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JW Broadcasting
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At the 130th Annual Meeting on October 4th, 2014, a special resource for Jehovah’s Witnesses was unveiled. A new website called “JW Broadcasting” (tv.jw.org) would feature videos promoting the work of the Watchtower organization, and every month an hour-long video would be uploaded to be presented by a Governing Body member.
Since I feel strongly that Jehovah’s Witnesses deserve to hear both sides of the arguments presented by the organization and its leaders in these extremely persuasive videos, I have committed to releasing a rebuttal/response video for each monthly JW Broadcasting episode. These can be found below.
If you struggle to watch the videos in the smaller dimensions, please click on the “YouTube” button in the bottom right hand corner of the video you are watching, and it will open in its own browser window.
October 2014 – Stephen Lett
November 2014 – Geoffrey Jackson
December 2014 – David Splane / Mark Noumair
January 2015 – Anthony Morris III
Related blog post: “Tony’s JW Broadcasting rant against higher education…”
February 2015 – Samuel Herd / Robert Luccioni
March 2015 – Gerrit Losch / John Ekrann
April 2015 – Mark Sanderson
May 2015 – Stephen Lett
June 2015 – Geoffrey Jackson
If you notice any of the above videos are missing or no longer available, please let us know and we will try to find alternative YouTube sources.
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5 Responses to JW Broadcasting
Grace says:
March 17, 2015 at 2:42 pm
Muslim community establishes $1 million television studio, the One Path Network, to counter mainstream media treatment of Islam
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-03-16/muslim-tv-studio-counters-mainstream-media-treatment-of-islam/6323814
Is this the latest thing? Setting up ‘god tv’ everywhere.
Reply
Gilbert says:
May 29, 2015 at 11:36 pm
I thing the best thing that has happened to Watchtower id Steven Lett on video. Really!. We should all right in letters of how touching his video broadcast are. Maybe this will inflate his ego and he would do more videos. Effectively making your job easier. NO sarcasm intended. I really believe his ego will grow
Reply
Gilbert says:
May 29, 2015 at 11:38 pm
I thing the best thing that has happened to Watchtower is Steven Lett on video. Really!. We should all write in letters of how touching his video broadcast are. Maybe this will inflate his ego and he would do more videos. Effectively making your job easier. NO sarcasm intended. I really believe his ego will grow
Reply
Trish says:
June 5, 2015 at 7:48 pm
JW Broadcast is awesome! It has really helped me to see what is truly important in life!!! I absolutely LOVE it!!
Reply
Markw1509 says:
June 10, 2015 at 8:23 am
Trish…could you elaborate on your comment about JW Broadcasting being ‘awesome’?
Would like to hear more!
Peace
Mark
Reply
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Videos
New videos are constantly being uploaded to the John Cedars YouTube channel.
Here is a playlist featuring the most recent uploads…
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And here is a playlist of recommended videos from other channels…
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11 Responses to Videos
KtotheRAD "Konrad" says:
August 25, 2013 at 6:55 pm
With every word they reveal and “impart” far more than they ever intended…
Reply
george says:
August 27, 2013 at 4:45 am
Sorry Cedars, I can only access the first video on my I pad. There are a lot of over sized play icons and they won’t work.
Reply
Luke says:
October 27, 2013 at 5:27 pm
Continue the good work on this site that expose what Watchtower Organization really are — a fanatic end-time driven cult that only serve interests of its leaders. I left this
cult three years ago for good. My only regret is that I had not left the Watchtower Cult earlier! On Easter Sunday this year, I was baptized in the Name of the Father, Son, Holy Spirit and received into Eastern Orthodox Church, apostolic Church that preserved the Faith that was once for all delivered to the saints.
Cedar, you have my blessings of your work on this site that
will yet help millions of JWs to see the truth of so-called ‘Truth’.
Reply
Fred says:
November 2, 2013 at 12:09 pm
Forget taking your numbers from a 1974 yearbook if you question the amount of those killed, interned, etc get the numbers from the Holocaust museum. You forgot to mention the ‘JEWS’ were and its quoted several times in the Watchtower publications as it is related in the bible, “ONCE GOD’S CHOSEN PEOPLE” but they did not remain that because of their actions. Your quotes from WT publications are based on the latter that they fell out of favour in God’s eyes. They therefor were NOT written in an anti-Semitic nature. Many Jews have become JW’s over the years are they lesser beings because they were of Jewish blood?…ABSOLUTELY NOT! All races are equal so this video in my opinion is twisted in its presentation. Not to mention the ridiculous claim of Rutherford’s so called love letter to Adolf Hitler. No blinders on here, I have checked the facts. Sorry but this video paints an untruthful twist of events and statements about the WT as regards the comments on the Nazi’s and Jews.
Reply
Palma says:
February 28, 2014 at 3:48 am
Hi everybody! Hi cedars!
I found this article about a discovery in egypt that brings light to the origin of story of joseph in the bible.
What do you think?http://www.davidovits.info/the-lost-fresco-and-the-bible-my-new-book-in-french/
Reply
Idris says:
March 27, 2014 at 8:12 am
Thank you for this page, it has been a great help to me, as I seek the truth of the word of God, however I noticed in the video ‘Does the Bible speak of ‘Paradise Earth’ the speaker quotes Luke 21v43 twice, regarding Jesus word on the cross, there should be a correction note as the verse he mentions is in Luke 23 v 43.
Keep up the good work
Reply
Julia Orwell says:
July 17, 2014 at 3:47 am
Been to internationals before and this elaborate souvenir thing is entirely new. The last one I went to in 2009, the last ones they had, had nothing like this so it’s not a matter of you having not noticed it in the past, it’s a matter of it being a new phenomenon.
I theorize that the wt motives for this involve keeping the masses busy and therefore obedient. Jws would volunteer to do this because there are no other legitimate outlets for creative expression. Armageddon being near has nothing to do with it: it’s about keeping the sheeple busy and happy. Making stupid trinkets is also a team building activity as it involves jws working together, thus reinforcing the herd mentality jws have.
Reply
frankie fernandez says:
February 27, 2015 at 4:44 pm
dear friends I was baptized in 1974. Thank God I am no longer a member of the WT. Free at last and oh what a relief it is. A member of my former congregation who I considerd my best friend molested a minor. There was a big argument amognst the elders on the judicial committee. One elder who was a maverick, wanted to notify the police. But, instead they followed the instuctions of the society. They kept this crime against the child, hush hush. So as not to tarnish the name of Jehovah. But in reality it was a coverup to protect the wt’s reputation. Meanwhile this poor child that was raped has to carry the heavy burden of a victim for the rest of thier lives without compensation and without justice. While the abuser has remaind a member in good standing. The congregation he is attending now has not been notified that he is a sexual preditor.
Reply
Kirtley W. Burggraf says:
March 11, 2015 at 11:16 am
Tell me, since governing body members are elected (replacing someone who dies) at what point do do they become “divinely inspired” or “spirit guided”? Were they always thus in the lower ranks or does this just “happen” the moment that they are appointed? What’s Watchtower’s take on this?
Reply
Alone in MD says:
March 31, 2015 at 6:00 pm
Regards your video on the Memorial Service. I am one of those “non believers” married to a baptized witness. I go to just keep the peace but I’ve made it known that I consider this service one of the worst religious ceremonies that I have ever been to. “Anointed What”. Also it was announced at last years meeting that “this may be the last memorial service”. They are at it again. Thanks for the great videos.
Reply
frankie fernandez says:
May 10, 2015 at 9:50 pm
IF CHRIST WAS ENTHRONGED IN 1914, WHY ARE THE WITNESES STILL CELEBRATING THE MEMORIAL? CHRIST SAID THAT AFTER HIS ARRIVAL NO ONE WAS TO CELEBRATE THE MEMORIAL .ALSO HE SAID THAT THE DAY OF HIS PRESENSE, IT WILL BE LIKE LIGHTNING FROM ONE POINT OF THE EARTH TO ANOTHER. LIGHTNING TRAVELS AT THE SPEED OF 3500 MILES PER SECOUND. SO IT WILL TRAVEL AROUND THE GLOBE IN LESS THAN A MINUTE. HE ALSO SAID THAT ALL EYES WILL SEE HIM. NOT LIKE THE WTS THAT SAYS WE ARE IN HIS INVISIBLE PRESENSE.
Reply
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The must-read story of a ministerial servant and his wife who woke up in the last few months
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start-thinking
In June 2012, a jury in Oakland, California ordered Watchtower to pay $28 million for its role in the abuse of Candace Conti.*
In October 2014, a San Diego Superior Court judge ordered Watchtower to pay $13.5 million in punitive and compensatory damages for the abuse of Jose Lopez.
In June 2015, Watchtower was ordered to pay £275,000 to a victim of child abuse by the High Court in London.
*The amount and judgment were later reduced on appeal, with Watchtower still being required to pay $2.8 million in compensatory damages.
These are not isolated instances. They are not just the work of one or two rogue individuals. They are not persecution by Satan or the product of unjustified attacks by opposers. They are the result of specific, documented instructions issued to congregation elders by Watchtower on how child abuse should be handled.
This is a systemic problem, and sadly it will not be going away any time soon.
The reason why Candace Conti, Jose Lopez, and countless other children of Jehovah’s Witnesses have been let down is because the Governing Body views child sex abuse as a sin first-and-foremost, and only a crime by coincidence.
The “two witness rule,” according to which elders still operate today, means that they are to “leave matters in Jehovah’s hands” if an independent witness to an act of child molestation is not forthcoming. (see page 72 of the elders’ Shepherd manual, below)
child-sex-abuseWhen critics of Jehovah’s Witnesses talk about the organization “protecting” pedophiles, they do not mean that the organization’s literature condones or encourages child molestation. They are referring to the fact that Watchtower policies effectively conceal pedophiles and make it easier for them to operate due to the culture of secrecy and confidentiality that Watchtower insists upon.
In the following video, investigative reporter Trey Bundy explains some of the disturbing lengths Watchtower has gone to in order to keep the identity of child molesters secret.
All of this means that you have no way of knowing whether someone in your congregation is a child molester or not, because the Governing Body is more interested in protecting the reputation of the organization than protecting ordinary children.
All they need to do to change things, and safeguard against more child abuse cases in the future, is write a letter to elders telling them to report ALL accusations of child abuse to the authorities – but the Governing Body absolutely refuses to do this.
If you are a Jehovah’s Witness reading this, you need to ask yourself: How can this be Jehovah’s Organization if it continues to put children at risk despite these adverse court judgments? If Jehovah’s clean organization truly abhors child abuse and considers it a crime, why can’t it allow all accusations of child abuse to be reported in the same way as other crimes (such as theft and murder) are to be reported?
The makers of this web page urge you to consider waking up to the possibility that only by confronting these issues and saying “enough is enough” can we bring about change and safeguard children of Jehovah’s Witnesses from those who would do them unspeakable harm.
We invite you to start doing research using some of the online resources listed below. And please don’t be afraid! Remember that if a God of love and truth really exists, he would never resent someone for trying to uncover the facts.
JWfacts.com
JWsurvey.org
WatchtowerDocuments.com
PDF of Crisis of Conscience
10 Responses to JWawake.com
Grace says:
April 8, 2015 at 9:02 pm
Great piece, well presented & simple to read.
I’m looking forward to more articles.
Reply
Patrick Haeck says:
April 9, 2015 at 3:03 am
Great job! Thanks!
Reply
Girma Terefe says:
April 9, 2015 at 3:49 am
who will responsible child abuse elders abuser who if hé déniés because thé elders do not have investigation knowledge.
Reply
Alex says:
April 13, 2015 at 1:21 pm
Need to translate it to several main languages. All people should know truth about JW.
Reply
Elder Johnson says:
July 16, 2015 at 9:19 am
I’m so glad to see this. It has made me realize the truth about the truth.
Reply
pj wilcox says:
July 16, 2015 at 2:32 pm
These bastards should be all sent to jail. There they will be confronted by men who will take care of what should be done to them. Prisons do not take lightly, men that molest kids sexually. We should have this on pay per view, make Budweiser a sponsor and give the monies raised to the victims. Hell, I would pay $50 for this.
Or castrate all that have been found guilty.
Reply
Former Pioneer says:
July 17, 2015 at 10:44 am
Thank you! This is a great resource and kudos to everyone who helped on the billboard in Texas.
Reply
Hilani Morales says:
July 17, 2015 at 3:29 pm
I was molested for years by a Jehovah’s Witness named Carlos Buten in a Boston Ma Kingdom Hall. Myself and the other victim (who is 2 years younger than I) were interrogated by a room full of men and were asked if our intentions were to hurt him or cause trouble. They then asked us to get into painful details about the sexual abuse. After it was over we were given clear instructions not to contact authorities or tell other members in the congregation about the abuse in order to safeguard brother Buten’s confidentiality. He remained an active member in the congregation and continued to play with other children in the church. I was eventually placed in foster care because of my parents’ neglect to protect me against my molester and for my father’s physical abuse. As for my father’s relentless beatings, I was instructed to pray to Jehovah and everything would be ok. Sometimes my father even beat me during Kingdom Hall reunions in the back room. To this day I experience ptsd from all of the abuse I experienced as a child under the leadership of Jehovah.
Reply
Ray franz says:
July 18, 2015 at 9:12 pm
I hope they go on to research rand cam, the military company the Watchtower owned, you can check it in the U.S. GOV SEC files to prove it. I hope they research the UK guardian newspaper article on the Watchtower agreeing to support the U.N for over a decade. I hope they research the recent governing body member that left having seen how it was run at Brookly Bethel, writing a vital book to read as a JW called “Crisis of Conscience”… I hope the fear they feel at even THINKING about doing any of this research, gives them s clue that there is something wrong with their beliefs……. Snare x
Reply
M. says:
July 20, 2015 at 3:45 pm
Thanks!
Reply
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← Why class distinction among Jehovah’s Witnesses is alive and flourishing
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The Book Corner – Combating Cult Mind Control by Steven Hassan
avatar
Posted on July 2, 2015
The 25th Anniversary edition of Combating Cult Mind Control includes extensive material on Jehovah's Witnesses
The 25th Anniversary edition of Combating Cult Mind Control includes extensive material on Jehovah’s Witnesses
When renowned cult expert Steven Hassan first published his seminal work Combatting Cult Mind Control in 1988, the world was a very different place.
There was no internet, so mega-cults like Watchtower, Scientology and the Moonies had a free run at inflicting their undue influence on people, including my parents, virtually unchallenged. There was precious little recourse for mounting any meaningful like-for-like rebuttal to the torrents of damaging nonsense spewing forth from cult leaders like the Governing Body.
And when it came to seeking support in escaping purveyors of undue influence, where could one turn? Cult refugees were forced to muddle through the best they could in their efforts to debrief themselves following their ordeal. There were no forums, reddit pages or facebook groups to turn to for solidarity, a hearing ear, or advice on what to do. Despite the groundbreaking work of pioneers like Robert J. Lifton, mind control as a serious field of study was even more taboo and misunderstood than it is now – and that’s saying something!
Step forward Steve Hassan, who since first publishing Combatting has gone on to author several other valuable guides for assisting those under undue influence, and with multiple media appearances has developed a reputation as one of the world’s leading authorities on mind control.
I had the pleasure of meeting Steven at the undue influence workshop in London last August, on which occasion he and I sat down for a quick interview (below). I recall in subsequent conversations Steven mentioned he was trying to secure the rights to re-publish the 1988 edition of Combatting so that he could bring it up-to-date with a quarter of a century’s worth of developments in the cult field.
Of course, one of the most appealing features of the 1988 Combatting was that, while introducing the BITE model as a means of recognizing cult characteristics, it didn’t mention Jehovah’s Witnesses once. This meant that Combatting could not be prohibited as “apostate literature” by the Governing Body, thus allowing doubting Witnesses to read it without having to wrestle with crippling feelings of guilt.
But why the oversight? Because as a former Moonie, Hassan simply didn’t know enough about what Watchtower was doing to consider the organization a cult back then. It took conversations with the likes of Randall Watters, a legend in the Watchtower resistance movement, to convince him that Jehovah’s Witnesses are “one of the largest contemporary cults,” and that almost everything he wrote in Combatting regarding cultic influence could be applied to Watchtower’s methods.
Steven Hassan credits Randall Watters with helping him understand Watchtower's cult-like attributes
Steven Hassan credits Randall Watters with helping him understand Watchtower’s cult-like attributes
A 25th Anniversary re-release of Combating (now minus one of the “t’s”) was the perfect opportunity for Steven to redress the balance and drag Jehovah’s Witnesses under the umbrella of organizations whose toxic influence must be urgently remedied.
Ex-Witnesses (and those seeking to be ex-Witnesses) will find chapters such as chapter 4 (“Understanding Mind Control”) and chapter 22 (“Strategies for Recovery”) very helpful. The latter includes a section titled “Floating: Dealing With The Cult Identity After Leaving,” which offers strategies for coping with the inner torment experienced by many cult victims long after they have left.
Those who are trying to help a friend or relative who has been enticed into joining the Witnesses will find chapter 8 (“Curing the Mind Control Virus”) helpful, as it walks the reader through the basic techniques involved in staging interventions for loved ones. And trust me as someone who has tried and failed with an intervention on his own indoctrinated father – though there is never a magic bullet solution when it comes to waking up family members it is all too easy to get it wrong!
Combating also features two “survivor stories” from ex-Jehovah’s Witnesses on pages 173 and 175. One is that of Lee Marsh, president of AAWA, who suffered abuse as both a child and a wife during her traumatic Watchtower experience. The other story is my own – a brief run-through of my journey out of Jehovah’s Witnesses at the expense of normal relationships with my father and sister, who now shun me for taking a stand against the organization. (This is a story that I will be detailing in my forthcoming book, which I hope will be published next year.)
I am grateful to Steven for including both these experiences. By highlighting the specific ways in which Watchtower is ruining lives, we can hopefully inoculate others, including escapees from other cults, against ever getting entangled in the organization’s corrosive web of influence.
Steven reserves some of the most scathing material about Jehovah’s Witnesses for the closing pages of his book, where he mentions the deadly prohibitions on blood transfusions and calls for Watchtower’s tax exempt status to be revoked.
“Any country that grants tax-exempt status to organizations that abuse children, not just physically, but mentally, emotionally or spiritually, should be held responsible for that abuse. Tax-exempt organizations like Jehovah’s Witnesses, that have had policies in place for decades that systematically protect pedophiles from criminal prosecution, and which disfellowship victims and their families for speaking out, should lose their exemption. The leadership should be prosecuted for conspiracy to cover up illegal activities.”
I fully endorse those sentiments, and I am grateful to Steven for adding his voice to the growing calls for greater scrutiny of cults, particularly as regards tax exemption. After all, it is bad enough that governments are doing nothing to make life difficult for cults without them effectively giving them a leg up by subsidizing their income.
More than anything, I am thankful that Steven and others in the ex-cult movement are doing such wonderful work in raising public consciousness surrounding undue influence, and advising those who suffer from it.
The 25th Anniversary edition of Combating Cult Mind Control shines a bright light on the murky world of cults, and the strategies they use so successfully in controlling people’s lives. If you are struggling from the effects of cultic manipulation, or want to help a loved one escape its grasp, you will find this book a wonderful resource.
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To order your copy of the 25th Anniversary edition of Combating Cult Mind Control, click here.
To listen to a recent podcast interview with Steven Hassan regarding his new book, click here.
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62 Responses to The Book Corner – Combating Cult Mind Control by Steven Hassan
Richard E. Kelly says:
July 2, 2015 at 8:45 am
An excellent review of Steven’s book, Lloyd. A must-read for all ex-JWs. And I am looking forward to reading your book, another staple I am sure, for those books that will help to make the world aware of Watchtower abuses and its shameless use of undue influence on its members.
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Mama Joy says:
July 2, 2015 at 9:01 am
You should lose your tax exempt status when you act more like a hate group than a religion.
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ScotWm says:
July 2, 2015 at 9:02 am
The Watchtower mind control program consists of illogical, rambling nonsense spewed out by the “faithful and discreet slave”, now claimed to be the Governing Body. The irrational demands of the Governing Body become painfully obvious when the facts are known:
“Since Jehovah God and Jesus Christ completely trust the faithful and discreet slave, should we not do the same?” Watchtower 2009 Feb 15 p.27
“We need to obey the faithful and discreet slave to have Jehovah’s approval.” Watchtower 2011 Jul 15 p.24 Simplified English Edition
Once properly programed, brainwashed witnesses will truly believe the Governing Body’s lies and then attempt to lure others into the Watchtower cult.
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Stephane Laliberte says:
July 2, 2015 at 5:18 pm
Those quotes are gold!
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ScotWm says:
July 4, 2015 at 12:23 am
RE: “Those quotes are gold!”
I agree. Those are a couple of real winners. And here’s another good one:
“The Bible calls the era that began in 1914 “the last days.” ” (WT Study Edition 08/15/2015, p. 24, #1)
As you might have guessed, there is no scripture that can be used to back up this statement.
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Wendy says:
July 5, 2015 at 7:33 pm
Right ScotWm, there is no scripture that exists to back up this belief. I have spent much time going through the gyrations of how JWs get to this date, and the algebraic equation isn’t satisfied by their explanation. Basically, it’s 1260 = X + (y)X + 1/2X to arrive at that date, and unless you know the value of Y, you can not know the value of X, which they use to define as a “time.” So the whole hypothesis of all their dates fall flat without an explanation of how they arrive at 1914. Would love a rebuttal in case my math is incorrect.
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Searcher says:
July 2, 2015 at 10:05 am
Thanks Lloyd for the review and info on the latest edition of “Combating Cult Mind Control”. I read the first edition, recognizing so many similarities to Hassan’s BITE model to the WTBTS. Funny how any JW elder will swear (figuratively, of course) up and down that the Watchtower is not a cult. I’m glad that Hassan has directly referenced the Watchtower in the book as a destructive cult.
I also look forward to your new book. Keep up the good work you are doing. You are helping so many people out of the horrible control of the WTBTS.
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Mike Dennis says:
July 2, 2015 at 10:54 am
Thank you Lloyd for all your good work and help to all of us who were part of this cult in the past. We all have a book in us and I hope yours helped you personally in dealing with your losses. I also have lost all my family because I refuse to accept ” the slave “. It’s so heart breaking to lose all you once held dear. I just ordered the new book from Mr. Hassan. Thank you again.
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JJ says:
July 2, 2015 at 11:07 am
I’m going to say that leaving a cult is very hard. It might even be worth staying in, or leaving someone in.
My life has become a mess since I’ve left the Jehovah’s Witnesses. Not because I started drinking or taking drugs but from the loss of friends, my wife leaving me, my in laws turning against me and trying to take my family away. I know that all of this just proves how evil and wrong the cult is but to try and fight all of these people on your own is absolutely exhausting and depressing.
Then there was the ‘awakening’ to the fact that the Paradise isn’t coming and that we are all going to die. That was very hard to deal with.
Finally, growing up in the cult doesn’t provide you with the emotional background or experience to deal with the real world on different terms.
I know that this would sound silly to someone who has never been in a cult but these are very real problems for me. (I’m hoping to save my marriage and my family but my wife’s dream is shattered or having a ‘spiritual’ man as her head)
Of course I think the governments should tax all religions, investigate and charge cults that do damaging things and educate people to stay away from these groups. But it might just be better off to leave some people right where they are. Be there to support them when they do come out but don’t actively try and pull people out if they’ve been raised and have an extended family in there. As wrong as it all is, there is too much to lose for most people.
I know the cults are insidious this way but people’s lives and happiness are involved. It would be much like us going to a primitive tribe somewhere and trying to force these people into the 21st Century.
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5 years out says:
July 2, 2015 at 12:19 pm
From one ex-jw to another, am sending you lots of big hugs. It isn’t easy leaving and having everything around you taken away or people attempting to take them away.
There are a few facebook groups of people who have left which (if you haven’t already joined) might help to talk about things and to come to terms with the changing situation eg:
https://www.facebook.com/groups/695974930436633/?fref=ts
https://www.facebook.com/groups/Excult/?fref=ts
It’s going to be tough but you can get through it :) Find people who like you for who you are not just for what you do or don’t believe
Stay strong, you can do it :)
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Mike Dennis says:
July 2, 2015 at 12:34 pm
JJ, I understand your dilemmas. When I was DF, I told my wife to just come with me for one year, to travel and heal and rebuild our relationship. The only non negotiable stipulation was that no WT for that year. She could pray. Read the Bible. No WT influence. She refused, saying she was ” completely loyal to Jehovah “. As much as I tried to explain to her that the Org is not the same as Jehovah, she refused to consider it. As a consequence, I have no contact with my sons, except for business. My mother refuses to even open my letters. I was a born in. I served as an elder for many years. I saw too much that was wrong while serving. I was willing to forgive and overlook stuff because that’s our nature. ” it’s just imperfect men “. That was used too much. In combination with…” Obey those taking the lead ” it became ridiculous to try and excuse the org anymore. Even while in I tried to keep my sons and wife open minded and encouraged them to question things. Now, I see that something very bad must happen to most folks before they wake up. We cannot wake our family up if they prefer to blindly believe. As for myself, I have chosen to be true to my conscience. I cannot support the org. I believe it is stubborn, wrong on lots of levels. Just the fact that it breaks up families is reason enough to dismiss this cult. Ex JWs understand each other mostly. Find someone to talk to in your circumstance. Do not despair and return to this cult and support it to regain your families love. What a terrible way to live. I know now that if I went back to my wife, who I love still, my life and hers would be miserable. I’m an outcast now, a low life form who disrespects the ” slave. ” I have lost all I knew because of making a mistake many years ago. My wife had forgiven me, but the org didn’t. I wasn’t ” sincere enough ” in my repentance for a single act committed several years prior. If you want to get well after a life of indoctrination, you will have to work at it. Friends won’t come instantly as when you’re ” in “. You will have to take time and effort to learn patience and real love. Not love based on common beliefs. Loving your family and missing them is what makes us good humans. If the org would let folks decide for themselves who to shun or not, life would make more sense to JWs. As it is, their thinking is done for them. I am of the opinion that you cannot drag loved ones from this cult. They will leave or wKe up when they get that epiphany and realize that there are holes in the fabric of this society. In any case, good luck. We all make our own journey. Freedom to think is priceless. Aloha
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Simon Kestral says:
July 2, 2015 at 3:49 pm
Sounds like she forgave infidelity but can’t cope with rivalry against WT. Tragic. Sorry for your loss.
But you’re right about the org. I hope you stay strong and find peace of mind, with or without your wife.
In my view, a man does what a man has to do, with or without the support of loved ones. Not saying it’s time for you to move on, only you can know that. But given enough time, we all do.
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Finn Sawyer says:
July 2, 2015 at 6:14 pm
JJ,
I sympathize with your statement. Know that others are going through the same as you. I wish I could tell you the story will end OK, but that may not be the case. Hang in there.
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ScotWm says:
July 2, 2015 at 6:50 pm
RE: “I’m going to say that leaving a cult is very hard. It might even be worth staying in, or leaving someone in.”
You raise a valid point. I know that there are many who remain in the JW organization to avoid the very problems that you have outlined. These floaters are easy to spot because they have only moderate knowledge of the most basic Watchtower history and doctrines. They are dragged along by faithful family members and they offer absolutely no resistance to even the most asinine pronouncements of the Governing Body. They parrot back the information presented in study articles and offer no original thoughts on the material being considered.
Exposing false Watchtower doctrine to these people is only a partial solution toward helping them break free. If we can’t offer a viable alternative to Watchtower association and beliefs, a person may feel that remaining in good standing with the Watchtower organization is the better choice. Choosing to remain in a secure environment triumphs over being cast out, all alone, to face the unknown.
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Meredith J says:
July 3, 2015 at 9:01 pm
So sorry to hear how the Witnesses messed up your life. I was lured into the organisation along with my hubby and kids we brought up in it. One is still in it with his family and thoroughly brainwashed. I was shattered for quite sometime not feeling right about everything. My husband felt like he had been conned for the 17 years of our lives we were in it after we made the move. We had lost so much in material wealth, it was all catch up for us. It wasn’t easy, but somehow we made a life for ourselves. You can do it and come out sane on the other side. This time you have the freedom to think for yourself for once. I know it’s not easy but it feels like you have got out of gaol. Certainly that is a real blessing. Sure we all go a bit crazy and over the top for a while. It’s like we are finding a balance which we eventually find. Hang in there brother.
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Cr0okedfinger says:
July 4, 2015 at 12:14 am
Actually you’re right on JJ. As an ex-christian, I feel the same way towards my very religious family. If you’re happy as a Christian, enjoy it. Because really it’s all the same in the end. Only those who are unhappy and are seeking answers outside their religion or sect and have open minds should be given the truth, because it’ll be wasted on those not willing to listen.
The sad reality that there is no soul, and no afterlife, means that when we die, we simply cease to exist, same as all other animals. So believing in an afterlife or not is all the same in the end. All men die and we all come to nothing. Enjoy your life in the meantime, it’s the only one you’ll ever have.
PS: for several years after leaving Christianity I often felt that I was happier when I was a believer. But eventually that passed and I’m much happier and content with life now. There’s no going back for me. I could no more go back to believing in false religions than I could regain belief in Santa Claus.
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ScotWm says:
July 4, 2015 at 10:38 am
[Evangelical comment removed – please refer to posting guidelines before commenting again.]
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ScotWm says:
July 4, 2015 at 3:14 pm
I have re-read all of your comment posting guidelines. I also went back and re-read your article posted on April 11, 2015:
“My response to the haters (and why I can’t always shake it off)”
Please accept my apology for posting a personal belief that I can’t prove.
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John Baptist says:
July 2, 2015 at 12:56 pm
test
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John Baptist says:
July 2, 2015 at 12:59 pm
I wrote a reply and puff gone. lol I just got the book on Kindle last week. Cant wait to be done with it. Much needed!! Thank You
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JJ says:
July 2, 2015 at 4:36 pm
I was, unfortunately, under the illusion that when I learned the truth about “The Truth” my wife and my Inlaws would be likewise happy and excited. I was shocked to find that Jehovah’s Witnesses DO NOT want to know anything other than what comes from their governing body. It doesn’t matter what you can prove or what makes sense, they wish to believe as they see fit and they want to know that you do too.
That knowledge is important so that you don’t make any enemies or even have cult members become suspicious of you.
Of course if you wish to leave then that’s your business and right to do so, just these ‘apostates’ or drifters should be aware of how most cult members will treat them.
Also, there is a process that happens when you realize there isn’t (or might not be) a god, an afterlife or any hope at all. When someone’s belief structure gets torn away it can be quite traumatic.
In short, you can make someone’s life better by getting them out of a cult but it can be much worse too. There are many happy Jehovah’s Witnesses who were born, raised and died in that organization. If their whole, extended family, friendships and employment were inside of the Jehovah’s Witnesses then what are you offering by getting them out?
I don’t like the JW religion but there could be worse ways to live. Ignorance is bliss.
I kind of feel like that one guy in The Matrix who was angry that he was ever taken out. I thought that I would bring my whole family happiness but I’ve only brought them misery and sadness, so far. I think that I’m right but it doesn’t matter. All of my predictions have come true (about owning a home, having a pension, making investments) but it doesn’t matter if they can’t be happy with me.
I’ll never go back in but I may have to fake it. I’ll hate it but I’ll enjoy what I can and I won’t try to take anyone else out.
My wife always asks what else I can offer her/them?!? Some people will never be ready to stare into the void.
In fact, I feel that if there are enough people like me on the inside it would weaken the organization more than all of the websites and books ever could. We could water down all of the doctrines, temper all of the discipline, break all of the cliques and simply take seats without ever contributing one penny. Really that is every cults worse nightmare; to have unbelievers present. They would form their witch hunts but they would have to be run continuously.
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Simon Kestral says:
July 2, 2015 at 5:11 pm
That’s deep, like The Matrix. But I could never do it, no peace of mind. The simple truth works best for me. I’d rather be Tom Hanks stranded on that island alone, than living a lie among “friends.”
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anonymous says:
July 2, 2015 at 5:57 pm
Simon, that is how I feel also. I can’t live a lie to keep friends that aren’t even friends. They are only friends as long as you agree with the lie of the Watchtower religion.
