Branch Servants& JW Lawyers are The Best Jehovah can Provide then I am GOING OVER to SATANs Worldly Side as they are more COMPASSIONATE,CARING,& CONCERNED about VICTIMS of CHILD SEX ABUSE!!
 Geoffrey Jackson !!! Where is YOUR APOLOGY to the Way your Elders handled those 1006 Sex ABUSE Cases!!! Where is your Christlike Demeanour since you claim you are going to rule beside him!
Reply
 
 
 Ted says:

 August 14, 2015 at 12:25 pm
 
A predictable outcome, no firm concessions on the main issues,
 2 witness rule, women as decision makers in a judicial capacity,
 shunning, sharing in a joint reparation scheme.
After failing to make a convincing defence of these concerns, he
 gave weak promises, that the gb, would give consideration to
 them. I think we can be sure, if changes are made it will be just
“Window dressing” ( as per blood fractions ).
Any J W still under the spell and who was watching will chalk it
 up as a win. The only way to get meaningful changes is to put
 their tax exemption on the line. I’m sure they’ll be able to come
 up with some new light to justify an about turn then. It wouldn’t
 be the. first time !
Reply
 
 Chiafade says:

 August 14, 2015 at 6:55 pm
 
Very true! If their money is at stake there will be all kinds of new light.
Reply
 
 
 
 Excelsior! says:

 August 14, 2015 at 12:51 pm
 
Ted,
As a fellow Brit, we can bring this evidence to the attention of the Charity Commission, who is investigating the WTBTS as we speak.
It would be good if we could have an Australian and a British version of the same elder letter, with practically the same wording, if not identical.
I’m good at ideas, but not good at doing them, so if anyone wants to have a go at that, then that would be great.
The ARC has been an excellent opening act, and its evidence and findings will assist us for years to come. We now have our own investigation here in the UK.
I know that some of us have already written to the committee, but it doesn’t hurt for more of us to do so. Drop them an email and have your part in the process.
Peace be with you, Excelsior!
Reply
 
 
 Grace says:

 August 14, 2015 at 2:51 pm
 
I noticed how caring Mr Jackson was to take time out from tending to his dying father to see what Mr Spinks had testified to at the RC but he didn’t have time to read BCG or BCB’s statements to get insight into the pain these women had suffered for years.
That in itself showed the spirit of these spiritual men.
Reply
 
 Excelsior! says:

 August 15, 2015 at 4:18 am
 
Grace,
Great point! He went further, though. He used Spink’s testimony to shove Spink under the bus!
The elders and branch workers passed the buck up to the governing body, then a governing body member passed the buck down to unnamed helpers at various branches!
Peace be with you, Excelsior!
Reply
 
 
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 14, 2015 at 3:15 pm
 
Yes, and I also couldn’t get over that he had not heard of this stuff going on before. Please Mr Jackson. Tell us another porky pie. Anyone can go look on Youtube to see the evidence in the form of news stories and documentaries on the Watchtower’s history of not giving a stuff about child sexual abuse. I’m not clever enough to put a link on here but you can find Bill Bowen’s (incidentally, my hero) efforts to organise a famous march in 2002 after he formed the Silentlambs.org, in the middle of New York City straight down to Bethel Headquarters in Brooklyn with quite a number of victims. The Governing Body sent a number of Bethelites to go to the gates and lock them, away from the victims, like they were some kind of danger and threat to their very existence. I was disgusted and wrote to Bethel in Sydney about it. No reply of course. They left toy lambs on the steps as a symbol of their plight and pain. God love them. Now how can that man sit there pompouslike and say he wasn’t aware of the situation. What a big fat lie.
Reply
 
 
 Decimvs says:

 August 14, 2015 at 5:56 pm
 
Jackson was not quite as inept as I thought he might have been prior to taking the stand. To be fair, on the plus side, he was poised, respectful, articulate, not cocky, all-in-all he gave a good account of himself, he was quite slick. If anybody out there was expecting or hoping that he would collapse in a heap or discredit the Watchtower Society in any way you would be disappointed. True he was evasive on occasion, his answers were of topic at times and it was obvious he made a concerted effort to avoid any compromising entanglements. If this was a boxing match and points were awarded I would say 60/40 overall in favour of the Crown.
Reply
 
 Criticus says:

 August 17, 2015 at 12:14 pm
 
I totally disagree with Mr. Jackson “not being cocky.” True, he never lost it, but he was at times VERY condescending, in a quite sophisticated way though. Repeatedly, he tacitly told the commission off: “May I correct your statement?” One of the highlights was this one: “Well, this is always the problem when ‘worldly commissions’ are trying to explain the Bible. May I help you with this?” At several occasions, he made it clear who the all-knowing ones are as respects Bible interpretation, like, when saying cheerfully: “I am glad you give me the opportunity to elaborate on this”, and then graciously opening his treasure store of heavenly wisdom. One cannot help but note that he is not in want of self-confidence, like at the beginning, when stating with conviction: “I WAS APPOINTED TO SERVE ON THE GB BEC. OF MY SPIRITUAL QUALIFICATIONS.” Oh yeah. The one exalting himself will be humiliated, dear Mr. Jackson. But I guess without this chuzpe, this reckless self-confidence and audacity you cannot really pull through in such a position as being a member of this self-appointed human central committee pretending to be the sole an dexclusively chosed divine mouthpiece.
Reply
 
 
 
 anonymous says:

 August 14, 2015 at 6:36 pm
 
Mr. Stewart called Mr. Jackson a “scholar” which really bothered me. I don’t see Mr. Jackson as a scholar at all. Mr. Jackson made a comment that when it comes to headship that there are many happy wives in the organization. I wonder just how happy those wives would be if they had the Shepherd the Flock book where they could read it for themselves, especially on pages 84, 85 where it talks about when the accused is a wife and the husband gets to attend the committee and hearing meetings but when it comes to the husband, she does not get to attend his meeting because of his confidentiality. Also, it says that during that meeting with the elders when the husband is accused of adultery or anything else, he can go on and on about all his adultery and the wife doesn’t get to know what all he said during that meeting but she is supposed to ask him what all he said during that meeting but they aren’t allowed to tell her and he doesn’t have to tell her and if she resumes relations with him, now she is not allowed to get a scriptural divorce from him. All the elders can do is “suggest” to the wife that she talk to him again. I can’t think of a more disgusting way to treat women than the JW religion!!! There is a good reason, the elders don’t want that book public information.
Reply
 
 
 Amy says:

 August 14, 2015 at 8:58 pm
 
I’m wondering what is going to be done about all this. So anxious to know if the Watchtower is going to pay in some form or fashion. What about the abusers in each of the cases that were covered up? Are they going to be investigated and punished by law? I think that if someone is covering up someone’s crimes, that makes them an accessory to the crime!
Reply
 
 steve Middleton says:

 August 15, 2015 at 2:58 am
 
I bet the WTBATS are right now hiving off their land holdings, cash and other assets in ring fenced companies in lieu of the litigation risk. They have been covering up child abuse for years and have finally been caught out.
Reply
 
 
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 14, 2015 at 8:58 pm
 
What he said was very ambiguous. While trying to not get his fellow GB men angry by giving away too much, he was also trying to appease the Commission. What comes of this will be interesting in the final outcome when they fail to perform the changes they are supposed to make as the GB flatly reject some of the suggestions.
Reply
 
 ScotWm says:

 August 14, 2015 at 10:05 pm
 
The interrogators were seeking an admission from Jackson that there is no graceful way to leave the Watchtower cult. You are either in, or you are out and shunned. This fact was used to illustrate how a female child sex abuse victim might be reluctant to reveal the crime to a judicial committee. If they didn’t believe her, she might be thrown out of the cult.
Jackson refused to concede this point and he told the commission that the church would not change a rule which requires alleged sex abuse victims to appear before a committee of male elders.
Reply
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 15, 2015 at 3:03 pm
 
That’s right. So she just has to cop it sweet and “wait on Jehovah”. And if that turns her or him inside out then that’s her fault for not having enough faith. As far as they are concerned, if she loses her faith then she is worse than the perpetrator. What a screwy, cruel religion.
Reply
 
 
 
 
 ScotWm says:

 August 14, 2015 at 10:29 pm
 
Geoffrey Jackson made a serious concession which could cause him some problems with the Governing Body. He indicated that the Watchtower might provide apologies and compensation for child sex abuse victims who were further abused by the Watchtower’s “less than perfect” responses to sex crimes.
There will never be apologies to sex abuse victims from the Watchtower Governing Body. Governing Body member Stephen Lett has already gone on record stating that those stories, which claim that the Watchtower is permissive toward pedophyles, are “apostate-driven lies and dishonesties.” The Watchtower Governing Body will never admit to any wrongdoing in this matter.
If the Watchtower officially offered any admission that its handling of child sex abuse crimes was “less than perfect”, it would open a floodgate of new lawsuits and a Watchtower apology could be used by the victims as evidence in court. Having Governing Body member Geoffrey Jackson state that apologies from the Watchtower may be forthcoming could mark the beginning of the end for him as a Governing Body member.
However, Jackson was correct in saying that there may be Watchtower financed compensation to sex abuse victims. Compensation will continue to be paid by the Watchtower in the form of court judgments and secret out of court settlements.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-08-14/compensation-may-be-on-the-cards-for-victims-of/6699236
Reply
 
 Chiafade says:

 August 15, 2015 at 7:26 pm
 
If there were to be an apology I imagine that it would not be public. It would come in the form of a generic branch letter. I doubt that they would broadcast it on JW.org even though they should.
Reply
 
 
 
 Queen Elsa says:

 August 14, 2015 at 11:08 pm
 
I would like to know when the governing body ever officially apologized for anything as GJ stated… I can’t think of anytime in history…
Reply
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 15, 2015 at 2:13 am
 
They actually did. During the Second World War, the Australia Branch were running low on certain things. I cannot remember what but they began making their own stuff because of all the rationing and not being able to get regular supplies. Apparently, it worked well for them, and when the war ended, they turned the making of these supplies into commercial businesses. Eventually, they came to realise that it was wrong to be making money commercially from a religion so they apologised to Jehovah at an assembly. I don’t know if they had conventions then. That was just in Australia. Maybe that is what Jackson was referring to. How things have changed since then.
Reply
 
 
 ScotWm says:

 August 15, 2015 at 9:00 am
 
“With the appearance of the book ‘Life Everlasting – In the Freedom of the Sons of God’, and its comments as to how appropriate it would be for the millennial reign of Christ to parallel the seventh millennium of man’s existence, considerable expectation was aroused regarding the year 1975. There were statements made then, and thereafter, stressing that this was only a possibility. Unfortunately, however, along with such cautionary information, there were other statements published that implied that such realization of hopes by that year was more of a probability than a mere possibility.” Watchtower March 15, 1980.
And here’s the Watchtower’s weak, insincere, passive-voice apology to those foolish enough to believe Fred Franz’ false prophecy:
“It is to be regretted that these latter statements apparently overshadowed the cautionary ones and contributed to a buildup of the expectation already initiated.”
The Watchtower Governing Body then went on to blame its lowly cult believers for failing to understand that the 1975 date was “only a possibility” and not a definite date.
http://www.culthelp.info/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=331&Itemid=8
Reply
 
 
 
 anonymous says:

 August 15, 2015 at 3:06 am
 
I wish that Mr. Stewart would push what the Shepherd the Flock book says but in my opinion are falling short. This is what it says on page 72:
#38
“If wrongdoing has not been established but serious questions have been raised, the body of elders should appoint two elders to investigate the matter promptly. For example, there may be just one witness. If so, it would be loving for the witness to confront the accused and encourage him to take the initiative to approach the elders. The elders can then allow the accused a few days to approach them. (For the witness by himself to confront the accused may not be advisable in all cases-for example, if the witness and the accused were involved in sexual immorality together or if the witness was a victim of incest or rape by the accused or is a child and the victim of sexual abuse. Or it may be that the witness is extremely timid.) Whether the witness approaches the accused or not, the two elders appointed should speak with the accused.
 39
 If the accused denies the accusation, the investigating elders should try to arrange a meeting with him and the accuser together. (Note: If the accusation involves child sexual abuse and the victim is currently a minor, the elders should contact the branch office before arranging a meeting with the child and the alleged abuser.) If the accuser OR THE ACCUSED is unwilling to meet with the elders or if the accused continues to deny the accusation of a single witness and the wrongdoing is not established, the elders will leave matters in Jehovah’s hands.”
The Australia Commission only seems interested in the fact that the Society is insisting the the accuser does not have to appear before her accuser at a committee meeting but the Shepherd the Flock book clearly says that if the accused refuses the accusation and the accuser has no other witnesses, that no committee meeting will be held to determine whether or not the accused actually committed the crime and the elders will leave it in Jehovah’s hands.
If the accused is an elder, that elder has the Shepherd the Flock book and knows that all they have to do is deny the accusation and refuse to appear before the committee.
Also, if a woman tells the elders that she has been raped, that woman will have to convince the elders of the rape or she could be disfellowshipped for pornea or adultery. A woman can’t just say they were raped. So for instance, the woman is married and she gets raped and gets pregnant. She has to convince the elders that she was raped. She can’t just say she was raped. Since she became pregnant by another man’s sperm, if she can’t prove she was raped, the husband could have grounds for a scriptural divorce.
Reply
 
 
 anonymous says:

 August 15, 2015 at 3:49 am
 
In the “Pay Attention to Yourselves and to all the Flock” book from 1981, on page 150 under the topic of Self-Defense it says: “A woman threatened with rape should resist by screaming and physically resisting. (Deut. 22:23-27; 1 Cor. 6:18) Other details are given in w68 6/1 pp. 345-350; g73 4/22 pp. 16,17.”
This is what it says in that 1968 Watchtower from June 1, on page 347 “Resistance is imperative, because the rapist is after, not just money, but your virtue. An issue of integrity to Jehovah’s laws is involved here. So by no means would it be proper quietly to submit to rape, as that would be consenting to fornication. – 1 Thess. 4:3…..Would it be different if the man had a weapon and threatened to kill you if you did not submit? No, the Scriptures plainly state that Christians are under obligation to “flee from fornication.” (1 Cor. 6:18) It is true that you face the possibility of death in this case. But you have no guarantee that if you meekly submit, your assailant will not kill you anyhow to avoid identification.”
If a woman or a young child claims to have been raped, she has to prove it or not make the claim. No matter what those men say on the stand, the Society will make that girl or woman prove that they were molested or raped and if not, nothing is done about it.
If the accused denies the claim, no committee meeting will be held and the accused is considered still in “good standing” in the congregation and so it will bring “reproach” on God’s name if they report it to the police.
All those men who the Commission has brought up on the stand for the Society are not telling the “whole truth and nothing but the truth” and that to them is okay because it’s “theocratic warfare”.
Reply
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 15, 2015 at 3:09 pm
 
I think Stewart was just concentrating on this particular case and BCG’s comments in her statement. I am sure anonymous this aspect of the book will be analysed when other cases are examined. According to Grace there are many to be analysed.
Reply
 
 anonymous says:

 August 15, 2015 at 4:38 pm
 
Meredith J, is there more to the commission looking into the Jehovah’s Witness religion and child sex abuse? I can’t remember where I saw it but it sounded like Jackson’s testimony was the last one concerning the Witnesses. If so, I am disappointed as I think there’s a lot more to be exposed than what has been brought out so far.
Reply
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 15, 2015 at 10:46 pm
 
I know as much as you anonymous. Perhaps there will be more revealed next week about the subject on the Royal Commission website. They had a pattern of reporting every few days of what their next steps were. I have no doubt they will reveal in time what they will do. They seem to keep investigating each institution behind the scenes. Some churches and schools have had continuous investigation after their first hearing.
I have been told by my daughter whose husband is friends with one of the victims who appeared in the Sunday program in Australia around 2006 that they (all the victims on the show) have been speaking to the Commission also. I am not sure but the wheels seem to be in motion for more action, whether it is through the commission or court cases but now there is a precedent set so that makes it so much easier now I’d say than it was before the ARC. Finally, the world including the legal profession are seeing what is really going on.
I also read a report from the Washington Post about the ARC and they said (not sure where they got these figures from. They may or may not be correct) that they had 5,000 cases. I don’t know if that is pure speculation or if there was a leak but that is what the Washington Post said, not me. However you look at it, it can’t be good for the Watchtower.
Reply
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 15, 2015 at 11:08 pm
 
I just wanted to add that what I have said is heresay and nothing else. Sometimes I just have a big mouth.

 
 
 
 Enuffsenuff says:

 August 15, 2015 at 11:46 pm
 
There is more to the Commissions work with JW’s it just wont be online. Meredith J referred to the Washington Post, which has an interesting articlehttps://www.washingtonpost.com/world/asia_pacific/jehovahs-witnesses-face-child-sex-abuse-investigation-in-australia/2015/08/14/d8a58eda-406e-11e5-9561-4b3dc93e3b9a_story.html
 World
Reply
 
 
 
 
 
 Ted says:

 August 15, 2015 at 4:53 am
 
Excelsior,
 Your suggestion to write to the Charity commission in Britain
 Is a way of doing something positive about the rottenness in
 JW.org, while the opportunity exists.
One email may seem like a whisper but many added together
 can make a big noise, and cause someone to take notice.
 Best wishes Ted.
Reply
 
 Grace says:

 August 15, 2015 at 2:49 pm
 
To Excelsior & Ted,
That’s sounds like a great idea. If you could provide email links to everyone, I for one would write from Australia as this is not just an Australian problem, it’s a worldwide problem with Jehovah’s Witnesses. I hope that they hold a Royal Commission In Britain & the US as well.
It was heartwarming & confidence building for us Aussies to know that letters to the ARC were sent from around the world in support for us here.
Love & Peace to you all.
Reply
 
 
 
 Ted says:

 August 16, 2015 at 6:38 am
 
Grace,
 Thanks for your enquiry, The commission has an on line form
 that you can access. If you type in, —
Complain about a charity – GOV.UK That will get you to the
 relevant page.
Then move down the page to the bold type heading, —
 “Other serious complaints”, underneath that you will see
“Report serious concerns.” If you tap on that it will bring up
 the form.
Like most people I’m not keen on forms, but even if you phoned
 or wrote a letter they’d still ask you to fill it in. I understand the
 commission has received more complaints about JWs than any
 other charity. If anyone else has better info, on how to contact
 the charity commission I would welcome it.
Best wishes Ted.
Reply
 
 Grace says:

 August 17, 2015 at 10:33 pm
 
Thank you Ted,
I will get a draft ready to send. I want to make sure I word it well.
Gosh! more complaints than any other charity? That’s got to be a huge red flag there.
Reply
 
 
 
 Pickled brain says:

 August 16, 2015 at 2:23 pm
 
Has anyone seen the Latest DISGUSTING 3 minute Video on TV.JW.Org of how Jehovah’s Loving? Organisation of Brothers & Sisters helped a SEX ABUSE Victim prior to coming into the truth!!! Very very strange this video was put out yesterday so soon after Geoffrey Jackson Testified to Royal Commission!! Makes me SO ANGRY as if Jehovah’s Organisation SOooo HELPS SEX ABUSE Victims!!
 Oh if it wasn’t so SICKENING!!
Reply
 
 Garrett says:

 August 16, 2015 at 5:32 pm
 
Pickled Brain,
 We will have our revenge and vindication. This cult is just digging its own grave. There are many savvy witnesses out there that see the timing of the commission and the skit on TV and realize it’s just more Watchtower damage control and propaganda under the guise of “caring” . We’ll get em! It’ll just take time.
 G
Reply
 
 Pickled brain says:

 August 16, 2015 at 7:36 pm
 
@Garrett . Thanks for your comments & YES WE WILL GET THEM ; I thought Geoffrey Jackson showed ABSOLUTELY NO LOVE or COMPASSION with ABSOLUTELY NO PERSONAL APOLOGY to the CHILD SEX ABUSE VICTIMS who were handled DISGUSTINGLY by the MEN ELDERS!
 Where is the Christlike Attitude??!?
 Yes you are right that there are MANY SAVVY JWs & I am one of them working on the inside still playing the Game of my OWN THEOCRATIC WARFARE but in Reverse Determined to Save my Family & STUFF the 7 SMIRKING SLIMEY 7 MEN of the Governing Body & These WICKED ELDERS !!!
Reply
 
 
 
 
 Pickled brain says:

 August 16, 2015 at 8:45 pm
 
The 7 MEN of the GB have NO LIVE,JUSTICE,MERCY or FAITHFULNESS towards any SEXUALLY ABUSED CHILD! Nor Have ANY of the ELDERS who are ACCESSORIES to the POLICIES of the Governing Body!!
 Would JESUS Agree with A Policy of putting a CHILD in front of 3 Elders & the CRIMINAL ABUSER many who were Elders & Ministerial Servants going over All the DISGUSTING DETAILS !! The WHOLE Hierarchy is Perverted!! Look at Previous members of the Governing Body : LEO GREENLEES & EWART CHITTY who were removed. These were the ones who were found out!! BUNCH of FLIPPING PERVERTS!!
Reply
 
 Pickled brain says:

 August 16, 2015 at 8:48 pm
 
Apologies but in the first line where I said ‘LIVE’ it should have been ‘LOVE’
Reply
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 17, 2015 at 2:09 am
 
Now that makes more sense.
Reply
 
 
 
 
 JKL says:

 August 17, 2015 at 12:58 am
 
The transcript is now ready to be downloaded here under August 14:
http://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/case-study/636f01a5-50db-4b59-a35e-a24ae07fb0ad/case-study-29,-july-2015,-sydney.aspx
Reply
 
 
 Excelsior! says:

 August 17, 2015 at 3:20 am
 
Folks,
I just watched the three minute video on JW Broadcasting, which is an interview with a child abuse survivor.
I have great sympathy for the lady who was abused, as we all do. Her abuser, it seems, was not one of Jehovah’s Witnesses. And still she is not encouraged to go to the police! That’s right, folks! The WTBTS even protect paedophiles WHO ARE NOT JEHOVAH’S WITNESSES.
This is what the governing body feel is the correct response to the ARC? Immoral and useless!
That poor lady was not encouraged to get professional help for her psychological trauma. She was not encouraged to go to the police.
We are going to win, WTBTS. Eventually, you will be held accountable for what you have done, and continue to do.
Peace be with you, Excelsior!
Reply
 
 
 Nemorino says:

 August 17, 2015 at 3:32 am
 
Our friend Meleti Vivlon over at Beroean Pickets published an excellent accounting of Geoffrey Jackson’s performance before the RC, which I recommend to all concerned.
I quite agree with Decimus when he said, above: “Jackson was not quite as inept as I thought he might have been prior to taking the stand. To be fair, on the plus side, he was poised, respectful, articulate, not cocky, all-in-all he gave a good account of himself, he was quite slick.”
Still, there was more than enough in his testimony to indict him and his organization for willful deception and disingenuous obfuscation. He put about the best face the organization could have put on the situation; I guess
 JWs can thank Jehovah it was he, not Tony Morris or Stephen Lett on the stand!
Reply
 
 
 anonymous says:

 August 17, 2015 at 3:57 am
 
Nemorino, thank you for telling us about that site. I was especially impressed how it brought out that Jeff Jackson actually called the Watchtower Society presumptuous by claiming to be the only spokesmen for God, which of course we know they do claim to be. Mr. Jackson said it would be presumptuous to be calling itself God’s sole spokesman. That is something we can all use and it came straight from a Governing Body member.
Reply
 
 Searcher says:

 August 18, 2015 at 7:47 am
 
The definition of presumptuous: “(of a person or their behavior) failing to observe the limits of what is permitted or appropriate.”
Yes! I agree with Mr. Jackson! It would be presumptuous for the WTBTS to claim itself as the only spokesmen for God. I would like to say in retort to Mr. Jackson, “Yes, you are presumptuous!”
Reply
 
 
 
 Kat says:

 August 17, 2015 at 4:56 am
 
STEWART: “Well it’s hypothetical in a sense, but what I’m driving at is, is the scriptural basis – and you’re the scholar, I’m not – is the scriptural basis for the two-witness rule really solid, or is there not space for your Governing Body to recognize that in cases of sexual abuse it can’t apply?”
JACKSON: “Again, if I could just mention the fact that we’ve already acknowledged that circumstances can also be one of the witnesses.”
STEWART: “Well, I’ll come to that but my question is a different one. It’s whether the scriptural basis to the two-witness rule in relation to cases of sexual abuse has a proper foundation?”
JACKSON: “We believe that it does because of the number of times that that principle is emphasized in the Scriptures.”
It would seem that Brother Jackson feels that the number of times the two-witnesses principle is emphasized in the Scriptures means that there is no possibility of an exception to it. The fact is that it is found 5 times in all of Scripture: Regarding false worship (De 17:6); interpersonal disputes (De 19:15-20; Mt 18:15-17); accusations against one in authority (2Co 13:1; 1Ti 5:19). It is never applied to sins of sexual abuse or rape.
Mr. Stewart has provided Brother Jackson with a valid scriptural basis for disregarding the two-witness rule in cases of sexual abuse and rape, but Brother Jackson feels that the question is hypothetical and cannot be determined until such time as he meets Jesus to ask him.
 Is the Governing Body God’s channel of communication or not?
Earlier in his testimony Brother Jackson says that they arrive at their decisions based on an examination of all Scripture, not just selected verses. Here is an excellent example of just that methodology and yet he seems unwilling to apply it. Instead he doggedly sticks to established JW tradition.
http://meletivivlon.com/2015/08/16/geoffrey-jackson-speaks-before-the-royal-commission-on-child-abuse/
Reply
 
 Excelsior! says:

 August 17, 2015 at 8:26 am
 
Kat,
Fantastic logic in your penultimate paragraph!
Why doesn’t Jehovah reveal the answer to this question through the Holy Spirit? After all, the whole Organisation is supposedly spirit-directed, isn’t it?
It was fascinating to hear the gibberish spewing forth from Mr Jackson’s mouth. He sounded as if he were giving a talk at an assembly, rather than answering serious, pointed questions under oath! And that’s the point. Mr Jackson knows that the public of Australia is now disgusted by the WTBTS. They won’t be getting many new converts now! So, his whole testimony was pitched towards the rank and file. It was all about creating enough of a smoke screen using unconnected bible verses to fool the already indoctrinated that the WTBTS’ child protection policies are completely bible based and so cannot be changed.
I hope that Mr Jackson will be able to be there for his father. As a human being, I have sympathy with him, having lost my own father four years ago.
As a religious, Christian leader, he is a disgrace. I did not feel as if a “brother of Christ” was talking. He did not inspire confidence in me at all. His insult to people who attend “your churches” was a classic cult statement. Thanks for that, Geoffrey!
Still, at least Mr Jackson told us that the assumption by the WTBTS that it is God’s sole channel on earth is presumptuous! I wonder if he could direct us to the other channels? Because I certainly don’t want to be using his one anymore, with all this child sexual assault going on!
Peace be with you, Excelsior!
Reply
 
 
 
 Excelsior! says:

 August 17, 2015 at 8:14 am
 
Folks,
I just had a brilliant idea! I was watching Katie Kitten’s latest video, and it came to me, fully formed and tied with a bow.
This is something we can do internationally.
My cunning plan is this: we call the bethel in our country, posing as a loyal witness. We make up a name and congregation. We ask the branch to confirm our interpretation of Tony Morris the 3rd’s order to report child abuse to the “appropriate authorities” as meaning the police. We tell them that we have had a worldly relative present us with apostate driven lies about there being a problem with paedophilia in Jehovah God’s clean Organisation. We wait for the Bethelite to confirm our interpretation.
If the Bethelite doesn’t confirm that the “appropriate authorities” are the police, we have them!
If the Bethelite does confirm that the “appropriate authorities” are the police, we have them!
We need to record clearly the whole conversation, and then we can upload them to YouTube as an international phenomenon!
Sound like a good idea? Please let me know what you think. I believe it could be a really good bit of activism, disguised as loyal rank and file JWs defending the honour of their “spirit-directed Organisation” from those evil apostate, gangrenous, mentally diseased ex JWs!
Peace be with you, Excelsior!
Reply
 
 Simon Kestral says:

 August 17, 2015 at 8:23 am
 
No, encouraging people to violate fraud and wiretapping laws is not a good idea.
If you want to take legal action against WT, hire a lawyer.
Reply
 
 zeebo says:

 August 18, 2015 at 5:16 am
 
Well its not obtaining goods or services by deception, so it isn’t fraud.
Recording your own call (not being a third party) is perfectly legal, and if you are still worried you can simply say at the end “Is it ok if i pass this info on? I mean it isn’t PRIVATE is it?”.. of course they will say its ok.
Reply
 
 Simon Kestral says:

 August 18, 2015 at 3:35 pm
 
Legal in some jurisdictions, not in others:
http://www.dmlp.org/legal-guide/recording-phone-calls-and-conversations
Reply
 
 
 
 
 Searcher says:

 August 18, 2015 at 7:56 am
 
I have to say this with all due respect, but two wrongs don’t make it right. Let them fight below board. The elders and GB are both showing what side-steppers and dancers they are to try and cover their tracks. Don’t stoop to their level of deception. Stay with the law.
Reply
 
 Excelsior! says:

 August 19, 2015 at 8:36 am
 
Searcher,
Thanks for your respectful and pertinent comment.
I take it that you would be willing to call and ask if:
1. You used your own name, address, congregation and current status with the WTBTS (current, disfellowshipped etc)
2. You did not record the telephone call
Is that correct?
Thank you, folks, for giving me your opinions. They are of great help to me. I want what is best for the women and children of this disgusting cult, and your insights help me to ensure that my activism is the best it can be.
Peace be with you, Excelsior!
Reply
 
 
 
 
 Excelsior! says:

 August 17, 2015 at 8:32 am
 
Simon Kestral,
Thank you for pointing this out. Do you have any suggestions to modify my plan?
Peace be with you, Excelsior!
Reply
 
 
 al etheredge says:

 August 17, 2015 at 9:45 am
 
I’ve been away from my computer for a couple of days. What’s happened in the meantime?
Reply
 
 
 rob says:

 August 17, 2015 at 2:38 pm
 
Jackson was very smooth and slithery and used his hand gestures to make himself look more credible and authoritative and he also used stalling tactics to compose his thoughts – such as “that is a good question”.
Clearly he was coached by the lawyers.
But when he skirted many questions by saying “I don’t know and that is not my department” He was lying and he lost credibility. We all know that everything is micromanaged by the inner circle at headquarters and they control everything. He clearly did not want to provide an answer that could get him into hot water at headquarters.
He may get many accolades from his GB buddies for this performance and for standing up to this persecution and what they will call “Satan’s media” but I and many others saw through the lies and evasion and dodging of questions. More importantly God saw through this as well.
My hope is that one day in the not too distant future, the poor victims of this awful religion will be compensated and will have justice.
Reply
 
 al etheredge says:

 August 17, 2015 at 9:42 pm
 
Thanks for the info.
Reply
 
 
 
 anonymous says:

 August 17, 2015 at 3:05 pm
 
If I wasn’t a Witness and I was watching those men on the stand, I would see them as creepy and trying to hide something. That goes for every one of those men and the woman they hired to represent their teachings, came off as ignorant of the teachings. I agree with Louise Goode. I don’t think anybody who wasn’t a Witness would want anything to do with them when they go knocking on doors from now on in Australia.
Reply
 
 
 Jack says:

 August 17, 2015 at 6:01 pm
 
After the hearing mr. G. Jackson, i wonder why not there new articles from Cedars. I am waiting impatiently!!!
Reply
 
 Queen Elsa says:

 August 17, 2015 at 10:10 pm
 
I know me too! My guess…they are analyzing the entire thing… I can’t wait to see the final analysis!
Reply
 
 
 
 questionall451 says:

 August 17, 2015 at 7:16 pm
 
I like to watch a TV series called Deadly Devotion. It has covinced me that no matter how fanatical, abusive, bizzare, or hypocritical the Watchtower becomes, they will continue to be around for a long time. They may hemorrhage members and money, but there will always be a core of ultra indoctrinated poeple who will completely shut off all common sense and blindly follow these men with the passion of psychotic lunatics. It won’t end until the GB makes everyone drink the kool-aid.
I find it fascinating how easily people will hand over their conscience, free will and gut instincts to others; how much people want to be led by others; how quickly the religious mind betrays the very principle that should be central to any religion – love. I believe in faith, but I would have thought that there is an obvious line between faith and “kool-aid”. If that line isn’t obvious then our religion doesn’t have love and has truly failed us.
My parents are along in years and I sometimes wonder if trying to “wake them up” is even the loving thing to do. It would be devastating to get to the end of your life only to find that everything you’ve ever believed is a lie. My relatives continue to insist that it is all just the actions of a few bad apples in the bunch, but “Jehovah will take care of them”. I wonder how far it has to go and what it’s going to take for them understand that their faith is in the traditions and doctrines of men.
Reply
 
 
 Ted says:

 August 18, 2015 at 3:27 am
 
questionall451,
 Very good comments. I have relatives, some of whom have wasted
 up to 55 years serving this organisation and some who are extremely
 ill. They tell me they are just waiting for the new world to have their
 bodies repaired and they don’t want that taken away from them.
So I have decided it’s not the loving thing to do, to disillusion them.
 There’s no point to it at this stage of their life, it would be snatching
 the straw from a drowning man.
Thankfully I woke up 34 years ago with a good part of my life in front
 of me, although they did get most of my youth. Wasted years that
 could have been used in a more worthwhile way.
Best wishes, Ted
Reply
 
 
 Mark says:

 August 18, 2015 at 5:06 am
 
Q. And do you see yourselves as Jehovah God’s spokespeople on earth?
A. That I think would seem to be quite presumptuous to say that we are the only spokesperson that God is using. The scriptures clearly show that someone can act in harmony with God’s spirit in giving comfort and help in the congregations, but if I could just clarify a little, going back to Matthew 24, clearly, Jesus said that in the last days ‐ and Jehovah’s Witnesses believe these are the last days ‐ there would be a slave, a group of persons who would have responsibility to care for the spiritual food. So in that respect, we view ourselves as trying to fulfil that role.
A rare but welcome example of humility from the Governing Body?
….
….
Q. Is it not the case that had Jesus been asked about a case of sexual abuse, he may have referred back to this part of Deuteronomy and said that it’s not required to have two witnesses?
A. I certainly would like to ask Jesus that, and I can’t at the moment, I hope to in the future. But that’s a hypothetical question which, if we had an answer, then we could support what you said.
Why not? Has Jesus not returned since 1914 and been running this organisation? Then why can’t the GB ask Jesus for guidance right now? Are prayers not being answered at the moment? So when for example Tight Pants Tony goes off on another rant, is it safe to assume that he is just abusing his position of ‘slave’ to foist his personal opinions on others, opinions that have not been endorsed by Jesus as he isn’t taking calls right now? Does he not have a duty to make that clear so that the wider JW community can choose to ignore him should they so choose?
I welcome the less arrogant tone of Jackson but his answers do raise questions about the credibility of the Governing Body to direct the ‘flock’ when a member freely admits that he has no way of communicating with Jesus, especially on such a damaging issue that threatens to destroy the reputation of the entire organisation and alienate people who might otherwise give them a chance?
Reply
 
 Simon Kestral says:

 August 18, 2015 at 7:18 am
 
Jackson may appear less arrogant with his manner and smile, but they all support the same lie: the WT “faithful and discreet slave” is completely trusted by Jesus.
They didn’t wait for an answer from Jesus when claiming the title of “faithful and discreet slave” for themselves, so why do they need a direct answer from Jesus to understand the two witness rule?
De 17:8,9 already provides the clear answer: take the case to a judge. Why can’t they see that simple truth? Why do they need Jesus to tell them what the Bible plainly says? Those verses do not require interpretation; just read them and apply common sense.
When Jackson said the governing body’s role is to guard WT doctrine, he revealed a deep flaw: they substitute WT doctrine for Jesus, and worship the WT organization in place of God.
We should not expect truth or honesty from an organization that claimed the title of “faithful and discreet slave” all the way back in 1881. You can’t build a house of truth on a foundation of lies.
Reply
 
 Excelsior! says:

 August 18, 2015 at 2:50 pm
 
Simon Kestral,
All the governing body need to do is read Romans 13.
There is no need for a slave, faithful or otherwise, to protect vulnerable children and young people from paedophiles.
Child abuse is a crime. The police need to investigate crime and the courts need to prosecute criminals, and punish accordingly.
This is in complete harmony with God, Jesus and all the Holy Angels.
I have no interest in who the faithful and discreet slave is. If Jesus was raised on the third day, then he has everything in hand.
All we need to do is be loving to other people and everything will be fine.
Peace be with you, Excelsior!
Reply
 
 Gameisover says:

 August 18, 2015 at 11:45 pm
 
In two words you’ve said everything. Thank you Excelsior.
Reply
 
 
 
 
 Excelsior! says:

 August 19, 2015 at 8:28 am
 
Mark,
Excellent argument, sir!
Just how “spirit-directed” are they? How does Jesus “talk” with the Annointed governing body anyway?
The Jesus I have read about in the New Testament would want children and young people to be protected from paedophiles. He would never have instigated or condoned behaviour or procedure that harmed anyone, especially children.
Peace be with you, Excelsior!
Reply
 
 
 
 zeebo says:

 August 18, 2015 at 5:23 am
 
Governing body is a just one big lemon party!
Reply
 
 
 Jakemon75 says:

 August 18, 2015 at 7:31 am
 
Minor complaint. I have been telling everyone I knew that a “Body Member” would be supplying testimony to the Royal Commission and to read the fine coverage at jwsurvey.
It’s Tuesday…………………. I’m sure the administrator and your team are working on something, but this didn’t get any in depth coverage anywhere that I could find. Counting on you guys and can’t wait to read some substantive analysis.
Thanks in advance.
Reply
 
 pnavaja says:

 August 18, 2015 at 10:23 am
 
Here’s a Transcript (Day 155): 14 Augusthttp://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/downloadfile.ashx?guid=5d6d5636-001a-4e8e-84b2-2d8338ec25fa&type=transcriptpdf&filename=Transcript-(Day-155)&fileextension=pdf
Reply
 
 pnavaja says:

 August 18, 2015 at 10:40 am
 
Pages 42 – 45 Is the two-witness rule really so solid?
Reply
 
 
 
 Grace says:

 August 18, 2015 at 3:06 pm
 
Jakemon75,
Maybe they’re having to put their brain in overdrive over this one because for me, Jackson spoke a lot of riddles & I’ve had to sit & read each one of his answers to understand what the hell he was saying. There were many things that stuck with me about his answers but I haven’t been able to put it to words. All I can think is that he spoke a lot of “BWB”.
One thing that stuck with me besides those that were already brought out here was that same thought stopping cliche that he used about JC’s & disfellowshipping used for the sake of “keeping the congregation clean”. My question is who is deemed “clean” enough to judge another man of his uncleanliness? Aren’t we all meant to be unclean because of imperfection?
I think that JC’s, disfellowshipping & shunning create a toxic environment of self-righteousness & judgement especially where there is an abuse of power & secrecy.
Reply
 
 
 
 rob says:

 August 18, 2015 at 7:56 am
 
@questionall451
Your comments are very insightful and I do agree that some people will blindly follow and just want to be told what to do. Perhaps the watchtower gives them structure or a sense of belonging to a group.
Unfortunately they do give up their freedoms and ability to question anything mandated by the watchtower but most importantly they give up their right to manifest all of their talents and their individuality. The world inside the watchtower religion is very insular and traps individuals in a conundrum of rules and regulations and takes away all individuality. People become clone like.
 They must conform, they must be controlled, they must be just like every other witness.
I too struggle with trying to wake up my relatives from this religion. I suppose that each person has a right to choose what religion they belong to, but I grit my teeth and bite my tongue, each time I see or hear things that are obviously and blatantly different from what Jesus taught and what Jesus stood for, which was love.
Jackson is a typical “company man” who is all about protecting the organization. He is phoney and proves by his words that this religion is all about policy and rules.
This religion is not about love, and anyone who is hurt by the religion must not complain, they must trust the organization and if they chose to disagree with policy or the rules, they are simply viewed as collateral damage. The mothership must be protected at all costs.
Reply
 
 
 ruthlee says:

 August 18, 2015 at 8:06 am
 
hi all just a thought did anyone notice that mr j rarely said yes to a question because if he did well that would be biblical and you know anything else well… you fill in the blank i have another thought they are so hung up on the old law and the two witness rule well as i recall even slaves had rights under law and im sure rape was not allowed but it seems our children were/are less than slaves as they are not believed not protected and not defended i suppose because they are not a financial asset until of age is that a bit too cynical? a slave provided a service and had ameasure of protection but it seems to me children are to be disreguarded unless they have something to give just being a child and growing up in gods love is not enough because when all is said and done there is no love here if there was we would not have slick lawyers and endless departments and constant upgrades letters edicts and new light whatever happened to being wronged accepting discipline saying sorry and making recompense this whole fiasco should be a stark warning that these men are simply not from God He does not need a legal dept or canny power and the law of love spaks for itself shame on them and all of us who believed and put trust let us hope God will do the decent thing and put it right reguardless of who is the agent sorry ive gone on a bit but im a bit angry last thought isnt mr Angus a wonder he is very dignfied intelligent and his composure speaks volumes very inciteful in how these things proceed rl
Reply
 