I can’t go in service to promote a lie and I can’t go to meetings and give anybody the impression that I agree with lies. I’d rather be on that island alone with my volley ball than live like that. Tom got to love that Volley ball. That volley ball would be a better friend that any of the fake friends at the hall.
If anybody at the hall cares to know why you don’t go to meetings anymore and they ask you and they listen to you and understand what you are saying and won’t turn you in as an apostate, then you have a friend.
Who knows what they will do unless when somebody asks you why you left you try and tell them, if they turn out to be a real friend or not? You won’t know unless you talk to them. That will be the real test if they are a real friend or not.
I know one thing. When I was still “in” and one of my “friends” at the hall told me about the Society belonging to the United Nations like what I first found out about last year, I would have wanted to prove them wrong. I wouldn’t have closed my ears to it and told them that I didn’t want to hear it. That is the kind of person I am and who knows? A person might have some of those kinds of friends if they try and talk to them. As for me, if those people don’t care enough about why I am not going to the meetings to ask me directly why I am not going to the meetings anymore, then I know they don’t care about me and I won’t press the issue with them. It’s painful to find out that you don’t have any friends anymore in the “truth” but I’d rather know than not know.
There is a “sister” in my old congregation who gushes about all the “friends” in our Kingdom Hall but behind her back, they talk about her all the time because she’s got such a mean and arrogant mouth. What she doesn’t know is that when people are “forced” to be nice to you, that doesn’t make them your friend.
How many of the people at the Kingdom Hall are “forced” to be nice to us? We will never know unless we drop out and they miss us so much and ask us why we left and they listen to us and give us an ear and don’t turn us in as an apostate. That is when we find out if any of those people are really our friend. A real friend will try and free their friends from the prison of the Watchtower.
I know when I left, it was difficult realizing that I was going to die and probably not see my mother and father in the resurrection but it also freed me from the thought that I was serving an insatiable organization that only wanted more and more of my time and money and I didn’t have to force myself to sit though all those boring meetings and go in service and assemblies which I hated every minute of.
I am no longer feeling the depression of feeling like I was never good enough unless I was a regular pioneer, which I couldn’t afford to do and didn’t want to do.
In a way, I am glad to find out the Watchtower was all lies because now I am free of all the guilt and fear they put on me all those years.
I have no respect for the Governing Body but I have respect for myself, which I didn’t have all those years because of what that religion did to me.
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Brent says:
July 3, 2015 at 12:01 am
The truth about the Truth is that you never had real friends in the truth. A friend will stand with you through the tough times. For that matter as a witness you don’t truly have a belief system of your own because when ever the GB changes a doctrine you must go alone with it or lose your family and your so called friends. In the end it is better to know the truth about JW friends. It is helpful to go back to the people you rejected as a Witness and ask for forgiveness for being a real turd when they needed your help. It is a very positive thing to do for them and yourself.
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Finn Sawyer says:
July 2, 2015 at 6:24 pm
JJ,
I thought about faking it for a while too. But, ultimately, I couldn’t do it. I realized it just wasn’t about me, the clincher was my kids. I couldn’t do it to my kids. They were still young enough to save. I couldn’t indoctrinate them with something I hated. That being said, it’s all uncharted territory for me now. I have a huge void where once was a pre-determined path for child-rearing. Now I have to make it up as I go along. I feel like my kids are at a disadvantage, but no more so than had I made them drink the kool-aid. At least there’s hope.
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Mike Dennis says:
July 2, 2015 at 8:26 pm
The idea of faking it makes my stomach turn. Being true to yourself beats living a lie in any universe. To each his own. To support this destructive cult is unconscionable to me. Everyone is different. One life is what we get. Spend it on the WT…your call. I wish you well JJ. Aloha
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Meredith J says:
July 3, 2015 at 9:15 pm
I’m not you JJ. We all have different circumstances, but I am not sure I would have plucked up the courage to leave if my husband had not said he wasn’t going to the meetings anymore. You see I was one of those sisters who never missed a meeting, not a week in field service or getting my pre-study (brainwashing) done. I realised after awhile he was right and so I stopped going too and did some research on the internet myself and was convinced I did the right thing after a fortnight of battling a damaged conscience. Anyway, that was my experience. I know there would be no guarantee that this would be yours.
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tim3l0rd says:
July 8, 2015 at 2:18 pm
I’m dealing with some of this too. Thankfully there are plenty of websites like this one and groups like exjw over on reddit that helped me to realize that I need to slow down and take it slowly with my wife and family.
It pains me to think that I might not be able to wake them up and that I might have to walk away from all of them. I sometimes too have thought about what would have happened had I decided to not prove the truth to myself. I honestly doubted many things for a long time and kept taking the blue pill any time a doubt would surface. I finally took the red pill as I couldn’t help someone else come into this org if I myself had any doubts. The rest was history.
Now that I’m faced with the questions and uncertainty of the future, I sometimes long for the certainty I held before waking up. However, I’m also glad for the freedom of choice that I now have.
Know that you have a “great crowd of ex-witnesses” that have been through and are going through much the same as you. I hope that eventually your family, especially your children, come around.
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Vivian says:
July 2, 2015 at 9:26 pm
I think getting a jw to read literature on cults is one of the better ways in. Even if you have never been in one I think its interesting and useful to know how the human brain can be handled and manipulated. Even a strong good mind can be controlled and directed towards unhealthy illogical lines of reasoning IF its an unassuming one. And of course that’s all children!
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Cecil B. Demented says:
July 3, 2015 at 12:57 am
As always a great read. Have to point out that at the time of reading (0855 UK time) the AAWA link isn’t working.
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Cedars says:
July 3, 2015 at 1:08 am
Thanks, fixed! :)
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David says:
July 3, 2015 at 4:56 am
Leaving the jw.org corporation is a real trauma. I cannot understand how people that study the Bible and learn Jesus teachings can be so cruel and selfish.
But the important thing is that you cannot ruin your life and the relationship with your loved ones for this heartless cult.
Unfortunatelly lots of experiences show that the organization is like a giant machine that it is prepared to destroy family relations and innocent people lives for its expansion aims.
It practices a form of inquisition and loyalty to seven men is more important of loyalty to God, If you do not agree with them you must be avoided by family members. Crazy but true.
I suggest that if you start waking up do not tell anyone. It does not matter how logic or true your points are. They will never agree. They can’t agree. The group mentality wins.
Instead try buiding relationships with people outside or no jw people and clear your mind of the cult mentality. It takes years to erase the cult mentality where even the most innocent thing is seen as gross sin (birthdays, smurfs, etc).
You could also post to blogs or write to authorities to fight for your religious freedom.
We should not loose our vantage point for this stupid organisation but instead play smart.
Remember you can excuse your inactivity by saying that you cannot teach to other non sense teachings like the overlapping generation, child baptsim or that you do not agree with their real estate materialistic attitude.
Like this you can keep contact with your jw friends, make new “worldly” friends and fight from feedom from the inside. You’ll win, they’ll loose.
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JJ says:
July 3, 2015 at 8:03 am
Thank you for all the kind words of support! I can see that many of your experiences are similar to mine.
Yesterday was a particularly hard day as I have been reported on at work. Guess by who? Yes, a good Jehovah’s Witness! (He wants to have me moved so that he could take my spot). He’s been reporting secretly on me to our superiors that even innocent and friendly things are making him feel “uncomfortable”. JW’s just don’t seem to make good friends for oneself.
The JW’s do seem to be pre-programed to drop you and to ostricize you like in some Orwellian novel.
I’m lucky that my parents aren’t like that at all but I really need to pull my family back together. How is life worth living without the people you love? Like your wife and children?
I could never go like I used to but if I have to sit through an occasional boring meeting or spend a day at an assembly or memorial then I could do that. I could do a family study using the time to get closer to my children. (Maybe not using the literature as much as hearing about their experiences and letting them talk)
Interestingly enough, my best friends are still JW’s. They are good people, the religion aside. I don’t know what would happen to them if this cult came crashing down? I mean, they’d be ok but would they go and find something else???
Again, thank you for the kind words and I really enjoy everyone’s experiences and comments. I’m glad that you all can sympathize with my plight and understand my thoughts on how hard it will be to leave a controlling cult like the JW’s.
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David says:
July 3, 2015 at 8:45 am
The rank & file are good people but the GB builds a distorted mentality. At the same time I believe the normal JW should be able to understand when something does not make sense. But they are trained to swallow all. Ideally you wish to have honesty, integrity without loosing loved ones. But is not possible at the moment. If you start having doubts keep them for yourself. Loosing loved ones is devastating, also you have developed a cult mentality and you’ll find it difficult to get used to normal people.
So better to stay in but fight for changes within the organization.
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anonymous says:
July 3, 2015 at 9:09 am
JJ, it was the hardest decision I ever made but I couldn’t support lies once I knew about all the lies in the Watchtower organization. Those people aren’t real friends. They may seem like it but a real friend will listen to you and let you talk if you disagree with them or the teachings and they will give you a listening ear and not reprove you for it. If you try and talk to them and they turn a deaf ear to you, you will know who is your real friend. We don’t need “friends” like that.
If you need moral support, read some books like Gentile Times Reconsidered or Crisis of Conscience. Watch videos over and over again. Lloyd’s are wonderful. If you watch them over and over again, it gives you strength to stand up for the real truth but you need to keep watching them over and over again to keep you strong.
It takes a long time to get to the point that just stepping foot in the Kingdom Hall seems like stepping into cow sh**t and you have nothing but pity for all those still stuck in the tower.
Believe me, there are people at that Kingdom Hall that you go to, that go because their arms are being twisted. Just look at the faces of the people in the audience in the jwbroadcasting video about Mosambique. Does even one of those people look happy to be there???
Reply
David says:
July 3, 2015 at 9:19 am
The problem is brainwashing. The leaders use big words to convince the people. Everybody wants a better world, life after death. The outer appearance of the leaders is trustable and therefore ignorant and gullable people become victims. It is like the people who sell cancer cures. You want to live and may become victim of this charlatans. The rank & file have a some responsibility because you cannot be completely stupid. But I don’t think the normal JW are not friends, they think they doing God will, but in reality they are followers of men.
Reply
Wendy says:
July 5, 2015 at 8:09 pm
David, I never thought of it like that before but you are right, the way the JWs entice you to commit to them is by promising you a cure for death, just like a quack will offer magnetic bracelets or coffee enemas as a cure for cancer. It’s a pull on everyone’s desire to live forever and when people are desperate they will try anything. This is not to say that I don’t believe in anything else after our life on earth is through, only that I can see how manipulative the WT is by directing their initial conversations towards everyone’s basic fears. Snake Oil 101.
Ted says:
July 3, 2015 at 10:13 am
Facing up to oblivion, after becoming wise to the cult con
Just contemplating eternity makes my head spin.
Of course it would be difficult to choose a cut off point
for myself. But endless life on that scale, scares the hell
outta me! Oblivion’s not so bad anyway, we’ve all been
there before, and I don’t recall any anguish, or trauma, or
“Anything at all”.
The chances of anyone of us being here are truly astronomical.
All our ancestors had to stay alive till they were old enough to
procreate. Thousands of chance meetings had to happen.
Just one variation, and we wouldn’t be here. So I’m just
grateful for this shot. no one owes me anything else.
The “Lure” offered by our favourite cult. — Everlasting life on
Earth, is obliterated by scientific evidence. In the cosmos out
there, stars like our Sun are exploding every second. Anyone
who thinks we’re gonna get away with it, is living in the stone
age. It will be hell down here then, not paradise!
Before that though, Gravity is forcing our galaxy on a collision
course with the Andromeda Galaxy. eta, 2.6 bill, years.,
( there seems to be a flaw in the design somewhere! )
I’m sighing with relief, that I won’t be around to witness any of
those events.
Reply
Simon Kestral says:
July 3, 2015 at 10:32 am
Not all science is good science. They now say there may not be as many galaxies as once thought. An apparent “flaw in the design” may later be exposed as bad science.
Reply
tiger123 says:
July 3, 2015 at 12:36 pm
JJ
I, like so many sympathize with your loss of family and friends.
The fact that so many do not want to know that they are going to die only hastens death. Consider this, if you were on a train track and a train was coming would you want to know, or ignore that fact. Knowing certainly would be an advantage, because by knowing you would have a chance to get off of the tracks.
Consider the facts, at the turn of the 20th century the life expectancy around the world was less than 40 years. Jehovah’s Witnesses have contributed 0 years to anyones life expectancy. They have given nothing to cancer treatment, Sciences of the heart, lungs, kidneys, or the cure to any disease or illness. Look at those who openly acknowledge they are in the path of the train (atheist and agnostic) Collectively they have cured many cancers. My mother is living proof of this. She had a cancer that would have killed her decades ago and she is able to take a simple medication monthly and leads a normal life. Leukemia, once considered the most tragic diagnosis, today we have a cure for several types of the disease and are working hard to end aml. Look at Ebola, in the developed scientific world we do not even have to worry. In the superstitious underdeveloped world, death spreads unchecked. Today, smallpox (which took between 300million-500million lives in the 20th century) cured. Polio, tetanus, rabies, whooping cough, rinderpest, yellow fever, rabies are things we do not even think about, but only 100 years ago they plagued and killed 100s of millions.
By our facing our own mortality we have waged a war against death leading us to better health and a much longer life expectancy. Today modern technology moves forward with limitless possibilities. We change things at a molecular level. Computer chips, literally are altered at the smallest level. Stem cell research continues to provide solutions that were science fiction only a few decades ago. We grow fruits and plants in the desert using hydroponics, once considered impossible. Our opportunities are boundless.
Not only is life longer, today, we no longer demonize the mentally ill. Today we have so many ways to help those who struggle with mental illness and in more and more cases effective cures and aids enabling people to lead happier lives. Again JWs contributed nothing, they even demonized the mental health field for a long time.
Reply
tiger123 says:
July 3, 2015 at 12:40 pm
The real question is this, if you know the train is coming, do you focus on the train and impending death or a way to get off the tracks. JWs have trained you to focus on the train and feel sorry for yourself. By doing this you will ignore your own talents and ability to lead a full happy life.
You my friend have opportunities that are limitless, take your eyes off the train and don’t feel sorry for yourself. You have abilities that you are yet to discover, those abilities will outshine Watchtowers glib world. Take the time you would to go to a meeting and volunteer at a hospital, a park, or a fundraiser. Then and only then can you contribute to all of humanity including your family and lead a life of purpose. Nothing attracts people to you more than a life of purpose. Your case will be so much more valid when you decide to begin that journey. Don’t give in, you have so much more to offer them than giving in. Find your talent and help us all live longer and better lives.
Reply
anonymous says:
July 3, 2015 at 1:09 pm
JJ, I’d like to add to some of the comments to you too and I also feel for you. We were all at where you are at. If you listen to Lloyd’s videos, it took him about 10 years to break completely once he started doubting and I think for me it was probably 10 years too.
What the Watchtower does to us that learn what the real truth is, is devastating in so many ways. In a way, to live in the bubble works for a lot of people. They like being in the “truth” and it works for them. They will continue to think that they are saving the world through the Watchtower and it gives them real purpose in life and it will until they get old and die, still waiting for the “real” life and right up until they day they die, they have the hope that Armageddon is going to come in their lifetime and they won’t have to die.
The problem is that we do only get one life (if the Watchtower is wrong). If they are wrong, then we don’t get a second chance. I can’t tell you how many times I have heard comments like “I wished I could learn to play an instrument but there isn’t enough time but in the new world”…..It’s always in the new world is when they will do something that they really want to do but because of being a Witness, there isn’t enough time.
Before they know it, they are old and it’s too late to have accomplished something in their very brief life, waiting for the “real” world.
It takes about 10,000 hours to learn to be really good at something. If you took those 10,000 hours to be really accomplished at something, the people in the Watchtower would think you were a terrible person for not taking those 10,000 hours and spending it in the door to door work saving lives. You are not allowed to be good at anything or you will be viewed as “materialistic” or something bad. You have to give up your life, waiting for something that may never come. Millions of people have given up their one and only life and are now dead and went to the grave thinking that they will wake up in the “new world” perfect. That is when they think they will finally have a life but the precious life that they were blessed with right now is being pissed away on a fantasy.
It is the Watchtower Society that has put us in that terrible position of staying in to keep our friends and family or leave and be all alone in life. My hope is that soon the Society will be exposed for the dangerous cult that is really is and it will come crashing down and all of us and you will be set free from it’s prison.
A lot of people say that you should build up friends now and then fade slowly. My way of doing it may not have brought anybody out (except my youngest daughter) but I am not ashamed of telling them straight out that the Governing Body are a bunch of idiots who don’t deserve even one ounce of respect from me. I won’t even pretend to anybody that I don’t hate each and every one of them and consider them all to be blood guilty for thousands upon thousands of lives lost due to their man made policy about blood transfusions. I don’t even care whether or not my family and former friends think. I know that what I am saying is the 100% truth and that is good enough for me. I can’t pretend and I can’t cover up for those men. They are all scam artists and I am not afraid to tell anybody and everybody including the elders and have but it takes time to get to that point.
What I rely on when or if I get a chance to tell anybody is how the Society disfellowshipped Carl Olof Jonsson because he proved the Society wrong about 607 B.C.E. I can’t forgive them for doing that to him and I am not afraid to voice my thoughts about it and I will tell anybody that they should be ashamed to be supporting an organization that would do that to their brother.
It took me a long time for my hate to get to that point. At first I wanted to give the Governing Body the benefit of a doubt but no more. There is no way that they don’t know what they are doing. Nobody can be that stupid.
Reply
Simon Kestral says:
July 3, 2015 at 2:40 pm
Don’t underestimate the power of stupidity. Hitler thought he was an agent of God!
“Hence today I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator: by defending myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of the Lord” (Mein Kampf)
These people deceive themselves. Who knows why, but they do.
Reply
anonymous says:
July 3, 2015 at 5:27 pm
Simon, touche’. You are so right.
Reply
applause says:
July 3, 2015 at 2:46 pm
Anonymous, I just wanted to tell you that I was very touched by your very articulate comment explaining what a waste of a life it is to cling to this cult. Kudos to every single person out there who is working to expose this cult and stop people from wasting the one chance at life that we know we have on delusional hopes and fantasies.
Reply
anonymous says:
July 3, 2015 at 5:28 pm
applause, thank you for saying that.
Reply
Ted says:
July 3, 2015 at 4:11 pm
Hi Simon I can’t argue against your point that there is bad
science. But I don’t think there’s a lot of it about.
Scientists debating, disputing, testing out the various ideas
is the way that knowledge is refined. That surely cannot be
classed as bad.
My comment was not about the varying opinions of the number
of galaxies in the universe. But just the future of 2 galaxies
that are thought to be on a collision course. Thereby ruling out
eternal life. On Earth. As well as casting doubt on the efficacy
of a system that’s heading for destruction.
If you have any evidence, or even reasonable suggestions that
that the galaxies will win out against the force of gravity, or
that the earth will abide forever, I would welcome it , as I’m
sure the scientific community would also.
best wishes.
Reply
Simon Kestral says:
July 3, 2015 at 5:37 pm
“Thought to be” is not hard evidence, the essence of good science. Your assertion about eternal life is more about faith, or lack thereof, than science. And the article is about cults, not science vs. eternal life.
We could debate whether science worship is a virtual cult. But that may annoy the moderators.
Reply
Cedars says:
July 3, 2015 at 11:59 pm
“We could debate whether science worship is a virtual cult. But that may annoy the moderators.”
You could debate it by yourself if you like, but I doubt anyone but other religious fundamentalists would be interested in debating a motion based on a false premise, i.e. that accepting science is a form of “worship,” or that evidence-based theories about our universe are akin to religious dogma.
Reply
Simon Kestral says:
July 4, 2015 at 1:06 am
Science provable by experimentation is good science. I didn’t say that was worship.
A theory is just an idea until proven by experimentation. Unproven theories are sometimes exaggerated with speculation. Accepting unsupported speculation in the guise of science can amount to worship.
Why you class me with “religious fundamentalists” is puzzling. Is any praise of God or the Bible offensive to you?
Reply
Cedars says:
July 4, 2015 at 1:15 am
I didn’t call you a religious fundamentalist. I suggested your motion was one that only religious fundamentalists would be interested in “debating.”
“A theory is just an idea until proven by experimentation. Unproven theories are sometimes exaggerated with speculation. Accepting unsupported speculation in the guise of science can amount to worship.”
You don’t know what “theory” means in a scientific context. I suggest you look it up to avoid any further embarrassment.
Simon Kestral says:
July 4, 2015 at 1:31 am
In physics, theories are proven by experimentation. In mathematics, theories can be proven with formal logic. Are you familiar with Gödel’s ontological proof?
Not that I want to convince you of what Gödel proved. I can agree to disagree. No need to become enemies over this.
Reply
Cedars says:
July 4, 2015 at 1:41 am
I am familiar with the ontological argument, and I agree with Dawkins’ assessment that it is essentially a word salad and piece of trickery that doesn’t bear serious scrutiny.
But I strongly suggest you look closer at what a theory is in the context of science. Your comments suggest you aren’t fully versed on that score… https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_theory
Simon Kestral says:
July 4, 2015 at 2:03 am
It says “A scientific theory is a well-substantiated explanation of some aspect of the natural world that is acquired through the scientific method and repeatedly tested and confirmed through observation and experimentation”
I see no cause for embarrassment on my part.
Reply
Cedars says:
July 4, 2015 at 2:11 am
If you see no contradiction with your earlier assertion that “a theory is just an idea until proven by experimentation,” then no, there is no cause for embarrassment.
ScotWm says:
July 3, 2015 at 5:54 pm
I’m glad to see that author Steven Hassan has credited Randall Watters with helping him understand the Watchtower’s cult-like attributes. I have read some of the experiences of Randall Watters and I was particularly impressed with his conclusions as to the operation of Bethel leadership.
According to Watters, all of the constantly-changing Watchtower doctrinal inventions are done for one purpose; to control the masses. The actual doctrines are irrelevant. Convincing others, through the use of clever manipulation, is the key to allowing the Governing Body to maintain power. The literature, meetings, assemblies and field service are all used to control the minds of Watchtower followers. Any who openly doubt the teachings of the power-hungry Governing Body are thrown out of the organization. Not surprisingly, Watchtower leaders have a history of trying to control each other.
After the death of Watchtower founder Charles Russell, Joseph Rutherford engaged in a power grab and gained control of the Watchtower. This was done against the expressed wishes of Russell. More power struggles followed as Fred Franz rose to the top and became the Watchtower’s undisputed prophet. Recently, Pastor Russell was stripped of his faithful slave status. At the same time, all of the remaining 144,000, who claim to have the heavenly calling, were also striped of their faithful slave status. So now, only a handful of high-ranking Watchtower leaders, those who comprise the Governing Body, are left to fight among themselves for the top spot. If Watchtower history is any indication, the members of the Governing Body are already plotting against each other as each one tries to gain control over the others.
As Randall Watters said, it’s all about control. Will some of the faithful eventually see what is really going on at Watchtower headquarters? We can only hope.
Reply
Sheree says:
July 4, 2015 at 3:24 am
So proud to see your experience in the book Lloyd! I downloaded it as soon as I heard about it. Well done. Your story can help so many.
Reply
Ted says:
July 4, 2015 at 8:08 am
So many good points in your article Lloyd. The quote
from Steven’s book about, countries that grant tax exemption
to cults like JWs, should be held responsible for the harm
inflicted by them. Is very sound.
Also, information is the key to complete freedom. The Org,
wants to keep us in, pre- 1980s ignorance. Some totalitarian
regimes, have put people to death for owning a cell phone.
The WTS, can’t go to these extremes, or even ban us from
owning computers etc. So ludicrous statements like
“Sharing at the table demons” are used to frighten people off.
Only their own jw,org site is recommended as safe. The same
tactic is employed by the one family controlled regime of
N,Korea. They have just one, “State Controlled” TV station.
Life after JWdom. What do we replace it with?– “Freedom”!
Reply
Bret says:
July 4, 2015 at 2:01 pm
Cedar;
Since you are writing a book and it includes some history. Thought you might research and do a video of this:
1)There are accusations made that Rutherford was expelled from Bethell by Russell for conduct and drinking.
2) Rutherfords take over of the Watchtower and turning it into a “Organization” is not what it truly is or happened in the proclaimers book.
Rutherford began anslow process of takng control of every congregation except a few who would not submitt and introduced mind controlling doctrine through fear Phobias such as a new “Armegeddon” quite different from what Russell taugh. Along with many other control phobia doctrines..
A true look at his take over and perhaps his evolution of this group into an organization cult.
Reply
Finn Sawyer says:
July 5, 2015 at 11:40 am
I bought this book and have been flipping through it as I have time. The parallels Mr. Hassan highlights between JWs and other cults methodologies are striking.
Not to discredit the latest edition, but I think I will purchase the older edition as well. I want to have it on-hand in the event I can share it with my JW family and friends. As stated, since the older edition did not mention JWs I think it might still be in “safe” territory, whereas I believe currently indoctrinated JWs would reject the new book outright after seeing how it includes JWs in its cult descriptions. The October 2015 Watchtower (study edition) article entitled “The Naive Person Believes Every Word” instructs JWs to reject anything that isn’t positive about the org–an unbelievable request to ask of anyone with a brain IMO. Mr. Hassan, if you’re reading this: I am not a cult expert but the article I referenced above seems striking in its attempt at mind control–might make an excellent excerpt for your next edition!
Reply
Sardec says:
July 6, 2015 at 11:03 am
Just reading the BITE model online 2 years ago is what woke me up.
Reply
JWIntellect says:
July 7, 2015 at 3:55 pm
That’s apart of what woke me up as well!
Just got through purchasing the the 25th Anniversary edition of Combating Cult Mind control on Amazon. I’m so excited to start reading it.
Reply
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Tony Morris scapegoats gay people in bizarre child abuse denial rant
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Posted on July 6, 2015
Tony Morris has indulged in a bizarre rant in which he denies any organizational problems with child abuse
Tony Morris has indulged in a bizarre rant in which he denies any organizational problems with child abuse
Governing Body member Tony Morris has used the July 2015 episode of JW Broadcasting to indulge in an astonishing rant about child abuse, seemingly in response to the onslaught of negative publicity Watchtower has faced in recent years.
In his nine-minute statement on the matter, Morris shows two video presentations and reads from a 1982 Awake! magazine in attempting to make the case that Watchtower has always been “pro-active” in making the protection of children a “top priority.”
At one point, Morris unleashes an astonishing swipe at gay people in an apparent attempt to scapegoat homosexuals as being the main perpetrators of child abuse. “It [an Awake! article] warned about homosexual men who prey on and advocate the right to use boys for sex. Shame on them!” he says. (See time stamp 02:49 in the video below.)
The 1982 “‘Chickens’ and ‘Hawks'” article to which Morris alludes is a shameless piece of propaganda blaming homosexuals in general for child prostitution rings that flourished in the 80s and 90s, and which society itself has condemned (such as in the 1994 award-winning documentary “Chicken Hawk: Men Who Love Boys“). (See Wikipedia article)
Morris’ exploitation of this isolated controversy to make a sweeping generalization about gay people represents only the latest example of what appears to be a pattern of homophobic bigotry above and beyond even the scathing condemnation of gays and lesbians found in Watchtower publications.
Last year Morris was voted one of 2014’s craziest “right-wing nutjobs” by Advocate magazine for his baffling comments at last year’s United States Branch Visit, at which he warned of a conspiracy whereby homosexuals are designing tight clothing merely to lust after men’s bodies. (See time stamp 03:20 in the video below.)
And only recently, at the 2015 regional convention, Morris made a not-so-thinly-veiled declaration of his disapproval at Ireland’s recent referendum legalizing same-sex marriage.
Clearly Morris has an axe to grind against homosexuals for reasons best known to himself, but that he should mobilize his bigotry against gays in defense of the organization’s outrageous record on mishandling child abuse is bewildering to say the least.
Head in the sand
Homophobic scapegoating aside, Morris’ comments are a fascinating example of the organization’s “head in the sand” approach in the face of mounting media scrutiny of Watchtower’s child abuse track record.
This strategy was most recently deployed by Stephen Lett, who used a recorded “morning worship” speech to claim that media attention on the issue was nothing but “apostate-driven lies and dishonesties.”
As much as activists like myself desperately wish there to be no problem in this area, and as much as we yearn for JW children to be protected, various facts are well-documented and glaringly obvious, namely:
◾Watchtower has been found legally responsible for its mishandling of child abuse in courts of law on several occasions in two different countries (see articles on Candace Conti, Jose Lopez and the latest UK high court judgment), in some cases being ordered to pay multimillion dollar damages for their negligence
◾Watchtower gathers and holds information concerning an unknown number of pedophiles, thought to number into the thousands, on a database. Watchtower admitted the existence of the database in a 2002 fax to the BBC, and it lost the Jose Lopez case in part because it refused to divulge the contents of the database in that particular trial. (See this Huffington Post interview video.)
◾Watchtower publications do not urge parents to report allegations of child abuse to authorities in all instances
◾Watchtower elders have been criticized for covering up instances of child abuse from the authorities, as in the cases of Mark Sewell, Jonathan Rose and Gordon Leighton
◾Watchtower instructions to elders in the 2010 Shepherd the Flock of God book and subsequent instructional letters uphold the “two witness rule,” whereby if there is no witness to an allegation of child molestation (or no allegation from a second victim is forthcoming) elders are to “leave matters in Jehovah’s hands,” as the following scan clearly shows
◾Watchtower instructions to elders also maintain the position that the branch office, not the police, should be the first to hear of a report of abuse, and that past child molestation does not necessarily bar someone from serving as an elder in the congregation
child-sex-abuseNone of the above pressing issues are addressed or even alluded to in Morris’ nine-minute statement. Instead he heaps praise on the organization for taking “a decisive stand,” for being “pro-active,” and for making the safeguarding of children a “top priority.”
A reputation to be proud of?
Morris even summons the gall to claim: “We are proud of our reputation in this regard.” Irrespective of what Morris or other Governing Body members may think of their handling of child abuse, if there is one thing beyond dispute in this area, it is that Watchtower’s reputation is not one to be proud of.
One possible strategy Morris might have employed if he had an ounce of humility would be to throw his hands up and admit that, like other organizations, Watchtower was simply caught off guard at a time when the threat posed by child abuse wasn’t fully understood.
Instead, Morris adopts the reverse approach by suggesting the organization was always ahead of the game while secular authorities were floundering and “somewhat naive” as to the magnitude of the problem.
As an example of Watchtower’s foresight he parades the “landmark” 1982 Awake! magazine as highlighting the scourge of child abuse over thirty years ago. But it should go without saying that it is one thing to highlight child abuse as a problem, but another thing entirely to offer effective advice.
For example, the article in that magazine titled “To End Child Abuse” gives the following advice, few aspects of which can be considered especially relevant…
◾“[The bible] calls for close communication between parent and child”
◾“[Psychologists] say parents must be fair and set good examples, but children need regulations and discipline”
◾Sex education promotes masturbation and homosexuality. “Regardless of the pros and cons of sex education, the hard fact is the tremendous increase in child prostitution, sodomy, pornography and incest.”
◾“In God’s due time all who embrace his kingdom under Christ will become able to keep this law of love perfectly… This is the only way, the final way, to end child abuse.”
Watchtower’s 1982 guidance on protecting children from predators thus called for (1) better communication between parents and children, (2) strong parental discipline, (3) less sex education and (4) God’s kingdom. This advice, claims Morris, “straightforwardly addressed” the issue and, combined with subsequent magazine articles can be considered as exonerating Watchtower.
What Morris doesn’t mention is that not one of the magazine articles on child abuse published over the last few decades specifically tell Witness parents to go to the authorities with any and all allegations of abuse, which is surely the first priority in the wake of a crime of such magnitude being perpetrated. One 1993 Awake! article even goes so far as to suggest that, in certain cases, “the legal system may offer little hope of successful prosecution.” (Awake! 1993 10/8 page 9)
Morris attempts to throw up a smokescreen early in his presentation by asserting: “Our policy as an organization is that one professing to be a victim, or his parents, should never be discouraged from reporting the incident to the appropriate authorities.” But this is nothing more than a play on words, and a deliberate attempt to deceive.
It is one thing to tell children to resist predators, it is another thing entirely to deal properly with the aftermath
It is one thing to tell children to resist predators, it is another thing entirely to deal properly with the aftermath of an attack
True, Watchtower doesn’t expressly dissuade parents from going to the authorities, but it doesn’t persuade them either. Morris thus overtly relies on the ignorance of his audience regarding the nuances of Watchtower’s policies in an attempt to dupe them into thinking reporting is encouraged, even though the organization has yet to issue such instructions to elders despite repeated courtroom defeats.
At best, Watchtower literature over the decades has taught children to be able to identify predators and report such ones to their parents – the most recent example of which is the Caleb and Sophia cartoon presented by Morris in this video.
But teaching children to resist predators is only a fraction of any meaningful, effective child-safeguarding policy. The whole reason why child abuse is so evil is precisely because, for obvious reasons, children will always be vulnerable in the face of any sufficiently determined and opportunistic predatory pedophile, irrespective of how much resistance they put up.
Any child safeguarding policy worth its salt must thus adequately address what to do in the aftermath of an attack so that pedophiles are swiftly apprehended, and this is precisely where Watchtower falls woefully short. Parents are not told to go straight to the authorities by elders in every instance, they are merely informed that this is their “responsibility.”
Throw into the mix the perception that child abuse is a sin that the elders have a remit to investigate, the importance of “waiting on Jehovah,” the stigmatization of taking your “brother” to court, and fears surrounding slander and false accusations, and the likelihood of the police being left out of the loop entirely becomes all too apparent.
Worse than you think
I recently found myself in a phone conversation with a BBC journalist regarding Watchtower’s mishandling of child abuse. I expressed to her my frustration at the perception among Witnesses and Watchtower apologists that so-called “apostates” like myself are exaggerating the problem of child abuse.
I told her that, if anything my colleagues and I are understating the magnitude of the problem, because some of the horrendous stories we hear about privately simply cannot be publicized for various reasons.
She replied: “Welcome to the world of journalism.” This, apparently, is the challenge all journalists face in covering important stories where the full grisly horror of what is happening simply cannot be revealed for a myriad of issues including privacy, court orders and so on.
Tony Morris and the Governing Body may desperately want there to be no problem regarding child abuse, but as the saying goes, there is no smoke without fire. When you add up the relentless stream of child abuse reports in the press, including several clear instances where Watchtower has been found guilty and ordered to pay eye-watering sums in compensation, it is clear that, far from being ahead of the game, the organization is ablaze with this problem.
And documented evidence in the organization’s own instructions to elders leaves the Governing Body red-handed in not taking child abuse seriously enough by considering it a sin first, and a crime second.
For all his bluster, boasting and outrageous gay-bashing, the frustration and desperation of Tony Morris and his fellow Governing Body members is becoming painfully obvious.
Putting their hands over their ears and saying “la, la, la” in the face of serious accusations of child safeguarding negligence may work for them personally, but this juvenile charade only adds to their culpability as court after court finds Watchtower negligent. And growing numbers of Jehovah’s Witnesses are seeing straight through it.
new-cedars-signature3
Further reading…
◾Rawstory: Jehovah’s Witness leader promotes child safety cartoon with homophobic rant
◾Freethinker: JW chief targets gays in child abuse video
◾Pink News: Jehovah’s Witness Leader, “homosexuals” are child abusers
◾Taze.co: Jehovah’s Witnesses link Homosexuality to Child Abuse in official Broadcast, like it’s 1979
◾JWvictims: The Governing Body of Jehovah’s Witnesses Blame Homosexuals for the Pedophilia in Their Religion
◾Stephen Lett slams “apostate-driven lies and dishonesties” concerning child abuse record
◾After his branch visit performance, is “Tight Pants Tony” now a liability for the Governing Body?
◾“We will decide who is a predator!” – New Watchtower Instructions to Elders on Child Abuse
◾JWsurvey articles on child abuse
A full video rebuttal of the JW Broadcasting episode in question is forthcoming, and will be embedded at the foot of this article when complete.
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63 Responses to Tony Morris scapegoats gay people in bizarre child abuse denial rant
Newer Comments →
dontknowwheretogo says:
July 6, 2015 at 7:15 am
It is not so much WHAT iTony is ranting about that I enjoy but the fact that he IS ranting, and ranting way more than the other GB members.
He reveals his true colors, what is in his heart (a scripture came to mind but I forget) and it is becoming clearer and clearer this man is not “right” and has “issues”.
He will become a valuable tool in waking up others, ironic isn’t?
Lloyd, perhaps you should call him to tell him he is deluded and helping others wake up to TTATT…oh wait…
Any more details on your chat with the BBC? It is annoying there is not more coverage…Conti case gets settled and there is hardly a peep from any mediastreams…
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StrongHaiku says:
July 6, 2015 at 7:43 am
I have a hypothesis, that others may feel free to shoot down, but seeing these types of incendiary statements from the GB makes me think that this may be a reaction to their own irrelevance.
I was indoctrinated with the idea that JWs were so special and important that Armageddon would come when they would draw the anger of the nations, etc. and be persecuted. That has not happened.
I often think this is some type of strategy (whether conscious or not) by the GB to get the world to notice them. I can imagine being in the 21st century as a JW beginning to realize that most people don’t really care what JWs think, stand for, etc.
What do you do when you seem irrelevant? What do you do when the promised persecution/Great Tribulation has not come? Well, maybe you get in people’s faces and say controversial things and try to create the situation. Maybe they are trying to draw the ire of the world and spin that as persecution. If this is their strategy we should expect more and more controversial public statements and doubling down on controversial doctrines (e.g. blood, shunning, etc.).
Of course I could be wrong…
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Badshah says:
July 6, 2015 at 8:38 am
I don’t have a credible source for this, but I read ‘somewhere’ that your explanation was exactly why Rutherford came up with the no blood policy, to draw the ire of the world and spark persecution. I wish I could find where I read that.
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JWIntellect says:
July 7, 2015 at 3:12 pm
When I was in the religion I really thought, as did many other former Jehovah’s Witnesses, that we were truly a “theatrical spectacle to the world,” but I’ve since come to the immediate realization since abandoning the organization that, quite frankly, no one gives a damn about Jehovah’s Witnesses. They are an irrelevant, insignificant bunch to the world that no one even thinks about. The idea of being the center of attention was merely an illusion.
Your hypothesis isn’t too far fetched. It sounds credible to me. The nations are not paying any attention to Jehovah’s Witnesses and so their leaders are attempting to garner this attention by making provocative and incendiary comments about extremely sensitive issues.
I think one of the reasons Jehovah’s Witnesses were so intensely anti-Catholic in its early days was because of its own less than prominent status in comparison to the Catholic Church. The Governing Body and the Watchtower in no way, shape, or form have the kind of influence and power that the Pope and the Catholic Church have in the world, and so it would only seem right in their eyes to attack the big man on campus in order to gain some clout themselves.
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holy Connoli says:
July 8, 2015 at 6:02 am
@JWintellect. I thought about it the same as you regarding the Catholic Church and the WT viscous attacks on Catholicism. They attacked the Catholics the Most bc they were the Biggest! The when the Catholics attacked back or defended themselves it somehow gave “credibility” to the WT! They could claim and argue see, we are being persecuted..we are somebody! See! They hate us for preaching the Word of God and we are the ONLY ONES doing it! SEE! We are significant! IN Reality when you leave the WT you realize nobody really cares or gives a Rat’s Arse about the JW’s or what they teach or say especially since 100% of their prophecies or predictions have NEVER come true! Not 1 thing they ever uttered in prophecy has proven true.
SOmetimes when I am with people or business friends we may see somew Jw’s wandering on the streets and I say look! ARe those JW’s? WHat are they doing? They look lost out here, what do they believe? Hardly a reaction from y associates or friends. A few may say, Oh I have a cousin or a work mate who is a JW. Or, Oh yea they thin the end of the World is coming soon, Or..are they the ones who don’t salute the flag or don’t take blood transfusions? Nobody takes them serious or that they have this great ALL IMPORTANT message? Tp the majority of humanity they are insignificant despite what they thin about themselves.
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Criticus says:
July 16, 2015 at 6:06 am
(2nd attempt to get this posted – am I blacklisted? If yes, please let me know why. Thanks.)
Remember the “arrow in the running priests’s butt”-pic? Or the WTS’s insolent “God will destroy you and your Nazi party”-letter to Hitler? That’s what u r talking about. Now, THAT drew some irate clergymen’s or politicians’ attention, and triggered the wave of persecutions that dropped on the JWs during the beginning of the previous century. It was all self-inflicted, like a self-fulfilling prophecy. And then, they cheered: “Hoorai! WE are the real deal, we are the ‘true Christians’, bec. Jesus said ‘ You will be persecuted’ ” – but stop: Jesus also said (and the JW ignore this): “You will be persecuted BECAUSE OF MY NAME!” That’s the difference. JW did not get persecuted bec. they were Christians, but bec. they blindly followed the manmade rules of erroneous little men who deluded themselves into believing they have godlike authority. That’s why in Germany for example, the JW (formerly called “Earnest Bible Students”) are NOT considered as “exemplary” when it comes to resistance to the Nazis, not like Bonhöffer, Niemöller, the “Red Chapel” or the “Solf-Circle” for example, who suffered bec. of adherence to their Christian principles, not to manmade org-rules. Well, lets’ see when their “in your face”-tactics will bear some fruits – some real bitter ones.
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Faithful Witness says:
July 6, 2015 at 7:55 am
As a non-JW victim of child sexual abuse myself, I know how hard it is to report abuse to your own parents. I was not subjected to the intimidation faced by JW kids, and it still took me 4 years to say anything to my mom. When I brought this topic up with my (now) JW mother after the Candace Conti verdict, she replied with accusations of greed on the part of alleged victims.
Blame the victim? These ARE Witnesses of Jehovah… (or WERE, until they started making up stories about those who are supposed to be protecting them…??)
How can you be proud to represent an organization that refuses to protect the most innocent and helpless among them?
I continue to watch my family get more divided, as my parents & sister surrender their minds & lives to this high-control religious organization. If an adult wants to give up their worldly ways and join a rule and work-based religion, that is one thing. Children of JW’s have no say in the matter.
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Cognitive Loop says:
July 6, 2015 at 9:17 am
Good to see you again, FW. Hope things get better for you and yours. Plus I am very glad to see that you stood up well against the “elderettes” and their continued attempts to get you to come back to the indoctrination-fest, aka meetings.
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Mama Joy says:
July 6, 2015 at 8:05 am
Um….When was pedophillia the “new morality”?
Also, saying you protect kids doesn’t make it so.
I was told to not tell on my Dad to child services because then he would be taken to jail and it would be my fault.
Then the scripture about not taking a brother to court was used and I was told I would go live with worldly people and if anything happened to my Dad in prison it would be all my fault and I would be blood guilty in Jehovah’s eyes.
The elders knew and said I needed to be more obedient. I had to secretly video record him before they would do anything…., then they made it their mission to punish me for getting my Dad disfellowshipped. They sent spies (concerned sisters) to grill me for anything they could pin on me.
This video sounds good, like they actually help children, but the reality is way different.
If you try to go to “proper authorities” (law enforcement or them only???) they will insist they handle the issue. And believe me they will talk to the person and that’s it. Your child will have to go to the meetings with their abuser and then as a parent if you tell the police, they will disfellowship you (for imprisoning a brother and not going through Gods proper channels).
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tosch says:
July 6, 2015 at 8:12 am
I can’t help thinking that, when Toni Morris stresses the ‘appropriate authorities’, he might have a different definition in mind than we do. By adding ‘appropriate’, he seems to somehow include the elders… or am I wrong here?
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K. W. Burggraf says:
July 11, 2015 at 7:29 pm
No, You’re absolutely right. I picked up on that immediately. I’m sure he means not only “including” the elders but “excluding” the police. Isn’t this stressed in the elders’ handbook for dealing with such situations?
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Cognitive Loop says:
July 6, 2015 at 8:30 am
He states, “However, to take advantage of innocent young ones is absolutely despicable. As a religious organization, we have taken a decisive stand against such behavior” (approx 40 second mark).
Couple of things:
Firstly, they made make taking advantage of young ones into an art form. Someone quoted a gov body member that some child of 5yo had been ‘pioneering since 4yo and was now still pioneering at age 10′. Also, teenagers should have their drivers licenses used as leverage, in order to get dunked into a lifetime of servitude to this real estate corporation.
Secondly, the legal weasel-language is strong in that second quoted sentence. “As a religious organization, we cherry pick which scriptures back up our stance” would be much more accurate. They use Deuteronomy 19:15 to hold up as original two witness “law”, which had everything to do with REAL ESTATE, not rape. Yet if you page over to Deuteronomy 22:25, it actually discusses rape and that the woman needs no other witness if she was somewhere where no one would hear her screams. “[…] only the man who has done this shall die.”
But the real good news is this: they are feeling it, as far as the blowback of their misuse of the scriptures and horrible treatment of victims goes. The internet is shining a light on these virtual cockroaches (the gov body being the topmost ones) and their heinous behavior towards victims, including courtroom behavior, such as Gordon Leighton case, where elders refused to state the man confessed to molesting the child! And whole congregations standing behind the guilty elder, only on his side of the courtroom, leaving the victim and family to stand alone.
– – –
“Courtroom shenanigans
Rose arrived for his trial at Manchester Crown Court with an entourage of Witness supporters, including several elders. But this inundation of fans did not impress the judge.
With the trial threatening to descend into a circus on only the first day, the judge ordered that the court’s public gallery and even the waiting area should be off-limits to all but family and those involved in the proceedings.
Despite this ruling, certain elders are said to have ignored orders by trying to sit beside Rose in a public show of support – even though this was to lead to their ejection from the courtroom. The pleas of one elder to present evidence in support of Rose were similarly denied after complaints from the victims’ side.
Watchtower representatives emerge
A surprising feature of the trial was the arrival of two Watchtower representatives from bethel towards the end of the first week. Both were relatively young, perhaps in their thirties. Their identities are as yet unknown.
The victims’ side looked on in disgust as, for the remaining days of the trial, these representatives sat firmly on the defendant’s side of the courtroom, consulting with Rose and making it clear as to on whose side their allegiance fell.
Only when confronted emotionally by one of the victims’ family members on the final day of the trial did they accept that their behavior in supporting Rose so openly was inappropriate. After this exchange, they elected to sit in a more neutral position from that point onwards.”
– – –
^ That ain’t even the half of it, as they say.
Yup, the Watchtower sure hates deplorable behavior and stands firmly against child abuse/molesters.
edit – Not sure why my replies are not coming through. Hoping this one will.
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Simon Kestral says:
July 6, 2015 at 11:11 am
Good point about Deuteronomy 22:25. A two witness requirement does not apply to sexual crimes. The same chapter says rape is like murder, where there may be no witnesses at all. Nevertheless, the one found guilty is put to death.
Common sense says a two witness requirement cannot apply to sexual crimes. I don’t expect much common sense from the GB though. They claim to be the “faithful and discreet slave” without consulting the master.
Not much common sense in that.
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Cognitive Loop says:
July 7, 2015 at 1:12 pm
They have zero proof that they are indeed chosen by god. Funny how a child who is raped must produce two witnesses against his/her attacker, and yet the Gov Bod need no proof that they are who they claim to be.
Terry over at JWN pointed out that “Annointed” is an interesting title for these Brooklyn-based false prophet clowns to lay claim to: Hebrew translates the word to “Messiah”, and in Greek it translates as “Christós” or Christ.
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Queen Elsa says:
July 8, 2015 at 1:18 am
That behavior makes me sick… I’m at a loss as to what to do for my two young children being raised in my once loved beliefs… :(
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Brad says:
July 6, 2015 at 8:32 am
This is becoming more laughable from the perspective of those of us who have left and have lifted the veil.
Sadly, it becomes sadder and sadder these attempts by the GB in their literature, broadcasts, morning worships, cartoons, and letters to elders have little to no effect on the masses because of their minds.
Unless something changes in the court systems the WT will continue to shell out payments that will hurt it but not cripple it, and they will continue to grow and deceive more people.
I want to post links to all of these articles on my public social media pages since I know all of my former friends check my page from time to time but this will drive them right away since they will see it as Satan’s deceptive propaganda. He is the ruler of this world and controls the media after all with his master puppeteer skills..
The WT is doing the only thing they know how: portray an image of what they want to be believe and instill fear if you believe anything else.
Hope change is coming some time soon. As the org grows, so will the amount of children being taken advantage of.
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Jerry O Connor says:
July 6, 2015 at 9:30 am
Hello to all.
Morris is a homophobic gob shite! Cracks are most definitely appearing in watchtower. Trying to justify a non cooperation with the police. “He doth protest too much” would seem to apply to tight pants. Could Morris be the weakest link in the weakest chain? The more the public here what vitriol he spouts, the better. Still watchtower hides child rapists and its hands are covered in the blood of those murdered with the heinous blood issue. They make me mad
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Kat says:
July 6, 2015 at 11:10 am
Once again they use a foolish picture of a small girl, dolly in hand telling her “father” or some man a firm NO! As if that would work, in your own bedroom, with you fully dressed and I could go on. That is not an accurate portrayal of the problem, and as usual it will put the blame for sexual assault on the victim. Katie darling, did you tell Elder Jackson a firm NO! when he asked to see under your dress? Yes, brothers I did, I told him NO! and said Jehovah doesn’t like this! Good girl, your free to go and Elder Jackson you too may go and geez Willie, next time hit up a worldly girl!!!! You guys are making our job tougher than it needs be…makes me sick but that is the way my case went.
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Daniel O'Brien says:
July 6, 2015 at 12:25 pm
Cedars, that was one of the most balanced and clear articles that you have ever written on this subject.
A very bright light needs to be continuously shone on this problem if it is ever to be eradicated.
Well done!
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Jill Hileman says:
July 6, 2015 at 12:32 pm
Hi Lloyd,
Would you consider taking the above child abuse handling bullet points along with the literature references only and creating a document or article specifically for use in forwarding to Witnesses who are fence-sitting?
If I sent this article as is, it would be immediately ignored, labeled propaganda. But mothers of young children deserve to know these facts, being obscured by the GB.
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Cedars says:
July 7, 2015 at 12:32 am
That’s a good suggestion Jill, thank you. I am considering making a YouTube video of JUST those points with the aim of putting Witnesses in the picture in the face of an apparent determined effort on the part of the Governing Body to misinform on this issue.
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Ted says:
July 6, 2015 at 1:21 pm
Morris’s feigned concern for children is sickening.
Sure they’re worried about Paedophillia in their org.
But mainly because of the bad publicity, and the effect
it will have on recruitment, and possible defection.
Plus the cost of expensive litigation and the threat to
their tax exempt status.
If they were “Genuinely” concerned. They would drop
the two witness rule. It’s entirely inapplicable to a crime
where the perp, goes to great lengths, to make sure
there’ll be no observers. And how cruel to demand from
a distressed child, that they produce such witnesses.
otherwise it’s only their word against another’s .
They have no right nor the appropriate training to subject
children to such a harrowing inquisition. I repeat. If they
we’re genuinely concerned. They would, without further
delay, issue instructions to elders. To immediately hand
over any complaints. To the Police.
Morris’s statement that they are concerned, that even no
“Emotional Harm” should come to a child. Are just empty
words, propaganda. They will fool many. But not those
who are aware, of the methods and motives of this corrupt,
Godless and materialistic org.
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Richard E. Kelly says:
July 6, 2015 at 3:51 pm
Kudos to you, Lloyd. You were definitely in good-fighting form on this post, well armed with the facts on your side. Too bad that cognitive dissonance is alive and well in Watchtower Land, because an article like this should have spawned a mass exodus.
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Grace says:
July 6, 2015 at 4:39 pm
Another great article but god it makes my blood boil.
“We are proud of our reputation in this regard.”
Proud of their reputation!! Incase they hadn’t noticed, their reputation is that they hide child molesters & throw victims under the bus to save their deluded reputation.
Also, when a dirty old man rapes a little girl. It just has to be the gays fault. (sarcasm).
These royal hyenas are just clutching at anything. I wouldn’t be surprised if this is an attempt to get their propaganda in before the Australian Royal Commission comes out & airs the dirty laundry that has been soaking in the mire for so long. On the 27th of July, the hearing will be aired to the public. I hope that those that have secretly suffered will come out & speak. My feelings are that they wouldn’t be pursuing it if there wasn’t enough evidence to see a problem that needs addressing.
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David says:
July 6, 2015 at 4:56 pm
Tony just follow the usual cult protocol. They can condemn no JWs to death if they do not acknowledge
the GB as the only channel between God and Mankind (role according to the Bible belonging only to Christ) but feel persecuted to the slightest criticism. But I think this is a win for the “apostate” community. The GB will be forced to change their policies and report pedophiles to authorities. At least we should be happy that children will be more protected. I guess next we have to teach the GB and make people more aware that people should not be ostracised if the choose to leave their denominations just like they want to be free to preach their half truths.
It is also strange that Tony feel persecuted when JW.org shows clear signs of wealth. It displays a new suit on every appearance and the usual “godfather” style pinky ring.
An appearance radically different then Jesus Christ’s.
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Eric says:
July 6, 2015 at 5:40 pm
Thank you so much Cedars for your articles. Having just woken up from JW mind control in October, I still suffer from ptsd and attacks from my cult personality. I find great comfort and encouragement in your articles and videos. The time and well thought out preparation cannot be undersold. What you are doing is a true service and I thank you for it.
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JWIntellect says:
July 7, 2015 at 3:20 pm
Happy to hear you’ve exited!
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Barb Moor says:
July 6, 2015 at 6:07 pm
Caleb, Sophia! It’s YOUR fault for getting abused; your conscience was too weak! Bad boy! Bad girl!
The new video featuring the animated pair is really sneaky. Yes, kids should run away from predators. BUT, no focus is given on the predators themselves (such as known abusers within the organization). The way it is portrayed on the video, the burden is put on children to prevent abuse, according to their “trained” conscience. It doesn’t illustrate the reality that the parents could be the abusers themselves. It doesn’t show that there are times when it is physically impossible to get away from a predator (Elder Handy in the car group).
And what if the abuser threatens to kill beloved Mommy or Daddy (or baby brother) if Sophia does tell on them? Well, Sophia then has to decide: save them or myself? Sophia loves them so she’ll likely keep quiet, because predators are PROS at manipulation and deceit. This will go on and Sophia will comply with the predator thinking she’s protecting her family. You can picture Sophia in group therapy 15 years later with an addiction to meth to cope with the years of abuse, made worse by listening to talks that will make her think she is guilty for the abuse. All those talks on fornication will make her wonder, was I committing fornication? Why DIDN’T Mommy protect me? Why did Brother Creep give a talk on telling the truth at all times then tell me to lie to my parents?
She will have seen him at assemblies or meetings: maybe even giving a talk about porneia? Poor Sophia: her conscience wasn’t strong enough. She didn’t outwit a cunning adult with years of manipulative skills! And then, why didn’t Jehovah protect her? Was she not worthy of protection, given all the theocratic examples of children who were spared suffering ‘because they listened’? Apparently not, because it happened to her. Sophia will end up depressed, lonely, fearful, and likely lacking in any sort of faith. If she even remains in the organization (she’ll have so little self-worth she may stay in it out of fear), she’ll become one of the “weak” ones looked down upon by the strong because she’s not perky and happy and glowing with the good news. She’ll go downhill, while the way this organization works, the abuser will be promoted.
Ironically, the watchers of this stupid video will likely be praising the organization for its helpfulness and loving concern, ignoring that Elder Handy and Brother Creep are right there in their hall, maybe sitting next to them at meeting. Other elders in the hall may know, but they won’t warn parents. Because the loving organization that has cared SO much for SO long has said not to divulge those little details. You’re on your own, Sophia and Caleb! Good luck with that!
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John says:
July 8, 2015 at 12:49 am
Barb, that’s a fantastic comment.x
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Jean says:
July 11, 2015 at 9:26 am
Well said, Barb. The hideous monster in the video is sofar from what actually happens, it makes me wonder why the GB actually believes this is “the truth”. The onus of responsibility is always put fairly and squarely on the shoulders of Joe Publisher, not on those making the policies. Will they ever wake up?
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Barb Moor says:
July 6, 2015 at 6:28 pm
Boy, does Tony get heated up about homosexuals, doesn’t he? Latent much?
Seriously, he deliberately misleads the definition of a homosexual by implying that a homosexual is a pedophile. Big difference: the homosexuals I know have no interest in little boys or little girls.
It’s a cheap shot on Tony’s part (I feel I can be informal now that we are on a chatty basis via his constant tv appearances). His self-righteousness is disgusting. And really, his lies reinforce the same abusive tactic that predators use: listen to ME and no one else.
These people have no morals. Shame on the lying org, the congregations who hide sexual abusers, the elders who know what abuse has happened and have the benefit of protecting THEIR kids but not everyone else’s. Shame on the parents for trusting this org and letting some out-of-touch corporate shill tell them how to parent and tell them their kids are safe. And shame on Tony Morris for lying to children by acting like he cares.
Reply
Thinking of leaving says:
July 6, 2015 at 10:43 pm
Interestingly when I was awakening from my indoctrination and also becoming increasingly aware of the sex abuse problem, I was still an active publisher at the time. I thought that I would put it out there and gauge the reaction I would get from the R&F. Out of the dozen people I tried I couldn’t find one who said “I feel sorry for those victims and I hope they get the help and support they need.” The replies I got were mainly media hype and one even refused to admit the news report was real. The reply that really stands out in my mind is “don’t read overseas news papers because this is going to confuse me”. Yup child abuse can be put down to overseas news papers confusing me. About sums it all up really.
Reply
bobow says:
July 7, 2015 at 2:26 am
I have the same observation. every bro just denied the story, without even reading about it.
Reply
holy Connoli says:
July 8, 2015 at 6:18 am
@bobow: I still have a few JW friends I talk with sometimes or do some business with. When I bring up the Child Abuse issue to them and how rampant it is and the BAD 2 witness rule they seem unaware of how bad it is or they say something like Oh yes, I am gald those guys get DF’d! We have ZERO tolerance for anyone doing that! I point out the WT seems to protect them bc the 2 witness rule is impossible to enforce and they say well the bible does say that! I don’t think the R&F have any Idea how bad it really is.
Reply
Meredith J says:
July 10, 2015 at 4:26 am
Yes, I left for exactly the same reasons as you. No one cared. I did and so did my husband but all the Witnesses could think of was that we shouldn’t talk to others about such things because it looks bad for Jehovah and it must be from apostates. They could not have cared less about the innocent young lives that had been ruined and that the Society had caused all that misery and cruelty themselves to the victims. You see to the Watchtower Society there are no victims. Unforgivable.
Reply
Syl says:
July 7, 2015 at 3:11 am
Great analysis and rebuttal Lloyd. What you do is useful. Thanks for the time and effort you invest in this.
Reply
chatpal says:
July 7, 2015 at 4:25 am
the thing about the JW’s I know family included, in the U.S, is that they are not aware of any child abuse nor other sorts of crimes as this, they never hear any media coverage on any of these abuse cases. these people work, sleep shop, go to meetings and service and watch kids shows or home improvement shows or netflix or very little tv at all. They would have no idea why he was bringing up that article, orthe subject.I can hear my own mother , if hearing his comments, say” well the society must be preparing for a rise in child abuse issues, they are always ahead of the game” as if there is none and there might be in the near future. she literally thinks they are able to see future trends. its sickening, she finds no fault with these men, yet says that they do not claim to be perfect and ‘we do not worship them’ such mental hypocrisy she displays against herself, for Id be willing to bet my right arm she knows deep down in her heart, something isnt right , after all she often says things that are her own opinion, and does things contrary to what the jw suggestions are, and even gets told about it, [like going up to a door when there is a sign that says beware of dog, and then giving ‘jehovah’ the credit for her not getting bit,lol] but she being 73 has been in this so long it would make not a bit of difference to change now.
Reply
Barb Moor says:
July 8, 2015 at 7:47 pm
Respectfully I disagree. JW’s secretly watch ALL the televisions shows that are “inappropriate” most of the time: they just don’t tell. They aren’t sitting home watching JW.ORG except to be able to SAY that they watch it (likely on fast forward). Most are just as fake as the GB.
And child abuse stories are everywhere, even a commercial for Law and Order SVU makes it pretty clear. They can’t say they didn’t know when every storyline in just about every show or book has child abuse in it.
But I totally get what you are saying: most people know deep down things aren’t adding up, but they are afraid to admit it out loud for the backlash it’d cause.
Reply
Bart says:
July 7, 2015 at 9:12 am
I will never forget this guy. He’s the one that really changed my perception (lost respect) of the governing body a last year at the annual meeting and his infamous tight pants and spanks talk. But it wasn’t those things in particular that turned me off as much as his overall demeanor and his smug approach to those who aren’t worshiping the way he thinks they should, or who’s parenting efforts were not good enough to keep their children in the truth, etc. I was disgusted by it all, and continue to be. That day, when I saw him speak for the very first time, I thought, ‘How can this possibly be God’s chosen group of men to lead us all?’. I lost a lot of faith in the “faithful and discreet slave” that day, despite the other governing body members’ loving and warm demeanor. The fact that this loony is in the group speaks volumes, and while some JW’s laugh it off or downplay his antics by means of memes on Instagram or what have you, most people are so blind that they think he’s brave for calling things like they are, just like Peter was constantly an outspoken member of Jesus disciples. Since that time, I’ve read Crisis of Conscience and honestly it sent me into a bit of depression, learning things that would shake any Witness’s faith to the core. I literally cried for that man when I realized he died several years ago, and all that he had gone through. It left me feeling alone too, and I still feel like there is no easy way out or in.
Reply
Paul says:
July 8, 2015 at 2:14 am
Bart,
I felt the same way after reading Crisis of Conscience, but that quickly lead me to reading his second book and that explained a future course that made sense to me. I have not been to a meeting since, and I am determined to forge a new life free from the hypocrisy and falsity of the GB. If you think Morris is weird what the heck is Lett about?
If Jehovah is choosing these guys the the world is in deep doo doo. My guess is that they are actually the man of lawlessness, the evil slave.
Reply
Excelsior! says:
July 7, 2015 at 10:48 am
Bart,
Welcome to your freedom, sir! If you are still a person of faith, then take comfort in the teaching that Jesus is always with you.
If you are like me, an atheist, then it’s time to find your own path.
Either way, you are well rid of any association with an organisation with such an appalling record.
I wish you the best of luck, Bart.
Folks, Anthony has given us such an excellent response to the child abuse scandal in the WTBTS! He is proud of their record, and of his involvement and support of it. The latest Caleb and Sophia video is disgraceful. Telling a manipulative sociopathic paedophile to stop will work out fine!!!!!
This second attempt to deflect proper scrutiny of the WTBTS’ child abuse policies and cover ups will be a powerful recruitment sergeant for our cause.
Peace be with you, Excelsior!
I hope that this idiot is called to defend his policies in court some time soon.
Reply
Freedom says:
July 7, 2015 at 7:27 pm
Dear Anthony Morris: Homosexuals do not sexually abuse children. Pedophiles sexually abuse children. There is a difference. Perhaps your research department should educate itself. Numerous organizations state the following: 1 out of 5 girls will be sexually abused as a child while 1 out of 20 boys will be sexually abused as a child. It would appear that a girl is at a higher risk – so who is abusing the girls? If we follow your logic that homosexuals abuse little boys, then heterosexuals abuse little girls. Therefore, shame on all heterosexual men. I look forward to your next Awake article condemning “the heterosexuals” for their deviant, disgusting behavior. I also look forward to another one of your broadcasts where you assure all JWs that the organization does everything it can to protect the congregation from “the heterosexuals”.