 Pickled brain says:

 August 18, 2015 at 9:46 am
 
BBC Website has just published a Church of Scotland PUBLIC APOLOGY to All CHILD ABUSE Victims & has Published Public Details of ALL Child Abuse Allegations between 2006 to 2013 and will FULLY investigate ANY Historical Allegations made right back to 1947!!!!
 WELL Geoffrey Jackson & ALL GB Members ?????
 HOW ABOUT Following the EXCELLENT EXAMPLES of BABYLON the GREAT!!!
Reply
 
 
 
 MrFair says:

 August 18, 2015 at 10:10 am
 
GJ’s performance went exactly as I expected it would. He looked and sounded as though he were giving a talk to the Royal commission on the Theocratic Ministry School. He got a “Good” on delivery-poise, gestures, illustrations, etc. I would give him a “work” on the content of his message. It was almost completely untruthful and misleading. I also thought personally that he was condescending in his treatment of the ARC. Though acting humble and respectful, he made it seem that the ARC is incapable of understanding religious or scriptural matters, along the lines of – “you can’t understand because our organization is a spiritual one and you are secular authorities.”(blinded by Satan in his mind) He spoke for hours and didn’t say anything of any substance. He could have summed up his whole testimony and his answer to every question by saying “maybe yes, maybe no, we’ll see.” Unfortunately I think the GB and other indoctrinated JWs will think his performance was a success.
Reply
 
 Grace says:

 August 18, 2015 at 3:15 pm
 
Mr Fair,
Beautifully said. I thought the same thing. He showed the typical PUBLIC VERSION of this religion as opposed to the insular version, the one that we all know & have lived but the records speak for themselves & all of the “BWB” that GJ used doesn’t hide the fact that it is on record that they disregard the secular authorities in every shape & form. It’s like when a police officer pulls over a drunk driver that has a history of speeding fines & DUI’s, he can deny & make excuses all he likes but his record says otherwise.
To me, he just sounded like a charming cult leader.
Reply
 
 
 Searcher says:

 August 19, 2015 at 9:12 am
 
Mr. Fair and Grace,
I agree with you fully. He did show style, manners, and poise as any WTBTS trained speechmaker would have. In reality, he had a really good pair of tap-dancing shoes on. Jackson said a lot without saying much at all. He reminded me of a politician that has been caught and called to the carpet.
Reply
 
 
 
 Sister drifter UK says:

 August 18, 2015 at 1:47 pm
 
Obviously this is mainly about child sexual abuse.
 But that is not the only abuse.
 If there is to be compensation for victims of sexual abuse then this could open the floodgates in terms of compensation for emotional abuse.
 Particularly the emotional damage caused by shunning. Either feeling obliged to shun or by being shunned.
 It runs through our culture and divides families and causes tremendous emotional damage.
 It would be impossible for the magnificent 7 to back track in this.
 How many people have cut themselves off from their children, parents,siblings for decades?
 It would do too much damage to those who have obediently followed this direction. They would lose numbers.
 Then we come to the damage that people have suffered by remaining single because they are quite simply fishing from a small pond and fear being marked if they find someone ‘worldly’.
Or childless.
 Or those who have forfeited an education and are unemployable.
 Or those who were advised not to take out life insurance or pay in to a pension fund.
 Could they not claim compensating for being misled?
 The opportunities are endless.
Drifting is not easy.
 I am in my late 50s and I am finding it a very very hard process with many losses along the way.
 But I cannot go back.
Anyone else out there finding this process difficult?
Reply
 
 Pickled brain says:

 August 18, 2015 at 2:19 pm
 
@Sister Drifter UK . I REALLY REALLY LIKE your Reasoning point by point of ABUSE not just of a sexual nature but in so many other areas of Life the 7 Men of the GB control JWs by their SUFFOCATING MAN MADE Policies & Directives which Really Most of them should be down to an INDIVIDUALS CONSCIENCE!!
 I Am from the UK too ,but my family are totally Brainwashed whereas they will research everything Thoroughly on websites when they are buying a washing machine;a car; a cooker ; going on holiday.etc ! They will spend Days, weeks, even months doing research on material things BUT when it’s 7 FALLIBLE MEN who constantly change interpretation of scripture EVEN admitting so in Watchtower Studies, YET will not EXAMINE THOROUGHLY outside Research or Independent Websites!!’ FRIGHTENING HOW FEAR of LOSING FAMILY & FRIENDS Can keep people in SLAVERY to 7 Mainly WHITE AMERICAN MEN!!! Very very SAD!!!
Reply
 
 Pickled brain says:

 August 18, 2015 at 2:30 pm
 
@Sister drifter UK. May I add YOU Have GREAT LOGIC & DEEP UNDERSTANDING of how Really Evil these 7 men are in their MANIPULATION of People’s LIVES,TIME,MONEY & ENERGY!! Whereas their FULL POTENTIAL as A Loving,Kind, Compassionate Human Being is STRANGLED by CUTTING OFF FAMILY MEMBERS just because they have a Different Opinion to what the Bible says & they were Encouraged to be Baptised at 11,12,13,14,15,16 when Really no youngsters understand the FULL IMPLICATIONS of what they are getting involved in & the consequences!!
Reply
 
 
 
 Excelsior! says:

 August 18, 2015 at 3:03 pm
 
Sister drifter UK,
Believe it or not, the governing body already have!
Please listen to Anthony Morris III’s talk about abuse. He talks about emotional abuse, as well as child abuse!
There are a lot of gems in that nine minute or so section! He was trying to talk to too many audiences at once, and he used language that was necessarily vague. Priceless!
I was given the Royal Order of the Boot twenty years ago, so I haven’t had to fade.
My advice is always to find the least you can get away with and still be left alone, do a little bit more than that, and be super duper enthusiastic about “Jehovah God’s spirit-directed Organisation” whenever anyone comes sniffing around. Of course, this advice is coming from someone who hasn’t had to actually do this, so….
It comes from the fact that JWs short cut everything. They don’t really read the bible, they don’t really think about what it says, because everything is shortcutted to the organisation. This is why I say to do just a little bit more than the minimum and say the right lines, dress the right way, don’t make waves and they will shortcut you into the background. Dependent on individual circumstances.
We are all here for you.
Peace be with you, Excelsior!
Reply
 
 
 Idontknowhatodo says:

 August 19, 2015 at 7:36 am
 
I too am in my late 50s and am trying to plan my exit strategy…its hard and demoralizing…I just have to listen on this site to the advice to remember my mind is free even though I may not be … if I left I would lose everything…family and friends ALL Jw’s… I am heartsick at my lost opportunities and when I think how fullfilled my life could have been… I am learning to look ahead not behind… I feel as a child born into this religion I have been mentally abused and also because I am a woman ….we really have no voice…. what they say from the platform is laughable if it was not so damaging… Im reassured by the fact I am not alone…. keep going… you are not alone either.
Reply
 
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 19, 2015 at 4:45 pm
 
Yes, Sister drifter UK, you are absolutely right. So many of us gave up things, precious and once in a lifetime things, for this cult, especially those of us who came in from the ‘world’. We cut ourselves off from family, which you don’t get back, good jobs and worldly pursuits which were really normal and not unscriptural. But of course if they interfered with those insightful meetings then they were bad.
Pioneer, pioneer, give every cent you’ve got to spiritual interests. Armageddon’s coming, so it doesn’t matter about anything except getting the preaching work done, get yourself in debt, make illogical mistakes, they will all be fixed at Armageddon. Go and serve where the need is great and you’ll be rewarded spiritually. What was my reward for that escapade? I suffered a serious nervous breakdown and our children changed schools umpteen times. Our kids were so smart too and could have done so much better had they not had to change schools so many times. I believed the Bible and I still do but I don’t believe the WBTS
We lost out on so much materially that now that we have gotten older, would have counted a lot now. If only I knew what I know now I would have told those two ladies that I wasn’t interested when they came to my door in 1979. I am sure that is how many of us feel. Ripped off!
 So yes, you are absolutely right. There is so much pain and shattered dreams involved with the Watchtower, and what I have said has only scraped the surface. All those told not to have children, not to get married and those who have lost family through the blood issue would be hopping mad about it. Not to mention the debt people end up carrying by attending all those conventions and not working to make their lives more ‘spiritual’. Wow, one could go on and on.
Reply
 
 
 
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← Reflecting on the Australian Royal Commission (Day 3, Part 1)
An apology, and update on what’s in store for JWsurvey →
 
Royal Commission’s Angus Stewart accuses Watchtower representative of deliberate deception
Posted on August 10, 2015

Branch committee coordinator Terrence O'Brien was accused of intentionally trying to mislead the Commission
Branch committee coordinator Terrence O’Brien was accused of intentionally trying to mislead the Commission

This is the latest summary of the Royal Commission in Australia by non-disfellowshipped JWsurvey reader “CovertFade,” who is standing in for the JWsurvey writing team as we process the fast-paced events “down under”…
The closing moments of Day 7 of the Royal Commission’s investigation into Watchtower’s child abuse procedures saw some heavyweights from Watchtower’s Australia branch face up to some brutal questioning by the Commission’s Senior Council, Angus Stewart.
At one point the following remarkable exchange took place in which Terrence O’Brien, the coordinator of the Australia Branch, is accused of deliberately trying to deceive the commission in an apparent attempt to protect Governing Body member Geoffrey Jackson from being called to give evidence.
◾Mr Angus Stewart SC: Mr O’Brien, you have given evidence that you gave instructions to counsel on the point of Mr Jackson not being able to assist and his activities being in relation to translations. I, as a matter of fairness, must put to you that those instructions you gave were false, were they not?
◾Terrence O’Brien: No, I don’t believe so. Mr Jackson does oversee the translation work, but as part of the writing committee member, which he is one of the Governing Body members on that committee. So —
◾Stewart. And I suggest to you, or I put to you, that when you gave those instructions, you knew them to be false?
◾O’Brien. No. I disagree.
◾Stewart: And by giving those instructions, you sought to mislead the Royal Commission, to protect Mr Jackson from any potential summons to appear?
◾O’Brien: No, I disagree. I think the reason we asked consideration to be shown to Mr Jackson was the grave situation of his father – the very reason he is in Australia.
◾Stewart: Yes, and in relation to that, in view of what I have put to you, perhaps you can answer this: how are we to know if what you say about Mr Jackson’s compassionate circumstances is, in fact, true?
Attempting to mislead a Royal Commission is a criminal offense. If charged and convicted, Mr O’Brien could face a fine of up to $20,000 and up to five years in prison. So how on earth did the normally legally-savvy Watchtower manage to put itself in a situation where the head of its Australia branch was caught out in such a clumsy lie? Especially when the previous six days of testimonial curb-stomping clearly demonstrated that the Commission team was very smart, very aware of Watchtower’s inner workings, and quite prepared to examine matters with a fine tooth comb until it uncovered the truth.
Well, with hindsight, one can see the answer, and it revolves around the Cult Of Personality that the Watchtower has recently started to build around its Governing Body.
By Day 5, it was clear that a number of aspects of Watchtower’s handling of child abuse were seriously troubling the Commission. They included the two witness rule, the all-male nature of the judicial process, allowing a guilty-but-reproved offender to remain in the same environment as his victim with no real sanction, and more.
It was also clear that Watchtower considered these policies unchangeable due to their supposed scriptural basis, and that it was eagerly offering concessions in some lesser areas while carefully trying to sneak the weightier matters of concern out of the Commission’s spotlight unaltered.
The logical conclusion being drawn by the Commission was that they simply had to talk to the Governing Body. Ordinarily, this would be impossible; the seven members of the Governing Body reside in Brooklyn USA and as such are beyond the Australian Commission’s reach.
However, it transpired that Governing Body member Geoffrey Jackson had actually been in Australia since early July. The Commission made two separate approaches to Watchtower to organize testimony. Watchtower replied to the effect that Mr Jackson was in Australia for private, compassionate reasons and, also, that since the Governing Body was not involved in the implementation and administration of policies and procedures in relation to child sexual abuse, he would not be able to give relevant evidence.
The idea that a Governing Body member would not be able to give relevant evidence in this matter is absurd. Yet it should be noted that this fits a pattern of behavior. Gerrit Losch also refused to appear in defense of the organization’s child abuse policies in a US civil action the previous year. Nonetheless it appears the Commission was content at that point to let the matter go, and did not issue a summons. (It is important to note that refusing a summons to a Royal Commission is a criminal offense than can carry a sentence of up to six months imprisonment.)
However, by Day 6 it was clear that not only was the Commission realizing no meaningful change was possible without Governing Body sanction, but also that Watchtower was pulling out all the stops to firewall Jackson. My theory is that Watchtower Australia was given strict orders from Brooklyn that under no circumstances was Jackson to be summoned.
The damage to the cult of having one of the illustrious seven Faithful and Discreet Slave members, together comprising a revered mouthpiece of God, cut to dry-mouthed ribbons under examination as to his support for indefensible child abuse policies, was too awful a scenario for them to permit.
Nowhere was this more obvious than in the Day 6 testimony of Senior Service Desk Elder Rodney Spinks.
In the context of what we now know, it’s clear Spinks was tasked to mislead the Commission into believing Watchtower Australia had the authority to implement any changes the Commission might recommend, and thus shield Jackson from involvement. He does this in a manner that would make some of the most slippery political spin-masters green with envy. Let’s look at “Slippery Spinks” in action as he answers a simple, direct question. (By the way, the simple, direct answer to the question is: Yes we would need permission from the Governing Body.)
◾Mr Angus Stewart SC: But if you are to publish something new which sets out how child sexual abuse allegations are to be dealt with within congregations in Australia, would you need to get the clearance or the go-ahead from the Governing Body that what you have set out is fine, because it is not in conflict with the scriptures?
◾Spinks: I think the documents would show that we correspond openly with the Governing Body on matters of interpretation. I think my point is clear, that if recommendations from this Commission, and some things that we can obviously see ourselves – so, for example, if there is a legal requirement, whether it’s because of mandatory reporting or because of a criminal law that is less familiar to me than you, but if there are legal implications and we are working outside of those, you can be certain that an adjustment will be made here in Australia and a document produced relative to Australia, including collating those, as you see it – and correctly so – references from decades, that would be better into a single document tailored for the law, the culture, the expectation here in Australia. Absolutely.
◾Stewart: And you would only do that through engagement with the Governing Body?
◾Spinks: That’s – as many things could be done here in Australia, what I’m saying is we have such great respect for the Governing Body, we would have no issue at all with corresponding with them back and forward. I am confident there would be no issue, if we don’t stray from the scriptures, that they are happy for each branch committee – remembering that those members of the Governing Body are simply, as well, unpaid members of the organization that are selected from elders from different countries. So that’s not the issue. The issue is: is it in harmony with the scriptures and is it appropriate here in Australia. And the Australia branch committee would have that.
Notice how Spinks tries to dance around a simple and truthful “yes” every time, never quite telling an outright lie but still giving the false impression that the Australia branch can give the Commission everything it wants and thus there is no need to trouble Jackson.
During Day 6, the question of Jackson’s participation again comes up, and this extremely significant exchange takes place between Justice McClellan and the Watchtower Legal Council, Mr Tokley (bold is mine):
◾Justice McClellan: Now, these are very significant issues. They are not small issues, they are significant issues. At the moment, we are, as I say, facing the situation where we can see a problem, but we do need assistance from the church in what is the solution. We rather thought that Mr Jackson might be able to assist us in that respect. I understand the reason for compassion being extended to him. I have no difficulty with that. And for that reason, I have not issued a summons requiring him to attend. But at the moment we face a serious issue with which only the church can help us. Whether that needs a response now, I don’t know, but we would like you to reflect upon that situation.
◾Mr Tokley: Your Honour, may I respond on behalf of the persons I represent. Your Honour’s points are being taken on board, are being addressed, and are being given the most earnest consideration by the authorities. Mr Jackson would probably not have been of any assistance in any event, because his role and his responsibility is in relation to the translation of matters; it’s not in relation to these sorts of matters.
Remember that specific wording. That’s going to come back in a big way. Watchtower has just set something in motion that cannot be undone.
As Day 6 ends, it’s clear that Slippery Spinks has failed to protect Jackson. The Commission is clearly unconvinced. But it’s Day 7 when the wheels spectacularly come off the wagon for Watchtower Australia. During examination of the first witness of the day (Vince Toole, the elder in charge of the Legal Desk) the Commission submits a piece of previously unseen evidence.
◾Mr Angus Stewart SC: You say your understanding is that the branch committee members are equals. One of them is actually designated coordinator, is that not right?
◾Toole. Yes, I think he’s the coordinator of the – of the branch committee.
◾Stewart: And that designation or responsibility also is an appointment by the Governing Body?
◾Toole: I believe so, but I’m not absolutely certain – but I believe so. I’m sorry I don’t have a lot of information on that, but I just – I’ve never been involved.
◾Stewart: There are other copies coming shortly, but I’d just like to show you – there’s a copy for you – a document. You see it’s headed “Branch Organisation Effective December 15, 1977, Revised February 2003″. It says “This material in Branch Organisation –being the name of the publication –should not be copied or duplicated except with the permission of the Branch Committee.” It’s published in the USA, I understand, by the Governing Body. Have you seen this publication before?
Yes, for reasons that will come to light in a future JWsurvey article, the Royal Commission managed to obtain a copy of the Branch Handbook. If you thought the elders handbook was hard to obtain, that’s nothing compared to the Branch Handbook.
If the elders handbook is all about running a congregation, then the Branch Handbook is all about running a multi-million dollar worldwide corporation, and details, among other things, the full responsibilities of the Governing Body – the same Governing Body Watchtower Australia is desperately trying to insist has no say in the issue.
The day continues. Toole disgraces himself in his own special way during testimony, and also frantically tries to avoid giving straight answers as to the role of the Governing Body. Yet finally he is done, and Watchtower Australia’s big cheese, Terrance O’Brien, takes the stand.
Keep in mind what has happened up to now. Previous elders have been frantically spinning the narrative that Jackson is not needed, yet the Commission is clearly deeply suspicious, and most critically of all, Watchtower legal council has officially stated that Jackson’s role is limited “to the translations of matters.” To back away now would expose their deceit, and lead to possible criminal charges. But at the same time, it’s clear the Commission have all the evidence they need to see through the ruse. They have the Branch Handbook for crying out loud!
This is the no-win situation confronting O’Brien as he takes the stand, on an international live webcast, to face Mr Angus Stewart Senior Council, who has previously made mincemeat of every elder placed before him (even Slippery Spinks) and who now possesses the very publication that tells O’Brien how his own organization works.