Reply
ES says:
July 7, 2015 at 8:23 pm
Very well written and accurate; thank you Cedars. You’re correct in that Tony is way off on describing WT position in the topic of child abuse. A close family member to me is currently fighting a legal battle over the issue of child sex abuse within the JW org, and my devout parents have acknowledged that the society has handled these child cases quite poorly. I’m curious to know what the thought while watching this episode of JWB.
Reply
ruthlee says:
July 8, 2015 at 1:32 am
this mans demeanor disturbs me i try to be objective and hope he has our best interests at heart but ive come to realise all this talk and exposure is just that before there is genuine decisive action these dishonourable men will shoot themselves in the foot meanwhile we look on pained and insulted i hope one day that i can roar with laughter at such feeble nonsense but at the moment things are a little too painful i do beleive GOD will have the final say and it will be heard by everyone there will be no excuses ha ha bring it on
Reply
Paul says:
July 8, 2015 at 2:06 am
It is just another example of avoiding the real issues and putting up straw men and knocking them down with old magazines that do not address the issues either. Here are old men who are totally out of touch with reality because they believe their own imaginary world.
Unfortunately virtually zero active JWs will pay any attention to facts from outside sources, so he can spout rubbish and avoid reality and all the sheep will bleat in total (ignorant) approval. Till an avalanche of bad press engulfs them they will refuse to admit the mountain of evidence.
Reply
David says:
July 8, 2015 at 3:20 am
He gives a distorted impression of the matter. The broadcast starts with persecution to prepare the minds of the listeners. Then it just gives a one sided account of the issue. They criticise other religions but for what I can see they have no decency. When something happen to others they are quick to share articles. When jw.org is criticised then the media are of the devil.
Reply
anonymous says:
July 8, 2015 at 5:00 am
Tony Morris skipped over the article in the June 22,1982 titled “Rape at Home” which was about incest. This is what one of the paragraphs said, quoting from an outside source and even giving us the page of that outside source:
“On page 129 of the book “The Death of Innocence”, we read: “Among prostitutes, the frequency of sexual molestation in childhood is 92 percent; 67 percent of them experience some form of incestuous assault…At least 75 percent of he runaways, on the national average, are escaping incestuous abuse. The same figures apply to cases of adolescent drug addiction: About 70 percent are victims of incest.””
What is so ironic is that the June 22, 1982 Awake has in the very next article about child abuse an article “To End Child Abuse” and this is what it had to say was the remedy for this abuse:
“They know that bad family conditions cause children to run away from home, and that a high percentage of runaways end up on the streets and in prostitution and pornography and suffer appalling abuse. Some are escaping incest at home, homes broken by divorce, chronic conflicts with parents, lack of loving attention, and some are swayed by their peers. Whatever specific causes, the remedy is the healing of family breakdown. So say the experts. So does the Bible. It calls for close communication between parent and child.”
So, the Society has the first article about incest being the cause of most runaways who turn to prostitution and drugs and are abused by child pornography and the very next article saying that the remedy is better family communication between child and parent and they ignore the fact that the preceding article said that most children are abused by incest first before running away and getting abused. Do these people even read what they write?????
Also, I think the reason Tony Morris skipped the incest article is because he was hoping that most people would not have that old Awake magazine where they could double check what he was saying in that video about the incest article in that June Awake. There is absolutely no advice to help parents or young ones to be protected by pedophiles in those article and there is no advice to report abusers or rapists to the police. It is a useless rag that belongs in the garbage can and not “groundbreaking”.
Another reason Morris skipped the incest article is because what if Sophia’s father was her abuser???? According to the incest article, most children run away from incest and get abused because of incest!!!
Reply
Meredith J says:
July 8, 2015 at 5:23 am
This Governing Body member has obviously been informed about the upcoming Royal Commission Into Child Abuse in Australia. The Catholic Church has already been through the ringer for the past year about it as all their dirty washing has been hanging on the line for all to see and now the Witnesses have formally been told that they are next on the chopping block as from July 27th, 2015. I’ll bet he is worried that it will look like they are not trying enough to counteract the problem. It will be so interesting to see the outcome of the commission. They will probably expect to look exonerated but I think they will be shocked at the level of scrutiny.
Reply
Brad says:
July 8, 2015 at 9:06 am
I think we are all forgetting something. Think back for a moment to the days when you were a faithful witness who fully backed the organization and believed in these key points (I know, this is difficult to do):
1. Jehovah is the universal sovereign
2. Jehovah has allowed suffering to continue to prove that he is a loving god and his way is the best way.
3. There have always been some of Satan’s seed trying to incorporate themselves into Jehovah’s earthly organization and even if they last for a little while, eventually they will be found out and Jehovah will be the judge of them in the end.
4. The Governing Body cannot ignore bible principles, such as the 2 witness rule.
If you were on the other side of this argument, still a faithful witness, and you presented these 4 points and someone still argued with you, you just throw up your hands and that’s it, there is nothing more you can say or do but leave it in Jehovah’s hands and say how sad it is that some people like touching children.
This information continues to reinforce in us that we made the right decision and we are happy to be no part of this organization, but time and time again, when we have them absolutely dead to rights with a straight flush nuts hand in a game of hold ’em, a witness will still have that cognitive dissonance rear it’s ugly head and make them believe this is an attack by Satan and his minions.
Reply
Excelsior! says:
July 8, 2015 at 10:03 am
Lloyd,
Can we find a way to ask Morris just who the “appropriate authorities” are? I believe he is deliberately trying to infer that these “appropriate authorities” are the police, or perhaps child protection services. However, he believes that the “appropriate authorities” are the local body of elders and the Bethel Branch overseeing that country.
Am I wrong in this interpretation? What do you think?
Thank you for an excellent article. Your long term support of victims and precise articles on this dreadful problem are a testament to your good character.
Peace be with you, Excelsior!
Reply
M. says:
July 8, 2015 at 10:03 am
10 Anti-Gay Myths Debunkedhttp://www.splcenter.org/get-informed/intelligence-report/browse-all-issues/2010/winter/10-myths
Facts About Homosexuality
and Child Molestationhttp://psychology.ucdavis.edu/faculty_sites/rainbow/html/facts_molestation.html
Reply
sirius says:
July 8, 2015 at 1:45 pm
Just a thought, perhaps starting a thread on the subject of Common Jehovah’s Witnesses Excuses and Habits.Here’s a few to get started…
1.Read the NWT with an open mind
2.You took the verse out of context
3.Read the following verse
4.Read the verse before that one
5.That KJV is suspicious
6.You must be progressive to understand the NWT
7.Must be an error in the translation
8.What’s your religion?
9.Jehovah knows your actions before you are born but you have free will
IMHO
dogstar
Reply
Finn Sawyer says:
July 8, 2015 at 9:35 pm
Why isn’t the FBI breaking down the door at Bethel? How can Watchtower be allowed a secret database of know pedophiles?
I don’t know why but I expected more damage control. I was hoping to hear they changed their policy about the 2 witness rule for that crime. More than irrelevant references to a 30 year old magazine, lies about an “isolated incident” and a cartoon.
I don’t understand why the secular authorities don’t require the clergy to report child abuse in their congregations. Sure, JWs are shielding pedophiles, but the government allows it and it is the more important problem to attack, IMO.
Very disappointing overall.
Reply
Rosie says:
July 9, 2015 at 4:17 am
Lately a politician “sparked controversy when he appeared to link child abuse with homosexual relationships.” Sound familiar?
There was quite an uproar from the public and local media about this.
As a result the politician is currently being questioned by the police and had to step down from his position.
Reply
Brent says:
July 9, 2015 at 1:59 pm
Its to bad that all the magazines such as the one that Tony shows are not available. They only go back online too 2000. My folks got rid of there old brown volumes 10 years ago as the GB told them to do. Mostly so that there would be no record of there false prophecies and UN NGO status. Its up to the Governing Body to pick which old light they would want you to know about. As long as the GB can go back and pull old literature out why won’t a member under judicial review do the same?
Tony states that he will not go into the legal back and forth which was and will be the reasons for the lawsuit losses in these child abuse case. The real reason is that they by their system in effect and in truth protected child abusers. They are so misleading, yet the rank and file will agree and look no further into the subject being that to do so would be seen as reading apostate literature.
Reply
Hazel says:
July 14, 2015 at 3:12 pm
Information is provided in the CD disk=W.T. Library2012 English edition. Copies of magazines back to the 1970’s.
Reply
anonymousish1987 says:
July 13, 2015 at 8:46 pm
The irony of him focusing on homosexuality when from all I’ve read most of the abuse in the Watchtower is heterosexual. Candace Conti was abused by a MAN. So…he can have several seats. This is so disheartening and angers me so much.
Reply
MrFair says:
July 14, 2015 at 3:29 am
It seems to me that the Caleb and Sophia video shows a lack of understanding of child sex abuse. Note: I myself am not a professional on the subject but simply would like to make some observations.
It would be helpful if child molesters all looked and sounded like the creepy monsters in the video but the reality is that it could be a grandfather, an elder in the congregation or another trusted friend that isn’t overtly creepy. They are monsters but they usually don’t appear that way, which is how they get close to the children in the first place. I wonder why they didn’t put a nice looking man in a tie, a grandfatherly figure, an aunt, etc. in the cartoon? Maybe too incriminating? Not that children should be made to feel paranoid around everyone but it just seems to me that Watchtower thinks that all molesters are unkempt guys in tank tops, drinking beer and acting creepy in public (like the guy in the public service announcement video). Also, it seems that a child saying “stop! Don’t do that!” will not always chase away a molester. In other instances a child may not even understood what has happened until later in life. Could the video create guilt in victims who didn’t take the prescribed steps? Or who did but were molested despite it? That’s what Watchtower used to do to rape victims who didn’t scream. We all agree it’s very important to protect children but we should look to professionals who have a deeper understanding of how to do it. Sad situation… Just a few thoughts…
Reply
anonymous says:
July 14, 2015 at 4:55 pm
@Mr.Fair, the Watchtower still creates guilt in rape and victims of molestations and they still have to appear before a committee for the committee to determine if the victim actually committed fornication or adultery. That isn’t a thing of the past at all.
Reply
MrFair says:
July 15, 2015 at 6:22 am
Good point. The guilt is still there… It seems that they don’t disfellowship based on the screaming or crying out rule anymore? That’s what I was referring to… I’m always open to correction. As a former elder I can say sincerely that judicial committees regarding anything sexual are very damaging no matter how “loving” the brothers might be.
Reply
anonymous says:
July 15, 2015 at 7:20 am
The way I understand it is that the Society allows for a female being so traumatized by it that they can’t fight back or scream but they have to convince the committee of that.
If a person was molested or raped, they still have to appear before a committee to explain what happened but of course it’s their word against the accused and have to convince the committee that it wasn’t consensual and if not, they face disfellowshipment for fornication.
If the accused was a man in the organization, they get to appear without the female accuser so they can go on and on about how the accuser “led them on” or whatever else they might say and the female has no idea what is being said about her behind her back. I know this is the way it is if it is the husband or father of the female but I don’t know if this holds true if the accused man isn’t the husband or father of the accused.
I personally know of a “sister” whose husband raped her and her husband was only publicly reproved for it. Who knows what he said about her behind her back.
When it comes to the female and she is married or it’s her father that is accused of abusing her, she doesn’t get to defend herself when the elders talk to the man. That is in the Shepard the Flock book.
If the husband beats on his wife or cheats on his wife, he gets to appear before the committee and go on and on about how “terrible” the marriage is etc. and how terrible and neglectful the wife was and how she egged him on (if he beat her) and wouldn’t give him his “due” and who knows what else he gets to say about her to get the sympathy of the elders but if the woman is the accuser and she wants to tell the committee about her abuse, he gets to be there to defend himself and again go on and on about how she “egged” him on or she wasn’t submissive or God knows what else he can say and it’s her word against his.The whole thing is rigged against the female in favor of the male.
It’s ironic that the Bible doesn’t say at Revelation about the 144,000 that tomen didn’t “defile” themselves with men. After all, aren’t some of these 144,000 supposed to be women?
No, the Bible comes right out and says about women that for men to have relations with women, it is “defiling” to them as if to say that women are “unclean”. This is the definition of “defile” in Websters:
“to make unclean or impure: Befoul, Besmirch as a: to corrupt the purity or perfection of: debase >the countryside defiled by billboards> b: to denude of chastity: deflower c: to make physically unclean esp. with something unpleasant or contaminating d: to make ceremonially unclean e: sully, dishonor syn see contaminate”
Just that one scripture alone in Revelation is enough to tell me that in the Bible, women are not respected, no matter how the Watchtower likes to “spin” it and that doesn’t even scratch the surface of how women are treated in the Hebrew Scriptures.
Reply
Everyday Explorer says:
July 14, 2015 at 6:36 am
I say to us all, and myself included, to keep heart and keep activist in your own way. The level of exposure re the heinous ‘safeguarding’ policies of the Watchtower is now higher than ever before, gaining more momentum and certainly isn’t going to be stilled. It will become increasingly difficult for good-hearted still-JWs to deny the factual evidence of endemic corruption as the spotlights continue.
I look forward to the Royal Commission Into Child Abuse in Australia beginning on 27 July this year. I look forward to the results of the UK’s Charity Commission investigations into the safeguarding procedures of the Watchtower, which should be relatively soon. I look forward to the Independent Inquiry Into Child Sex Abuse, also UK-based, which has now begun and will last four years.
But I also know how heart-breaking and discouraging it can be when we are faced with family members who we know are good-hearted but who still find themselves defending the Watchtower’s system. But then I remind myself that I can do my activism here (as well as with them, when possible) and that helps so much, even when I don’t post. Thank you again, Lloyd, for creating jwsurvey and thank you to all who post, whether regularly or not, and with such compassion.
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Tony Morris scapegoats gay people in bizarre child abuse denial rant
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Posted on July 6, 2015
Tony Morris has indulged in a bizarre rant in which he denies any organizational problems with child abuse
Tony Morris has indulged in a bizarre rant in which he denies any organizational problems with child abuse
Governing Body member Tony Morris has used the July 2015 episode of JW Broadcasting to indulge in an astonishing rant about child abuse, seemingly in response to the onslaught of negative publicity Watchtower has faced in recent years.
In his nine-minute statement on the matter, Morris shows two video presentations and reads from a 1982 Awake! magazine in attempting to make the case that Watchtower has always been “pro-active” in making the protection of children a “top priority.”
At one point, Morris unleashes an astonishing swipe at gay people in an apparent attempt to scapegoat homosexuals as being the main perpetrators of child abuse. “It [an Awake! article] warned about homosexual men who prey on and advocate the right to use boys for sex. Shame on them!” he says. (See time stamp 02:49 in the video below.)
The 1982 “‘Chickens’ and ‘Hawks'” article to which Morris alludes is a shameless piece of propaganda blaming homosexuals in general for child prostitution rings that flourished in the 80s and 90s, and which society itself has condemned (such as in the 1994 award-winning documentary “Chicken Hawk: Men Who Love Boys“). (See Wikipedia article)
Morris’ exploitation of this isolated controversy to make a sweeping generalization about gay people represents only the latest example of what appears to be a pattern of homophobic bigotry above and beyond even the scathing condemnation of gays and lesbians found in Watchtower publications.
Last year Morris was voted one of 2014’s craziest “right-wing nutjobs” by Advocate magazine for his baffling comments at last year’s United States Branch Visit, at which he warned of a conspiracy whereby homosexuals are designing tight clothing merely to lust after men’s bodies. (See time stamp 03:20 in the video below.)
And only recently, at the 2015 regional convention, Morris made a not-so-thinly-veiled declaration of his disapproval at Ireland’s recent referendum legalizing same-sex marriage.
Clearly Morris has an axe to grind against homosexuals for reasons best known to himself, but that he should mobilize his bigotry against gays in defense of the organization’s outrageous record on mishandling child abuse is bewildering to say the least.
Head in the sand
Homophobic scapegoating aside, Morris’ comments are a fascinating example of the organization’s “head in the sand” approach in the face of mounting media scrutiny of Watchtower’s child abuse track record.
This strategy was most recently deployed by Stephen Lett, who used a recorded “morning worship” speech to claim that media attention on the issue was nothing but “apostate-driven lies and dishonesties.”
As much as activists like myself desperately wish there to be no problem in this area, and as much as we yearn for JW children to be protected, various facts are well-documented and glaringly obvious, namely:
◾Watchtower has been found legally responsible for its mishandling of child abuse in courts of law on several occasions in two different countries (see articles on Candace Conti, Jose Lopez and the latest UK high court judgment), in some cases being ordered to pay multimillion dollar damages for their negligence
◾Watchtower gathers and holds information concerning an unknown number of pedophiles, thought to number into the thousands, on a database. Watchtower admitted the existence of the database in a 2002 fax to the BBC, and it lost the Jose Lopez case in part because it refused to divulge the contents of the database in that particular trial. (See this Huffington Post interview video.)
◾Watchtower publications do not urge parents to report allegations of child abuse to authorities in all instances
◾Watchtower elders have been criticized for covering up instances of child abuse from the authorities, as in the cases of Mark Sewell, Jonathan Rose and Gordon Leighton
◾Watchtower instructions to elders in the 2010 Shepherd the Flock of God book and subsequent instructional letters uphold the “two witness rule,” whereby if there is no witness to an allegation of child molestation (or no allegation from a second victim is forthcoming) elders are to “leave matters in Jehovah’s hands,” as the following scan clearly shows
◾Watchtower instructions to elders also maintain the position that the branch office, not the police, should be the first to hear of a report of abuse, and that past child molestation does not necessarily bar someone from serving as an elder in the congregation
child-sex-abuseNone of the above pressing issues are addressed or even alluded to in Morris’ nine-minute statement. Instead he heaps praise on the organization for taking “a decisive stand,” for being “pro-active,” and for making the safeguarding of children a “top priority.”
A reputation to be proud of?
Morris even summons the gall to claim: “We are proud of our reputation in this regard.” Irrespective of what Morris or other Governing Body members may think of their handling of child abuse, if there is one thing beyond dispute in this area, it is that Watchtower’s reputation is not one to be proud of.
One possible strategy Morris might have employed if he had an ounce of humility would be to throw his hands up and admit that, like other organizations, Watchtower was simply caught off guard at a time when the threat posed by child abuse wasn’t fully understood.
Instead, Morris adopts the reverse approach by suggesting the organization was always ahead of the game while secular authorities were floundering and “somewhat naive” as to the magnitude of the problem.
As an example of Watchtower’s foresight he parades the “landmark” 1982 Awake! magazine as highlighting the scourge of child abuse over thirty years ago. But it should go without saying that it is one thing to highlight child abuse as a problem, but another thing entirely to offer effective advice.
For example, the article in that magazine titled “To End Child Abuse” gives the following advice, few aspects of which can be considered especially relevant…
◾“[The bible] calls for close communication between parent and child”
◾“[Psychologists] say parents must be fair and set good examples, but children need regulations and discipline”
◾Sex education promotes masturbation and homosexuality. “Regardless of the pros and cons of sex education, the hard fact is the tremendous increase in child prostitution, sodomy, pornography and incest.”
◾“In God’s due time all who embrace his kingdom under Christ will become able to keep this law of love perfectly… This is the only way, the final way, to end child abuse.”
Watchtower’s 1982 guidance on protecting children from predators thus called for (1) better communication between parents and children, (2) strong parental discipline, (3) less sex education and (4) God’s kingdom. This advice, claims Morris, “straightforwardly addressed” the issue and, combined with subsequent magazine articles can be considered as exonerating Watchtower.
What Morris doesn’t mention is that not one of the magazine articles on child abuse published over the last few decades specifically tell Witness parents to go to the authorities with any and all allegations of abuse, which is surely the first priority in the wake of a crime of such magnitude being perpetrated. One 1993 Awake! article even goes so far as to suggest that, in certain cases, “the legal system may offer little hope of successful prosecution.” (Awake! 1993 10/8 page 9)
Morris attempts to throw up a smokescreen early in his presentation by asserting: “Our policy as an organization is that one professing to be a victim, or his parents, should never be discouraged from reporting the incident to the appropriate authorities.” But this is nothing more than a play on words, and a deliberate attempt to deceive.
It is one thing to tell children to resist predators, it is another thing entirely to deal properly with the aftermath
It is one thing to tell children to resist predators, it is another thing entirely to deal properly with the aftermath of an attack
True, Watchtower doesn’t expressly dissuade parents from going to the authorities, but it doesn’t persuade them either. Morris thus overtly relies on the ignorance of his audience regarding the nuances of Watchtower’s policies in an attempt to dupe them into thinking reporting is encouraged, even though the organization has yet to issue such instructions to elders despite repeated courtroom defeats.
At best, Watchtower literature over the decades has taught children to be able to identify predators and report such ones to their parents – the most recent example of which is the Caleb and Sophia cartoon presented by Morris in this video.
But teaching children to resist predators is only a fraction of any meaningful, effective child-safeguarding policy. The whole reason why child abuse is so evil is precisely because, for obvious reasons, children will always be vulnerable in the face of any sufficiently determined and opportunistic predatory pedophile, irrespective of how much resistance they put up.
Any child safeguarding policy worth its salt must thus adequately address what to do in the aftermath of an attack so that pedophiles are swiftly apprehended, and this is precisely where Watchtower falls woefully short. Parents are not told to go straight to the authorities by elders in every instance, they are merely informed that this is their “responsibility.”
Throw into the mix the perception that child abuse is a sin that the elders have a remit to investigate, the importance of “waiting on Jehovah,” the stigmatization of taking your “brother” to court, and fears surrounding slander and false accusations, and the likelihood of the police being left out of the loop entirely becomes all too apparent.
Worse than you think
I recently found myself in a phone conversation with a BBC journalist regarding Watchtower’s mishandling of child abuse. I expressed to her my frustration at the perception among Witnesses and Watchtower apologists that so-called “apostates” like myself are exaggerating the problem of child abuse.
I told her that, if anything my colleagues and I are understating the magnitude of the problem, because some of the horrendous stories we hear about privately simply cannot be publicized for various reasons.
She replied: “Welcome to the world of journalism.” This, apparently, is the challenge all journalists face in covering important stories where the full grisly horror of what is happening simply cannot be revealed for a myriad of issues including privacy, court orders and so on.
Tony Morris and the Governing Body may desperately want there to be no problem regarding child abuse, but as the saying goes, there is no smoke without fire. When you add up the relentless stream of child abuse reports in the press, including several clear instances where Watchtower has been found guilty and ordered to pay eye-watering sums in compensation, it is clear that, far from being ahead of the game, the organization is ablaze with this problem.
And documented evidence in the organization’s own instructions to elders leaves the Governing Body red-handed in not taking child abuse seriously enough by considering it a sin first, and a crime second.
For all his bluster, boasting and outrageous gay-bashing, the frustration and desperation of Tony Morris and his fellow Governing Body members is becoming painfully obvious.
Putting their hands over their ears and saying “la, la, la” in the face of serious accusations of child safeguarding negligence may work for them personally, but this juvenile charade only adds to their culpability as court after court finds Watchtower negligent. And growing numbers of Jehovah’s Witnesses are seeing straight through it.
new-cedars-signature3
Further reading…
◾Rawstory: Jehovah’s Witness leader promotes child safety cartoon with homophobic rant
◾Freethinker: JW chief targets gays in child abuse video
◾Pink News: Jehovah’s Witness Leader, “homosexuals” are child abusers
◾Taze.co: Jehovah’s Witnesses link Homosexuality to Child Abuse in official Broadcast, like it’s 1979
◾JWvictims: The Governing Body of Jehovah’s Witnesses Blame Homosexuals for the Pedophilia in Their Religion
◾Stephen Lett slams “apostate-driven lies and dishonesties” concerning child abuse record
◾After his branch visit performance, is “Tight Pants Tony” now a liability for the Governing Body?
◾“We will decide who is a predator!” – New Watchtower Instructions to Elders on Child Abuse
◾JWsurvey articles on child abuse
A full video rebuttal of the JW Broadcasting episode in question is forthcoming, and will be embedded at the foot of this article when complete.
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63 Responses to Tony Morris scapegoats gay people in bizarre child abuse denial rant
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jon says:
July 14, 2015 at 8:36 am
Hi Lloyd,
Another well written piece. I would like to know what you, or others on this commenting board, think of the potential impact of the media coverage of the child abuse scandal on the rank and file. Do you think that the ongoing uncovering of child abuse scandals that are gaining momentum right now (e.g. BBC and Savile, Rotherham/Oxford grooming gangs, historical MP abuse network) will dilute the coverage of the JW child abuse scandal? Or do you think this will amplify the awareness of the general public and the rank and file?
All the best,
Jon
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The must-read story of a ministerial servant and his wife who woke up in the last few months
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Posted on July 9, 2015
daniel-genser
Daniel and Devon Genser are now enjoying their freedom after facing some huge dilemmas over the past few months
I will never forget the feeling of liberation I felt in November 2013 when I published the story of my awakening on JWsurvey, thus revealing my identity for anyone who knew me.
I knew the article would eventuate in my disassociation from the organization. In fact it took only two months for the inevitable phonecall from my congregation coordinator. But regardless of the ramifications, being open and honest about my authentic identity was absolutely the right decision – a decision I would make again and again if necessary.
It was with feelings of nostalgia for my own “outing” that I devoured the article published a few hours ago by Daniel Genser, only recently a ministerial servant in the North-Western corner of America. The article is titled “What I Believe to Be True – and How I Have Come to Believe It,” and I would urge all JWsurvey subscribers to read a superb treatise that brims with love, empathy, humanity, and above all, intellectual honesty.
What I Believe to Be True – and How I Have Come to Believe It
By Daniel Genser
I don’t want to rehash Daniel’s story because I want you to read it yourself, and I don’t think I could possibly do it justice. But it’s worth acknowledging how incredibly recently the events described in the above article transpired.
Daniel writes of still struggling to reconcile doubts over his faith as recently as the 2014 Annual Meeting at which JW Broadcasting was announced, and the now-notorious 2014 United States branch visit at which Tony Morris unleashed his ‘wisdom’ about certain types of clothing to 1 million bewildered American Witnesses.
Fast forward only a few months, and Daniel and his wife Devon find themselves in a remote part of Italy, completely free from their Witness indoctrination and, amazingly, with their relationship in tact having awoken simultaneously.
The journey of how they reached this realization, the insurmountable problems with Watchtower dogma they wrestled with, and the dilemmas they faced are all superbly and eloquently documented in Daniel’s article, which is why I feel it is so deserving of everyone’s attention.
Daniel’s thoughts on shunning are insightful and thought-provoking, and his writing on the 607 BCE controversy is one of the best concise treatments on this complicated subject I have ever read.
Apart from anything else, it is extremely heartening to see how quickly Jehovah’s Witnesses can shed their mindless loyalty to the Governing Body when they are intellectually honest and conscientious enough. And if that isn’t a happy-ever-after in itself, you have the fact that a husband and wife have pulled off this challenging feat side-by-side.
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Kat says:
July 9, 2015 at 5:13 am
Very well told and some great points, 607. but also this was well put, and I would hope that many JW that viewed this JWTV with Tony Morris would come away with the same impression.
“The next event was a special meeting for JW’s in the United States in early November. It was a live stream from world headquarters broadcasted to all congregations in the United States branch territory.
Anthony Morris III, one of the seven members of the Governing Body gave this talk to about 1,000,000 JWs across the USA.
This man, supposedly one of a select few chosen by Jesus Christ, chose on a historic occasion to talk all about the many spiritual dangers of tight pants. To guilt sisters who wear exercise pants — while jogging. To guilt trip brothers who wear close fitting suit pants. To call into question the reasonableness of fancy socks. To denigrate brothers over 23 years of age who are not in an appointed position. To assert that “tight pants” are an elaborate conspiracy by “homosexual fashion designers” because they want to see young JW men in them. It was embarrassing to listen to.
The way the the talk was delivered was embarrassing, too. It sounded as if he wasn’t even prepared. It sounded like he just rolled out of bed, got in front of the camera, and just started spouting off on his pet peeves. I left that meeting feeling very small. The religion I was in was not expansive, not life-affirming. It was small. It was petty. And it was utterly controlling.
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anonymous says:
July 9, 2015 at 11:12 am
@Kat, I enjoyed that comment from his article the most too and nobody could have been said it better!
This was an amazing article that he wrote and I am so glad that Lloyd posted it here for all of us to see.
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Melka says:
July 9, 2015 at 4:35 pm
That’s one of my favorite topics of the article too. I think the research that Daniel did regarding his questions and concerns about the organization and the doctrines are all along the same lines of research we’ve all done to be where we are at today, on this website. But the fact that he meticulously documented his research and facts, it’s absolutely priceless for someone questioning the organization. When I first came out, I didn’t actually know where to start, I would have loved to read this article.
But aside from that, I was thinking about how he felt when he saw Anthony Morris III give that talk. I came out before JW broadcasting, but up until then, I thought all the talks by the CO’s and DO’s were always so inspiring and affirming, and surely the GB would even be more so… but… they are clowns. I’m so glad Daniel and his wife could see that. I wonder if he would have delayed his decision to leave, or if his wife would have been as open to the discussion if it wasn’t for the “tight pants” talk.
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dontknowwheretogo says:
July 9, 2015 at 5:16 am
Just read it….utterly fantastic blog post. Concise and to the point…
I’ll be showing it to my still-in wife.
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Kat says:
July 9, 2015 at 5:21 am
And I would like to thank you for your bravery in coming out and publishing this very must read article, I am sure you will help many.
All the best to you and your lovely wife, and pleased you found a good home for your sweet cat!!
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bobow says:
July 9, 2015 at 5:45 am
I can identify myself with his opinion almost on 100%.
Anyway, after reading Franz’s books and checking some factographic sites like jwfacts, or explanatory sites like jwsurvey or meletivilon.com, I have an enormous bunch of arguments, why to leave.
Happy to read about him. This story might help me to get out my wife, what is the only reason, why I’m also still in.
But happy to tell, I finished to be an Elder, so now I’m in such a neutral state, 2-3 hours in the ministry a month, not inactive, not good enough to get any of the stupid privileges :)
Actually beside the obligation to visit meetings from time to time, it’s not a burden to be still in. Just what happens me often, that I start to laugh on meetings. Now is th assembly in front of us, so let’s see, how I can survive that
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Amber says:
July 9, 2015 at 10:33 am
Bobow, Lol about your comment about how you start to laugh in meetings now. I had exactly the same problem when I tried going back to appease my family. Once you are truly awakened you realize how silly it all sounds. I would also inadvertently click my tongue too, not realizing how loud it came out until I got the evil side eye from my sister. I knew then, it was no use trying to fake it. It was too hard!
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Bart says:
July 9, 2015 at 5:48 am
This guy sounds like me and my recent experience, doubts, beliefs, etc., with a couple differences…
1) He’s done a lot more research than I have. Just as I’ve never been good at memorizing Bible scriptures by number, I have a hard time breaking things down to specific details but go more by the big picture ideas.
2) My wife and I haven’t left, but are inactive. We recently moved to a new state, which has given us a brief respite, but ultimately still have the burden of accounting to our friends and family who expect us to fall right in with a new congregation out here.
I really appreciate this article, lots of food for thought.
Reply
Rowland Nelken says:
July 9, 2015 at 6:02 am
Great piece of writing. It seems that the JW outfit becomes ever more dependent on cruel coercion in order to hold together. Perhaps this is in proportion to the bad publicity and its increasing availability.
He mentioned that shunning was really beefed up from the 1980s, the years after the 1975 nonense sent several JWs to the Kingdom Hall exit.
Having failed to steer its flock away from the internet, the Org is now having to compete with the oceans of ex and anti JW websites and vids available; so as well as making it ever harder to leave, JWdom is getting heavy on dunking the littluns before they have a chance to think for themselves.
How many within the org., despite harbouring serious doubts, only remain to avoid losing all family and social contact is hard to tell, but this piece suggests that there must be many such.
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Johannaes Hoekstra says:
July 9, 2015 at 6:28 am
Where we can read the story about 607 BCE – 1914CE?
On Facebook is : Lollard Movement
They want to replace the Governing Body and look for assist in the USA.
Reply
Steve McRoberts says:
July 9, 2015 at 7:22 am
Kudos to both Daniel and Devon for their amazing journey, and for documenting it so well. Other than the decriminalizing of drugs, I agree wholeheartedly with every word of their conclusion.
Hugs to you both, and “Welcome to the world!”
Reply
Cedars says:
July 9, 2015 at 7:30 am
Hi Steve, though I would not speak on Daniel’s behalf, I think he was referring, not to cocaine, heroine, etc, but to drugs like cannabis (marijuana) which on closer inspection can hardly be classed as a drug at all. Marijuana doesn’t kill people, there is no known lethal dose, and it is abundantly less harmful to society than alcohol. And yet prisons in America are brimming with people whose ‘crime’ was to distribute it. I do understand your sentiments on this score, and I shared them myself until only recently, but it is remarkable what you uncover once you start expanding the remit of a critical mind to multiple aspects of society. The prohibition of marijuana is essentially religiously motivated. Religion doesn’t like competition in the area of experiencing bliss, euphoria and serenity.
Reply
StrongHaiku says:
July 9, 2015 at 10:07 am
Good points, Cedars. I would also add that part of the stigma of Marijuana/Cannabis, in the U.S. anyway, has to do with a long-standing political stance on it being classified as a Schedule I drug (which includes Heroin, LSD, etc.). Historically, it was President Nixon in the 1970’s that pushed on classifying it as such despite all scientific and medical evidence. Historical records showed that his main motivation was purely personal as he associated the use of Marijuana with “radical demonstrators”, which he was trying to squelch.
This is similar to how the U.S. government associated atheism with communism in the 1950’s to push a theistic agenda and proceeded to add God in the pledge of allegiance, etc. Once they did, they made belief in God intricately associated with being an American. But that’s another discussion for another time…
In any case, based on all available facts and studies it is a useful substance and has an innumerable number of benefits. Like all things, best in moderation but definitely better than many things that are legal (e.g. alcohol).
Oh, and for full disclosure, I live in Colorado where it is perfectly legal. There are more Marijuana Shops that Starbucks. It’s all good.
Reply
Maria says:
July 10, 2015 at 5:53 am
Keep in mind that decriminalization does not mean legalisation. Decriminalization only means that you can’t be put in prison for possessing small amounts of drugs for personal use. The drugs are still illigal and you may have to pay a fine instead.
Reply
anonymous says:
July 10, 2015 at 6:50 am
And to add to Maria’s comment, it still goes down on a person’s arrest record, making it harder to get a job, thus so many having been arrested or fined for possession of pot, being out of work and having to rely on the state for food and rent.
One time when I was in service, I brought up the topic of not arresting people and putting them in prison for possession of pot since it because in the end makes it so hard for these people to get work, even if they haven’t been put in prison for being caught with marijuana and even those in the car group had to agree with me.
Nobody in their right mind, can think that throwing people in prison for smoking pot and giving them a criminal record makes any sense and it doesn’t keep people from doing it anyway and it isn’t any more dangerous to smoke than cigarettes.
A few years ago, one of our elders was fighting cancer and going through chemo and I brought up medical marijuana and told him about it as it makes going through chemo so much easier and they can eat etc. and he listened to me as he was being made so sick by chemo. I told him that you can eat it in food and yes it’s a feel good drug but what is the difference between that feel good drug and any other prescription drug with cocaine or heroin in it. They are more addicting than marijuana and doctors prescribe them for pain. Why not marijuana which is less dangerous to use. He had to agree with me.
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Daniel Genser says:
July 10, 2015 at 7:12 pm
I think many drugs should be completely legalized and regulated. There are some that are truly vile, but, at the very last, we should be treating abuse as a health issue, not a criminal issue.
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ScotWm says:
July 9, 2015 at 8:02 am
Daniel Genser wrote, “I decided to stop going to meetings because my beliefs and values no longer align with the official policies of the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society and their affiliate corporations.”
Witnesses are told that the laws of God do not change. I’m sure there are many more JWs who are finding it very difficult to keep their sights aligned with the continually-changing doctrines and policies of the Watchtower organization.
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Imacountrygirl says:
July 9, 2015 at 8:13 am
Thank you for this article!
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Jess says:
July 9, 2015 at 8:36 am
Wow what a well written article.
More and more people are leaving thanks to crazy rants from GB members. Please keep the ridiculous broadcasts coming!
I
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Arlis Scott says:
July 9, 2015 at 8:48 am
Daniel and Devon, “Welcome to the world of Humanity!” “Welcome to Freedom!”
The only good thing that I got out of being raised as a witness was not to judge anyone. I used that as my belief in giving people a chance to be the best that they could be. When the organization went against that belief I knew it wasn’t right. They are not what they claim to be. When you get to the point in life that you don’t even recognize your own brother or sister,who is not a witness and disfellowshipped, something is definitely not right. This was a turning point for me in leaving. But as you know leaving your witness family is one of the hardest part of starting over. Your door maybe open to them, but chances are they will never use it unless they also come to the same conclusion, that being a Jehovah’s Witness is wrong.
I never went into any scripture or belief that they were wrong, except that the thought of Jehovah and his angels killing over 7 billion people and then not letting those who died have any chance of starting over in a resurrection, and then the thought of myself and what I did or not do effect the life of one of those lost, blood guilt! No amount of reasoning can make that right! Having the world on your shoulders is really hard to do. Scriptures can be turned into whatever you want them to mean if you have the thought of controlling people. Doesn’t make it right!
Enjoy your freedom, it has been hard fought for by countless people! Love dearly what you wrote!
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Paul Sear says:
July 9, 2015 at 9:46 am
I have found that people who are homophobic views have muted same sex desires. Interesting about the tight pants thing, to even come up with such a thought worries me as to where he got the idea from. Peraps in his own mind.
Shame satan put the new hq on a contaminated site or is the real god trying to nobble the JW Bystanders
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coverspiff says:
July 9, 2015 at 10:22 am
Also, I’m not surprised in the least when he says of JW Broadcasting:
“Having the opportunity to see and examine Governing Body members in the flesh on a regular basis would have a huge impact on me in the following months.”
I would like to concur that seeing these idiots broadcasting their craziness across the internet accelerated my awakening like a shot of radioactive espresso as well. In creating JW Broadcasting, the GB truly have loaded up an Uzi and pointed it cheerfully at their own feet. Even my devout JW parents have commented they they’re “not fond” of Steven Lett.
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john says:
July 9, 2015 at 12:18 pm
Black Sabbath under the sun.
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Mikeinkona says:
July 9, 2015 at 12:45 pm
Amazingly well written story. Everyone…please post this article to your Facebook pages.
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john says:
July 9, 2015 at 1:06 pm
I’m an English man in new york
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anonymous says:
July 9, 2015 at 5:55 pm
Most of us that leave the JW religion can’t move away like Daniel and Devon did. Most of us have to live in the same community and either hide in our homes or run the chance of meeting our former friends from the Kingdom Hall when we are out and about. I am one of those people.
Today when I went to the grocery store, one of the elder’s wives who I was good friends with for over 40 years had run into the store and as she passed me, I said hi to her an she smiled and said hi to me too and kept going. I am sure she was just as uncomfortable in running into me as I was uncomfortable running into her. That is how I feel every time I leave the house. I wonder if there is a car group driving past me and what they are saying about me and why I left. I feel uncomfortable every time I go out of the house. I hate that feeling but no matter how much I hate being in this position, I will not go back to the Kingdom Hall for anything once I found out what a sham religion it is.
I am so happy for those who can move away like Daniel and Devon. That is the best way to escape that cult if you can do it.
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Gameisover says:
July 11, 2015 at 12:06 am
I have the same situation. I live in a place where everyone knows me and used to love me.
I meet them left and right. I realize how uncomfortable they feel by their fake smiles but I view them in a different way. The way I used to view Bible studies. People that need to be liberated because they are rotting in a prison cell with no windows.They have been denied all the happiness and beauty this world can bring. So I greet them cheerfully, warmly and I think they can FEEL how much I care for them. Several have already left and are grateful. Dear anonymous, try this new way of looking at things. Everyone secretly longs to be happy, to be free, no matter how brainwashed they are.
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anonymous says:
July 11, 2015 at 6:06 am
@Gameisover, I so desperately want to go over to their houses (the ones that I can trust) and tell them the whole truth but I am so scared to do to do it.
So many of them, I think are depressed because of the demands of the Watchtower. The young woman that is the mother of the girl I studied with (hates it) told me that if I really loved them, I’d tell them the truth about the “truth” but the only thing is though, is that since she didn’t get involved strongly like most are, she doesn’t understand the uphill climb that it takes to get through to them and in the meantime, we have to realize that they probably think we are demonized.
Believe me when I say that I do want to so much tell them what a trap they are in and to get out but I don’t know how to do it. I know how I was and I thought it was the truth too and that Satan was out to get us away so we’d all die at Armageddon. I thought the Society was run by God and I thought that right up until about a year ago and even then, it took me several months of intense research before I realized what a sham it was and that I had wasted my entire life on a sham.
That is what makes it so difficult to warn them is that when it sets in that we have been taken advantage of by a very clever organization, we were hurt, angry and depressed because it is then that we realize that we have wasted all our life on it and we can’t get that time back. They might be like me and even lose faith in the resurrection hope which is really depressing too.
It is such a double-edged sword. On the one hand, you are freed of the emotional blackmail of having the deaths of all your neighbors and relatives not in the “truth” on your head because you didn’t preach to them when you think you should have and then when they die at Armageddon you will feel like it’s your fault or else you will be afraid God is going to kill you at Armageddon because you didn’t preach to them every time you could have etc.
It is such a double-edged sword because when you realize it’s all a scam, you don’t feel guilty about not having to sit through all those boring meetings and having to go to assemblies and out in service anymore too and that’s like getting out of prison when you are free to live your life and enjoy your free time doing things you always wanted to do but didn’t have time.
It is so very complicated to be in our situations. What I keep hoping for is that the great “majority” wake up and stop supporting it and it dies.
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Grace says:
July 9, 2015 at 7:44 pm
Anonymous, you just described my life. I often wondered how many ex-jw’s are walking around like me not wanting to be noticed. I remember an elder saying out in field service one day a few years back that they could form 2 more congregations of ex’s/inactive ones in our territory.
It frustrates me that I let these people make my world so small. I have to really mentally prepare myself sometimes when I go out so that if I do run into someone, I will hold myself & smile & be friendly because I don’t want to be self-righteous like they are.
As for the article, I love the fact that he addresses each of the doubts that he has. Most of us have had it whirling around our heads like a washing machine but we were too afraid to address each one thoroughly while we were in. It takes so long to do it because the emotional upheaval that takes first place & dealing with that seemed to be priority for me, at least.
I went through almost a post-traumatic state for a few months, crying at the drop of a hat over my daughter. Reliving the day she died until I finally was able to come to terms with what I had put aside 20 years ago when she died. I basically had to go through the grieving process this last year & half all over again because my mind had put the fantasy of the new system in place to deal with it.
Now, I can say that facing those flashbacks & allowing myself to cry has made me stronger. I can only say to others that are new out…Don’t be afraid of your emotions & let yourself cry until it’s out of your system because it is a form of grief & the body has emotions & tears for a reason.
Love to all.
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anonymous says:
July 10, 2015 at 3:44 am
@Grace, what you were saying about the grief of realizing we won’t see our dead loved ones is the worst part of my process of letting go of the JW religion too. Even though I had doubts about Armageddon for a long time, I still clung to the hope of seeing my parents and aunts and uncles and grandparents in the resurrection and the hope that my children wouldn’t face death.
So much, I want to tell my former “friends” from the hall that they should enjoy their precious lives now instead of wasting them away trying to please men of the Watchtower but I can’t say anything to them. I have to let them think the worst of me and go on with my own life. I have tried with my son and oldest daughter but they refuse to listen and so I have to let them find out on their own.
Over the week-end a really wonderful man from my first congregation died from loss of blood during a routine operation and another two really nice people from my first congregation are dying, one from leukemia and the other from cancer. A couple months ago another really good friend from my oldest daughter’s congregation died from cancer. It seems that these older people that I first knew when I was snared into the religion are dying like flies now that I am old too and we were all promised that Armageddon was coming in 1975 when we were all young and we believed the lie.
Every single person that I knew then when I was young that were 30 or 40 then are now dead or in the 90’s if they have lived that long. We were all fooled into believing the lie, just like Eve was fooled by the devil.
It’s the same devilish lie and it’s fooling people every day in all religions. Every day, JW people are still believing the lie and giving up their lives that they could enjoy right now but they are wasting it away on a man made religion. It is so easy to fool people if you can make them believe that the Bible is from God because facing the fact of our death is so hard to deal with and nobody wants to die or see their loved ones die.
The only difference between the JW religion and other religions is that other religions teach that if you follow it’s teachings, they will go to heaven to be with their dead loved ones. The Watchtower takes it one step further and promises it’s followers that they won’t even die, which is the same words the Devil used when it tricked Eve.
The Watchtower’s lie is crueler than the other religions because followers of the Watchtower are taught that they should not even enjoy their life right now but have to wait to enjoy life in the new world and spend every minute working for the Watchtower. They use emotional blackmail into making followers think that every person that they don’t convert to the JW religion is going to be killed at Armageddon. At least other so-called Christian religions don’t use emotional blackmail on their followers the way the Society does. They don’t resort to emotional blackmail to make them preach and they don’t use the emotional blackmail of disfellowshipping them if they don’t keep doing it and decide to quit.
All religions fool their followers into believing they won’t die and if they believe it themselves, they can convince others they won’t die too. It happened to me and I thought I was smarter than that.
There was a lot of truth in the Bible when Jesus said that many people would perform all these things in his name but they never knew him.
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JJ says:
July 10, 2015 at 6:50 am
Grace and Anonymous, both of your comments have touched me.
Grace, I remember my Pharisitical father-in-law saying the very same thing about his territory; if all the inactive ones came back to the Kindom Hall then they could form another congregation. It did go through my brain at the time, why all of these people stopped attending the JW meetings. They were disillusioned of course, with the lies and the problems in the congregations.
Yes, the JW’s make the world small for you when you leave! They act most unChristian and if they are in a group, they do their best to make you feel like a piece of dog-poop to be avoided.
When you don’t believe that you will never grow old or die, of that all of your loved ones will live forever, you do yourself a great diservice. As distasteful as it is, you might as well prepare yourself for the inevitable.
Anonymous, I often wonder at all of the old people in the congregations now. Like you said, “they are all dying like flies”. I remember when these elderly people were the young to middle aged JW’s that were ‘running the show’, giving the pompous talks and hunting down the ‘sinners’ to administer harsh discipline. I wonder what goes through their minds as they sit there, old, decrepit and broke. I guess they can’t leave or get too bitter or they will lose out on their funeral and the announcement of how “faithful” they were for their whole lives.
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anonymous says:
July 10, 2015 at 7:11 am
@JJ and the saddest thing about the resurrection hope is that when Witnesses are wasting their lives trying to convert strangers, their own families and former friends are dying off too and once they are gone, they are gone. We won’t have a chance in the new world to make up for all the lost time that we did not spend with them now.
If we hadn’t spent all that time trying to convert strangers, we would have had more time for our parents and brothers and sisters.
The saddest of all is those who are wasting their lives away trying to convert strangers and at the same time, shunning their own brothers and sisters and mothers and fathers and sons and daughters. When those people who are shunning are old and on their death beds, those that they had shunned all their lives are nothing to them, even their own children. That is the worst of all. Those people will have given up their families for a religious fantasy.
Now that my parents are gone, I’d give anything to explain to them why I didn’t have more time for them but it isn’t going to happen. I won’t have a chance in the “resurrection” to explain it to them and it about kills me.
I’d give anything to go back and know then what I know now but all we can do is try and help those still trapped in the religion to make the most of every day and cherish every day we have with our parents and children and not let a day go by without telling them that. Once they are dead and gone, we won’t get another chance like the Watchtower would like us to believe.
The Watchtower wants to stand in the way of family relations by putting itself above our families by making us believe that the Watchtower was appointed by God.
The Watchtower was never appointed by God and has no right to come between families.
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Finn Sawyer says:
July 11, 2015 at 1:17 pm
@anonymous: “Over the week-end a really wonderful man from my first congregation died from loss of blood during a routine operation”
I’m sorry to hear about the deaths and sickness of your friends. I am collecting articles about those who have died from refusing blood transfusions. Is there an article on the web or in a paper that you can share about your late friend?
Thanks.
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miker tower says:
July 9, 2015 at 8:37 pm
Can I translate it to Spanish? And make it available in our Spanish channels?
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Kat says:
July 10, 2015 at 2:05 am
I thought Daniel was spot on with his words here.
“They are just men. Men who are captive to the most dangerous concept of all — that they are chosen by God.”
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Insearchforchristianfreedom says:
July 10, 2015 at 8:40 am
Even if this God that we all once served at one point does exist. I believe what Raymomd Franz felt. Gods existence is still possible but the use of a central organization cannot make sense. It only cause more dilusions and divisions. If there exist a divine being that is aware of this destructive cult corporation whatever you want to call it.. I believe that oneday the almighty himself will destroy it. Or it will destroy itself because of what’s happening. But time will tell. At the mean time we all have recover and move one.
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Itfeelsgoodtobefree says:
July 10, 2015 at 9:32 am
Absolutely brilliant article! I have to take time to re-read. All the best to Devon and Daniel <3<3
It gives me hope to see many people waking up so recently. I'm working on my mother these days, saying a few things here and there and picking her curiosity. The other day she started the conversation herself and said something like: Our family has been ruined by the JWs… I thought I was hearing things (lol). You just never know…
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Grace says:
July 10, 2015 at 2:17 pm
Itfeelsgoodtobefree, That is a BIG sign. I said that very same thing to my husband when I started to wake up because I had pushed my worldly family away for the cult family.
Just make sure that you are gentle with your reasoning with her. She will become very fragile when she the penny does drop.
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Exhausted says:
July 10, 2015 at 12:29 pm
I must join in on this. My mother died when I was only
In my mid twenties. She was a very zealous person, full
Of love and compassion towards all. However, after she
Became divorced from my father, who was a cheater, etc
She became responsible for four children who were teens
And up. her stress was too much, even though she was
Mother of very good, helpful kids. I loved her and respected her with all my heart as did my brother and
Sister.
With that, I. Remember these self righteous sisters coming over and critizing her because her hours and meeting attendance was faultering somewhat. ?????
really??? They had worldly husbands who took care of
Them and had no worries. Did I mention that she was
Gorgeous and half of them were so jealous they couldn’t
See straight??? Mom woke up to a lot of things even then.
One sister who actually studied with her had a bi-racial
Kid who is grown now and it’s just obvious he isn’t white.
She even took mom out to clubs where this guy performed
And she more than knew what went on. This sis also
Would get up at circuit assemblies in her pink furs and
Brag about how she brought in entire congregations (by
Numbers) into the truth. Now excuse me while I go
Puke. I always thought Jehovah called his sheep.
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Bad Penny says:
July 10, 2015 at 5:46 pm
anonymous –
I really like your posts, you say so much about how many of us feel.
I became a JW from the ‘world’. My fleshly family, although against it, lovingly put up with my ‘religious mania’.
My sadness is, now that ‘I am out’, I cannot apologise to my mother and two brothers for the grief I caused them as they died whilst I was a witness.
Although I no longer believe Watchtower lies I have not lost my faith in Jesus Christ. Why should I let evil men take away that love. Jesus himself promised that the resurrection would take place. OK, we don’t know when, but I prefer to believe it will happen one day.
There is much evil manifest in this world, especially when it comes to religious fanaticism, in all its forms.
I can only hope that there will be a balancing factor of ‘good’ eventually conquering that evil.
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Kat says:
July 10, 2015 at 9:50 pm
all these posts are so sad yet encouraging. Many years wasted preaching to others while ignoring our loved ones, family that were not JW, but tolerated our beliefs, the WT says that worldly families are dangerous and abusive towards JW, I disagree, my family tolerated and always were loving and although did not hold any of my beliefs would listen to me as I ranted on about the kingdom hope, the resurrection.
When my mom was sick and dying of cancer the elders said she has the resurrection hope, put all your effort into preaching more, this will sustain you, if you draw back you may never see your mother again.
I regret not spending more time with my mother, and just saying well she will be resurrected better she died before Armageddon where she would have been destroyed as she was in a privileged position having family as JW and had the chance of changing.
Now that I look back I have so many regrets, and I see the cruelty and judgmental bias of this org, its unloving.
Spend as much time as you can with your loved ones, its now that what counts, if we can’t love our own then what hope is there.
We cant turn back the clock. But we can now help others and make a difference so they don’t have to go through what we did, and in turn hurt the very ones we now are sorry we listened to this controlling unbalanced and delusional men.
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Bad Penny says:
July 10, 2015 at 11:02 pm
anonymous and Kat
On the point of not wanting to bump into JWs. I don’t care anymore. I hold my head up high, knowing that I stood up for truth. If they prefer to believe lies its their prerogative. My conscience is clear. Don’t let the b……s grind you down!
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Kat says:
July 11, 2015 at 2:28 am
Bad Penny what you say is true, standing up for truth has its repercussions with the org, as sad as they are still one can know that they have stood by truth. Thanks
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anonymous says:
July 11, 2015 at 2:59 am
@Bad Penny and Kat, thanks for the encouragement. I feel the same as you do because I know that we are the ones that know the real truth and the ones from the Hall are wasting their lives on nothing but as much as I know that and pity those people now, I still feel a little uncomfortable every time I walk out of the house but I do hold my head up high.
The best way we can “help” our former “friends” is to let them know that we aren’t walking around in a blue “funk”.
When I first left, my cousin emailed me and suggested I was “isolating” myself and I emailed her back and told her I wasn’t “isolating” myself.
That is what they think. They think that when we leave we are depressed and laying in bed all day long or something. That is what the Watchtower has programmed them into thinking is what happens when you walk away and it couldn’t be further from the truth. I am happier now than I have been in 50 years.
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Wanderer says:
July 11, 2015 at 6:29 am
The JWs are told they are Gods happy people, seriously if an independent study were made I would not be surprised that there is more depression and anti-depressants being used by JWs than the general population. In my old Kingdom hall and those around, were full of depression and people who suffered from high levels of anxiety.
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JJ says:
July 11, 2015 at 7:30 am
I forget where I heard or read it, and from what source, but I remember learning that you cannot keep people living on Red Alert. People cannot sustain that kind of vigilance, expectation or fear for very long. You must let them ‘come down’ and normalize.
The JW/GB makes it there #1 priority to keep their followers on Red Alert every minute of the day, every day of their lives. (I am convinced many of the more stern jerks in that Organziation do not believe it so they can manage just fine by simply pretending that they expect The End of the System or that Jehovah is watching/judging them). The rest of the people are stressed out, totally anxious that they have a secret sin, that they’ve screwed up somehow or maybe not done enough to help others or their family. Hence the need for antidepressants or some drug to level off at the end of the day. Or if they don’t feel the joy they are told that they have they must use pharmaceuticals to get that happiness.
They are a miserable bunch aren’t they?!?
My wife is at the Convention today and she asked me not to come. She said that she needs to go and get some of her joy back, hinting that because I don’t believe that garbage I’m responsible for the way sherman feels. Nice, eh?
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JJ says:
July 11, 2015 at 7:39 am
Don’t know where that word ‘sherman’ came from. Silly autocorrect!
It was just supposed to be ‘she’.
Ted says:
July 11, 2015 at 7:30 am
Daniel had many nagging doubts, while still carrying on in
the religion. I think this is the case for many of us, but we push
such thoughts to the back of our mind. Still being in the grip of
the monolithic org.
The Genocide in the Bible was an issue that kept resurfacing
for me. The WT, rationalisation, that the people were immoral
and we’re polluting the land, seemed weak to me.
What could be more immoral than armed warriors slaughtering
every living thing, including unarmed women and babies?
I had to agree with a comment in our local newspaper. That,
“Such things happening today, would be classed as. War crimes”.
Another puzzling question to me, was. The Origin of Evil.
God we were told was omnibenevolent, ( Good in the absolute
sense,) Also, originally he was alone in the universe, so evil did
not exist. Then he started creating other beings, with the
potential to do evil. So the concept of evil could only have come
from God. Being omniscient, he would be aware of the pain and
distress that evil would bring, to the living, feeling, creatures that
he had made. Evil from a source of absolute goodness, was very
hard to reconcile!
Despite some misgivings, I kept on for 24 years. The last straw
came in 1982 at a WT, study, where they said, we were not
allowed to question the F&DS. In other words thinking was not
necessary, it would be done for us.
Daniel says “Research, Research, Research.! It requires effort
but pays off in enabling us to separate “Fact from Fantasy”,
and break free from mind control.
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anonymous says:
July 11, 2015 at 11:58 am
@Ted, I always thought about evil too. My thinking was that according to the book of James, anyone can sin if they think about it long enough and of course the perfect angels “sinned” so what was to say that if Adam and Eve hadn’t eaten of that fruit, that they might have sinned some other way. Why was the only way they could sin was to eat the fruit? What about if Adam had beat on Eve or killed Eve? What about if he had been cruel to his kids or the animals? Why was the only “sin” that they could do was to eat some fruit? I forget where it was but it was in Watchtower publications that God first waited to see if any animals would be a mate for Adam but when he saw that no animal would be a suitable mate, then he made Eve. So, then why would having sex be a sin if God hadn’t made up his mind yet when he made Adam?
Then what about their offspring? What makes us think that they wouldn’t have sinned even if Adam and Eve hadn’t? What makes JW’s think that once they make it into the “new world” that they wouldn’t sin? They think that because Satan wouldn’t be around that they wouldn’t be prone to sin but Satan and all those angels with him sinned and he and all those angels were also created perfect, as was Adam and Eve.
All the years I was in the “truth” those thoughts went through my mind and I kept pushing them away but in the back of my mind, it never did make sense to me.
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Finn Sawyer says:
July 11, 2015 at 1:33 pm
Ted:
About the biblical stories of genocide and mass murder in the name of Jehovah: We are indoctrinated as infants into believing that is what is good in God’s eyes. For me, it all started with the “My Book of Bible Stories.” Also, some may not remember this but the WTS also had a collection of cassette tapes for children that were dramatized narrations of bible story accounts, including those stories where people were dying at Jehovah’s hand. Like many JW children I suspect, I basically memorized the “My Book of Bible Stories” and I could recite the cassette tapes word-for-word. For several of my most impressionable years I went to bed every night with those tapes playing in the background. I can still hear Miriam–Aaron’s wife–scream when she was struck with leprosy. I used to entertain my parents on long car trips with my re-enactments and imitations of the various voices–some of which were screaming as they were being tormented in the stories. Looking back on all that is truly surreal.
My point is, born-in JWs may not think about the genocide and other types of violence because we are taught from infancy that it was righteous. This understanding makes it easier to then accept that all those who are not JWs will die by Jehovah’s hand in the future. However, if you are a JW parent that is “un-plugged” (thanks Cedars for the term) the WTS literature for children really stands out in stark contrast to other children’s stories that are simply wholesome and innocent. That small detail is one of the many things that prevented me from indoctrinating my children–I could not in good conscience read bible stories to them that glorified and praised violent acts of genocide.
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Fatchance says:
July 13, 2015 at 11:59 am
You should see the new videos they’re coming out with. The word melodramatic comes to mind but maybe I’m being to nice.
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Little Sis says:
July 11, 2015 at 10:45 am
Cedars,
This was a great post… I just read his story. It’s incredible. It saddens me that some of us are so pushed into a corner with our beliefs that once we come out of the org we decide to not believe anything for a time. Glad he and his wife are happy. And I’m glad all you other guys and gals who make it out are finding happiness wherever or whatever it may be. I’m still working on my research and figuring out with my husband who is an “unbelieving mate” what my best strategy is…. Good luck to you all…
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Ted says:
July 11, 2015 at 3:02 pm
@Anonymous, ” What makes JW’s think that once they make it into the “new world” that they wouldn’t sin?”
That’s a very interesting question. WT, 00, 4/15, carries an article entitled.
“The New World, Will You Be There”. The article is based on Isa 65, and
Rev, 21, It concedes that there may be rebels in the new world, but says
“They will not be allowed to live to disturb the tranquility”. Then on the very
same page, they cite Rev 21: 1-5, that says “Death will be no more”.
So we extrapolate from that, that people will still have free will, and
can choose to steal, rape, or kill. The Earth too has to be filled with more
millions, to fulfil God’s original plan. So much more than the odd rebel
is more than likely. It’s all so contradictory and unbelievable !
Reply
anonymous says:
July 12, 2015 at 3:18 am
@Ted, I remember the Society has taught that for as long as I can remember that those who sin in the “new world” will be done away with but it doesn’t add up with Rev. 20:7-15 where it describes a 2nd Armageddon after Satan has been abyssed for 1,000 years and he’s let out of the abyss and he goes again to mislead the “nations” and all those that follow him will be thrown into the lake of fire. So, if all these people end up following Satan again, why aren’t they all just killed off before the 2nd Armageddon? And how long would these people that follow Satan again, be allowed to be misled before being burnt with the fire that comes down from heaven to kill them? Here it doesn’t say in the 2nd Armageddon that Jesus/Michael and his angels are going to kill them, but it’s going to be fire from heaven.
When I was a Witness, I never gave any of those scriptures a 2nd thought. How dumb was I???? I should have figured it out a long time ago, but I listened to that nonsense for 50 years but it took Youtube videos and jwsurvey and jwfacts to make me come to my senses but it’s better to learn late than not learn at all. That’s my motto.
Reply
PaPa D says:
July 11, 2015 at 4:02 pm
How many times
Can they fill me with lies
And I listen again
Twisting the truth
And they’re playin’ around with my head, O.K.
The things they will do and the things they will say
But they don’t really understand
Tears fill my eyes when I hear all the cries
For the reason today
And they don’t really know even what they’re talkin’ about
And I can’t image what empty heads can achieve
Leave me alone, don’t want your promises no more
‘Cos rock & roll is my religion and my law
Won’t ever change, may think it’s strange
You can’t kill rock & roll, it’s here to stay
Reply
Ted says:
July 11, 2015 at 4:38 pm
Hi Finn, I agree with you. The way the org, teaches the Bible,
( Using it like a blunt instrument to cow people into compliance,)
is not wholesome for impressionable children. In fact it disturbs
many adults.
Thomas Paine said. “Any system of religion that has anything in
it that shocks the mind of a child, cannot be true”.
A man I studied with cancelled any further lessons, when we got
to a part containing a picture of Abraham, arm raised with a knife
in it, ready to kill Isaac. He said, “That’s not from God, it’s from
men”, then he added, “I wouldn’t let my son see that”.
My own little daughter, now aged 57 but when about 5 or 6,
if she fell out with other kids in the street , would shout to them,
“You’ll get destroyed at Armageddon” it definitely did not help
neighbourly harmony. Oh for the benefit of hindsight eh.
Reply
Ted says:
July 12, 2015 at 5:10 am
Anonymous.
If all JWs, would scrutinise WT, publications and the Bible,
and apply logic the way that you do. The org, would be
out of business in no time. Thanks for all your,
“Research, Research, Research.”
Reply
anonymous says:
July 12, 2015 at 3:29 pm
@Ted, thank you.
Reply
insearch4christianfreedom says:
July 12, 2015 at 6:00 am
I served as a regular pioneer for 5years the became a Ministerial servant at 18 i served in a isolated island here its a US territory. I did a public talk every month eventually i burned out. Then i decided to give the bethel here a try. It even killed me until i was depressed. I am the last of my family left. Everyelse left, my mother dissassciated herself. But i was wondering all of us here regardless of being Atheist or believer in Christ. have so much gifts and talents like Daniel did. Isn’t there any way we as faders and help take down the borg.??? Does any one have suggestions???
Reply
Daniel says:
July 12, 2015 at 12:30 pm
That was an amazing article and I enjoyed reading it very much. Thank you Cedar.
Reply
Mc fan says:
July 13, 2015 at 2:38 am
Finn,
Check out a book titled:
Jehovah’s Witnesses hide a tragedy worse than Waco.
Reply
Fatchance says:
July 13, 2015 at 11:53 am
I wish I knew Daniel. I’m trying to become a software developer myself. It’s hard to make the right business connections when you lack the social skills to do so.