The transcript records Stewart using the Handbook to establish Jackson’s role spanning multiple committees, including the writing committee and the teaching committee, both of which have direct involvement in the Commission’s area of interest. Then, the final nail in the coffin:
◾Stewart: I understand that you have not served as a member of the Governing Body, so I’m asking you from what your understanding is. But your understanding is that the seven members of the Governing Body, as a Governing Body, meet weekly, do they, every Wednesday?
◾O’Brien: Yes, so those who are present meet weekly.
◾Stewart. It will be that Governing Body as a whole, or those who are present, who would authorize the various publications and guides and guidelines, and so on; is that right?
◾O’Brien:. They would give the final approval for the publishing of them, yes.
◾Stewart: You will have heard yesterday that senior counsel representing the Jehovah’s Witnesses in Australia and the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society of Australia said that Mr Jackson would not be likely to be able to assist this Commission, because his role is in the translation of matters. Now, that, do you accept, is in clear variance to what you have explained in your evidence?
Think about it. What would you do? Admit the truth and your previous deception, or keep trying to deceive, even though it’s clear that the evidence to disprove your testimony is literally resting in the hands of your opponent? O’Brien makes his choice. Stick with the lie.
◾O’Brien No – sorry, it’s not. The translation, it comes under the writing committee, as I understand, which is what Mr Jackson is a member of.
 Stewart: But he’s also the coordinator of the teaching committee that has many other responsibilities, and not translation – not so?
◾O’Brien Yes, he – as a member of the Governing Body, he has a number —
◾Stewart. So can you explain, Mr O’Brien, how it came about that senior counsel representing the organization was given instructions that Mr Jackson’s role is confined to the translation of matters, when it clearly is not?
Finally! It took two solid days of testimony, of dancing around the issue by various senior elders, and dogged persistence by the Royal Commission to establish an answer to the simple question of: What does Geoffrey Jackson do? Two Days!
It’s not over yet. When Justice McClellan next speaks, the webcast audio records a softness to his tone that underscores that severity of the situation more than a raised voice ever could.
◾Justice McClellan: Mr O’Brian, did you give those instructions to senior counsel?
◾O’Brien: The instructions regarding Mr Jackson?
◾McClellan: Yes.
◾O’Brien: Yes.
◾McClellan: It led me to believe that there was little that Jackson could add to the discussion, and no doubt that is what you expected would happen; is that right?
◾O’Brien: That’s true, and I still concur with that.
◾McClellan: Well, I’m starting to form a totally different impression, I have to tell you.
The day ends on Watchtower’s worst case scenario: Justice McClellan issues a summons for Geoffrey Jackson. What will the fallout be?
At the time of writing, it is unknown if O’Brien will face charges. On the surface it would appear the case against him is compelling, and it’s clear both Mr Stewart and Justice McClellan viewed O’Brien’s misdirection seriously. Additionally, it’s clear this was part of a strategy of misdirection employed by every Branch-level elder who testified. Yet even if all involved escape legal sanction, the fact of their deception is preserved online for all the world to see.
Google doesn’t forget.
What of Jackson? He has three options.
1.Refuse to appear before the Commission, stay in the country to look after his reportedly dying father and go to prison.
2.Appear before the Commission and take part in the worst PR debacle the cult has even seen.
3.Refuse to appear, flee the country and make it clear to the world that he is so scared of the Commission he will even abandon his dying father to avoid testimony.
There is one final irony. As mentioned, the witness preceding O’Brien was Watchtower Australia’s top lawyer, Vince Toole. During his testimony, the concept of theocratic warfare was directly put to him:
◾Ms David: In the Watchtowers in 1957 and 1960, have you heard they say that: “As a soldier of Christ, you are in theocratic warfare and you must exercise added caution when dealing with God’s foes. Thus the scriptures show that for the purpose of protecting the interests of God’s cause it is proper to hide the truth from God’s enemies.” Have you heard of that?
◾Toole: No, and I’ve never read 1957 magazine articles, I’m sorry. I only became a Jehovah’s Witness in 1972.
◾Ms David: But, as a lawyer, you would be aware of such concepts, wouldn’t you – that you can lie to protect Jehovah’s name?
◾Toole: (Visibly angry) We are truthful. To be a Christian, you have to be truthful.
Maybe O’Brien didn’t get the memo?
 
CovertFade
 
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← Reflecting on the Australian Royal Commission (Day 3, Part 1)
An apology, and update on what’s in store for JWsurvey →
 
455 Responses to Royal Commission’s Angus Stewart accuses Watchtower representative of deliberate deception

← Older Comments
Newer Comments →
 
 Wanderer says:

 August 18, 2015 at 1:49 pm
 
I wonder if the Royal Commission hands down harsh penalties or fines, the Society will take the advice they give sexual abuse victims, “just leave it in Jehovahs hands and pray more”.
I read about a case in Australia of an elders daughter who had been repeatedly sexually abused by a family friend, a Ministerial Servant. As an adult she reported it, it went through the courts, it was not his first offence, the JWs just moved him over a couple of congregations & he was no longer a MS. At his trial she said when she told her parents and the body of elders, they told her to pray about it and just leave it in Jehovahs hands!
 That shows the incredible power of mind control the organisation has over its devout members, what father in his right mind would not support his own daughter in such a terrible circumstance?
 The MS is currently in jail, thank goodness for the “worldly” judicial system.
Reply
 
 Pickled brain says:

 August 18, 2015 at 2:48 pm
 
@ Wanderer . You also Enunciate so well the EVIL & WICKEDNESS of what these 7 EVIL MEN are doing to Normally Loving Human Beings who are ‘CAPTIVES of a CONCEPT ‘
The Whole JW Organisation is No better than the Catholic Church who Shuffled Sex Abusing Priests from Parish to Parish!! WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE?? MAY YOU GEOFFREY JACKSON HANG Your Head in Shame the way YOUR ELDERS have Handled these POOR TRAUMATISED YOUNG CHILDREN!!! ABSOLUTELY NO WAY is This GODS ORGANISATION!’!! It’s been HELL ON EARTH for these Young Victims!!!
Reply
 
 Searcher says:

 August 19, 2015 at 9:22 am
 
So True. These are not God’s “Faithful and Discrete Slave” and this is not God’s one and only organization. I can use the bible that they always refer to prove it.
Matt 7:15 – 18: “Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. You will know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes from thorn bushes or figs from thistles? Even so, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit.”
The JW’s and WTBTS sure has born bad fruit in this case.
Reply
 
 Searcher says:

 August 19, 2015 at 9:27 am
 
BTW, I’m sure the GB would ‘revise’ this out of the NWT bible if it were used against them, and I believe that GJ said he was ‘coordinating’ the Translation committee. (LOL)
Reply
 
 
 
 
 
 Bad Penny says:

 August 18, 2015 at 4:49 pm
 
Having listened to G.J. or Mr. Potato Head, it occurred to me how he never showed any real empathy with the victims in this case, never even listening to their testimony. He was obviously playing for time with his long, laborious answers and scripture quoting. He succeeded in totally exasperating Justice McClennan. I also thought him very rude when he was quoting a scriptural text to Angus Stewart and saying, ‘Have you got that yet?’ as if he was talking to an inept student. I do not think his performance will pull the wool over the eyes of the Commission, despite his condescending manner.
 pickled brain – I think you should have stopped at ‘MAY YOU GEOFFREY JACKSON HANG….’
Reply
 
 Pickled brain says:

 August 18, 2015 at 9:12 pm
 
@Bad Penny. I LOVE your LAST SENTENCE & your STYLE!!! LET ALL 7 GB MEN HANG & yes you are right ! I thought JACKASS ,Sorry Jackson lacked Empathy towards the victims by not reading their statements because unless he did he wouldn’t rely understand their PAIN!!
Reply
 
 
 Searcher says:

 August 19, 2015 at 9:14 am
 
Mr. Potato head? Now that’s funny!
Reply
 
 
 
 zeebo says:

 August 18, 2015 at 11:54 pm
 
Guys,
Looks like one of our finest has defected! Look at this picture from the convention.
http://i.imgur.com/pyr4v2V.png
That explains the long silence on the royal commission!
Reply
 
 zeebo says:

 August 18, 2015 at 11:56 pm
 
* Its a joke! and yes I should have found a pic with only living GB members in it.
Reply
 
 
 
 ruthlee says:

 August 19, 2015 at 12:07 am
 
dear sister drifter uk you sound like me similar circumstances we are on the scrap heap because of being duped but having heard other peoples experiences and being connected to sites like these it gives you hope because we all have one thing in common in that we have been damaged we may not see eye to eye on all things but everyone is entitled to an opinion when did the true faith get so commercial!? i still go to meetings and i cringe when i hear what spews from men but sites like these give me the voice of reason just one more point how are the org going to pay for all of this i have done my research and i hope cedars will do an article on vicarious liability it is very very interesting so dear sis keep your heart strong in the way you know best rl
Reply
 
 
 Jake says:

 August 19, 2015 at 2:20 am
 
People do not put new wine into an old wine skin, the fermentation process expands an already expanded wine skin and will burst it.
 A great illustration of a human mind, new teachings and their exceptence.
 Consider the difficulty, fractions, inoculations, the generation, all the belongings, organ donation, oral sex, who is the slave, e.t.c
 Did it really take the royal commission to change Watchtower policy’s and not the suffering of children?
 Though Mr Jackson heard the testimony of Mr Spinks, he failed to consider the victims testimony.
 The Watchtower blames God as God has not given direction, is the Bible therefore in complete?
Reply
 
 Pickled brain says:

 August 19, 2015 at 3:31 am
 
@Jake . Your Point is EXCELLENT!! Why did it Take a supposedly? WORLDLY SATANIC ORGANISATION like the Royal Commission which is going to be DESTROYED at ARMAGEDDON as they don’t worship Jehovah to make Geoffrey Jackson eat humble pie & maybe make the Judicial Committee Process to be more Sympathetic to CHILD ABUSE VICTIMS??? Why couldn’t Jehovah have guided the Governing Body 50 years ago to be more CHRISTLIKE & all those years ago been more kinder & empathetic towards Victims??
 I TELL YOU WHY NOT Geoffrey!! Because you DO NOT HAVE HOLY SPIRIT!! You belong to a PUBLISHING & PROPERTY EMPIRE which is EXPLOITING Vulnerable people with the FEAR of SHUNNING to use their time money & resources!!
 ABSOLUTELY WICKED!!!
Reply
 
 
 
 Bad Penny says:

 August 19, 2015 at 2:52 am
 
Pickled brain – Thanks for your comments – We appear to be on the same wavelength.
zeebo – I love the pic – it’s good to exercise the chuckle muscle when you have been inundated with such tear jerking stuff!
Sister drifter UK – Yes, I agree with you. The damage caused to thousands, or may I say millions, of minds is heart-breaking.
 I am also in the UK. I feel that there appears to be much burying of the head in the sand here. The good ‘ole Brits keep the stiff upper lip and put up with all sorts of bulls…
Yes, it’s difficult to break away, most of us have been there. The longer you stay away though, the easier becomes your resolve to NEVER go back.
 I recently read a quote from Voltaire, which sums up Watchtower :-
‘To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize’.
Another clever man said, ‘Control literature, you control what people think’.
Come out from under the control and be free!
Reply
 
 Pickled brain says:

 August 19, 2015 at 3:33 am
 
@ Bad Penny. GREAT Quote from Voltaire!! Really sums up the JW Organisation!!
Reply
 
 
 
 Jake says:

 August 19, 2015 at 3:01 am
 
To the governing body of Jehovah’s witnesses.
 Positively 4th Street by Bob Dylan.
Reply
 
 
 Tim Witness says:

 August 19, 2015 at 8:06 am
 
The Royal Commission procedures, findings, and recommendations will have an impact on cultural and socio-political orientation on the subject in much of the Western world, of which it is a considerable part. Anyone who feels an obligation to offer a counter-testimony to the JWs’ statements has an opportunity to contact the Royal Commissioner’s Office and contribute to the historical proceedings.
Reply
 
 
 Simon Kestral says:

 August 19, 2015 at 9:54 am
 
@Excelsior
Personally, I have no desire to call WT on the phone; I no longer dance to their music or play their game.
But for those who want to, I agree with your proposed approach: keep it honest, and don’t use any electronic recording devices.
However, you can lawfully make written notes to preserve important points of the conversation. You might say “excuse me while I write that down.”
Just don’t be surprised if that has a decidedly chilling effect on the conversation …
Reply
 
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 19, 2015 at 3:52 pm
 
We called in to see our JW kids yesterday, our son and his wife. For the first time in about 9 years we had a discussion about the Watchtower. My daughter in law’s comment was that this was ancient history and that what came out of the ARC was to be taken in a positive way because now they can fix up any problems. She also said that these victims were done and dusted. I said “Well, they’ve had at least since 2002 to fix up the problems and they haven’t.” I hurriedly then explained why I left, which she had never let me do before. That is a breakthrough but it shows what kind of stuff the elders must be telling them or what everyone is saying to make up excuses for the past.
Our grand daughter gave me a brochure while I was there which was entitled ‘Return To Jehovah’ and she asked me to read it. The Watchtower make children worried about their relatives who have left which is an added burden for them besides all the other burdens they carry. This must be working to brainwash some into going back. The brochure seems to presumptuously think that most people left because they are weak. I hate that premise. Many times I am sure they leave because they have stronger principles than what the Watchtower can produce in it’s subjects.
On page 12 of the brochure which I quickly glanced at there was a heading that said “Return to “the Shepherd and Overseer of your souls”.” And I don’t know where they got that from but it definitely couldn’t be Jesus Christ.
Reply
 
 Simon Kestral says:

 August 19, 2015 at 4:42 pm
 
Two local elders dropped by and gave me the same brochure. I said I would look it over, and bid them good day.
Upon skimming it, I quickly gathered its premise: I am not attending meetings due to some fault or weakness of mine! They don’t understand the very premise is false.
If they return, I am not obligated to enlighten them, though if I’m feeling a wild urge, maybe I will.
Reply
 
 
 Grace says:

 August 19, 2015 at 6:26 pm
 
Meredith,
How sad for you that they are still making excuses for the church & making you feel bad for leaving. I wonder if they put your grand child up to be the one who would give you the brochure.
Also, do you have the download of the “Incidences of CSA in Australia” list. Of the 1006 offenders reported to the Society, it gives you the dates that they were reported. Some as soon as 2015, 2014, 2013 & still no reporting to the Authorities. So it’s not ancient history.
I hope that your daughter in law will look at that list & see for herself that these victims didn’t “get done & dusted”. I’m sorry to have to say this but that was a really cold statement she made.
It must take great restraint on your behalf to hold yourself back from saying more.
Reply
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 19, 2015 at 7:00 pm
 
Yes, Grace, I’m sorry you had to hear that statement too. My husband when we got back in the car after the visit was the first to say also what a terrible statement she made about the victims being ‘done and dusted’ too. I wondered if she was quoting what someone else also said or whether that is how she thought of it.
I have gotten used to the silence when we visit. The talk is only about their house or work, but nothing is ever talked about in the way of the Witnesses. I am so glad I did not get disfellowshipped because I know she would have stuck to the principles of disfellowshipping. At least we have a relationship with our grand children, which I know is better than some have to put up with. I know a girl who lives not far from me who was disfellowshipped and her parents have seen her in the street and they pass her by. She has 5 children and they do hardly remember their grandparents. He is an elder and they went to serve in a foreign country for a while. How could they ignore their daughter like that is beyond me. The damage is far and wide, Grace.
Again, I’m sorry for you to hear that comment as a victim. I would not want any who’ve been there have to know that is what some think. As anyone who has half a brain could work out that these kind of things leave awful deep scars and it’s never ‘done and dusted’.
Reply
 
 Grace says:

 August 19, 2015 at 8:15 pm
 
Don’t be sorry Meredith.
I’m glad that you shared this because it really shows up the mindset of JW’s. I just hope that one day they wake up & see how they are while under the mind control of the cult.
I know that when my brain started to operate again, it felt like I had come down off drugs & straightened up. It really did feel like a brain snap had happened & I felt embarrassed that my thought processes where like that.
Reply
 
 Pickled brain says:

 August 19, 2015 at 11:22 pm
 
@Grace & @ Meredith. I agree with you both. IT IS CERTAINLY ‘NOT DONE & DUSTED ‘ these Child Abuse Cases. What a Horrible Way to look at it by relatives who are active JWs . I would ask them ‘Why is a WORLDLY Organisation like the Royal Commission way ahead of the GB in Handling & Empathetically Caring for these ABUSED Jehovah’s Witnesses above what the Elders did ?’ & Believe me anyone who is a supporter of the GB who is reading this : ‘ The GB & Elders would have KEPT on Leaving it in JEHOVAHs Hands if it WASNT for the Royal Commission & other Courts & Secular Authorities Embarrassing the GB in way of Publicity & Compensation ‘
& As you say ‘WHAT ABOUT the 30,40,50 YEARS until the ABUSED JW DIES ,the GRIEF,TRAUMA,EXCRUCIATING EMOTIONAL SCARS & PAIN & SUICIDAL tendencies because of the DISGUSTING UN-CHRISTLIKE way these Thousands of Cases were Handled! WE WILL ALL KEEP FIGHTING UNTIL these EVIL 7 GB MEMBERS are Bought to Justice!

 
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 21, 2015 at 3:46 pm
 
Grace, I know exactly what you mean. You feel totally deflated when you realise that all your dreams and efforts were for nothing. The first thing you notice is the mental brainwashing has stopped and you feel funny. Your time suddenly increases for you as you don’t have to spend so much time in prestudy, meetings and witnessing. There is almost a feeling of “Yipee”. You have your life back. I know what you mean about being embarrassed. Then you have to explain it to people and that’s another story.

 
 
 
 
 
 
 Bad Penny says:

 August 19, 2015 at 5:39 pm
 
One to watch on British TV, Channel 5 @ 9 p.m. Monday 24th August – ‘Inside Scientology and escaping the Witnesses’.
Maybe another nail in the coffin.
 The preaching work could soon be over for JWs when people understand what a cult it is.
 Interesting, to me anyway, is that all things are being revealed that have been hidden, just as the Christ said they would be (Luke 8:17).
Reply
 
 
 steve says:

 August 19, 2015 at 9:00 pm
 
1006 = a very tiny tip of a monstrously large iceberg
Reply
 
 
 Sister drifter UK says:

 August 19, 2015 at 10:12 pm
 
Does anyone know what the Australian brothers and sisters are being told through the congregations?
 What is the general reaction at grass roots level?
 Are they all taking a ‘positive position’ on this matter- believing that WT is working alongside the Royal Commission in order to improve?
 And what happens next?
 Is GJ going to appear again?
 Do we know when?
 Everything feels a bit in limbo.
How many faders and drifters are there reading this?
 I’m just wondering if we all actually know each other!
 I’ve been in 8 congregations in my life – worked at assemblies, quick builds, been in dramas – done it all- brought my children up in it- I know so many people and yet there are less than a handful of people I could ever be really honest with.
Reply
 
 
 Grace says:

 August 20, 2015 at 12:14 am
 
Where I am in Qld it seems like everyone has gone quiet. I have been going out more thinking if I run into someone I can look them in the eye & hold myself but I have not seen anyone.
My husband has run into some while working & they seem oblivious to anything. They have been friendly to him. I keep saying to him that they are just being friendly because the latest brochure about drawing inactive ones back. You can never take Witnesses at face value, that’s the annoying thing. I always think that there is an agenda behind the actions.
Otherwise, I don’t think that they’re reading anything about it.
Reply
 
 
 Ted says:

 August 20, 2015 at 7:01 am
 
Angus Stewart made the point to Jackson that it was a “Captive
 Religion”. Citing the example of baptised faders still being subject
 to cong, discipline, if discovered celebrating Christmas, or living
 in “sin” etc.
At this point Jackson expressed Shock Horror,– “But Mr, Stewart
 your suggesting we’ve got some sort of “Spy Network” going on,
 we don’t have anything such as that.”
If Mr, Stewart was suggesting that, he was absolutely right.
 In my experience, the whole congregation acts as a “Spy Network”
tale bearing to elders is common practice. Very few
 follow the Bible counsel, “First confront your brother alone.”
Such is the paranoia about keeping the cong, clean, or JHVH will
 remove Holy Spirit, that irrational measures are taken. A case in
 point, was of two elders staying out all night hiding behind the
 hedge in a garden to get evidence on a brother they suspected of
 adultery. ( They even took flasks of coffee for their all night vigil )
Official or not , the spy network exists this is the reality, that exists
 among insecure, frightened and guilt ridden people.
Reply
 
 
 rob says:

 August 20, 2015 at 7:52 am
 
The witness religion is all about “snitches” and I even remember reading in the watchtower that it was the duty of individuals to report to the elders if they knew that someone was doing something that they thought was wrong.
Obviously they would not go to the fader and confront him, but instead would go the elders and the fader would be disfellowshipped in absentia if he or she chose not to appear before the elders.
Jackson knows this, but chose to play dumb and again he skirted the issue of control and destruction of families by shunning. We all know how things work within this religion and so does the Royal Commission and regardless of the lies and evasiveness of Jackson, everyone knows that the witness religion is a religion which traps its members and will not let them leave without severe consequences to the individual’s social network and social structure.
Reply
 
 al etheredge says:

 August 21, 2015 at 5:46 pm
 
Spying and reporting other witnesses activities to the elders is something I remember very well. At school I used to spend the period during the flag salute looking around to see who else was not participating. When I identified another witness child I stayed away from them to avoid potential meetings with the elders for some alleged “infraction” of witness rules. If that is christian love North Korea has it in spades.
Reply
 
 
 
 Exhausted says:

 August 20, 2015 at 9:19 am
 
Spy network??? Are you serious??? It reminds me of what
 I have read of Nazi Germany when neighbors would tell
 On neighbors for being Jewish or hiding them. The same
 Fear tactics are in place and that is something that held me back from squealing on one of my friends who I knew
 Was messing around with a brother in the congregation.
 I did tell her that I knew and she should do the right thing
 Which she finally did after they got caught . I just wasn’t
 Going to be the one to come forward. cast the first stone
 And all,…. Oh that no longer exists…. Excuse me.
Reply
 
 
 rob says:

 August 20, 2015 at 9:43 am
 
In my opinion, the similarities between the Nazi regime and the witness religion are pretty frightening. I have read books and essays analyzing these types of regimes and the only light at the end of the tunnel is that these types of regimes do have a shelf life.
Reply
 
 Simon Kestral says:

 August 20, 2015 at 10:45 am
 
Oh boy Godwin’s law. I won’t post a link, it’s easy to google.
Reply
 
 
 Garrett says:

 August 20, 2015 at 8:39 pm
 
Too bad the Nazis aren’t around. One phone call to Gestapo HQ and the whole governing body would disappear in a puff of Dachau smoke.
Reply
 
 
 
 RC says:

 August 21, 2015 at 2:07 am
 
Hi,
 There has been no article on the Geoffrey Jackson hearing. Any significant development that will be revealed at a later time? The silence is surprising.
Reply
 
 Grace says:

 August 21, 2015 at 12:55 pm
 
RC,
It’s a waiting game now with ARC. They have so many people who have come forward that they have to process. The number has been phenomenal behind the scenes. This will take some months, a year or two to process.
Angus is going to come back with his final report about the Church & it’s handling of child sex abuse.
 Hopefully, he won’t hold back.
Reply
 
 RC says:

 August 24, 2015 at 2:43 am
 
Hi Grace,
 Thanks for the update. However, there has been no update on this site. It has been silent for almost 2 weeks now. Any
Reply
 
 Grace says:

 August 24, 2015 at 3:58 pm
 
Sorry RC,
I thought that you have been away for a while.
The last time I tracked John’s whereabouts (chuckle) was that he had been doing a European work/vacation stint from Amsterdam to England. I just noticed that from his videos above. He mentioned that he hasn’t had time to sit & go through GJ’s hearing.
Reply
 
 RC says:

 August 25, 2015 at 2:22 am
 
Oh ok Thanks for the update Grace. Comments for this blog are reaching 400. Eagerly waiting for what John has to say about Geoffrey Jackson’s performance.