Reply
Bad Penny says:
July 13, 2015 at 3:33 pm
Daniel – Just finished reading your story. Your research is excellent!
I too, when I first started to wake up, and before I read any other 607 research, decided to embark on this for myself, I had to know the truth. It took me many hours of extensive research to find the answers, but I’m so glad that I did it. I was like a dog with a bone, I could not leave it alone. The way the Society has manipulated all the relevant dates in that time period to fit in with 607 is truly amazing. The Insight books are full of misleading dates which have been so well integrated into the commentary they become believable!
My research came from the standpoint that the Bible chronology was true and therefore if we use the correct date for the destruction of Jerusalem, 586 BCE, everything should fit in to God’s timetable perfectly.
I eventually managed to reconcile both 70 years of exile and 70 years of desolation to fit both scripture and history. No controversy, no argument. Six pages of typing later …I now understood why everything was written down in such detail, so that we could indeed find the truth. This of course meant that my ‘faith’ in the GB as God’s chosen channel, evaporated.
The realisation that I had been duped took its toll in many ways, it was like losing someone in death. Everything I had believed and trusted was now in doubt.
I have now researched so many things that I too feel I could write a book! Maybe I will one day.
Reply
Everyday Explorer says:
July 14, 2015 at 6:45 am
Well done to Daniel and Devon Genser. Brave article, brilliant read. Enjoy your new-found scintillating, sometimes-tremulous freedom!
Thanks to Lloyd for bringing Daniel’s inspirational article to our attention here.
Reply
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The must-read story of a ministerial servant and his wife who woke up in the last few months
avatar
Posted on July 9, 2015
daniel-genser
Daniel and Devon Genser are now enjoying their freedom after facing some huge dilemmas over the past few months
I will never forget the feeling of liberation I felt in November 2013 when I published the story of my awakening on JWsurvey, thus revealing my identity for anyone who knew me.
I knew the article would eventuate in my disassociation from the organization. In fact it took only two months for the inevitable phonecall from my congregation coordinator. But regardless of the ramifications, being open and honest about my authentic identity was absolutely the right decision – a decision I would make again and again if necessary.
It was with feelings of nostalgia for my own “outing” that I devoured the article published a few hours ago by Daniel Genser, only recently a ministerial servant in the North-Western corner of America. The article is titled “What I Believe to Be True – and How I Have Come to Believe It,” and I would urge all JWsurvey subscribers to read a superb treatise that brims with love, empathy, humanity, and above all, intellectual honesty.
What I Believe to Be True – and How I Have Come to Believe It
By Daniel Genser
I don’t want to rehash Daniel’s story because I want you to read it yourself, and I don’t think I could possibly do it justice. But it’s worth acknowledging how incredibly recently the events described in the above article transpired.
Daniel writes of still struggling to reconcile doubts over his faith as recently as the 2014 Annual Meeting at which JW Broadcasting was announced, and the now-notorious 2014 United States branch visit at which Tony Morris unleashed his ‘wisdom’ about certain types of clothing to 1 million bewildered American Witnesses.
Fast forward only a few months, and Daniel and his wife Devon find themselves in a remote part of Italy, completely free from their Witness indoctrination and, amazingly, with their relationship in tact having awoken simultaneously.
The journey of how they reached this realization, the insurmountable problems with Watchtower dogma they wrestled with, and the dilemmas they faced are all superbly and eloquently documented in Daniel’s article, which is why I feel it is so deserving of everyone’s attention.
Daniel’s thoughts on shunning are insightful and thought-provoking, and his writing on the 607 BCE controversy is one of the best concise treatments on this complicated subject I have ever read.
Apart from anything else, it is extremely heartening to see how quickly Jehovah’s Witnesses can shed their mindless loyalty to the Governing Body when they are intellectually honest and conscientious enough. And if that isn’t a happy-ever-after in itself, you have the fact that a husband and wife have pulled off this challenging feat side-by-side.
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74 Responses to The must-read story of a ministerial servant and his wife who woke up in the last few months
← Older Comments
Faded says:
July 14, 2015 at 7:29 am
Amazing. Simply amazing. Thank you for sharing this Lloyd.
Reply
El Chapo Guzman says:
July 14, 2015 at 10:11 pm
This site is just plain awful. Sorry to break it to you.
Reply
anonymous says:
July 15, 2015 at 3:50 am
@El Chapo Guzman, why do you say that? Could you come up with a web site where all current and former JW’s can say how they really feel about the JW religion that they belong to?
All of us are the “silent” majority of the JW religion and have nothing to say about it or where our contributions go. We have nothing to say to the Society that they want to hear. The Society has all the say and we the “silent” majority have no say. The controlling “minority” in New York have all the say but they would have no say if it wasn’t for the “silent” majority out here sending them money every month and donating their time in placing their literature and preparing the talks and donating all their free labor to build all their buildings and donating the money and time in doing all the work at their buildings that the Society owns, which they wouldn’t own if it wasn’t for all that donated time, enerty and money.
Do you feel that we the “silent” majority should just support anything the Society tells us to do and if we don’t go along with it, should be kicked out and shunned?
At what point do we have the right to say “I am not going to take it anymore?” At what point can we draw a line in the sand and say that this religion is a dangerous cult? Do we have to lose a child to refusing blood? Do we not have the right to say that if our child is molested and raped that we can go to the police and turn that person in to the police without retribution from the Society? At what point in our lives can we have control over what we think? At what point can we take control over our minds and think and question our religion without being kicked out and shunned?
Do you really feel that in order to put on the “new personality” that we have to lose our personality and become mindless, numb robots to support an organization that says that God chose it without an shred of evidence to support that concept? Are you allowed to ask how the Society got it’s appointment by God in 1919? If so, I’d like to know the answer.
If you can’t come up with that information, then you are blowing hot air and you need to only go to jw.org. and stay in your bubble.
Reply
Let's get real says:
July 15, 2015 at 2:43 am
El Chapo
Sorry to break it to you, but hundreds would disagree.
You know what to do don’t you?
Reply
Pickle brain says:
July 15, 2015 at 5:39 am
@El Guzzler Chappo. I think I spelt your name right . I think your name is more awful than this website!!
Reply
Pickle brain says:
July 15, 2015 at 7:46 am
& El GUZZLE CHAPPIE! Sorry to break it to you , BUT your comment is AWFUL!!
You are disobeying the 7 HOLY Heavenly Anointed GB members by associating with Apostates on this website . You could be Disfellowshipped for that!!
You are a VERY NAUGHTY ‘EL GUZZLE CHAPPIE!!
Reply
Queen Elsa says:
July 16, 2015 at 2:05 am
Daniel, I noticed you mentioned you are type one? I have a young child with type one…I was at the same convention in Seattle. I sure wish we could communicate somehow… We have more than one thing in common…
Reply
Mike Morris says:
July 17, 2015 at 12:22 am
Excellent article. 607 was the starting point for me too, after reading ‘The Greatness That Was Babylon”, can’t remember the name of the author at the moment. It is just a straightforward history of the Babylonian empire, with no religious axe to grind, and it explains very clearly how the dates for key events are calculated. I think it is still available.
Reply
Mike Morris says:
July 17, 2015 at 12:30 am
HWF Saggs was the author.
Reply
James Broughton says:
July 18, 2015 at 11:13 am
Thank you for publishing Daniel and Devon’s story. We are thrilled that they are enjoying their freedom and wish them every blessing for the future.
Reply
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Is Watchtower imploding? 10 reasons why the end could be nigh
Is Watchtower imploding? 10 reasons why the end could be nigh
JWawake.com
JWawake.com
The must-read story of a ministerial servant and his wife who woke up in the last few months
The must-read story of a ministerial servant and his wife who woke up in the last few months
Battle of the cults: Anything JW Broadcasting can do, Scientology can do better!
Battle of the cults: Anything JW Broadcasting can do, Scientology can do better!
Tony Morris scapegoats gay people in bizarre child abuse denial rant
Tony Morris scapegoats gay people in bizarre child abuse denial rant
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Is Watchtower imploding? 10 reasons why the end could be nigh →
Battle of the cults: Anything JW Broadcasting can do, Scientology can do better!
avatar
Posted on July 14, 2015
Watchtower's JW Broadcasting studio (above) is about to get a competitor from the Church of Scientology
Watchtower’s JW Broadcasting studio (above) is about to get a competitor from the Church of Scientology
Any cult operating in the information age, an era when facts can be easily verified with a few clicks on Google, will find disseminating baseless propaganda increasingly problematic.
Internet subscriptions are steadily on the rise, even in third world countries. It is simply impossible to dupe people as easily as before internet connectivity became widely available.
Watchtower’s answer to this problem has been a full-scale assault on the internet – an “if you can’t beat ’em, join ’em” approach. In 2012 Watchtower consolidated its web presence from three websites (jw-media.org, watchtower.org and jw.org) into one, essentially putting all its eggs in one basket with a visually appealing (if utterly misleading) JW.org revamped site.
Then in October last year the Governing Body announced the launch of JW Broadcasting (tv.jw.org) – a shameless foray into the tawdry world of TV evangelism that they had spent decades denouncing in their literature. Tony Morris, speaking at one of this year’s regional conventions, explained some of the thinking behind the move…
“The news agencies, you don’t see them hardly ever do a story about us because, guess who runs the media! This is no surprise. I did news service work at conventions in the early days when I was in the truth – very rarely did we get any decent press. We don’t care anymore. We’ll make our own news, we’ll put it on JW Broadcast, and I’ll tell you we get a lot of people that are not Witnesses – it’s directed, the audience is Jehovah’s people – but they’re like ‘who are these people?’ See, because Jehovah’s going to reach out and let ’em know ‘here’s where the truth is.'”
In other words, the internet and media are becoming increasingly toxic against the Witnesses, especially as reports of shunning, child abuse, and needless deaths from refusing blood transfusions steadily receive more media attention.
JW Broadcasting is therefore a propaganda counter-measure, aimed at projecting Watchtower’s Orwellian “listen, obey and be blessed” message in the hopes that if enough nonsense is thrown at the web-browsing public, some of it might stick.
Now it seems another cult – one that also happens to have a terrible media reputation – wants in on the act. The Daily Mail has reported that the Church of Scientology is constructing its own $50 million studio on Sunset Blvd in Los Angeles to globally disseminate Scientology’s own patented brand of mind control, as the cult’s website explains:
“The global media center that will revolutionize the Church’s communications footprint throughout the print, broadcast, and internet media worlds as a state-of-the-art hub helping beam Scientology’s message all over the globe. The world population of 7 billion is growing by more than 250,000 daily. With 3,000 opportunities to reach each person on any given day, the technological power to reach out exists at unprecedented orders of magnitude. Scientology Media Productions is the emphatic answer to that most vital question of how we will in fact catapult into the next dimension. When this new property opens, we will be capable of reaching virtually every person on Earth.”
scientology-jw
scientology-jw2
Scientology’s newsroom (top) is eerily reminiscent of its JW Broadcasting counterpart (bottom)
Scientology watchdog Tony Ortega of the Underground Bunker blog has already anticipated the development. “They’ve talked about doing a Scientology TV channel, showing their dumb videos over and over again,” he said. “But it could also go the way of their Freedom Magazine, where it’s trying to be more mainstream and commenting on everyday issues. They will try to do TV shows which are legitimate, speaking about every day things with a Scientology slant. Scientology news would be hilarious, but who would watch it?”
Gaining an audience for blatant cult propaganda will doubtless be more challenging for Scientology, regardless of their bigger and better facilities. Despite dominating the media discussion on cults, Scientology is punching well above its weight in terms of membership.
According to “Going Clear,” a recent HBO documentary (which I would urge everyone to watch!), the organization currently boasts a mere 50,000 active members – around the same number Watchtower has in Mozambique! My guess is the majority of viewers of Scientology video material will be critics of Scientology, and members of the atheist and ex-cult communities.
Watchtower, on the other hand, can bank on at least 8 million devoted subscribers to its online content, including JW Broadcasting videos. Even so, it is telling that when it comes to finding ways to thrust unprovable nonsense on people, birds of a feather like Watchtower and Scientology really do flock together.
new-cedars-signature3
Further reading…
◾Daily Mail article on new Scientology studio
◾HBO “Going Clear” documentary on Scientology
◾Coming soon to a web browser near you – Governing Body TV (on demand)!
◾JWsurvey’s “JW Broadcasting” page
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40 Responses to Battle of the cults: Anything JW Broadcasting can do, Scientology can do better!
Etienne Genedl says:
July 14, 2015 at 4:57 am
It still seems totally unreal to me that they are actually having this broadcasting channel. Back in the days when I was a witness – which is just five, six years ago – it would have been completely unspeakable. I recall some of the brothers in my former congregations in Germany mocking other churches for their media appearance, saying something like God would not need a TV channel to speak to his people or make his will known to the world. Now, these presumptuous men at the east coast decided differently and all over a sudden, the witnesses embrace what they once were told to reject. When I think of some of the older, more conservative brothers and sister that I met over the years both in my home country and in other areas of the world, I am very sure that they somehow secretly doubt that these new media campaigns are a part of God’s plan for his people while they’re watching the younger generation of witnesses preaching a website and a logo.
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buk lao says:
July 14, 2015 at 4:57 am
Wow i’d watch both just to be entertained to see which speaker is the better looney tune. This is going to get interesting.
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Kat says:
July 14, 2015 at 5:12 am
It is basically to combat the internet. The scientology cult treats ex members the same as the JW, I have seen them on current affairs programs saying the same thing as JW, bitter ex members.
the information is there on the internet, damaging to cults, so the propaganda TV cult network starts.
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Jordano says:
July 14, 2015 at 5:33 am
I’ll watch it. This is going to be hilarious.
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Dee says:
July 14, 2015 at 6:19 am
This is religious oneupmanship and an expensive king of the mountain game. Nooooobody cares what these goofballs have to say in their self important, self righteous, self serving talking heads rhetoric. Let them spend all their money. :)
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StrongHaiku says:
July 14, 2015 at 6:32 am
“…We don’t care anymore. We’ll make our own news, we’ll put it on JW Broadcast…”
I think AMIII went to the “Rupert Murdoch School of Journalism”… He is confusing news and journalism with opinion pieces and propaganda…
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JWIntellect says:
July 14, 2015 at 6:45 am
Lol. Who knows? He might be able to land a job on Fox News.
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StrongHaiku says:
July 14, 2015 at 6:54 am
Right? Just watched “Outfoxed: Rupert Murdoch’s War on Journalism” last night. I hadn’t seen it in a couple of years. If you get a chance, watch the documentary. It gives you an insight on the JW.org Broadcasting playbook…
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Dee says:
July 14, 2015 at 6:34 am
Oh…and the studios are gorgeous. But it’s still just lipstick on a pig. Now they’re right up there with Fox News and the Enquirer. Lol.
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anonymous says:
July 14, 2015 at 6:43 am
With all those famous actors being Scientologists, at least the acting should be better than jwbroadcasting. I think it will be entertaining. I just hope they don’t swing a watch in front of the camera to get my hypnotized into another cult. Being drawn into one cult was enough for me in my lifetime.
On a serious note, I think it will work because people are drawn to movie stars and there’s a lot of movie stars in that religion and people might think if they join up with them, they will hob nob with movie stars. People are that shallow.
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Oubliette says:
July 14, 2015 at 6:53 am
Interesting development.
Two comments:
1 – That quote of dialogue from Anthony Morris is quite interesting. I’ve heard him talk many times and often noticed what is very obvious when you read a transcript of his speaking. He rarely completes a sentence! His thoughts are quite scattered and disjunct.
2 – In my own informal non-scientific survey I have asked quite a number of JWs if they watch JW.TV. The vast majority of them have said they do not. I wonder what percentage of JW’s watch JW.TV.
Keep up the good work!
Oubliette
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chatpal says:
July 14, 2015 at 7:00 am
this is too funny, its like they hired the same set designers,lol
well I always heard the comment, ‘you cant believe anything coming out of the mouths of those tv evangelists’,
or tv to begin with….
I think once something ends up on the old viewfinder, its going to start to slide down the old scale of respectability.
media has a way of defiling anything viewed as wholesome ,lol
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Bad Penny says:
July 14, 2015 at 7:44 am
I noticed one subtle difference between the two sets. Scientologys’ logo has the intertwining pyramids! JW.org prefers to hide that part of their history!
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David says:
July 14, 2015 at 8:14 am
the light is getting brighter even for Scientology
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Jill Hileman says:
July 14, 2015 at 8:43 am
This right here– the average person hears the term Scientology and assumes rightly to stay far away. The average person hears the term Jehovah’s Witness and assumes nice, innocuous but annoying on Saturday mornings and weird about holidays.
The sheer number (50,000 members compared to 8 million!) makes it that much more important that both cults are exposed for the controlling, manipulative, family-shattering groups they both are.
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David says:
July 14, 2015 at 9:27 am
so they publish a magazine called “Freedom Magazine”. JWs publish the awake magazine. Nice! They know how to change the meaning of words.
Yes, once you join one of these cults you are free. You have the only freedom of saying… Yes sir! It is all a waste of money and resources to publish rubbish!
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Hakizimana Jean de Dieu says:
July 14, 2015 at 10:04 am
I tend to think they will have a good number of people to watch the Watchtower’s TV… Some people are so desperate that they eager to hear anyone saying the end is near! They are FALSELY helping those “Those With Anxiety Disorders”
*** g 3/12 p. 27 How to Help Those With Anxiety Disorders ***
Post-Traumatic Stress Disorders (PTSD) In recent times this term has been used to describe a range of psychological symptoms people may experience following an extremely traumatic event that involved physical harm or the threat of such. PTSD sufferers may startle easily, be irritable, become emotionally numb, lose interest in things they once enjoyed, and have trouble feeling affection for others—especially those with whom they used to be close. Some become aggressive, even violent, and tend to avoid situations that remind them of the original traumatic incident.
http://wol.jw.org/en/wol/l/r1/lp-e?q=g+3%2F12+p.+27
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Mama Joy says:
July 14, 2015 at 11:01 am
No matter what they try, the JWs still look crazy to anyone who isn’t brainwashed yet.
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Tony Brock says:
July 14, 2015 at 11:42 am
How is this possible though without Jehovah’s spirit? I mean, that is how JW’s were able to do it, right? That’s what I heard anyway. I wonder if the Scientologists will have stories about how material for their studio couldn’t be attained until, by some miracle, it became available, and at half the original cost.
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JJ says:
July 14, 2015 at 10:43 pm
Even Pharaoh’s priests could make their rods turn into snakes too.
(See, that’s how it’s done. You compare Scientology’s studio to the JW one and I’ll come up with some obscure scripture proving nothing)
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Ted says:
July 14, 2015 at 12:19 pm
there’s plenty of “Snake oil” (quack remedies) for sale on the net,
sold by guys hoping to make a quick buck out of the gullible.
While most of it wont do you any harm, it won’t do you any good
either.
The mental poison, peddled by the likes of WT, and Scientology
is both addictive and harmful. Psychological damage and family
break up, through shunning or disconnection, resulting sometimes
in suicides. Thousands of needless deaths through pressurised
refusal of medical treatment, etc, etc,
Alongside the fraudsters claims, there’s lots of genuine, independent
information, just a click away, exposing them. The move then into
Internet broadcasting by these two groups, could well be counter
productive.
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Bad Penny says:
July 14, 2015 at 12:53 pm
Ted – I agree with your comment.
Just looked at the Scientology website –
Just like JWs, it appears squeaky clean, the same open eyed folks looking sooo happy!
Again claiming to lead ones to truth and freedom, when in fact it is leading to captivity.
The good thing now is, one only has to look at other sites to be warned to keep well away. Once bitten, twice shy, we would say.
I can’t see how these cults can survive in this informed world – unless you are totally gullible, stupid, hypnotised or brain washed!
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Jakemon75 says:
July 14, 2015 at 1:30 pm
I think the best thing that could happen to J-Dubs are those broadcasts.
Not for the GB, but for the rank and file.
The embarrassing and out of touch manner in which these men speak and the mannerisms they use in speaking to the rank and file have got to be raising some questions.
They’re embarrassing.
Some have got to think, even privately, “This is one of the handful of persons that Jesus hand picked?”
Or, “How could this person possibly know what it’s like to be in my shoes and have to get through life everyday?”
Please keep them talking. I know from talking to persons still attending meetings that they are finding these broadcasts to be embarrassing, and out of touch, and it’s raising the eyebrow that could lead to actually looking into what they are told.
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Mark says:
July 14, 2015 at 7:29 pm
The general opinion among anti-Scientology activists is that the LA studio is merely a minor variation on cult dictator David Miscavige’s property-scam—the vast, expensively-revamped ‘Ideal Org’ buildings it owns—the majority of which are all but empty, but which permit Scientology to try and duck accusations of inurement (or operating for profit and personal gain despite their US tax-exemption). This constant acquisition of property allows Miscavige to fool his dwindling flock that Scientology is still expanding as “the fastest-growing new religion in the world”. It also serves to loosen the purse-strings of his ‘whales': rich followers like pharmaceticals billionaire Bob Duggan, who continue to pour millions into Scientology’s already bulging coffers. In the (frankly unlikely) event the LA studio does start transmitting, it will only be preaching to the converted.
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Mc fan says:
July 15, 2015 at 2:57 am
Anyone ever wonder,how many of these supposed 8 million Jehovah’s Witnesses are Faders, liars, drunkards,Child Molesters, fornicators, adulterers,rapists,wife beaters,child beaters and wife swappers!
Oh Yeh!
And why does the membership number stay at 8 million for so long, it’s been around 8 million members for a few years now! If JEHOVAH is constantly blessing this orginazation why don’t the membership numbers continue to grow?
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da' says:
July 15, 2015 at 4:25 am
Couldn’t JW Broadcasting eventually turn out to be a great thing for the R & F ? AMIII said even non-witnesses watch the broadcasts. What if people from every nation tune in , well wouldn’t that give those Saturday am doorknockers time to do something else?
And then if all the weekly meetings and Assemblies were broadcast too ? See where im going here ?
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anonymous says:
July 15, 2015 at 6:33 am
@da’, I was thinking the same thing. The goal is to have more money coming in than what they have coming in at the present time. That is what is important to the Society, the cheapest way to get more money coming in than what is presently coming in at the present time.
If people can print their own literature and then take their cars and use their gas to “place/dump” it on to the public, that’s even a cheaper way to go. Then they can get rid of all the Bethelites working in the Bethels and send them home and sell off all the Bethels.
I have been thinking that they will do that in the end as that would certainly be the most cost effective method for a non-profit publishing charity/cult.
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Rosie says:
July 16, 2015 at 4:19 am
In Ireland, they closed the Branch office – probably due to cut backs, but (I don’t know if this is 100% correct, I may have picked this up incorrectly) apparently they have “Bethelites” who operate “Bethel” from their own homes?
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rob says:
July 15, 2015 at 10:09 am
I still find it disturbing that God’s name has been reduced to an acronym – JW TV. When I was a witness i remember how important it was for the witnesses to ensure that God’s name was proclaimed and was not hidden. The witnesses criticized the other religions for taking God’s name out of the Bible and replacing it with Lord and God etc, but now they have done the exact same thing by replacing God’s name using just the first letter. Very very hypocritical.
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Ted says:
July 15, 2015 at 11:12 am
Anonymous.
The orgs, main focus is the almighty dollar, yen, pound, and whatever
other currency exists.
On the elders course, at Mill Hill Bethel, the instructor told the class,
“The org, is not concerned primarily with the easiest way, but the
cheapest”. Of course when you’ve got thousands of unpaid workers
you can do things on the cheap !
When the Egyptians were building the Pyramids, they didn’t have a lot
of technology, but they had plenty of slaves. No wages to pay, just
keep em fed on bread, onions, and garlic, and plenty of beer to wash it
down with. ( water was mostly polluted )
The org, works on this ancient system, especially in the Bethel’s,
although I think, they hold back on the beer
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anonymous says:
July 15, 2015 at 1:33 pm
@Ted, the Egyptian slaves were paid pretty good. They had all kinds of animals, sheep, goats and cattle and they had houses and they even had gold earrings. When they left Egypt, they even had tents and all kinds of other stuff with which they were able to saw down wood to make the santuary and all kinds of tent material to make the santuary tent cloths with etc. . When they were in the wilderness, they even had weapons to kill off all the Canaanites and anybody else who got in their path.
That sure doesn’t sound like the unpaid slaves that Watchtower cons into working for them. The Watchtower slavery, more resembles the kind of slavery that the United States had before the civil war before the slaves were freed from that kind of tyranny. The really sad thing is that Watchtower slaves are conned into it because they think they are saving the world from destruction at Armageddon and they are mindless voluntary slaves because they are so meek and mild-tempered and good hearted.
The whole purpose of the JW religion is to “witness” about the coming war of Armageddon and if you were to ask any of Jehovah’s Witnesses to describe the actual war of Armageddon, there isn’t a one of them that could tell you that the War of Armageddon in Revelation chapter 20 is AFTER SATAN AND HIS DEMONS ARE ABYSSED FOR 1,000 YEARS AND NOT BEFORE. The whole purpose of the religion and going to meetings and being taught how to preach about Armageddon is meaningless if any one of them realized that the war of Armageddon is after Satan and the demons are abyssed for 1000 years.
They all think that Armageddon is right around the corner and Watchtower isn’t going to tell them the real truth but really if anyone of them would just crack out their Bibles and “meditate” on the scriptures, like Watchtower is always preaching, they’d see it for themselves but of course, they are under cult mind-control and can’t think anymore.
They are totally brain dead and that is the way Watchtower wants it.
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Excelsior! says:
July 16, 2015 at 7:06 am
anonymous,
You are right, as usual! The “final war” will indeed be AFTER the 1000 year reign of Jesus. It won’t be so much a battle as a slaughter. Fire will rain down and consume all the “bandana people” and Satan and the demons.
Your comments on the origin of sin were very interesting. If one believes in God, which I don’t, Sin, evil etc always existed as potential inside a perfect God. God decided to voluntarily limit himself from sin and evil. If God cannot sin, then he is not all powerful (omnipotent). My favourite paradox involving omnipotence is this; can God create a stone that he cannot lift? If he can create a stone he cannot lift, then he is not omnipotent. If he can’t create a stone he cannot lift, then he is also not omnipotent.
Now, steering this back to Scientology and other cults, we can begin to understand that all of these religious cults are using a God or gods that do not make any sense. Applying the “stone” question reveals that our very concept of God is logically flawed. As science discovers more, God or gods are pushed further and further away from the known towards the still unknown.
Centuries ago, gods lived in temples, or on mountains or in heaven, which was in the sky somewhere. People went up into the sky and they didn’t find heaven. Well, heaven must be in space! People went out into space and they didn’t find heaven. Well, heaven must be in a different dimension, or really really far away….
Interestingly, the WTBTS used to teach that Heaven was physically located in the “Seven Sisters” constellation!
I have no problem with people choosing to believe in anything they want, as long as they don’t harm other people. Please don’t see this as bashing those with faith.
Peace be with you, Excelsior!
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GEM says:
July 16, 2015 at 10:35 am
@ Anonymous: Your comment regarding Armageddon forced me to blow the dust off the old book and do a re read of Revelation 16….where the sole reference to Armageddon is made…and then to read Revelation 20.
Cutting to the core… I think you are wrong on this point, and Excelsior is correct in stating that one is a “battle” and the second one is more of a slaughter!
Could you throw some light on your statement, Anonymous, please?
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anonymous says:
July 16, 2015 at 1:50 pm
@Gem, I see two wars, the one at Rev. 16:16 where the Bible talks about the seven plagues (which are almost the very same plagues on Egypt in Exodus) but this scripture in Revelation speaks about a war that is about to come with the destruction of Babylon the Great which goes from Chapter 16 through Rev. 19:3 where it describes the destruction of Babylon the Great. T
hen it talks about the marriage of the Lamb and then Rev. 19:11 it speaks of a white horse and someone called Faithful and True is sitting on it and he carries on “war in righteousness” and has a name which nobody knows except he himself and the armies in heaven were following him on white horses and they have white, clean fine linen and the one who is Faithful and True is going to strike the nations with the sword coming out of his mouth and he will shepherd the nations with a rod of iron.
Chapter 19:15 is where it says that he is going to tread the wine press of the anger of the wrath of God the Almighty and on his thigh is a name King of kings and Lord of lords. Then it goes on to say how the birds are going to eat the fleshy parts of kings and military commanders and strong men and horses of freemen and slaves and small ones and great.
Chapter 19:19 says John sees the wild beast and the kings of the earth and their armies gathered together to wage the war with the one seated on the horse with his army and the wild beast was caught and along with it the false prophets that performed in front of the signs with which he misled those who received the mark of the wild beast and those who render worship to its image and while still alive, they both were hurled into the fiery lake that burns with sulphur. But the rest were killed off with the long sword of the one seated on the horse, which sword proceeded out of his mouth. And all the birds were filled from the fleshy parts of them.
Then Chapter 20 goes on to talk about the Devil being abyssed for 1,000 years so that he couldn’t mislead the nations anymore until the 1,000 years were ended and then afterwards he will be let loose for a little while longer. (It is interesting that in Chapter 20:4 it talks about thrones and those who sits on them being given authority to judge and they are given that authority to judge and rule as kings for the 1,000 years but it doesn’t say that there are 144,000 of them.) It talks about those that come to life and rule with the King for the 1,000 years and verse 5 says the rest of the dead didn’t come to life until the 1,000 years had ended (that’s what the Bible really says. Forget Watchtower’s explanation of that scripture. That is what the Bible really says).
Starting in chapter 20:7 is where it says that when the 1,000 years had ended, Satan is let loose to mislead the nations (nations again???) Gog and Magog to gather them together for the “war” and they encircle the camp of the holy ones (thought they were all in heaven at the end of the 1,000) and verse 9 says that fire comes down from heaven and consumes them (who is it talking about here, the holy ones, since the very next verse goes on to say that the Devil was hurled into the lake of fire and sulphur and will be tormented forever and ever.
Those scriptures in Rev. 20 about Gog and Magog are the scriptures that the Society likes to use when they are talking about Armageddon and that is after the 1,000 years have ended when Satan has been abyssed but those are the scriptures the Society likes to use when they are talking about Armageddon.
The whole account in Revelation starting in Chapter 16 through 20 are talking about one war with Babylon the Great being destroyed and all those who worship it and then down to the final war in Chapter 20 where Satan will be thrown into the lake of fire forever.
What I see here are two separate wars of God. The first one is the only place where Armageddon is mentioned but the Bible calls it a place called harmageddon which has to be symbolic since all these nations of the earth can’t be in one single place at one time. It isn’t a real war. It’s a place. That is the only place in the Bible where you see harmageddon and it’s not a war but a place (symbolic).
I am only going by what I see in the Bible. I don’t even begin to understand Revelation. To me the whole thing is gibberish and I could be totally wrong and I don’t mind being corrected if I am wrong too.
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anonymous says:
July 17, 2015 at 3:36 am
Hi Gem. I got out my Bible and reread those scriptures again last night too. Rev. 16:14 tells about the war of God and then Rev. 16:16 tells how all the kings were gathered at a place called Har-magedon. So I looked it up in the Insight Book #1 and it says it is “associated” with the war mentioned at Rev. 16:14 but it still doesn’t call it the “war of Armageddon”. It would be like if the U.S. had a war in New York during the Civil War, you wouldn’t call it the New York War, you would call it the Civil War. So, actually when people think of the “war of Armageddon”, they have it wrong. It is just “associated” with the war mentioned in Rev. 16:14 but if you look up war in the Concordance, it’s used nine times in Revelation. So, it’s just an assumption that Armageddon is just a war and then the war in Rev. 20:8 is a slaughter. I think they are both slaughters but Har-magedon is still just a place and not a war. Do you catch my drift?
I think the person who wrote Revelation was on drugs or drunk and suffering from hallucinations. That is my person opinion because no matter how much I try to make sense of that book, I can’t and I don’t think the Society has a clue either. They just pretend like they got some “inside” info on it.
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GEM says:
July 17, 2015 at 1:38 pm
Patmos is famous for its Magic Mushrooms, Anonymous. I can accept that John may well have been under the influence at the time. :)
Still can’t see how you have arrived that Armageddon is an event that takes place after the said 1000 years.
I scratch my head as to why the Good God above would want to write such ambiguous gibberish, when he could just have penned it all in plain language.
John must have had one helluva trip, man!
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anonymous says:
July 18, 2015 at 3:10 pm
Gem, I truly believe that whoever wrote Revelation was on something and magic mushrooms came to my mind too. Just looking at Revelation 9:1-11 seems like nothing but drug-induced hallucinations where it talks about how John saw a star fall from heaven and and the key to the pit of the abyss was given to it and he (star) opened the pit of the abyss and smoke came out of the abyss and out of the smoke came locusts and the locusts resembled horses prepared for battle and they had women’s hair and faces and had crowns of gold on their heads and these locusts had what looked like iron breastplates and their wings sounded like chariots of many horses running into battle and they had over their head the angel of the abyss and his name was Apollyon or Abaddon. If just that one scripture doesn’t sound like a hallucination, I don’t know what does.
There are two ways of examining the Bible, exegesis or eisegesis.
Exegesis is the exposition or explanation of a text based on a careful, objective analysis. It means literally to lead out of. That means that the interpreter is led to his conclusions by following the text.
The opposite approach to Scriptures is eisegesis, which is the interpretation of a passage based on a subjective, non-analytical reading. The word eisegesis literally means to lead into which means that the interpreter injects his own ideas into the text, making it mean whatever he wants.
Obviously only exegesis does justice to the text. Eisegesis can lead to a misinterpretation but exegesis is concerned with discovering the true meaning of the text, only being concerned with making a point, even if it is at the expense of the meaning of the words.
So, I am using Watchtower’s words here when it comes to what it says about Har-mageddon (Armageddon). If we were to go only on what Revelation actually says, we would take it literally and would think the Bible writer was on drugs.
Most Bible believers, believe Revelation came from God and it went through an angel to John and he wrote it down as a prophecy for our time or at least a future time from when John was alive and he was not some drug-induced hallucination.
So, if we use the Watchtower’s eisegesis explanation of Revelation in the publication “Insight on the Scriptures” volume 1, under Har-mageddon on pages 1037-1038, it says that Har-mageddon is not a literal place but a “condition or situation” to which the kings of the earth are gathered in opposition to Jehovah and is a “fight” where God’s invisible armies take part.
Har-mageddon is only mentioned at Rev. 16:16. From Rev. 16 to Rev. 19, the Bible is describing the fall and final destruction of Babylon the great and then at the end of Rev. 19 is where it talks about the war with the one seated on the white horse and the armies in heaven etc. and the birds eating the dead and the wild beast and the kings of the earth all being thrown into the lake of fire and sulphur and verse 20 says “and the wild beast was caught, and along with it the false prophet that performed in front of it the signs with which he misled those who received the mark of the wild beast and those who render worship to its image. While still alive, they both were hurled into the fiery lake that burns with sulphur. But the rest were killed off with the long sword of the one seated on the horse, which sword proceeded out of his mouth. And all the birds were filled from the fleshy parts of them.”
Then Chapter 20 tells about an angel coming down out of heaven with the key of the abyss and he seized the Devil and bound him for 1,000 years and then when the 1,000 years had ended, Satan is let go to mislead the nations again and the final war is at Rev. 20:9 where it says: “And they advanced over the breadth of the earth and encircled the camp of the holy ones and the beloved city. But fire came down out of heaven and devoured them.”
So, either fire devoured the holy ones or it devoured anybody on Satan’s side who is fighting against the kingdom rule.
So, the Bible talks about two wars. The Bible doesn’t say the war of Armageddon. It’s simply God’s war at Rev. 16:14 and the 2nd war is also God’s war.
The word Har-mageddon simply means a condition. It doesn’t mean total destruction, like what most people think of (not Witnesses though). It is simply the first war and the 2nd war is final destruction.
Both wars are all the people against God and so are situations and could both be considered Har-magaddons, that is if you were to take the eisegesis approach to interpreting the Bible which is subjective and means that the interpreter can put any meaning into the scriptures that he wants to.
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anonymous says:
July 20, 2015 at 6:39 am
Upon reading Revelation in chapter 21, you can see that the 2nd Har-mageddon isn’t a total destruction either. This is talking about how after the 1,000 years when Satan has been abyssed and let out and he again misleads the nations and fire comes down and burns them all and Satan is thrown into the lake of fire…. Rev. 21 is talking about after that.
Rev. 21:24-27 reads: “And the nations will walk by means of its light, and the kings of the earth will bring their glory into it. And its gates will not be closed at all by day, for night will not exist there. And they will bring the glory and the honor of the nations into it. But anything not sacred and anyone that carries on a disgusting thing and a lie will in no way enter into it, only those written in the Lamb’s scroll of life will.”
I told my husband this morning that I want to understand Revelation so well that if anybody talks about it, I will know what I am talking about and nobody will be able to “talk over me” when it comes to Revelation so I study it a lot. In fact I am obsessed about it. That is the extent that I want to know what it says so nobody can talk “over my head” about it.
So this morning I was telling him that I saw a scripture in there last night that had gone over my head before and I brought it up like this: “Last night I saw a scripture in Revelation that I had never before paid any attention to and I can’t figure out how I never noticed it before. It tells about after the 1,000 years and after the 2nd Armageddon and it talks about kings of the earth and nations etc.
So then I showed these scriptures to my husband and his explanation is that the Bible must not be in Chronological order. That was his answer. So then I said he was speculating.
How we got into this discussion is that he said yesterday at the Watchtower, it was saying how Witnesses are now to talk about what they are going to do in the new world and I said it sounds like what they were really saying then is that in order not to be depressed about what their lives are now, they are supposed to think and talk about what it will be like in the new world. Of course, I was all wrong about that, according to him. The Society would never do that as their lives are just so happy now. But then if their lives are so happy now, why would they have to daydream about the new world????
Ted says:
July 16, 2015 at 12:14 pm
The structure of both these organisations, along with their
Internet broadcasting stations, reeks of brash commercialism.
When you finally get rid of the cult blinkers, you realise this is
exactly what they are, hucksters selling an illusion a mirage
ie, “Religion” .
It’s the oldest game in the world. The other one comes second.
Reply
anonymous says:
July 17, 2015 at 3:46 am
Leah Remini has a reality show on TLC and her 2nd season opener two nights ago, was called “Leaving Scientology” and it was as if she was describing leaving Jehovah’s Witnesses. If any of you can watch that show and have people in your family watch that show, there is no way that they can’t see how much the same the two religions are, especially when it comes to disfellowshipping.
The reason Leah decided to leave the religion was because of her daughter. She knew that the religion came before family and that when the daughter got older, her loyalty would be to the religion over and above her family and she couldn’t stand the idea.
Her husband, mother, step-father, sister and brother-in-law left the religion when she did because she chose to speak out about it and so she was labeled a subversive and nobody was to speak to her from then on and her family couldn’t do that since they are such a close family.
They had a session with a therapist as a family and they all talked about leaving and were actually glad that Leah left because it helped them to see that they had all belonged to a damaging cult and didn’t realize it until they had left. Leah’s brother-in-law described how his father threw him away like throwing away an old tee shirt.
It was so much like the Watchtower religion and if you can get your family to watch it, it might help them to see Watchtower is no different than Scientology.
Reply
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Is Watchtower imploding? 10 reasons why the end could be nigh
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Posted on July 17, 2015
Are we witnessing the beginning of the end for Watchtower?
Are we witnessing the beginning of the end for Watchtower?
For many current and former Jehovah’s Witnesses who find themselves victimized by Watchtower’s cruel cult-like practices, the prospect of witnessing the end of the organization seems too good to be true.
Especially when you have spent many years being sold false promises of extraordinary future events, it’s understandable that you would be wary of getting your hopes up over something as significant as the downfall of the organization that misled you.
I obviously won’t make you any promises, because I have learned to be extremely cautious of wishful thinking in all its forms. But when I look at what is going on with Watchtower, I see an organization falling from grace at a rate faster than I could have ever reasonably envisaged.
The latest evidence of the organization’s free-fall comes in the shape of a letter to all elders in the United States branch territory, dated July 8, 2015. You can read about Watchtower’s new “master plan” yourself, but essentially it adds a further caveat to their smash-and-grab, stealth-tithing maneuvers from last year. (Thanks go to JWleaks.org for first making this letter available.)*
The new letter essentially says to publishers (or doesn’t say to publishers, because it’s an elders-only letter): “Not only are we going to make you promise to send us money every month for maintaining a kingdom hall that isn’t owned by you in any meaningful sense, we are also warning you that we might sell your kingdom hall, pocket the proceeds, and send you to go share someone else’s kingdom hall while STILL taking your money for the kingdom hall we’ve just sold.”
Rather than write an exhaustive summary of the letter, and re-hash points I have already made on this matter from previous articles, I thought I would take a different approach by adding this latest development to my list of 10 reasons why I believe Watchtower COULD be about to implode. Here goes…
1. Jehovah’s Witnesses are becoming a toxic brand
toxic-brand
The internet is more hostile than ever regarding Jehovah’s Witnesses. As the world becomes more aware of the cult phenomenon (thanks in part to the success of documentaries like HBO’s “Going Clear” film about Scientology) journalists are becoming less squeamish when it comes to highlighting the cult-attributes of the organization in newspaper articles and news broadcasts.
Ex-Witnesses have already turned YouTube into a no-go zone for believing Witnesses, and continue to explore ingenious strategies for reaching out to those under Watchtower’s spell. Even non-Witness blogs like Hemant Mehta’s Friendly Atheist are now rallying to the ex-JW cause and becoming increasingly vocal about the organization’s harmful practices. All this means it is harder than ever for Witnesses to find new converts, and easier than ever for Witnesses to wake up.
2. Less “spiritual food” is being printed
spiritual-food
The wafer-thin magazines on the literature carts testify to a huge drop in printed output of 39% for monthly magazine printing since 2005. If God’s one true organization is flourishing, why has it so drastically scaled down on its “spiritual food?” The simple truth is, printing is expensive. VERY expensive. A good gauge of prosperity for any printing organization is its printed output. If a printing company has a problem, it will print less stuff. That is exactly what we have already been seeing for some time with Watchtower.
3. Globally, the organization is in retreat
retreat
Watchtower has been shutting down branches at a rate never before seen, with branch numbers plummeting from 118 in 2009 to just 90 as of last year. The organization used to pride itself on its global footprint, and would herald the dedication of new branches as evidence of God’s backing for the global preaching work. Now Watchtower is in open retreat, using single branches to run the affairs of multiple countries. RTOs, or “Remote Translation Offices” (think of an RTO as a Bethel-lite), are seen as a way of keeping some kind of presence in far-flung territories, but the glory days of Watchtower’s relentless global expansion are fast disappearing in the rear view mirror.
4. The begging has started
begging
For the first time in the organization’s history, the Governing Body openly admitted to a shortfall in needed funds in the May 2015 JW Broadcasting episode. This unprecedented move was made despite Watchtower making 1 Billion from selling off its Brooklyn portfolio ($375 million in one transaction alone), which could indicate the Brooklyn proceeds have already been spent. After all, when there is zero accounting transparency, we have no way of knowing how indebted the organization is. No amount of revenue from property sales will be much use to Watchtower if it is all getting sucked into a bottomless pit of accumulated debt.
5. The stealth tithing has started
tithing
Expect an organization in financial peril to desperately claw around for ways of bringing in more cash from available assets. In Watchtower’s case, they are prevented from demanding money from individual members, because this would be classed as “tithing” – a practice associated with false religion that the organization has condemned since its inception. What Watchtower CAN do is tithe, not individuals, but congregations. This is precisely what the new “Local Design/Construction” arrangement has achieved.
Last year elders were forced to promise a fixed amount to be donated to Watchtower every month from their congregation account, based on (1) what the congregation was already sending for paying off a building/renovation loan, or (2) anonymous slips of paper passed around so that publishers could indicate what they could afford to pledge. Congregations were even told to send any surplus funds squirreled away for a rainy day to Watchtower, leaving just $5,000 plus three months’ worth of regular operating expenses.
Amazingly, the majority of Witnesses continue to be oblivious to what amounts to a smash-and-grab, and are instead under the assumption that Watchtower has mercifully forgiven all kingdom hall building loans.
6. Kingdom hall ‘mergers’ are in store
fuel-in-car
As already mentioned, Watchtower has instructed all United States elders as of July 8, 2015 to be ready for their congregation to be re-assigned to a different kingdom hall if the organization’s new “master plan” deems this necessary. The letter marks the green light for the downsizing we are already seeing at branch level to be soon rolled out at congregation level, and is again clear evidence that Watchtower is desperate to claw in money wherever it can and become a smaller, more financially nimble organization.
The end game would be kingdom hall multiplexes in city-center locations shared by five or more congregations – a far cry from the parochial feel older Witnesses will be accustomed to.
As delightful as it is to think of such a huge regression in the local presence of the organization, you can’t help but feel bad for all those long-standing Witnesses who have donated thousands over the years under the false assumption that they were responsible for their local kingdom hall’s upkeep. Soon, for all their kindness and generosity, such ones may face lengthy and costly car journeys to intimidating, soulless, inconvenient city-center locations allocated to them by Watchtower.
7. Personnel are being jettisoned
kicked-out
Last year district overseers received the unwelcome news that their positions no longer existed, and they were surplus to requirements. Though some will have been demoted down to circuit overseer rank, the majority will have been jettisoned by the organization to fend for themselves – an entire strata of the organization’s hierarchy dissolved, and deemed no longer serviceable or cost-effective.
In a similarly unceremonious manner, workers at branch offices subject to closure by Watchtower have been cast adrift, with years or even decades of loyal service apparently counting for very little in the organization’s quest to make ends meet. The recently-emerged story of a Wallkill bethelite who was virtually thrown out on the street due to “cutbacks” suggests that the organization’s top brass have no qualms when it comes to wielding the axe. Bethelites in Watchtower’s heartland would do well to watch their backs and plan for the worst as the organization looks to slash spending wherever it can.
8. The secret weapons have failed
secret-weapon
Despite all the fanfare and hype, JW.org has been unable to attract internet-savvy non-Witnesses – its main target audience. It is, quite literally, preaching to the converted. The 2015 Yearbook boasted that JW.org received 850,000,000+ total visits in the first two years from Aug 27, 2012 to Aug 31, 2014. This figure sounds impressive until you factor in the number of Jehovah’s Witnesses – 8 million. Assuming every active Witness visits their own website at least once per week, you arrive at only a slightly lower figure of 832,000,000 visits over the two years (8,000,000 x 52 x 2).
And despite succeeding in making the organization more visible, there has been no notable increase in baptisms in the two years since the literature carts (or “metropolitan witnessing”) program was launched. After all, getting literature into someone’s hands won’t stop them going on the internet and fact-checking when they get home. And that’s assuming anyone is interested in approaching the carts to begin with. In this Guardian article, the reporter watched some carts in a busy part of London for an hour, and the only person who approached the Witnesses did so because they needed directions.
9. The child abuse floodgates have opened
flood
As was predicted at the time, there has been a relentless stream of child abuse lawsuits filed against Watchtower since the 2012 Candace Conti verdict. In 2013, a year on from the Conti judgment, lawyer Irwin Zalkin told me he had no less than 11 lawsuits on his books. Though many such lawsuits end up being settled, the success of the Jose Lopez case and the recent victory in London’s High Court have shown that if child abuse victims are willing to dig their heels in and stay the course they can have, not only compensation, but justice served.
All of this doesn’t bode well for an organization already under fire for its cult-like shunning practices and death-dealing prohibitions on blood transfusions. And apart from the atrocious reputation, with well-informed journalists like Trey Bundy spelling out the problems of organizational mishandling in the media, the money for paying off multi-million judgments and out-of-court settlements has to come from somewhere.
Even if the Governing Body sent a long-overdue letter out tomorrow FINALLY telling elders to report all child abuse accusations straight to the police, Watchtower would still have to answer to the backlog of lawsuits from victims who suffered while the two-witness rule was (is) still in place. Such victims may well have only a finite window of opportunity to get ANY money out of Watchtower at all.
10. Watchtower doesn’t have a PR strategy
head-in-sand
You’re an international, faith-based non-profit organization with a toxic brand both on the internet and in the media. Fewer people from wealthy, developed countries with internet are joining you, and thus donations are dwindling. For all the evangelizing and promotional work of your members, a few clicks on Google can completely dismantle your organization’s message. To make matters worse, you have mounting legal costs and settlements to pay for out of an ever-diminishing revenue stream. What you urgently need is a good PR strategy to make it easier to bring in fresh converts (and their donations) – but even here Watchtower is almost comically inept.
The organization’s PR strategy is essentially two-fold: (1) bury your head in the sand and hope your opposers eventually get bored and go away, or (2) refute the claims made by your opposers using outright lies (*cough* Rick Fenton). Both of these methods may help the likes of Tony Morris get to sleep at night in the short-term, but ultimately they are self-defeating. To neutral observers, silence is incriminating when damning allegations are on the table – especially related to harming children. And when you flat out lie about your damaging policies and teachings, you only give critics like me more rope to hang you with.
The only workable strategy Watchtower can pursue at this stage is one of reform, but past experience shows that any form of “compromise” is seen by the Governing Body as capitulation to Satan’s hordes. In short, Watchtower is sinking because its deluded leaders are their own worst enemies.
What does the future hold?
I do not for one moment suggest that we will see an end to Jehovah’s Witnesses as a religion in our lifetimes. The fact that there continues to be such a thing as the bible students, who still cling to Charles Taze Russell and his discredited, outlandish teachings, tells us that religions have amazing survival abilities even when members are deprived of their leadership. Faith, after all, is a product of people’s minds. When enough people believe the same unsubstantiated thing you have a religion, regardless of whether there is a person or organization to lead it.
But while religions are virtually indestructible, corporations are not. Non-profit organizations like Watchtower are just as capable of getting into debt as any other business. And when your bank manager starts bankruptcy proceedings against you because you can no longer service your debts, it’s game over.
The organization's glory days are already behind it
The organization’s glory days are already behind it
Those who suggest Watchtower is too big and successful to go down need only look at the fact that it has already been shrinking since it reached its zenith (in terms of branches and printing operations) some time between 2005 and 2010. Add to that the desperate clawing for cash over the five years since then, and you have the omens of an organizational collapse.
The winds of change have completely overtaken Watchtower in the internet age, and the Governing Body find themselves in a whole different ball game to their predecessors. If things are really as bad as I suspect, Watchtower needs to drastically downscale its operations to, say, a handful of branches and zero printing. In other words, it needs to become like its noisy neighbor Scientology, which despite having only 50,000-or-so members (and an even worse reputation) still has an impressive portfolio of valuable property scattered across the globe and minimal overheads compared to Watchtower.
But any downsizing of that magnitude would send Watchtower into an even more vicious spiral, in which it would start hemorrhaging even the most diehard members. After all, when you have spent decades pointing to your success as evidence of divine backing, how do you explain any sudden, sharp decline?
If Watchtower were to go bankrupt, it could always try claiming that the Great Tribulation has begun and Satan’s minions (their creditors) have started overtly attacking God’s people, but this simply will not wash with more intelligent Witnesses. Whatever is left of the organization (perhaps re-branded to ditch the Watchtower name entirely while retaining the Governing Body at the helm) would have a huge exodus on its hands.
It is precisely because of all the pride at stake that, in my mind, a sudden implosion seems increasingly plausible. Unlike ordinary commercial organizations who have the flexibility to change their size and scope according to the prevailing conditions, “God’s organization” can only be seen by its members to be going in an upwards trajectory for its grandiose claims of divine direction to have any credence. Any noticeable regression would rightly be interpreted as evidence of God’s favor being absent. Thus any problems would be allowed to accumulate behind closed doors until they reach a critical mass.
Of course I could be wrong, but if that is so then Watchtower is doing an awful lot of begging and downsizing for no particular reason, and with far too much to lose by doing so. It could well be that some incredible developments are ahead as Watchtower’s predicament further deteriorates, and the Governing Body slowly discovers that Jehovah isn’t coming to the rescue after all. I had better get on with writing my book while there is still an organization to write about.
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Translations: Spanish | French
Further reading…
◾JWsurvey articles on Watchtower downsizing
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74 Responses to Is Watchtower imploding? 10 reasons why the end could be nigh
Newer Comments →
Gareth says:
July 17, 2015 at 9:27 am
Haha that last sentence begs the question: would you be happy or unhappy if your book would be obsolete before it being published? 😀 Although I think it would be useful anyway, even if only for history reasons.
Reply
StrongHaiku says:
July 17, 2015 at 9:47 am
Really enjoyed the article, Cedars. You made my day.
You mention the following:
“If Watchtower were to go bankrupt, it could always try claiming that the Great Tribulation has begun and Satan’s minions (their creditors) have started overtly attacking God’s people, but this simply will not wash with more intelligent Witnesses. ”
You make a very good point. Claiming the GT has begun may be one of the few plays they have left, but it is a very dangerous one. If they say the “GT has begun” in order to explain what is going on, this will likely start the clock ticking in the head of some of the members. I sure hope they become desperate enough to put a “stake on the ground” and commit to an event/date.
I cannot see how they can maintain the status quo and remain vague and uncommitted to an event/date forever and recover (let alone grow). Without a clear target people start loosing their sense of urgency, wake up, etc.
If past history is any indication, what I imagine they may do is “imply” that that GT has started without stating overtly to leave themselves plausible deniability (akin to the 1975 fiasco).
Regardless, as an apocalyptic religion, they have a limited number of choices and shelf-life. And, even though many will stay with it past the “expiration date” (like my family), it may wake up at least some.
Reply
Kat says:
July 17, 2015 at 10:06 am
Inspiring!
One can only hope this is the beginning of the end for the WT org and its GB.
Reply
David says:
July 17, 2015 at 10:13 am
I think the WatchTower hasn’t got any economic problem. For managing assets they are masters. They have the best advisers and the american rich JWs pump lots of money in.
They have instead membership problems. I don’t think more people want to give up freedom for a cult with inhuman practices (like shunning).
Lies won’t last forever so one day they have to face reality but it will take time. Cults have a difficult time to realise what they truly are.
Reply
peggy says:
July 19, 2015 at 10:29 am
This is a good point David, maybe not economic problems but, membership problems. Which eventually could spell economic problems. About 4 years ago my congregation was told by the CO to split a perfectly nice large congregation into 2. We went from 150 using the nice large hall to 70 people and extra utility use when they had to open it up for the extra meetings.(I always thought the move was to make the numbers of congregations appear
to be growing when membership is stagnant. I have been gone some 2 years now. And then this letter comes out about putting congregations back together when they are not using the hall to max. I honestly believe something is up. Something is amiss. And it may mean problems. Which GB may hint is a sign of the end.
Reply
Susan says:
July 17, 2015 at 10:21 am
Great article! It’s so exciting to think that this horrible and cruel organization may one day implode! They’d shot themselves in the foot years ago when they strongly discouraged couples from having children – so think of all the ice cream money they weren’t able to extort! I imagine that many more will wake up when they are personally affected with upcoming Kingdom Hall mergers and those who are laid off at Bethel. They will experience first hand just how “loving” their organization is, and discover that JW org would rather risk losing members than losing money. Once again though, they are shooting themselves in the foot as these lost members equal lost revenue and will be another step closer to the organization’s demise.
Reply
airborne says:
July 17, 2015 at 11:09 am
I really enjoyed the article Cedars. My gut says the Watchtower ship is sinking like the Titanic. Of course all the poor Witnesses in Steerage Class are going to get screwed.
Reply
Searcher says:
July 17, 2015 at 1:24 pm
Great analogy! I think they are sinking like the titanic. Not many people believed it was sinking until it was too late to put the lifeboats out fully. Like you said, the poor steerage members of the rank and file will get left holding the bag. History always shows that in many other organization implosions.
Reply
Alone in MD says:
July 17, 2015 at 8:58 pm
I agree with you airborne. Most of the minions are very dedicated, god loving people that don’t know or care about what rules and regulations the GB come up with. My wife is one of the brainwashed minions and can’t point out anything negative about the GB. Very sad situation.
Reply
Dee says:
July 17, 2015 at 11:20 am
Thanks Cedar :) It’s comforting and affords hope to us when all of those points are gathered together like this. There isnt an “increase” in their ranks, and the annual report will be the next thing to go. A decrease in numbers will be explained away with the whole “there will be a cooling off” or “separation of the sheep and goats” or similar damage control responses. I for one appreciate so much what you do.
Reply
Grace Cowie Wilson says:
July 17, 2015 at 12:07 pm
If they decide that the great tribulation has arrived they are then free to start issuing instructions thT might not seem rational from a human viewpoint.
Another thing that intrigues me is the “no show” in the Lopez case leading to a decision for damages in the sum of $13.5 million. Clearly the WTBTSB made a pragmatic decision in this case to pay up on a default judgment against it rather than risk
(i) a precedent setting decision against it that could affect settlement prospects against it in other cases; and/or
(ii) disclosure of damning documents.
The extreme lengths litigation-wise it has gone to (including a very risky strategy which failed) to obstruct the investigation by the UK Charity Commission is also very interesting.
They may have even more to hide than we are currently aware of.
Reply
Itfeelsgoodtobefree says:
July 20, 2015 at 12:46 pm
Very well put Grace! Who knows what else they are trying to sweep under the rug…
Reply
John says:
July 17, 2015 at 12:33 pm
I find it comical that if you want to believe the prophecies in the bible, notably in Revelation, it seems that most of the ‘fulfillments’ that the WTS applied to other religions are now more applicable to them. Keep up the great stream of articles Lloyd. Good reading for a change.
Reply
doda says:
July 18, 2015 at 2:08 pm
Agreed, John! I have been thinking this very thing for quite some time. I also have to agree with the comment about the GT, implications that it is/has started. Oh to be a fly in the car of any car group in the USA and the UK!
Reply
Ken says:
July 17, 2015 at 12:36 pm
First I have talked to ex -witnesses who say that the organization today is unrecognized in its form every one says –
It’s not the same sect I grew up in .. That’s what everyone who left are saying . Most of those who left were of the so called 1914 er generation who grew up back in the 1970 and 1980s saw hundreds baptized at conventions . The decline today is obvious . It’s no getting away from that ,secondly is the constant shifting doctrines , the literature decline only means they don’t have enough educated people to write as they did back in the 1950 – 1970 era because the org was able to mass produce books , and magazines . One has to only hear Anthony Morris anti eduction rant on JW.tv . Obviously the decline is a self inflicted wound. As a teen I saw a prelude of it back during the 1980 s when the first secret elders book came out , along with how people were treated at the Kingdom Hall. The loving so called atmosphere was replaced with judge mental talks from the elders . Things were unraveling then . The future , the only way to save the Watchtower is a revolution from within , removing the entire governing body , and shift the sect back closer to the Adventist movement where it sprang.
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Carlos says:
July 17, 2015 at 1:19 pm
In Buenos Aires the Watchtower administers a huge geriatric complex. Older people sign off their pensions, property, and anything their family may inherit. Then the Watchtower promises to take care of them until they die. Knowing the Watchtower record on fulfilling promises … this is not going to end well. I imagine they will leave the country and stick the old geezers to the care of their congregations after taking everyone to the cleaners. Mark my words!
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Chris says:
July 19, 2015 at 1:15 pm
Do you have any links with info about this?
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Cedars says:
July 19, 2015 at 1:23 pm
Links are in the article. :)
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Carrie Bee says:
July 17, 2015 at 1:33 pm
Fantastic article John!!!
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Searcher says:
July 17, 2015 at 1:43 pm
Good analysis of the situation! As I said a while back, the internet and education are the GB and WTS’s worst enemy. It’s really beginning to take it’s toll on them. Why do you think they are so dead-set against higher education and having their members question what the leadership says?
The “organization” is in a tail spin, retreat, and downsize mode for now. However, don’t think they are going to go anywhere anytime soon. They will regroup as some evidence is shown. The will pull “bunnies out of the magic hat” as Dee has said earlier. There are some loons that will believe their drivel now matter what. Basically, people believe what they want to believe, even if it’s ridiculous paradise earth visions that have no logical substantiation.
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Searcher says:
July 17, 2015 at 1:47 pm
My apologies to anyone that have family members still in. I didn’t think before hitting the send button. “Loons” is not a good term, since these are loved ones to some of you out there. People are to be respected. I don’t want to lower myself to the name calling that the Watchtower has done for so many years. :/
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Bonnie says:
July 18, 2015 at 5:43 am
The people formerly known as MY family who are still in this hateful cult ARE loons. No offense taken here.
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Grace says:
July 17, 2015 at 2:36 pm
This is one of the best articles I have read.
Narcissistic, Psychopaths always find a way to survive. The top end will make sure that they have some strategy to stay afloat. Those that will stick by them will be the vulnerable who aren’t necessarily unintelligent but can’t think of a life outside of the cult.
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yawn says:
July 17, 2015 at 3:00 pm
Really hoping you are right, but in some ways I hope it lingers on. Why? I just think about all the people who would be completely devastated if it ever folds. I managed to get out in my late teens. I can’t imagine what its like for people who are farther on in years and suddenly have their one figurative crutch removed. I don’t know which is worse! I’m some ways I think they deserve it but in others I just feel bad for them. And unfortunately the men benefiting from this scam will never see justice. :(
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J*L*C*R says:
July 17, 2015 at 2:52 pm
“Down, Down, Down, in a burning ring of fire”.
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MYSELF 3.1 says:
July 17, 2015 at 3:34 pm
Dear Cedars,
Thanks for your balanced and well thought article, which got my attention as a run a management consulting firm. Here some observations.
On one side the financial issues are pretty evident, yet JW are once more proving very able to make smart business moves: they are cashing-in and reinvesting in real estate, securing and centralizing ownership of properties, ensuring constant incoming cash flow through what you described as tithing, reducing costs of printing, facility management and human resources.
They also seem to have understood the need for a re branding by pushing the jw.org logo above both Watchtower and the name Jehovah, which incidentally is quite sad because they proud themselves of being better than ancient Jewish who adopted abbreviations and replacements for The Name, and now they are doing pretty much the same hiding The Name behind jw.org… the only difference being that the scribes did it out of reverence, the WT is doing it out of shame. Still, though, a sound marketing move.
Are these good signs or bad signs? Are JW doomed or rather successfully engaging in a new strategy? It depends on what the objective is. If the purpose is to remain in existence and safeguard the comfortable life and annexed ego of few, then they might indeed succeed. This means that we will see more changes and a total re branding of the organization, to the point of making it unrecognizable from what it was. I envisage even a possible change of name, and perhaps the jw.org campaign is a prelude of this. The hard activities will gradually be eliminated, following the trend of reducing pioneering hours, convention days, magazine pages and number of meetings. The junior management will be made happy by taking away the burden of preparing talks, living them free to enjoy their role play as little managers making petty decisions. The meetings will feature just broadcast sessions, which will increase uniformity and further reduce critical skills. To be a JW will involved attending weekly shows, like going to the movies, and enjoy tiny bits of local power and strong social acceptance within the group. Altogether very appealing for right wing bigots, left wing idealist, people seeking the comfort of social acceptance, people without any secular fulfillment enjoying putting on a tie and playing to be a mini-leader, people in need of channeling their unaddressed psychological issues and conspiracy theory style folks that love the cheap elitist of knowing a secret alternative truth.
In my opinion the current organisation looks like the typical company that has good consultants but a structural inability to apply sound advice. Hence, the contradiction between sound business strategies and terrible PR, such as the rambling of the current GB members, the insistence in policies that are a total marketing disaster such as ostracism, blood issue and abuses cover ups. Who will prevail, the business wise component or the inadequacy of the leaders?
I wish to see them imploding but I think that it will take some external help and activism on the part of us former members. We need to expose the brutality of their mind control methods and their dangerousness before they implement a re-branding and before they cleverly take distance from their own history. To flood the Internet with the TATT is just one of many ways required to facilitate the implosion and I am glad to join this forum posting my first comment!