 
 
 
 
 
 
 Willows says:

 August 21, 2015 at 2:29 am
 
When Jesus said go therefore an make disciples of people of all nations or words to that effect. One would reason that a disciple of Christ would be taught the mind of Christ….
And having been taught,…. to know and be able to deside,…. outcomes to problems,… themselves…..
When grown men have to refer on to headquarters what to do re Child Abuse, when the Australian organization has experienced many cases of child abuse as outlined in the Royal Commission….
Makes one wonder what sought of job the Watchtower is doing about making disciples, teaching the mind of Christ?…
It appears they are failing to teach the mind of Christ to these grown men!
Even Christ’s example of the good Samaritan would have done a better job!
Who proved himself even though not a Jew to be neighbor to the injured person he came across, even paying for the injured man’s accommodation till he recovered!
Another thing is this, when it takes a Royal Commission to teach the Watchtower how to show compassion to abused victims,… it says a lot about the Watchtower.
Reply
 
 
 anonymous says:

 August 21, 2015 at 3:26 am
 
I put Geoffrey Jackson’s testimony on for my husband to listen to and he listened to the whole thing and of course he thought that Jackson did a bang up job defending the “truth” and in the end, my husband’s comment was that it was good because now the Society will do something about all those terrible elders who don’t follow the Society’s instructions and now the Society will make sure the elders do their jobs correctly. So, that was good. But I argued with him that I thought that the elders were supposed to be appointed by Holy Spirit so how come they are bad elders and he said no, they were appointed by each other but Jehovah corrected it by now having he Circuit Overseers appoint the elders.
They have an answer for everything.
Reply
 
 MimiLove says:

 August 21, 2015 at 6:58 am
 
I had my husband read the Jackson’s testimony (you know youtube can’t be trusted). He said the same thing. One thing he did not like was when Jackson said we wouldn’t be so presumptuous to think we are the only source to the true god.
Reply
 
 Pickled brain says:

 August 21, 2015 at 9:11 am
 
@Mimi . I’m glad your husband noticed that because it could have been missed. Jackson said In answer to Angus Stewart something like they aren’t the only ones speaking for God which is FLIPPING NEWS to EVERY JW ever !! So does that mean there are other religions who speak for God , perhaps Jackson Agrees with Jesus words FOR A CHANGE at Mark 9 v40 where he says’Whoever is not against us is for us’ !! In response to the disciples annoyance that the man who was expelling demons wasn’t in the same group or organisation as the disciples following Jesus!!!
 So this Scripture alone means Jesus was saying YOU Don’t HAve to follow one Group of People or Organisation as long as you have Faith in Jesus!!
Reply
 
 MimiLove says:

 August 21, 2015 at 9:48 am
 
I am new to the commenting, been nervous for obvious reasons. I have made comments to two of my good friends and my daughter and you would have thought that I slapped them. I sent them the link directly to the Australia website and they refuse to go to it. I’m like wake up this is a civil authority and you refuse to even look at it! One of my friends said it was proof that the witnesses were right that babylon is turning on religion….I was like “false religion” hello????
Reply
 
 
 
 anonymous says:

 August 21, 2015 at 1:32 pm
 
@MimiLove, my husband’s answer to the presumptuous comment was that the lawyer was only out for money and is an ass***le for asking Jackson a “gotcha” question which didn’t have anything to do with it and of course the Society has never claimed to be God’s only spokespeople. He understands what Jackson was saying and I am just too stupid to understand it, according to him, no matter how many Watchtower articles I have shown him in the last two hours saying just the opposite.
Reply
 
 Grace says:

 August 21, 2015 at 4:24 pm
 
Mimilove,
Your friends need to understand that prophecy has nothing to do with the ARC. This is a systematic problem with all institutions. The ARC has just got to put each of them up to see who is not protecting children to the best of their capacity.
It just so happens that this church & its policies & procedures have failed miserably & its failures point straight to the top. It’s shown up to be a system that protects the church not the victims.
Angus brought that out with Jackson. He wanted Jackson to agree that this RC is with good intention & not an attack on the religion or driven by apostate lies. I believe that the RC were deliberately being very careful not to put to task Jackson as there were many thousands viewing it.
I think that they were being sensitive to those still in because their lives are so committed & it would be too devastating otherwise. I personally think that they did exactly what should have been with Jackson.
They knew he wasn’t being honest but they had to think of his followers as well.
Reply
 
 
 
 
 Pickled brain says:

 August 21, 2015 at 9:30 am
 
@Anonymous. Well done for keeping on trying to help your husband see the SHAM Erroneous teachings of the Watchtower. I believe every so Called DIE HARD JW is now having Doubts but they go into a MENTAL IRRATIONAL DEFENSIVE MODE…. But One Day Everything you have said to him will gradually wake him up especially when he lies awake at night going over in his head The FALSE EXPECTATIONS; the CONSTANT BEGGING for DONATIONS; The CONSTANT DEMAND to do MORE & MORE ; The DISGUSTING ATTITUDE & HANDLING of the CHILD ABUSE ISSUE!!’ One Day Someone or Something will get on his Nerves & then ‘BANG ‘!! All those SECRET DOUBTS Will SURFACE!! Stick in there Anonymous, you are an Intelligent Woman … TOO INTELLIGENT to be CONNED by 7 ARROGANT AMERICAN MEN !! NO HUMILITY AT ALL,Unlike Jesus !!
Reply
 
 
 Grace says:

 August 21, 2015 at 12:44 pm
 
Anonymous,
There was something about what your husband said that irritated me too.
“now the Society will do something about all those terrible elders who don’t follow the Society’s instructions and now the Society will make sure the elders do their jobs correctly.”
Umm didn’t they follow the Society’s instructions! Without question or reasoning, using their own discernment or conscience. That’s why they’re all in this sorry state of a mess.
Reply
 
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 21, 2015 at 3:26 pm
 
Obviously, the GB are just covering their own butts individually, as this seems to be the ongoing consensus. Remember what Jackson said when confronted that he had only been on the GB for 10 years as if that somehow excused him from the situation. If that attitude prevails and they keep distancing themselves from one another then they will implode from within. It means they don’t trust one another anymore.
Who knows what Jesus Christ will do to speed it up? I personally believe that he has sent child sex abuse as a plague to the Witnesses. There is nothing to hide behind now for them. Their cover is being removed for all to see. I am sure there are multiple prophecies that must describe this situation, as they hoodwinked so many and were so cruel in the process. You can’t profess to be ‘God’s spokesperson’ and then go and produce bad fruitage and expect that there won’t be consequences.
Reply
 
 minion says:

 August 21, 2015 at 10:15 pm
 
The scriptures your requesting can be found in the book of Malachi, chapters 1 through 4.
It’s ironic that every elder should know this account and its implications. The application then and now – the present day application, history will repeat itself.
Jehovah will have another cleansing at hand, sooner than later, by way of the court system.
My heart goes out to all the victims and their families.
Keep hope alive,
Reply
 
 sirius says:

 August 22, 2015 at 7:50 am
 
>>>Jehovah will have another cleansing at hand, sooner than later, by way of the court system.
Simple curious, how many cleansings to date?
IMHO
dogstar
Reply
 
 minion says:

 August 22, 2015 at 7:59 pm
 
We all joyed the way Angus Stewart maneuver and always in controled the dialogue. however, always used for the most part – an ending leading question, ‘do you understand?, then GeeJackson would answer, ‘Yes, I understand’.
Many times over, how many times? Many times over, how many times?
 Many times over.
Jehovah has a ‘final call or last call’ an event of grand proportions. Some have label this event as World War 3. And perhaps it is.
The book of Malachi has much insight on how the 7 men of WT have really screwed things up. By the building, name, contributions – the cash & crab, and worship.
 Take time and read the four chapters, if you wish, and you will understand and the patience is weary out on JG.
Peace out,

 
 
 
 
 
 
 Edgar Steele says:

 August 21, 2015 at 4:59 am
 
Is anyone aware of a source that documents the sex abuse cases and money paid out by the WT for these cases over the past few years? This would be a great reference to have; to be able to show JW’s what has happened and how much donation money has been lost (misappropriated) due to the society’s mishandling of such things.
If anyone is aware of a reference source for this please let me know.
Reply
 
 minion says:

 August 21, 2015 at 10:46 pm
 
Edgar Steele-
I quote; Public Access to Court Electronic Records (PACER) is an electronic public access service that allows users to obtain case and docket information online from federal appellate, district, and bankruptcy courts, and the PACER Case Locator. PACER is provided by the Federal Judiciary in keeping with its commitment to providing public access to Court information via a centralized service.
Who Can Access PACER?
PACER is available to anyone who registers for an account.
Their web address:
https://www.pacer.gov
Get back with us with your research – and forward to Cedars.
Keep hope alive, true unconditional Love,
Reply
 
 
 
 Bad Penny says:

 August 21, 2015 at 6:49 am
 
Edgar Steele –
I can’t find a specific list of documents, but if you ‘google’ ‘Sex abuses within Jehovahs witnesses’ you will find some info. Notably $20 mill paid out in June 2012 (Jonathan Kendrick case). $13,500 paid out in Oct. 2014, no names. Case from Loughborough, England, June 2015 – six figure settlement. £275,000 case in Devon, England – V.P. Law solicitors.
 Just a taster of many.
Reply
 
 ScotWm says:

 August 24, 2015 at 9:25 am
 
RE: “Notably $20 mill paid out in June 2012 (Jonathan Kendrick case).”
The original judgment in the Candace Conti case was drastically reduced on appeal: “What the revised punitive damages will be remains to be seen, but for now the $15.6 million judgment has been effectively stripped down to just $2.8 million in compensatory damages, with the $8.6 million in punitive damages against Watchtower overturned, and Kendrick unable to pay his $4.2 million in damages.”
http://jwsurvey.org/general-information/conti-appeal-watchtowers-punitive-damages-reversed-but-negligence-for-lack-of-field-service-supervision-is-affirmed
Because the Watchtower keeps its financial information secret, we have no way of knowing how much is being paid to sex abuse victims. However, the Watchtower is now literally begging its cult followers to give money so that they can “show appreciation for all that Jehovah and his Son have done” for them. This begging has reached a new low now that the Watchtower is specifically targeting bank accounts, stocks and bonds, real estate, wills, donations via electronic bank transfer, debit card, or credit card, cash, jewelry and other valuable personal property.
http://www.jw.org/en/publications/magazines/w20151115/donations-worldwide-work/
This is an indication that at least some of the sex abuse judgments are being paid.
Reply
 
 
 ScotWm says:

 August 24, 2015 at 9:45 am
 
RE: Jonathan Kendrick and the Candace Conti case:
The Watchtower legal department employs a very effective legal strategy which consists of stalling and appealing. The history of the Candace Conti appeal can be found by following the link below. Between its starting date of 09/25/2012 and ending date of 07/13/2015 – – 85 separate actions were registered in this 34 month period.
http://appellatecases.courtinfo.ca.gov/search/case/dockets.cfm?dist=1&doc_id=2025979&doc_no=A136641
Reply
 
 
 
 Bad Penny says:

 August 21, 2015 at 7:04 am
 
Sister drifter UK –
I know exactly how you feel about the handful of people you can be honest with. I have spoken to a few witnesses who I was particularly close to about my situation, but they are now avoiding me! It would be lovely to know someone in the same boat to be friends with. I and my husband were witnesses for 30 years and brought up our son in the faith. We are all now ‘out’ of our own volition. We also moved about a bit, having been assigned to six different congs from Devon to the Midlands. It would be amazing if we really did know each other?? Meantime, you can be assured that we can be on-line ‘sisters’.
Reply
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 21, 2015 at 3:32 pm
 
Bad Penny, we feel isolated, but really when we all get on here too, we are many. It is great to know that we’ve all been through it too. We weren’t that stupid. We were just duped. It must be one of the world’s greatest lies.
Reply
 
 
 
 Jake says:

 August 21, 2015 at 11:25 am
 
Perfect fear throws love outside.
Reply
 
 
 ruthlee says:

 August 21, 2015 at 1:47 pm
 
bad penny and sister drifter i too an an englander and moved a lot in my dysfunctional childhood so know quite a few it would be funny if we did know each other and even stranger that this website brings us together as seekers of truth and honesty out of the corpse came honey rl
Reply
 
 Pickled brain says:

 August 21, 2015 at 2:47 pm
 
@SisterDrifter& RuthLee& BadPenny
 I know many in some South Devon Congregations . I & my Family are in South London Congregation at the moment which I cannot reveal any more information as still very active just so I can subtlety try to save family. If they knew I was on this website it would break my family up because they would call the Elders to try & save me as I would be viewed as Spiritually weak !!! LAUGHABLE if it wasn’t SO SAD as I am still putting in about 20 hours a month in field service so I can be with my wife as I am DETERMINED This Organisation isn’t going to break my marriage up !! There are SO MANY MARRIAGES DESTROYED in the Organisation because of either Marrying too young or the STRAIN & STRESS of CONSTANTLY TRYING to ALWAYS DO MORE or One Spouse no longer believes & the other Spouse MANICALLY tries to follow the GB DEMANDS Avidly… Etc.
Reply
 
 Meredith J says:

 August 21, 2015 at 3:41 pm
 
Pickled Brain, if your wife is having some doubts and you have been through a lot of difficult times in the Organisation, then don’t lose hope. My husband left about 2 months before me. An elder came up to me and said “It must be so hard for you coming here on your own.” That comment made me so mad. I thought that it wasn’t hard as I kind of felt the same as him but hadn’t had the courage to go, but that comment told me that I did not want this man telling me that my husband was at fault. I never went to another meeting after that. Anyway, don’t lose hope. Communication is always good in any marriage. The brainwashing is so strong and that is what you are up against. All the best with it.
Reply
 
 Grace says:

 August 21, 2015 at 4:10 pm
 
Ditto,
My husband & I have often talked about when it was that was the final nail in the coffin & we both agreed that we had many incidental moments. They weren’t from people making big statements that made us see things, they were subtle little comments that came from various ones.
For instance an elder said to my hubby once, “we’re good at making rules” that stayed with him. I had a young inactive girl say to me, “the nice ones seem to be the ones that leave”. So it was little things like that that planted seeds of doubt over a period of time.
Then there was this really bizarre assembly in our circuit a couple of years ago & 2 elders gave the talk about not putting our conscience on to others. The story they used was a bible study going to a dinner party & they were playing a game that required lying to win (I think it’s called balderdash or something like that). The bible study didn’t want to play the game because he couldn’t see how that would be entertaining to lie to each other. The elders made the point to the audience that he was immature in the faith. (I thought is he sitting here while you ridicule him). By the end of the talk my husband & I couldn’t even bring ourselves to clap. Then outside I could see people hovering around the eftpos machine & I said to him later in the car that I couldn’t be bothered coming to another assembly, it’s just a load balderdash. We went to another 2 after that but it was already over for us mentally.
Reply
 
 
 Pickled brain says:

 August 21, 2015 at 10:49 pm
 
@Meredith . Thanks for your comments & encouragement. Much appreciated.
Reply
 
 
 
 Chiafade says:

 August 21, 2015 at 9:42 pm
 
You’re right about the difficulty in keeping the marriage together when there is a disagreement on the validity of the JW.org.
While the watchtower claims to want to preserve marriages and families they have no compunction to talk about separation when this situation arises. The shepherd the flock of God book makes it clear that it’s okay for a JW to separate under these conditions 1) extreme physical abuse ( I agree with this) 2) Extreme spiritual danger (Where is the scriptural backing for this?)
Number 2 is obviously directed towards someone who’s mate has gone “apostate” a crime and sin worse than pedophilia according to watchtower.
Reply
 
 
 
 
 Bad Penny says:

 August 21, 2015 at 2:41 pm
 
ruthlee –
Nice comment, thanks to CEDARS, (WHERE ARE YOU BY THE WAY? We are up to 300 comments on this one!) we can have love among ourselves. This makes up in small part for the ‘love’ we have lost to JWdom.
Reply
 
 
 Grace says:

 August 21, 2015 at 3:39 pm
 
Has anyone listened to Paul Grundy’s interview on abc. Conversations is the name of the Piece. He did such a great job.
http://www.abc.net.au/local/stories/2015/08/21/4297526.htm
Reply
 
 anonymous says:

 August 21, 2015 at 5:11 pm
 
Thanks for the link Grace. I loved the interview as well!!
Reply
 
 
 
 Jake says:

 August 22, 2015 at 12:58 am
 
Very true observations regarding the comments on marriages. I wrote to the society almost 20y ago and made the comments that within in the last ten years I had seen over 40 divorces within the surrounding area (5 congregations), 4 suicides and 5 convicted child molesters. There is a huge amount of pressure on marriages, do more, do more, obey, even over your marriage, we have the answers. It does seem to me the gentle and honest folk leave first. Conformity, despite your own conscience, is what they require, which in the end produces a toxic environment of fear and paranoia. Don’t lets get started on the false teachings and the arrogance of believing your always right.
 I’m sure there’ll be a new article soon
Reply
 
 
 Jake says:

 August 22, 2015 at 1:09 am
 
I’m 50 now, our generation who have had children within the organisation, well I can tell you, very few of them remain in. If I were to guess at a figure, knowing the couples I know, I would say 85% have left. It’s increasingly a toxic brand. Don’t worry about the devil out there, worry about the devil behind you in there.
Reply
 
 
 Bad Penny says:

 August 22, 2015 at 1:49 am
 
Jake –
So true, the last time I spoke to an elder in my old congregation, after I had left, he told me that I was doing the Devil’s work for him! I said, at least now I know who I’m working for, I didn’t realise I was working for him for the past 30 years!
 Just a point, don’t you think Geoffrey Jackson looked and acted like a snake in the ARC hearing. He was so slippery he could have fallen off his seat!
Reply
 
 Jake says:

 August 22, 2015 at 2:16 am
 
He’s trying to defend the indefensible. He did a good job, in certain areas, but to those in the know we saw straight through it, we’ve lived it.
Reply
 
 
 Pickled brain says:

 August 22, 2015 at 9:53 am
 
@BadPenny . That’s a good definition of Jackson! He was like a slippery snake& who was the first Slippery Snake ? MR SATAN himself !!!
Reply
 
 
 
 Jake says:

 August 22, 2015 at 2:10 am
 
Have Jehovah’s witnesses been a toxic brand within marriages, absolutely. What are the facts?
 In the 1970s a question from readers asked ” is oral sex a grounds for a scriptural divorce?” The answer was yes.
 Let me paint a scenario,
 Wife is a JW the husband is not. She decides he has committed pornia and is unrepentant, she decides to divorce him.
 He may well lose living with his children, his home, pay thousands towards solicitor costs, settlements, have another man move into his home and have his reputation ruined.
 Five years later the same question was asked, “is oral sex a grounds for a scriptural divorce?” Answer was no.
 That poor b****** lost everything on a falsehood and he was completely innocent.
 Is that not toxic?, show that man an apology then.
Reply
 
 Jake says:

 August 22, 2015 at 2:22 am
 
Ahh, and JW’s, because he hadn’t committed pornia she therefore did not have a scriptural grounds for a divorce, that means of course that if she has remarried she has committed adultery. How’s that for toxic, after all God hates a divorce. Gulp Watchtower because you led them into it.
Reply
 
 sirius says:

 August 23, 2015 at 9:02 am
 
@Jake
Well said in all your posts covering marriage & the perceived lovefest of perpetual bliss. The Pew research body did a statistical study of happiness (as I saw it) but through divorce rates across various religious groups in the USA. In short, and through the smoke and mirrors of JW propaganda (hype) there is NO significant difference across all groups. JWs are average and well within the margin-of-error. By the way, would love to see this same statistical study repeated for today’s times. The thinking here JWs would follow the general trend of the population and certainly not fight the trend!
IMHO
dogstar
Reply
 
 
 
 
 Jake says:

 August 22, 2015 at 3:12 am
 
Wt 1974 Nov 15 p703-4
 Wt 1978 Feb 15 p30
 Wt 1983 Mar 15 p27-31
Reply
 
 
 Enuffsenuff says:

 August 22, 2015 at 5:55 am
 
I liked Anonymous’ story of what her husband thought of Jackson, (who) did a bang up job defending the “truth” … my husband’s comment was that it was good … now the Society will do something about all those terrible elders who don’t follow the Society’s instructions .http://spartacus-educational.com/RUSsunday.htm
Just a little story about the The Winter Palace Massacre, in Russia. The workers at the Putilov Iron Works, 110,00 of them, were sacked. The workers and their women and children decided to go to the Tsar to get justice.
 The workers and their families thought the Tsar would help them. Instead he ordered his troops to open fire on them.
 In the attack by the Cossacks over 100 workers were killed and some 300 wounded. Alexandra Kollontai observed the “trusting expectant faces, the fateful signal of the troops stationed around the Palace, the pools of blood on the snow, the bellowing of the gendarmes, the dead, the wounded, the children shot.” She added that what the Tsar did not realise was that “on that day he had killed something even greater, he had killed superstition, and the workers’ faith that they could ever achieve justice from him.
 The moral of the story;- (Psalm 146:3-5) 3 Do not put YOUR trust in nobles, Nor in the son of earthling man, to whom no salvation belongs. 4 His spirit goes out, he goes back to his ground; In that day his thoughts do perish. 5 Happy is the one who has the God of Jacob for his help, Whose hope is in Jehovah his God,
 Don’t rely on Jackson or the elders, they are only there to protect the Org and its property.
Reply
 
 
 Ted says:

 August 22, 2015 at 11:38 am
 
Ray Franz was true to his conscience, which resulted in removal
 from his home in Bethel. With no special commercial skills, he
 supported himself and his wife by doing yard work for his friend
 Peter Gregerson. Similarly with Ed Dunlap, aged 72 he had to
 earn a living hanging wallpaper.
I ask myself, how can a man in the position of Jackson deliberately
 go against his “Christian conscience” by lying under oath? Claiming
 ignorance when asked pointed questions about certain functions
 and policies of an org, he has been at the pinnacle of for 10 years.
 Attempting to defend what he very well knows are inhuman, unloving,
 and unlawful practices.
A strong incentive for Jackson and his fellow GB, members and other
 prominent ones to ignore their conscience, is the reality of what
 happened to Ray and Ed. They themselves could be cast adrift
 if they spoke the absolute truth. And at their age could find a
 government pay check is all they have to live on. Their employers
 are not known for handing out. golden handshakes.
Reply
 
 Pickled brain says:

 August 22, 2015 at 12:15 pm
 
@Ted . You are so Right about Ray Franz & Ed Dunlap who both had REAL GUTS to Stand up for Truth & what they Knew was Right! To Give up a COSY, CUSHY LIFE at BETHEL to leave & do Menial work outside because they knew the Whole JW Organisation is ONE BIG CON !!!
Reply
 
 
 
 Ted says:

 August 22, 2015 at 12:06 pm
 
Government assistance is what two aged special pioneers
 In my former cong, ended up on. And undoubtedly is the
 experience of many.
Reply
 
 
 Bad Penny says:

 August 22, 2015 at 4:13 pm
 
It’s a sad fact that you don’t know about the shadier side of Jehovah’s witnesses until you actually leave them, or until you want justice for a terrible wrong, as is the case for victims of abuse!
 Unless these poor folks awaken to the real truth they will remain in their fools paradise.
 I believe they will all be cast aside with nothing when the axe finally falls on the Watchtower. The Society could not afford to pay the compensation claims for unfulfilled promises!
 Enuffsenuff – how often we read that scripture and didn’t realise we were doing it, putting our trust in nobles, etc. I have found that by turning scriptures round to apply to Watchtower instead of the world things are starting to make more sense. I do think they have taken up the ‘name’ of God in a worthless way and will have to pay full recompense for their error. I remember a Watchtower study a couple of years ago when it was proudly stated that they had taken the name that no-one else wanted. If you arrogantly believe you are THE CHOSEN ONES, you should make darn sure you live up to it!
 I hope this ARC hearing is the beginning of the end for them and that maybe God will use the ‘superior authorities’ to punish them with the greatest severity. (Ex 20:7)
Reply
 
 
 GEM says:

 August 23, 2015 at 3:04 am
 
@ Bad Penny:
I respect your right to self expression.
If you are not careful, we will lose the measured approach and rhetoric displayed by the ARC in a tirade of blood lust and scalp hunting.
Already you have called on Cedars to head up the mob action. Don’t you think, being August, he might be having a little quality time with his delightful little family? Cut some slack and give him space to breathe!
The only way you will get the monolith called Watchtower to recognise the error of its own actions is to reason with them on their own territory.
The ARC is an EXCELLENT start for rolling out the correct thought processes which may lead to change.
Remember, Bad Penny, many of us joined the movement originally because we saw the blood lust and guilt in the other suburbs of “Babylon”…. if your from the South of England, like me…take a walk through the cloisters and aisles of Winchester Cathedral. Raise your eyes and see the distressed Union Jacks, soaked in the blood of the Valiant.
Give your (ex) brothers and sisters time to repent…I always found the vast majority to be kind and warm hearted people. They just need a little nudging out of slumber to question who they are really serving.
Peace and Reason everyone.
Reply
 
 
 Garrett says:

 August 23, 2015 at 7:05 am
 
Gem
Chalk my vote up for blood lust and scalp hunting.
You cannot teach Chinese to a dog and you will never
“reason with them on their own territory”.
Reply
 
 
 GEM says:

 August 23, 2015 at 7:34 am
 
@Garrett:
That’s a shame.. personally I was impressed with Paul Grundy’s Podcast interview. I guess he is probably closest to the way I feel.
It is my hope that all “men” will reason and finally reach universal agreement…otherwise, we are damned.
By the way, having experienced a session in a pool with a Dolphin recently I am not so sure about your conviction over teaching animals foreign languages.
All the best.
Reply
 
 Garrett says:

 August 23, 2015 at 7:55 am
 
Gem,
 You cannot “reason” with radical religion.
 Americans aren’t dropping pleas and pamphlets on ISIS and the Taliban because they know it doesn’t work.
 They use bombs.
Half measures and hand wringing wishes are as ineffective as throwing popcorn at a charging rhino.
Reply
 
 
 
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