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Ted says:
July 17, 2015 at 4:19 pm
Unpalatable instructions to elders, always include some devious
phrase, to ensure their compliance.
Re- the letter regarding utilising K, Halls. Elders are appealed to
As “Spiritual Men who recognise that the K,Halls belong to JHVH.”
So the not so subtle implication is, as JHVHs Org, we can do what
the hell we like with them.
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SR says:
July 17, 2015 at 4:37 pm
I am going to start saving up for when they auction off Jehovah’s Chariot. I am going to slap an orang triangle on it’s backside and pimp it all over town.
Sadly, no matter what happens there will still be some incapable of accepting they have been tricked. David Koresh still has followers.
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Imacountrygirl says:
July 17, 2015 at 4:38 pm
Great article Cedars!
I have a sort of different take. I don’t think WT is necessarily running out of money, I think they are quietly moving the money around and putting it in safe places/accounts, sort of like squirreling it away. If it’s in a protected account, it can’t be touched by lawsuits. I think they are attempting to get as much money from the pubs as they can while they can. Now that they have taken over ownership of all those KH’s, it would seem WT is about as wealthy as they have ever been, imho.
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John Plummer says:
July 17, 2015 at 4:41 pm
Great article…except such pessimism re the life expectancy of the Watchtower Society. Don’t forget, THE driving force for ordinary Witnesses is the imminence of Armageddon, and when exactly is that coming? Before the generation that overlaps the generation that witnessed the year 1914 passes away. And who said this? Jehovah God, in His, “increased light”- information transmitted directly between God and the Governing Body and reported in the April 15, 2010 Watchtower. When “increased light” is proven to be false it can’t be dismissed as “speculation” by “Jehovah’s people” or blamed on “over enthusiasm” by Watchtower writers… when the “overlapping generation” passes away (with no sign of Armageddon, of course) Witnesses will be left with the stark choice: either Jehovah lied or the Governing Body lied. Either way, the religion is screwed! How ironic for the Watchtower Society – they are about to be annihilated in a corporate Armageddon!
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Queen Elsa says:
July 19, 2015 at 10:48 pm
, I couldn’t agree that
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Queen Elsa says:
July 19, 2015 at 10:48 pm
More
Reply
Ted says:
July 17, 2015 at 5:03 pm
Great read Cedars. Who says there’s not much good news
these days.? can’t think who they might be!
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Mama Joy says:
July 17, 2015 at 5:55 pm
Do you have a copy of the elders letter?
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Gareth says:
July 17, 2015 at 11:54 pm
@Mama Joy, there is a link in the article: “letter to all elders…” is the link.
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Mike Morris says:
July 17, 2015 at 11:28 pm
I think that the organization is mirroring what is happening to Christianity generally, and will be left with an ageing membership that will decline over the years. All the points made in the article will have an impact of course. Particularly the effect of the internet and sites like this one.
Reply
sally1914 says:
July 18, 2015 at 1:23 am
Wow! I think this is your best article ever! SO encouraging! I thought I was getting my hopes up, and was trying not to, then I read this article. Your points are dead on accurate, watchtower surely seems to be hurting financially! It’s so exciting to think that this horrible and cruel organization will one day implode!
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Bonnie says:
July 18, 2015 at 5:38 am
One can only hope. However, even if there was a mass exodus, there is always a handy scripture from the J Dub Translation to explain it. “The love of the greater number cooling off” comes to mind. They have scriptures to explain everything away.
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MrFair says:
July 18, 2015 at 6:08 am
Great article! As far as printing operations are concerned, there is a HUGE amount of waste. Kingdom Halls almost always have a massive stockpile of old magazines in the attic, basement, etc. The publishers have loads of them laying around their house, garage and cars. My neighbor, who is a special pioneer, cleans out his car trunk monthly and inevitably ends up with a large box of unused and now damaged literature. He burns it in a fire pit to avoid the embarrassment of it all being dumped at the recycling center. At some point they will catch on and reduce the printing amounts. I would have done it years ago. They did at one point ask for publishers to bring back any undamaged, placeable literature to the hall. Now what are we going to do with this box of “Truth” books and Awake! Magazines about the dinosaurs? The whole thing is an absolute circus when the spell breaks and you see it for what it is. I hope they do declare bankruptcy someday, morally, spiritually and financially.
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Braveheart says:
July 18, 2015 at 7:13 am
Wholeheartedly agree with the sentiments Cedars, but for a different speculative reason. As you say, because of the Org’s financial secrecy, we can only guess at what is really happening within the Org’s chambers.
My take: the money grab, followed rapidly by the promise/threat to merge congregations, (not to SHARE a KH) has been too dramatic to even think that this is a CHOSEN course. I’d suggest that the Org has been forced into such unheard of, draconian action because of the 2008 financial collapse. Its investments & hedge fund speculations have collapsed big-time and exposed them to bankruptcy, thus demanding such punitive measures on congregations.
The flock could never be told that their beloved Org almost gambled away “God’s earthly organization.”
Reply
John Z says:
July 18, 2015 at 8:57 am
I am no trend setter. For my wife and who were very devout mid thirties born in jws. Now facing shunning and dfing I’m not alone many are waking up! I hope the org crashes and burns!
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James Broughton says:
July 18, 2015 at 10:47 am
A well-written article, worthy of being produced in the form of a tract. Just as in the 1930s there could be a new movement with a new title rising out of the ashes but it will be full of the old heresies and bad practices that will continue to dupe unsuspecting people.
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Ted says:
July 18, 2015 at 11:06 am
The WT, often bragged about the millions of mags, it distributed,
but how many were actually placed with the public, and how many
we’re junked? MrFair’s comment is so true.
I more often than not had difficulty placing my quota, in fact
sometimes I came back with more mags, than I went out with.
Making back calls on previous placements, the h,holder would
come to the door and thrust the literature back at me, saying
“I don’t want this rubbish in the house.”
And the hard backed books, you’d carry them about for weeks
then end up throwing them in the junk cupboard.
The con, here was that you paid up front this stuff, you didn’t get
it on a “Sale or return basis” , so it was a no lose system,”For them”.
I worked for a company, selling brushes, and polish, they used
the same no lose method. You’d pay in advance for what you
needed to fill your orders, then some of the customers would
change their mind. So instead of wages to feed the kids, you
we’re left with several toilet brushes, and a few tins of floor
polish. ( it’s a good job my kids were not fussy eaters. )
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JJ says:
July 18, 2015 at 12:35 pm
I hope you’re right!!! It would solve so many of my problems if this stupid cult would crash-and-burn.
It would be fun to watch, and maybe even be a part of taking down this huge, vicious group of deluded men. Then finally seeing my wife and children freed, not to mention many other friends and family members.
For sure, without a doubt, JW.Org-land is going through some serious problems. Let’s see if they can reinvent themselves? I doubt it. Will some people stay in to the end??? Yes, some will. I think the vast majority will slowly slip away like cowards on a battlefield. They won’t talk about it and they will deny that they ever really believed it. The old hard-arses will not know what hit them as they see their “flock” get smaller and smaller every month.
It will be fun to gloat!!!
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Paola says:
July 18, 2015 at 3:03 pm
Very well written Lloyd. It is very sad to see how blind people can choose to be even when you try to share and just get them to ask questions from their organization. Love that last line! I’ll be in line to get your book. :)
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Wanderer says:
July 18, 2015 at 4:25 pm
I can’t see them going broke. They have sold off their Brooklyn assets, they are ramping up on donations and they get their Kingdom Halls built at construction materials only prices paid for by the R&F and sold off at any time by the Society. They would be one of the only religions that don’t have any charity expenditure.
I can’t see how they can lose with that business model.
Reply
jakemon75 says:
July 18, 2015 at 4:53 pm
Nice work. Your recent pieces have been especially good! Please keep finding the time to put these together.
Reply
Ned Holcomb says:
July 18, 2015 at 8:59 pm
This is my first comment on a site like this but your thoughts on the org’s finances made me think of another problem they may be having. The practice of shunning ones children caused many to send their estates to the Borg when they died. Why give it to those awful kids who left Jehovah when you can send it to God himself.
Many of us who spent our life in this money hungry religion have no inheritance to give to anyone because of “putting God first” and not getting a career and not planning for retirement.
It would be nice to see them as broke as many of us are as a result of there horrible advice and false prophecies.
I think though that so many are so terrified of these men’s threats of destruction of those who oppose them that they will stay and support them no matter how bad they get because ” where do we go away to” is so instilled in there heads.
I did love your thoughts and hope it happens.
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Tim says:
July 18, 2015 at 11:26 pm
Great article and very perseptive. In each congregation there are real die hard believers who feel in their hearts god speaks via the governing body. Seeing GB members speak on their own TV channel is akin to seeing god speak. For this audience JW can do no wrong.
I think imploding is a long way off. What is more likely is a reduction in active membership to core believers and lots of fear inducing talks, Watchtower study articles to make core believers get the faders and stragglers onside. My wife, not very active, is impressed with videos shown at mid week meetings. This is evidence, she and others believes, that god is modernising the organisation.
On a completely different note, how many kingdom halls have windows? Any other public building without windows would make people dubious.
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Idontknowhatodo says:
July 19, 2015 at 2:17 am
I find myself hungrily devouring every word you write because finally after a lifetime of being duped I have woken up….I always had times of periodic doubt but suppressed it because of various avenues of indoctrinated fear…I reg pioneered on many occasions…but over the last two years and especially since the monthly broadcasts on jw.org Ihave seen what I and my parents and siblings have dedicated our life to…an evil lie…now I am to old at 57 to build a life that can give me financial and personal fullfillment satisfaction…the opportunities I have tossed aside because of the direction of the organization…ones that would have meant such a happy and satisfying life…Im sick at heart…I am so in love with my spouse but they are totally duped and will listen to no reason or any argument against the organization…and would report me to the congregational elders ‘for my own good’ if thought needed…Im petrified of shunning because my whole family and all my friends are witnesses and I would be so alone…though sometimes I feel alone in a sea of people…in one way I have such relief…I no longer believe in God or a Devil..but I am utterly depressed because the best years of my life are gone…how can they do this to people?
Reply
Excelsior! says:
July 19, 2015 at 6:04 am
Idontknow…,
I am truly sorry for your situation. I hope that the WTBTS implodes soon, but I think it will be around for a good while yet in some form.
If I were in your situation, I would try to see my “theocratic” responsibilities as a role I had to play. What is the minimum you can do and still be “in good standing” in your situation? Find that level, and try to average around that. Another good tip is to use good old cheap words to your advantage. A few hearty “Isn’t Jehovah God’s spirit-directed Organisation wonderful?!”s and other similar statements will help convince the elders that you are in the fold.
I would reccomend reading the “Shepherding the Flock of God” elders text book. It is a cheat sheet for just what the elders will be looking for and knowledge is potential power for you to play them at their own game.
It’s a wretched situation, but these tips will hopefully help you. The only place where any human being can possibly be free is within their own minds. You are free, but your loved ones are sadly not.
These tips are how I would tackle this tragic situation. They may not work for you, but they may be of help to you. They come from a genuine feeling of compassion for you, and all those who face this awful dilemma.
All the best to you and your family.
Peace be with you, Excelsior!
Reply
Idontknowhatodo says:
July 19, 2015 at 7:10 am
Thank you Excelsior
Its great that your advice comes from a sincere place and not a ‘words by rote’ mindset…
I think I will follow your advice for the near future and though Im no spring chicken try and alongsode it create a life for myself…
My loved ones are for the moment imprisoned…
Im happy my mind is not…
Thank you for bringing that to my attention..
Peace be with you also
Reply
peggy says:
July 19, 2015 at 6:13 pm
Idontknow….I am 54 and recently told my family I am inactive. It took a long time to do it. I gradually woke up. My mind belongs to me now and that is more valuable than anything. The tips given to do as little and say the right “theocratic lines” helped me as I was leaving. I was angry the best years of my life were wasted, too. But, many new opportunities await. We can make it happen. It is funny , but the first thing I stopped doing was contributing money. It felt great.
Reply
Searcher says:
July 20, 2015 at 10:03 am
@Idontknowhatodo
I really feel for your situation and it is touching. Don’t feel that all is lost. You now have your own mind and no one, not even the JW organization can take that from you. Of all things that Nazi concentration camp victims said: They would say that the Nazi’s could take their freedom, but not the freedom of their mind. You can rebuild yourself and move on even at 57, just not as some in greater society would think. You are free in your mind and that is something to be proud of, because freedom isn’t free.
Reply
Gameisover says:
July 19, 2015 at 2:42 am
Thank you for a superb article, Cedars. You’ve said it all, and so well. I know many “friends” who still attend meetings for the love of their families. The great silent revenge is they have stopped contributing completely.
They also write 1or 2 hours in their monthly report so as not to be considered inactive. How sad to have to resort
to those strategies in order to conserve ones family and friends! (The number is legion).
Reply
Idontknowhatodo says:
July 19, 2015 at 3:20 am
Really…is it that many?
Im not alone then
Thank You
Reply
Alicia says:
July 20, 2015 at 11:20 am
I was baptized at 13, was contacted at 25 by Jon Mitchell, a friend at Brooklyn Bethel, regarding the shake up involving Raymond Franz and others (didn’t listen), and finally, at 50 and unhappy, I read Crisis of Conscience and In Search of Christian Freedom (became inactive).
That was 10 years ago. I just read “Exiting the JW Cult: A Healing Handbook for Current and Former Jehovah’s Witnesses” by Bonnie Zieman. I can’t recommend it highly enough. I wish I had this info when I was young enough to make a real life outside JW.org. But whatever time I have left can be better. All’s well that ends well.
Reply
Queen Elsa says:
July 19, 2015 at 11:01 pm
Yep, me too!
Reply
anonymous says:
July 19, 2015 at 3:41 am
When you read between the lines of that letter to the elders, you can see the Society is losing ground but true believers will see that it’s a smart move to close down Kingdom Halls where attendance is low and drive to distant Kingdom Halls.
What the rank and file don’t see is that the Society will get the money from these fire sales and sock it away in their off-shore accounts where nobody can get their hands on it or they will reinvest it in more and more property.
What I also foresee, is faders and old people dropping out when they have to start driving long distances to their new Kingdom Halls and having to pay for the gas and getting home so late. I think it will be a good excuse for the faders and doubters and old people and people with young children to stop going and with fewer and fewer people attending, it will be more and more discouraging for those attending and then as the old ones die off and the younger set going on the internet and seeing the “truth” for what it really is, I see it dying off in maybe 20-30 years. By that time, the Governing Body will be all dead but the Watchtower corporations will be the richest organizations on the earth with the sale of all their Kingdom Halls and assembly halls and branches.
Reply
JWIntellect says:
July 19, 2015 at 5:34 am
Superb article!
Reply
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Is Watchtower imploding? 10 reasons why the end could be nigh
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Posted on July 17, 2015
Are we witnessing the beginning of the end for Watchtower?
Are we witnessing the beginning of the end for Watchtower?
For many current and former Jehovah’s Witnesses who find themselves victimized by Watchtower’s cruel cult-like practices, the prospect of witnessing the end of the organization seems too good to be true.
Especially when you have spent many years being sold false promises of extraordinary future events, it’s understandable that you would be wary of getting your hopes up over something as significant as the downfall of the organization that misled you.
I obviously won’t make you any promises, because I have learned to be extremely cautious of wishful thinking in all its forms. But when I look at what is going on with Watchtower, I see an organization falling from grace at a rate faster than I could have ever reasonably envisaged.
The latest evidence of the organization’s free-fall comes in the shape of a letter to all elders in the United States branch territory, dated July 8, 2015. You can read about Watchtower’s new “master plan” yourself, but essentially it adds a further caveat to their smash-and-grab, stealth-tithing maneuvers from last year. (Thanks go to JWleaks.org for first making this letter available.)*
The new letter essentially says to publishers (or doesn’t say to publishers, because it’s an elders-only letter): “Not only are we going to make you promise to send us money every month for maintaining a kingdom hall that isn’t owned by you in any meaningful sense, we are also warning you that we might sell your kingdom hall, pocket the proceeds, and send you to go share someone else’s kingdom hall while STILL taking your money for the kingdom hall we’ve just sold.”
Rather than write an exhaustive summary of the letter, and re-hash points I have already made on this matter from previous articles, I thought I would take a different approach by adding this latest development to my list of 10 reasons why I believe Watchtower COULD be about to implode. Here goes…
1. Jehovah’s Witnesses are becoming a toxic brand
toxic-brand
The internet is more hostile than ever regarding Jehovah’s Witnesses. As the world becomes more aware of the cult phenomenon (thanks in part to the success of documentaries like HBO’s “Going Clear” film about Scientology) journalists are becoming less squeamish when it comes to highlighting the cult-attributes of the organization in newspaper articles and news broadcasts.
Ex-Witnesses have already turned YouTube into a no-go zone for believing Witnesses, and continue to explore ingenious strategies for reaching out to those under Watchtower’s spell. Even non-Witness blogs like Hemant Mehta’s Friendly Atheist are now rallying to the ex-JW cause and becoming increasingly vocal about the organization’s harmful practices. All this means it is harder than ever for Witnesses to find new converts, and easier than ever for Witnesses to wake up.
2. Less “spiritual food” is being printed
spiritual-food
The wafer-thin magazines on the literature carts testify to a huge drop in printed output of 39% for monthly magazine printing since 2005. If God’s one true organization is flourishing, why has it so drastically scaled down on its “spiritual food?” The simple truth is, printing is expensive. VERY expensive. A good gauge of prosperity for any printing organization is its printed output. If a printing company has a problem, it will print less stuff. That is exactly what we have already been seeing for some time with Watchtower.
3. Globally, the organization is in retreat
retreat
Watchtower has been shutting down branches at a rate never before seen, with branch numbers plummeting from 118 in 2009 to just 90 as of last year. The organization used to pride itself on its global footprint, and would herald the dedication of new branches as evidence of God’s backing for the global preaching work. Now Watchtower is in open retreat, using single branches to run the affairs of multiple countries. RTOs, or “Remote Translation Offices” (think of an RTO as a Bethel-lite), are seen as a way of keeping some kind of presence in far-flung territories, but the glory days of Watchtower’s relentless global expansion are fast disappearing in the rear view mirror.
4. The begging has started
begging
For the first time in the organization’s history, the Governing Body openly admitted to a shortfall in needed funds in the May 2015 JW Broadcasting episode. This unprecedented move was made despite Watchtower making 1 Billion from selling off its Brooklyn portfolio ($375 million in one transaction alone), which could indicate the Brooklyn proceeds have already been spent. After all, when there is zero accounting transparency, we have no way of knowing how indebted the organization is. No amount of revenue from property sales will be much use to Watchtower if it is all getting sucked into a bottomless pit of accumulated debt.
5. The stealth tithing has started
tithing
Expect an organization in financial peril to desperately claw around for ways of bringing in more cash from available assets. In Watchtower’s case, they are prevented from demanding money from individual members, because this would be classed as “tithing” – a practice associated with false religion that the organization has condemned since its inception. What Watchtower CAN do is tithe, not individuals, but congregations. This is precisely what the new “Local Design/Construction” arrangement has achieved.
Last year elders were forced to promise a fixed amount to be donated to Watchtower every month from their congregation account, based on (1) what the congregation was already sending for paying off a building/renovation loan, or (2) anonymous slips of paper passed around so that publishers could indicate what they could afford to pledge. Congregations were even told to send any surplus funds squirreled away for a rainy day to Watchtower, leaving just $5,000 plus three months’ worth of regular operating expenses.
Amazingly, the majority of Witnesses continue to be oblivious to what amounts to a smash-and-grab, and are instead under the assumption that Watchtower has mercifully forgiven all kingdom hall building loans.
6. Kingdom hall ‘mergers’ are in store
fuel-in-car
As already mentioned, Watchtower has instructed all United States elders as of July 8, 2015 to be ready for their congregation to be re-assigned to a different kingdom hall if the organization’s new “master plan” deems this necessary. The letter marks the green light for the downsizing we are already seeing at branch level to be soon rolled out at congregation level, and is again clear evidence that Watchtower is desperate to claw in money wherever it can and become a smaller, more financially nimble organization.
The end game would be kingdom hall multiplexes in city-center locations shared by five or more congregations – a far cry from the parochial feel older Witnesses will be accustomed to.
As delightful as it is to think of such a huge regression in the local presence of the organization, you can’t help but feel bad for all those long-standing Witnesses who have donated thousands over the years under the false assumption that they were responsible for their local kingdom hall’s upkeep. Soon, for all their kindness and generosity, such ones may face lengthy and costly car journeys to intimidating, soulless, inconvenient city-center locations allocated to them by Watchtower.
7. Personnel are being jettisoned
kicked-out
Last year district overseers received the unwelcome news that their positions no longer existed, and they were surplus to requirements. Though some will have been demoted down to circuit overseer rank, the majority will have been jettisoned by the organization to fend for themselves – an entire strata of the organization’s hierarchy dissolved, and deemed no longer serviceable or cost-effective.
In a similarly unceremonious manner, workers at branch offices subject to closure by Watchtower have been cast adrift, with years or even decades of loyal service apparently counting for very little in the organization’s quest to make ends meet. The recently-emerged story of a Wallkill bethelite who was virtually thrown out on the street due to “cutbacks” suggests that the organization’s top brass have no qualms when it comes to wielding the axe. Bethelites in Watchtower’s heartland would do well to watch their backs and plan for the worst as the organization looks to slash spending wherever it can.
8. The secret weapons have failed
secret-weapon
Despite all the fanfare and hype, JW.org has been unable to attract internet-savvy non-Witnesses – its main target audience. It is, quite literally, preaching to the converted. The 2015 Yearbook boasted that JW.org received 850,000,000+ total visits in the first two years from Aug 27, 2012 to Aug 31, 2014. This figure sounds impressive until you factor in the number of Jehovah’s Witnesses – 8 million. Assuming every active Witness visits their own website at least once per week, you arrive at only a slightly lower figure of 832,000,000 visits over the two years (8,000,000 x 52 x 2).
And despite succeeding in making the organization more visible, there has been no notable increase in baptisms in the two years since the literature carts (or “metropolitan witnessing”) program was launched. After all, getting literature into someone’s hands won’t stop them going on the internet and fact-checking when they get home. And that’s assuming anyone is interested in approaching the carts to begin with. In this Guardian article, the reporter watched some carts in a busy part of London for an hour, and the only person who approached the Witnesses did so because they needed directions.
9. The child abuse floodgates have opened
flood
As was predicted at the time, there has been a relentless stream of child abuse lawsuits filed against Watchtower since the 2012 Candace Conti verdict. In 2013, a year on from the Conti judgment, lawyer Irwin Zalkin told me he had no less than 11 lawsuits on his books. Though many such lawsuits end up being settled, the success of the Jose Lopez case and the recent victory in London’s High Court have shown that if child abuse victims are willing to dig their heels in and stay the course they can have, not only compensation, but justice served.
All of this doesn’t bode well for an organization already under fire for its cult-like shunning practices and death-dealing prohibitions on blood transfusions. And apart from the atrocious reputation, with well-informed journalists like Trey Bundy spelling out the problems of organizational mishandling in the media, the money for paying off multi-million judgments and out-of-court settlements has to come from somewhere.
Even if the Governing Body sent a long-overdue letter out tomorrow FINALLY telling elders to report all child abuse accusations straight to the police, Watchtower would still have to answer to the backlog of lawsuits from victims who suffered while the two-witness rule was (is) still in place. Such victims may well have only a finite window of opportunity to get ANY money out of Watchtower at all.
10. Watchtower doesn’t have a PR strategy
head-in-sand
You’re an international, faith-based non-profit organization with a toxic brand both on the internet and in the media. Fewer people from wealthy, developed countries with internet are joining you, and thus donations are dwindling. For all the evangelizing and promotional work of your members, a few clicks on Google can completely dismantle your organization’s message. To make matters worse, you have mounting legal costs and settlements to pay for out of an ever-diminishing revenue stream. What you urgently need is a good PR strategy to make it easier to bring in fresh converts (and their donations) – but even here Watchtower is almost comically inept.
The organization’s PR strategy is essentially two-fold: (1) bury your head in the sand and hope your opposers eventually get bored and go away, or (2) refute the claims made by your opposers using outright lies (*cough* Rick Fenton). Both of these methods may help the likes of Tony Morris get to sleep at night in the short-term, but ultimately they are self-defeating. To neutral observers, silence is incriminating when damning allegations are on the table – especially related to harming children. And when you flat out lie about your damaging policies and teachings, you only give critics like me more rope to hang you with.
The only workable strategy Watchtower can pursue at this stage is one of reform, but past experience shows that any form of “compromise” is seen by the Governing Body as capitulation to Satan’s hordes. In short, Watchtower is sinking because its deluded leaders are their own worst enemies.
What does the future hold?
I do not for one moment suggest that we will see an end to Jehovah’s Witnesses as a religion in our lifetimes. The fact that there continues to be such a thing as the bible students, who still cling to Charles Taze Russell and his discredited, outlandish teachings, tells us that religions have amazing survival abilities even when members are deprived of their leadership. Faith, after all, is a product of people’s minds. When enough people believe the same unsubstantiated thing you have a religion, regardless of whether there is a person or organization to lead it.
But while religions are virtually indestructible, corporations are not. Non-profit organizations like Watchtower are just as capable of getting into debt as any other business. And when your bank manager starts bankruptcy proceedings against you because you can no longer service your debts, it’s game over.
The organization's glory days are already behind it
The organization’s glory days are already behind it
Those who suggest Watchtower is too big and successful to go down need only look at the fact that it has already been shrinking since it reached its zenith (in terms of branches and printing operations) some time between 2005 and 2010. Add to that the desperate clawing for cash over the five years since then, and you have the omens of an organizational collapse.
The winds of change have completely overtaken Watchtower in the internet age, and the Governing Body find themselves in a whole different ball game to their predecessors. If things are really as bad as I suspect, Watchtower needs to drastically downscale its operations to, say, a handful of branches and zero printing. In other words, it needs to become like its noisy neighbor Scientology, which despite having only 50,000-or-so members (and an even worse reputation) still has an impressive portfolio of valuable property scattered across the globe and minimal overheads compared to Watchtower.
But any downsizing of that magnitude would send Watchtower into an even more vicious spiral, in which it would start hemorrhaging even the most diehard members. After all, when you have spent decades pointing to your success as evidence of divine backing, how do you explain any sudden, sharp decline?
If Watchtower were to go bankrupt, it could always try claiming that the Great Tribulation has begun and Satan’s minions (their creditors) have started overtly attacking God’s people, but this simply will not wash with more intelligent Witnesses. Whatever is left of the organization (perhaps re-branded to ditch the Watchtower name entirely while retaining the Governing Body at the helm) would have a huge exodus on its hands.
It is precisely because of all the pride at stake that, in my mind, a sudden implosion seems increasingly plausible. Unlike ordinary commercial organizations who have the flexibility to change their size and scope according to the prevailing conditions, “God’s organization” can only be seen by its members to be going in an upwards trajectory for its grandiose claims of divine direction to have any credence. Any noticeable regression would rightly be interpreted as evidence of God’s favor being absent. Thus any problems would be allowed to accumulate behind closed doors until they reach a critical mass.
Of course I could be wrong, but if that is so then Watchtower is doing an awful lot of begging and downsizing for no particular reason, and with far too much to lose by doing so. It could well be that some incredible developments are ahead as Watchtower’s predicament further deteriorates, and the Governing Body slowly discovers that Jehovah isn’t coming to the rescue after all. I had better get on with writing my book while there is still an organization to write about.
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Translations: Spanish | French
Further reading…
◾JWsurvey articles on Watchtower downsizing
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74 Responses to Is Watchtower imploding? 10 reasons why the end could be nigh
← Older Comments
ruthlee says:
July 19, 2015 at 8:04 am
dear i dont know what to do ive just come from a dead meeting all those little lost sheep with nothing of substance to say for themselves and i attended fs meeting afterward 2 elds 1 real pio not the pretend young who never support anyone but themselves see it for what it is and have hope in time you will see the path you need to be on meanwhile people like lloyd and others help you realise you are not going mad i too in 50s and frittered away my life but i hope and still believe in our creator and ihope the smashing instrument comes first to those who declare they have Gods authority the rot really has set in and the house will fail just dont let you and your family get caught in the crossfire and this site has helped me so much im truly grateful that like minded people exist and are willing to be kind
Reply
It'sJustMe says:
July 19, 2015 at 11:24 am
“If Watchtower were to go bankrupt…..”, Lloyd dixit, ….I would not hesitate for a second to celebrate this happy event with champagne.
Reply
Pam says:
July 19, 2015 at 1:52 pm
Hi Cedar,
Thank you for this information. However neither my friend or I could open the letter to the elders. Is there some other way to view it?
Thanks in advance,
Pam
Reply
Cedars says:
July 19, 2015 at 2:09 pm
Hi Pam! I’ve just checked again and the link above does work.
Be sure to click the blue rectangular box that says: “Click here to start download from sendspace.”
Thanks.
Reply
Cognitive Loop says:
July 19, 2015 at 7:06 pm
How I opened the elders letter linked in this article:
Go to site linked in article. Click the download link. There should be a pop-up box asking how you want the file: save it? or open it? Select “open”.
But here’s the trick: it requires a file reader such as Adobe/Acrobat Reader. Perhaps that is what is gumming up the works on your end? Or maybe a firewall/permissions setting?
Reply
Finn Sawyer says:
July 20, 2015 at 12:09 am
Looks like Watchtower had the link to the elder’s letter removed from the JW leaks site server. The URL is null.
Reply
Cedars says:
July 20, 2015 at 3:26 am
Yes, the JWleaks/sendspace link no longer works. Fortunately the letter can still be read on this link… http://imgur.com/Ng4CYXy
Reply
Erik says:
July 20, 2015 at 1:56 am
Or…downsizing CAN be explained to the flock as a sign that we are sooo deep into the last days, all religions are under attack, even this one now. So soon Jehovah must act, because now Satan has turned his wrath onto His organization. Any negative happenings can be explained away like so!!
Reply
alain says:
July 20, 2015 at 4:06 am
Hi Lloyd,
Thanks for this sobering article…
But, about these facts:
1) the huge building process in Warwick ( the new JW worldwide headquarters)
2) the crucial need of more and more Kingdom Halls?
Looking forward to hearing from you the soonest,
Kind Regards
Reply
Cedars says:
July 20, 2015 at 5:47 am
Hi alain
The building project in Warwick is a property flip. They are building their new headquarters at a fraction of the cost of what they are making from selling Brooklyn, so it’s a money-making exercise rather than a statement that the organization is financially stable.
As to the stated need for kingdom halls, for this to be a “crucial” need, you would need to see a corresponding surge in the numbers of those baptized. Instead the growth figure has been hovering around the 2% mark for the last five years, indicating growth is stagnant and any perceived need for new halls has been there for many years.
Lloyd
Reply
Rae says:
July 20, 2015 at 6:40 am
Cedars
You’re spot on with so much you have to say about the Watchtower Society… my own experience… but to disavow the existence of the maker of all things because the messenger has become apostate itself…? No condemnation here at all. Just a suggestion for a little rethink. Is it possible that God has become ticked off and decided to do something about the falsehood in the Society?
Yours… Rae
Reply
Cedars says:
July 20, 2015 at 6:46 am
Rather than being based on my experience with the organization, my reasons for no longer being religious are due to the lack of evidence for a theistic God, but thank you for your concern.
Reply
Idontknowhatodo says:
July 20, 2015 at 7:32 am
Me too Lloyd
Im certainly not replacing all I have rejected with another ideology…
Evidence points in one direction only…
I refuse to ignore my powers of reasoning any longer…
Please never stop writing or doing your videos…
They have been an enormous help to me…
Helping me free my mind.
Reply
Free Thinker says:
July 20, 2015 at 7:10 am
Has anyone else noticed the use of the phrase “master plan” in paragraph two of the letter. How many dictatorial powers have used that phrase and come to nothing.If it goes wrong they can always blame the “master plan”.Imagine now Vincent Price laughing manically in the background.
Reply
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